670 thoughts on “THE NINE CLUES….Part Four

    • germanguy,

      I toured that hotel room and balcony 3 years ago. It was a little eerie.We also toured the National Cvil Rights Museum in Memphis. It’s a great museum. I recommend it to anyone visiting Memphis. Memphis is a pretty cool city.

      Maybe someday soon his dream will be realized. We’re closer… but not there yet.

      jd

  1. OK – I think we need more than the memoirs to aid the poem. It would be nice if we could find one of those bronze jars with his autobiographies in it. They have me curios because it should give more insight into what is dear and private for him.

    • Hi. I’m Becky from WV. I don’t understand something – are y’all in this together? Swapping clues & helping each other? Why?

      • Good question…not all in this together as in going to search…but in it together as far as having a common interest. I think we just try and think of what the clues can be sometimes and share what that might be. None of us will know if any of these ideas for solutions will be right till it’s found. It’s probably not anywhere we’re even thinking…it’s probably up in Canada and only a couple people have figured that out lol….

      • I thought these folks who are always on here are obsessed (read: “crazy”) and must have nothing better to do. Now here I am leaving posts and replies, and I can’t seem to stop reading and following now. I really do hope it is one of these good spellers/obsessed people who finds it. And I hope they find it soon so I can get on with my life!

        • Just want to clarify that I was a normal person before this and Forrest is to blame for my mental illness….maybe Dal a little too…but that’s really just by association.

        • It adds to the THRILL of the Chase to be helpful, besides just being neighborly.

          Even if the CHEST is a NEEDLE in a HAYSTACK Forrest says you are not going to “STUMBLE” upon it… and that saying even if you have CHOSEN the correct HAYSTACK… if every PEAK in the ROCKIES represents a HAYSTACK… how many HAYSTACKS would that be… ? More than are listed here for instance…

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_peaks_of_the_Rocky_Mountains

          Mountain peaks of the Rocky Mountains

          … but it’s a START …

  2. Hey Dal,

    Didn’t you leave a trail of crumbs behind you? The crowd is gone….:)

  3. Oh, I don’t feel stuck, just want more pieces to the puzzle. He said the place was dear to him and private where he hid the treasure. That says to me one has to know his history in order to better understand some possibilities and test spots when one comes up with them.

    I’ll be heading out this weekend to my 6th and possibly seventh spot this weekend. I have another but that will happen probably after I pay my taxes. Of course, i am still waiting and a little more Remote Viewing intel as well.

  4. Has anyone considered that the beginning may actually be the end as well? If you put in below the home of Brown and then head back in the direction you came from, it could be possible. This might explain how he was able to easily place the treasure without having to follow the whole path of the poem. When you return and find the blaze, from a direction that you otherwise would not have seen it from, you might be back near where you started. The heavy loads and water high would also be where warm waters halt. Some of the poem seems to prohibit that, but if you think about it, does it? We’re assuming that it’s an almost linear search, when it may somehow be more circular in nature. As valid as any other theory until proven otherwise.

    • On2it-
      Tony Dokoupil considered that when he said he knew where it was. He started at Ojo Caliente in Yellowstone and ended up at the Freight Road Bridge about a hundred feet from where he started.
      I have looked at that possibility but it never works out. The clues keep taking me further away from where I started.

    • Yes that made me think of the Enchanted Circle…that it’s some how along that route. I don’t think a complete circle though…more like a horseshoe with 50 miles between where you start and where you end. That’s one of my theories…I have more than a few lol.

        • Why yes Clinger…I have related a horseshoe to an omega….and maybe that’s the route on the Enchanted circle…. ..hmm then again, maybe since there are only two omegas….Forrest took a horse with only two feet. If anyone sees a hopping horse, can they pm me right away? I need to follow it.

  5. The clues are tough because each can have several possible solutions, each of which would possibly be true when all are properly aligned in order to find the location of the chest. Forrest Fenn says to work them in order though. I am still going on my original “home of Brown” which I originally interpreted literally even though it can also mean a few other things too. “home of Brown”. It still fits even though my search locations have changed a bit.
    Currently, I am considering an entirely different approach to the search in light of all the news of problems on public lands. Although Forrest Fenn did say in an interview that he thought it would be wonderful if the treasure went to the Smithsonian to be put on exhibition so that everyone would be able to see it.

  6. Just an update. A 58 year old fellow had a heart attack while looking in a cave out near Taos and there is supposed to be a report tonight on the 10pm News on KOB-TV in NM.

    • Geez… I hope there isn’t a curse on that chest. Where’d Fenn say he got the chest Dal?

      • germanguy-
        I don’t know that he actually said where he got it but I think he did say what it’s origin was…Transylvania maybe…no no no…but I can’t remember…maybe Stephanie will remember when she is done with her beauty sleep…

        • In the excerpt from his book on his blog:

          “Fortunately, I talked a museum friend into selling me his beautiful cast bronze chest that had three-dimensional female figures on its four sides and on the lid. I know I paid way too much for it but once in a while something comes along that is so special as to discount all logical rules of value. An excited antique scholar said the chest was probably a Romanesque Lock Box that dated to about 1150 AD. He also thought it might have once held a family bible or a Book of Days. Now it could hold my ancient jewelry and solid gold pieces. I was delighted. It was the perfect treasure chest.”

  7. this is a reason too that I have hesitated with my direction lately. The last part of the poem says…”for all to seek”. I take that as everyone…young, elderly, etc. This combined with the other problems in the mountains is really changing my thoughts about how to approach the search and where the ultimate location of the treasure might be.

  8. It is in the Rocky Mountains, yes…but maybe not out so far from a populated place where it would be risky if someone were alone and got injured or something.

  9. Okay, we need to narrow this down. Fenn said that he knows the treasure hasn’t been found yet. How? Well, it has to be somewhere that he can go check on it, or he would be lying. Well he’s not lying. He has no reason to. So, where can an 82 year old man go? He can’t travel much higher than 8,000 feet, due to thin air. So we first off eliminate any place where the altitude is dangerous for an older person, regardless of his physical prowess. Lungs, heart, etc. generally wear out no matter how fit you look. It’s part of life. So he said it’s above 5,000 feet and we set a ceiling of 8,000 feet. That should reduce the number of possibilities somewhat.

    • I went point blank with Dal on that question after Mr. Fenn asked him to let everyone know that those who have claimed to have found the treasure were hoaxes. He said he hadn’t heard a definitive explanation yet as to how Mr. Fenn would know. Stephanie speculated that she heard someone say that Fenn had checked on it last fall and that it was now covered in snow, so he was reasonably confident that it had not been found.

      Here’s what I’m more interested in. Earlier you alluded to having solved the H.O.B. and now you want to “narrow it down”? So, 8000 feet is your “warm waters halt”? What is your reasoning there? and If you know the H.O.B. why do you need to narrow anything down. Sounds like you’re reading the poem backwards, as was suggested by a post a month ago.

      • CrazyFamily

        Many of us on here have some pretty good ideas as to where we will be looking. That doesn’t mean we won’t share some things that are valid with others, as long as we don’t do it and jeopardize our search options. So I will help whenever I can, but at some point I have to sit back. I hope you understand. Good luck to you

      • Mmm, well it’s interesting how verbose you are when you think no one is listening and then you sit back when you’ve got one on the line. Tell me then how you are so sure of H.O.B. without having been to W.W.W.H.? This was what I was getting at with my remark about Fenns questioning of Stephan. After all W.W.W.H. is not www. …as in dot com!

        • Crazyfamily – There will be times that I won’t be able to answer your questions without revealing what I know. Everyone at some point or other will swear they figured out where it is. This has been true for at least the two years this hunt has been going on. Yet up until now, no one has stepped forward with the chest. Ask Dal, he’ll confirm what I’m telling you. When it’s my turn to go out, I may or may not come back with the chest. But I too, feel I am 99.9% certain of it’s location. But like the advice I gave earlier, when you have gotten to the point where none of your solutions to the poem fail under any conditions (which is based on every, I mean EVERY clue Fenn makes) you have a reason to pursue the chest.

    • Germanguy, no offense, but that is absolute nonsense…an 82 year old that is acclimated to high altitudes could hike a fourteener with no problem. In my opinion (that phrase included so that Dal would think me diplomatic) you cannot assume the chest is below 8000 feet just because of Forrest’s age. I’ve lived for a long time at a mile high…even ran the 175 mile Colorado Relay from Idaho Springs to Glenwood Springs over Vail Pass twice, and I will tell you there were octogenarians running it along side me. I guarantee Forrest could haul 20 or 40 pounds 2 miles uphill into the Rocky Mountains easily. Altitude sickness is no joke, but after one spends a lengthy time above 6000 feet, altitude is not an issue.

    • Germanguy-
      There is a picture of Forrest on this blog, one of the scrapbooks, playing with his dog at 9,500ft at his familiy’s ranch. I don’t think Forrest is restricted to 8,000ft in altitude.

    • Germanguy-
      If it was in town somewhere he would be able to check on it everyday if it was at one of his regular haunts, Like Collected Works or the Loretto Inn or the Pink Adobe…unfortunately it has to be North of Santa Fe…

      • I think he must have checked on it last fall before the snow and now he knows it’s under snow and can’t be found. I’d be curious if once all the snow melts in places that he will still be able to say it. If he is…then I say there’s some chip in the chest, or he can drive by the location and see it as he drives. I thought about that once when we were looking in Cimarron…I thought maybe you could see it as you drove down the road and that’s why everyone was missing it there…you had to be driving to see the blaze and not hiking in the woods. Is anyone else amazing that I’ve had this many crazy ideas? I think it exposes my obsession a bit too much.

        • You missed it Stephanie. He can check it in the snow also.

          He just flys over it and looks for foot prints in the snow. Then flys home again.

      • I wonder what Forrest considers the boundaries of “Santa Fe” to be. The city limits are small relative to what is labeled Santa Fe as far as addresses go. The mountains are outside of the city limit, as are many of the foothills and roads. I like to think that maybe his spot is one that is in the mountains that overlooks his house so he can always be near home. Maybe he can somehow see it, like he has left it in a place that will reflect the sun onto a rock and the blaze is visible with a telescope from his backyard? You’re not the only one coming up with crazy ideas, Stephanie…

        I LOVE the idea of it being at Collected Works (even if it doesn’t fit in with not being IN Santa Fe) but now that whole “it’s in a place that’s PRIVATE to him” is upsetting me. That makes it sound harder. I am having a hard time seeing Forrest throwing a tracking chip in the chest because that would mean some tracking company also knows what’s going on. That’s getting too complicated. I bet he knows it hasn’t been found because it’s THAT hard to find.

        • LOL Yeah Bonnie for being on the crazy idea bandwagon. My idea about Collected Works was that he could get around it being IN Santa Fe by being in a fake book called The Mountains North of Santa Fe….sometimes ideas are not so good and there’s a bit of reaching involved LOL….plus he had that whole chapter on books. I agree about the chip too. I lean towards it being somewhere under snow…so he knows it can’t be seen at this time of year and that he probably did check on it last fall. I like the telescope idea though..that’s a new one for me.

      • I think he’s got a motion activated web cam in the area, maybe more than one.

    • Being a PILOT, Forrest woudn’t have those limitations… he said you would be SURPRISED… probably how much STAMINA he had in those two trips he made… were they days apart or at the same time he did not say.

      If you are accustomed to SEA LEVEL breathing… the mountains can get you no doubt, how young you are does not matter…

      …how VISITING FOOTBALL TEAMS play at MILE HIGH STADIUM for instance… oxygen on the sidelines…

    • You said – “when it’s my turn to go out”? What do you mean “my turn”?

      • Oh, didn’t I tell you, we each take turns going out for the treasure. As Fenn said, “As I have gone alone in there”. This way, we all don’t show up at the same location. You know how awkward that would be. And quite obvious I might add, as to what we’re all doing. 🙂

  10. KOB TV just said that Forrest said he isn’t going to comment on whether it is on public or private land. Would give too much away. No mention of the heart attack.

  11. New Mexico:

    Williams says the man told officers he was digging for Fenn’s treasure. Fenn has published a memoir with a poem of clues to the treasure’s location.

    Williams says it is illegal to dig on state game commission land without permission. And he notes that if any treasure is found, it would be property of the state. Federal forest officials say similar rules apply on federal lands.

  12. This is supposed to be the “Land of the Free”. Public lands are no longer public. Be sure when you walk on it you don’t leave any foot prints. And whomever is last to leave the park at the end of the day has to empty the trash.

    • I planted a tree at a public park once. Within a week they took it down stating you can’t plant trees in a public park without a permit to do so.

      • Oh that’s a good idea… if you need to dig for the treasure, get a permit to plant a tree…. then dig up the treasure and put the tree in its place and no one will question why you are digging…….I don’t think its buried though…… but if it is that would be a nice “giveback” to nature too.

      • I can believe that! There are alot of rules for public land. Permits for almost everything. The goal of the rules is to protect the land from the people and the people from the people. Meaning if they let anyone do anything without knowledge, havoc could be wreaked. People might plant an invasive species and so on. But if you go through the right channels and get the permit your good to go.

      • JMC

        “Land of the free”. Don’t you just love it. It makes me think of an amusement park, but then again, aren’t they all.

    • Germanguy, to paraphrase Fenn from his book, “Owned by the American people and managed by the land bureau”. I don’t think Fenn has much respect for the Feds except to stay away from them.

      The whole issue of who owns the land where he put the treasure matters little to him. -JP

  13. My money’s on whomever finds the chest does exactly as Fenn says “But tarry scant with marvel gaze, Just grab the chest and beat feet”.. And for cryin’ out loud keep you mouth shut (just send us all an email from your new European home.

  14. That’s just the spark I needed. BOLDLY I shall enter the country and with my metal detectors painted bright orange, No man nor beast shall I fear as I hunt the Fenn Cache.

  15. GermanGuy: He can’t go to the treasure. Too much chance of being followed at this stage. I think he is counting on gratitude to ping him back when it’s found. Thus the offer to buy back the bracelet. Maybe a homing device rigged to activate when the lid is opened?

    How did we all decide “north of SF” means between NNW & NNE? Why is it not North of the 35th parallel? That would include almost all the Rocky’s. Percentage wise, it’s not that much more area.
    I hate to eliminate the one area I should be looking!
    Is it because he thinks like a pilot? Sounds too “in the box”.
    So much for narrowing the field.

    • Stevador’

      A few blogs back, Dal covered (pretty good I would say) what north of Santa Fe was. Check it out.

      • Deutsch Dude, Dal covered what Dal believes is north of Santa Fe, Many others commented that anything north of a line drawn around the globe north of Santa Fe would be north of Santa Fe. I’m with them. We can all be as certain as we are comfortable with as it relates to what we believe, until it is actually found. We’ll know who is right then. 😉

        • Well, they used the 38th PARALLEL NORTH to divide NORTH KOREA and SOUTH KOREA, but they were still just talking about KOREA… ( ROCKIES in our case )

          The 38th parallel north is a circle of latitude that is 38 degrees north of the Earth’s equatorial plane. It crosses Europe, the Mediterranean Sea, Asia, the Pacific Ocean, North America, and the Atlantic Ocean. The 38th parallel north has been especially important in the recent history of Korea.

          NORTH KOREA did not gain any land in the “CIRCLE of LATITUDE”… the ROCKIES are still “Just the ROCKIES” aren’t they ??

          You can look anywhere you want, but I’m going to be in the ROCKIES if you are looking for my location, it will be in the ROCKIES, but that’s just me.

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountain_peaks_of_the_Rocky_Mountains

          • Yes so any Rocky Mountains, north of the line would be fair game. Not just Rocky Mountains on NNW but also WNW. We could argue this til the day is long. But like I said only when it’s found will we know for certain. 🙂

    • Stevador-
      Well, he didn’t say north of the 35th parallel. He said north of Santa Fe. So that’s what we use. Seems legitimate to me.

      • The 35th Parallel (not precisely) is the global position of Santa Fe, so anything north of that can be considered North of Santa Fe. I still don’t know how you can eliminate that fact.

    • Agreed. He’d be followed wherever he goes, now. I think he’s got a(some) motion activated web cam or something like that in a tree.

  16. I am new to the Thrill of the Chase and I am having a blast! My kids are excited and our family has a trip planned to Yellowstone in September to check out our spot. FF to my knowledge and correct me if I am wrong, never said it was buried. He also had the contents water-proofed. He also mentions title to the gold. Just a thought here but maybe in the jar along with his biography there is also a title to the treasure and the next steps to take in collecting it. The physical treasure does not have to be in the chest. It could be for example in a safety deposit box, revealed inside the chest. He goes to the bank and sees it is still there or if no one has contacted him with the title he knows it has not been found. Could be why FF moitors his emails waiting to see if the “I found it claim is real”. And then it could be just as it seems and all the contents are in the chest. If you do find the chest, you do not have to divulge to anyone that you found it. You wouldn’t have to mention where you found either. Just take the chest and go in peace. I think as good a planner as FF is, he would have thought this through as to not inflict legal problems onto the successful hunter. If I found the treasure I would give it back to FF in hopes that he would create another poem and a new Chase. Or maybe I could accomplish that on my own. This would keep his dream alive and continue his goal of getting people outdoors. I would take a nugget to frame and put on the wall I have to admit. Some will keep the treasure and it will change their life but then the Chase will end. Thats okay to, If you found it you have the right to do as you wish. Thank you Dal and Steph for the blog pages, resources and open arms in gathering together to try and solve a puzzle! Lets get it solved!

    • Randy,

      You’ll find a lot of information here to help you. Just check out the earlier blogsin the upper right and Dal’s lins across he top.

      Welcome to the Thrill of the Chase.

    • Randy-
      Not likely that there is a chit or IOU in the chest because he has said that the chest may not be found for a hundred years…If it was a chit or IOU it would be worthless after a considerable amount of time. Forrest would be gone and how would the finder collect in say 2108?

    • So let’s play hypothetical. Someone finds it, and tells Forrest and Forrest goes back to get it. Is it still Forrest’s to go back and get to give to the finder in person?

        • Ok but seriously…can you leave it there and go get Forrest???? I hope there’s wifi wherever it is….I’ll take a photo and ask him to come “quickly” there. Of course then you have a line of 20 stalkers following him there….hmm. Ok, I don’t have this all figured out…guess one puzzle at a time.

      • @Dal Good point. My wife works for a Real Estate Tiltle company and this was actually her reasoning. I don’t think it would be a chit or IOU and I myself think the physical treasure is in the chest. Especially if he made two trips in carrying it to his spot. But lets play hypothetical Steph, Elaborating on my wifes theory is that FF has the treasure in a spot he can check all the time by just going to the bank, like a safety deposit box. Inside the chest is the transfer of title paper already notarized and signed by FF along with the key to the safety deposit box. I am not sure on the legal aspects as if it were done this way and the treasure was not found until year 2108 like Dal mentions. Also I work as a State Park Ranger and I am sure it is different for every State as well as it is most surely different for Federal Land but an example is: A deer hunter brings an expensive deer stand into the State Park and leaves it locked to a tree. Another hunter comes by days later, finds the deer stand and removes it. The deer stand has found a new owner. According to our Park Rules, if you take a stand into the woods you must take the stand back out the same day. If you leave it there it is considered abandoned property and can be used or taken by anyone who comes across it. Lets not worry about this (lol) lets get back to the actual puzzle, we have to find it first and then all these questions will be answered. Like Collective Works it is going to take a collective effort to solve this puzzle. This is a great place to start and get involved and sharing the information might give a lucky someone that AHA!

      • If he hands the treasure to you, he owes the taxes, if you find it, you owe it. Big difference and no way he commits tax fraud for you. Which he would be doing by giving you a treasure and not paying the gift tax.
        So please go in peace, but email him so I can stop spending thousands on my trips. If anyone finds it and doesn’t send him the bracelet quickly, just never come forward or face the wrath of the other searchers who spent time and money on worthless trips during the time you kept quiet.

        • steph
          Taxes who said I was going to sell my special book with the compass on it cause that is all I think I will get when i get lost on this blog from Dal.
          Can anybody find nobody here

  17. I have a question: when/how did Forrest Fenn say that the treasure was hidden in the mountains north of Sante Fe?

    In other words, did he just posit this in his book, or was it spoken? And when?

    • Adventura-
      Those questions have been asked and answered umpteen times on this blog. If you spend a little time and dig around you’ll find answers to those and lots of other questions. I suggest you head out to the Tips post, Rumors post, Forrest’s email posts, Media page and watch the Santa Fe Interviews posted on this blog. Then head over to Stephanies blog and Richard’s blog…Lots of good reading ahead for you..

  18. Thanks for getting another set of blogs going, Dal. Lots of work involved there and I’m sure we all appreciate it. I’m just stumped right now. The poem seemingly can’t be absolutely literal because there aren’t enough literal clues to get you to a finite spot. But the poem seemingly can’t be too encoded or cryptic either if FF said, ‘show it to your kids – they’ll get it.’ It’s a goodun’

    • Stance-
      I never heard Forrest say that…pretty good…If you are correct, where does that leave us?
      WWWH is the key..Forrest said so himself. I believe it. Figure that out and the rest will follow. Although it didn’t for the folks who got the first two clues and then missed the next seven. I keep trying to figure out WWWH. Of the 29 places I’ve looked I would wager that I have had 20 different WWWH places. I may be an authority on where warm waters halt in the mountains north of Santa Fe. 🙂

      • @Dal,
        It puzzles me about the folks that got the first two clues and then missed the next seven. I’ve always taken Fenn at his word when he said;

        “The person who finds the treasure will have studied the poem over and over, and thought, and analyzed and moved with confidence. Nothing about it will be accidental.”

