878 thoughts on “The Nine Clues…Part Twentyeight

  1. Great timing! The very moment I tried to post a comment on the last nine clues page I was DENIED! 🙂

    Someone was asking…I forget who, sorry…if it’s possible to find the blaze and not solve the poem. My personal opinion is, that’s not very likely. It’s pretty clear to me that once you’ve found the blaze you simply look quickly down…and presto change-o!…your quest has ceased…and you likely need a change-o-underwear.

    • I don’t know how anyone can be positive they have solved any of the nine clues unless they either find the treasure or Forrest confirms they have one or more of them correct – and I don’t think he will EVER do that! We all think we have some or all of the clues figured out but no one has the chest yet. Forrest has given a few different statements about how close people have been – within 500 feet, within 200 feet, not closer than 12 feet. and maybe some different answers in emails. He has also said so far that searchers have had the first 2 clues correct, but have some people solved more of them but he hasn’t said? There may still be some searching to do when you find the blaze and you may still not find the treasure even if you are within 200 feet.

      • If you have found the blaze you must simply look down and you will be with in 12 feet if you’ve done your math proper. 200 ft, im guessing the blaze has not been found yet… all my opinion.

      • CJ-
        And as a new searcher pointed out to me yesterday…at one of the Collected Works events where we have video Forrest was asked the closest a searcher had been and he said about 50ft…

        • Dal,

          this is new information for me. i havent seen it on a blog before

          some questions for you please about this 50 ft comment

          when you say a searcher pointed it out to you, do you mean in a post on this blog, or do you mean in a personal or email conversation with the searcher?

          and when you say collected works where we have video, do you mean this comment was captured on video, or just that the event was video recorded, but the comment itself is off video and is being recalled by the searcher (and if so did you, Dal, witness the comment also)

          and by collected works event, do you mean the one from april or october last year, or is there another one?

          • Chris-
            A searcher I met with yesterday who has not commented on the blog yet.

            The comment was captured on video.

            I didn’t remember it but the searcher insisted it was there and I have no reason to doubt him. He’s a sharp guy.

            It would be one of the Collected Works interviews sessions with McGarrity and Preston…dunno which…
            I have not gone back to look for it…

            The one in April of 2013 is here and is audio only:

            The one from October of 2013 is here:
            I believe this is the one because he said it was video…

            and yes..there was one from 2010 when Forrest first announced the book..same 3 guys..but since no one had been out looking at that point it’s doubtful the remark was from that session.

            Although it’s fun info it really means nothing in the grand scheme of my search. I feel confident that it’s not in Kansas and I will start checking South Dakota this fall.

          • This info on the 50 ft – I would be very interested in. Thanks for checking it out Chris.

          • The real question is, Did that searcher know how close they were? Searchers been with in 500′ or 50′ or less only confirms, that they told FF where they have been, but they may not even have realized where they were. or when they were near.

            Does knowing how close one was help?

        • News to me too. What are the odds that two serious, deep thinking searchers would miss that? vs. Dal getting swindled…

          I’ll vote Dal swindled.. but just in case I like my crow lightly breaded and pan fried.

        • I thought I had seen all the Collected Works’ videos and I never heard the 50 ft remark. I hope someone can find it as that may be a video I haven’t seen or heard and I would like to listen to it.

          Stephanie also said on her blog that Forrest once said she was within 6 feet but then sent an email saying she had never been closer than 12 feet. Maybe if she hadn’t been on 50 searches, that info would have helped her find the treasure! 🙂

          • If the chest is resting at an elevation of 6985 ft in the Rocky Mountains and I’m standing at point with an elevation of 7000 ft on a mountain in Oregon, am I within 50 ft of the chest? We seem to have defaulted to 2 dimensional thinking while attempting to match wits with a former pilot.

          • Nice thoughts Homey but rest assured we will see 900 comments on who was 500 feet ….. So over kill.

          • Navyigator, I bet almost EVERYONE thinks they have been within 500 feet! LOL! My main point was that I just want to see/hear the Collected Works interview or Q&A as I like to decide for myself what might be a hint from Forrest. I think he gives lots of hints, at least it seems that way to me and my solve, so the more statements from him the better, although sometimes his statements almost seem contradictory like the recent “over-simplifying” one vs the not to “over-complicate” the poem by trying to use cyphers, declination etc. Anyway I’m interested in the “50 feet” interview if there is one.

          • I just watched the November and October book singing videos and didn’t hear the 50 feet remark on those two

          • CJ,

            I understand where you are coming from, how can you move forward in confidence if you have not analyzed all the info given and determined if there is a clue or meaning to the different ranges given. Maybe this is all a set of hints that help you figure out some distances that are laid out in the poem. And all your super detective work may just pay off for you or someone else.

            But will say with all the double sided talk I agree it is good to look into every detail. Maybe I should go back and check on my magnetic variation clues. At this point who knows.

            I will be honest, I have never searched so you can rule me out as one of the persons who was within 500/200/50/12 feet. However, I feel I have all 9 clues solved but that does not mean getting to the chest is that easy. If I said anymore it might help my arch-lurker nemesis. Well either way CJ good luck on your chase. btw where in Cali are you?


          • Navy, I’m up in the Gold Country, half way between SF and Tahoe, and only search once a year while on vacation. So far I’ve only been on 2 hunts to the same general area and next year I’ll be going there again as I just really like the area and my solve, even if it proves to be wrong. 🙂 I like to figure things out so even if someone else finds it, I’d love to know how close I was. I try to read/watch all Forrest’s interviews and frequently see things that seem to be hints as to the state the treasure is in. I suppose everyone feels that way! How about you Navy – ever going to go to your spot?

        • I do not believe you will find that “50 foot” comment on tape anywhere. I feel I know where that occurred but I would be just spreading rumours.

          Instead I will just say this – that statement occurred when the 500′ statement was around. Since then there was has been the 200′ statement and the “tight focus on a word that is key” statement that sent everyone into a frenzy and many gave up thinking it is over.

          Thus I don’t think Mr. Fenn would reveal exactly how close the individual was because it would likely cause extreme panic and ruin all the fun for everyone. So in the mean time, 200′ is probably as close as he wants to reveal until he feels the masses can handle the truth. Remember 200 (and 50 for that matter) is a round number.

          The Wolf

          • You know, here’s the thing, when Mr. Fenn wants to say something without saying something he gives large numbers. Like “above 5000 ft” or Below “20000 ft”. And he did say in the interview that there have been a couple searchers that he knows of that have been within 50ft but he said HE WOULD NOT TELL THEM because they would tear up the countryside ripping up their old tracks. I don’t think that 50ft is supposed to mean anything other than saying, its almost found.
            So its good to mention but useless to focus on.

            All the best!

          • Nothing important to a round number in this example. Just making a point that if he is using numbers like 500, 200, 50, you can be assured it is considerably less than that. It will get interesting when numbers like 3,4 or 6 are being quoted.

          • 6 was quoted by Stephanie but then she said Forrest wrote her and changed it to 12. So, I wonder what all that was about – true? false? or just playing word games? Regardless, unless Forest says WHERE someone was when they were 500, 200, 50, 12, or 6 feet from the treasure, it means little to our solutions. 🙂

          • Even? Odd? or both?

            Every horse has an infinite number of legs.

            At the back a horse has two legs, and at the front a horse has fore legs.
            Thus the total number of legs on any horse is two plus fore = 6, an even
            number. But 6 is an odd number of legs for a horse to have! Hence we
            have shown that a horse has a number of legs that is both even and odd.
            The only number that is both even and odd is infinity, therefore a horse
            must have an infinite number of legs.

          • Huck

            the comment you refer to occurred at the Moby Dickens book shop 11/2/13 between the 8 and 9 minute mark

            you might want to listen to it again

    • I agree….and I also disagree. IMO FF tells us what the blaze is in the poem, if we can unlock the clues. He just doesn’t tell us EXACTLY where the blaze is…we must be wise to locate it’s precise location. So, IMO you could “find” what the blaze is (for example, the blaze could be the letters FF), and not never be wise enough to “find” its location.

      • au contraire mon frere

        the poem tells us exactly where the blaze is

        and there is a 2nd level more elaborate confirmation


        if you saw the blaze there is no way that you could know it was the blaze

        decoding the location is imperative

  2. To follow up on my post from previous page and Ed’s follow up: From beginning to middle to end (start)…. From 0 degrees to pi (180 degrees) to two pi (360 degrees or 0 again)….

  3. We have overlooked something…our pulse would quicken when we are at the last steps. Further research required. Armchair for now.

  4. Joanne – As you put emphasis on “THE” mountains, I would like to add: Montana means mountains, in Spanish. Montana is also the “Treasure State” for new comers to the chase. Of course, same logic also applies to the many Spanish named peaks in NM/CO.

  5. An interesting part is what exactly are the nine clues?
    There has been a good deal of speculation, but nothing concrete so far.
    As I recall Forrest has said ” Begin it wwwh” Does this mean this is the 1st clue?

  6. Kudos to Fred Y on last 9 Clues post about “The end is ever drawing nigh”.

    May I kindly request, for your own benefit, that you have the poem next to you when you quote from it.

    Examples : “The end is always drawing near”

    “end is drawing neigh”

    “The end is drawing nigh”

    and, “The end is ever drowning nigh”

    I don’t point these out to be overly critical, and I know fingers slip on tiny buttons.
    To solve, the clues must be followed PRECISELY.

    Since I feel bad about acting as “Mr. Language Person”, I will show something good :

    Yes, Sissel, there IS a tribute to Eric Sloane. It is right in front of you.

    Ask me if you don’t see it.

    Alan M.

  7. I haven’t picked nine clues I’m just following the poem from the first line and all the way down to the bottom. 🙂 I believe and I’m determined . And I’m going back 🙂

  8. No place for the meek… im out on the lake today being towed by jet ski and my buddy runs over the rope. we nearly sank the ski but got to the closest bank. there we stood, ankle deep in orange mud, for hours cutting one strand at a time with wire cutters. of course knowing the deep native roots that were once there, during my break i was eyeballing the rocks… and pondered… this is no place to be if you are meek…. yes the ski started and we met up with the fellas on the boat. pulled into a cove, cracked a cold one, and fed a brave and curious turtle chips till we drifted into the bank. we were so amused no one noticed till it happened, then we laughed some more…. ahhh…so where is that no place for the meek?

  9. Some people are scared of stuff and some have a history of being meek. I wonder if a kid would know the dif… 🙂

    • Hey pieces,
      You’ve got my gravatar that I have been using on Chasechat for over a year now. How does that happen?

  10. Dal and Group,

    So I’m the “sharp guy” eh! wow what a compliment. Thanks Dal,thought it was the other way around. Cant wait to get your signature.

    I’m just surprised that each of you have not transcribed every word that Forrest Fenn has ever said online.. as I have : )

    Well, no not really. That would be very dificult.

    Good Luck everyone. The prize is at hand.


  11. IMO, the blaze is something you see after “waiting for the light to change.”
    IMO, the deliberate inconsistencies in Forrest’s stories lead the way.

    I still am working out my theories (I have 2) so really, I don’t have a clue where it is, although I suspect it’s about 300 feet away from a road, is near a natural pool (not a lake or pond), and something (possibly a trail) is hidden behind a tree. It may be in or related to a cistern (natural or man made). In the cisterns I’m checking, they don’t count as “structures” because they are carved into the ground without using man made materials.
    I think it may be related to Native Americans (maybe a sacred place) or it may be related to art.

    I’m toying with the idea it may lie in the center of an asterisk (you find the answer to one clue, draw a line on the map to it’s “twin”, and maybe all 9 lines form an asterisk?)

    I do think the clues will lead to an exact spot but I think you might have to find not only the answer to the clue, but understand it’s twin, or mirror image, too.

    Tomorrow when I get time, I’m going to organize my notes, which are presently all over everywhere, on napkins, in notebooks, on sticky notes, on paper plates, and on maps. Lol.

    • don’t give up on the ‘cross’ idea Mindy, and as for the light at a certain time of day, i’m thinking first, morning light and not the light at the time of day when the treasure was placed. Very few searchers are on hand in a particular ‘favorite’ search spot at sunrise , i bet: this is one way for ff to separate the wheat from the chaff. 🙂 And forget the National Parks, like YNP, IMO ff wouldn’t be caught dead in those nature amusement parks with the two-with-nature hordes.

      • Hi Omega,
        I haven’t given up on crosses yet…just exploring the different ways certain cultures “illuminate” Christ. 🙂

    • Mindy, where are you coming up with “a natural pool” or a “cistern”??? TFTW. If so I don’t have that. Could you reference the “written words” for me?

      • Just southeast of Leadville Colorado there is a dry creek bed and the Ute Native Americans thought to have healing powers somewhere near a canyon. I believe it was near Colorado Springs

      • There are several places in TTOTC where he starts sentences or chapters with Well. He uses the made up term “well bug,” several times in both books. Once in the chapter about Tea with Olga, and a couple other times. He’s said the word “cistern” a couple times, I’ll have to go through my notes to find the exact spots in the books.
        There are also a few other indirect references to wells/cisterns, but again, I’ll have to go through my notes to find the exact spots. I’ll do that today and post later.

        • Nice, thanks Mindy. That’s one theory I haven’t even considered when thinking about it. I will have to place it in my solve and see how it works. Oh yeah, and read TTOTC again a couple of times.

  12. Mindy, IMO you have some good ideas there. Don’t know if this will help but here are some things I have found that I believe are important to the correct solution.

    The theme that runs throughout the book and many of his statements is that he is exploring time and timelessness. Time; past, present, future. It is a continuum in which we all exist. All of the poets, writers, and artists he quotes make statements about our place in that continuum. We exist in the present. We live our lives and make our mark in time and then move on to eternity or timelessness. We become memories for someone else’s life in the future. But memories only exist in the present. They are a connection or intersection of the present and past, but they are not the actual experience. Fenn is exploring what all this means and trying to find ways to unify or dissolve the edges that separate the past, present , or future. When time and timelessness unite, memories no longer exist because they can only exist in the present.

    “I feel my life has been a rough draft of the place just ahead where the past will come alive again and all my experiences and friends through the years will meet me at the great banquet table of history. Then there will be no past.”

    There are things and places where time and timelessness intersect. That is why his artifact collection is so important to him. It connects him in the present to the past. That is why he tells people to “please touch” which is another way to physically connect to the past. He put his biography in the chest and in the bells and jars he buried for the same reason and it is why he doesn’t care if they are found today or 10,000 years from today. His life will not be forgotten like the French soldiers or his father after all the people with memories pass on.
    So it makes sense that this is an important part of solving the poem and that the place the treasure is hidden will be a place where time and timelessness intersect. That is why the place is special to him.

