Could it be Here?…

June 2014
by germanguy

Forrest Fenn said “It’s not easy, but it’s not impossible” to solve this poem. Well, I found that it was not easy to write up this solution, so that it could be understood by everyone. But I’ve always lived by “Nothing is impossible, but the word itself”, so here goes:

A note here: What I learned about Fenn’s rules regarding creation of the poem, is that there are very few or none. He tends to mix techniques. When you expect him to do one thing he changes to something else. As I go through this, you will see what I mean. I have always showed a level of confidence that to some seemed excessive, but after you are done reading this, you will finally understand why.

First stanza is a preface to the poem. It contains 1 and possibly 2 clues. The fact that he uses the words “I” and “My” later provides me with my ‘Blaze’. Secondly, “I” was used as the Roman numeral for the number 1, as in ‘One has gone alone in there’.

Second stanza was the most difficult for me to solve (as it has been for everyone), however when carefully studied, it gives an exact location. This made it easier to decipher. The “Begin it…” tells what road to travel. The ‘I’ (in the word “it”) again is switched in it’s meaning. Fenn now switches to the numeric position of the letter in the alphabet, so that gives us the 9th letter of the alphabet. Add to that ’t’ and you have ‘9t’ or simply 90. The line now reads “Begin 90” in the canyon down (south), so you know that you are driving south on 90.

The third line of this stanza, the words “Not far, but too far” is known as a paradox in the English language. In south western Colorado is a valley called Paradox Valley. The valley is surrounded by sandstone cliffs, which prevent ground water that accumulates there from escaping (Where warm waters halt). It is known as an evaporate area. The sub basin (or subsurface if you will) is composed of a deep salt bed (anticline that has collapsed). Additionally, due to the high concentration of salt in the ground water that is added to the Dolores River, a desalination plant was constructed there to remove 205,000 tons of salt a year from the river, which then flows into the Colorado River and further on enters other western states and Mexico. I recently commented about not studying the poem as single lines, but rather as complete sentences. I’m sure you can see that without the complete sentence, I would never have found WWWH. Much talk about a focus word, has been discussed on the blog. If I were to pick one, it would be “Paradox”, simply because most people would miss it. What do you think?

Following route 90 south (out of Paradox Valley), you intersect with Colorado Rte. 141 (see picture included). North on this road (approx. 45 miles) is John Brown Canyon. Thus we have our “Home of Brown”, which is located in the Gateway, Colorado area. So we’ll be turning left (put in) going north.

Third stanza has a lot of clues. “From there it’s no place for the meek” alludes to the high sandstone cliffs that make you feel insignificant or meek. Again, the numeric reference in “It’s” = 90’s. So we have “From there 90’s no place for the meek”.

“The end is ever drawing nigh” tells us that the next spot we’re looking for is on the left and close (using both definitions of ‘nigh’ doesn’t change anything).

“They’ll be no paddle up your creek”. We are traveling north at this point and so is the San Miguel River (which is on our right). In order to “paddle up your creek”, you would have to turn around, going south away from our destination. Also, the use of the word ‘creek’ is quite accurate. The river we follow, at certain times of the year is nothing more than a creek. This river is one of the last ‘free flowing’ rivers in the United States. There currently are no dams along it. However, as time would have it, I read in an article recently that there is a proposal to put in diversion dams (this news came, after Fenn hid the chest). As a nature lover and someone who doesn’t like government interference in how our natural resources are controlled, I know that this will probably come as a disappointment to him. I wondered if he might have changed his mind on this area, if he knew this.

“Just heavy loads and water high”. Even though Fenn would have picked Winter to even consider going to this spot to hide his chest (which to be honest would have been the smartest move) and for the sake of it staying put for a long, long time, he could have very well known the difficulty of Summer attempts. So, this line makes perfect sense. Winter equates to no water, no bugs and no people. Perfect. This may also have accounted for his having to make 2 trips, as he could have gone too early (due to the level of the water on the first attempt).

In this stanza, there were 2 words that when their alternate meanings were used (which I believe was intentional), gave another important and supporting clue. The words…paddle and drawing. When replaced, became row and glyph. Using ‘high’ from this stanza along with the other 2 new meanings became ‘hieroglyph’. In the location I had uncovered, there is a canyon called Hieroglyphics Canyon. Two more clues were uncovered using the ending words in each line of this stanza…Meek, nigh, creek and high. I will reveal them in the next stanza.

In the fourth stanza “If you’ve been wise and found the blaze, look quickly down, your quest to cease”. I remembered that I was curious about his use of the singular pronouns “I” and “my” in the first stanza. Why use them at all, unless they were key to some other purpose further on down. After all, if anything, I saw the whole first stanza as a preface to the rest of the poem. However, after reading the aforemention 2 lines, I now understood.

I always figured that Fenn was making himself the “blaze”, as in “Trail blazer”. Well, after reading the first and second line in stanza four, it was here that I uncovered what I believed to be the purpose behind the use of “I” and “my” from the first stanza.

I think we can all agree that Forrest is quite literate, given the number of books he’s written in his lifetime. Also, I believe we all can agree that as a result of all those books, he understands the rules of the English language very well (look how he put that ‘paradox’ right under our noses). He is very clever and insightful man. What I will show you now is his cleverness.

In the English language, the singular first person pronouns are I (subject), me (object), my (possessive delimiter). Subject “I” (Fenn), Possessive “my” (chest/treasure) and finally Object “me” (Fenn). Now if “me” is an “object”, wouldn’t it fit the bill as being both Fenn and the “blaze” (as a blaze can be an object)? So what do we really have here? Well, everything but the “me”.

Now in order to find the “blaze”, we need to move on to the next line, “Look quickly down, your quest to cease”. Remember his words “You only need the poem”. He never hinted or said that we need to go out into the wilderness and look for a blaze. So, if this is true, the blaze is and always was in the poem.

Recall in the early days of the search, that one of the pictures Fenn posted, was of a tree with (as I recall) 2 “F’s” carved in it. It was then that he gave us the biggest clue. He was the blaze, as in ‘trail blazer’.

Back to the “me” issue. Every time I read these first two lines of this, the third stanza, I always asked myself “If I’m to be wise” and “look quickly down”, “I have to have already uncovered the blaze”. So here is where the “me” came in. In the previous stanza, the last word in the first line is “meek”. There in front of me (no pun intended) is “me”ek. I now have the blaze.

Now comes the beauty of this. The “look quickly down” uncovers another valuable clue. Looking down at the first 2 letters (remember ‘me’ is only 2 letters) in each of the words “meek, nigh, creek and high”, I find ‘me’, ‘ni’, ‘cr’ and ‘hi’. Unscrambled, they produce “rich mine”. Keep this in mind for its handy, further down in the poem.

Note: Forrest Fenn has stated “If the poem is followed precisely, it will lead you to the chest and the end of his rainbow”. So, even though it would be impossible to follow the poem step by step to the chest, after the poem is completely solved, it does precisely that.

The third line, “But tarry scant with marvel gaze”, is a reference to a special kind of marble that I’m sure some ‘old timers’ are familiar with. Their composition was unique and I’ll share that with you further on. You’ll understand the significance of it then.

“Just take the chest and go in peace”. Not much here, but possible use to keep rhyme scheme.

In the fifth stanza “So why is it that I must go”. This was definitely very creative on Fenn’s part. “Why” phonetically is really the letter “Y” and the “i” in the next 2 words are Roman numerals “1”. There is a road named Y11 in the area I’m going to take you to.

“And leave my trove for all to seek?” Again, just filler for purposes of the poem.

“The answer I already know,” Same use as the previous line.

“I’ve done it tired, and now I’m weak. Again, another nicely done clue. We finally get confirmation of the road that we turned north on from route 90. This time we have a combination of Roman and Arabic numbers (from each of the words “I’ve done it”). “I” = Roman “1”, “d” =4th letter of alphabet and “i” = roman “1” again. Combined equals 141. We are on route 141 heading north from route 90 to road Y11.

Forrest gives this line a dual purpose as he’s done previously in this poem. The line says “I’ve done it tired and now I’m weak”. Replace ‘tired’ with ‘driving’ and ‘weak’ with ‘south’. Cars have tires and when you’re weak you fall down and down is south.

Now comes the most important stanza of all. This brings everything previously mentioned into focus.

“So hear me all and listen good”. You have to do exactly that. Not just read the lines, but read them out loud, or you’ll never hear the final clues.
“Your effort will be worth the cold”. Phonetically, the strongest sounds you should hear are “f” and “e”.
Next sentence “If you are brave and in the wood I give you title to the gold. Phonetically, you should be able to uncover 2 clues. First is “U”,”R”,”AV”,”AN” which equals Uravan. Second requires repeating the first and continue through to the last line. It will result in “U”,”R”,”A”,”N”,”I”,”U” which equals Uraniu. We are missing a key letter here to complete the word “uranium”. Typing the first 3 letters of the wordd “title to the” in all caps, gives us the familiar letter “TTT”. Three vertical lines with a horizontal line across the top (m).