        So obviously we can’t move that confidently to the next clue……Or is Fenn saying he can’t believe the dummies found the first two and then just dropped the ball completely on the rest.

        Are you confident it’s not where you searched or has that got you second guessing all the places you’ve already searched? You’ve stated before you believe the hidy spot is very clever and well hidden.

        • You’re right. I am not confident at all that I did not miss the chest. I really think the reason he knows it hasn’t been found is because the place he hid it is incredible. I think we could stand right next to it and not see it. I think it’s like a magic trick. Maybe like those old Lone Ranger movies where the bad guys hid their guns in a hole in a rock wall that had a perfectly fitting rock plug in it so no one ever noticed the hiding place. I also think its in a place no one has searched yet. I know…I know… He said searchers have been within 500 feet of it. But that doesn’t mean they were looking for it in that spot…Let me explain what I mean…

          Just lets pretend for a moment that Collected Works Bookstore was north of Santa Fe. Imagine all the searchers that go into that place. If the chest was hidden there it would certainly be a fact that searchers have been within 500 feet of it.

          I don’t believe for a second that it’s in CW Bookstore..I’m just trying to draw a picture of another way to look at this thing.

      • I really believe that some people have gotten the first 2 clues correct because they are the most general clues. It’s like playing 20 questions…one starts out very general… Question #1 – “Is it bigger than a bread basket” equals “Where warm waters halt”…probable answers are CD, dam. hot springs, or confluence…limited locations, Question #2 – “Animal, vegetable or mineral” equals “canyon down no lower than 5000 feet”…limits it even more. However, even if you got those first two correct, you now are faced with the first hard, specific clue. That is where the rest have faltered. “Home of Brown”…get a reasonable solution to this one, as well as the next 6 clues and you should start planning your trip. I estimate that there are probably 5,000 to 10,000 locations that match the poem’s 9 clues perfectly. The poem was never intended to pinpoint an “X” on a map…it was intended to get our lazy butts off the recliner and out into the wild. Even 10,000 possible locations with 5,000 searchers at 2 trips per year solves this thing in a year or so…ish….

        An infinite number of monkeys, on an infinite number of poems, for an infinite number of years…will eventually locate the chest…or might compose Lady Gaga’s next hit…I’m not sure which…

      • @Dal,
        I see what you mean…….hidden in plain sight. That definitely sounds like something Fenn would do. I agree with you that the key is finding the correct WWWH spot. So say you have the correct WWWH spot; how confident are you about being able to “move with confidence”, like Fenn said, to the next spot?

        • JMC

          If you just wait around a while until Dal is done searching (he’s got over 30 trips out under his belt), then you can begin checking out the places he hasn’t been. LOL

          • I don’t think he has 30 trips…I think 30 solutions he’s come up with. I don’t know how many trips he’s made..he makes his longer…like last summer I think he was out there for like 20 days on one trip. Where is Dal? I’m feeling neglected….aren’t you all?

      • Goofy – Could be the first two clues that were figured out were purely accidental, clue one may simply be the rocky mountains…. depending on how you look at it! Clue one may also be in the first stanza…. 😉

        • What if many have figured it out, and he just decided to tell us about two that did? He can talk like that. I don’t have his direct quote…I think Dal just posted it recently verbatim….but I think he just said that a couple figured out the first two and went by the other 7. So maybe he just forgot to mention the other 823982398 that have also. By the way…I find it more interesting that he did actually separate them into specific individual 9 clues in saying that I think…..

      • Forrest actually told me to show it to my kids. I took it to mean that I was (as usual) overthinking the process.

      • Here are my thoughts, very simply, on how people could have figured out the first two clues correctly and missed the next seven.

        Begin it where warm waters halt….they got that part right
        And take it in the canyon down….they took the right canyon
        Not far, but too far to walk….they went too far and missed their home of brown.

        I could quite easily see how people could have been close to it and not found it because they missed on how far is far, but not too far.

        • ohhhhh I hadn’t thought about it…they missed home of Brown. Wow, that’s an interesting thought. I was just mentioning how Gadi says on his resource page that Home of Brown is important. Someone just said they thought they heard it was big…but I think the right word is that it’s “important”. So is it possible that it’s actually something smaller and can easily be missed or something that’s so not obvious? Like he mentions rocks like agate etc….so I’ve thought Brown could be a rock…is it a type of rock that’s called a Brown such and such and when you see that is where the creek is? *OHHH* What if people assume it’s Brown Trout…so they miss the real Home of Brown and that’s why they went by it? Hmmm. He must know his rocks with the arrowheads….who has a list of rocks that would be called Brown something or others?

      • Stephanie, no rocks that fit that description by name, although a rock that has a high copper or iron content may appear to be brown. My thought is its probably a petroglyph that looks like a home and is colored brown. Probably one that he found, maybe his first one he found.

    • Stance-
      Maybe there are enough literal clues. Maybe we are thinking too large. Maybe the tabletop is smaller than we think?

      • Dal, i am with you. I am of the opinion these days that most of them are in the same area and not strewn out across a large area or state.

      • Stephanie, did he say it was in a place for kids or that a child could find/get it? I do believe it is in a spot that is not dangerous for anyone including kids.

        • His resource place says to keep kids close. I’ve never ever heard him say anything about taking a kid or a kid is more likely to find. Maybe Dal has…but I take that talk as hearsay…and don’t give it 100% truth in my thinking…I “think” I remember him telling someone on one of his blogs that a kid might be more likely to see it, but my memory stinks…so I might have just made that up, because it sounded good.

        • That’s easier said than done..Hopefully Forrest is happy I got my husband off the couch lol….my son did go 3 times…but then hit his teen years…and it’s all about girls and xbox.

      • I see it as a “from the mouths of babes” reference.
        They see the simple side of the clues. No overthink that we adults are prone to do.

        When I played MYST, there were puzzles I just didn’t get that were right there in front of me. I kicked myself a few times for not dumbing it down a notch.

  19. Hey DAL is there any way to set up a chat room? I worked a treasure hunt in Las Vegas for 2 years (Vegas Die) and the chat room was a great resource for all the treasure hunters, nothing like real time chat. If not thanks for this area to talk. ~ Mike

  20. Well, just a short note… Fenn’s “Poem” is a two sided painted canvas hanging on the wall.. The treasure is the Mona Lisa, Rembrandt, Picasso, etc painted on the BACK. The FRONT is painted with a series of painted colored arrows pointing in 9 different directions. We see those 9 arrows and we follow them.. but the real arrow is painted as a dot in the middle. If you were to look @ it from the side the dot is an arrow pointing thru the canvas to the back, where the real treasure is.

    The first stanza of a poem, gives the meaning to the rest of the poem. There are two clues there that no one has mentioned. I believe they’re there to give hard facts to the poem. I believe Fenn only said you have to follow in sequence. The first is in the first Stanza, People who know these 2 clues know where the blaze is. You Poets should Knowit.

    • Um can you clarify that a bit in more simple terms about the 2 sided painting. I think I know what you are meaning because of my thought process but I am not sure….. I wish I was a poet….. guess I am going to become one!

      • Just that what is on the front of the canvas is the poem. The treasure is on the back of the canvas. The front points you in a lot of different directions. We don’t see the one arrow hidden that points to the back of the canvas (“The Treasure”).

    • JP, sorry for the confusing sign in under NoWhereHere.. Switched to my wifes computer, using wrong name.

    • When you say us poets should know it, are you saying you know it, cause if you do, you should already have the treasure found. Someone as wise as you should have it figured out by now. Come on. Stop insulting others!!!

      • Molly, Didn’t imply either.. that I knew where the treasure was or insulting you. Only supplying a clue that was not found. Any questions?

  21. Wish-
    Forrest said start at the beginning but also said you have to start with WWWH. How does that mesh with your ideas about the first stanza?

    • Dal,
      The first stanza has two clues “Secret Where” and “Treasures Bold”. Fenn did not create those 2, he borrowed those as flattery to someones.

      • JP, I wish I could say but I would be giving away a big clue…if they are truly meaningful. Fenn may have used them for color… if not then you will definitely be looking @ poem in a different light, not following everyone else’s path. “A” connected to “B” as most people do.
        1. The clues are not easy to find on internet…
        2. It takes a lot of study, once you find them.
        3. Even after the study, they only may be there for “color”.
        Like Fenn said takes lot of study. Not simple to find.

      • NP mate, i understand. I know what you mean about how one approaches the poem.

        Many take the clues to be independent of each other and to support each other only from the sense that they draw a path to the treasure, i.e., connect the dots. I see it a bit differently.

        All the following represents a single location that allows one to home in on a particular spot to begin:

        “Begin it where warm waters halt and take it to the canyon down, not far but too far to walk – put in below the home of brown”

        This is a new approach for me as i had been thinking about it differently before then more in a connect the dot fashion.

        I have the first part pretty good. Now i need to understand the next set of clues in a different light: “from there it is . . .”

      • just because he borrowed some phrases shouldn’t mean that the phrases which are not his are the key to the whole thing. That shouldn’t make any sense.

    • Dal, A poem is usually explained in the first stanza. Well it’s like a “Treasure Hunt”, no pun intended, but usually you have to have a few items to take before you get started.. Like maps, compass, ice picks, etc. The 1 stanza gives those to you.. then you start at “Begin”. See if you overlook the 1st Stanza, you never picked up items you need later in when you “Begin”.

      But….. I’ve been wrong before.

    • How did I miss that one Dal. Sounds like clue #12 to me!

      Forrest sounded genuinely surprised to hear people were using Google Earth to search.
      That doesn’t sound like someone who means World Wide Web by the WWW part in this diddy.

  22. Has anyone thought of translating key words to spanish other than Ojo Caliente.

    Here are some thoughts to ponder.

    Your effort will be worth the cold.
    If you are brave and in the wood
    I give you title to the gold.

    Wood = “La madera” There is a La Madera, NM directly north of Santa Fe.
    Brave = “Valiente” There is a Rio Vallecitos directly east of La Madera, and a Rio Ojo Caliente starts where Rio Valiente and Rio Tusa merge.

    Home of Brown = “Pueblo Pardo” which is the name of ruins in New Mexico once inhabited by the Tiwa Indians.

    Put in below the home of Brown. In canoeing terms, “Put in” means put your canoe in the water.

    Canyon down = “cañada de la Cueva” joins with the Rio Ojo Caliente, not far downstream. cañada means glen in spanish or low lying.

  23. A controversial berm preserved this bit of dry-fly heaven, albeit for a price. As you stand on the west bank, the Yellowstone is running high, wide, handsome, and brown—brown with meltwater, streaming from the Yellowstone caldera and the peaks of the Absaroka and Gallatin Mountains which form the river’s valley

    Read more at Trails.com: Armstrong’s Spring Creek | Livingston Montana Fly Fish Waters | Trails.com http://www.trails.com/tcatalog_trail.aspx?trailId=FGU003-058#ixzz2Pai3IzDl

  24. Had a good idea I wanted to share……

    I’ve brought along many copies of The Poem, only to have them get wet, wrinkled, and torn…just to toss them and need to print a new copy for my next search. So, being the constant thinker that I am…..and not having a lamination machine at my finger tips…I devised a solution. Make a copy of The Poem, as small as you can that you can still read well. Then using clear packing tape, cover the text area on the front and back. Then cut out The Poem and make sure that you’ve really pressed well all over so it’s pretty good and sealed. It won’t be waterproof, but at least it should keep a bit better.

    Now just make sure that when you have this in your wallet, that you realize there is not a carry and conceal law passed for Forrest’s poem. If your on State of Federal land and this is found in your possession while holding a stick, picking up a rock, eating a sandwich, moving dirt particles, as you take each step….you will most likely be arrested and maybe given a life sentence. So don’t say I didn’t warn you……

      • Awww thanks Jen *hug*. I just got my packing tape one’s ready for my next trip…..which I wish was sooner rather than later.

    • Stephanie, I’m still laughing!!!! Other words translated one might consider is Timber = Madera
      and Forest = Bosque

    • Next you’ll be selling them on ebay for 2.00 a pop. Way to go Stephanie.

      • I just memorize POEM, that way I won’t have it on me when the FEDs FRISK me…

    • @Steph,
      That’s funny………concealed carry law for Forrest’s poem.

      I’ve been asking strangers what they think about the poem in an attempt to get new ideas. Last Wednesday the wife and I went over to the coast for her antique shopping fix. While she’s shopping I usually walk around town (small beach town) with the dog; on my walk I found several victims to ask about the poem. Apparently a county sheriff (the small towns don’t have police departments) had noticed I was talking to different people pointing and talking about a piece of paper I had handed them. As the dog and I was walking down the street looking for another victim the sheriff pulled over to the curb and ask to speak to me…….He asked what I was soliciting, if I had a permit and wanted to see the paper I was handing out. I told him I wasn’t handing out anything because I only had one copy with me; I was just showing it to them.

      I reached in my pocket and reluctantly pulled out the poem and handed it to him; thinking to myself how I was going to explain this to him without him calling the mental health department, and wondering if I could take my dog to the wife before he put the straight jacket on me. I told him I was just trying to get new ideas and started explaining the poem……..Much to my surprise he interrupted me saying, “Oh wow, that’s a great idea, Forrest said to show it to a kid to solve the poem.” He’s the only person (out of dozens) I’ve ask about the poem that knew anything about it. We had a great talk but he wanted to talk more because I’m familiar with the areas being searched…….The wife and I are going to have dinner this evening with him and his wife, it will be great fun.

      I still don’t have a clue about where the treasure is but I’ve got another friend.

      • Oh gosh what a great story. I was worried it wasn’t going to have a happy ending(and I wont’ see movies that don’t have a happy ending 😉 That made me smile so much. Not sure if you’ve seen the last post I just put up…that doesn’t have a happy ending yet, but….I hope it will. It’s crazy how we’re afraid to do anything anymore and I think we’re all victims of that without even realizing it. I can remember one of my first conversations with Forrest when I said something about going out West and worried if I could even pick up a leaf out there, because you can’t around Chicago…no joke…your not allowed to take leaves or flowers from our state parks…could get arrested. He said I could pick up a leaf there. I don’t think he realized maybe the laws have changed there too. It’s just such a shame. What a great story. Made my day 😉 Stephanie

      • That’s HILARIOUS..I hope he is not one of those sheriff’s I read about who kidnaps tourists and extorts them for clues in his basement…
        Just Kidding!!

      • @Dal,
        Well, the sheriff didn’t kidnap us. 😀

        Even if he did and extracted everything I know he would only be more confused. 😯

        They are really nice folks and he had some interesting thoughts on the poem. They can’t wait to get out of California but they aren’t sure where they are going. I told him to set up a base camp in a state with no state tax, get a big motorhome and go search for treasure. They were very excited about that idea……..

        It may be a complete circus in Santa Fe this summer. 🙄

        • Goofy-
          Okay..well maybe you were lucky this time..or maybe not…did you check under your car for tracking devices 🙂

      • TRACKING DEVICES 😈 Of course, that’s why he was so nice……Man that’s sneaky.

        Then again, all he would find out is I’m going around in circles. 😳

  25. I have been wondering about something. Fenn wants the chest to be found in about a 1,000 or even 10,000 years. He must know that Yellowstone is a massive super volcanoes that is already over due to go off. Given that, how would hiding it there accomplish his aim? Talk about a melt down!

    Even if it was in New Mexico it would get covered by a lot of ash but could be found by someone. Maybe Toledo is closer to the chest than we think. 😉

    • After researching what a caldera is……I think finding his chest will be the last thing we need to think about if it goes off. He’s talked about being concerned if there’s a fire if I’m not mistaken in one of the articles. So I don’t think he considered any natural disasters when placing it…he only placed it in his special private spot. If he had to have concerned himself with disasters…he’d have to move his special spot…and how do you do that?

    • John Paul

      Have you ever heard the saying “Like finding a needle in a haystack”. 🙂

      • Stephanie and Germanguy, it probably (sorry/pun intended) will change now!

        Now (oops) though – the probability of a needle being in a haystack is virtually nil However, if a needle was to end up in a haystack then the probability of finding it would depend on the size of our magnet.

        Now these guys think that the math exist to discover it without a magnet http://arxiv.org/pdf/quant-ph/9706033.pdf

        And of course myth busters has shown that it (finding a needle in a haystack) can be done!

        But if that box were to be swallowed by a lava flow all bets are off because it would no longer exist! 🙂

      • …. and in the case of the ROCKIES, you FIRST have to finde the CORRECT HAYSTACK …

  26. Halt definition

    lame on the feet (Gen. 32:31; Ps. 38:17). To “halt between two opinions” (1 Kings 18:21) is supposed by some to be an expression used in “allusion to birds, which hop from spray to spray, forwards and backwards.” The LXX. render the expression “How long go ye lame on both knees?” The Hebrew verb rendered “halt” is used of the irregular dance (“leaped upon”) around the altar (ver. 26). It indicates a lame, uncertain gait, going now in one direction, now in another, in the frenzy of wild leaping.

  27. Stephanie, are you telling me you don’t have this poem memorized yet? lol Kidding aside, that’s a good idea.

  28. The “house” (home) itself gave rise to the letter ‘B’ through an early Proto-Semitic hieroglyphic symbol depicting a house. The symbol was called “bayt”, “bet” or “beth” in various related languages, and became beta, the Greek letter, before it was used by the Romans… (maybe the reason for the capitol B in Brown?)… In Irish and Ogham, letters were formerly named after trees, for example A was ailm (white fir), B was beith (birch) and C was coll (hazel).

  29. Your efforts will be worth the cold.
    If you are brave and in the wood…

    In the poem Vafþrúðnismál, collected in the Poetic Edda, the god Odin poses a question to the jötunn Vafþrúðnir, asking who among mankind will survive when the winter Fimbulvetr occurs. Vafþrúðnir responds that they will be Líf and Lífþrasir, that the two will have hidden (in the wood) of Hoddmímis holt, they will consume the morning dew as food…

    • What in the blazes are you talking about louderback???? I have yet to get any help from you with this search let alone any meaning from a single one of your comments. When do you actually start to contribute? You might as well be saying ‘I found it’ for all the good you are doing. 🙁

    • Good job Louderback1960.. Thinking outside the box may solve this puzzle. The poem (Fenn’s) is a very interesting piece of work.. not just thrown off the cuff. Every piece has some purpose, just wish I was a better poet to unlock all of the clues.. because as we all know the clues are there in some form. Glad to see some people digging into the poetry. If you know what I mean.

  30. This is exactly like a Easter egg hunt! A million kids of all ages though, looking for that Golden egg. I suppose that every searcher should remember one thing, just because someone has said they have been to this spot or that spot and its not there you should not believe them for one minute that the treasure could not possibly be where they looked. Unless of course it is an EXACT SPOT no less than ten inches by ten inches they can show you.
    They could be trying to get you to go somewhere else while they continue to search that area. And remember too, just because someone has been to an area does not mean they could have been standing? within 5 feet of the treasure and just did not see it or walked right by it. My suggestion, follow your own path and instincts and do not be swayed by others. And remember too, you might be in the right place and just missed it too!

  31. @Dal –

    You mentioned mr. Fenn says that the key is WWWH. Where does he mention this? Is it a personal email, or in a blog, or in an interview? I know you said that Forrest says to start WWWH but that doesn’t necessarily make it the “key”…..?

    • Not the key. He said BEGIN with WWWH. It’s here on this blog somewhere. I think It was a comment he made on one of Stephan the Pirate’s posts.Maybe someone else here remembers where it’s at.

      • “WWWH is the key..Forrest said so himself. I believe it.”

        Sorry, I assumed you meant the key to the poem. You just meant it’s key, or important, to start WWWH…..

    • Some are loose with interpretations or paraphrasing of what FF said. For example, I’ve heard he actually said, “Begin it where warm waters halt” but I’ve also heard that he said “Begin at the beginning” or don’t start in the middle or something like that/ Those two things are vastly different of course. Just because the word “begin” is in the poem, that might not be the true beginning of the hunt. Does anyone have the exact quote from him? Is it “start at the beginning” or is it “Begin where warm…..”? Gracias.

      • Stance, in the Jennifer London interview he states that we are to follow the clues in consecutive order. That might not address your exact question. However, i am of the humble opinion that the first occurrence of the word begin means where we begin.

      • It’s also important to note that Forrest also answers the same question from different people in different ways. So you might see an answer to a question say one exact thing and in another statement he said something similar but not exactly the same. Maybe this means that dissecting words is more important to searchers than to Forrest.

        He also occasionally contradicts himself. For instance, dozens and dozens of times he has said “I never said buried, I said hid.” or variations of that phrase. But then on the WGN radio interview the first words out of his mouth were, “I’m 82 years old now and I buried it when I was either 79 or 80 years old.”

        Later in that same interview he once again stated that “I never said it was buried.”

        So go figure!