    Remember in “Important Literature” TIME magazine was thrown in the trash?

    • Yes, I remember. 🙂 I believe time is an important factor in solving the poem.
      Very well said. Thank you! 🙂

    • Jackf – Nice work. Yours is the only explanation I’ve read that IMO sums up ff’s philosophy and his purpose for TTOTC. Time and timelessness IMO exist here and now – so if that’s Forrest’s purpose, there may be a TC hidden. The memory connection interests me as well. Fenn’s exploration of time’s continuum Past, Present, Future is one that the curiously bright have wondered about thru the ages while many people just wander about through life. Perhaps like us, who chase treasure in earthen vessels rather than seeking life or answers. Testing the time continuum comes through physical death and is part of a grand design by The Architect of eternity. He’s given each person life on earth with a marvelous gift of free will – which will determine where and how each spends eternity. Solving an architectural poem which may or may not have a chest of gold hidden pales in comparison to knowing God – the architect of all time, space, and creation.

      (I hope expression of beliefs doesn’t give me the proverbial ‘boot’ off the blog 🙂

    • Jack,

      A lot of what you say rings true. I’ve had several similar ideas to your elegant approach lately; and you have expressed them more eloquently and publically than I have.

      A few days ago I stumbled upon a bit of art that, at first, seemed to fit so deliciously that I thought maybe I had found a “secret key.” (I could not imagine that the connections could be coincidental.)

      Today, I am pretty sure that others must also be aware of this work, and that even WITH a secret key, this box might remain somewhere near impossible to find. …and it could just be one of NUMEROUS tiny, sometimes elegant breadcrumbs on the path home.

      …sure wish I could figure out for certain whether Forrest really is Da Vinci’s smarter brother, or just a small-town Texas jet- jockey who has everybody navel-gazing for wisdom’s crumbs. 😉

      • I have a couple of theories about his use of time in the poem. One is that he uses a clock as a map, where something important is located at 6:00 (a time he keeps repeating), and there is also the theory I want to believe but am leading away from, is that the poem highlights important parts of his life, and the poem invites you to live them vicariously through his stories and clues. Then, when you find the chest, he can now rest in peace, while you go in peace, hopefully to enrich others lives with the blessing you just received.
        And also in a way, I guess the third time theory I’m working on is that Forrest is not the only one he wants remembered from the chase.

        • Sissel,Methodical,and Mindy,
          Thanks for the kind words an for adding very good ideas. Chris Yates has an excellent post below about star gazing that I feel is relevant to this same idea. Something I hadn’t thought of.

  13. Where is the last 9 clues thread gone, cant find it under ‘searchers discussions’ > ‘9 clues archive’..?

    So, what ‘ma missing?

  14. Mindy-
    I like cistern as an end point. Every time I read “listen good” I think of WELL. I just cannot seem to put the a meaning to this line that goes with the rest of my thoughts for the clues.
    Mr. Fenn’s ” Look at the big picture” quote had me thinking (besides reminding me of an elephant story that was told to me as a lesson).
    Lets say you have a specific spot already picked out. Using a pilot theory…my thought is to maybe zoom away from the spot and ensure the other clues fit into the area. The question is to determine dimensions of the area. I’m using 50 miles as a starting point. Now after using the poem to get me to the spot, I then use the book to identify the area. Sounds simple doesn’t it. Find an altitude then rotate…you need to figure directions N,S,E,W. If the running man does not fit into MY view as a geoglyph then I am not using it. I haven’t tried the asterisks but I will now just to see.
    I suggest you need to figure the clues first. Doesn’t mean I have…Its just a thought. (IMO)
    ” Having a comprehensive knowledge of geography…” F… leads me to look at a good route to the spot with “no shortcuts”.
    or maybe he is telling us to look a the big picture on page 99 in TTOTC.
    Crazy idea but what can it hurt.

      • Yes, very interesting. Forrest using the term “well bug” over and over is odd. Yes, we know he makes up words. But a well bug? And when he further cements the use was intentional by starting his sentence with, “Well…” and then talks about cisterns in odd spots…makes ya wonder. 🙂

    • Amy,
      Did you know there’s a place in NM called Underwood? I don’t know anything about that place but I did notice it on a map. 🙂

      • I have not heard of that. My heart is in Colorado I can’t even research another state my mind will not let me. Because nothing fits to what I know about the poem. 🙂 I felt that from the poem I made it from the first line down to the blaze then I got stuck lol. Well, now I believe I’m unstuck lol. 🙂 !!!!!

      • Indeed there is an Underwood in NM. And then there is his ‘Underwood’ typewriter. Hmmm.

        Perhaps – ‘if you are brave and in the wood . . . I give you title to my gold’ – means that once you sign your name on the piece of paper (wood) – the title (to the gold), you’re golden!

        Having the ‘title’ in the chest – for you to sign and return (to get official ownership of the booty), would also be one way Mr. Fenn would know if someone has found it or not. After all, I don’t think many would opt to go black market to liquidate the gold. That would be rather difficult and expensive. Instead, I think most would take the legal way out, sign a title, pay their tax and go in peace. IMO

          • This is one reason I’m beginning to lean toward NM. Forrest has to know that many searchers will be flying on commercial airlines to their spot. Who would want to check 42 pounds of treasure on the return flight?

            Technically, I suppose the finder would just rent a car and drive home, but I know that I would want to let Forrest know I found it and would offer to stop by his place to return the bracelet.

            But what’s to say he didn’t hide the treasure with the “title” inside it in a ziplock? I think what he meant with the statement about no notes is that the treasure is really physically there, but I think there could very well be a personal note or title inside.

          • And you too Mindy! I do seem to recall Mr. Fenn saying he may have left an IOU in there . . . that he couldn’t remember. So perhaps a ‘title’ as well.

          • Mindy,
            f said he designed the treasure so that when the finder opened the chest, he/she would be amazed by the sight of it.

            I’d be happy to have that weighty problem !!.

          • I did see one interview where Forrest said he might have left an IOU for $100k in the chest, but he could not remember if he did it.

    • At one time I was a believer it was in wood but with boots on the ground I can see first how fast growth of plants and the decayed tree can over circumference an object. With some of his latest stories I’ve seen pictures with his friend in a cave and other stories mention something similar. Chairs are mention as well as bench that can be intrepid as a rock formation. He also mentions standing on a stool to do dishes. The only thing with my line of thinking is the poem doesn’t really give any hints to Rocky bench. Maybe the poem if followed correct with boots on the ground will lead you to the path of this and will be obvious.

      • I have no idea when I find it I will let you know if you could see it from 12 feet away. 🙂 lol

  15. Simple directional language for Geography would include up, down, forward and backwards.

  16. If the chest is resting at an elevation of 6985 ft in the Rocky Mountains and I’m standing at point with an elevation of 7000 ft on a mountain in Oregon, am I within 50 ft of the chest? We seem to have defaulted to 2 dimensional thinking while attempting to match wits with a former pilot.

  17. Relative direction runs three patterns: (X axis) left -> right, (Y axis) back -> front, (Z axis) down -> up.

    IMO the mention of with # of feet is the Z axis. It doesn’t mean you leave off X and Y it just means Forrest maybe thinking in terms of Z axis to answer that specific question. He is a pilot after all…elevation has a whole different meaning to him.

    Maybe he learned his directional sense from the Negrito Pygmies in Survival School in the Philippines? (TTOTC, p. 86)

  18. More ideas to ponder-
    What are we looking for if we get within 12′. I doubt the chest will be out in the open-atop a rock engraved with a smiley face (I would probably walk right by it with everything else I have in mind).
    I’m guessing its hidden and not buried. I keep thinking of Teachers with ropes or Cody and the axle. Not to mention the thread in the mud, treasures on a string necklace and how about the tobacco tin with chain.
    Is it possible the chest could be tethered, lets say about 12′? The prize for best storyteller really made me think.
    If it is tethered…To what ?
    I still haven’t decided if the blaze is the directions or a final destination. Both?
    Still have a lot to think about.

    • Amy – perhaps silence is golden. My hearing and perception are more clear listening to the sound of the wind throught the trees. Solitude and silence are endangered species in our world today.

        • Say if I found the chest perhaps
          I would not blog it like Forrest said no one would believe me anyway.
          It would be left up to Forrest to let others know not me 🙂

          • @ Amy

            Entirely up to the finder. But wisdom says silence yields peace and safety.

            Think water leaking from a dam. Once released, it can never be taken back; the leak gets larger by the minute. Each drop commingles with the larger body of water and becomes less pure, saturated or polluted by the greater body of water.

            If the finder can be silent, they preserve personal peace, and the ability to publish anonymously details they wish to be made public. Mr. Fenn was very brave to go public and remain active in his project. I admire that greatly, but not sure I could do the same.

          • I agree with you, Amy. If I am lucky enough to find it while Forrest is still alive I’m sure I’d leave it in his hands. I’d say…”here’s your bracelet AND your treasure…what do you want to do with it, Sir? If you’d like me to “carry the load” for you I’d be happy to do that”. 🙂

  19. I don’t believe other searchers have come within 1/2 mile of the chest of course this is IMO

  20. I haven’t posted in awhile, yet I read the blogs daily. I had to get legal advice before my next trip. The DA lost his case against my home of Brown. See you in late September.

    • Amy,
      Thanks, I’m seldom correct, and certainly not about 9 clues. Peace comes in different forms… the name Sissel means without sight. Tomorrow I plan to become blind to voices on-line and hopefully experience a quieter peace of mind, body and soul. Happy searching Amy. I hope you find what you’re looking for.

  21. At times in life it’s good to say thank u and smile. Or say Thank God and smile. 🙂

    For whoever finds the chest absolutely should let Forrest know.
    I agree with the comments above 🙂 !!!!!

  22. So let me ask the group a question . . . Say you had a treasure to hide for others to find, and you too (like Mr. Fenn) had a very special, dear and secret place in mind to hide it; at what point (time/age) in your life do you think it most likely that you would have first discovered this special place?

    • AFTER I had my pilot’s license and flew over the spot and then shared it with my best friend, whatever that age may be.

  23. Forrest is a intelligent man.
    He could advise the person who finds it . And we all need advice from someone who is wise,

  24. If the chest IS hidden in NM, I would like to think he might put a little card with his address and phone number on it, saying, “Stop by for a visit.” 🙂

  25. Another thought on the location. I’m thinking that it has to be a place that has experienced some dealing with 17th century Spanish people. There are a few in NM of historical note, and I haven’t checked Colorado, but I think Coronado explored the southern portions there.

  26. What was the final verdict, todays latest revelation that MAYBE someone got as close as 50 ft? Watched the October bookstore video, Yeah it was interesting, it may have been terrific to be there in person, but Fenn didn’t specifically mention 50 ft

    • It would be good for those quoting Fenn to give a source. I’m not aware of the fifty foot statement, but that doesn’t mean he didn’t say it. Without a source there is no context, if he actually said something. Last year everyone was saying Fenn said to “think big”. Fenn said he never said that.


      Having said that, I give a lot more weight to what he has written vs. what he says or doesn’t say. Some of the things he’s said seem contradictory or at best confusing. I would advise folks to listen to everything he’s said to decide for themselves if it’s important.

      For example at the same event we are discussing he said, “I haven’t given a clue that I think was going to help anybody…”. Then later he says, “I’ll tell you that it’s not on a top of any mountain. That’s a big clue ’cause there’s lots of mountains out there…it may be close to the top…”. I suppose that means he’s giving a “big clue” that won’t help anyone.

      Another example in a different interview the reporter said Fenn stumbled over the grave marker when he was shot down…….he didn’t correct her. It’s at 15:50. If that is the only interview a person watches they could reasonably conclude Fenn stumbled over the grave marker after being shot down. Which is wrong.

      This same interview is the infamous Coriolis Effect statement. It was so wrong I thought it had to be a clue. It’s at 26:20


      Apparently from his recent (written) statements we are both overly complicating and overly simplifying the poem……I’m still trying to figure that one out.

      • I agree Goofy and that the 50 foot statement is not anything to help a searcher but we all think we are close and false statements like that would have over thinking our ideas to which that time and energy could be spent best else where.

      • Goofy, I believe he originally said (in print, to Dal) that a “useless” clue is something that won’t lead a person to the treasure. He followed that up in an interview by saying he’s never given a clue that would help anybody. I believe his meaning was the same in both cases: that is, by “it won’t help anybody” he means, “it won’t lead you to the treasure.”

        I believe he has given many clues that will help lead the right person to the treasure, but they will never be identified as “important clues” or “clues” by him. Anything identified as a clue is a “useless” clue, in my opinion.

        I also agree with William that a non-existant statement attributed to Mr. Fenn will not help a searcher.

        • I know, You guys are going to laugh me out of the forum on this one. But it all clicked on me. ALL OF IT. yesterday I was sitting at my desk and whamo! All of these words hes said and lines from his poem started an atomic reaction in my mind. If I didn’t have a responsible bone in my foot I’d be walking out of the spot right now with 40lbs on my back. its killing me that I’m not there right now.

          And about searching down quotes and references just to “prove” that Forrest said someones been within 50′ of it. Why waste my time. I’ve listened to nearly every recorded word hes said. That’s what every searcher should do. All this arguing or going back and forth on what he said or didn’t say is pointless.

          My word, I heard it. What does it mean, about as much as above 5k’ in the rocky mountains means. Why all the hoot and holler?

          All the best,

          • Huck – Not laughing you out of here, but here is some Fenn wisdom to consider…

            “Serendipity: An aptitude for making desirable discoveries by accident.”

            “The word carries several connotations…, and I don’t think it works for me in the context you mentioned. Playing a hunch is nearly always fraught with disappointment, especially if the stakes are high. A searcher who guesses through life is destined to carry a thin wallet.f”

            And another…

            “it will take the right combination of cunning and perseverance.”

            I don’t believe one aha moment is going to bring a solution to all nine clues; each has to be discovered and figured out separately; and none of them are easy.

            But go with what you have, just allow for some disappointment somewhere in all the confidence so you aren’t completely distraught when you are walking out with a little less than the 40 lbs on your back.

          • Not playing on a hunch or serendipity. I have had many aha moments and didn’t hop in my car guessing with any one of them. Watch and learn boys and girls.

            Don’t want everyone still searching after I come up with it so I’ll figure out a way to tell without telling. I do have a thin wallet yes but who better to find such a blessing. Don’t let my thin walled deceive you, and definitely don’t look down on me because I’m in the lower class. That’s ridiculous. I’d like to see anyone of you soft skinned rich boys walk through to poverty I have seen. Its enough to crush dreams and eliminate hope. But both hope and dreams I still have.

            But I am dead serious. IT ALL CLICKED! And don’t worry, If I find it.. I’m writing a memoir and a poem and hiding it all over again for others to find. I am the type to pass it along and pay it forward. One of the reasons my wallets thin.