The location is Uravan Colorado. Mineral mined here was Uranium. The “Tarry scant with marvel gaze” is in reality a Tarry substance known as Pitchblende which is a byproduct of uranium, along with Yellow Cake (Yellowstone). The “scant” is the 2-3 percent used to make a marble glaze which causes the marble to radiate in the sun. These were available when Forrest was a kid (and remembered by old timer’s).

The “F” and “E” sounds when combined, give us Effie. It turns out that in Uravan there was a “rich mine” (we uncovered this earlier in stanza 3) that was called “Effie F”, following true to form, the “blaze”.

To finish the search, we need the final location. If you’ve carefully read this solution, you will recall it says “Y11” that I must go, starting point on route 141 driving south for 1 mile. At that point there will be water to cross (Your effort will be worth the cold) first and trees to enter (If you are brave and in the wood) second. This is the order in which these 2 instructions appear in the poem.

Aerial views of search location and potential treasure location:
(click on photo to see it full size)

Overall View

Overall View

Start and End Points

Start and End Points

Personal Thoughts:

1.  Do I honestly believe that the chest was there?  Yes.  It is too perfect a solution in my mind not to.  His reference to Yellowstone on page 45 of TTOTC, lends itself to that conclusion, along with so many of the other hints in the book.  His use of the word Yellowstone for example, in this area you’d find “Yellow Cake”.  He speaks of the war and the rationing going on.  This place was guaranteed not to suffer shortages, because Uncle Sam was mining Yellow cake for Atomic bombs (see page 74 caption in TTOTC)and had to keep the miners and there family well provided for.  He speaks of a little dirt road and a school house, both are here.  The fact that elsewhere in the book he speaks of grinding rocks to make marbles on a piece of sandstone, all these references point to this place.  The line with “no radio”, suggests a lack of signal because of the high cliffs and remoteness of the town.

2.  Could it be buried?  Possibly, but Fenn made numerous comments that make me think otherwise.  Like “it’s exposed to the elements”.  Based on the period the chest was created, it was a period in which tin and not iron was used to make Roman bronze, so it would truly stand the test of time, which after all, is what he wants.

3.  Did Fenn go here to hide his chest in the summer or winter?  Winter, because it wouldn’t involve dealing with high water, bugs or people.  The perfect place for a 79 year old to go.

4.  Are there elements of this place that would appeal to Fenn?  Yes, many.  Such as Butch Cassidy herding stolen cattle up this canyon, or using this as an escape route after robbing the Telluride bank.  The mining of Uranium for the first atom bomb. Uranium from here that was shipped to France for Madam Currie in her discovery of radium.  Uravan’s history includes a “Hanging Flume” that was reconstructed (at least 48 feet of it).  This Flume was used earlier, prior to the mining of Uranium, for gold placer mining (riches, new and old).  The project to build it cost about $100,000 and the owners got only $50,000 of that back, before they abandoned the enterprise.  Radiation treatments saved Fenn’s life, so it definitely holds a place in his heart.  Arrow heads, agates for making marbles (found in Paradox Valley), fishing, archeology, etc., all come together here.  One important fact I feel Fenn knew about this place, was that it was so remote, that it had been forgotten in history (left overs of history).

Hints from “The Thrill Of The Chase” book itself:

Page 7    I always listened carefully.

Page 15   Left overs of history

Page 24   crossed the river

Page 32   I’d spend class time grinding marbles against sandstone slab

Page 38   Hop A Long Cassidy

Page 45   In love with Yellowstone

Page 47   that was years ago before the streets were paved

Page 62   that little stream got narrower and narrower

Page 67   into a stream of fast moving water

Page 74   I sat alert with an atomic bomb under my wing

Page 109 kids crossing street holding rope

Page 136 come and see my shining palace built upon the sand

I could probably go on forever, with all the discoveries I found, but I won’t.   I will leave it to you to decide if this is a valid solution or not.  The only question that remains, is whether or not the chest is still there or has it already been secreted away.  Good luck to you all and happy hunting.



MichaelD will be writing about his adventure soon.

160 thoughts on “Could it be Here?…

    • @GermanGuy
      Do you remember my questions regarding polluted “warm water” as it relates to Ur contamination? I may have been on the right track but dang GG your brilliance outshines my half-life glow. (I’m a thyroid cancer survivor with confmd cancer from Ur exposure as a kid in MT.)

        • Very sorry German 🙁 and in service of our country. Thank you for all you did to serve and protect!!! All the Ur mined in the Rockies during 60s & 70s for weapons was most likely my exposure.
          I’m not a vet but in need of a physician to help with rebuilding health. Have SLE & cancer. Any recommendations of type of doc to see. Guessing Vets have better drs trained in such.

          • Nor,

            Sorry to say, I can’t provide assistance in regards to dr.’s but only because it was handled by a group of dr.’s at the VA. It was a combination of seed implants and radiation treatments.

    • do give Mr. fenn the bracelet back. awe some clue finding and solve . congratulations andthank you for serving your cocountry. please post pics when the treasure is unearthed.

  1. Wow germanguy
    Ok that’s a lot of information and research in that poem that u were trying to solve . I think u were messing with Forrest’s poem.
    You did well trying to figure that out. How long did it take u?
    Are u still going to search another location or was this your last?

    • Yes Amy, That is a lot of information. Understand, the most difficult part was putting it together so everyone could comprehend it.

      As far as “messing” with the poem, there is no “messing”. I used only what was already there. Try to remember who the author of the poem was.

      It has been in the works for a long time. I solved it about a year and a half ago. I will admit that I didn’t follow through with it immediately. If you were around Dal’s blog, you know that there was 2 previous searches before this one.

      Sadly, this was my last. Age is sometimes cruel. Although, given that my partner Michael D. wasn’t successful in his search of the location due to the bugs and raging river he encountered, I believe still in the spot and would suggest a winter search when things calm down. Water down and bugs gone. My opinion though.

  2. German Guy- If the chest is NOT there in your spot, I will go put something of value there. Amazing solve! My mind cannot begin to comprehend how you even started. I guess that’s why I stay over on the poetry page with all the jinglers. 🙂

    • Mac,

      Getting started wasn’t a problem. I just laid a map of the USA on the desk, closed my eyes and pointed downward on the map. Viola! that’s where it is…LOL 🙂

    • @MacSweeney I best be headed back to the poetry page myself Mac. Always amazed at the gifts and clever minds given to other folks.

  3. IdahoHaldol,

    Dal is fixing this page currently, the answer to your question should be in the “My thoughts” section towards the bottom.

    Thanks for the compliment.

  4. Well, people – –

    If you DO wait until winter…. to paraphrase Frank Zappa,
    another reason to “don’t eat that yellow snow”

      • Inspiration is the word – –

        maybe should email discreetly, but I was thinking

        MY is M = Manhattan Project , Y = Project Y

        which brought me to Los Alamos.

        Not as clever as you, germanguy. And I’m not “sycophant”-ing. (just learned that word today).

        • Even if it’s not the solve, at least you were thinking out of the box. If anything, that was the only way I could come to any conclusions regarding the poem. It was meant to be, as Fenn put it, “Not easy, but not impossible either”.

      • I know you’re waiting for more feedback, but that’ll come in the morning. Everyone went to sleep thinking they had the latest news already. I usually work nights….
        Got to get up early, taking the little lady to her Thursday chemo. Thanks for being brave and bold!!

  5. Somehow, I just dont think ff would want to lay his body here. The symbolism just isnt personal enough. But nice work laying out the brain-work for us. Thanks for a thought provoking trip, I admire your research.

  6. germanguy-
    Your mind is like an agile gymnast. I can’t even think that way. Like someone said on an earlier post…”If that’s what it’s going to take to solve this riddle than I may as well take up collecting stamps.” Your solution is impeccable, fascinating and unique. Thanks for sharing.

        • Matt,

          If your interested, go to that rest area, cross at low water (or when it’s manageable) and search in the trees. Good luck.

        • Matt,

          In the second part of my search there, I explained that the rest area is actually at the point on my map, where it says “start point/one mile south”. You will find a parking/rest area, across from which is a group of trees that backup to the hill.

  7. my solve was based on Germanguys…but I went a different direction with it….