        In the poem it says “home of Brown” yet on this very blog he wrote “house of Brown”…

        And on and on and on…

        Forrest is a human being. A human being wrote that poem and gives interviews and writes email and makes mistakes. Just like Stephanie, Forrest occasionally contradicts himself ( 🙂 ) or bumbles his words or writes things differently today than yesterday.

        My point is that I think its very possible to look for clues where there are none. I realize that this won’t stop anyone and probably moments after I post this comment someone will post another comment asking where Forrest said “house of Brown”…

        All I can say is if you stay at home and go cross eyed looking at the poem from the back of the page and sideways and rearranging the verses you are missing out on all the fun. I don’t think Forrest had any reason to want us to analyze the poem under a microscope.

        Granted, it’s tricky. The exact meaning of the lines are shrouded in mystery. But I believe Forrest when he says start at the beginning, find where warm waters halt and the rest will fall into line. I have 6 more places lined up to look. I am VERY excited about 3 of them. I am kinda/sorta excited about the other 3. But I know I am going to have a spectacular set of days out looking and although I will look hard and use my noodle as best I can I suspect I will be heading home without an additional 42lbs in the back of my truck. I am not in the slightest unhappy about that prospect.

        • How do I contradict myself? I don’t think I mean to. I mean I like throwing out different ideas and possibilities. I don’t think that’s contradicting myself. Like I can say why I think he might have put it in YNP because he could fly in or drive a great distance so that he isn’t seen going there. Then the next day I could say that I can see him having it in Cimarron Canyon where he can drive down that road and maybe see it from the road. Is that what you mean? Just curious what you mean…not taking any offense. Stop saying anything about your spots and liking them so much…your scaring me.

  32. Aside from the obvious locals you cinnamon eaters under palisades are looking <~(also a viable spot) …I suggest the cache could be hidden simply on top of a lava flow.

    Many reasons to support this but won't tell all. However I will give one or two explanations as to why…
    Lava flows can be somewhat cumbersome to traverse but not difficult. They tend to be monotonous in there design and the experience wanes quite rapidly for most but for the true naturalist. <~(the kind of person Fenn believes might find the treasure) This allows for a simplistic place to hide a box knowing few go further than 100' on lava flows. A box laden with treasure could simply sit on top of a lava flow for centuries before being discovered all the while 500' from passer-bys.
    And there is no tree delima ..as Fenn explained if you walked far enough you eventual come to trees.

    This is one of many possible locations.

  33. Has anyone considered the home of brown to be the home of Molly Brown in Denver Colorado…when asked about BROWN being capitalized Forrest said think big…(Titanic)

    • When did he say that????? I’ve never heard that before. Yes, that was my first Home of Brown, because it’s such an odd way that the museum is titled. The Molly Brown HOUSE museum. So I thought it had to do with it being below Denver which were additional reasons that brought me to the Air Force Academy and also Cimarron. I figured maybe this is the route they could have taken up to Yellowstone when he was young since he sort of mentions directions there.

        • Maybe Dal can chime in then. I read on Gadi’s resource page that it’s important…but not big…and that can mean something totally different. That’s why I can be a stickler on what’s the verbiage. Don’t take it personal…

      • Also Stephanie he said that people had been within 500 feet of the treasure wouldn’t be easy to assume that if it is in the four corners that people ride by it all the time and you can only go by car or tour bus… not far but too fat to walk maybe means you MUST go by car
        and now I think the Blaze is def. a trail marker they are all over 4 corners http://youtu.be/dPeAuqCyvrs

      • Stephanie the clue your effort will the worth the cold there is a Burr trail in the same area I have been talking about… Burrrrrr as in cold and not for the down far.

      • Put in below the home of Brown south of Denver north of Santa Fe somewhere in-between

          • Im thinking off a road in the 4 Corners…on their website it says you can only travel thru there in a car or tour bus (not to far but to far to walk) MUST have vehicle to go…people have been with in 500 feet of it how does Forrest know this because people are riding by it all the time not sure what you mean by 25??

          • 25 is the road below Denver..isn’t it? I wasn’t looking at the 4 corners…haven’t looked in that area…. Kind of funny when you talk about the too far to walk part of the poem. Now whenever we give directions in our family….we’ll say take this road…it’s not far, but too far to walk…then giggle like school girls. It’s really kind of funny when my husband does it, because he doesn’t look like a school girl at all.

          • LOL that is a nice story…. I wish my husband would get involved in this…. as to 25 im not sure I’ve never been out west or anywhere for that matter im finding everything from computer a lot of youtube as well … if 25 is a specific # to you from the poem clues ….the speed limit on the video of 4 corners tour I posted is 25mph

          • Tarry scant clue when you find it hurry up and get back to the car before someone drives by and sees you its by a somewhat busy road and didn’t Forrest say a child you find it some of the places people are looking could be dangerous for a child…and he encourages family’s to go together a tour of the place I’ve been talking about is a nice family trip

          • Maybe the reason he says(if he does) that a child might be more likely to find it, is that it’s on the side of the road somewhere…where you can see it as you drive by. Kids tend to be the one’s glancing out the window since they don’t drive. Maybe that’s the reason him and Skippy ran along side the “slow” car. *sprinkle sprinkle*

      • If Molly Brown is important and her home was in Colorado. Think big, and use the home of Brown as the State of Colorado. Now, find a stream, creek or river, “put in” it and follow the other clues. Where does it take you?

    • ummm…not this dal…I can’t remember him ever saying that to me…and I try to listen very close when he speaks…lol…

      • Dal I have read too many things to count watched videos,etc. I wasn’t sure it was you but I am pretty sure it was some kind of an interview maybe with the guy from NBC but I am Positive when he was asked about that by whom ever he said think big… yet another vague I just thought of Molly Brown and Titanic

  34. The home of Molly Brown is in Denver Colorado… which is also ‘The Mile High City” 1 mile =5,280 feet… maybe in-between Denver and Santa Fe Four corners(The only way to get here is by automobile or tour bus) People who are auto touring can make a loop by driving south on the Notom-Bullfrog Road to the Burr Trail, then west on the Burr Trail to the town of Boulder, then north on Highway 12 to Torrey and Hwy 24, then east on Hwy 24 to their starting point in the park.***** Grand Circle
    ******

    • If looking in the four corners ..I suggest locating the more accurate surveyed location of the four corners and starting there.

  35. Hi everyone, I’m new to the chase and have really enjoyed reading this website. One question in my mind has to do with the possibility of the treasure being found in a hundred years or more. It seems that Forrest regards that as a possible outcome, but–if so–I wonder if he thinks it would then be found accidentally (given enough centuries) or if it will be found even then through analysis of the poem. If the latter, then it suggests to me that the nine clues would have to have a certain permanency about them. If “blaze,” for example, is a marker or sign, it would then need to be something that could really stand the test of time.

    A couple of other random thoughts: someone mentioned the Navajo code-talker’s language in the last Nine Clues post. I’m fascinated by ciphers of all sorts, so I did research the Code-Talker’s dictionary (you can find it with a quick google) which is fascinating but seems to have no relevance to this search. But the way it works is that a NAvajo word like big wind meant November, things like that. There were also other Native American languages used for codes in WWII, like the Hopi language (which would seem more in line with Forrest’s interests). I haven’t found any Hopi code-talker’s dictionaries yet though and it probably is a blind alley.

    One more thought: are any of you familiar with the unsolved treasure story of the Beale Ciphers? I was researching poem and book ciphers and came across the Beale Cipher story which struck me as interesting since the gold was described as originally being found “some 250 or 300 miles North of Santa Fe.”

    • There’s a reason the Beale Papers have never been solved. Edgar Allen Poe was a genius!

    • She has her own museum in Denver called The Molly Brown House Museum. So I thought that could be the big directional thing in the poem that would narrow it down to a location.

      • Okay sorry, did not catch that. But Leadville is not far from the mountain route of the Santa Fe Trail…
        That was an early idea of my husband’s and mine. We abandoned it but did not fully check it out.

        • I would def. check it out….when all clues match that certain spot that’s where it will be

      • I have another place I am more partial to now but the mountain route of the SF Trail makes some sense as a frame of reference. In the mountains north of Santa Fe and all.

    • Molly lived in Leadville with her husband until they got rich and then they moved to Denver for the culture and social avenues.

      • Outside Denver is the “Molly Brown Summer House” it is a big tourist attraction in Denver, but Maggie called it ‘Avoca’, after a poem by her favorite Irish poet, Sir Thomas Moore, called “The Meeting Of The Waters”.

        Possible clues? Now if we have “Brown”, we just need to figure out the relationship of “waters” here.

  36. dal,

    I know this can be a prickly subject, so I want to get this straight from the start. You are doing a fantastic job maintaining this site as a great resource for treasure seekers everywhere. I do not doubt your honesty in dealing with questions in the least. That being said you have many times said to be extremely careful with secondhand quotes from FF. I have seen the question about FF saying the treasure is in the Rockies raised a few times and a reply given without any direct attribution to him. I know, from experience, that sometimes we hear what we want to hear. We can be jaded by our own perceptions of things.

    Can you guide me to something direct from FF saying it is in the Rockies? I have found a spot, as we all have, which looks to match the clues perfectly, including the over 5k ft, which is outside the Rockies ( and also your recommendation of fuzzy areas). I have limited means to go on a treasure hunt and I don’t want to waste my time focusing in a place that is definitely out but, conversely, I don’t want to exclude it if what FF said might have been misconstrued.

    I hope to be here for a while and share in the trill. I hope I’m not starting out on the wrong foot. Again, thank you deeply for all that you are doing.

    • There is a post called most important posts on this blog. Go through those resources first. It includes tips from Forrest. Rumors and email where Forrest answers some questions himself.

  37. Okay.. Get ready… I’m about to tell everyone where the treasure is… Seriously! Begin it where warm waters halt = A MAJOR riverThat every other smaller stream/creek/river flows into… Spring thaw = warm waters. Warm waters halt @ the Rio Grande. And take it in the canyon down, not far, but too far to walk= Rio Grande begins to carve its canyon just above the home of Brown. Home of Brown= CoLORADO is the home of Brown..Remember-Forrest said think big regarding this clue. Molly Brown lived in Denver, C O L O R A D O! So put in below the home of Brown =Colorado/New Mexico Border!
    NOW GO GET IT AND CUT ME IN!!!
    Mike D

  38. I guess no replys means your all at work or you all ran out the door and jumped into your cars to get the chest!

      • All of this talk about Maggie Brown and Colorado is ludicrous…everyone please concentrate on NM and YNP…LOL

        “Move along, these are not the droids you’re looking for”

  39. World English Dictionary
    Brown (braʊn)
    Notice the Omega in braʊn?
    Remember the double Omegas in the book?
    Going number 2?
    The solid waste excreted by human beings and many other animals is characteristically brown in color due to the presence of bilirubin, a by-product of destruction of red blood cells.
    Anyone know of a waste treatment plant above a canyon anywhere?

    • I like the cut of your jib, matey, I do. Great word sleuthing & cudos on taking it out of the box! Oh, and yes, I do know where there is/are plants (that also release warm{er} waters) above canyons.
      Keep those posts a ‘comin & don’t get discouraged by nay sayers unless you get 86d of course, even then, keep pasting as a follower be. Your scandinavian lore does relate to ff’s gator. And some
      divide the “stanzas” of that epic by the funerals in the yarn which are themselves involved in the ritual of hoarding: the deposition of sacrificial objects with both religious and socio-economic functions.

  40. The earlier discussion between some of you about where the treasure/poem clues and hiding spot reminded me of a story I read as a teenager and has to do with perception . I don’t know if it is of any validity to anyone but it did provoke some thoughts for me on the poem and the treasure itself , hope it does the same for someone else.

    According to the Naturalis Historia of Pliny the Elder, Zeuxis and his contemporary Parrhasius staged a contest to determine the greater artist. When Zeuxis unveiled his painting of grapes, they appeared so real birds flew down to peck at them. But when Parrhasius asked Zeuxis to pull aside the curtain from his painting, the curtain itself turned out to be a painted illusion. Parrhasius won, and Zeuxis admitted, ‘I have deceived the birds, but Parrhasius has deceived Zeuxis.’
    This story was commonly used in 18th and 19th c. art theory to promote spatial illusion in painting. In a 1964 seminar, the psychoanalyst and theorist Jacques Lacan observed that the myth reveals an interesting aspect of human cognition: While animals are attracted to superficial appearances, humans are enticed by the idea of that which is hidden.

    Therefore I am re-evaluating what is hidden if anything about the poem/clues and it may explain why FF knows it is still there while others have walked by it.

    • Ragnar, it could be that Forrest is using one of those DARPA funded invisibility cloaks that uses optical phase conjugate metamaterials. OK, yes – i am out there but they really are doing this and have also been successful with spatio-temporal cloaks that make events disappear in time. A quick google will pull up some information on this.

      • I am aware of some the things you posted , not exactly what I was trying to convey, my main point is not to complicate things too much and don’t overlook the obvious , however I think the spatial-illusion is in effect here .There is a video, by Scientific American I believe, that demonstrates this illusion effect in a very dramatic way with very simple props , hope i can find a link to it.

      • I would like to see that video if you find it. I do get what you are saying. I imagine a complex layering of rocks such that it looks like it’s naturally part of the environment but actually has the treasure inside of it. If it wasn’t for the blaze you wouldn’t know it was there.

  41. I asked my 8 yr old son “where do warm waters halt”, but had to rephrase it to “where do waters stop being warm”. He came up with ice almost immediately. We decided to start at ice mountain, Co and it seemed to fit with below the home of Brown, if you consider Leadville as a possiblility for Molly Brown. I read she met and married JJ in Leadville and he struck gold during that time. Story seemed to fit with striking it rich by finding Forrests gold.

      • I considered the double omega that ppl reference from his book. Ice mountain is part of a three mountain massif. The other two are the North Apostle and West Apostle. In the end times it talks about two witnesses in the Bible, maybe two apostles, who knows.

        From here I considered St Elmo, Co. This is a well preserved ghost town that supposedly has had some hauntings. Maybe no place for the meek. I also read that the latch of his chest has CES on it, turn the letters around and you have SEC or St. Elmo, Co. I think this is more coincidence, but just some thoughts I had.

  42. Also just north of the mountain route of the SF Trail! St. Elmo is a neat place to visit. Good luck!

      • Do a google image search on Romley, Co. Look for the images of the bridge. This is about 2 miles south of St. Elmo (up Chalk creek). The bridge, I believe, used to be for rail cars (heavy loads) and in some images there is a discoloration about half way up the girders (water high).

        I haven’t thoroughly searched this area and since I’m not sure if I will be able to make it back anytime soon, maybe someone nearby could take advantage of this location.

        • Dal has a section on here of people willing to search for others and will do a split if they find the treasure. You might want to ask if anyone there is interested in doing something like that.

    • I am very confused here. I do not see the Santa Fe Trail being anywhere near Leadville, or St. Elmo, or the Four Corners Area being anywhere near well, anywhere. I find it hard to figure what you all mean “near.” Could Steph, or Tarry or Susan or someone please try to explain your logic here?

    • His brother wrote a story saying he couldn’t find it…I think it might have been due in part to the snow…so I think they might still like the area and are going to go out searching together. I believe Adam is back in the states now.

  43. the Burr trail is crossing The Gulch, historically called Alone Creek. the confluence with Steep Creek is about a quarter mile north of the Burr Trail. Brrrrr it’s cold Burr trail(brave the cold) Alone Creek (as I have gone Alone in there) Steep creek (not for the meek)

  44. Remember that FF is into excavation. The Brown House is not the same as the home of Brown. FF deals with Native American artifacts. Think Pueblos, and Spanish names. Rio Caliente (Warm River), La Madera (Woods), Rio Vallecitos (Glen or “Canyon Down”), Pueblo Pardo (Home of Brown)

    Also when it says to Put in below the Home of Brown. Canoers and Rafters will “Put in” below or above certain points in rivers.

  45. I leave Sunday for where I’m pretty sure the treasure lays I will send pic’s and also stay in touch with you dal

  46. Some out-of-staters may not realize how many people visit the public lands of New Mexico and the rockies. Wood cutters, hikers, sportsmen, rockhounds, all types of people search all over these mountains, and many of us try to go where we will find no one else. To have not been found by now and to be in a place that an old man/child could get to, it has to be in a really unique kind of place, the kind of place that no one wants to go to. Like a skunk den.

  47. Methinks perhaps many here are extrapolating too many nuances out of a limited number of clues:

    For a different tack, we took our clues to a local theatre group, asked ’em to read what we had, and then talk-act out a day in the life of Mr. Fenn, that day being the day he hid the box. We’re back east, in the Catskill Mountains, an easy place to play out the clues what with our geography of steep hills, deep valleys and lots of streams: turns out the acting group all kind of fell for the idea of a riverbank along a very snowy gorge, exposed only for a few weeks or months per year, easy to reach, not viewable from above or when paddling on the creek…..and the boxes weight would help keep it put.

    But then, perhaps, it wouldn’t be found for a thousand years……

    Going back to that postmark that looked odd, like it was June 5, 2013. From an astronomer friend (and guru) earth’s annual aphelion is on June 5th this year. On that date, after midnight, the crescent moon will be near Mars, with Jupiter not far astride. What could become available then? This was important stuff in the ancient’s minds, artifaces of which, Mr. Fenn treasures.

    Personally, if I were 2,000 miles closer, I wouldn’t be broadening the individual clues, I’d be broadening my co-conspiritors……

  48. Here’s a question for you all. I’ve been working on this since Feb 28, when the story hit the national news, as many others have. At this point, with all the attention, is it more likey that 20 or more people have deciphered the poem and are waiting for the spring thaw? Or, that no one.anywhere, has it figured it out yet?

    • John,

      I too began in late February and my thought is since this has been going on since about the fall of 2011, I could start out as a newbie, find all of the obvious locations in New Mexico and around Yellowstone that were discovered and searched by Dal, Stephanie, Richard, Mark and others, or I could “write off” the first 10 or 15 hot spots I came up with and look for areas less likely to be heavily searched.

      The problem with newbies is we ask the same questions the experienced searchers asked two years ago (if you watch the blogs you’ll see this all the time) and we find the same locations they found. There are exceptions of course but generally everyone reads the poem the same when beginning and that leads to the same locations. The blog posts prove this out also. But so many of us have limited resources and want to make it count so we choose carefully and wait for the snow to melt in the less heavily searched areas.

      So my answer to you is I think many of the newbies will be searching the same areas that are obvious but new to them, and many of the experienced will be searching newer areas.

      With that being said we have a couple newer clues that the experienced didn’t have, so that may eliminate some search areas for the newbies, but may not if we don’t read the blog posts first, and it’s obvious some don’t.

      No one can say if they have it figured out until it’s in their hands. I figure my best chance is to “go where no man has gone before”, so that’s what I look for.

      Yellowstone is going to be a madhouse this summer!

      jd

  49. I’m not quite sure what people are waiting for in regard to the “thaw”. We had a terrible snow year yet again, there isn’t any snow below 10K feet, and even above that its very thin, easily navigated, and the snow will surely have melted off of a treasure chest (as it has the logs, rocks, etc).

    • then why did Forrest say we should wait till spring/summer? Where is there snow? Or did he just like the idea we’d be warm and cozy out during our searching? Hmm….

      • If I remember correctly, his advice to wait until it’s warmer came the weekend that I was in Santa Fe which was the same weekend that the girl from Texas got lost. There was quite a bit of snow that came down in Taos and the higher elevations that weekend and “I think” Forrest just wanted us to use our heads and think safety first and “I think” the statement was made as a direct result of the “wayward hiker”. I didn’t read anything else into it as far as a clue or hint. Just my take on it 😉

      • i was greeted to at least 3 feet of snow in some areas of taos.. it didnt look or feel like it was going anywhere soon.. i knew it would be tough searching but had to see lay of the land . it was everything i imagined and more. it was everything babylonslim described.. immense rugged and craggily!

      • hello stephanie.. no we just got home yesterday. spent 5 days there, which of course is not nearly enough time … but still very enjoyable and hopefully valuable next time around.. its easy to see what keeps you and dal going back.. or to the other states involved. we also drove down to the bookstore in santa fe and got our copy.. my wifes read it and now i need to. its in my evening’s plan..:0

        • Oh fun. Yes you’ve seen what keeps us going. I just am in awe of the landscape. Each trip I find myself being brave about something too which is fun. You’ll love his book. He has such a neat way of writing. You’ll be done in no time and wish there was more.

  50. Just thought Id share here what I wrote in the NM section. As it belongs here better.

    Just another thought on the up YOUR creek. The line is: There will be no paddle up your creek.
    To paddle up a creek means you are in trouble and your situation is hopeless. So in his phrase, he is actually saying “it isn’t a situation you can’t get out of. Have hope. ”
    Because he says there will be NO paddle up YOUR creek – it means that your particular situation isn’t hopeless.
    Just another thought

    • Actually, It would mean that there is no hope. Because, if being up a creek without a paddle is to be without hope, then “there will be no paddle up your creek.” However, the phrase does not mean hopeless, it means in over your head. Just think about that for a minute.