            Very Cunning, Sharp (according to Dal), and perseverant,

          • Huck

            whether or not you care about the 50 ft comment, a lot of searchers on here do, including me, and you should take that into consideration and try to be clear in your communication of it

            you said previously that he did say in the interview that there have been a couple searchers that he knows of that have been within 50ft and also you indicated to Dal that the comment was on a recorded video appearance of Forrest

            now you are saying my word, I heard it

            are you indicating now the comment is not recorded and it is just something you personally heard, if so, i will take your word for it no problem, just i think its important you be clear on the details on a comment of this nature.

            like i say, that may not matter to you, but a comment of this nature matters a lot to me and others here.

            ps. if it was on video, kindly reference which appearance it was, thanks

      • @William, I agree, that’s why I wanted folks to source their information. Without context and exact phrasing the statement is useless. Whether it’s important or not is up to each searcher. Most folks mean no harm but just can’t remember the exact statement and are giving their opinion……someone else could hear or read the same statement and come away with a completely different meaning. And there are those that mislead intentionally; just for meanness or an attempt to confuse those searching.

        @Mike; I call that incident the “Great Useless Clue Debacle”. I had quite a conversation with Fenn on that one. One of the arguments I made is that “not in Utah or Idaho” is not a useless clue. If he kept telling me where it’s not, it would eventually lead me directly to where it is. I’ve got over it…….it doesn’t matter what I think; it’s Fenn’s game and he makes the rules. And the way he feels about rules basically means there aren’t any.

        @Huck; I had an atomic reaction in my mind once…..it turned out to be a sinus infection. If you were a nice guy you would go get the treasure and put the rest of us out of our misery. Maybe then I could go hunt for something that would actually be profitable, like Bigfoot or a UFO…… 😆

        I do agree with you that every searcher should do their own research. I also agree all the arguing about what he said or didn’t say is pointless. Which is why I think the source should be posted. However, I think discussing (arguing) the different interpretations and opinions folks have about what he said (from a source) is interesting and helpful to some of us. As with everything else about the chase, each searcher has to decide what is important or not.

        I think everyone should keep in mind that Fenn is first and foremost a master of marketing. He made his money buying stuff and then convincing someone it was worth more than what he paid for it. While it’s a lot of fun and interesting I think most of what he says is nothing but marketing from the master. Then again, I don’t have the chest.

      • When you look out into the night sky, and you see the stars far away, you’re seeing them because of the light that has traveled from them to you.

        It takes time for light to travel here. So what you’re doing is seeing the stars as they were in the past, the amount of time its taken for the light to reach us. And the further and further away those stars are, the further back in time we’re looking.

        Now we’re seeing a star, let’s say, six thousand years ago. Imagine somebody on that star, looking at us. They would be seeing us as we were, six thousand years ago. Which of those two is now?

        So space and time are linked together. We are looking across space, we are looking back in time.

          • I agree, Specialklr. People can make it more complex than it really is. In the example, “we” are only separated from “them” by distance (space) which takes time to travel. We and them are both now. The mistake is made by assuming the light which we see is “them” when they are, in fact, separate. Where it REALLY gets mind-boggling is trying to imagine what happens when light and “body” become one. i.e. Enlightened or Glorified. Such an event may only occur in another dimension…a spiritual dimension.

        • I feel like that was a rap by Mclemore and Lewis on the stars and time CY.. is that ff’s words?

        • Excellent post Chris! I have a comment somewhere above about how Forrest is exploring the intersections of time and timelessness. I think this is the core of the book, the poem, and the solution. Looking at stars is one of those intersections. It is one of those “aberrations at the edges” where the boundaries that separate the past, present, and future disappear. Finding an artifact that has been untouched for thousands of years is another of one of those intersections. So is finding his treasure or one of his bells or jars 10,000 years from now.

        • Chris, this reminds me of the following poem by THE Romanian poet and philosopher Mihai Eminescu:

          “So far it is athwart the blue
          To where yon star appears,
          That for its light to reach our view
          Has needed thousand years.

          Maybe those ages gone it shed
          Its glow, then languished in the skies,
          Yet only now its rays have sped
          Their journey to our eyes.

          The icon of the star that died
          Slowly the vault ascended;
          It was when it couldn’t be spied,
          We see now what has ended.

          So is it when our love’s aspire
          Is hid beneath night’s bowl,
          The gleam of its extinguished fire
          Enkindles yet our soul.”

  27. A question for Stephanie, please:
    Tonite was the first I heard of your 6 ft – 12 ft feedback from Forest; I remember my thoughts about his ‘careful’ chat with you as you talked about traveling the BearTooth departing YNP. Uhm, did you make some stops along the way, out?

    • He’s said I was 6 feet, then no closer than 12, than someone said within 200…then there was that I’d faint. He knows I’ve been on 50 trips, and I’ve spent close to 100k searching going on 4 years. People would be surprised to know I’ve been on 4 trips this month and been in all the states and I have been trying to quit searching. I’ve searched 6 states and traveled many many miles. It wouldn’t surprise me that most people have been that close, because it’s a popular search area. He has said we’d be surprised where it is. That’s what makes me think that way. It will probably turn out to be at the entrance to YNP

      I have no idea what you’re talking about with BearTooth. I’ve spent a lot of time in YNP and West Yellowstone, but I never heard of that.

      • Hi Stephanie,

        I am truly surprised that Mr. Fenn has commented to you at all regarding how close you may have come to the TC. To me, this flies in the face of him not wanting to provide any help (fair or unfair–leading or misleading) or advantage to a searcher. If this is true, and accurate then your search area is significantly smaller than that facing all other searchers.

        So, I would question perhaps the interpretation of his comment to you. For example, someone posted that perhaps it was “elevation” that he was referring to without actually stating as such. This would be disappointing as well because that would be playing games with you in my view and falsely get you excited.

        This is somewhat disturbing on many levels, but I truly hope that Mr. Fenn does not have you spinning your wheels and your bank account.

        all the very best to you Stephanie and good luck on your searches.

      • Stephanie….are you saying Forrest told you that you were within 6′. Am I reading this correctly? Do you mind saying what states you have been looking in?

        • I can understand how folks can perceive The 6′ 12′ comment as Unfair or misleading etc. But lets have a bit of a reality check for a moment.

          As one searcher put it well, the distance may not be near the chest but possibly at the same elevation of the chest. We also do not know if this was in reference to a physical place visited or a theory passed on to Fenn. As well as when or what state. Stephanie herself has stated many time over the years she has been to all the remaining state multiple time and just stated she has been on 4 trips recently, with a total of, as she stated, 50 trips. Yep that narrows it down for me !!!

          Fenn has stated that searchers have been within 500′ – 200′ – 50′ . But has the chest been discovered because we know those distances?
          To Know how close a searcher “has been” is only helpful if we know who and where at what time they were near the chest. So far I have not seen any information leading to one individual have any knowledge to this information.

          I just don’t see what all the fuss is about when it comes to a searcher being any distance from the chest… It would be speculation, at best, to say who those folks that FF was referring to.
          No helpful information here… IMO

          • I still believe the error is in the interpretation of what he said. Something like no closer than 12 feet. It doesn’t even mean 12 feet! Like his experience at Borders when he said “I’ve never been able to find a place where I couldn’t embarrass myself and this store was now number one on the list.”

            I thought this was settled. I could search in my backyard and that statement would be true. I was never closer than 12 feet to the chest… or 12 miles for that matter.

          • Oh my, you have to include” a male searcher has been within striking distance”.

            I think it was me in an email he got but not from me. Think about that one.

          • Seeker: I think you are right on target. I don’t understand why this issue is so important to some people. The only value I see is that it is reassuring in a little way that someone out of 50,000+ searches has been either physically close or had identified a spot that is close. If he had said that NO ONE had been close, in either an actual search or in identifying a search location, then I would be totally discouraged. I think trying to figure out “how close” someone was is misdirected effort. Perhaps what people are really trying to determine is whether they are “the one”, like some did with the “whisperer” comment, and some do when they interpret FF’s replies to their emails. People should ask themselves “do you have the chest?” and if the answer is anything but YES then they are not “the ONE”. At least not now. Proofs in the pudding, eh? The only steps that actually propel “the one” toward finding this treasure (imho) is actually searching in a spot that matches the clues in the poem. If it isn’t where you look then you can eliminate that spot. I think that is why he said it wasn’t “easy”: it takes a lot of work to find it and not the kind of work that takes place in front of a computer. Sometimes I wonder if his comment that someone will walk right up to it is being interpreted correctly. Sure, they will walk right up to it eventually, but what he doesn’t say is how much they will have work to find it. Watching someone win a 50 miter race looks easy when you don’t consider the months, and years of training that go into winning that race.

          • Seeker,

            A general comment to all regarding how close people have been to the treasure is one thing, but to tell a specific searcher like Stephanie that she has been within 6′ or 12′ is most concerning to me if it is not accurate for Stephanie’s sake. Even if she has made 50 searches across multiple states, I bet her total search area is less than 50 square miles and that is compressed further by knowing exactly where she has informed Mr. Fenn that she has been. Compare that to the total search area in TFTW that other searches have to deal with.

            If this in not accurate information for Stephanie,then that is even worse in my view.

            Either way …the playing field becomes titled. Either in Stephanie’s favor or against her if she is now searching only her past areas based on a possible erroneous and misleading comment from the Master.

          • windsurfer,

            The only response I can give you in regards to How many or where some one has search, is by what was stated by her in many different comment, post, responses, on different sites.

            Whether one wants to believe what another has said to be completely factual or not, is up to that person.

            My comment was about the unknown factors of when, where, etc. in regards to, how it would not help anyone to narrow down the location of the trove.

            The unknowns or unsubstantiated factors are more important than just a single number. This, for me is not unlike the comment of… paraphrasing… A man was closet to the trove, but a woman could have been with him. This may seem to be an unfair a comment as well to some. But does it help anyone to narrow where the chest is?

            as well as the comment… paraphrasing… if she knew how close she was, she tear up the country side… WHO? who is she? and is “She” the one that was with the man who was closet?

            The point is, it’s all about the unknowns and not what is told.

            You stated you would bet her search areas is less than 50 sq miles, I don’t know the answer to that or could even guess. You would need to ask her.

            As always… Just my opinion.

          • IMO, the email/conversation/story that informed FF that they’d been so close (intentionally searching or not) didn’t include the woman’s full name. That’s why the semi-uncertain status.

          • Lets stir the pot one more time and then I will let it simmer for another 30 days until I head up towards Montana. Forrest gets emails daily from everyone here on this site. I am sure he checked the bottom of his post. I really like the daffodil page perhaps I prefer Mimosa Pudica. See everyone here next month. I enjoy reading everyone’s post. Thumbs up.

        • I’ve spent my savings on searching….and then some believing. I’ve tried to quit at different times. My husband’s going in for open heart surgery in the next month or two…I’ll need to then for sure.

          • Raven,

            I always like it when someone says, I’m right…so thanks for that. I agree with your comment , On Fenn’s comment, a searcher will walk right up to the chest.
            The chest will not be in plain sight, just that the searcher knows the clues to place them at that the 10″ x 10″ spot. One may even be within 12′ of the chest and not see it. They just need to know it’s there by their correct solution. They will most definitely need to to do something other than, just lift with their knees and not there back.

            No one will just happen upon the chest by accident.

            I’m not criticizing anyone who want to go search for the chest if they feel they may have the first 2 or 3 clues correct…
            But for me, that’s just jumping the gun and a waste of time and money. Whining about it after is, just as much a waste as well. IMO…

    • Let’s just say that Forrest told me:
      “Dal, you’ve passed within 50 feet of the chest.”
      This is hypothetical. I am not saying that Forrest ever said this to me….but let’s explore it for a second.

      A couple of things to consider…
      What if I am one of those people who goes out a lot and hammer’s Forrest with emails telling him where I am and why I am looking there. I have looked in a lot of places and Forrest knows where I have looked. He also knows all the roads I’ve driven to get from point A to point Z, where I’ve stopped for dinner, and sight-seeing side trips I’ve taken. I am a blabbermouth and constantly write Forrest with info about my trips. I have spent an enormous amount of money, been out 50 times and traveled thousands and thousands of miles in four states as I look for the chest.

      Then one day Forrest tells me I’ve been within 50ft of the chest. He does not say when or where I was when this occurred. He is talking about distance…not elevation. He is not trying to trick me he is out and out telling me that I passed by that chest within 50 feet somewhere on my journey…somewhere in the past 3.5 years of searching. He didn’t say I passed by it while on foot. I might have passed by it when I was driving any one of the 8,458 miles of roads that I have driven down as I’ve looked for the chest…from 2-rut Forest Service jeep trails to superhighways in 4 states.

      Would this do me much good…and is it a clue?

      In the very broadest sense it would be of use only because it would tell me that if I have not been to Denver, I need not search there now. It has narrowed down my possible search area to 55 locations and over eight thousand miles of road and all the towns, tourist traps, museums, cafes, gas stations and fly shops I’ve walked through in the past 3.5 years…

      Oh…and there was also the trip I made to see my aunt Zelda in Colorado Springs that I blabbered to Forrest about…He knows about that trip too…so I guess I have to include that…I told him I was thinking about going up to Denver…I never went there but maybe he thinks I was so I guess I better include I-25 between CS and Raton, NM.

      Under Forrest’s definition of clue I don’t see how it could be a clue because it does not get me closer to the chest than I have already been…

      For me, this would barely be helpful…
      It’s exciting to ponder…and gives me hope…but in the real world of where to look next……pretty useless…


        • Had similar thoughts. But Dal’s Logic101 course is pretty useful for people getting overly riled up- …presuming they can let themselves stop to listen good .

          All this distance hint garbage is moot– he said all you need is the poem, and he said he wouldn’t give any hints that would lead anyone to the chest. Whether 200 feet, 6 meters, 66,000 links , 300 miles west, whatever, are accurate or not, they WON’T HELP YOU SOLVE THE POEM.

          • yeah…good insight Map. Some folks might find that Forrest’s comments are directed at no person in particular. Individuals MAY BE so invested, or infested, that they think he is speaking always to them only. I do believe he does toss tidbits out there, but unless you are on track they will mean nada…IMO the Poem is where all the info is.

      • dal,

        I have a place in mind currently that I am certain Stephanie has not been to or she certainly would be returning there because of what she would have “found” which could place Stephanie within 6′ or 12′.

        200 ft to 500ft is one thing and yes you could go right by it on a road at these distances, but 6′ has got to be at the end game of anyone’s search in my view. I am 6’4″ and if he hid it along side a road, I guess he just threw it out the window. I guess I should pack it in or maybe we can all email our locations to Stephanie and for $5 she can tell us whether she has been there or not. Because now I have to factor where Stephanie may or may not have searched into my calculus. Might save folks a lot of time and money and allow Stephanie to recover some of her savings.