    The Sure Thing
    By Michael D

    I always felt like stanzas one, five, and six went together because it was Forrest Fenn speaking to us. These are the only stanzas where he is using I, me, and my to communicate to us. It seemed like stanzas two through four were telling us where the chest was at. It sounded like to me by the last line in stanza four, the location was divulged…so my line of thinking was that stanzas one, five, and six gave the directions to where warm waters halt, then stanzas two, three, and four told us where to find the chest from there.
    It was also logical to assume that the poem divulged the blaze by stanza four as well because it says “If you’ve been wise and found the blaze, look quickly down, your quest to cease, but tarry scant with marvel gaze, just take the chest and go in peace.” I believe stanza four is used to let you know that the blaze exists in stanza one, two, or three, and that you must be wise to find it. If you have been wise and found the blaze, then look quickly down to stanzas five and six, because, if you found the blaze, then stanzas five and six tell you where to go to find the chest. This is a MAJOR departure from what I have read on the blogs…(most people have been taking the poem as all directions on the ground all the time). So once you know the blaze, stanzas five and six reveal themselves a bit….I quickly deduced that if stanzas one, five, and six went together, stanza one HAD to be the stanza with the blaze, since stanza four tells you to first find the blaze, then look quickly down to five and six for directions to WWWH. Forrest always said to start at the beginning. I noticed right off the letter I, and two ones in the first line…As I have gone alone in there….What if I was one. In the first line, with a little imagination, we see, “As ONE have gONE alONE in THREE”…Now, I know that’s a stretch for some, but remember, my solve began at the beginning. The first stanza uses the word I in a specific way…”I can keep my secret where” is telling us the LETTER I is important to the solve. After stanza one, the letter I is not used again until stanza five. “As I have gone alone in there” is a code. I one one in three. A butterfly is really a flutterby, and there is really three. Imagination is more important than knowlege, and gone is one, as is alone). This is the BLAZE….I equals one. As we read through the rest of the poem with this in mind, the very next line says, AND WITH MY treasures bold….So perhaps instead of just I being a number one, whenever Forrest refers to himself in the poem, it means the number one. So every me, my or I in the poem would turn into a number one… we see in stanza four it states, “If you’ve been wise and found the blaze, look quickly down, your quest to cease, but tarry scant with marvel gaze, just take the chest and go in peace” We now know the blaze has to be introduced in the first three stanzas, and we found it…
    And one one one in three is true…So what if “I” as in Forrest Burke Fenn, is the Blaze?? That would mean not only I, but Me and My would be ONE, since they all refer to FBF. So I substituted ONE for all me, my and I’s that were referring to Forrest Fenn (in red letters), And BOLDED all the ONES that already appeared in the poem… and I also bolded any changes or interpretations I made to the poem, and this is what I got: ( I left out stanzas two through four because they have no ones or FF referrals)
    As ONE have gONE alONE in THREE
    And with ONE treasures bold,
    ONE can keep ONE secret where
    And hint of riches new and old.
    If you’ve been wise and found the blaze,
    Look quickly down your quest to cease,
    But tarry scant with marvel gaze,
    Just take the chest and go in peace.
    So Y is it that ONE must go
    And leave ONE trove for all to seek? = Y11 (trove = drove?)
    The answers ONE already know,
    ONE’ Ve dONE it tired, and now ONE’M weak. = 141 (it tired = drove?) and now ONE’ M weak….The reason I changed why to Y and the I’ve to a 4 (roman number IV…the e is silent) was because of what I found subsequently in stanza six….and where that took me on the map….So really I kinda went out of order to solve the 141 and Y11, because Stanza six made WAY more sense if I approached that way.
    So HEAR ONE all and LIST TEN good,….(This is why the last I in stanza six is used as a letter instead of a one…we already changed 10 me ,my, I’s into ONES, just as FF tells us to in stanza six! So hear ONE all and LIST TEN good) But I was looking for something else…something that would convince me I was on the right path…and Germanguy gave it to me on a silver platter!! He’s also saying to list ten letters… we hear in stanza six…
    Your Fort will B worth the cold.
    F U R brAve and N the wood,
    I give U title to the gold.
    FBFURANIU…wait, that only = nine letters…FBFURANIU, we are exactly ONE’M WEAK (from stanza five) of spelling out FBF URANIUM. FBF = Forrest Burke Fenn…THE BLAZE!! The Blaze is FBF which is synonymous with me, my and I in the poem!! This is the carving we will look for on the tree, cliff, rock etc…but uranium?…URANIUM…URANIUM??
    Okay, let’s think about this. Why would anything having to do with uranium be a very special place to FF? Maybe because it saved his life when he got cancer? Maybe because the very thing that is a symbol of war, which FF has learned comes at great cost, saved his life in the end. How’s that for a paradox (As in not far but too far). So the key word is ONE, and Forrest Burke Fenn, aka Me, My, I, is the BLAZE (both times) first time as me, my, I and second as FBF. So the nine clues, in order, are:
    1. Y
    2. ONE
    3. ONE
    4. ONE
    5. FOUR
    6. ONE
    7. ONE M’ weak
    8. FBF
    9. URANIU
    So if you search for Uranium on Y11 and 141….google comes up with Uravan, CO. ( If U R brAVe ANd)… Listen and HEAR what it sounds like…urbraveand…..uravan… With these clues we can find Uravan, CO and begin to unravel the mystery of where warm waters halt.
    So in order to find where warm waters halt, I go to Uravan, CO Uranium mine on Y11 and 141. And we know what blaze to look for (FBF) when we figure out the rest of the poem. Now that we have solved the clues, the book begins to make a lot more sense. Research goes a long way toward revealing the hints in the book. Yellowstone is really yellow stone, carnotite, uranium ore. Miss Ford is crossing the Delores River, with her loud voice and choppy steps. Y11 road is a graveled road to the south that crosses the San Miguel River at the “Black Bridge” and goes to Paradox and Bedrock, Colorado, via the scenic canyons of the San Miguel and Dolores rivers. Paradox is a farming and ranching community. It was named because the Dolores River runs north and south through the valley rather than the usual east and west—a Paradox that occurs in only one other valley in the world. Red Canyon, MT is really Red Canyon quadrangle, Colorado. 15 miles of water runway is the hanging flume. 6000’ in elevation is where the chest is at or near (within 85%). The grave, the waterfall, the crescent moon (arch), 2.42 river miles from omega one (below the Home of Brown), on omega two (which is really omega three) which is 7 miles west of town (Uravan) on 141, between mile marker 79 and 80, on a large sagebrush flat with large stands of pine trees (stumps now) all around. The Yellow and Purple flowers and the abundant tall grasses surround the gravestone. But I digress….back to WWWH… What do we know about the poem? We know what Forrest Fenn has told us, it contains nine clues that if followed precisely will lead us to the end of his rainbow, and the treasure. But we know more than that.
    [ prə sī́sslee ]

    1. exactly: used to indicate that something is stated exactly
    2. accurately: with absolute accuracy
    3. in detail: in complete and accurate detail