  51. 100,000 people “KNOW!” where it is….,10,000 of those will actually attempt to look for the box…1000 will be in the correct state or “region” by attrition alone. 100 of those MAY have correctly solved the first two clues… 10 of those MAY have correctly solved the third clue…One of those MAY go on to WANDER past the site by dumb luck… BUT NOBODY WILL FIND THE CHEST!! IT IS THERE….But you will miss it. Unless you KNOW EXACTLY WHAT AND WHERE to do and go from the home of Brown…

    • Mike,
      you don’t need me or anyone else to validate you conclusions, but I agree with you 100%!!
      The following is from Forrest’s “Thrill Resource Page”:

      – – This poem written by Forrest Fenn contains nine clues that if followed precisely, will lead to the end of his rainbow and the treasure. Happy Hunting!

      What part of “precisely” do people not understand? What makes people think they know more about the location than Forrest does????

      All (perhaps 10,000, if not more), who actually search for it, can go to YNP and dig for a long time, they still won’t find it!

      Fred W

    • It’s like the guy said… “Nooopppee itttsss noott herrre”, “Nooopppee itttsss noott herrre eitherrr” will be ECHOING through the Rockies this year… like the RICOLA, RICOLA commercial but without the “ALPINE HORNS” in the background…

      DEFINE: The alphorn or alpenhorn or alpine horn is a labrophone, consisting of a wooden natural horn of conical bore, having a wooden cup-shaped mouthpiece, used by mountain dwellers in Switzerland and elsewhere.

    • Thanks for the info Stephi – it all SHOULD help, but we’ll have to see if it actually does. 😀

  52. I lived in that region for 4 years and within a short while after reading the poem I was fairly confident of where he was talking about and only confirmed it through research- and yes I’m just waiting for spring time to fly back to the mainland to spend a couple weeks/months looking for it. Helps having been already out there before he went and hid the treasure. I would regret not giving it a go and hearing later it was found where I think it to be. I’m not 100% on 100% of the poem, but I’m 100% on the starting point- just foggy in the middle.

    Thanks Dal for this site- it’s been a great a resource in trying to decipher the poem and has helped me personally with a few clues. Your insight and friendship with Forrest is invaluable in this endeavor, and sharing what you have is very kind and generous.

  53. Forrest said you will be surprised when you open the chest because it may be empty and then you have to bring the chest to him to get the prize
    This way he knows when the chest is found. Did any think of that if so, sorry but Nobody can remember everything posted here.
    Or maybe there is a rubber snake inside or just a ball of string

      • Steph
        I am serious because if it is on Fed land all they can do is get the chest and if you get a million or more later who would care giving up a 25k chest.
        He said he hid the chest, not the chest plus all the goodies, he said earlier he put the gold in but he could have taken it out and stored it somewhere that you go outside Fed land to claim the prize maybe?

        • Yeah I love the idea…I’m being serious too. When he says you’ll be surprised when you open up the chest…that would be funny cool I think. I mean he’s kind of said he didn’t want to do that, because if he wasn’t around anymore….but maybe the feds changed his mind and he’s figured a way around that…maybe there’s a note that says…see my lawyer. Probably can’t be done without someone figuring out how to get around it though..but I love the idea.

          • Steph
            2 trips
            One trip to place the light 10 pound say chest with the treasure like map in it and the 2nd was the place the bootys is buried somewhere you later go to get that. I know this is not solving the poem but then he could have gone in there further and also would not have to worry about it being confiscated cause they whoever would only get the ches even him if stopped when placing it. The map if you put in your pocket they can’t force you to empty your pockests, even if you did you could say the map in my pocket was what I used to find the chest and they cannot take a piece of paper from you because it is only a worthless piece of paper and they have no way to prove you didn’t make it yourself.
            To me nothing would be as much surprising as finding an empty chest with just a note in yet?

        • He said he made TWO(2) 20 lb trips in… so just how do you divide up the CHEST… to make TWO(2) 20 lb trips in if the 20 lb chest is empty ? Don’t over-think it. His TWO(2) Trips statement is well publicized.

          • Maybe he took the chest 10pounds? Then he took a zippy with another 10lbs on one trip….Then the next trip he took two zippies with 10 pounds each…one for each hand. Is this an additional riddle? Do we get points for this?

          • SantaFe Smart
            I don’t think he said that anywhere if so please give me the link, the only thing I can remeber about two trips is maybe Steph saying he mentioned it to her or someone. Don’t over assume it

          • No I know for sure he said that, because he said it to my husband and son when they were there and he recently I believe said it somewhere else. So that I would believe 100%…well, it is coming from me…get your grain of salt out if you don’t trust my memory or character…lol….

          • Steph
            I believe you but what i was tryin to say when he said he made two trips to hide the treasure, may be one for the chest and another in another place for the treasure. I did state two trips but did he actually say to the same place, i think people assume so but maybe it is in two different places.
            So when SFsmart said two trips in the same place he did not understand my meaning and critized me for overthinking. I thought it might be a logical thought no one has thought of.
            Do you and SFsmart get my original thought and sorry I said 10 some punds for the chest but that was not the point and the point was not the pounds but the chest and treasure could be two differnt places.

          • I think that I remember reading that DAL thinks Forrest may have found the “HIDEY SPOT” a long time ago. And then Forrest responds to the two(2) trips using 20lb Dog Food example as …


            I received a nice letter today from a delightful woman in Colorado Springs. Her name is Jeannie. She said she was in the grocery store and looked at a bag of dogfood that weighed 20 pounds so she put two of them together to see if she could lift them (the treasure weighs 42 pounds) she said she couldn’t budge the two bags. Maybe that’s why a 79 year old man had to make two trips to hide the treasure. f

            http://lummifilm.wordpress.com/2013/03/26/scrapbook-twenty-nine/#comments

          • Oh missed that part. Sometimes I read posts too fast or get distracted on my end here. That’s an interesting idea….

          • The chest weighs 20 pounds (one trip) and the booty weighs about 22 pounds (second trip). It’s not rocket science and it’s on this blog and elsewhere…..

          • I agree you about the shovel… it’s probably not buried… but under water for part of the year… you don’t need a shovel for that… I still think it could be under water.

            BRONZE is used a lot in PLUMBING…

          • The interior of the box is lined in wood and I just find it hard to believe he would place an unlocked $25,000 beautiful chest underwater and possibly ruining it. I suppose if he sealed it in a waterproof container, it could be underwater.

          • Except that he says it will be in the elements….so even rain and snow would probably hurt the wood…any moisture would.

        • Tim

          You underestimate the brilliance of this man. Do a google search for Common law regarding abandoned property. That should put your mind at ease.

      • The problem with this line of thinking is that Forrest has said on several occasions that he would like to have the bracelet back and has had 2nd thoughts about putting it in there. If he still had it, he could do anything with any of the treasure before it is claimed. Nobody would have “title” to it until Forrest gave it to them.

  54. JD,
    I agree with you. I’ve gone the route others have two years ago. I’m just trying to get through the learning curve faster. And like you, find a remote, obscure site. Do you have yours yet?

    • As a professional geographer and frequent explorer of northern NM, I am becoming skeptical that the poem describes the treasure’s hiding place. There are many possible locations, but not that many and given the intensive use of these lands, in addition to the searchers, it seems unlikely to stay hidden for so long. Perhaps the poem itself is a giant word jumble, or every fifth letter translates to its rank in the alphabet and lists out a GPS coordinate, or only read the first word in the first line and the second in the second, etc.

      • “I am becoming skeptical that the poem describes the treasure’s hiding place … Perhaps the poem itself is a giant word jumble, or every fifth letter translates to its rank in the alphabet and lists out a GPS coordinate, or only read the first word in the first line and the second in the second, …”

        Something like that Good luck,astree

    • John,

      I have a location that no one is talking about. It’s not obscure to people outside of the chase, tourists frequent the general area, but not the spot, and I think that might help “preserve” the integrity of the spot for the long run. Of course tourists can be searchers too. Just no one in the chase has talked about it. I’m waiting for the snow to melt and trying to pinpoint other areas nearby to have multiple sites to search when I go.

      It took some creative thinking to get there, so I could be way off base. We’ll see.
      Good luck to you.

      jd

  55. Some interesting tidbits:

    A canyon is a deep, narrow valley with steep sides.

    Denver is located in the South Platte River Valley on the western edge of the High Plains just east of the Front Range of the Rocky Mountains. That goes along with foothills being part of the rockies.

    Home of Molly Brown.

    The Denver downtown district is located immediately east of the confluence of Cherry Creek.

    Brown Palace Hotel

    • OK, OK, now that I’ve waken from my afternoon nap I’m back to reading the best thing going on the internet. You guys! You must take into account that he did say “And take in the canyon down, not far, but too far to walk.” which does not mean that the treasure is hidden in a canyon. It might be that the treasure is hidden beyond the canyons end on to flatter ground? He was only using the springs as a starting place to point you in the right direction.

  56. I agree with Forrest.
    When I was young my grandfather took me to the mountains where we collected wild mushrooms. He has several named after him. I learned a lot about the mountains, biology and the great taste of something grown in the wild. When in season there are usually many around. My grandfather has since passed. I took my kids up in the mountains to have the same experience . When we got to a secluded area in the mountains there were signs posted on trees by Uncle Sam not to pick mushrooms. Now I understand that to leave them for all to enjoy may be OK. However, when there a many out there in the hundreds of acres of forest it seems to me a few missing would not hurt anyone. Have we restricted ourselves out of being able to enjoy the mountains? Are they going to become like a store front where you can only look but not touch?

    I was in the mountains north of Santa Fe today and there is still a few feet of snow in the lower creek areas. Areas that face the sun are melted. this was at about 8,000 feet.

    • it maybe that the sign is posted there, because some can be poisonous though? But just wondering…did your grandfather ever tell you about a variety by the name Brown such and such mushroom?

  57. I’m a big fan of cryptograms and jumbles. Has anyone played around with either of those? I know someone talked about using Scrabble tiles, but I think a person could get there faster at
    http://ull.chemistry.uakron.edu/solveit.html.

    Then there’s the puzzles where you change one letter to make whole other words. Or how about you add a letter somewhere in any given word, front, back, 3rd. Well, I guess I can scrap the plan for cleaning my car this weekend.

    • I have but my hubby keeps saying no way did f do that, and to KISS! (Keep It Simple Stupid) Like a child….. I love playing around with words, I even made some crossword puzzles yesterday using poems……… yeah that got some odd looks! Thanks for the link I’ll check it out!

      • Your hubby is probably right. Changing obvious clue words would be self defeating. However, what about, say, every ninth letter or word. But again, as a wordsmith, FF probably wouldn’t do such things to a poem he perfected.

        Years ago (and I mean LOTS of years-sometime early eighties) there was a computer game called Adventure, long before such advances as animation and graphics. This game was word clues to explore and find treasures in a cave (no pictures, just a black screen with words on the left margin). To secure a treasure and move on, you had to type in exactly the word or phrase it was looking for, such as west, up, across, north. I never did reach the end, but I had big ledger size paper with drawings and directions about finding the various treasures. I think I recall one being a “plover’s egg”. Anyway, I keep dwelling on how to use this poem in a similar fashion. Coming up empty.

    • I have put it together and treated it like a word search 2 different ways. One looking for words sideways and one up and down, due to the layout of sentences. On the sideways one I got 48 word. One the up and down one I got 43 words. I started to cross off the ones that were duplicates and came up with 26 words that were not repeated. LOL This may actually mean something or totally PROVE that I have waaay too much time on my hands!!! LOL Here;(my caps)
      TIE, I.Q., GPS, NUDE,SENT,, WIELD, DALE, LAD, ION,ZELDA,MOON,HOST,EYE,ROT,ARE,BED,NEW,DENT,IT,SEAT,LET,GET,TIER,NO,OWL,NIL,

      • I got “in the home town of pueblo W” with a br left over from put in below the home of brown a bit ago. There happens to be a pueblo west and it has trails and warm waters halting. But it has leftover letters.

      • I think that I heard or read a quote from FF saying,”only the phantom knows” lol Well, I just got done watching a n*tfix documentary about Wolverine~the Phantom, and one of it’s ‘haunts’ is Glacier Nat’l. Park, and it makes it’s burrows under 10 feet of snow pack that doesn’t melt until May for it’s kits.

        • Kim,

          “Only the PHANTOM knows”… now that’s different than “Only the SHADOW knows”… ( a popular saying originating from Saturday Morning Radio Serials )

          … the phrase sounded so familiar that I mistakenly equated them, but they’re not……. hmmm

      • or go hike under the Santa Fe Opera in the wash aka arroyo. or in tunnels with an underground water system. because that’s where the “phantom’ took the lady he kidnapped.

      • they also catch the wolverine in a trap that looks exactly like a woodpile but the lid on it lifts up.

  58. Let me assure everyone here that Forrest Fenn thought of EVERYTHING!! Like the man said, “whoever finds the treasure will have read the poem over and over, and studied it, and thought and planned and will go DIRECTLY to the treasure-the poem is a DETAILED MAP!! I GUarantee it!!

  59. “the chest was not hidden in a tree but that it was surrounded by trees”. I think this is a restatement of “if you are brave and in the wood”. Obviously if you are in the wood you are surrounded by trees.

    Both of these wood references though could also literally mean the chest was blocked from view unless you squeezed into a clearing of trees. It could also mean it is in a larger hollow tree, a thicket of vines, a wooden box, or in a wood pile. (I think a log cabin is ruled out by being a structure). This may also limit the actual altitude height. It might have to be BELOW the treeline. Trees don’t grow above certain altitudes. He also mentioned he was concerned about wildfire. The box might survive but his surrounding of trees might not!

    • TJH
      I think you are corect in some ways but I tend to think the opposite of that
      he was a pilot and I think they would prefer and I am only thinking the he would prefer the open blue skys where you could see almost forever and see everything below maybe

    • Tony

      Am I missing something here. Have you figured out all the clues and are now working on “If you are brave and in the wood”?

  60. It could also mean it is surrounded by trees if you zoom out far enough. i still believe it could be in a very desolate treeless location. He states its “in thee mountains N. of Santa fe” but if I hug you, you are “In my Arms” even though my arms only surround you. This could be said of both the mountains and the trees. I am telling you now… the chest will be found near the Rio Grande river…

    • Dal has a great blog about the confluence of the Rio Grande and the Red River and the Hondo I think it is. I hadn’t realized there was such a thing before. I think he’s also talked about the hot springs that are by it. We learned at the visitors center about another hot springs up there that I had been unaware of till we went there. We plan on checking that out next visit.

  61. When Forrest said he was concerned about fires, mudslides avalanches Tsunamis, etc. That just made me more confident that wherever he put it, its relatively stable and safe. He believes the location will endure for 1000 years…Think about that for a second, and you will eliminate thousands of possible locations…It HAS to be high in elevation, the higher, the safer. It has to be in a geologically STABLE are, NOT like Yellowstone, but more like New Mexico. Yellowstone history and prehistory is spotty, because of geologic events like floods, earthquakes, mudslides, etc. The geologic stability of N. New Mexico is proven by the MANY Prehistoric and Pre-columbian ruins located there. This man is a THINKER!! We will not outthink him, but we might begin to catch up with him if we try…

    • I really hope you can answer this. Do you know where he said that he believes the place will endure for 1000 years? I’ve never seen him say that and I’d like to see a quote on how he put that. I know he’s said he’s ambivalent(is it just me, or is that a fun word to say?) as to if it will be found now or then…but never heard him say the place will endure.

      • Sorry, misleading statement. He has said 1000, 10,000, etc which leads me to believe he is smart enough to have placed it in a location that has a chance of staying unchanged for that period of time… i don’t believe he actually said it Would.

  62. He also talks about the rosetta stone not being found for 2000 years and how proud the guy that carved it must be…

  63. I wanted to postulate on how I thought you could hide a box in the middle of nowhere. I actually drew several pictures to flesh out my ideas of how I would hide a box in the wild!

    1) It is just under a pile of rocks or logs or a small leaf covered trench. Not quite buried but not quite in sight. Doesn’t have much staying power unless covered by some rocks. Makes it really hard to find though if under some rocks. My first idea here is just of a bear trap, without the spikes, containing the box.

    2) It is within a tight circle of trees. You can only see it when you are within that circle of trees. Not from above by Google Earth, plane or any side as the trees are thick. This also applies to a thicket of sorts. Would have to be non-deciduous trees so it was always the same level of camoflauge. It’s darn hard to find the correct circle of trees in a forest!

    3) It is in a terrain so ugly but is just sitting within an openig in some rocks. This would be like a lava field or in a bad lands type of place. In some terrains you can be within 20 feet of someone and not find them. Perfect place to hide a box, just off a trail, but hidden completely by the non-meekness of the terrain. I got this idea from my travels to lava fields in Hawaii. There are so many jutting rocks and jagged holes that a box could be 10 feet from you and you don’t see it unless you are over it. I found many petroglyphs there by ‘stumbling’ on them. Seems a likely place.

    4) The box is under snow/ice. You say why is this important becasue the snow would just melt? We know he said it is currently under 3 feet of snow. But what if it never melted there. The box would be hidden until some global warming took effect. It could be 3 feet into a glacier or 3 feet above the permanent snow on a mountain. Maybe it was also 3 feet deep when he buried the box in the snow at the height of summer, the low point of the snow.

    Happy hunting!

    • and maybe under water. Some don’t think so, but he talks about the fantasies on the river bottom…so I wouldn’t discount it all together. What if he wanted it in the water? Then wouldn’t a bronze box be a good choice for that? Is postulating legal? *tease*

      • I REALLY wanna rule that out, but I must admit I cannot. It seems SO INSANE that it just might be true…

      • What about an abandoned beaver lodge or den in one of the rivers? Might not be enduring but the treasure would lie underwater but it would be dry? Or does this violate the not associated with structure proclamation? Note that the water flow in the cimarron is partially controlled by the dam.

      • Can we at least finally rule out Beaver damn for everyone who is stuck on that??
        Yes a beaver is brown and lives in a cold stream in a warm den, but It seems really dangerous to go poking around in a beaver’s home. I don’t think they like that and they do have some big teeth! Grizzlies are also brown and don’t like when you visit unannounced!
        Fjording in a mountain stream is also totally dangerous. Imagine getting your arm/foot stuck under a loose rock and drowing to death in 2 feet of water.

        Be safe my fellow explorers!!! Abide by all common sense outdoor rules!!

        • Here’s a dime’s worth of my thinking today. The house of Brown cannot be something like Unsinkable’s house — that won’t stand another 100 or more years. It can’t be any structure such as that. It also can’t be something like Casa de Marron (House of Brown) restaurant or hotel or any such thing because that business could be sold and name changed or burn down and the puzzle would be unsolvable if home of Brown is critical to the solution — can’t be ANYTHING that isn’t absolutely permanent (barring a natural disaster against which there is no protection). So if it can’t be anything named Brown and can’t be anything man-made, it almost has to be a natural phenomenon or something occurring naturally in the universe. Maybe the fact that Brown is capitalized is the same as when he has said – think big! Maybe it’s as simple as he capitalized it so we would see big B instead of little B. So I would suggest all the Molly Brown followers are just plain wrong, but also all the Brown Ranch or Brown Hotel or Brown Valley would also be wrong because those are things named by men and just might not be lasting names at all. Gotta be something more expansive and wild and weird and out of the box — a legitimate play on words……

          • I agree with you 100%. That is one of the bullets I shot into all of my potential locations, until I finally found one that would totally stand on it’s own. No matter what.

          • “Maybe it’s as simple as he capitalized it so we would see big B instead of little B.” After all, he did say think “B”ig. 🙂

          • Uhhhhh……. One sec…….. OPPs…. Just had a memory crash. Please hold on as I Reboot.

      • I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well. I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help! http://www.facebook.com/blainebosserman

      • Stance,

        Please try to state your opinions as just that…not fact. There are a lot of new searchers that are reading these comments, and probably taking them as absolute truths. If you write “it can’t be X, and can’t be Y, so has to be Z” flavor it with a bunch of LOL’s, IMHO’s, “Just my 2 cents”‘s, etc so newbies understand that your thoughts are not the consensus of the blog.

        To shoot a couple of holes in your thoughts…(can I get thrown out of school for saying that these days?)…there are many ways to designate a location as a home of a real person, that will stand the test of time…long after you and I have gone to the farm with Old Yeller. How do you think people have found out that Leadville is the home of Molly/Maggie Brown? 1000 years from now Googlers will still be able to find that fact out. If a clue says “under the big nose of Lincoln” I think it would still lead you to Mt. Rushmore a few hundred years from now. Most “Homes” of famous people are marked with plaques, monuments, or statues, and most certainly recorded in writings, national historical designations, local knowledge, folklore all of which pass the smell test of 100, 1000, or 10,000 years (depending on what you believe Forrest did or didn’t say).

        Incidentally, I am not sure why I am writing this, as I do believe in the Molly Brown conspiracy theory…but I think we need to only present opinions, and let the good folks digest and decide for themselves IMHO, LOL.