        Now I am suspicious and it makes it even more difficult for you dal…should you actually find the TC…people will always now question it….

        For these reasons, I am finding it difficult to believe that Mr. Fenn provided this information to Stephanie…unless perhaps he did not believe the TC will be found during his lifetime or Stephanie’s. Well, what if it is found and what if it is not located anywhere near (6′ to 12′) where Stephanie has searched? Someone then owes Stephanie some answers.

        • well, not all of this in whining for the following reason…I was investigating a place near West Yellowstone on-line and couldn’t make whether I saw a path “in there” from GE. I emailed Stephanie and asked if she had ever been there and if so was there a path and she told me she had never been there so if FF did tell her she was within 6 or even 12 or even 50 feet then I just saved the money and hassle of a trip to look in that spot. Now I am back to the entire Rockies to search as she is only down to 50 finite spots or so instead of the entire Rockies like the rest of us…no whining but feel she has an advantage in MHO….

          • CTron, I think you would be making a major error if you decided against making a search based on what you think Steph may have been told or more importantly what she thinks she may have heard. It should come as no surprise by now that words, definitions, recollections, interpretations, and motivations are all involved in trying to understand this chase. Unless I see a email or recording of what, where, when, and what a statement was responding to, I take what is repeated to be worth just a grain of salt. If Forrest said “CTRON, you have never been closer than 6 feet to the chest”. That statement does NOT mean you have been 6 feet or 10 feet or 10,000 feet of the chest even though you may interpret what was said differently. What is said and what someone intended to say and what the statement is interpreted as meaning are all different things. Language is elastic at its best and EXACT wording and context is very important to understand what is being communicated. Statements are misquoted on this blog by well meaning folks every day. Don’t let this red herring keep you from doing your own fishing.

          • Cton-
            You are not paying attention…You have to calculate in all the places she’s been..the places she drives, eats, stays overnight, etc…she has been looking for 3.5 years…thousands of miles of road and trail…you have to include all of it…not just her search spots..

          • Ctron — yes, Stephanie has an measurable advantage , she’s gotten off her duff and put boots on ground. Shes 50 trips ahead of all the armchair indiana joneses. An advantage, but only based off effort. Any other suggestion is libelous conjecture.

        • I’ve puzzled over statements like “NEVER BEEN CLOSER THAN12 feet from the treasure” and have thought of how Forrest likes to play with language. To me, and perhaps to Forrest, that does not mean the same thing as “someone HAS BEEN AS CLOSE AS 12 feet from the treasure or WITHIN 12 feet.” Do you see the difference in the statements? “Never been closer than 12 feet” could very well mean 500 feet away if interpreted in that way. I really don’t believe Forrest lies to people. He may miss-speak occasionally when talking to people, but who doesn’t? The ONLY reason I was interested in whether he made a 50 ft statement is because there may be an interview I missed and I would like to hear it. I care nothing about that particular statement. I just want to listen to all the interviews that are available.

      • OK All,

        Perhaps we sort out this dilemma in the following Fenn fashion.

        He responds to Stephanie regarding how close she has been to the TC when she perhaps pesters him a bit too much about it. I can just see him saying the following.

        “not as close as 6ft, but no closer than 12ft”

        Now that would explain a lot of things, but then Stephanie might as well be searching on the moon, which would be very sad.

        Well, there are two sides to every story….and then there is the truth.

        For now…I guess I will remain neutral.

  28. What does Mr. Fenn mean to go with confidence to Arthur Manby’s gravesite? Does anybody know?

    • Until it’s found, I’m not ruling out any state. I’m leaning toward NM, but there’s a spot in Colorado I’m looking at, and a spot in Wyoming, too. And I’m open to other spots as I research more. It takes time to pore over every square inch of the TFTW map!

  29. I think people should listen to Forrest. People don’t give him enough credibility. He’s a straightforward guy. You have to solve the clues before you can get to the chest. Don’t waist time chasing shadows. Get out the dictionary and study the meaning of words.

    • I agree Ed. Our energy is much better spent solving the 9 clues precisely and walking to the treasure, rather than worrying about who searched where or who was told what, when and why.

  30. Ohhhh Stephanie,

    I think I need to talk to you privately. Do you have an email? I think I might have some valuable info and maybe we can corroborate. It has to do with one of your searches and I think you were very very close, and I might might might have something.
    My email is mindyfausey@yahoo.com.

  31. Hey Windsurfer,
    Last time I checked Stephanie was still a woman. I know there have been some weirdos immitating women on these sites but you are omitting one very important fact:
    The closest person to the treasure chest was a MAN (not a woman), so you might want to take the 6 foot rumour with a grain of salt. Some times people hear things that they want to hear.
    The Wolf

    • Hey Wolf, Always appreciate your insights. I hope that you are correct otherwise the Chase will have taken a huge step backward in its integrity…and that is when I am out. I sincerely hope that Stephanie simply misunderstood Mr. Fenn’s comments just as I believe the Cheat Sheet craftsman was not listening clearly when Mr. Fenn reportedly stated “and it will be there waiting when you arrive.”

      Should be “and it will be there wading when you arrive”. IMO!

      • “the Chase will have taken a huge step backward in its integrity” – Windsurfer

        My response – you have no idea, if you did know, you would be out……little over a year ago

    • Wolf – Someone had to take a picture of that MAN and send it to Fenn, maybe it was the woman. 🙂

    • Wolf,
      My interpretation, since Forrest said the closest “person”, never saying closest “searcher”, leaves the possibility that he could have meant himself. Just another way of looking at it, I guess. Semantics!

        • Chris,

          Can you point me in the right direction about where to find this piece of info?

          I thought (like everybody else) that I was the guy he was referring to.

          I wrote to him in late Sept. about our trip, my solve of the “puzzle” and how I got my blaze (which incidentally is Y shaped).

          I explained pretty detailed how close we got to the point where I think it is hidden, which is a little over 50 ft., no more than 80 ft.

          The thing is, if he said that people didn’t know they were close, that would exclude us, because I told him that I’m convinced it’s there, even if we weren’t brave enough to “be in the wood”.


  32. Hey Windsurfer/CTron,
    The last time I checked Stephanie was still a woman. I know there have been some weirdos immitating women on these sites but you are omitting one very important fact:
    The closest person to the treasure chest was a MAN (not a woman), so you might want to take the 6 foot rumour with a grain of salt. Some times people hear things that they want to hear.
    The Wolf

    • Concerning Stephanies recent statements, has everyone forgotten this Fenn statement from Scrapbook 78:

      “Second, I have not said that a searcher was closer than 12’ from the treasure. It is not likely that anyone would get that close and not find it.”

      Based on this I think it’s probable she miss-understood something he said.

  33. I my self don’t listen to what forrest says or doesn’t say – does or doesn’t do – im not going to let my time to be wasted on any thing other then on the poem to let other things to get in my way is just a waste of time

    • You should rethink that policy…. You have to realize that everything Forrest Says or does that Treasure is Right there in front of his mind. its going to bleed out into everything he says. his Sarcasm, his jokes, his non clues… everything.

      You are right though about the poem. It will all fit in there.

      • There’s a method to his madness. I agree with Huck. It would be a fatal mistake not to consider everything f says.

  34. everyone keep in mind that Forrest said this in response to stephanie’s assertion

    I have not said that a searcher was closer than 12’ from the treasure. It is not likely that anyone would get that close and not find it.

    • Chris,

      For me, that means that the TC is more than 12′ from the blaze…you must get closer to find it and it is still not easy at even that point. As Nor alluded…searching for objects underwater is not easy. See my cheat sheet comment above.

      • the following is all IMO of course

        i think that many have misinterpreted the placement of the blaze in this poem puzzle

        like the other things along the way, heavy loads and water high, the blaze is another landmark along the way, and does not indicate you are very near the chest

        the blaze just happens to be one of the last landmarks before you get there, but not necessarily the last one

        the treasure is more than a mile away from it

        • I hope it’s not a mile away from the blaze . If that’s the case I may never find it lol.

          • why would the distance from the blaze make a difference to your likelihood of finding it?

            if you solve the poem, you will go exactly to that spot, and wherever that is, is where it is

            this is a puzzle solving treasure hunt. it isn’t a ‘go to some general area and look around for it’ treasure hunt

            i guess i should say IMO but hasnt Forrest said enough to make this clear?

            thats why the people who have been the closest didnt know they were close. the only way someone can be close and not find it is because they are looking around the area and happen to be close, but they dont know it because they havent solved the puzzle of the poem

            the first time someone has solved it and walks into the area, they are going to find it, because they will know, and they will know where to go

          • you mean, why do i think it is more than a mile away from the blaze

            because the coordinates for the blaze and the chest are in the poem, and they happen to be more than a mile apart.

            i am being intentionally vague on the distance of course

  35. i have been studying the poem and i seem to be picking up on a clue pattern throughout the poem

    i am wondering if where ever F placed the treasure he hid it inside a really large tin can. that way it couldnt be damaged by someone trying to discover it with a shovel or some other tool

    • Hi Chris: I went over 4000 miles to check out something that I saw on an earlier trip.
      A beat up old rusty drum was stranded on high ground with the creek water flowing around both sides. It was just below an old washed out wooden bridge.
      It seemed to be a perfect place, but alas, no chest!

    • Wasn’t he “canned” in one of his stories and his mother explained what that term meant? Perhaps the can is made of aluminum.

    • if I paid 20 thousand for a treasure chest why would I want to put it in a hole and fill it up with dirt so I agree chris

  36. So now I sit here past midnight, beside my juniper fire …

    this page in the book always seemed significant to me but i couldn’t understand why. now i think i get the midnight reference.

    at first, i wonder why he says, past midnight, when i would have expected something else. however, then i realize he’s sitting next to the juniper fire, so actually it makes sense

  37. Ellen,
    Your comment was maybe valid a year ago, however he has recently confirmed that it was a Man searcher. I encourage you to go to Jenny Kile’s site and read for yourself.
    The Wolf

    • The Wolf,

      Thank you, all of this can be very confusing and open to interpretation.

      If it is the 7/3/14 question (Jenny Kile) you are referring to, the question says that “a man came physically closest, but who has come mentally closest…?”

      Forrest’s answer – “Perhaps all searchers think they have been mentally close to the treasure…”. He goes on to say a man has been within striking distance but so have some women.”

      I’m not making the leap from “searchers” in Forrest’s first sentence and “man” in the second?

      The 6/2/14 Q&A does the same thing. When asked “Who has been the closest to the chest; man or woman?”, Forrest answers “…the closest person to the treasure was a man….” His next sentence he uses the term “searchers” when discussing their common mistake.

      It is interesting, to me, how Forrest, almost like a magician, can blend two sentences and come out “tricking” the reader.

      Perhaps there is a 3rd Q&A I missed. Thank you again.

      • Ellen,
        One can analyze this to death from a lawyer’e eye, but at some point you have to add up all the circumstantial evidence and draw the intended logical answer. The fact that he said the (man) may have had a woman with him nullifies him since he “went alone in there” and is the only one who knows the location. The fact that the question implied a searcher, means his answer refers to a searcher to all but the conspiracy theorists.

        • Wolf,

          Not a problem. None of these questions about who was closest or how many feet in distance really matter in the end (to me.)

          A side note: Having participated in your 100 searcher poll a few months ago, I seem to remember that the largest number of “What month will it be found” answers covered June/July.

          Would you remember how many, besides myself, answered in September? Just asking….

  38. I’m enjoying reading all of this… 2 things come to mind quickly… #1 Keep it up and ff might have to clarify out right how close someone was and #2 not many of y’all are taking into consideration that the special spot is where his bones were going to be so therefore things like ( he can’t put himself in a tin can under a bridge) unless you don’t take stock in ff’s words. IMHO

  39. dal,

    Our prayer request group is inquiring about Hayden Porter’s condition. Have you heard anything from his father Brian?

    • Windsurfer,

      Thank you so much for your prayers…

      It’s quite a miracle… Hayden went back to school yesterday.. 1 week and 2 days after being struck by a Chevy Tahoe at 30+mph, cartwheeling through the air 20 feet, and hitting the pavement, losing consciosness… We were told he had 3 fractures but he actually had 5 – 2 in his eye orbital/sinus, one in his right collar bone and 2 in his pelvis…

      He was in the hospital Monday though Friday, and Saturday, he was walking without a walker, on no medication and required no surgery! It’s really hard to explain – seeing him come into the emergency room the way he was, and how he is now…

      Thanks to EVERYONE who prayed for Hayden – the group prayer obviously helped!

      I’ll send a photo to Dal to see if he can post…



  40. in some of my comments i say things like i mean them literally, but i do not

    i believe Fenn does the same thing in some of his comments which when understood for the hints they are, are not literal

  41. Congratulations Laura!……let Forrest drink the Brandy and he might tell you where the treasure is.

  42. The Wolf,

    Appreciate the poll results I inquired about. Wonder if the “State” choices would change if done now. Good luck.

    • Ellen,
      It was my pleasure to do this and share the results. I was surprised by the number of Colorado votes. This was contrary to the one done by CO High Country just a few months before *NM was always the highest by a lot). Initially with this poll, there was a 2-1 CO to NM ratio but mostly the participants were Chasechat voters. When I sent it to TTOTC and Dals site the NM numbers increased.
      The Wolf

  43. William,

    In regards to your comment: “I believe if you want everyone to not find something you hidden just tell them the truth and they will not believe you.”

    You’re right. Better yet, put it right in front of their eyes and they won’t believe it…LOL 🙂 I guess that’s just human behavior though, to be suspicious.

  44. OMG, does no one on this site work? Or sleep? The precious gems of your thoughts and words are exhausting me. Can you possibly keep a few for your heirs?

    And Laura, congrats on the win. Would love you to post a picture of yourself wearing the necklace. Hope it inspires Lady Luck for you.

  45. lol yes sir I work. But I’m able to keep up with the post . When I’m at home I do my chores and while I’m busy here I just keep checking in lol.

    Forrest we have a addiction problem here. 🙂 !!!!!!!

  46. The sun is rising over forest and old barn, dew is on the grass. A hawk flew past this morning and an owl hooted during the night. I think it is going to be a good day.

    • It is raining now, nature is being refreshed. Good time to sit on the front porch and drink my coffee.

  47. A new thread started less than an hour ago by one Ripsaw on the chase chat has stated “the treasure has been found” with no further comment or any verification…

    Guess we’ll have to wait ans see if this is another “sure thing” or not once again…

    • Oh, great! Here we go again. It never ends…just “breaks” in between. One of these days it will be true, though…because of me I hope! I just hope it isn’t true at this very moment because of Ripsaw.