    It is perfectly logical then, to assume the poem contains within it, exact directions to the chest. Forrest tells us to “Begin it where warm waters halt”, and he means it, but we MUST start at the beginning in order to find the beginning.
    Uravan was a town that no longer exists, and was bulldozed because it was radioactive. It sits on county road Y11. From there, other, possibly imagined, clues start popping up….Drawing=Glyph, Paddle=ROW, High=Hie…reverse it…Hieroglyph. Hieroglyphics canyon is in Uravan. “Not far but too far” is a Paradox….Paradox Valley is near Uravan. Bedrock, Colorado in Paradox Valley is where Y11 comes off of HWY 90. (it=9T?) (“Safe upon the SOLID ROCK the ugly houses stand, come and see my shining palace built upon the sand!”)
    Stanza 2: “Begin it where warm waters halt, and take it in the canyon down, not far, but too far to walk. Put in below the home of Brown.” This was the HARDEST PART of the whole solve. I couldn’t for the life of me find a decent wwwh in my area …Germanguy was convinced it was the continental divide, then Uncompahgre plateau, then Unaweep Canyon….None of which worked for me…because FF already told us where to begin looking, (Uravan) so WWWH becomes a point at which to begin the actual trail to the chest…not a place to begin looking for the general area…we have the general area already! And then it happened. April 18th 2014 at about 11pm… I was searching the internet for Y11 road references, and I hit the jackpot! Y11 FIASCO mountain bike trail…
    This technically challenging trail follows the old Indian trail from Uravan to Saucer Basin, a small collapsed salt dome. The trail climbs along the south rim of the San Miguel River canyon, with great views of the hanging flume and the confluence of the San Miguel and Dolores rivers. It can be ridden as a lollipop overlooking the confluence, or as a loop featuring a very technical downhill into Saucer Basin and returning along CR Y-11.
    Saucer Basin!? Tea with Olga?! Warm waters halt when they run over the edge of your teacup and into the saucer. My heart was racing!! This wwh along with all the other stuff was just too much of a coincidence to be a coincidence…this was it! I had it! I found wwwh!! FF had taken us full circle on this bicycle trail, from Y11 road in Uravan to Y11 road in Delores River Canyon!! This is when I boldly posted the poem was solved…I was wrong…By the way, it turns out Forrest could easily drive from Y11 at Uravan to Y11 at Saucer Basin, but I may not have come across Saucer Basin if not for that mountain bike trail description! So begin it in Saucer Basin and take it in the Delores River canyon down, not far, but too far to walk. Put in below the home of Brown. The dreaded HOB!! I couldn’t find it! I searched forever…nothing, nada. So I must have to be there to see that part right? But the San Miguel River is a well-known and famous Brown Trout fishery, and runs a very Brown color at its confluence with the Delores River…and it is less than a mile downstream to the confluence from Saucer Basin. So I started working on the rest of the solve using the confluence as HOB. It was an educated guess, but it worked out so well later that I kept it as fact…a dangerous game!
    Now, everyone needs to get on google earth and look at that confluence!! Double Omega central!! “From there it’s no place for the meek, the end is ever drawing nigh. There’ll be no paddle up your creek, just heavy loads and water high.” After searching for some specific directions hidden in this part of the poem, I came up with everything is too far to walk if you “PUT IN” the water…So I measured in the streambed instead of on the roads, believing No place for the meek may mean by water instead of by land. And searching for more directions, I looked at “Not far, but too far to walk” and thought to myself, not four, but two four two walk. So I “Put in” AKA started, below the confluence, and measured 242 feet. Then 242 miles, then yards. Nothing made sense…I started to think, is 2.42 miles too far to walk? WAIT! Not four is saying less than four….so 2.42? So I tried this measurement. EXACTLY 2.42 miles downstream from the “PUT IN” spot below the confluence of the Delores and the San Miguel you end up at another Omega! And using a USGS quad map, you find a grave on that Omega!! I was really getting excited now! Begin it at Saucer Basin, and take it in the Delores River Canyon downstream on Y11 road. Not four, but two four two walk. Put in, and begin your 2.42 miles below the Confluence of the San Miguel and Delores Rivers…now I found a grave marker exactly 2.42 miles downstream from the confluence of the San Miguel (home of Brown) and the Delores River. (Not far, but 2.42 walk) Worked for me! This grave was calling me out! Was there a crude aluminum grave marker in the tall grass there? I HAD to go look at it. When I arrived in Uravan, where Y11 and HWY 141 come together, I reset my odometer’s trip meter. “seven miles west of town in a large sagebrush flat that HAD large stands of pine trees everywhere”…pg. 65 TTOTC…
    EXACTLY 7 miles west of Uravan, CO on HWY 141 is the dead end on the sagebrush flat (that leads to the grave) that had numerous pine tree stumps all around in the tall green grass and the yellow and purple flowers were scattered about.…I had goose bumps when I read the tag on the mining claim corner marker that was on that flat…The name of the claim was DREAMS!! As in, “My church is in the mountains and along the river bottoms where DREAMS and fantasies alike go to play.” When I found the Grave, the name on the stone was John Christian… (John Charles Whatever??). The real kicker was there were broken pieces of an old tea cup and SAUCER resting beneath the shade of the headstone. I reached down and picked one up…the only word legible on the back was Tea (Tea with Olga)!! Warm waters halt when they run over the edge of your teacup and into the saucer. My heart was racing!! I have never wanted to dig up a grave…but boy I was tempted!! As I observed the area, I could tell nothing had been dug up for many years…and I felt like FF would not have done that. But I searched the heck out of that peninsula, from top to bottom and side to side…for three days…nada. The last evening I was sitting in the tall grass near the grave admiring the view and trying to figure out what I had done wrong. I glanced across the canyon and I saw something that caught my eye and triggered a flood of thoughts all at the same time. There, on the south rim of the canyon, was a beautiful waterfall! It was dry, but it was obvious it ran as a spring creek. There was a beautiful inverted natural arch that had been carved out by the water…was this Forrest Fenn’s Rainbow?? My heart was pounding again as I realized the error of my ways. The end is drawing EVER nigh! He was telling me Just keep going left whenever you have the ability to! So, on google earth I began measuring from my “put in”, below the confluence (The HOB), 2.42 miles…this time going left whenever I could. The first place I was able to take a left was at that waterfall! And 2.42 miles put me PRECISELY at the top of the falls, at 5014 feet in elevation. I was sure finding the grave was all a part of FF’s plan. He knew solvers would go there first…and he knew what they would see on the other side of the River too. But I had no internet or cell service at the location, so I was unable to determine a driving route to the falls. (I feel it important to point out that with google earth, your cache will function without an internet connection). I sure as heck couldn’t wade the Delores River in April! So I went home…and I passed a bridge that crossed the Delores…but It was fenced off, so I assumed it was private. I felt frustrated and excited all at the same time. Over the next day or two, I researched a way to get within half a mile of the falls by vehicle… (4X4 only out there folks!!) The next day I drove the 11 hours and 685 miles back to the falls and hiked the scary and tricky, but doable descent into the little side canyon with the waterfall. I had a 200’ rope, a harness, and a one hour rappelling lesson under my belt, and I was determined to get to the bottom of that waterfall! When I got there, I was amazed at how much larger and scarier the falls was looking down from the top of it. The arch was 40 feet down, and the pool at the base of the falls was another 100’ feet below the arch! I was terrified, but I boldly harnessed up and tied my rope to a large tree. As I began to walk down the rolling edge of the precipice a thought occurred to me. How in the heck was I planning on getting back up? Fear (AKA logic) took over, and I was already able to see the pool and the backside of the arch, and no chest was present, so I wisely pulled myself back from the sheer drop off, and sat down to ponder my ignorance. I had gold fever didn’t I?…I needed to rethink my solve. And come down off my adrenaline high for a while. Forrest said not to go looking where a 79 0r 80 year old man couldn’t go, and I give FF high marks in the athletic dept, but decided rappelling was probably not his chosen method. But I couldn’t let this area go.
    So the double omegas of the canyon where the Delores River and the San Miguel river come together were screaming for me to read the book again…which I did.
    “I tend to use some words that aren’t in the dictionary, and others that are, I bend a little.”
    “Cross the street” pg. 20 = Y11
    “cross the river” pg. 24. =Delores River
    “You should always tell the truth, but you should not always tell all of the truth.” Pg. 26.
    15 miles of water runway pg. 53 = Hanging flume
    Ravens pg. 55, 61, 142 = Uravan and Raven mine
    Red Canyon pg. 59 = Red Canyon USGS quad in Montrose County, CO
    In Love with yellow stone= Uranium ore is yellow (carnotite)…do you see the genius of FF yet?
    “7 miles west of town in a large sagebrush flat that had large stands of pine trees everywhere…” The Grave is exactly 7 miles west of Uravan in a sagebrush flat with pine trees.
    There are so many more! I find more every time I read the book. He scattered confirmation hints throughout the entire memoir! They do more harm than good until you begin to solve the poem…then the floodgates of imagination, coincidences, and printed evidence all come together into a heavenly hodgepodge of “You’re Getting Warmer” stew.
    As ONE have gone alone in three, and with ONE treasures bold, ONE can keep ONE secret where, and hint of riches new and old.
    Begin it in Saucer Basin, (wwwh) and take it in the Delores River Canyon Down, Not 4, but 2.42 walk. Put in (begin your 2.42) below the Confluence with the San Miguel River (HOB).
    From there, enter the river, (No place for the meek) the end is to the left, (drawing nigh) there’ll be no paddle up your creek, just heavy loads and water high.( The creek at the end of the 2.42 miles)
    If you’ve been wise and found the (Blaze) = FBF? look quickly down, your quest to cease, but don’t just stare in awe, take the chest and go in peace.
    So Y is it that ONE must go and leave ONE trove for all to seek?
    The answers ONE already know, ONE’Ve dONE it driving, and now ONE’ M weak.
    So hear ONE all and list ten good, your Fort will B worth the cold, F U R brAve and N the wood, I give U title to the gold.

  8. Germanguy, great solve! I figured out hieroglyph last year when people were saying how could the blaze last for 100-1000 years. Then the runningman and the “f”‘s appeared with no explaination. So there was the blaze content. Then F said he hoped no one mistook “it” for their campfire, so figured it was the blazed rock! It seems you have worked with the poem to fit this area using all the clue-lines in TOTC. I still hear that little voice in my head, repeating what F said, he loves rivers and pueblos, you only need the poem…

    I found a 1940 map of the U.S. at a flea market. I have traced the most logical route F’s family would have taken through the four states and have found some eye opening locations as camp spots along the way, that are NOT mentioned on today’s maps. Perhaps this is what F meant by a “good map”?