        BTW, I forget who mentioned the metro Denver area as a possible location, but with 4,000,000 residents, it would be hard to find a spot that someone wouldn’t stumble over it. Also, if you go to the Brown Palace Hotel and tell them you are looking for a chest, you may get directed to a hooker. My 2 cents:)

        • Everywhere you go though, there is always some spot that is “OFF the BEATEN PATH” that even MAINTENANCE CREWS do not even go through… places only visited by the wildlife on occassion… coyotes, even in NEW YORK CITY, which btw, is not in the ROCKIES, as UNEXPECTED goes…

          Coyotes have been spotted in the Bronx, Queens and even Manhattan. Places you wouldn’t expect them to be… but just saying no place “IN THE ROCKIES” can be ruled out… even if you’ve been there, you could have walked past it… : )

          http://www.sciencefriday.com/video/04/06/2012/coyotes-cruise-nyc.html

        • That’s too funny about the hooker. I’ve thought if it was in a well populated area that it could be IN a bronze. Remember when he talks about teaching his friend at Shidoni how to make a lid for the jars? Seemed to me that worth the cold could be a bronze and that there might be a secret compartment in a bronze that people go by all the time. No one would find it unless they knew it was there….right? I was thinking it could be an indian(brave) possibly.

        • How arrogant are you to police my thoughts on here. For the love of God, when I say, “it’s my two cents worth” that means it’s my OPINION. How much more clear can it be! I’m sick of all of you.

      • Scott C.

        Glad you’re back.

        The chest joke was a good one. I was bowling the other night and a pin fell out of the rack as it was coming down to set up a new set of pins. I commented “I hope we don’t have a bad rack tonight”. One of my teammates returned “I love all racks!” It took me a minute to realize what he meant, but I finally got it.

        keep searching!

        jd

    • Tony-
      I’m with Mike on this-
      Please tell us when Forrest said the treasure is under 3 feet of snow?
      I know he said Yellowstone was under 3 feet of snow…

      • My mistake. Retracted. Still doesn’t rule out being buried under snow or ice, by choice or by nature.
        Under water does not pass the child can get there rule though. I would cross off underwater. It also is extremely corrosive. Ice and (permanent) snow however will preserve the box. Anyplace in the runoff of snow melt seems like a poor choice too since it is basically a wet environment. Dryer would be better for longevity of the box.

        • >> I would cross off underwater. It also is extremely corrosive

          Except that BRONZE is used in PLUMBING… and that WATER is NOT CORROSIVE… WATER has a PH of 7, NATURALLY NOT CORROSIVE… “pH” stands for the “POWER OF HYDROGEN”.

          DEFINE: Pure water has a pH very close to 7 at 25 °C. Solutions with a pH less than 7 are said to be acidic and solutions with a pH greater than 7 are basic or alkaline.

      • I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well. I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help! http://www.facebook.com/blainebosserman

        • Blaine, it’s not necessary to post the same thing multiple times. I think everyone has seen your post by now. 🙂

  64. I do not believe Forrest EVER said it is currently under 3 feet of snow. That sir, is MISINFORMATION?

  65. NM Game and Fish and National Parks spokesmen say today in an article in The New Mexican, “No finders keepers.”. I imagine that any other state where the chest may be hidden will probably announce the same thing. This possibly changes the whole dynamic of the quest …Whoever finds the chest will have to choose between fame and no fortune or fortune and no fame.

  66. Hello all:
    As a newbie, i can’t say how much I’ve enjoyed the “thrill of the chase” but I’ like to present several points that may seem obvious even to a child.
    If I ask myself where do warm waters exist over 5000 feet in elevation North of Santa Fe. They have to come from hot springs or some type of thermal outlet. I don’t believe the sun can create enough warm water at that altitude to be a consideration.
    Forrest knows that no one has found the treasure, because of the winter snow.
    Everyone seems to have tried to make this more complicated that it probably is.
    As I’ve studied the poem(and the history of Forrest) I’ve changed my ideas numerous times until I think I know “the house of Brown” “worth the cold” and “in the wood”
    My ideas are different from all that I’ve read in the blogs, but enough.
    I wish y’all the best of luck, and safe chasing,
    Emmett

    • The warm waters is the lake at the end of the canyon the creek runs through! I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well. I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help! http://www.facebook.com/blainebosserman

  67. My thoughts about under water. I think that if it is under water it needs to be in a protected spot. Some sort of small cave or similar carved out spot. Think about this, place a 45 pound box in a water course, it would get pummeled by sand and rocks when there is extra run off from heavy rain or spring runoff. Would not this ruin the chest? May be it is in protective wood? If it was not placed on a rock solid bottom the water would scour around and underneath and it would become buried by debris. That is why to find gold you have to get to the bottom bedrock. Heavy stuff works its way down. I feel it would be at a significant spot, not just some random pool in a creek. Without a GPS coordinate it would be difficult to find. To me it does not make any sense to place a treasure in a such a place. The treasure is at a destination. I think. I am in the double digits of searching so… may be not so smart.

    • when I looked under water, my reasoning is why did he make it so darn heavy. I mean I don’t think I could lift it really even. So I thought maybe the reason for the weight was that it would have to withstand the movement of water. Also, he has said that he chose bronze because of it’s properties. He owned his own foundry…so he knows bronze. His nephew knows sunken treasure. I don’t have that as a quote…but I’m pretty sure that’s what was said…that he chose it because of it’s properties…I do agree that it would need to be in a place where it wouldn’t be disturbed by fishermen. That is why we looked at places in Cimarron under the roadway in the big giant culverts. We looked at the one’s we could in the fall when the water level was lower(worth the cold). It was dark under there…so a flashlight was helpful…and if I had, had a sandwich I would have tossed it to the bear. I didn’t find it though…

      • >> and if I had, had a sandwich I would have tossed it to the bear.

        STEPH, ( only because you didn’t get hurt )… THAT IS SO FUNNY !!!

        What do I feed the RATTLESNAKE that bit me in our REMOTE VIEWING ? Would BEAR SPRAY WORK, or just make it MADDER ?

        They say RATTLESNAKES can control the amount of VENOM they inject, DRY BITE all the way up to the SNAKE is MAD, which means COMPLETE INVENOMATION…

      • Stephanie, I think I can help.

        You must bE the box. Become one with the box.You are worth one million in fine jewels. Are you in a drainage ditch? Are you slowly drowning at the bottom of a stagnant pond? Are beaver’s using your pretty stash to decorate their bathroom?

        No, you are special… and in a special place.

        • Ok, then I’m in one of those shops in the SF plaza looking out at the pretty clothes they have for sale….I don’t think it’s working…because I don’t think it’s there…but I kind of like feeling like a pretty bronze box full of jewels…I like this method solving idea. Probably best if I turned myself into a boy box…and thought about worms, dirt and ugly fish. Maybe that’s my problem…I think like a girl.

      • I want to channel your feminine side as I am also drawing a blank. Let’s try this again. Remember that you have great knowledge and your vast knowledge and beauty is to be treasured and admired by all.

        OK now, don’t bE the box. Be IN the box. Don’t believe what they told you to try and be outside the box. You are IN the box. Repeat, “I am IN the box,” 9 times slowly taking deep breathes, getting ever more relaxed…

        into the box you go…

        [repeat] I am in the box…

        Deeper,… deeeepeeer, deeeeeepeeerrrr into the box…

        [repeat] I am in the box…

        Deeper,… deeeepeeer, deeeeeepeeerrrr into the box…

        You can’t see can you? It’s dark and cold. You sure would like to be out of this cold dark place and in some warm hand, being admired and cherished again. It’s like a coffin, a sarcophagus. Only bones nearby. There is the smell of a half decayed old man. It’s awful, it’s hell, it’s purgatory. You wish for release weather it be by destruction or freedom.

        Where are you feeling like you are now? GPS coordinates please! no vague feelings!

    • There happens to be a home of a certain brown butterfly in a certain canyon in the foothills of the Rockies. Off the top of my head I can’t think of the species but I just happens on it in an encyclopedia. Never thought I’d use one if those ever again. Have fun with that!
      I couldn’t get the other clues to align after that though. But I did make it to home if brown.

      • Jen
        Butterflys now are we (LOL)
        I think you asked me why butterflys and it is the same reason you are now intered I think but I let that one fly away and I only get butterflys in my stomach now.

          • Jen
            During the last outing a butterfly landed on branch just eye level to me on the trail and it let me look at him before flying off, later a few yards up the trail the rare butterfly that I was interested in lflew right by me and landed on a bush a few feet away and I went over and got a long look and then it also flew away. I was sorta freaked out because before the trip I noticed on the internet that there was a unique and small numbers of a rare butterfly in that area and one landed nearby.

          • Oh! I bet that was an amazing experience!! I have a friend in the zoology realm. Think I will enlist him on this angle. I might need your email. 🙂

  68. So, if it’s found on Federal land,and the Feds find out and don’t let the finder keep it….might it then become owned by the Federal government end up somewhere like the Smithsonian?

    • I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well. I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help! http://www.facebook.com/blainebosserman

  69. Would they be that arrogant knowing the circumstances to take it away from the finder?

  70. Heading out tomorrow from Pennsylvania to NM.
    Driving with a friend, be there in 2-3 days
    My one and only shot, using my Dads clues and his every last cent, he’s convinced that his spot is the “ONE”, (aren’t we all). He is dying of cancer and has less than a year, so I must at least honor him and check this one spot out. Sorry he can’t travel with me, but I’m gonna document the whole trip for him on video and camera.

    • I wish you the best of luck sorry about your dad,I lost my mother when I was very young to cancer,it devastated me.

    • Sorry about your dad – I lost my dad when I was 16 so treasure every minute you have left with him. Do make him the most entertaining and fun filled video you can – make him laugh – they say it’s the best medicine. 🙂

    • Seeker,

      GOOGLE: stork eating frog never give up

      Hopefully your Dad will have the same outcome as Forrest and my Dad… even METFOMIN is a CANCER drug now…

    • Seeker a few post below you is a guy from York, PA wanting to head out west his name/blog handle Blaine Bosserman , he posted his facebook page , thought you might hook up with him also. Sorry to hear about your Dad , I know what you and he are going through, tell him to hang in there things could change , I wish you and him nothing but look

    • Sorry Seeker I mean’t good luck (not look), this Blaine Lee Bosserman is pretty confident he has the resolution , i checked out his fb page seems like he needs some help due to disability

      • I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well. I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help! http://www.facebook.com/blainebosserman

    • Seeker, good luck my friend. I am sorry to hear about your Dad. I lost mine to cancer too. Its not an easy road. Wishing you and your Dad all the best!

    • I hope seeker contacts me and decides to take me along before he goes! I know where it is! Have it narrowed down to within a 1 square mile area, all we need to do is a grid pattern search. It is located in Angel Fire NM that is your Blaze!!!

    • I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well. I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help! http://www.facebook.com/blainebosserman

      • Blaine, YOU”RE PERSEVERATING! Most people read all of the entries so no need to post so much.

  71. What if Mr Fenn made a mistake when he said it is in the Rockies. Maybe it’s in a location close to the Rockies that he thought might be a part of it but isn’t.

    For example the Grand Canyon.

    Thinking he isn’t prone to making errors will be your ultimate mistake and will never find it if you’re wrong about that.

    • Right! As detailed as he is and thoughtful about all of this, being a pilot and archeologist, knowing the mountains better than any one of us probably ever will, and he might think that the Grand Canyon is in the Rockies? You can’t be serious.

  72. I am not discounting under water. To me the look quickly down part would fit because you would have to hurry because you are going to get cold. I think it would not need scuba gear or any such equipment as I imagine it not being deep. Forrest said a youngster could get it. Running water has immense hydraulic power. I am a swift water rescue person and have seen first hand what a small amount of running water can do. Even here in New Mexico we can get a surprising amount of water running down those culverts you mentioned. I am putting out my 2 penny loafers to help people think about the best possible water spot. If the chose to look there.

    • I think the look quickly down means that you will have to put on your brakes quickly or back up if you miss it that the ‘blaze’ will be seen as you are driving by it. Either a landmark or actual mark on a rock cuz signs and trees would disappear if there were a fire.

      • I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well. I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help! http://www.facebook.com/blainebosserman

    • Blaine , I see that you’re from Pa , there are a couple of other people , one from lancaster and one from Philly headed out west soon you may want to hook up with them. There handles on this blog are taco tucker and Seeker . Seeker just posted about his father having cancer so you can reply to that , he will give you his e-mail or you can direct him to your fb page

    • Blane, don’t be offended, it’s not about the SPLIT, what’s hard is this is not an EASTER EGG HUNT. Even if your SPOT is EXACTLY right, you may need to go 10 or more times to that same “spot” to iron out all of the UNEXPECTED’s.

      Think more along the lines of THE LOST DUTCHMAN’s GOLD MINE, and why it is still unfound… in a MUCH SMALLER area than the ROCKY MOUNTINS…

      • I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well.I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help! http://www.facebook.com/blainebosserman

      • No, I think there are other agendas going on here “once you click in”… I wish I hadn’t “Gone in there alone”… don’t ask.

      • Slope66,

        Sorry, thought I could let that comment go, but after some rumination I have decided to respond…I gotta admire your righteous indignation, and your condescending attitude, but indulge me as I state my feelings and then leave this blog. One doesn’t need to serve to know that a flag flown in that manner is either an alert to other ships that your radio is broken, or that your ship is under quarantine, or that you are under distress (I only know the Navy inferences as I was a Naval Academy child and that is what I know…sorry if you feel I haven’t served, but I lived a military childhood that uprooted me every couple of years, and I believe that was a service all it’s own). I fully expect Dal to delete this, so I will just put my feelings into words, and those that see it before it goes away can judge my intentions. I don’t know what Blaine’s reason was for having a logo of an upside down American flag, but the most common reason in 2013 to display that is to indicate that America is in distress…it’s a political outcry, and I think it is inappropriate here. My 16 year old son and I joined this hunt to bond on the trails and paths of Colorado’s beautiful landscape, and during the search I have tried to contribute genuine input as to my thoughts on the poem and the clues contained therein To turn this into a political blog is neither helpful, nor the intention of Dal (in my opinion).

        Good luck to all here, I hope everyone from this site finds what they are looking for. I will be watching from afar.

        • Scott,

          remark was for Blaine not you, thought that was obvious. Sorry about that.

          • Thanks slope, appreciate the graciousness. Thanks also to Steph, JD, GermanGuy and SF Smarty for the support…after a self-imposed 1/2 day timeout, I am reinvigorated, and not as testy!

            BTW, if anyone around the country is researching Colorado and wants some honest feedback and opinions before you make the trek, PM me or post your e-mail and I would be happy to respond. Obviously I will not give you my spot, and I don’t want yours…but I will be forthright on your findings and give you what information I can. There was a post earlier on the possibility of Denver…and if you want my reaction, as a long time resident, I will give it to you. My integrity is worth way more than anything in that box.

        • Scott C. There is no reason to you to go, sometimes it is better to ignore than to react… but we all do it… as I have as well.

          Stay and contribute, we don’t all have to agree to get along. The Post you initally responded to was as DISRUPTIVE as they come. I think GERMANGUY sent him to a better place to hitch a ride or find a partner.

          • Why does this thread keep ending up at the bottom…I was an a$$ with a comment and I keep hoping it will disappear upward…Dal do you have a magic eraser?

    • I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well.I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help! http://www.facebook.com/blainebosserman

      • Just a quick question. If you are standing below the Brown Bear Home adjacent to the Cieneguilla Creek, how do you reconcile that position with even being able to see the blaze? (Angel Fire) In other words, your position would be low in the canyon and the line of sight to your blaze would be blocked by the canyon walls which seems inconsistent with the line in the poem.

  73. I am also new to this and have some ideas only because it is an area that I once visited. I have emailed Dal some of my thoughts but know that I am probably totally wrong. Can anyone who lives in the area or searched the area tell me what is on the of spire/tower at the Catholic Church in Jemez Springs NM?

    • My other thoughts were – warm water halts, Soda Springs. Home of Brown, down the canyon from Soda Springs is the US Forestry building, Brown in color. I have not been there in 50 years but something about MEEK and GO IN PEACE for some reason brings me to the Jemez State Monument (Old Church ruins). I know that it is not in a structure but somewhere around there.

    • I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well.I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help!

  74. It’s funny that some of these webcams are called ‘apgar’ that is the score given on a newborn baby from the first nurse to handle giving it’s score for life signs. These are in Glacier Nat’l park. oh… joy of birth was another of my anagram non-clues.

  75. dale, besides the owner of this blog’s name is also an open valley in an area of low hills; a broad valley. Sometines there are clumps of aspen groves in broad valleys.

    • Not I! My interpretation doesn’t take me were you are going……and of course I think I’m right, but don’t we all? 🙂

      • I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well.I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help! http://www.facebook.com/blainebosserman

  76. I noticed that some people are trying to decrypt where the “Home of Brown” is. I wonder if they aren’t putting the horse before the cart here. As Forrest Fenn has told us, we need to start at the beginning, as in “Begin it where warm waters halt”. If we randoomly pick a point in the poem to start, it will not lead us to the “blaze”, which we all know is necessary in locating the treasure.

  77. This issue about Federal or State governments taking the treasure away from you is a non-clue and a waste of time. Just trust in Fenn to have taken care of this when he hid it. There is a “Common law” that addresses “abandoned” property. Fenn knows this I’m sure. Look it up when you have the time.

    • I know where all the clues are but live on a limited income of a monthly disability check. I have contacted the owner of the Brown home to see if Forrest Fenn was on the guest book. The creek that is spoken of runs through the canyon just below the Brown home. These are located at an elevation of 7000 feet above sea level in the resort town of Angel Fire NM. The end of the Rainbow is another clue that is located by the Brown home as well. I need a ride to this location and will split the treasure with whoever is willing to help! http://www.facebook.com/blainebosserman

      • Blaine

        At the top of this page under this line: THE NINE CLUES….Part Four

        You will find these links: Explore, Forrest Fenn, hidden treasure, Poem, riddle-poem, Treasure Hunt

        Click on “Explore” and when the page comes up, go down the list and select one. It is a list of people from each state that is looking for people to share with. You’ll have better luck there then here.

        Good luck.

      • Whats the clue to “from there it’s no place for the meek” if it sounds good I might raise some bus ticket moneys. I do NOT think you have the right Brown,ff hasn’t said hes’ been there.

    • germanguy, I forgot to mention to you that my grandmother on my mother’s side was from Germany. Makes me a quarter German. It goes Heinz after that. Thank you for questioning derogatory comments. However, I don’t think that any government cares about common law when a small fortune is involved. Deep pockets will be able to convince most courts that it is in the public’s interest that the public owns any abandoned property on public land, unless the abandoned property is worthless, then it’s a crime. We do pay these people good money to do this for us and they are good at it.

      • That is what i have been thinking all along. dal mentioned a FF family ranch at 9,500 feet. This really has my interest. So far, I haven’t been able to find anything on the internet. Another area of interest is a Brownies’ summer camp. Currently looking into this too, but doesn’t seem likely. Private land that FF has an interest in seems the most probable to me.

      • Thanks, I think, I will. A person just doesn’t know whether they are be ribbed or not, with all of the super intelligent people on dal’s blog.

      • dollar bill you may have something, one of my anagram clues is about brown knee hghs and who wears those BUT the Brownies 🙂 lol

  78. Blaine that inn has closed down in the early 80’s. Brown’s house has been a house of ill repute ever since then. Apparently you have uncovered some skeletons from Fenn’s closet. I suggest you go anyway. Ask for the Fenn special and see if you get any further clues.

  79. May be a treasure hunt, but don’t take people’s Friday nights away from them.

  80. As I alone have gone in there….an I alone in THERE gives you THIERE…German for BEASTS…just brainstorming……

  81. I find it remarkable that people on this blog actually think they can figure out the clues on the internet. Whats even more mind blowing is they think they actually know what the exact clues are and their real definitions from their butts in a chair without ever searching the locations. You cannot not speculate what the rest of the poem may mean or not mean until you find WWWH. The Poem was was meant to work in order, you can speculate all day what you the clues may be but you’ll never know what FF is describing until you’re in his spot. Does anyone feel FF would have tied clues to things you could figure out from your couch???

    • No I agree…I think most if not all are natural landmarks you can only see outdoors..except the canyon and the creek. Heck he might have “blazed” the entire trail it’s at and that’s why you’d move with confidence. You wouldn’t be able to see that online. I don’t have much choice though, but to research online for a canyon and creek and see where my next spots will be as I’m so flipping far away.

      • If this poem was meant to be solved 10,000 years from now then their could only be one type of clues to last that long. Everyone wants to share ideas and help one another which is great and honorable if you can’t search yourself. If people would just focus more on WWWH and share ideas, it would probably get everyone even more excited and better chances for people that have put in so much time and money and the first timers real chances of finding it. Unlike all these pipe dream scenarios.

        • I’d rather figure it out myself than have a list of places to go search and we’re all racing to them. I don’t mind when someone gives a search they’ve already looked at…but I personally don’t want to find it on someone else’s ideas. That’s how I see it..not that it’s right.

          • I agree, Stephanie. Far more rewarding to figure it out on your own. I do appreciate all of the thoughts expressed here (as I know you do as well) especially when they can shoot holes in my theories that I didn’t see before, thus saving me the expense of travelling to a bad location. With you and I being so far away like so many of the *searchers* it can be pretty expensive (right, Dal?) Lol

          • I figured out a way to pay for my trips. I am now towing an Oscar Meyer Weiner Wagon behind my truck and I will be offering hot dogs and schnapps to all the tired searchers on the Cimarron. I’ll also have “I’m a Fenner Too” T-shirts and prints of Forrest’s tire tread so you can see if he’s been up your dusty road. There will, of course, be discounts for all those on this blog. Bring your own lawn chair.