      • Surely if someone found the chest / title they wouldn’t post it. Only Forrest should post when it’s found then we will all know the truth at that particular time.

        • Hi, Amy. Agreed. I think it would be a dumb move for the finder to say anything to anyone without talking to Forrest first. He has put more thought into this than anyone. It’s his brain child, after all. I’m sure he has it all planned from Alpha to Omega.

          • I agree, I would hope Forrest would pay a finders fee and then hear about the chest at Smithsonian Museum for the rest of us to look at 😉

          • I think whoever finds has the right to do whatever they want. But I do agree consulting forrest and discussing it over a drink is the appropriate thing to do. But FF is swamped by email and other contact. So a good way to get his attention would be to blast a pic of his Jade bracelet on your wrist and the TC in the photo on Social Media. Then FF would come to you….

  48. Beautiful sunny day! Also sitting on the patio having a cup of coffee and piece of homemade peach pie! You all have been busy chattin’ up the 9 clues this week! Going to take a while to catch up. Have a great day!

    • It is raining here in West Central Florida. But I enjoy sitting on the porch sipping coffee ( or an adult beverage ) and listening to the rain on a tin roof. 🙂

        • JC,
          no tats on me lol. However…you do “not” want to pass out at one of my get togethers :mrgreen:
          We do have fish fry`s from time to time with shrimp as well as scallops.
          We have swings hanging from the oak trees and rocking chairs on the porch.

      • My grandparents barns had tin roofs. I lived with them for several years and loved to be in the barns during rain. The barns would creak, every now and then one of the doors would slam its frame, the rain on the tin roof. If it was not for the dim bulbs, you could forget what century you were in.

  49. Rick
    Me too! When I was young i would sit on our front porch and enjoy the lightning and thunderstorms that would blow through!

  50. IMO

    the type of person who would falsely claim to find the trove isnt capable of solving the poem

    when the person with the wits and ingenuity to figure this thing out does find it, they will either keep it quiet, or they will decide to let people know and there won’t be any games. it won’t be like this

  51. Thank you for sharing Forrest. In the big picture…….stories like this are so much more important than gold. Here lies the true treasures!

    *This whole thing has to do with US history and Religion*
    *The Clues of the poem are located all over the US*
    1)Forrest mentions Philadelphia specifically a few times in his book.
    -He flew over Philadelphia, The George Washington painting(Washington was in and around Philadelphia during revolutionary war)
    2)The shape of Delaware County PA is shaped like a triangle, like the triangle on the 1 dollar bill, with G. Washington on the front. at the tip of the triangle, where the all seeing eye is are names of woody sounding street names (northwoods, woods ln, oak grove ect., there are many more examples) and a road near the tip is called “Gypsy ln” like Forrest listening to Gypsies in his book.
    3)At the tip of Delaware County is Valley Forge Military Academy, Which is the School J.D. Salinger went to school, and based the school in “The Catcher in the Rye” off of. The book Forrest mentions at the beginning of TTOTC.
    4)A inscription at one of Valley Forge National Park says something like “In this valley of the shadow of death….” Like the shadow on the cover of his 2nd book, the “mistake” Clue.
    5)Forrest grew up in Temple Texas, Like Temple University in N. Philly.
    6)Forrest about taking in an animal that was getting thinned out by the federal government, like the deer at Valley Forge Park
    1)The number 55 is mentioned many times in TTOTC, go look at all the numbers in and see if you see the number 55 all over. It is also the price of the 2nd book. Look page 55 in “Flywater” a book he mentions, it is a river called “WARM springs run”, or something like that, in IDAHO.
    2)The weight of the chest is 42 pounds. Now that is on purpose. 42 is the answer of the universe in a movie, the number appointed to God according to Jewish tradition and the number of months the devil will reign over the Earth according to Christian beliefs.
    *The clues are all over the US, and Philadelphia is a VERY important part of it*

    -if anyone has questions or thoughts please send me an email at vf2philly55@gmail.com

    • I kinda think he uses ‘Philadelphia’ in the WAR FOR ME chapter because it means Brotherly Love. Relating to his band of brothers in Viet Nam, and the conclusions he draws for us by from thumb experience.

      • Maybe,
        But along of the lines of this being connected to religion, 7)Philadelphia is one of the 12 cities in the book of Revelations.

          • don’t be sorry, at least you responded. I bet most people that see that post will think I am a tad crazy….

        • IN Forrest’s book TFTW is a map of the states in the Rockies where he said the treasure is hidden. I’m confused, what does Philadelphia or any of the places you mentioned, have to do with the treasure being in the Rockies? Does WWWH begin in the East for you?

          • I believe I said that “the clues are all over the US and Philadelphia is VERY important”
            8)the ROCKies, like ROCKY Balboa? The greatest boxer of all time?

          • 9)”3 can keep a secret, if 2 of them are dead” a quote from Benjamin Franklin, a Philly man, that is in TTOTC

          • Hollywood and FF?
            1)the Movie ‘Dazed and confused’ there is a scene of a black teacher talking to kids about Viatnam, then the kids slid down a rusty slide, like Forrest did in his youth
            2)the movie ‘Forrest Gump’ a story about a simple southern man who becomes a war hero and gets famous, Like Forrest
            3)the song ‘simple man’ by lenyard skynard, read the lyrics as it says “dont chase after the rich mans gold”…..
            there are many other songs about chasing after a rich mans gold.

          • my point is CJ that I am adding my 2 cents and being positive. Instead of just trying to shoot down what others have to offer….
            William FF said he was not religious, but he also says he embellish’s the truth a lot, so you CAN NOT believe anything he says. Also there is a lot of mention of omega mark on this blog, like alpha and omega, what God said he is.

          • I’m just bouncing ideas around. It is a different way to look at it, I’m more on science cause I like to think of myself as a realist. You might believe that the sun rises in the east and sets in the west, but I know for a fact the sun is a stationary object and in fact the earth rotates west to east.

          • CJ…
            surely there is a sandwich shop somewhere in the Rockies that sell Philly Cheese Steak sandwiches…that is the kind of sandwich you take with you on your search… :mrgreen:
            Sorry…I could not resist.

          • Forrest did say to bring a sandwich. 🙂

            We all have our different interpretations of the clues and take different hints from the stories, and I do enjoy reading all the ideas people have. Some ideas are easier to understand than others but I try to see how they fit in with what I remember Forrest saying in the books, on the blog, and interviews. My head is getting full with all that info though! 🙂

          • Fiorrest stated he was not religious but a spiritual man. So that’s 2 different words here. I feel spiritual is way better than relegious. 🙂

          • William I replied to your comment above, I saw your pic, do you like paintball?

          • His church is in the mountains and along the river banks where dreams and fantasies alike go to play…

          • Philly

            This is Amy

            Further down its supposed to say
            Do u not believe Forrest Hid the chest?

          • William-
            I am sorry to hear that…As a kid I used to play in the woods near my house, good times. Wish I had people to go to poco loco with(paintball arena near my house).
            I do not know if FF hid the treasure or not? who knows? I think that he would be at least honest enough to not lie about that.

    • cluesfromPhilly –

      Now please, tell me you have been working on this for more than two days.

      Brilliant deductions. You have single handily given us a breath of fresh air and a new way to look at things. Congrats !

      • I wish it was just 2 days, more like 400 :(….
        Thank you very much! I hope you find the treasure with this new insight!

        • Philly –

          Do you have an area selected?

          I also believe Hollywood is involved – in more ways than one. He’s given many hints in that direction – many in his scrapbooks.

          • I think the tip of Delaware County in PA is a very important part of this chase, where VF military academy is and where JD salinger went to school and wrote about in catcher in the rye.
            I believe hollywood and politicians are involved as FF has said he knows a lot of politicians and other famous and rich (like really rich Rockafeller rich) types.

        • Maybe just a whisper –

          I think it would be very limiting to say that every “hint” to the chase would have to be in a certain area. I have been all over the world in my armchair explorations

          If we are talking “clues” yes, a limited area..

          • my thoughts exactly….he said north of santa fe in the rocky mountains, Could it be in the moutiains that rocky balboa trained in in one of his movies?

          • Inthechase, just to be clear : I haven’t seen any evidence that would limit where the 9 CLUES might be. The TFTW book’s map is only a map limiting where the Chest is. For all we know, WWWH is Death Valley, CA…. Or Antarctica.

          • If the TFTW map is where the TC is, that includes Santa Fe, which may be why he didn’t specify north of Santa Fe, NM?

          • Dam, that just blew my mind. That is what I get for going to work and not following the meat of this post.


            very cool thoughts, and def nice fresh air as inthechaseto mentioned. Map, it is also cool how you are so logically rational regarding the possibility that the clues could very well be outside the tftw map. Maybe this will help me. Def going to dig on it.

            Now I hear the trumpets of the Rocky song. ba bah bah ba bah bum bah bum as my search date gets closer. September is the month it gets found.


    • Philly

      Good job I have researched over a 1 1/2 .
      We share a few thoughts.
      Although I can not share my thoughts at this time but Forrest knows where I search and what I think it’s all about.
      I feel that I’m close 🙂 !!!!!

      • Keep searching! But why not share your thoughts? if it is of you wanting to keep the treasure to yourself, that will only hurt you in the end…..
        I gave all that I know about this chase, why not do the same? maybe someone can elaborate on one of your ideas and that will lead you to the chest?

        • Philly

          If I were to share my clues ,my location everyone might be there tomorrow searching. So I cannot share at this time I have researched and thought way to much .

          Remember it’s the Chase 🙂

          • LOL, I told my buddy that yesterday. However, there is a part of me that really wants to share my solve and be done with the chase. After this one search I will chase no more. Either way this has changed me for the good in so many ways. There’s your treasure buddy.

          • Keep it quiet. I live in the middle of Colorado and could be anywhere in the state in less that 6 hrs. I would search your spot. Haha.

          • Too close rick to say, have said things in the past but do not want the cover blown…. But if you see a group fishing that could be us!!

          • Navy,
            I hope that you are fishing below the correct HOB and no I do not mean trout either.

        READ “The underground railroad” By William Still…. Read around pg 550 there is a chapter called “In the woods” and read a few chapters before and after that one…. A lot of the poem is in those chapters!! GOOD LUCK!!

        • make sure you get the authentic long copy! This book holds the secrets of the poem!!! Hurry up now the information is out!! William Still was a black abolitionist from Philly, and the poem is contained within those chapters near “In the woods”

          • Thanks for that info Philly –

            Where I think FF hid the treasure – has “wood” in the name. There ya’ll have a little hint.

          • Im sure you can…My library had a copy, intothechaseto said they downloaded it…. you might want to ask them how they did that? Its very important part of the chase and I dont want you to miss out.

          • Philly-
            It’s only an important part of the chase to you and those who think like you. Forrest already told us the important items..The Poem and for added fun TTOTC and maybe a good map…
            So please tone it down a notch…

    • The river in Idaho should be “Warm River”. Your lack of precision is a worry.

  53. Does the First Word mean anything thing to you all. There is a trail association. Has anyone else figured this out?

    First Word Focus :o)

    • FWF, if one goes by the way of logic with your question (if there is a clue in the first word), then that would have to warrant a “yes” answer. FF has said (paraphrasing) that a few searchers have got the first two clues correct and still went right by the chest. Hense, if the first word is a clue, it would be the first clue and in turn a few searchers have got the first clue correct. Follow the logic? Keep in mind all of this is IF there is a clue in the first word. One could think there’s a clue where one does not exsist. Of course this is all IMO. Maybe you should ask f your questions. F would know one way or the other. Meanwhile, good luck on the hunt.

      • The first word of poem is AS
        How do u recognize anything from that word?
        I feel that following the poem has put me at the bottom now I have to find the blaze, thanks for wishing me luck. I will be back soon to my location:)

  54. Has anyone made the link between the first word in the poem and a famous trail that has an historical BLAZE? :o)

    First Word Focus

    • Let’s see the first word in poem is

      AS so how would u get a trail out of that word 🙂

      • Read the lyrics of that song.
        But the video I found was horrible lol unless it was the wrong video. Anyway 🙂 some can see the light 🙂

      • The Rio Grande has over eighty miles of trout water from where it crosses the Colorado State line into New Mexico and continues south. Beyond the Taos County line, the river becomes more of a warm water fishery, home to mostly Smallmouth Bass and Carp, plenty of fun on a fly rod.

        – Put in below the home of Brown. Brown trout, fish hatchery in Red River, NM or a measuring station where Brown LL did some research on streams, GAGING STATIONS ARE BROWN HOUSES

  55. Finding the TC is simple follow the clues literally in consecutive order. The complicated part is that every clue has hundred’s/thousand’s of possibilities. He chose his words/clues to have the greatest number of possible possibilities to increase the difficulty as much as he could. But if you find the first clue correctly, all the others are nearby and will fall in place.

    All it takes is a smart person and some luck and the dedication to take it to the finish line.

    Cyphers, metaphors, numerology, etc… will make you run circles around yourself.

    Stick to the poem. Occam’s Razor

    Only my opinion…

  56. I thought Forrest was supposed to give out clues on the Morning Show. Did he say is was not doing that any longer?

    First Word Focus

  57. I just want to see the mountains. To watch the clouds break upon them. The storms coming across the valleys. The wide rivers that nourish the plains. To walk under the majestic trees.

    • That sounds peaceful…but you left out watch the wildlife graze upon the meadows as the smell of wildflowers scent the air around you…

    • what answer did I give you? and Did you see my comments regarding the book? look up there are 2 with regards to it.

  58. the book by William Still, a black abolitionist from philly, “The underground railroad”, contains many of the same sentences from the poem in and around the chapter “into the woods” around pg 550 in the long version. Look it up and it might lead you directly to the chest…..

    • There really are an amazing number of coincidences — like the RLS poem titles all hidden in there when I thought it was all about that one shipwreck on his namesake island, the anagrams spelling out names of his good friends, the number codes that match FZf’s birthday / street address/etc, the political/current event and environmentalism metaphors — we, as s group, see a lot of saints in so little burnt toast 😉

      • hey mapsmith,
        Thanks, I read that book a few months ago but was afraid to share because I though people would think I was crazy to think that the clues/treasure could not be related to the Philly area….

  59. Philly –

    I’ve download the book from Guttenberg – but it doesn’t have page numbers – so could you give me a hint as to what section it would be in ?? Thanks

        • Well of course it’s an interesting book and of course a sad time in our history. Sorry but I don’t see specific hints to anything other than a few words that are the same. In particular the use of the word “tarry” which was used more in those times than now. That’s not to say I may have missed something.