    Geology, habitation and ecology all play a roll in my solve. Thanks for a different look at the solution! Good luck, hope you have Michael D headed out there asap! I hear doors slamming and tires screeching! ¥Peace¥ Donna

  9. Great adventure, Michael D! Glad you didn’t get stuck on those falls!
    I still feel YS is screaming a message to me. Not exactly IN YS, but near it. We have to wait til Aug. To go back, the waterhigh and heavy loads were just to boiling for us.
    I found a lonely field, of forgotten heros, where a river flows below the hob, and a waterfall cascades with shimmering rainbows abound. Yes, I will return to search.
    Good luck friends.
    ¥Peace¥ Donna

  10. I think there is something very important here with the way you two approached the poem. German Guy stated it best when he says “Note: Forrest Fenn has stated “If the poem is followed precisely, it will lead you to the chest and the end of his rainbow”. So, even though it would be impossible to follow the poem step by step to the chest, after the poem is completely solved, it does precisely that.”

    IMO, many people are trying to follow steps in the poem. You need to solve the puzzle in the poem first. Once you do that correctly, it will precisely lead to the chest. Nice work guys!

  11. I’ve posted previously that Forrest appears to be a non-linear thinker. He has woven a web in the poem. You have to navigate that web to solve it. Only then will it lead you precisely to the chest. You can’t find it just following the poem in a linear fashion.

  12. Wow, You must have about 11 elbows between your brain and your opposable thumb. I’m just looking for that final place where Peggy waits. (pg125)

  13. GG/ Mike D,
    Thank you for sharing your adventures. I always find it very interesting to read other’s adventures and what prompts them to become so confident. I have to say these are by far the most complicated solutions I have read to date. You have definitely strayed from conventional thought to derive this solution. I am left puzzled with the complexity of this solution and I wonder how you factored FF statement: “give it to a child” and “what seems so simple to me is so complicated for others”?
    I can only imagine how much fun it must have been to come up with this solution!
    The Wolf

    • Wolf,

      I know you have at least some idea of the way Fenn double speaks at times. It’s his 85/15 rule. He was metaphorically leaning towards the “KISS” theory.

      He didn’t literally mean that you should “give it to a child”, he was telling us, that we were making it harder than it is. Get it? Same goes with the other statement. In the other statement, he makes the same comparison, but instead replaces himself as the “child” and “others” as us again.

      I always try to watch out for “Tangled webs” and he definitely likes to weave them.

      • GG,
        “He didn’t literally mean that you should “give it to a child”, he was telling us, that we were making it harder than it is. Get it?”-GG

        Yes that is what I was referring to – how we tend to over complicate our solutions. I was just wondering how you personally felt about the complexity.

        I believe FF wants to be remembered as a great puzzle maker. He wants everyone to say “what took me so long?” Do you believe that is what people are thinking (if this is the correct solution)?
        The Wolf

        • Honestly, that is how I perceived him. As a puzzle master, regarding this poem.

          I guess to answer your question of “He wants everyone to say “what took me so long?””, I would say that it was probably a major factor in his creation of the poem. People would definitely be wondering Why, when they were told “give it to a child”, they didn’t understand him and probably kick themselves for not listening carefully.

          Take for example, the line “So hear me all and listen good”. How many people are finally having a light go on in their heads when they reflect back on his comment from the book, where he said “I always listened”. It’s funny, I still hear my parents tell me to “Listen up” or “Pay attention”. Believe it or not, they always got my attention. 🙂

          I hope that after people read my solution, they will at least “see” that their are other means of solving this poem.

          • GG,You are definitely correct about “here me all and listen good” I know many have taken that line seriously but I believe it has more to do with prepositions.
            The Wolf

          • wolf, could i email you something in regards to this? or could you email me

  14. @German @MichaelD Your solves reflect very bright minds and ability to equate larger picture important to future. My solve tap danced around DU issues and I found several geographical locations you could build similar cases in WY and MT. After reviewing your solves, I’m convinced I will not be the one to solve the poem and so offer meagher supporting evidence.

    WISE = “World Information Service on Energy” – Uranium project
    HALT = (photos on line) SIGNAGE: HALTING HAND over orange/yellow Radioactive symbol => stope Ur mining/protect our waters
    BLAZE = if you truly believe FF is the blaze himself; was he perhaps considering making a statement on Halting nucarms and amassing DU by going out in a Blaze.
    .*. = Triangular 3 dots which symbolize 3 Ur isotopes show up symbolically in severall photos in the memoirs (denoting both Ur and the face of death) See TOTC pg 133 photo of frog/gold coin/nugget – look closely at the nugget on the right and see the .*. 3 black dots on nugget surface.

  15. German Guy,

    I love your solve! I have lived 18 yrs in the Western Slope and I can attest to your knowledge of the area. I am originally from Nucla and will definitely put some foot miles into your location. From the longest time I thought you might be Douglas Preston or Lincoln Child.

  16. Germanguy and Michael D, Wow! I LOVE how your brains work! Amazing! Thank you, thank you, thank you for sharing!!!

  17. GG and MD-
    First I would say that your combined yet slightly different tales of your work on your solve(s) are quite an adventure and reveal extensive mental and physical effort on your parts, with quite an array of research and sources. It’s good to see your hard work be put to the test in the field.

    Coming from the vantage point of working very hard on this chase myself, I respect your efforts. The decision for MD not to rappel down that cliff was a wise one, and demonstrates how easy it is to go too far in our zeal to prove our solution and find the treasure chest.

    Secondly, after reading both of your accounts, I begin to hear reverberations of Forrest’s words from Scrapbook 62 echoing down the canyon. You’ve shown again how virtually limitless is the extent to which concepts and places can be linked to the poem and organized into logical form.

    From within the world of their solution, a searcher sees the entire picture in all its glorious detail and interrelations, and others recognize from the outside their personal excitement for their baby. Yet as put into text for all to read (a difficult task, no doubt, as you acknowledged), from my view it leaves me yearning for a solution that grows more organically out of the poem rather than a solution which feels overwrought and crowding it from the outside. I’m sure you guys don’t see it this way because of your intimacy and personal investments with your solution, and that’s understandable. But that’s the humble impression I get.

    Regarding “Not far, but too far to walk”, I see no paradox, although I appreciate your insight there.

    Thank you and congrats for sharing your hard work with everyone, and good luck with your future efforts!


    • Halo,

      I can understand your not being able to see the paradox. In life, we don’t really experience them often, so they tend to go over looked when they occur.

      A paradox is often know as a contradiction. That said, let me give a simple example.

      If a man talking to a genie, wishes that wishes couldn’t come true. This contradicts itself because if the genie grants his wish, he did not grant his wish, and if he refuses to grant his wish, then he did indeed grant his wish, therefore making it impossible to either grant or not grant his wish because his wish contradicts itself.

      In the paradox from the poem, you can’t say “not far” and then follow it with “but too far”, be cause it’s a contradiction. Is it “far”, or “too far”, which is it? Do you see the paradox in that line?

      Sorry, but that is the best I can do to explain it to you.

      • GG,
        The line “not far but too far to walk” is a relative description and not a paradox. One can say 20 or 50 miles is not far using the relative term in its relation to driving or comparing the entire distance from Santa Fe to the Canadian border, but this distance can still be too far to walk especially from the author’s perspective. Thus no paradox and a useful clue in determining the approximate distance.
        The Wolf

        • “A paradox is a statement that apparently contradicts itself and yet might be true. Most logical paradoxes are known to be invalid arguments but are still valuable in promoting critical thinking”.

          So, you can see that in either of our views, our interpretations would be correct.

        • IMO, it’s neither: it’s simply a riddle. ‘Not far but too far to walk’, is, for example, 15′ up in the air.

          • I have thought similar things, and I think it’s hinted at later on. “Look quickly down” Why do I need to look down? Obviously at that time I’m looking up. When you’ve found the blaze, stop looking up. That’s just one of my many ideas.

          • @Rodan24

            “Look quickly down” can mean: see & understand with alacrity what is important – downstream, or down the map, down from GE.

      • GG-
        While I appreciate you taking the time, I certainly don’t need an explanation of what a paradox is!!

        I can see clearly why you interpret “Not far, but too far” as a paradox. What I was trying to say is that that phrase does not work as a paradox, as you are interpreting it, for me in this poem.

        I can see exactly why you do see the phrase as a paradox, and apply it to your solve. On its own, yes, it is a paradoxical phrase, but in the context of the poem and other clue solutions that are contiguous with it, I see a more useful and direct interpretation and I don’t need to question any distances.

        It’s simply a matter of interpretation for a particular solution, not denying that a phrase cannot be understood as presenting a paradox.

        “In the paradox from the poem, you can’t say “not far” and then follow it with “but too far”, because it’s a contradiction. Is it “far”, or “too far”, which is it? Do you see the paradox in that line?”

        I agree that “Not far” is a contradiction with “but too far” when you break it out like that. But you are missing two critical words: “to walk”. So “Not far” is NOT a contradiction with “but too far to walk” for a particular interpretation (that I can’t spell out) in context with the other clue solutions…


        • Halo,

          I certainly respect your interpretation of a paradox. But, as you said “I can see exactly why you do see the phrase as a paradox, and apply it to your solve. On its own, yes, it is a paradoxical phrase, but in the context of the poem and other clue solutions that are contiguous with it…”. I guess this is one of those areas where we don’t truly know what Fenn had in mind at the time. But you seem to understand the direction in which it led me, and why.