          • I am seriously that fun Dal…and to think you have not made arrangements to sync your trips with mine so that you can see that in person.

          • LOL. Great idea, Dal! Don’t forget the grilled pimiento cheese sandwiches, too!

          • has anyone besides forrest really tried one of those? I was at my girlfriends a couple weeks ago and they were drinking dirty martinis…blah…..too salty. I would think those would be salty like that….

        • I’m with you on this Slope. I think we may be concentrating on another “non-clue” here. I don’t think Forrest said anything about the poem still being viable in 10,000 years or any of the landmarks either. I think (if I remember the interview correctly, but I may not) is that Forrest said something to the effect that he didn’t care if it was found now or 1,000 years from now and that was part of why he included his biography in the chest so that, if it was found many years after this “Chase” and he are long-forgotten, the finder would know why the chest was hidden and who hid it.

          Things are found or discovered by random accident all the time. Look at the remains of Richard III in England recently as an example. I know Forrest said that it was not just going to be stumbled upon by accident, but I don’t think, especially 10,000 years that too much will remain as they are now. I do agree with the “only one type” scenario concerning natural locations as the clues rather that man-made as being the ones that are most likely to stand the test of time, but I also think that from what I *think* I know about Forrest’s love of the great outdoors, he would never reference an outhouse for example. LOL

          Also know that everything I’ve written above could be filled with inaccuracies so take them with a grain of salt. My tiny brain is a bit burned out right now and I don’t have the stamina to go back through the videos and blogs to fact-check. Dal knows this stuff by heart, so when it comes to hard facts, I listen to him.

      • What about seeing it thru others eyes or lens who have been there? Far better to be there in person I’m sure but you never know what you might stumble across.

        • If you haven’t downloaded google earth…there’s a great feature where you can pull this little man icon down onto the road and go inch by inch on a road your searching. Great resource if your far away to get an idea of the landscape and most of that data has been updated within the last couple years.

          • Stephanie …. I’ve been thinking about the big B …… I think it should actually be a different capital letter…… brown perhaps is a description for the real proper name

      • Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to speak out and remove all doubt.

      • Steph

        Yes, we would all love to find this with our own ideas but F has made this poem remarkably challenging. I don’t know how any of us could unlock the poem without sharing ideas to help us think of things we may not have thought about. So I believe its critical that we share ideas. otherwise what are we all doing on this site.

        • Oh I’d totally leave the forum if it became one group of everyone trying to figure it out and the first one there gets it. I am fine with people feeling the way you do…but then I’d hope you do it in private email. It’s like playing a game and someone shouting out all the answers. What fun is that?

      • I don’t think it would be a race like your describing because even if you or I did find the real WWWH , I believe the rest of the clues would be just as challenging. I’m sure you read Tekoas remarks,which I agree with completely. I would rather be in a group working on this together. I mean some of something is better then non of nothing right. I think it will be a group of people that will eventually crack this just like all great treasure finds in history, its always been a team.

        • And that might be true…but why not create a group that’s in email so that those of us that want to try and figure it out on our own have a chance to still talk about the search? To me though…I don’t think I’d trust a group. If I had a group of say 5 people…one living in the area where we’ve laid out the solution and they go and find it…will I trust that person to tell the group of newly formed friend searchers? Not so sure. We don’t know for sure that if it’s found that Forrest will say where it was…especially now. Also, no one knows what’s in it except Forrest and he might not even have it cataloged even…so who’s to say this person that goes to see if it’s there will be honest in saying there was this or that in there. I don’t know…my opinions just different about that…..

      • You make valid points, but there must be a way to do it as a team with the trust factor in place. I don’t mean to insult anyone’s intelligence here but I believe a team will be the victors. FF has had what 12 or more years to perfect this poem. What makes it so intriguing and challenging, is he wrote in such a way that littoral interpretations could run with it in a thousand directions. The cryptographers who think there’s a hidden code could run wild with it. The professional poets could do the same, Artist, archeologist, detectives and every other professional that think they might have the upper hand. It was written for everyone to have a crack at it and enjoy the TOTC.

        Can you imagine how difficult that must have been to write a poem like that knowing how many people and experts in their own specialized field would have such a hard time cracking this riddle. I don’t think he expects for anyone to find this for a very very long time but it’s been a lot of fun so far.

        • I personally don’t think I could trust someone to go out searching with my solutions. Some have no choice and I think if they find it…some will have pretty good results trusting someone else. Maybe I have trust issues though lol….right Dal? I’ve gone out searching with my girlfriend and I even had a contract we both signed in case she saw it and picked it up. It fascinates me how Forrest wrote the poem to have so many “combination” possibilities. Then again, it fascinates me the way he can answer a question and if you look at what he says….he didn’t really answer it, because there’s more than one answer.

  82. Yes Scott please don’t go. That would mean one less person with good ideas and I would have to read 10 more ridiculous ideas before a good one. I’m barely hanging on as it is.

  83. To the 99%ers,

    I believe I understand what Mr. Fenn meant when he said start with the “where warm waters halt” clue and the rest will fall into place. Solving the poem is a progressive process. Specifically, you have to determine where “warm waters halt” and then actually visit that location before the next clue makes any sense. It’s a waste of time to speculate beyond that.

    Unfortunately, this has is not an armchair adventurer’s game as many think. Nine clues could mean nine different field trips plus one final visit if you are able to grasp the information presented at these locations. Mr. Fenn said that several people have figured out the first two clues but miss the other seven. The reason may be, like archeology, you have a clue where to search, but once out in the field it takes keen observations to make sense of it.

    One other point, the clues’ locations may not be contiguous. A clue may lead you to some place in New Mexico but what you learn there, plus the next clue, may send you off to Wyoming. This could get expensive. So to those who are so sure they know the final location, there’s more to it than one thinks.

      • slope66,

        I think this hunt might be too much for you and Tekoa. You acknowledge that it took Mr. Fenn 12 years to create the poem, so why should you expect to solve it in less than 30 days or even a year?

        Have you ever spent any significant time on a single project, just to have it ended and forgotten before you were ready to let it go? That’s what you are asking of Mr. Fenn. Let him have his fun. He put in the time to create it. If you aren’t willing to put in the time to solve it then go with Tekoa and find an easier hunt. Your whining is pathetic.

        jd

  84. thoughts about the blaze

    I know a lot of people are still stuck on WWWH, and some are back whining again that the poem is too hard, so I wanted to offer ideas for the blaze.

    There has been much discussion about what the blaze could be and that it has to hold up for 1000 years. There’s talk of nature destroying some blazes… and what do we do in 1000 years if that happens. The only thing I can think of that holds up is history. Recorded history of people, places and things. Find a blaze that is already recorded in history and your problem is solved.

    What you do next is determined by the path your on and where the blaze points.

    Example: Route 66. Once it was the main highway coming west for those that lost their farms in the Dust Bowl. Today it has lost its romance and isn’t used much. Businesses that once thrived on it are struggling or already closed. But much of it is recorded in history and has landmarks showing specific sites and their importance. This recorded information, indicating the exact location of an event or significant site, will never disappear. This could be a sample of the blaze we need to look for.

    There are also historical landmarks in national forests, parks and wilderness areas. Find one on your path and look where it leads.

    “But there are so many” some say…. let the whiners begin.

    One more thought… after the blaze, the next line is “look quickly down, your quest to cease”. This may not be indicating that your quest is ceasing at this spot which would be your blaze, but that this blaze is pointing TO where your quest will cease.

    Is there another path branching off from this point? Or does the blaze refer to something different than what you’ve been doing so far? If so I’d follow it and see where it goes,

    oh… so much to whine about.

    jd

    • JD,

      You must be one delusional self centered person because you are putting words in peoples mouths. Just to be clear, I’m not whining and neither is Tekoa. I did not state I would expect anyone to solve the poem in 30 days or a year. I just commented that this is very challenging. I’m not asking F to do anything, I did not say anything to put down what FF is doing. I think it’s fantastic that he’s giving everyone the thrill. Not sure what got your little panties in a wad son, but mind your own business.

    • A thought about a ‘blaze’ appearing in perpetuity:

      An open-crack rock or needle’s eye at the crest of a ridge lets sunlight through a ‘light shaft’ that lays a ‘blaze’ of light on the valley floor below or north canyon wall opposite the ‘hole’ rock.

      But the light ‘blaze’ only appears at the time of day the sun lines up. … maybe time of year is required to line up, too.

      When Forrest says “take along a sandwich” it is a clue about ‘lunch’ time, hinting that the sun alignment is around noon when the ‘blaze’ appears.

      And when it appears, don’t stand there gawking at it. Or do “marvel gaze” but the light alignment is brief and a few minutes’ rotation of the Earth puts an end to your ‘gawking’ or ‘gaze’ and the light goes out whether you’re ready or not.

      If a shaft of sunlight through a rock outcrop causes a shining ‘blaze’ then it will be there ‘blazing’ hundreds of years from now.

      Many people could hunt the same area on the same day, but only the ones who are there at noon could see the ‘blaze’.

      And, I suppose, such a ‘blaze’ shows as a light ‘line’ or arrow or pointer directed precisely at the treasure site … across the canyon? ‘down’ below? look quickly ‘down’ the line of light? 500 feet away?

      • I have been considering Fairy Falls. You can use the clues to get there in many ways just like other spots. The things I like and relate to are,
        Fairy falls represents one of the most severely burnt (publicly visited) areas of the Yellowstone 1988 Fire; after twenty-two years the falls are still surrounded by the tall ghosts of charred pine trees. Downed wood everywhere and something that I can relate to FF recovery from cancer. As devastated as this forest may appear, it is not dead. Food for thought.. (Ducking for cover)

  85. sorry everyone,

    I posted two times recently, and my name was changed accidentally to “JDIs the” and I didn’t notice it until after I sent the posts. Both are “awaiting moderation” at this time.

    I just wanted to let you know who they are really from.

    jd

  86. Bigger .. Odin .. that he named an alligator Beowulf, I believe, says he knows more than the SW.

  87. The following is just one man’s theories… no one can prove anything without the chest in his possession, and I sure don’t have it, despite being in the area of my interest twice. I don’t claim to have the total solution. And I never read the book… this all comes from the poem and my imagination, coupled with Internet and field research. Oh, and I only started doing this after his Today show appearance March 1 this year. I hadn’t even heard about it before that.

    Why don’t I keep looking? I might… but for now I can’t anymore without taking a sabbatical from my job. I’m more interested in the puzzle now than the treasure, and I want to see it solved more than I want to get a slice of the pie. If this essay helps someone reach the chest, then bravo. I can sleep at night and stop obsessing about it! (Thanks, Mr. Fenn, BTW!) If that lucky soul feels that I legitimately put him/her on course to the final solution and wants to give me a couple grand… or couple hundred grand… well, as Paul Simon once sang, “Who am I to blow against the wind?”

    I believe (as you will see) that the key to solving the poem is to read it for both its literal meaning as well as for hidden or figurative interpretations. The hidden meanings derive predominately from play on words, synonyms, and sometimes translations into Spanish geographical place-name in the area of interest, which I have come to decide really is New Mexico. Read on and see if you disagree. Oh, and get a good map of the whole Rio Chama Canyon, with place-name details.

    This poem written by Forrest Fenn contains nine clues that if followed precisely, will lead to the end of his rainbow and the treasure. Happy Hunting!

    Literal meaning: Essentially self-explanatory.

    Hidden meaning: His rainbow = a reference to rainbow trout, to clue you in to “Brown” also referring to a trout. Note that it does not say the end of the rainbow. Fenn (I gather/assume) enjoys trout fishing, and the end of his rainbow is at the end of a fishing rod.

    As I have gone alone in there
    And with my treasures bold,
    I can keep my secret where,
    And hint of riches new and old.

    Literal meaning: In the same courageous/determined/resolved manner in which Fenn took his treasure into its hiding place by himself, he can just as resolutely keep his mouth shut about where he hid it, and only give us vague hints, by way of this poem, to lead us to the old riches (the actual gold) and the new riches (the thrilling experiences the chase will afford the seekers).

    Hidden meaning: Old = viejo in Spanish, and is a reference to Mesa de los Viejos, one of the mesas which borders the eastern lower part of the Rio Chama Canyon.

    Begin it where warm waters halt

    Literal meaning: Start the search/the thrill of the chase where warm waters halt.

    But… what warm waters? Warmer than what? Warm is a relative term… cold water is still “warm” relative to ice and snow, and so all the runoff water of the Rockies (derived from melted ice and snow) is “warm.” And note Fenn doesn’t say warmer waters halt to draw any distinction, nor does he say hot waters to suggest hot springs waters. Warm is therefore a distractor from the true clue…

    Hidden meaning: Waters (plural) halt means “more than one dammed bodies of water.” Two dammed bodies of water in close geographic proximity means El Vado Reservoir and Heron Reservoir, in New Mexico. This conclusion is reinforced by many other place names hidden in the poem, such as Mesa de los Viejos, Ojitos, Scull Bridge, and others below.

    And take it in the canyon down,

    Literal meaning: Continue the search in the canyon below the halted waters.

    Hidden meaning: The Rio Chama Canyon proceeds south from El Vado and Heron Reservoirs.

    Not far, but too far to walk.
    Put in below the home of Brown.

    Literal meaning: The travel will be too far to want to walk it. “Put in” is universally understood to mean embarking in a watercraft onto a river, so take a ride on the river of the canyon, and put in your raft downstream of the home of Brown.

    Hidden meanings: Walk = caminar in Spanish, and is a reference to Mesa del Camino which borders the western lower Rio Chama Canyon. Too far to walk is reference to the 30 miles downriver that you normally take by raft on the Chama river run.

    Home of Brown = Cooper’s El Vado Ranch. This is where tourists go to get rafting trips on the Chama. The official put-in site for rafting the Rio Chama is just west and slightly downstream from the Ranch. The Ranch is also the resting place of the mounted largest brown trout ever caught in New Mexico; capital B of Brown = “the big brown trout.” Incidentally, it was caught just below El Vado dam, so even if you call the El Vado dam “the home of Brown,” you are still at the right place at the put-in site of the Rio Chama. See this webpage…

    http://www.elvado.com/trout.html

    From there it’s no place for the meek

    Literal meaning: Refers to the Class II-III rapids on the Rio Chama.

    Hidden meaning: Meek = not brave = a “chicken.” The Rio Gallina (gallina is Spanish for hen or chicken) joins the Rio Chama before the end. No place for the meek = don’t go up the Rio Gallina; you are going to not paddle up a different creek.

    The end is ever drawing nigh;

    Literal meaning: Almost to end of the river rafting run, but not quite at the end.

    Hidden meaning: Almost to Big Eddy’s take-out site, downriver from the Skull Bridge.

    There’ll be no paddle up your creek,

    Literal meaning: Get off the river and walk up the correct creek… but which one?

    Hidden meaning: Paddle = oar = scull, which refers to the Scull (or Skull… I’ve seen it spelt both ways on different maps) Bridge. The Skull Bridge spans the Rio Chama and marks one end of the Ojitos Trail, an approximately 8 mile trail which runs SW of the bridge and leads up in altitude to Mesa del Camino and Mesa Alta. Also, there’ll be no paddle up your creek because this trail was once a creek bed (or gully) which is now dry. So leave the river at Skull Bridge, and hike up the Ojitos Trail. Further proof of Ojitos Trail is below. But how far up… and to what end?

    Just heavy loads and water high.

    Literal meaning: Obscure and vague, open to too many interpretations to be of any use by itself. Any literal semantic meaning can only be derived with any degree of certainty by drawing from supporting information derived from the rest of the poem.

    Hidden meaning: Heavy loads = the rocks on the Ojitos trail? Water high = the numerous springs found high up on Mesa del Camino and Mesa Alta (alta = high in Spanish), including Fuertes Spring? (Fuertes = strong in Spanish, able to lift heavy loads.) All that can be said is it seems to suggest a hike to the highest part of the Ojitos Trail, around where the springs are on the mesas. However, I still cannot put too much stock in this meaning… other meanings are certainly possible.

    If you’ve been wise and found the blaze,
    Look quickly down, your quest to cease,

    Literal meaning: If you’ve been smart enough to interpret the poem’s clues, you should now be able to find a “blaze.” Once identified, a search in the immediate vicinity of this blaze will yield sight of the treasure chest. Implied in this statement is that the chest is not buried, though this is not stated explicitly.

    What is this mystical blaze? The obvious meaning would be a trail marker or signpost. Slightly less obvious is that it means a trail in and of itself. An even more obscure interpretation of blaze is a white mark on a horse’s forehead; Fenn could mean a distinctive white mark on a canyon wall. There’s one such mark on the canyon wall near Big Eddy’s takeout site… One other meaning I have contemplated is that, if one is wise like an owl, one should look down upon the geography of the land itself from an aerial (bird’s eye view) and discern a feature of the land that resembles a blaze, or flame, in shape.

    I doubt the blaze means an actual tree with the bark scraped off it, a pile of rocks on the trail, or the site of an actual forest fire or campfire circle; these are not permanent markers; they can be readily tampered with or destroyed. The blaze needs to be the most permanent and stable geographically of all the clues, since it is the most proximate marker of the treasure’s true location.

    Potential hidden meaning 1: The Continental Divide Trail (CDT) is the most important trail in this part of the country, of which the Ojitos Trail is a part (and is incidentally one of the few portions of the CDT in New Mexico which is completed). The CDT breaks off from the Ojitos Trail at the top of Mesa del Camino, and continues SW from here on Forest Road 468 to ultimately meet up with Highway 96. The CDT has numerous blazes (signposts) all along it. But there is also, at the top of the Ojitos Trail, a wooden signpost placed by the Forestry Service, which says, “Rio Chama Wilderness; Santa Fe National Forest.” Could wise = owl = Woodsy the Owl, the mascot for the US Forest Service? Is the wise blaze a sign placed by the US Forest Service or one of its sub-agencies?

    http://www.ask.com/wiki/Woodsy_Owl?o=2801&qsrc=999

    Potential hidden meaning 2: The Rio Chama divides in two and comes back together in several places, forming small holms (or “islands in the stream,” as it were) of land in the middle of the river. Just look quickly down… downriver that is, from the Skull Bridge… Seen from a bird’s eye view (like a wise owl might), this holm of land in the middle of the river is shaped like a flame, or blaze. Put these coordinates [36.328518,-106.622145] in Google Maps to see it… it looks best if map is set to satellite or Google Earth, and the map rotated so that true north is rotated to be pointing east. BTW, I’ve crawled all over this blaze, but not with a metal detector… just sayin’!

    But tarry scant with marvel gaze,
    Just take the chest and go in peace.

    Literal meaning: Don’t linger about much staring in awe at the treasure; grab the chest and go!

    Hidden meaning: Tarry (v) = dawdle or meander, scant = little or meager. Also, in Spanish ojos = eyes, ojitos = little eyes, but hacer ojitos is literally “making little eyes” at something or someone, but idiomatically it means to gaze at longingly, in awe or in marvel. So marvel gaze = Ojitos! Is this confirmation that this is the right trail? Or is Fenn saying “Don’t waste much time on Ojitos; it’s NOT here?”

    There is a little meandering (tarry scant) portion at the end of the Ojitos Trail that joins it to Forest Road #468. Put these coordinates [36.279949,-106.677786] into Google Maps to see it. Best viewed in map mode… zoom in until you can read the words “Continental Divide Trail” on the squiggly line of the trail. That Rio Chama Wilderness signpost I mentioned above is on this “meandering” portion. Fenn could have driven nearly right to this spot and not have had to do any of the rafting/hiking his poem describes to drop his 40+ pound chest somewhere around here. And he has stated that people have been within 500 ft. of the treasure.

    Also peace = reference to Monastery of Christ in the Desert, in the lower Rio Chama Canyon about 5 miles north of the Skull Bridge along Forest Road 151. There is a wooden sign near the entrance to the monastery which says,

    PEACE
    Monastery of Christ in the Desert

    http://christdesert.org/

    So why is it that I must go
    And leave my trove for all to seek?
    The answers I already know,
    I’ve done it tired, and now I’m weak.
    So hear me all and listen good,
    Your effort will be worth the cold.

    Literal meaning: Essentially self-explanatory.

    Hidden meanings: I’ve done it tired could be a joke meaning that Fenn didn’t walk or river raft to the hiding place, but rather drove his car (which is tired = has tires) to the spot. Cold could refer to altitude/temperature on the Mesa. There was still ice and snow up there last week. But in any event I don’t think any of this represents particularly relevant clues. If there’s more to it, I don’t have it… yet. 

    If you are brave and in the wood

    Literal meaning: Essentially self-explanatory. But does in the wood = in a forest, or mean that the chest is hidden in wood?

    Hidden meanings: Brave = Native American Indian = Mesa los Indios, yet another nearby geographic feature of the lower Rio Chama Canyon.