  60. Just catching up on the day’s posts. The Philadelphia connection doesn’t seem to fit my current solution, but last year I was working on some ideas that might be relevant to anyone developing a solution along those lines. Here are some of the things from my notes:

    Freedom seems to be a favorite theme.

    p. 26 – “That’s when I first started to mistrust governments.”
    Olga Svoboda translates to “Blessed Freedom”.

    “Making plans is antagonistic to freedom”

    p.78 – “The ‘freedom plane’ was to take me home in just four days, on the 24th of December, 1968.

    FF reciting the poem “Invictus” which is a declaration of individual freedom and self-reliance:
    “I am the master of my fate:
    I am the captain of my soul.”

    Students are warned by their authoritarian teachers “DO NOT TOUCH”. FF defiantly invites them to touch the expensive portrait. The portrait is of George Washington who fought for freedom from tyranny. The portrait is the mirror image of the portrait found on our modern dollar bill. The government in “Washington” has reversed the ideals that George Washington embraced.

    Also the question why? is asked in line 17 of the poem and page 76 of the book. 1776.

    Also read his statement on Forrest Makes Comment page of this blog concerning the arrest of the searcher digging a hole.

  61. Night has fallen. A pack of coyotes were yipping as they followed the river in search of their nightly feast. The neighborhood dogs always go crazy when they hear the coyotes.

    • It’s also night here in Northern MN and the eerie calls of the loons are echoing across the lake as a few boats drift slowly by fishing for walleye.

  62. Wolf I missed your survey but I would like to go with Colorado in September! Colorado is aBlaze with GOLD in September!

  63. when i find the chest i will definitely yell ‘yo Adrian!!’ very loudly, that will be the team call. ty Philly for the inspiration that is making me move forward, you must nevrmind the mindstuck grumps. soon soon not soon enough

    Here is another hint that Philadelphia, PA might have something to do with this chase…..
    10)The picture of the chest, with the lid open…..look at the symbol where the key hole is, it sure looks like a KEYSTONE to me, like the KEYSTONE state, PA.

    • Quoting Forrest : “All of the information you need to find the treasure is in the poem. The chapters in my book have very subtle hints but are not deliberately placed to aid the seeker. Good luck in the search.”

    • Philly, are ou locked in the basement? reading by candle light? Your experience with the wide world of real coincidences seems limited. You need to get out more.

    • Michael, a metal detector big enough to detect it from a distance is just not economically viable, lol.

    • Sally –

      I assume you are talking about the frogs eye – p133. There are a couple of ways you can look at that. Straight – it is a “M”. Upside down – a W.

      Second way – take the drop letters (in brown) from the start of the chapter and add them up

      You get

      ” I ” “A” and then the “M” in the frogs eye

      Adds up to – I am

      I believe page 132 is the most important page in the book. 🙂

        • Hi Sally,
          Just for fun here’s some more “w” connections: the letter at the “end of my rainbow” is “w”. “Where Warm Waters” – that’s a lot of w’s. The double omega looks like a w upsidedown. The UU in the UU Bar Ranch, kind of looks like a “w” (& sounds like “w”). In that really funny old movie, “It’s a Mad, Mad World” that treasure was found under a “w”.
          Don’t take my comments too seriously – I’m mostly just having fun with this search. However, whenever I see a tree shaped like a “w” – you can be sure that I look down quickly!! hee hee.
          Have fun and enjoy every minute!

      • So, you have revealed that page 132, the page where the poem is, is the most important page in the book, in your opinion. I will need to crawl into a cave/ well/ cistern and digest all that for a while.

        Takin’ a break…. peace all

        Alan M.

  65. Philly,
    Your clue set seems heavily reliant on historical events. I’m sure you are aware of F’s Q&A statement:
    “Mr. Fenn, Is there any level of knowledge of US history that is required to properly interpret the clues in your poem. ~Steve R

    No Steve R,
    The only requirement is that you figure out what the clues mean. But a comprehensive knowledge of geography might help.”

    Also, I have not heard how the Philly clues would tie back to a location of the TC in the Rocky Mt’s….. how do you get there? IMO, It would seem that politics, hollywood, history, and famous figures are of little use if they don’t eventually get you to the area where the TC is known to be.

  66. Philly

    Called Barnes and noble they don’t have the book they have to order it .it would take 7 days to get it in. I will be searching before that. I could check with our towns library.
    Otherwise u can tell me what it’s about. 🙂 !!!!!

    • oh your going to have to search your self! but the books expensive, ill look it up what it says. it just has a few lines from the poem in it, around “in the woods” chapter. But Dal told me to cool it with regards to that book, so i dont know if i should share or not. but on another note…..

      look at the chest while it is open, do you see the shape of the symbol where the key goes in? it sure lookes like a KEYSTONE symbol, the state symbol for PA.

      • Not to shoot down the Keystobe theory, because really , it’s got as much going for it as any other theory, but the chest predates the United States, including PA’s state symbol, by about 600 or 700 years…

        I kinda like the Pennsylvania involvement /discussion though, as it readily supports a certain ‘game’ themed theory, which I’ve always thought had just the right balance of whimsy for FF.

    • yes maybe the treasure is in a very old tree, but that wouldnt make sence with the whole 1000 year stance F has taken….
      I reread the book and I was wrong to point you guys to it, for that I am sorry, I thought there was more to it….

      But Amy did you notice the KEYSTONE on the chest? like PA’s KEYSTONE state symbol?

    • Amy –

      Just to let you know the way I make as sure as possible that I am on the right track – I have to find a hint three ways from Sunday before it is added to my solve. Hint’s lead to clues and if I cannot relate it back to the book or the poem – it is toast. I may just sit on it awhile and perhaps something else will come along to make it real.

      Of course, I could be so wrong. 🙂

  67. Reread the poem again and again,
    Until you find the clues locked within.
    No need to search until you’ve discovered
    A word that is key as well as a key word.
    Why it’s not impossible but it will be hard?
    And uncover a chest or a bell or a jar.
    Yes, of course they are out there where else could they go,
    Where his family and friends and his conscience won’t know?
    Is the poem all you should need for the chest,
    True, some subtle hints may help with the rest.
    Hear me all and look very closely,
    I am toying with you a little but serious mostly.
    Today we read left to right but not down,
    !Oy Vey ! turns a smile to a frown.

  68. Wise words from Yogi Berra (to the young ones–no, that isn’t the same as Yogi Bear):

    “90% of the game is one half mental”

    “If you don’t know where you’re going, you might not get there”

    “if you come to a fork in the road, take it”

    “You can observe a lot by watching”

    and finally: “Experience is a great thing–everyone can learn from it.”
    Thanks Forrest for learning us all of your experience!

  69. Has anyone taken a screen shot of the wherewarmwatershalt.com website and then played with it on Photoshop? You can see a whole lot more than CE5. I can make out a star in the upper left corner, an S below it, and also and X a little to the right of the S. There are a lot of little graffiti type petroglyh things sprinkled all over. Below the day, I think I can make out PETE and a little to the right of that JEFF. Lol. Don’t know what any of it means, but I’m trying to go through web pics of rock graffiti and petroglyphs to see if any of it matches.

  70. Also, to give you an idea of how many times a word is repeated in TTOTC, the word, well or cistern or pothole with water in it is used 12 times, and I may have skipped a few.

    • James- Do you have a PDF or OCR’ed copy of TTOTC? I am about to undertake a project to scan and OCR my own copy of TTOTC so I can search for words, but if I could get a copy from someone else, then I would be very grateful.

  71. Off Topic:
    Updated the Media Coverage page to eliminate broken links. This page contains links to video, audio and written interviews and stories with Forrest going back several years. It’s a good resource.

    My favorite is the EIS audio interview. Forrest says things in that interview I have not heard him say elsewhere.

      • Brian just sent this about Hayden:

        He’s doing great!

        He is walking without a walker. It is labored, but he’s doing it… We hope to have him back to school mid-this-week or next week.

        The biggest things bothering him are the 2 fractures in his pelvis and the fracture in his right collar bone… He has 2 fractures in his orbital bone and sinus, but they don’t seem to be bothering him much…

        The prayers have definitely helped… It is unreal to think that he’s moving around and OK… It’s like witnessing a miracle how much he has progressed day to day…

        Thank you for your support and the searchers’ support as well through these trying times…


      • To me it sounds like Hayden is a little Superman. Amazing! Mom and Dad know Who to thank I’m sure.

      • Sounds like a rephrasing of the Lewis Carroll quote,
        ” If you don’t know where you’re going, any road will get you there.”

        • maybe a subtle hint that the proper trail can be identified with confidence

          Rule #26

          26 is where we ‘begin’ in the poem. perhaps another subtle hint, we need to know where to begin, we need to know the area, before trying to put together a ‘trail’ of clues

          otherwise there are thousands of trails that could be connected, none of them meaningful, if you really want to find the treasure

          • In the context of his response, I would interpret this to mean that caution is only called for if you’re worried about the consequences. Not a hint IMO.

          • Sounds like you have to get lost on a trail to get lost in the area required to find a adventure/chest

          • No more like the end of a trail would be my guess. He stated somewhat that the treasure wasn’t near a human trail and now with the new statement on Jenny’s Kile site about any trail will take you there.

          • Please tell me where I can find Forrest saying something like: no human trail is in close proximity . . . Thanks! I have looked and looked for where Forrest made this statement, and just can’t find it. Thanks!

          • For Golden Retrievers…

            Go to Jenny Kile’s site “mysterious Writings”, (link at bottom of this page)…

            On the right look for “Questions with Forrest”…page down to entry on 6-28-2014, a question asked by Buddy…

            The statement is at the end of Forrest’s answer.


    • A big enough hammer and anything will fit, but the result might not be what you were going for.

  72. the more i think about the treasure, i think about the possibility of me owning it. i want to have it.

    am i being selfish? 🙂

    to be truly free, sometimes you have to be colorful

    author unknown

    • I just want the opportunity to try out my solution. First it was my son is too young to travel that far, then it was money, and now it looks like I have torn a tendon in my ankle. Seems the fates are against me. It just makes me want to tempt the fates and steal the eye of the Graeae.

  73. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with being hungry. Someone deserves to find the chest, why not you ?

  74. This is ALL just my humble opinion!!

    To any newbies out there. While I enjoy this blog immensely, I believe many on this blog may be reading too much into FF’s scrapbooks and comments, etc. I suggest you begin where we all should begin….at the beginning. Don’t cloud your mind with all the noise that comes from this blog. Forrest himself has stated all you need is the poem. Keep it simple, get a grasp on the content of the book and poem. Ease into the sucking vortex that is this blog. As entertaining, enlightening, and addictive as this blog is…it will steer you in directions your own mind would never go…not always bad….but very bad for beginners!!

    • MD that is why i am at the saloon drikin cold beer and listenin to good live country music. Maybe I will talk to this girl I used to work with years ago. I don’t envy you folks with no solid solution. Im keeping this country simple, which don’t mean stupid.

      • Navyigator, let me get this straight; you’re interrupting listening to good music, drinking cold beer, and eyeballing a good looking gal………to comment on this blog.

        Beam me up Scotty no sign of intelligent life here.

        • lol GoG, yes I did manage to drink, cheers many cheers, get the attention of the girl on the other side of the bar, dance fun, dance close, and lightly kiss, stop a fight, smile, drink many, watch johhny football lose, slow dance, post to this awesome blog i luv, pay for drinks, pee a four times, and catch up with 5 diff old friends. Btw she is so pretty and took the lead a couple times. ….. dang i just am loving listening to ‘get your kicks on route 66’. feelin a lil bit like capn jim; a lil underestimated but i will come out on top, ‘Thank Yoou goof e y Oold guy’ … (william shattner voice)

    • I concur…. imho I’ll add through simple deduction NM is out of the equation too 😉

    • Hi MIchael, I heard a interview with forrest and he was saying to read the poem over and over and try to find things in the Thrill of the Chase book that match? or have things to do with the poem. Something like this. I remember him saying something like this.

    • Michael D,
      IMO you are correct; however, I hasten to admit that I have gotten a couple of ideas about how to interpret some of the poem’s hints from the blog. Now, back to that poem again…

  75. jc you remind me of this insecure guy i work with, just full of a lot of quirky quips that amounts to nuttin but toolishness.

  76. OK chasers here it is, my solve

    I am over it and done with the chase. If my solve is correct good luck because this will truly become a chase.

  77. WWWH, this is where we must remember the Tomicita moment. Forrest posted her email in the scrapbooks because I believe this was a point he did want this chase to be over, just as I do. So he actually gave us WWWH in this post. However, being crafty, he knew that her story would lead to Ouray, CO and create a smokescreen to the true wwwh (sb 67). But not much earlier (sb 62) we were tossed for a loop about dams. This was all just a part of a preemptive clue/barrage.

    Chief Ouray died in Ignacio, CO and his body was hidden shortly after and then years later exhumbed for proper burial. In the Ouray mermorial cemetary is an honorary memorial grave to him and his wife (two white triangular tower.. GE them, they are quite serene). This my friends IS where warm waters halt. Chief OUray was the leader of the northern Utes, the Uncompahgre UTES, oooh do you see the UU’s? And when he died so did the Utes, more paticularly the Uncompahgre. Which translates to warm water and this is where our warm water halts. He was a rich of old.

    Take it in the canyon down…. lets talk about ‘it’, it is something, something indeed, but what? Well to find it you must look for it. I personally found it while reading the ‘what is it’ post. Remember you must read the poem over and over to understand what it is saying. While doing so for the one millionth time I realized it was what ever the wood was. If you are brave and in the wood, where he went in there alone, the begining and the end is all at the wood. So what is the wood? well it is that key word most of you have been discussing. Without wood you cannot have my solve. Because without it you can not work backwards and forwards in this place/path.

    So if you are at Ouray’s grave there is one river that flows right by, the Los Pinos. And guess which way it flows? South, almost due south! Till it hits what in now Navajo Lake, NM. Take ‘it’ in the canyon down, NFBTFTW…. not far but too far to walk? hmmm… someone here gave me the too far to = 2far2 =22 ….22 miles south? obtw… the Navajo endured a cruel act of enprisonment when they forced to march south from the four corners area to southern NM aka The Long Walk.. not far, but too far to walk is a beautiful metaphor to say no one should be treated like this, especially in their home land where they all started….. where did Navajo life began anyways? Was is close to Navajo Lake, I think so, out there on the knob.

    So who is following my stuper and realizes ‘it’ is the wood. And as we go not far 22 miles we are in Navajo lake. But this is when we need to remember the wood of old and where it use to lie, or still lays despite being covered up by Nav Lake, a new riches.