          Thanks for your feedback, as it is always welcomed by me and others on the blog.

  18. German Guy, i like reading your solve but you never mention airplanes really and they were an important part of his life. I know its not mentioned in the poem but i think its a subtle hint in the book.

    • Lorax

      See page 74 of TTOTC. You will see his plane and the atomic bomb under his wing. That “bomb” relates very well with my solution. Many of the hints are subtle in the book.

  19. What if we’re not thinking 4 dimensional. What if, instead of above ground, the poem hints to what is going on BELOW GROUND???

  20. I don’t see how this red neck could ever have figured that one out… I barely have a grasp on what a personal pronoun is let alone turning it to a number and then a roman numeral. My kids and I are going to have to study harder.

    I’m impressed with you two, Mike and GG and how hard you worked as a team. This treasure stuff is very hard and I am awed at how good your solve is.

    I was waiting however for other connections, and I hope they’re in your next solves.

    Uranium seems right, all I kept coming up with is how bad mining is. And a waterfall and arch don’t sound too bad. But the gravestone, that seems impossible to make up.
    The tea cup is extraordinary, that’s a word my five year old uses… I don’t know where he gets it.
    Tea is all it said huh? that cup must of traveled along way? I thought warm water halted in my coffee cup but I don’t use a saucer.

    I guess I could go on and on, but your solves might just be some sound clues as to what we are all looking for. Thanks for sharing!

  21. A little too complicated for my blood. Now, I could use a glass of wine. Maybe I should watch a movie to calm my naval mind.

    • @Slurbs – since reading GG’s solve I’ve been on hiatis watching the movie channel. Not a drinker and into the spirits trying to return to simpler days where fishing and camping were still in play. Ha!

  22. While I clearly don’t possess the same intelectual abilities as GG & MikeD, I did through research come to the same conclusion – uranium mines new and old may well be very IMPT to an fighter pilot who rode on top of bombs, suffered cancer because of it, and cares to leave a peaceful and clean environment to his grandchildren. I’m still torn as to whether Forrest Fenn chose to link the treasure to such and put others at risk of uranium exposure to pick up TC. My instincts tell me the solve is more ‘family friendly’ and may be solved in light of fishing, literature, history, art, geography and ecology. He is father and grandfather after all.

    • I would like to clear up some misunderstanding in some of the comments I have read on here, regarding the solution of this poem. Michael D. and I, did not partner up until After I had solved the poem. In the very beginning, it was agreed that when the search (which Michael D. went on) was over, I would be posting my solution and Michael D. would separately post the results of his adventure in Uravan. At no time did we work together on my solution. After all, I had the solution for over a year and a half at least and Michael and I only partnered a few months ago. You will also note from my solution above, that it states “Michael D. will be sharing his “Adventure” shortly”. Michael had asked me if it was ok to use my solution in his efforts to seek the treasure in other locations as well. This I agreed to, because it would be fair to all who read my post and decided to follow my solution.

      I’m sorry if it seemed confusing. Good luck to you all (I still believe the chest is there). 🙂

      • Yes, this is true….Gorman actually scolded me about trying to change his solution…LOL! He has been confident from the get go his solution is the correct one…I just found other possibilities after studying his solution…he said those were my solutions, and he wanted no part of them….just like he states above…I was but his errand boy regarding his solution…since I was headed there already for one of my solutions…It was clear from the beginning that all the credit for his solve would go to him. In fact, we almost got into it because I was eager to “improve” his solution…and he said I couldn’t improve on perfection!!

  23. Thank you for your research and search.

    Your opening line, reminded me of a line in a great movie.

    “Are we clear?”
    “ARE WE CLEAR???”

    Ok, now we can all move on to our own slolutions, and we can move with confidence.


  24. OK, Im taking my eyes and going to a different thread because I can’t hold my tea any longer…. Tea = T = an intersection like a rivers mouth, or maybe halt like at a Stonewall (tee hee). Consider (that means Google) — a different Hemingway book, Across The River And Into The Trees. Most of the book is a flashback by a man who is confronting his own death from a duck blind… (the meadowlark is blind, the robin ducked). Hem originated a literary style known as the ICEBERG style, meaning there’s more below the surface than the terse words on top, so, your effort will be worth the cold. Might even wanna run down the list of references… I think one of Olgas relatives is there. Harumph. I spin. I go.

  25. I like 2Far2Walk being a paradox, BUT I’m just saying and nobody is listening…this means don’t go on the trail.

    What do people do on trails? They walk.
    And the treasure will take you too long to get to if you take the trail.
    Plus Forrest is off the beaten path kind of guy anyway.

    (maybe if I whisper this on here people will hear)

  26. I got ya, GG. Thanks for sharing!

    No trail walking… At the trail head…horses perhaps… or a ride of sorts?
    Whisper some more … lol

  27. Not to put something too simply, but I think people are overlooking something very simple and basic with this location as the solution. Paradox canyon has some excellent examples of ancient high water marks…waters high…hmmmmm

    • Thanks for pointing that out sandsailor. I recalled those holes in the cliffs as well and discovered what you just pointed out. Great, wasn’t it? The things I had uncovered, were so numerous that I had to shorten my solution with “I could probably go on forever, with all the discoveries I found, but I won’t.” When you consider Forrest was here long ago (probably exploring with Skippy) this area was truly an adventure for them. I’d like to see Forrest put out a book about his time here. It would be really great stuff. It is really a great trip to go there, and follow the direction of the poem. My wife and I did and it was a real thrill. I would definitely recommend it.

  28. Way too complicated for my simple brain there Michael D and GG. Guess I’ll have to stay with what I’ve got and hope for the best.

    Good luck and Good fortune with further endeavors… 🙂

  29. I’ve always thought that Fenn’s clue about “not being associated with any structure” had nothing to do with physical structures. Perhaps, instead, he is referring to stanza “structure” or linear reasoning. “The solve (treasure) isn’t associated with any structure”. Germsguy’s solution makes light of this way of thinking. But… G-guy, I think you might have exceeded your nine allotted clues!

  30. GG & Mike D, I like the way you guys think:) I believe you will be capable and confident in all that you.


  31. Very interesting but waaaaaaaaaaaaaay too complicated even for Forrest. Just like half of my solves, way too out there. I have come up with the Supta in NM, The Brown or Jackson Hole in Colorado and now I truly believe it is in Wyoming at the Rainbow Terrace at Thermopolis the world’s largest Hot Springs and not far is the Green or Madison Rivers, or there abouts. I have also used Fredric Brown in Taos N M and even went there with my family last year . No one would be able to find it if Forrest used your solve!! MAYBE,but it is so far out there even for all of us crazy searchers. Sounds good let all of us know what happpens have you given this info to Forrest? He will let you know if it is correct or way far out there. I have know words to say but it sounds possible just not SO sure. Let us know. As always continue the chase and see you in the funny papers MS. Girl

  32. Wow GG and Kichael D! If these are the kinds of interpretations of the poem needed to find the treasure, I’ll never find it! 🙂 Great ideas and research so good luck as you continue on your searches.

  33. Be careful who you deal with around here. I gave someone a clue and they never even acknowledged that I gave it to them. No thank you and no info in return. That’s the greed factor I preach about. I’ve been involved with treasure hunting for many year and if there’s one thing I know, they are pretty much greed motivated. Greed blinds a person to the truth. Same with the other negative emotions. The Holy Bible says sin blinds a person to the truth. So shame on me for speaking the truth.

  34. And they ain’t all treasure hunters. You don’t know who they are. Could be outlaws or inlaws and I don’t mean relatives. Don’t make deals with people here especially if they try to push something on you.

    • On line its difficult to wisely determine who is on the other end. Forrest has to deal with crazies and all the good folks alike. So do we if we have an online presence. IMO it’s helpful to decide which clues you are willing to give out, and then just make them public w/o any expectations. That way anyone who pays attention benefits. Just MO. Sorry that you feel you were taken Mike – stinks when that happenns.

  35. GG and MD ,Great Solves. You guys worried me for a while. I guess I had better go get the Chest or you two are going to beat me to it.


    • @Germanguy – win the lotto while your there! When you return are you interested in putting together another mind bending solve similar to yours but near YP? Ur mines surround the entire park including 3 in West Yellowstone, 2 in Gardiner, right in the Yellowstone River, Ennis, Big Sky, Gallatin Gateway, etc. Those are just in MT. Wyo has same mess. The waters used to process Ur go back into aquifers & rivers and become “Warm waters” with permanently raised temps. from being chemically altered in mining. I’m not smart enough to puzzle out the poem like you, but more than willing to research related topics, gather data etc. Not interested in any treasure at all if you find it (TRUE). Just thought a brilliant guy like you could make a difference. These ‘warm waters’ change stream ecology all the way to the oceans, and make people like me sick along the way.