    The area on these mesas is actively being forested, and lots of trees are cut down here, and lying about in piles. But so much human activity precludes this area from being a safe resting place for a treasure chest.

    A hiker took this shot in 2011and posted it on his blog, saying: “In Ojitos Canyon is an old aqueduct, consisting of dirt ditch and rotting trestles with galvanized half pipes bridging the natural creek gully many times.” Click the link below and scroll down to the entry for May 19, 2011.

    http://bedore.org/2011_CDT_New_Mexico.html

    Could the “water high” mean the water that used to run in the aqueduct above the ground level? Could the chest be hidden in the wooden trestle of this dry aqueduct on the Ojitos Trail? I’m not sure exactly where on the trail this is… I walked most of the Ojitos Trail last week, and never saw it. I’d sure like to find it!

    I give you title to the gold.

    Literal meaning: Essentially self-explanatory.

    Hidden meaning: Title = title of his book = “I give you The Thrill of the Chase to the gold.” Is that his way of saying all you will get is the thrill, not the actual gold? Will the feds/state have legitimate claim to take the treasure away from the finder? Let’s hope not!

    Well, that’s all folks! Good luck all! Hope someone finds this darn thing soon!

    • I haven’t been able to post anything, which I thought was even remotely helpful, in a few days.

      Let me try this:

      Folks (noobies & old-hands) – PRINT MR. BROHAWN’S POST AND STUDY IT AS OFTEN AS YOU
      STUDY THE POEM!!!!

      Whether you agree with his location or not, his is the thought process that will be required to decipher the puzzle (in my opinion).

      Thank you Mr. Brohawn, I knew I was missing an interpretation of what “blaze” could be and I think you hit the nail on the head!!

      Fred W

    • @Bill
      ❗ Wow 😯 That’s impressive……..Thanks for sharing. Even if the treasure is not there it’s still impressive. I’m familiar with the area you are talking about and remember some of the things you are talking about……..That’s my problem, I’ve roamed the back country of the west for 40 years but I apparently don’t have the imagination to link what I know with the poem. I assure you if I find it because of your information I will definitely share the fame and fortune. As a matter of fact, you can have all the fame, and I’ll share a good chunk of the fortune with you. It will be great fun watching you and Fenn on TV while I’m sitting on the beach in the Caymans. 😎

    • Really good thoughts! Very impressive. I enjoyed what you wrote. There’s going to be a swarm of people there in the very near future. Ff is going to love it! Go tourism! Anyway awesome job!

    • Nice research. Thanks for posting and sharing your hard work. I don’t have any problem with people posting thoughts this detailed. It helps to see different interpretations of the poem from someone else’s point of view, and ultimately we want to see it from Forrest’s point of view.
      It could all be calculated misinformation as far as we know, but doubtful. Just because we are aware of Bill’s thoughts means nothing until the treasure is found, except that it may expand our views of the meanings of the clues. There are many more places that could fit as well, so no problem in my opinion. It’s not like he’s telling us where it is. He’s free to post, we’re free to like it, not like it, agree or disagree, life goes on. It’s a free country, somewhat.

      • I first heard about this when Forrest made his first Today Show appearance. I came to these same conclusions within 8 hours of research. I was confident and went there and zippo. Yellowstone now has more of my interest and I think when I eventually get the book, it will weigh more heavily than this. Just my opinion

    • Bill, thank you for sharing your information and hard earned knowledge. For those that don’t want anyone’s input or calculations I would simply say to disregard or not read it and to treat it like a remote control and clink on through. I realize I’m only a lurker and my opinion may not weigh much but I appreciate your input!

    • Bill, I like your way of analyzing the poem as a whole and the individual clues. It’s not the area I’m interested in at all but some of your interpretations give different/interesting meanings that are helpful in looking at my own special spot.

    • Well done Bill, I commend you on your work! I too took a similar approach, especially on home of Brown, that lead past Christ in the Desert and Ghost Ranch as possible places for the meek. The end is ever drawing nigh seemed to me like a couple of things. O’Keefe’s Pedermal mountain where her ashes have been spread and her spirit is there ever drawing. That hooks into the book. She painted that mountain over and over again. In fact she said “God told me if I painted it enough it was my mountain.”

      But a second idea was that ever drawing nigh could be the meandering Chama River itself that eventually empties into Abiquiu Lake. That is why there would no longer be any “paddle up your creek” because you were now in a lake seven miles long – a paddle is not going to get you anywhere. So, no paddle – you need a motor and it is water high in elevation. One thing one must be concerned about in a boat is the amount of load they are carrying – it effects how far you can go and how well you stay afloat.

      On google earth where the chama enters into Abiquiu lake there is an island that looks like the blaze one would see on a horse. There are also four additional islands out there. I started thinking about Forrest’s dream in the book where he was Captain Kidd and looking on Gardiner’s Island for his treasure. I hit every one of those islands in Abiquiu Lake and didn’t find it. However, I am still with you as to the general area. The map in Forrest’s book have the gold pieces laid out almost like an arrow head pointing northwest towards Abiquiu Lake. The lines in the map are tributaries to the Rio Grande. You can see where the Chama river empties into the Rio Grande.

      I support your collaborative effort here. There is still a lot of territory to cover out there. Even with this work, I don’t think anyone is going to find it anytime soon. Also, as much as this is good analytical stuff and the places all line up – it is not the only approach to the poem. I have now taken a different approach to the poem where it is not so much a connect the dots, stanza by stanza. For example, I now have wwh, canyon, far, and brown all within a few miles of each other.

      Still working on meek and wondering if Joe Meek and beavers have anything to do with it . . . So far nothing is coming up.

      It’s the thrill of the chase!

      jP

    • I found ghost ranch a couple of weeks ago in my studies. Its owned by the Presbyterian church. If I didn’t want the state or the feds to ever get their hands on my treasure…Its a thought

  88. OK. I’m going to help a bit with this “WWWH”. From what I’ve picked up from being on this blog awhile, One, if not two people have given a very strong solution to WWWH. Problem is they moved on past it and are off on a different tangent. If you’re new to Dal’s blog, the best advice I can give, is to read through the last 4 (hint) months worth. No need to go further then that. Happy hunting. Oh, something else you may or may not find helpful, WRITE ALL OF THEY DOWN. That way you can plug them in as you go through the poem. Happy hunting.

  89. Bill Brohawn,

    Thanks for the essay on one of the “many” places where the treasure could be. Here is my essay: I have actually been to ALL those places you mentioned and a few more. I really thought it was a good spot, but after searching every stream, dry wash, trail(Including most parts of the CDT and Ojitos Trail), mesa, Bridge, and canyon, I found nothing! I even studied blazes, Spanish symbols and markings for gold or treasure, and universal markings as well before I even set out. I even looked in water several times. I put a lot of work into it. But I put a lot of work and effort into other places as well, like up around Taos and near all kinds of “Hot Springs”, but still haven’t found the ever elusive non obtrusive chest. All I can say to anyone venturing up the Chama River Canyon Wilderness Area is………. good luck and be safe! It’s a lot bigger than you can imagine. And it can very dangerous hiking out there. …..You know Bill, people put a lot of time, effort and thought into figuring out where they should go look, and for you to just give ALL your information away like that without letting someone else work it out themselves or “put in” that work, well it’s almost as if YOU want some sort of praise for what you’ve done. It really just defeats the whole purpose of why he put the treasure out there in the first place………THE THRILL OF THE CHASE, not here is the exact place I think it is, go look! That really pisses me off!

    • Not at all, Zach… as I said, I don’t have the exact spot, or I’d have it already. I simply hope my posting gives even more people a framework upon which to work out their own interpretations, and will perhaps get more people into the chase. Obviously I also put a lot of thought into it. My “information” may have no validity, but it’s mine to give away if I wish.

      But you are correct… the Chama Wilderness is dangerous. The Mesa Alta road is barely passable. Have all wheel drive, people, and watch out for rattlers as it warms up!

      • Missed the point, Bill. I just don’t think it is fair to those people who have been looking for a long time and have put in the research, to just give out SO MUCH information about a particular area. I mean, what if someone, who just found out about this search, went right up to one of those areas where you said to look and found the chest in that vicinity, without putting in the time and effort of research(which is 99% of the work involved in this hunt). Would that be fair to the guy or gal with 6 kids and an old beat up truck who has put in the sweat of research and thought and been looking since day one? You seem like a intelligent individual and I like your thought process, and little help is fine, but you shouldn’t give someone ALL your information; it’s just not fair to them or to those who have been looking all along. And that goes for ANY place you think is the “right” area. Call me old school, but that is the way it should be. …….Here is a hint, and it’s not in The Chama Canyon Wilderness Area(which is WNW not Northerly and is questionably a part of The Rockies)and an area that could be a good place to search……..more thoroughly: petroglyphs.

        • As far as fair play goes…..yes Dal, Steph and handful of others have been putting in the time to have some one speculate this way. However, many others have done the same without being lambasted. Remember that whole Jesse James theory that turned out to be south of Santa Fe? I take it all with a skeptical eye. It;s only a good clue if you find the chest and I don’t think it will be found for a while. Forrest’s nest “clue” on the the Today Show will be vague but intriguing. Just my opinion. 🙂

      • Bill,

        Bill,
        I for one would like your email address. I’d much rather have the winning power ball numbers. 🙂

        You’ll have to excuse some of the views on this blog, some just don’t get the big picture.

      • @Bill,
        Seems we will all have to agree to disagree……I applaud you posting your search and ideas. I think you will have a much better chance of getting someone to share the treasure with you this way than a back room deal by email. I’m amazed you come up with such detail and made the trip to search all within a month.

        Your spot is probably as wrong as everyone else’s has been, but I find your reasoning very interesting and helpful…..Thank you for that. I’m sure it’s exciting for those without the means to travel to go through your explanation looking at maps.

        I honestly don’t see the difference between what Bill did and anyone that has shared their ideas about a particular clue. That one particular clue could give a newbie the key to solving the poem……what’s the difference. Would that be “unfair” to the elite searchers?

        I do get a kick about everyone saying get off the couch and go search; while we sit glued to the screen trying to get that one inspiration that will solve the poem. Forrest is glued to the screen reading our comments and emails behind his locked gates and security system, hopefully having as much fun as we are searching and laughing at our silly thoughts. Steph will post an insightful, fun, or just silly comment with her Galaxy from no telling where; the laundry room, on an airplane, or the bottom of a canyon. Hopefully none of those comments will give a newbie a way to solve the poem.

        What if the next clue from Fenn gave a newbie the one tidbit of information that he/she needed to find the treasure…..would that be fair to the elite searchers that have spent so much time searching?

        • Even if every possible place that makes sense is searched, it could still be easily missed. Just because someone gives their interpretaion of the clues doesnt mean the did not walk right over it. The process of elimination only works for the individual when he has conceeded to a certain location after PHYSICALLY looking in this case.

      • Please do continue posting here Bill! I enjoyed your thoughts. I don’t agree with them all but I was very enlightened!

      • …….I can almost envision standing on the banks of the Arroyo del Chorro, watching Coronado and his legionnaires come up the wash towards the San Lazaro Mission……and maybe you can to, but you should allow others to use their own imagination to see that for themselves. But hey, it would be a win win for you wouldn’t it, whether YOU find it or not, if someone were to find something where you told them to look? I mean it would only be the honorable thing to do; to give you part of it. I mean, I would, …..if I had not known already this information. So let’s get EVERYONE out looking where you’ve been looking, and if it’s not there then you can tell us a “new” place to look……..with ALL the details of course.

      • Hey man, I was just having some fun. I just wanted to see where people stood on this issue, now I know. And I do think your thought process is very cohesive and plausible; that is why I said what I said about Coronado. Personally, though, I still think you give away too much information. Leave some it up to letting people do their own research and using their own imagination. And slope66, I have been looking for this Letter Box since the spring of 2011 and have only posted probably 5 times……..I think I know what I’m talking about! …..Maybe Bill can you find it. 🙂 Don’t worry though, this will be the last time I post. Good Luck everyone! Maybe I will see you “in the wood” too far to walk, on a “horse?” where the mississippian boulders are big up near a spring of course. …..I wish I had that many kids, but they wouldn’t be starving. And I was always good at Monopoly, but this isn’t Monopoly is it. Nothing is ever JUST a game.

      • Bill,

        Yes, it is really dangerous out there in that area. And also pretty remote and challenging to get to. Even on the lake I had three run ins each consecutive time I went out there. Two were weather related and one accidental.

        After that, I decide that Forrest had said it is not in a dangerous place. I now have my first rule for the chase. If it is dangerous then I am looking in the wrong place.

        Cheers,
        jP

    • I have to concur. I mean I know you can’t control what others do and I’m only speaking for myself. I just wish people would consider saying something like….anyone want to hear my ideas email me for an entire solution. I think individual ideas to parts of the poem are fun to see or where you looked at it wasn’t…but to find out that someone just raced to a place that someone gave or if you posted whatever I was working on at the time…that would be a tough pill to swallow. Same reasons Jason said…it loses the thrill.

      • Hmmm… what’s the point of this blog if not to collaborate? I should only give 2 or 3 thoughts and hold the rest of my cards close to my chest? I’ve given up the desire to have the treasure all to myself, and just want to see the thing found, so I can see if I was even close with my solution. I’ll be fine if it’s somewhere else and I was 3 states off.

        This is my way of letting go of it… I realized I was obsessing over a few million bucks that may not actually be realized after the government gets involved and takes it away as “grave robbed” artifacts, or taxes it all away.

        Oh, and BTW… I have some insights into next week’s Powerball numbers. The first 5 are 5, 14, 22, 37 and 40. E-mail me if anyone wants the Powerball number. 🙂

        • Bill I know you mean well…so please don’t take this in a bad way. I get why you feel the way you feel…I’ve actually verbally said that I should just put all my complete search ideas out there so I can let go of the obsession. So I’m just asking you to look at the other side of it and see if you can see what we’re saying. I know it’s being said through frustration….but it’s just like if your playing a game with a room full of people and the game is super close and then your uncle walks into the room and blurts out the answer. I’m not saying you have the right answer…but it’s probably close to some people’s “answer” here that have been working on it for a while. Let’s say your playing Monopoly and your winning even…and the person to your left decides they don’t want to play anymore and so they just give all their properties to your opponent. I see where your coming from…but I hope you can see the other side too.

          • Bill,

            I see it like this, it would be like standing over a group of kids playing a game, and you knowing the answer, shouting it out. Think how the kids would feel. The game wouldn’t be fun for them and they wouldn’t want to play it any more.

          • I truly don’t understand the vitriol on Bill’s post. There have been several other similar posts and Bill’s myriad of “possible” spots have been scoured by many. I do agree with Stephanie that laying out the entire solution is b.s. As an earlier poster (forgot who) said it would or could give him a title to the prize because he led someone to it and, by posting his theory, he can claim partial ownership to it. I disagree. And I( will go on record as saying it’s in the Rockies and anyone who finds it in the Rockies owes me a cut. LOL

        • BILL Brohawn >> “This is my way of letting go of it”

          I enjoyed you post Bill. You are correct concerning collaboration. Nothing wrong with you leaving it all on the field.

          Readers of your post can always skip to the next post if your level of detail puts them ill at ease…

          No one wants to see the guy in front of them carrying off the chest… but in the end, No one has priority to a spot… and there are plenty of “spots” to go around.

      • “I should only give 2 or 3 thoughts and hold the rest of my cards close to my chest?” Why not?

      • I agree (too much info. is like a smoke screen in this case), besides I spoke to some folks that live up by Cooper’s (who are sick of folks calling by the way) some 7-8 weeks ago (when most of what Brohawn said actually occurred to me. Them, their kids and their kids’ friends (some in Brown) are combing all around the places Brohawn referenced. This is an expansive area and I don’t even believe that Brohawn really did actually go to all the places he wrote about because it’d take more than a month of 8 hrs.a day searching to be as certain as he sounds. (Nice try Bill) Google Earth IS cool, tho.
        There are cougar that will stalk you there:
        http://www.cougarinfo.org/
        There’s all kinds of things that can go wrong there: http://www.hikerhell.com/
        Besides, it is my opinion that ff didn’t put it up there. It is closer to S.F. (I think).

        So, ahem (clears throat)…
        God looked down and saw man wandering aimlessly and utterly lost. So God took pity on man and shone a great light so that man could see the passage. Man spun around and exclaimed, “The Light!, The Light!”. God said “No, the door, the door”, but man didn’t hear because he was blinded by the light. Get it? — true story.

        • One more post. I went twice in March. 1200 miles one way. Flew once, drove once. Stayed at Abiquiu Inn. Slept at Big Eddy’s takeout site at 4 AM in a rented GMC Terrain. Ate lunch at Bode’s. Drove up Mesa Alta and hiked 3 miles of Ojitos. Waded Chama onto my “blaze” of land. Drove to Oak Point campground (in the wood? hint hint). Looked at Meander Rapids (tarry scant? hint hint). Almost waded into river under Skull Bridge, but gallina’ed out. Saw Ghost Ranch, and Echo Ampitheatre, and Georgia O’Keeffe’s home. Is it possible to post pics here? I could. But I was only able to spend about 30 hours total seeking time from both trips. So don’t think for one minute I’m sure that the area is exhaustively searched, at least not by me!

          And for those who think I want any money from the finder… forget it. Give 10% of your final take to cancer research, just as Fenn is with the proceeds of his book. I’m not that greedy or needy. Actually, I’m reasonably well off on my own; I am a medical doctor. Everyone, not just me, needs to do some soul-searching to decide what they are really in the hunt for. Sorry for sowing seeds of discord. And leave Zach and Steph alone; they’ve got a valid beef. I regret sharing too much openly with the blog. You want teasers, not open discourse.

          PEACE OUT!

      • Bill great detailed work. Not sure why this has split the blog into two factions, You have given some valuable insight, BUT IT IS NOT THE ANSWER UNTIL SOMEONE IS HOLDING THE CHEST. (Sorry cap lock stuck…that’s my story and I’m sticking to it). There are probably thousands of similar solutions, and if someone chooses to go to the trouble of following Bill’s idea, scheduling a trip, spending a few days in the woods, and it doesn’t pan out, then that may have been at the expense of them foregoing their own research that might have led to the chest. Bill may have inadvertently prolonged the hunt!

        I have a little problem with the analogy of standing over kids and announcing the answer that you know…because this is not an answer that Bill knows for sure…it is just a suggestion. It is more analogous to “phone a friend” in Who Wants To Be A Millionaire, and then taking the suggested answer or not.

        Bill…keep on pluggin’

        • I never said it had to be the right answer…it’s annoying is all….to me. Why is everyone all feisty tonight? We can disagree and still spread the love…can’t we? Or do we need to be full of spit and vinegar towards each other? Where’s the rule sheet? *reading*…no we can love each other *hug hug hug*

      • OMG you are chastising me again Stephanie? If you don’t stop that I will take my ball and go home!

        Remember you can catch more flies with honey than vinegar…but you catch the most with a big load of BS.

        But who wants flies anyway?

      • Fisrt time I ever have disagreed with you Steph. The thrill is getting out there and physically looking yourself. Actually it’s more than that. I can’t go look until September and am having thrills finding my own places and looking at how other have approaced it. The flip side to this coin is that you see a clue Bill missed, go to that spot and Wham! Youre a happy girl 😉

    • well put zach.. i enjoy reading the different interpretations and conversations, but bill, you did go too far.. especially since some of us have been drawn to that region.. and in my opinion it probably wasnt a common search place..

      • I like the Monopoly analogy, because this search, like Monopoly, is just a game. And anyone who thinks otherwise has Monopoly money in their eyes. I didn’t give away any proven answers. My theories are probably as useless as every one else’s who has dropped hints about Yellowstone, Taos, petroglyphs, Eagle Lake, Angel Fire or a hundred others you can see here. No one is yelling at the guy who said Angel Fire… What if that was my hard-earned secret solution too?

        I think the ire directed at me is mainly because, even if wrong, my thought process is plausible and cohesive. My goal was to show how one should approach the poem. Anyone who wants the fun of solving the poem all on his or her own shouldn’t be reading this blog anyway. Enough. Dal, if the consensus is my post is ruining the game, then take it down. It’s only been up a few hours, and only a minority have seen it.

        Have fun, folks. I shan’t be posting here anymore. Sorry if I ruined anyone’s fun, or took gold out of the mouths of six starving children.

    • I find myself having to speak out again. A blog is “a Web site on which an individual or group of users record opinions, information, etc. on a regular basis.” That appears to be what is happening on dal’s blog site. I think dal is pretty good at letting people know when their comments are inappropriate. Let us not tell dal how to run his site and what bloggers should or shouldn’t say. I read Bill’s comments and merely dismissed them because I had already been down that road. Some people like to share more opinions/information than other people do. Only dal can draw a line on this issue. Not you, not me.

      With that said:

      It seems that FF would have had to happen on a cool hiding place or else he would have had to construct his own hiding place. I believe that FF has said that his hiding place would not be happened on. I believe that FF also said that his hiding place is not associated with any structure. Structure = shelter = something that covers or affords protection. This seems to put the chest underground. But then I believe that FF has said the chest is exposed to the elements and subject to forest fires, which seems to eliminate burial. If the chest were in a tree, it certainly could be happened on. If the chest were under a log, it certainly could be happened on. So if something has to give, I would say that the chest could be happened upon. Any other sharing thoughts out there?