    Now we must put in below the home of Brown. Who is brown, well brown is a few, brown is the Apache mostly but all the natives that roamed that land for many centuries before that lake existed. From the first natives to the last modern ones (Apache), that lake was home to many people for may years but lastly the Apache of Rosa and Ariboles. Their land was taken and submerged to make way for new ways and progress. So if you put in to the wood ‘the los pinos’ you put in right before the San Juan of old intersects the los pinos of old. If you have a good map you may be able to see these lines, also usgs topo maps at 4x out from min will also display these particular old river routes.

    Now if you do put in ‘below’ the home of Brown that will be quite deep, 400′ at some depths from what i hear. And believe it or not a great segway to a place not for the meek. These poor people in the 50’s and 60’s never stood a chance against big brother, they were too poor, too meek to fight the giant at their door. BTW there is now a marina filled with million dollar house boats… still no place for the meek.

    but befo4 i get to ‘the end’ i would like to point out an awesome angle of duality. If you go directly south of Ouray’s grave 21 miles, it that too far to walk, just one mile shy, you actually put in in texas hole, which lies in the most premier trout headwaters in north amereica.

    • Navy –

      I own a houseboat on Navajo Lake. I can assure you it is not worth a million dollars to anyone else but me. I am pretty familiar with the area. It sits over 300′ feet of water – I know because my husbands cell phone is at the bottom.

      Many homes, to include those of some Indians are now at the bottom of that lake – as others states needed that good Colorado water. It was a sad scenario.

      The lake area was one of my first thoughts in the chase, but as Navajo was created by a dam, I ruled that out. I did consider the outlet – below the dam, which is a superb trout fishing river – but what would capitalized Brown be? A trout – I don’t think so. And as I thought about WWWH – only really cold water goes into that lake and out of it.

      I think you are headed in the right direction – good luck.

    • It makes me sad everyday, what happened to the REAL americans. This solve is great work. I am sure Forrest thinks so too. Thank You. Let us not forget what horrific murder that the Whites put on the TRUE Americans, and their Lands. Our Brown Brothers and Sisters.

  78. I know this has been discussed before but maybe some new discussion is warranted in light of some of Forrest’s more recent statements. I keep thinking about his statements that searcher’s have been within 500′, 200′, and 50′. If someone correctly solved the poem and got that close, why were they not able to find the chest? Granted, it could be because the chest is there and so cleverly hidden that it is just difficult. But could it be because they are looking for the chest? I have to get to work so i don’t have time right now to dig out his exact words, but did he ever say that they were that close to “the chest”? Or did he say they were within that distance with no reference to what was that close?

    But what if he meant they were that close to finding the chest? Maybe the correct solution leads to the final clue that tells you where to take the chest and go in peace. Or that it leads you to the actual “title to the gold”.

    So if you solve the poem and go to the place it leads, you can’t find the chest there, but there may be something there that tells you exactly where to go. Maybe an inscription on the bottom of a rock or maybe something on one of his bronze bells that says something like “buried 24 inches at ———–“. Or maybe the final cryptic clue for you to figure out.

    The poem will still have led directly to the treasure. If you found the final clue on federal or private land, then the owner of the land has ownership of what you found there and you can give it to them once you get the treasure, wherever it is.

    Forrest says:
    “I said on the Today show that the treasure is not associated with any structure. Some people say I have a desire to mislead. That is not true. There are no notes to be found or safety deposit boxes to be searched. The clues can lead you to the treasure, and it will be there waiting when you arrive.”

    Would an inscription on a rock, a piece of wood, or something bronze, be considered “a note”? Maybe, maybe not. Just some thoughts.

    • Jack you are a smart guy. What state or government agency issues a “title” for gold? That’s right NONE. There is no such thing. Just because ff put a line in a poem doesn’t make it real. Maybe he is going to give someone “the title” to his gold car that he calls “treasure.” Are you trying to distract from Navy? His solve sounded like he wrote it after 12 beers.

    • Being a contrarian here, but fyi:
      He’s also said that there’s no proxy, that the poem does lead you to the chest. While I believe there could be something else there Also*, I cannot believe this man would violate the Code of the West with such an untruth.
      *= there could be a bronze piece or inscribed Rock, in addition to the chest, that lets the second place poem solver know they weren’t quite the winner — this is one of my (many) theories on ‘how does FF know if the chest has been found?’, and one that would help searchers know if its over even 100 yrs from now. He never said that the ONLY things he took, in those two trips from the car, was gold and chest….

      Also, he never said that the people that were ‘close’ (500′ is the only reliable quote I’ve seen, just to be clear… the 200′ comment was from a reporter who couldn’t even quote the name of FF’s book correctly) had solved the poem, as you suggest. Sometimes he doesn’t even say they’re TTOTC searchers.

    • Jack said

      If someone correctly solved the poem and got that close, why were they not able to find the chest?

      Jack, Forrest gave us the answer to this question. he said those who have been closest didnt know they were close

      so they didnt solve the poem. and they didnt know it was there. if they did they would have come back, kept searching there and found it

      i said this before, the first time someone goes to that right place, and knows it is there, and has solved the poem, they are going to find it

      • another thing to consider. if people who got close didnt know it. it may be they got close on the way to somewhere else. so they never really knew the spot they needed to look, but still they did get close, just didnt know it

        • That has always been my thought. Mindy says below that the chest is 300 feet from a road. So any searcher in the area on that road going somewhere else would be within 300 feet and not know it.

        • Good point. If you haven’t found the treasure, then you haven’t solved the poem.

          I just wonder if solving the poem leads you to a final clue that then leads you to the treasure. Similar to “National Treasure” or Dan Brown’s novels. It would add another interesting twist and could be a way to insure that it isn’t discovered by accident.

        • Consider this that F concealed his chest so well that it takes X-ray vision to see. Think dragonfly comic character. An electronic aide is necessary IMO

  79. I think some songs by Tom Petty will get you closer than your tape measure. We are all just instruments being played by the master but in the end will you measure up. We all need to be washed but I think God knew fenn would need a real scribing… Just kidding around with Ed. We are 1 for 3 hoping to make it 2 if we can out run Peter.. 🙂

  80. so put in below the home of the brown. well this is where you people need to think. GE yourself into Texas hole and look upstream.

    This is the point you have to realize that the semi colon in stanza 3 is very intentional. When looking up the definition of a semi colon you will see that it refers to the first half as a left boundary and the second half as a right boundary.

    the end is ever drawing nigh… i was torn on this one for awhile. Is this the end of the Los Pinos or is it the end at the damn where the concrete tower draws water everyday every second to provide for agriculture…

    heavy loads and water high.. while standing in Texas hole and look up stream from miracle mile you will see the dam and the mtn wall behind it. which looks like it shows the high water from millions of years ago. But if you notice the over flow ramp could very well be heavy loads(the earthen dam) and top part of the ramp which is generally dry(no paddle up your creek).

    So by looking at the geography this way you are def able to establish some finite points to work with. Now when you connect these points in the right way they for a triangle. A sail, a jib, a peace symbol? oh yes they do. Now the peace symbol points to one particular locale in the area and the other points to a particular spot. These are my two primary search spots. If you go to the one at the end of the peace symbol it will put you atop the mtn south of the dam. Right at the ledge, and of course you look right below the ledge and from above because yes the blaze is the triangle/peace symbol. The blaze south? peace? triangle? ….

    btw begin it … the blaze … the end… in my solves you can draw a line from Ourays grave to the end of the river at the concrete tower and it also gives you a line that cuts right over the ledge as well.

    But on the other side of possibilities, by lining up the left and right boundary points it actually lands you right in/around Texas Hole. Now I am not saying go and tear up this place. This spot is located in “special trout waters” and people fishing should not even move a rock. As to protect to sanctity of the trout’s home, the NM wildlife has made this law. So if you are in the wood(the pine) as the state calls it and brave(brave enough to free dive to the bottom of the river) your effort will be worth the cold (temps in that river range from 40-60). Definitely ice cold. I believe if he put it here it is one heck of a rock case that has two OO marking it, or maybe a ff, or double omega,… But that is what you have to look for if you go to these spots. Who knows maybe I only eight clues and one of you can find number nine.

    good luck all,

  81. I’d be interested to know how many people actually believe a small 42 pound box stands a chance of remaining in the same place in a moving body of water for up to 1000 years?

  82. Well, after about a year of on and off researching, I finally have a specific spot, and it’s in Colorado. In my opinion, which, like many others, could be very, very wrong, but also like many others, I believe it’s not (insert laughter here).


    1. Warm does not mean temperature.
    2. Paddle refers to spanking (in a way).
    3. Meek could mean both Meek and meek (and meek).
    4. Creek is a creek.
    5. Water high is water high.
    6. The blaze is shaped like a blaze you might see on a trail.
    7. Look doesn’t necessarily mean look.
    8. Tarry scant means don’t hang around gawking.
    9. Go in peace means just that.
    Extra info:
    1. It’s about 300 feet away from a road.
    2. It’s in a small space.
    3. Google Earth is very, very helpful.
    4. There are lots of clues in TTOTC.

    Happy searching! I’m taking a trip out in September. I’m looking forward to creating memories with my son, if nothing else.

      • @Chris–There’s one particular story in TTOTC that has a certain word in it repeated two or three times that when researched as I followed the clues I had so far, fit in so tightly I had to check it over and over (maybe 1000 times) to make sure it fit. Lol.

        @Amy–search is good but there’s an even more specific word that will put you in the line of sight. 🙂 search would work though!

          • Amy, I found a “hedge.” 🙂
            That’s the biggest clue I can give without practically handing my spot over on a silver platter. 🙂
            I am from Merritt Island, FL (a real Island of east central FL–directly across state from Rick). I live in New Smyrna Beach now (shark bite Capitol of the world, and yes, I surf), so I might as well be a million miles away from the treasure, but I think that’s what I think will make my upcoming trip so exciting. I’ve been to Colorado before but that was for OTS in the Air Force which might as well be a thousand years in the past. Lol.

          • Mindy

            I understand and thank u for sharing.

            Sounds like fun the beach I bet it’s nice. And do u ever have a trip ahead of u good luck. I search Colorado as well. I have a special place that I search. I leave soon to search for the 5 th time .
            Nothing compared to dal and Stephanie though. 😉

    • Mindy

      I have no idea what u are talking about a hedge and look at the pictures lol. I looked at them some things go right over my head. And I’m trying to figure a poem out. Lol

      • I’ll tell you after sept 4th. Lol. Chances are against me that the chest will be in my spot, but I do feel pretty confident. Time will tell. I’m only going to make one trip, so it’s an all or none thing. 🙂

          • MINDY
            Each time I went to Colorado
            I had so much confidence and still do I feel like I’m the one who is close. But yet I can’t seem to get it together when I’m actually there. But this time Boots on the ground. Right.
            I wish myself a blessing and for everyone else searching. How cool it would be just to have figured the poem out. That is my goal and I’m determined. 🙂

      • Positive. Check it for yourself. Had my wife double check it over my shoulder as well. Page 132 in the book does not match the websit.

      • When it came up before and after Forrest responded that it did not make any difference, it more or less spelled doom for the letter counters and numerology theorists out there.

        • Chris, what conclusion do you draw from what he said?

          Q: Based on the way the clues are solved to this point, it is obvious that every word and every letter are crucial. I was hoping you would be able to clarify which version of the poem is correct. Should the word answer have an S on the end to make it plural? Pehaps this one letter has no bearing on the final solution, but it is something that continually weighs on my mind.

          A: It makes no difference, one of them is only an innocent typo. You can pick which one. f


          • i cant think of any conclusion i would draw from what f said

            logically, i dont see that any numerological approach could be ruled out because of his answer. it doesn’t confirm it, nor does it rule it out

            the problem is that if there is a numerological approach that is correct, we dont know the specific nature of it. if we did, maybe we would understand that the existence of the “s” doesn’t make a difference, or enough of a difference to matter.

            if there is a numerological approach that was only put into the words, then individual letters wouldn’t matter

            we dont really know how to take F’s answer because we dont see or know what he knows. if we know what he knows, his answer may make perfect sense, and not rule out numerology at all

          • Chris-
            If your numerology approach includes counting letters or assigning numerical values to letters than a missing or added “s” changes the outcome. Many numerology based solutions used that approach. Same is true for letter based solutions. An added or lost “s” makes a difference in the words that can be formed. So to me, Forrest’s statement indicates that the letter is insignificant to figuring out the solution. If that is the case than counting letters or rearranging letters to form new words is probably not part of the solution.

            But it wasn’t just me who felt that way. Many of the searchers using that kind of formula gave up when Forrest wrote that statement.

  83. Sure thing clowny 😉

    I wonder if anyone’s made a connection to 42lbs, and the answer to the universe. Maybe he answers that question in his bio….maybe that was the purpose of filling it to that weight. By the way, it was a child who suggested that to me…kind of funny. Maybe the key word he’s had people tell him is fourty-two lol.

      • he said he was just testing us or something

        he said treasure was found but not fenn’s treasure and it was out fault for assuming he meant fenn’s treasure

        gosh i was so embarrased, i thot he meant fenns treasure. you know what they say about assume

        • Yeah, shame on us for assuming that he was talking about Forrest Fenn’s treasure on such a random blog as Forrest Fenn’s Forum Chasechat. The shame is almost unbearable. Ha!

          • Yeah, I guess it was just someone trying to rile people up. Kind of fun to get people talking even if it jump starts a few of our hearts.

          • Stephanie,
            Did you say a few days ago that you are still looking? I think that you also said something about 6 feet. Do you think that Forrest could have meant that you needed to be on a horse, or a horse trail? 2 feet are yours, and 4 feet belong to the horse?
            Very best wishes!

          • Hi Lowi,

            I don’t know about the feet thing.

            I’m out of money….I kept finding ways to figure that out. Not good ways. My husband is going to have to have open heart surgery. I can’t get around that.

  84. You guys better hurry up and get it I leave end of Sept – I feel much more confident then last year. Of coarse I will not be in NM either….

      • I think it could be in CO but I’ll be a bit north of your hunt – even if we don’t find it it’s the rush we feel right now that makes it all worth it. Good luck

  85. Hi All, I’m finding the thought processing interesting as comments I once dismissed now jump to mind. This is IMO, tossing ideas out there. Dal if this post should be at WWH please move it.

    I saw comments concerning waterfalls and a reply something like, ‘make sure it’s misty’. I thought rainbows perhaps.

    Searching ended up at how to save money keeping your pool cool. On list was run a waterfall in to it and another was install a misty thingo (forget what its called). Both cool the pond. Pools at bottom of waterfalls are usually colder. Plus if down in canyon generally cooler too. Tried to find science answer why. Forum-surface water displaced, molecules this n that. Couldn’t work out what the…but others seemed to know why. Forrest likes waterfalls and from searching Forrest has a waterfall which feeds his pond.