    • Hi everyone. We decided enough is enough and didn’t want to give anything back to the casino, so we’re back home. The 19th was my Birthday, so we took a room for a for a couple of nights and after collecting our winnings called it a day.

  36. Hi germanguy

    Interesting solve you posted. I think you have the right idea on some clue connections and how elaborate it is.

    Only issue I have is I think the correct solve will be more convincing.

    On another subject it seems forrest put an important clue right out there for everyone to see recently

    It took me almost a year and a half to figure that one out. But now I guess its time to level the playing field and give away free candy

    Thanks forrest

    • GG thank you for sharing what is obviously a super solve. Speaking of paradox, I’m torn between ff’s “give it to a child” simplicity and his “hard but not impossible” descriptions. I do not see how we can go with confidence, given the multitude of wwh, canyon down et al clues presented, without architually discerning the construction of the poem. I personally prefer simple but recognize great symphonies may seem melodically simple but in fact are the product genius technical construction. Thank You again.

      • Radcrad, My sentiments exactly. The poem’s simple melody is technically constructed to echo a 4 part symphony for the ages sempre. Rocks humming an ostinato beat in time with warm waters strumming in passionato rhyme.

      • Radcrad,

        First off Thank You for your comment. It has been very rewarding to read people’s comments on here.

        In regards to your comment “hard but not impossible”, You will note I pointed out my own feelings on “Impossible” in my article.

        As a kid, I once lived in Edison, New Jersey, named after Thomas Edison, the inventor of the light bulb. He once was asked by a reporter, how it felt to fail over 1,000 times at creating the light bulb. His reply was “Young man, I didn’t fail 1,000 times, I found over 1,000 ways in which the light bulb doesn’t work.”

        You see, his belief was, “Every wrong attempt discarded is a step forward.”

  37. wow germanguy. That was quite the post!
    I think the final solution will be easier to explain or prove with very few words necessary. In fact, I think it should look like somebody just caught a catfish!

  38. Everyone,

    Just want to thank you all for showing such great respect and appreciation in the comments posted to GG and MD. Everyone works hard at their potential solves both mentally and physically and it is nice to see that everyone can relate to such a great effort.

    • Lois,

      Given the numerous interpretations used in solving the poem, I see no reason that your logic doesn’t make sense, as all the others’. However, that said, where that leads you from here, will determine it’s value to you in solving the poem.

  39. And let’s just say, the first stanza means he is already dying. He has gone alone in there, with his treasures bold, etc. Obviously he has been there before and now has found his final resting spot, (not with his loved ones, but with gold). So let’s begin it, where warm waters halt…It’s like the beginning a movie, where they brought the end or near end of the story first, then the memories emerge to give you the scenario of what led Him, to decide, His final resting spot. When I first read this poem, I thought is was very spiritual or religious. Thought is was about a man dying and His family grieving, (heavy loads and water high), standing on his grave, crying. You see the white light because the end is near. It seemed so sad to me. So another glass of chardonnay, will hopefully open my mind to a happier ending. Did Forrest write this poem while He was dying or when he got well? If the later, than it’s a happy poem. I believe it is, he does want someone to find his rainbow and treasure. Isn’t it funny how we all interpret this poem? Good Luck!!!

    • After his Today show hints, I gave up wondering if the poem was sad, happy, about death, or about honeybuckets. At this point, IMO, it’s about a location of treasure. 😉

      • ok., Map. The poem is all we need, we do not need to know anything about Forrest Fenn. The 1st stanza tells me, imo, that in the poem, there are hints of riches, new and old. Forrest has said that people don’t even know the meaning of words. (Not that I need this info., anyway, because all I need is the poem.) Perhaps, ask an eight year old their interpretation the meaning of a word, then ask ourselves and then ask an 80 year old. Probably 3 different interpretations. My parents, this year, turned 80 and have a total different meaning to most words in the poem. At least that’s a start, I think. My first impression of where warm waters halt, as I’ve said before, is a confluence. Just thought of a “sink”, where two waters meet. Between hot and cold. Then bring it in the canyon down….maybe a pipe? Just silly imagination but worth a try.

  40. This is my first comment here, as I’ve just learned of this treasure hunt, but as it is so close to home I can’t resist. I live 15 miles east of uravan and am part of the local historical society that has leased a tract of land at uravan from montrose county to build a campground facility and museum interpreting the history of the uravan mineral belt and the town of uravan. And I think your solve is awesome! If only because it encourages people to explore a place that I consider one of the most magical in the world. But I would be remiss as a historian without clarifying a few things.

    From 1939-1946 uravan was commisioned by the u.s. army as a uranium processing mill for the Manhattan project. The town was on lockdown basically and a family would not have stayed there unless they were working there as a miner or mill worker. Also at that time it was known as tent city because there weren’t houses yet. Forrest’s father was a high school principal and there was no high school in uravan then, or ever.

    The grave that Michael referred to belongs to john christian, a hermit who was part of the danish royal family. There was a great article about him recently in the grand junction daily sentinel.

    The inverted arch is known to locals as the horse collar and I’m impressed you made the hike over there.

    Although I’m sketchy on Forrest having a childhood connection to uravan I do not discount that he would choose this area for the treasure. Many ancestral pueblans have claimed this area as a sacred space and it would fit right in with his respect and knowledge of indian culture.

    All I can add is that if you do come to uravan to search, please stop by the visitor center in naturita and say hi! Oh, and you’re more than welcome to use out campground, just consider leaving a donation on your way out!

    And if anyone wants more information on uravan or the west end of montrose county, I would love to share with you.

    • Dallas, that’s really interesting information. I would like to thank you and all the small town historians across our country who work endless hours, most of the time without pay, to preserve our heritage and rich history. Without folks like you so much of our past would be lost………On this 4th of July you deserve a special salute.

      Thank you

    • Dallas…
      Thanks so much for your post! I cannot tell you how much it helps me to know that the John Christian Gravesite pre-dates the chase by that much!! By the way, I still feel it is the correct area…And I have been there a total of three times this year already! I really appreciate the offer of a campground too…as you know, there are not too many options in the area. Please share all the knowledge you can with me about the area! I also went to the cave that sits on that creek above horse collar arch…does it have a name?
      Michael D

    • Dallas,

      Thank you.

      The things you shared here, I uncovered during my research of Uravan. I even found a blog (which I believe was created by locals there), that shared the history of families who either recalled life in Uravan, or had parents who lived and worked there. It was really great reading. I’m sure you’re also aware of the earlier history of Butch and his gang.

      If you would be so kind as to drop me an email, I have a very important question to ask you. Thank you.

    • Great to have you join us here Dallas. Regarding your comment, “From 1939-1946 Uravan was commissioned by the U.S. Army as a uranium processing mill for the Manhattan project.” You are correct. However, the government was so secretive, that they originally mined Vanadium and didn’t tell the miners that what they were really interested in was the uranium. Later there was a law suit to recover wages. Am I mistaken in my understanding of events?

      • The Joe Jr. Mill was built in 1914 to process carnotite ore for the radium value. Marie Curie received a gram of radium from the mill. However, when it was discovered it had no medical value, the project was abandoned. US Vanadium purchased the company and began reprocessing the ore for the vanadium. It was used to harden steel in the 1920’s- 30’s. It was then discovered that a bi-product of this process, uranium, was useful in atomic energy. They began by processing the tailings piles, or waste piles, from the vanadium extraction, and then buying more ore from the miners. You are correct in stating that they didn’t tell the miners they were interested in the uranium specifically. And there were many lawsuits filed to recoup the miners losses from that period.

        During the Manhattan Project The government built and operated a separate mill at Uravan. They ran a completely separate operation. And it was very secretive. There was a young man who lived here and he enlisted in the Army and was stationed at Uravan. He would see his parents on the streets and say hello, but he couldn’t tell them where he was!

        It’s hard for me to summarize this, as the history is so dear to me, but I hope that answers your question!

        And thank you, I’m excited to join you here. For me, it’s about the story as much as the treasure.

  41. We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

    • God created man, Samuel Colt made them equal.

      Potato Salad is made, beans are cooking, beer is cold, got to get up early to get the rib roll cooking………

      Happy 4th to you all.

      • Parable For The 4th of July

        Once, in the 1820’s, a little boy called Sam was playing in the yard behind his house. During his pretend fighting game, he knocked over the outhouse. Now Sam was upset and worried that he would get into trouble so he ran into the woods and didn’t come out until after got dark. When he arrived back home, his pappy was waiting for him. He asked suspiciously, “Son, did you knock over the outhouse this afternoon?”

        “No, pappy,” Sam lied.