      • $Bill,

        Over the last couple of days I have mentioned possible location was on private land. I took into consideration that Fenn wouldn’t neccesarily want people to got in any legal hangups. Also, his family had a ranch I read somewhere. What’s the chance that he hid it on family property (recollect it is in Montana). That would make so much sense. And it seems to fit with laws covering abandon property on private lands (non-government). I don’t remember any serious discussion on this. Just a thought.

        • germanguy-
          The ranch in Forrest’s family is south of Santa Fe. So not a possibility for the hiding place of the chest.

          • Thanks Dal, I’m glad you cleared that up for me. BTW, isn’t it a bit soon to leave the safety of the bunker?

      • germanguy, I agree, I just don’t know anything about FF’s private land(s), except his San Lazaro site, which a person would have to get past three locked gates and most likely be arrested for trespassing, and it’s south of Santa Fe out of the Rocky Mountains. It doesn’t seem that people are interested in the private land theory or not willing to post any info.

      • dal, you were posting as I was writing. You just cleared up for me what you meant by FF’s family ranch.

    • Zach,

      Are you happy now, Bill will no longer be posting on here because of your ridiculous unwarranted comments. You are such a child, and are definitely part of the 99% who don’t get this poem or the thrill.

      • Yeah, grrrrr. I mean… uh, what he said. Wait I’ve lost track, who’s mad at who? I’m catching All-timers here, think I’ll go check out what folks say the trail conditions are maybe in.
        “The light, the light”. Get it? I crack myself up.

      • Zach,

        For the most part I’m with you… but in case you missed it, you’ve been scolded. Now go to your room!.

        jd

        • After I send my son to his room he gets a marshmallow. So enjoy going to your room Zack! Have a marshmallow! (He’s one the marshmallow makes him happy again. The things I do. SMH!)

      • It is pretty disheartning. This is such a great resource for the experienced and the new. Weeds are popping up. There is no reasonable expectation of privacy here, this is a public blog and people are trying to POLICE what can be said for their benefit and the lack of benefit for others. The only person that has the right to POLICE this blog is Dal himself. If he wants to turn this into a private blog and police the information being given thats up to him and no one else. It is his blog……
        (Greed is the root of all evil,Timothy 6:10)

    • @Zach

      Most people can probably take from both sides of this. Understandably those who have searched longer and put a lot more time and money into it would be PO’d if someone came along and threw the answer up on an internet blog chat somewhere. Then again if you’re like me and over 1650 miles away and in a similar situation you described Zach then it doesn’t make much of a ‘Chase’ for us. Some of us can’t just jump in a plane, rent a car, and find lodging when the mood strikes us to check out a hunch. Everyone is going to take it a different way. Opportunists (of the many out there) will just take what is freely given and walk away laughing with no moral dilemma all the way to retirement. Then there is entitlement. People who think it should be theirs for a variety of reasons which I won’t get into because it could be considered inflammatory. And those that DESERVE it for all their time, effort, thinking, and determination. If you found it tomorrow I’d applaud. Makes a great story. Same for Steph or Dal or any of the others who’ve been tramping around the mountains for years. I’d want any of you ‘long-timers’ to sign my book if you get to the end!

      However keep this in mind. There are those of us out there who work like pack mules for our spouses, kids, and families in order to keep necessities and a few small luxuries in our immediate lives that are handicapped by geography, time, finances, whatever that still enjoy the Chase. Just so happens that all we have immediately available is the Poem and the book.

      Good on Bill for posting his thoughts and contributing. Should he have posted EVERYTHING? Maybe not. How good will you feel when the person who DOES find the box posts the entire solution? The same I would guess. There have been how many posts in The Nine CLues? And how many have actually been about figuring out the answers? Would someone giving out the answer to even ONE of the clues be the same as the total solution?

      My feeling about it would be don’t cry about spoilers when that is the titled purpose of the blog…the NINE clues. Then again don’t ruin everyone else’s fun by solving (or giving your idea of) what the charade really is. Post it on your own blog and let everyone else decide if they want to read it or not (much like the purple elephant has already done.)

    • ZACH
      Then don’t read it and get off this blog. Maybe this isn’t the place for you. Your negativity is unwanted, Bill wrote a long thought out process in a blog that is meant for that. I appreciated reading it and that is part of the THRILL. If you don’t understand that this is a community of people getting together and sharing stories or tips actually helps the chase as a whole, then why are you here? Go in peace and leave others alone if you have nothing nice to say.

  90. @Dal,
    I think you said you had 6 places lined up to search and was excited about 3 of them. In another conversation we had I asked how many clues did you solve before you put your money where your idea was and went out searching……I think you said you had most if not all of the clues match a spot before you considered it a spot worth searching.

    I find that amazing…….I’ve traveled the back country of the west extensively but I apparently don’t have the imagination to link what I know to the poem (as I said on Bill’s comment). That is really frustrating to me.

    I was going to ask if it was top secret when you are heading out, and if you would be wearing a disguise. Your vehicle with Washington tags is going to be like the doppler trucks and famous chasers during tornado season…..there’s always a long line of cars following them around wanting to get a glimpse of a tornado. They create quite the traffic jam at times.

    I was going to get an ice axe and offer to drive your vehicle around as a decoy so you could conduct your searches without having to worry about someone tracking you. I would just get a few shirts and sew on a “Dal” name tag. It would be a piece of cake, everyone would just be commenting on how much better looking you are in person. 😎

    After reading your recent comment I withdraw the offers; I just can’t bring myself to drive around towing an Oscar Meyer Weiner Wagon. 😆

    • Goofy-
      Not really keeping a secret from anyone about where I search…except from Stephanie. I think someone earlier said you could throw a dart at a map of the Rocky Montains and within 20 miles of where it lands will be a place that matches up to the poem. I am in, more or less, agreement with that. My point being that I believe there are too many places that draw me in, not too few. But of course it all comes down to the broadness or narrowness of your interpretation of the poem…and what you consider to be clues. My first area was the most perfect fit. If I were starting today, I would never consider that first place I went to. Because I have additional information that would rule that place out. First, the “ROCKY” Mountains hint, second the “no sense looking where a 79 or 80 year old guy would not have gone” hint and third the idea that he “never expects to visit the treasure”. But two years ago we didn’t have those hints so my original spot, at the confluence of the Rio Grande and the Red River looked perfect. I wrote a post about that spot shortly after I came back. It is located here:
      http://lummifilm.wordpress.com/2011/09/03/part-two-interpreting-the-clues/

      I go back and forth about taking those earlier writings down since they no longer reflect my thinking on the clues in the poem. This problem for me is compounded by the fact that I know others will head there thinking I must have missed something. I know people do go there because they email to tell me I had to be right and they are going to the same spot because I gave up too easily.

      But here is how I landed on that first spot two years ago:
      First of all, at that time I was convinced Forrest would have hidden the treasure close by so he could check on it once in awhile. So I restricted my search to New Mexico.

      Begin WWWH:
      About two months after I heard about Forrest’s treasure I was reading everything I could find about New Mexico rivers, hot springs, thermals, dams, fishing…the usual sorts of reading material searchers sweat through trying to figure out what WWWH could possibly refer too. During that period I read a beautiful essay by Tony Hillerman about the Rio Grande. I learned how important that river was to the wildlife, agriculture, ranching and residents of NM. It’s a beautiful piece. In that essay Tony described how the waters of the Rio Grande through the San Juan Valley in lower CO were too warm and too languid to support a trout fishery. But then something wonderful and exciting happens almost exactly at the NM line. The Rio begins its descent into the “gorge”. It falls and rushes and is fed by cold water springs and in little more than a mile it becomes one of the premiere trout fisheries in NM.The gorge deepens and is so lovely that the place is a National Wild and Scenic River.

      That essay convinced me that I had stumbled onto the most important place in New Mexico where warm water halted. Below that place where warm water changed to cold water was a long and deep gorge, called the box. Its 800 to a thousand feet down. No place for the meek. The cold and rushing Rio Grande is at the bottom. My “canyon down”.

      And on and on I went..each of what I believed was a clue in the poem I could match up to a place in that canyon. 15 miles seemed like to far too walk and at that point the Rio met with the Red. The Red was reputed to be a remarkable Brown trout fishery. A hatchery set just three miles upstream from the confluence on The Red. The Red was narrow and boulder strewn and no one would try to paddle up it.

      The only item I could not locate without standing in that gorge and walking along the Red River was the “blaze”.

      I walked from the hatchery down to the Rio. Then I walked the Rio north to the end of the shoreline trail about three miles up at Petroglyph Point. Then I drove over to the other side of the Red River and walked back down into that canyon south of the confluence to walk around. I saw plenty of blazes. Trail markers, tree markers, trails, rock cairns and more. I investigated everything. I spent three days down there. No sign of a 10x10x5 chest. It was May and it snowed on me. The days were 60deg and the nights were 26deg. I am not a kid anymore and walking back out of that canyon was not easy.

      I finally had to admit that I could not find the blaze or the chest.

      I’ve had the same kind of alignment with the clues in every spot I’ve looked except two. One was Ojo Caliente in Yellowstone and the other was the upper Madison outside of the park. They just seemed like good places for Forrest to hide his treasure. So I ignored the poem’s clues and just looked in those spots. No go!

      Contributors to this blog would probably think I was delirious for some of my connections between poem and landscape. But I have always felt confident. The clues can work so many ways…

      My point is that I believe there are a gazillion places in the Rocky Mountains North of Santa Fe where you can line those clues up. The problem for me is not finding a place…rather, it’s finding the RIGHT place and you don’t know that until you walk around for hours and sometimes days in your search area.

      I’m not complaining. I’ve seen some wonderful places. I’ve traveled some beautiful road. And if things get too heated and too crowded this summer. I’ll take a break. Wait for everybody to make the same mistakes I made, give up, go home and then I’ll start in again. When the roads and campgrounds are less populated.

      I love this hunt!!

      • Dal,

        That was a great comment. You my friend, have the truest meaning of what this adventure is all about. I almost have a tear in my eye (I said almost), but that is why someone like you will find it. I honestly hope that if I don’t find it (and of course you know my confidence level), that you my friend are the winner of this Great Race To The Treasure.

        • JP-
          I looked but there wasn’t any water in the stream bed upstream of the hatchery. I’m still scratching my head about that. Of course there would be no paddle up that stream either I guess…
          I skipped the whole river above the hatchery to just above the Moly mine. It’s really trashed by that mining operation at that point and I didn’t feel it could possibly be a place Forrest would want to hide his treasure..

          • Yes..Firehole Falls has been searched over and over. There is even video of Gadi searching around the falls on the KOB program on the media section of this blog. I have heard people mention Fairy Falls as a target area but I have not spoken with anyone who actually searched there.

      • Dal
        Well articulated and I have only been to NM twice but readying to go again soon to look in my most recent “hot spots”. I have to agree with Forrest who says “imagination is better than knowledge/knowlege” and I have a pretty good imagination so I have been able to find many “sure spots” like many people on this blog.

        I do think one actually does have to be there in person for some of the clues and therefore will return again to look around and hopefully stumble upon the “blaze” and then find the chest close by. I have read the book too several times now (just received it last Friday).

  91. Well, I think Bill gets the point and has his own soul searching to do (no pun intended). So what you say we ALL get back to the reason we are all here. OK?

  92. Scott C. I hope you are still watching. I, and I’m sure many here, value your input. Besides, I miss your comebacks on my comments 🙂

  93. After several failures on my perfect solutions, I have come to realize the truth – Forest spent 2 months creating the framework for the poem and another 9 years 10 months going to locations around the entire Rockies to make sure it fit everywhere. Words like warm water, canyon, brown, meek, wise, fire, horse, and devil are used in just about every river and national forest. I even searched the warm water creek that flows down brown devil canyon.

    For anyone who thinks they have the perfect fit, throw a dart at a wall map of the Rockies and you will find another perfect fit within 20 miles of that dart.

    I’m convinced the thing will be found by someone driving around and not someone who sits at home on Google Earth. I also think it’s impossible to know the blaze without being there. It’s not x,y, or z that is seen on a map. if it was, then who needs the first 7 or 8 clues. There have been thousands working on it and yet after 3 years, it’s still out there. It might be found, but it’s not something you can see from a desk. It’s the thrill of the chase and the word Chase means driving and hiking.

    I also can tell anyone looking that it’s a big world out there and it’s amazing how I could have been within 50 ft of it and I might as well have been a mile away since looking is so difficult in the streams, forest and rocks. Add in even a hint of snow and even my metal detector hits took hours with the digging. (I no longer do the snow thing as I know my perfect solution is more likely another failure).

    I think the solution by Bill B. is wrong, but still brilliant for it’s approach. It will take that kind of thinking to solve it.

  94. Interesting to watch the evolution of this play out. A week or two ago, nobody was sharing any real meat except from where they had already been. Then, as people got stuck, they started to throw out a thought or two just to see what feedback they might get. From there, it moved pretty quickly to some fairly substantial conversations about pieces to the puzzle. Finally, one guy jumps to his detailed thoughts on a plausible location and a bunch of people jump all over him. Not saying anybody is right or wrong in any of it, just interesting to watch.

    Quick poll…when somebody does find this, does everyone want the answer blurted out, or would it be better to get clues on the clues so you can try to figure out the rest. I go back and forth on this one. Trying to figure out the puzzle has been great fun, so it would be nice if I KNEW the starting spot and could work the rest of the poem from the known. On the other hand, by the time it gets done, I might just be ready for the answer so I can be done with it. Thoughts?

    • dale ive been followiing this blog about a month and no one has been quite that explicit yet.. and though his interpretations and effort are commendable, i dont think anyone should be giving it away like that, whether its wrong or right.. i dont know how others feel but i want whomever finds this treasure to have earned it.. not given the possible solution and location and then get lucky.. as far as when its found, i want to hear how they solved it.. and it will probably be a, why didnt i think of that?? note: this post was edited and hopefully approved

      Reply

      • He gave a possibility. It was great. Why did you continue reading it? Why are you reading anything. Who are you to judge bill. Do the best that you can and leave other people alone…That’s how you get Forrest’s respect. Maybe you missed that from his video!

    • From the 6 questions with FF and straight form the source itself.
      I am ambivalent about the treasure being found. When it is discovered I hope it is by some deserving person who is emotionally involved and has been rewarded by the other mountain thrills that come with the chase. If it is not found for several hundred years that would be fine with me. Sounded to me like Bill is emotionally involved, thrilled by the search he was on, and happy to share it with others. Go BIll! Sometimes people forget that this is a free world and infringe on others. I’ve done it, and when I do, I look in the mirror and do a checkup from the neckup. I heard people welcoming you back, I hope you stick around, I enjoyed your story. And for the record, it doens’t make me want to run out there and search that very place based on your description. If i lead myself to that point I will reference what you said. Thanks for the help!

    • Funny, when the Guy/Gal finds the Treasure and then post they have found it with pictures on The Today Show, then try’s to post his solution… everyone is going to say…NO,NO, don’t give it, you’ll ruin it for us. Then will know we’re obsessed.

    • Dale,

      I admit if there was only a grand in the chest I would’t be doing this but it’s the puzzle that intrigues me. I’d really like to figure it out. If the chest is found I’d like to know the state and if it’s one of mine I’d keep going for awhile. If not, then the heck with it, I was never really in it. My wife thinks I’m nuts and that no one will ever find it.

      I don’t need the incentive to get out into nature. But the goal will take me places I haven’t been to yet. That’s pretty cool.

      It’s fun to match wits with other searchers and get and give ideas on some minor things, but mostly I’d like to figure it out myself, for myself.

      It would be really fascinating to hear Mr. Fenn talk about his thought process while creating the poem. I hope to get that chance.

      hopefully in person

      jd

  95. I would not worry too much about what Bill posted. It reminded me more of how Batman and Robin would solve the the Riddler’s riddles on the TV series, than the more simplistic approach needed to solve this. I think the treasure remains safely hidden for awhile.

    • I’m not worried about the place he posted..never even thought of it before. I just was giving my own opinion and a few people who emailed and didn’t want to give their opinions lol…I don’t know why Zach got jumped on. I’m actually surprised that more don’t feel the same way. Maybe they can’t figure anything out and are happy to have a solution they can search. I don’t know. For me, the trying to figure this out has been so much fun. I get that we’re all throwing around a few ideas here and there…but that was just laid out so complete that if it turned out to be there….I’d honestly be pretty bummed as someone else said…that someone who didn’t even think just went and got it. I mean then why not go pay your buck for a chance to play the lottery? To me I like the game that Forrest has put on for us to play. It’s just my opinion…not putting it on anyone else…no one has to agree….I’m not expecting Bill to stop. Just being my verbal self.

      • Steph
        The odds are, even if we all posted where we think it is it probably is not there.
        We all are missing something or it would have been found
        When someone has to give so many details to where it is the more likely it was overthought maybe?

        • It’s not even my place that Bill mentioned…my place is the right place which I’ll go to on trip 19 and find and so it will be a moot point…. *running from the room to avoid the eggs*

  96. I would not worry too much about what Bill posted. It reminded me more of how Batman and Robin would solve the Riddler’s riddles in the old TV seres, than the more simplistic approach required to solve this. I think the treasure will remain safely hidden for awhile.

    • I know, I said I was done posting, but I actually like that one… “Holy Ojitos, Batman!” 🙂

      • Bill B,
        Welcome back and i applaud you for having the real guts to post a solution to the poem and where the chest could be.

        • Sheesh his real guts is coming back and facing the pink toenails and hearts soon to be floating around.

          Jen Durham

          • Jen
            now we all have to pitch in and buy Bill a compass but he has the book alrady so its 10 cents each?

          • Ill participate but only if its a pink one that holds a secret compartment full of glitter. And butterflies.

      • Senoir Bill! You are back. Los sientos hombre, you are a good man. We all love you. Que es el numeros para powerball por favor?

      • Bill,
        I enjoyed you sharing your Thrill of the Chase. Anyone who had or has a problem with what you shared are the ones with a problem. Please keep posting.
        Thanks,
        Bob

  97. Hey Folks we should all take a step back and consider that this is one man’s theory. He tried to move from the theoretical state to actually finding it or a factual conclusion and like the rest of us came out empty.

    We all have our own theories. Eventually one of us will get to a factual conclusion. So do your homework. Most importantly stay safe and try to travel in pairs. The wilderness though beautiful can be unforgiving.

    All the best to everyone..

  98. Rudeness is like cussing, in that it doesn’t help anything.
    Perhaps I’m on the wrong blog, but what was the definite explanation of why the treasure is in New Mexico? I’m still leaning towards Yellowstone.
    Thanks Emmett

    • So there’s no confusion, my above comment was for Randy. Boy what a wasted day.

      • I’m loose man believe me. Im calling it as I and many others see it. Talk about a wasted day, the last 100 posts were about telling Bill he “went to far” and running a nice guy out of the blog.

  99. The difference between a moral man and a man of honor is that the latter regrets a discreditable act, even if it has worked and he has not been caught.

  100. Anybody following the idea that all the clues are describing the same place? I know there has been talk of ‘going full circle’, but it was something I have been pondering. Others have kind of alluded to it in a way. Using the example I posted in Part 2 if you had to tell someone where something was in your house how many steps would it take? Or like the spare soap in the white wrapper in the back of the bottom drawer of the left side of the vanity in the master bathroom. Again just thinking out loud.

  101. This poem written by Forrest Fenn contains nine clues that if followed precisely, will lead to the end of his rainbow and the treasure. Happy Hunting! It seems to me the first thing everyone does is follow the poem exactly in order. Precisely does not have to mean in order, it can mean accurately or correctly. He said begin WWWH but possibly we need to De-scramble it where the 9 clues are in the stanzas. Following the punctuation one way I come up with is:

    Begin it where warm waters halt 1.
    Put in below the home of Brown, 2.
    And take it in the canyon down, 3.
    Not far, but too far to walk. 4.

    There’ll be no paddle up your creek, 5.
    From there it’s no place for the meek, 6.
    The end is ever drawing nigh; 7.
    Just heavy loads and water high. 8.

    But tarry scant with marvel gaze,
    If you’ve been wise and found the blaze, 9.
    Look quickly down, your quest to cease,
    Just take the chest and go in peace.

    So why is it that I must go
    And leave my trove for all to seek?
    The answer I already know,
    I’ve done it tired, and now I’m weak.

    So hear me all and listen good,
    Your effort will be worth the cold.
    If you are brave and in the wood
    I give you title to the gold.

    The last stanza I do not think contains any clues, just describes the area the 9 clues lead to. Cold, Wood, Gold.

    From the 6 questions with FF.

    We shall not cease from our exploration
    And at the end of all our exploring
    Will be to arrive where we started
    And know the place for the first time

    To me that means, Thinking of places you have already searched, go back to the beginning and look at it again because maybe it was only missed from the clues not followed accurately. Does it lead you somewhere else close to the area you already searched and still make sense?

    If it works just give me a nugget. I already mentioned that if I found it, I would return it to Forrest, minus a nugget to hang on my wall.

  102. Hi All-
    I am starting part five in a moment and then closing down comments here. Feel free to move to five when you see it.
    Thanks
    dal…

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