        “Well, let me tell you a story,” said the father. “Once, not that long ago, Mr Lincoln received a shiny new axe from his father. Excited, he tried it out on a tree, swiftly cutting it down. But as he looked at the tree, with dismay he realized it was his mother’s favorite cherry tree,” his pappy paused.” just like you, he ran into the woods. When he returned, his pappy asked, ‘Abraham, did you cut down the cherry tree?’ Abraham answered with, ‘Father, I cannot tell a lie. I did indeed chop down the tree.’ Then his father said, ‘Well, since you were honest with me, you are spared from punishment. I hope you have learned your lesson, though.’ So,” then Sam’s father asked again,” did you knock down the outhouse?”

        “Pappy, I cannot tell a lie any more.” said the little boy. “I did indeed knock down the outhouse.”

        Then his pappy father spanked Sam boy red, white, and blue. The boy whimpered, “Pappy, I told you the truth! Why did you spank me?”

        Pappy answered, “That’s because Abraham Lincoln’s father wasn’t in the tree when he chopped it down!”

        Happy 4th to all.

        • Um, sorry Germanguy, but thought that was George Washington…oh yeah! 85% truth 15% fabrication. I get it.

          • Anybody remember, Fenn’s fly-under a bridge in St. Louis in the 60’s? He was table talk by my Dad for a week! Sonic boom came a week later. Rattled the windows, no press…we all just threw our window’s open and looked up. We knew history was in the making for Sonic Boom.

            I have no point. Thank you Sir, you captured my father’s imagination as mine, you are history forever. Happy 4th!


  42. Dal,

    Where’s all the troops tonight? Probably all at the lake, settling in for a nice 4th of July holiday.

  43. Life is a gift, liberty a hard fought battle and the path to happiness is a up and downhill journey with no end. Tomorrow I will not think of red, green or black, but of red, white and blue and toast the day and all that it represents with a glass of ice cold tea, Southern style! Sweet!!

  44. On this day, 234 years ago, 56 men committed treason. The did so because they believed in something greater than themselves. If not for them, we would never have had the opportunity to become what we are today.

    Happy Independence Day.

  45. GG and MD, loved your solves. I have a similar one that seems to be leading somewhere near Jeffrey City, WY, which was a big time Uranium town that went bust. There are abandoned building with broken windows, giant tires and aluminum all over the place. They actually have a YesNo Motel wearing a top hat there. It is also fairly close to an airplane beacon.
    This particular one of my three-ish solves involves the elements. WWWH= H2O, which could be a clue on how the location is spelled. Two H’s, one O, or Two H’s, two O’s? Or even a synonym for warm preceding htwoo (an Indian word?)

    HoB could be Fe, the symbol for Iron. Iron is both called the Rusty King of all metals, and also coated Forrest’s backside with a heavy brown stain.

    Heavy loads could be lodes of the heaviest element known.

    And remember when Forrest said that his wingman could see him on fire from seven miles away? To me, that could mean one of two things. Either Forrest is the blaze, or when the light changes, you will see that airline beacon winking at you.
    He has also purposely misspelled beckon to read beacon.

    I think it would have been funnier if had had replaced beacon with bacon, but it think we all know why he used the word he did. 🙂

    I haven’t pursued that solve as much as my other two yet, because there are some things I just can’t get around.

    I’ve got four days before we fly to Denver, and depending on what solve I pick, we’ll either head north or south. Or west. 🙂

    And dang it, I just had typed a whole bunch of other stuff involving the obvious photoshopped images from TTOTC, where there is some somewhat sloppy pixelization around people’s heads, I accidentally hit the cancel button and it all disappeared.

    And can anyone make out what is on the white paper IN THE WINDOW of the school where they’re taking a class picture taken? To me, it looks like the cross of the NM flag, but I can’t tell. No matter how much I try to enlarge and sharpen, it still comes out blurred.

    Has anyone noticed the theme of fraud and fakery in the book? Elymr de Hory, the painter of fakes, the Duveen Brothers, who also sold fakes and were studiers of postmark fakes, and a few others, maybe even including Forrest himself? If his epitaph reads something like, “if only I had actually done, the things that were attributed to me.” Sorry, I know that’s paraphrased.

    I don’t think he said because he faked his heroism. I think he said that because of an underlying sense of guilt. He realizes all the players in his team played a part in his success–his wingmen, the Jolly Green Giant crew, the FAC’s, etc, and he feels as though he owes them a personal thank you for all they had done.

    I’ve seen where he has reached out to AF members looking for old friends. Maybe he’d tried to say thank you there, but learned they’d passed on, or were too feeble to use the Internet.

    Maybe this whole chase is his personal thank you to them by helping a younger generation learn about the horrors of a war we shouldn’t have been in, and learn about the heroes who have kept out country free. And if we learn about them, and in turn, respect and honor them, maybe they won’t be forgotten like that French soldier lying in thigh high grass in Vietnam.

    And maybe we will strive harder for peace, which I’m sure Forrest wants for his children and grandchildren. A legacy of peace would be very smile-worthy as he takes his last breath before being pillowed down to join his friends and family in that Great Banquet Hall.

  46. Hi Germanguy/MikeD,

    This is my first time posting here.
    I was very surprised reading your solve. The reason for my surprise is that before i read your posting i used a completely different method and also landed directly on Paradox, CO. Everything in the second stanza leads there if you look at the bigger picture. This makes me think that poem was designed to lead you there in more than one way so as to confirm the location.



    • You could be correct in that assumption. Unless you’re looking at ‘warm waters’ in the same manner as I have, regarding the salt anticline, how else did you look at it? Just curious of course.


      • Forrest has said that all you need is the poem and a good map. One thing that occurred to me is that although we know the chest is located in one of three states that does not mean that the clues are restricted to those three states.

        Lets say warm waters halt is where a river starts or ends and it runs thorough “the canyon”. When i think of “the canyon” i instantly think of the Grand Canyon with the Colorado river running through it. The Colorado river “halts” at La Poudre Pass in northern Colorado.

        So if you take a map of the USA and start at La Poudre Pass and draw a line “down” to the Grand Canyon the EXACT middle point of that line falls on Paradox (not far, but too far).


        • marinamile,

          I’m not trying to be pigheaded here.
          NM, CO, WY, MT. Four states.
          The poem, the book for reference, GE and or a good map.

          I agree the clues don’t have to be within the four stated. The one thing that I would consider is, some have gotten the first two clues correct… It would be interesting on how many searcher start outside the four stated, with the first two clues in mind.

  47. Hi germanguy …

    You and others may already be aware of this, but I don’t recall reading anything specific about it in this thread. If my concern here is already common knowledge among posters, kindly disregard my comments and the link below.

    You said … “The location [of the chest] is [in or near] Uravan Colorado.

    The link below confirms the status of Uravan. If the link doesn’t work, simply do a Google search, using the words “Uravan” “Colorado” “Superfund”.

    The relevant article is the third (3rd) one down the Google page.


    Even so, I really appreciate how much time and brain power you must surely have invested in this solution. And while I would personally rule out the Uravan area for reasons so stated in the linked article, some of your conclusions concur with my own treasure hunt theory, and add to it.

    Ken 🙂

    • Ken, if the item you are referring to is the radioactive materials in the area as being harmful, I agree. However, the only part of this area that was safe to explore, was an area along the river where cleanup had already been completed, and this was on the upriver side. I don’t think I would have taken a chance searching here otherwise.


  48. The Colorado Plateau region holds some fascinating history.

    Marbles were first manufactured in Germany? (Kinda think you already knew that!)

    In addition:

    The largest manufacturer of marbles is in Vacor de Mexico?

    Marbles are often mentioned in Roman Literature.

    West Virginia and Ohio currently manufacture marbles.

    Upon connecting marbles with “Tarry Scant – Marvel Gaze”…..a ‘formula’
    becomes a bit more clear.

    Might Flyer Fenn also possess a touch of Chemistry genius in his blood?

    • OMG! That is COOL! I never played marbles when I was a kid, but I liked looking at them and did have a few. Thanks for the link SL. 🙂

      • For some reason after re-reading my comment, it doesn’t sound quite right.
        Lately… Well over the past few years anyway, there have been days I’ve felt I had lost ALL my marbles! Maybe some of you can relate.

    • SL, I think you have solved one of the items in the chest that Fenn didn’t divulge. I’ll bet there is at least one of his marbles in the TC. He has many marbles upstairs, so he could let some go intentionally as opposed to just getting older, although that may be intentional by another entity. When you find the chest you will have all the marbles.
      How cool would that be, having a hand made marble by Fenn?
      I am pretty sure any retail store marble is mass produced.

  49. I must learn something new everyday, and as my Mother before me; research has always captivated and enriched my life. Mom was way ahead of her time in subjects beyond the grasp of many around her. How challenging and stimulating she would find ‘all’ of this to be.

    Am still learning, and sincerely appreciate all of the feedback. You all continue to amaze me!

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