    Another comment was Forrest didn’t have to walk the full trail to hide the treasure. I dismissed this at first too. Then those lines from TS Elliot kept playing in mind.
    “We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know it for the first time”.
    I saw a comment that Forrest prefaces his poem with this quote (please correct me if wrong). Sounds like a loop back to the start and then seeing it from a different perspective, like for the first time.
    How to get back to where you begin from poem. Nigh changed from ‘near’ to ‘left’. Picturing going left and returning to waterfall which is falling down in to the canyon this time you are now on a different path. Perspective has changed, like seeing it for first time. Picturing being at a higher altitude than at start and now a treed area, in the wood. The blaze is now visible from here but not before. Look quickly down maybe windy over looking near an edge. Treasure can be seen from this view, back at waterfall, maybe on ledge near top. Tarry scant because you have to return on loop trail back to start to get it. Perhaps no paddle up your creek fits here. Have to get back to start. Too much adrenalin and fear someone else now will get there first. From this view point you realise that the concealed path to this ledge or crevice in rock is such a short distance compared to trail to view point. Forrest did laugh returning to car.
    Plus in poem WWW is surrounded by begin and halt…you start and finish at WWW.

    Hope what I wrote makes sense, that it’s understandable, it’s like writing in circles.

    My two bobs worth for now, cheers.

    • Pip,
      The “path as a circle” concept has been around in various forms for a while. In the Moby Dickens video interview an audience member asked him something to the effect “if you follow the clues will you find yourself looping back?”. He answered “No”. Not sure if this applies to your idea but it’s a good interview if you haven’t seen it.

      • Thank you Marvin I tried to find the question and answer you refer to but couldn’t-using my mobile phone. Will put hearing aids in and try on computer later. Will get back to you. Cheers.

        • the specific wording that was used was “switching back” as in, when you follow the poem path do you find yourself switching back

          in my opinion, Forrest answering no meant specifically that you do not travel back down a path that you’ve already traveled, nor do you ever wind up back at a spot where you’ve already been

          assuming anything beyond that, i think you do at your own risk

          on the video the Q&A is just before 8 minutes

          • Hi Chris, hearings aids in now heard the question and Forrest’s reply, thank you.

            What I did fine interesting was that in answering the question Forrest continues directly with discussing the 2 people who deciphered the 1st 2 clues and went past. To me he follows his thinking from question. He also says the questioner is dangerous. Have noticed he replied to another questioner in this manner re pre-determining the Blaze question.

            Forrest also in answer says No to switching back. I googled switching back- ‘to zig-zag up a steep incline’, makes it easier to ascend. Or is switching back an American term that I’m unaware of? Do switching back and a loop mean the same thing? Is Forrest answering in reference to a loop. Hard to determine IMO.

            Again thanks for making easy for me to find on clip. Cheers.

          • Pip, I was in deep thought and was interrupted by your “switchback.” So, I got to wondering… I’m a “shellback.” Does that count for anything? Now I work with parts that have WOG emblazened on the side! OMG! I think my mind is working on overtime! How can this be? I thought my mind was a straight 40. Oh well, I am 44 yrs old. Maybe that means 4 years of OT. What’s going on here? Dang it… got’s to focus. Bad part is I haven’t even sipped any of my friend’s brew. Karl, I wish you were here. Remember, I’m gluten free. Dang it… focus, focus, Slurbs. Ahhh, breath… maybe I should go back home and re-something-or-other. Please stop using words like “switchback.” It probably makes f think about having a switch taken to his backside. Dang, that use to hurt. Ok, I feel better now. Whew! Sorry Pip. I had to release some thoughts. I feel better now.

    • Pip

      How about concealing the chest in a pool of water say under a beautiful waterfalls. Maybe tarry would apply as in coated the chest with tar as to preserve from the elements. I know here in CO there are lots of canyon pools and waterfall. Any thoughts?

      • Hi STW personally IMO I don’t think it is in water because of Forrests comment about the elements, exposed to fire. Nor hidden behind falls, unless there is a path/ledge behind the fall because of Forrests comment about walking straight up to it. Paraphasing, sorry. What I did find interesting is the science why ponds at bottom of waterfalls are cooler; warm waters halt at some point either in descent or at pond. As for tarry and coating the chest-not decided on this. 50/50 at moment. Forrest does know alot about how and why things can remain overtime and which methods have better results but would it be necessary. I don’t know. Cheers.

        • Yeah but some of these reporters still report its buried so not sure about that comment on fire being able to pass over the chest.

  86. The TS Eliot quote is from Jenny Kile’s 6 questions. I think if you you read his introduction to the quote carefully, you will see that he is referring to the poem rather than the trail to the treasure returning to the place you began. IMO it is also metaphorically referring to his own journey through life. I don’t believe the trail itself is a loop and he seems to confirm that in the interview at Moby Dickens.

    “The person who finds the treasure will have studied the poem over and over, and thought, and analyzed and moved with confidence. Nothing about it will be accidental. T. S. Eliot said:

    We shall not cease from our exploration
    And at the end of all our exploring
    Will be to arrive where we started
    And know the place for the first time”

    • The metaphor of his own life in the TS Eliot quote can be seen in the last two sentences of the book:

      “I feel my life has been a rough draft of the place just ahead where the past will come alive again and all my experiences and friends through the years will meet me at the great banquet table of history. Then there will be no past.”

      • Hi Jack, thanks. Need to listen to clip. I understand the point you make. Once I hear the clip properly and in my mind it negates my idea. I’ll disregard it. Cheers.

  87. I find it interesting that Forrest has made us become more knowledgeable and that we are becoming wise. I believe this was his intent with his poem and books.

    What a smart man he is 🙂

    • I know – I was at best a C student in school – but when I want to know something I dwell….

    • Yes, my eyes are starting to cross.
      But considering the recent comments, I suggest everyone read all of Little Gidding, and not rely on the quote out of its context. In fact, grit your teeth and read the whole Quartet (LG is the last of four). I’d have to check, but I think each one was written in reference to a place.
      Also, on the rainbow issue, I know there are a lot of arcs/smiles/crescents in the stories, and some think it refers to a mist rainbow, or arc of life rainbow, a pot of gold rainbow, but I think it may refer to Peace. I think the first peace symbols were printed on a rainbow background.
      There seems to be a consensus that the theme of the book is Time (past/present/future), but it is also War & Peace… which loops back to Little Gidding. IMO of course.

        • Just take the chest and go in PEACE.
          So why is it that I must GO
          And leave my trove for all to SEEK?

          Read across the last line of the trail, then down the last words of the next two lines:

          Just take the chest and go in peace. Peace go seek.

          Interestingly the last words of the lines above this:

          Nigh creek, high blaze. Cease. Gaze. Peace go seek. Sounds like instructions.

  88. Sometime in the last week or two the countdown clock at http://www.wherewarmwatershalt.com was advanced by precisely 12 hours. It would initially have gone to zero on 8/15/15 at 15:15 hours military time or 3:15 PM conventional time in the Mountain Time Zone. It now will reach zero at 03:15 or 3:15 AM on the same day, suggesting that the change was designed to eliminate the earlier ambiguity. I had assumed that we were to use military time because of the background military jargon.

    This changes the corresponding letter string from 8 15 15 15 15 >>> H O O O O to 8 15 15 3 15 >>> H O O C O, which can be grouped to yield HOO and CO. Perhaps a hint to be wiser about Colorado?

  89. taking what you say at face value, i would guess the original hint was 3:15 and the change was made to make that more clear

    if it hints at what i think, then the number in the boxes is hinting at the same thing

    • tired brain syndrome. been studying fenn’s poem for too long

      i was thinking actually about 415 not 315. that was the time i initially calculated when i first found this site. and that is arizona time

      if i am guessing correctly on the hint, there isn’t any connection to 315 that i can see

      so 415 would be MST, however, and someone correct me if im wrong but i believe most all the rocky mountains would be MDT, an hour later than my time right now

      so to me that makes it more likely hinting at 515

      • Chris-

        It always seemed logical to me to decide between MST and MDT by referring to when the clock runs down, which will be in August of next year.

        A few other VERY long-shot thoughts on the webpage as a whole…

        CE5 in the clouds is for real, I think we agree. This could suggest “See E-5”, hinting about relating letters of the alphabet with their corresponding number, as has been alluded to by astree among others many times.

        Taking the notion of substitution one step further, think about substituting WILCO (the group that recorded the album) for Yankee Hotel Foxtrot, and FF (Forrest Fenn) for 8/22, his birthday. Note also that F+ F = 6 + 6 = 8 + 2 + 2.

        Combining these letters we get WO + CLIFF. The Wizard of Oz + someone named Cliff or a special cliff somewhere?

        Other thoughts: WILCO and HOOCO both end up in CO.

        Along with all of the rest of you I’m sure, I send my best birthday wishes to Forrest on #84 (2 x 42!).

      • Hello Chris, It appears to count down to One “Concept”, doesn’t it? The “Gospel in a nutshell”? …and The Greatest IS Love.

  90. Changing my solve again (I know, I know), but you can’t doggedly hold on to a certain state without 100% proof. The theme of the poem and the book is “Equality.” This will lead you to Ft Defiance in AZ, yes, Arizona. He didn’t say every clue in the poem was on the map. Just the chest. There are two canyons that lead out of Ft Defiance, but you need to take the Canyon Down (Blue Canyon). From something he said in his last scrapbook or vignette or somewhere, he implies 10 miles is too far to walk. And on the Long Walk, the Indians were made to walk 13 hours a day, which is really too far to walk when you’re already starving and mistreated.
    This is where I, and a few others, it seems, gets stumped. I’ve searched all day for a HoB using every synonym possible for Brown, and can’t fins anything but a few Brown Houses much farther to the south, which seems implausible.
    One good thing to look at is the Navajo seal or shield. Very interesting, and a big hint, IMO.
    So, I don’t think my Colorado solve is right, even though it fits.
    I have no doubt and am 100% sure (based on research) that WWWH is Ft Defiance, and canyon down is Blue Canyon. And too far to walk is about 10-15 miles.
    Ugh, now 6 more impossible seeming hills to climb to figure out the rest!
    And I was led to Fort Defiance by discovering that the church in the Bible that was lukewarm was Loadicea. Laodicea translates to “people’s rights” or more loosely, “equality,” which is a central theme in his books covering every angle, from the rights of Native Americans, to Women’s Rights and Feminism, to mentioning another oppressed people more than a lot…the Jewish People.
    So, those are my thoughts today, which may change by tomorrow at the rate I’m going. Lol.

    • Mindy, Mindy, Mindy…you are so sweet. I enjoy hearing the gears churn inside your head. Let me please welcome you back to Colorado by informing you that Glenwood Springs was originally named Defiance. It is way to hot in AZ so please come vist CO.

    • You silly, the theme of the poem is riddle me this, and Forrest is the joker. A good solve should include elements of humor. He wasn’t just laughing when he walked back to his car, he was laughing when he thought of the clues, and is laughing when he writes some of these posts. Why did the Biddies cross the road? Two get to the graveyard is a possible answer.

      • If anyone has any idea about the beer in the purse, white Saint Bernards and doves- throw me a bone or some millet seed, please. That one’s driving me nuts.

        • purse=female
          beer=someone who drinks
          zip lock=zip it….

          I think they might be the same person as the big mouth bass.

          Someone told me about a new book series by James Frey(million pieces author). 3 books with riddles totaling 3 million dollars. One of the inventors of Ingress helped design parts of it. Have a friend who turned me onto Ingress…it’s a neat thing. I don’t think you have to leave your home to figure out the key.

          There’s a video on chasechat.com somewhere that someone posted about it done from a comic con panel. Seems pretty cool.

          • Oktoberfest has the #8 oct, beer, and according to Wikipedia is celebrating 200 years?
            Now I’ll have to look up James Frey, that sounds really cool!

            Thanks Stephanie!

        • I wondered about the “white Saint Bernard ” also, no such thing .lol So many of those oddities to look at .

          • historically speaking, the st. benards of today are quite the same as the original st. benards.

          • Another reason I think those are deliberate hints. I’m trying to figure out that one, too. How many white topped mountain (15ers) in each state vs how many small ones. I see it as a large/small contrast.

      • We know the treasure isn’t in a graveyard. 🙂 And there’s no doubt there is humor involved, but there’s also a bit of seriousness now. If you read TTOTC very carefully, and then research the people he talks about, you’ll see a lot of feminists, a lot of Jewish, a lot of Native Americans, and a lot about just getting along with others.

        In the very beginning of TFTW, he says the river he fished in was 10 miles long. In the very next paragraph, he says it is now too far for him to walk. The Native Americans were forced to walk 13 miles a day on the Long Walk from Ft Defiance to Fort Sumner. Lots of Native Americans died on that walk, because it was too far to walk when already starving and thirsty.

        Earlier in the same chapter, he says there’s a long story about a train ride from Naples to Pompeii. If he’s talking about Italy, and not Michigan to FL, the distance is 17 miles.
        So now we know (probably) too far to walk is 10-17 miles.
        Now, how can we be somewhat sure WWH is Fort Defiance, AZ?

        1. In TTOTC, he is constantly talking about windows. Climbing out windows, looking out windows, windows, windows here and there, windows, windows everywhere. 🙂
        Windows Rock is just south of Fort Defiance.
        2. Warm could actually mean temperature, such as the lukewarm church of Laodicea, which means “people’s rights” in Hebrew (another Jewish reference). So, where did people’s rights get taken away? Fort Defiance.
        3. Take it in the Canyon down. Because there are two canyons, he gives a big clue about which one. Down doesn’t have to mean descend. Down can be sad, and when you have the blues, you’re sad. Blue Canyon is the canyon for you.
        4. TFTW–Blue Canyon to Sawmill is about 13 miles (if I remember right). Too far to walk.

        And that’s where I’m stuck. I’m pretty sure there’s a synonym for Brown that I just haven’t found yet that matches up precisely with what I’ve got so far. It doesn’t have to be someone named Brown. It could be someone named Cook or Dunn or Russet or any one of those. Or it could be a historical site, such as Tunstall’s ranch, where that Brown guy who was friends with Billy the Kid lived for a while. So, I’ve got to research a lot to find out what HoB really is if WWWH is Fort Defiance.

        But, I agree. His word choices no doubt had him laughing when he placed the chest!

        I’m still heading to Colorado on the 4th if I don’t find anything 100% with what I have so far. If it does start in AZ, it still could end up in my spot in Colorado. 🙂

        • Oh yeah, one problem with Fort Defiance. Someone said that Forrest said you don’t need to know history, but you should know geography. If that’s true, my first solve works much better.

          • Mindy,
            Just playing devils advocate for a minute: I would ask you to step back and ask yourself how feminism, the Jews, the Native Americans, windows, Blue Canyon, Billy the Kid, and various random distances all fit together into a cohesive solution. IMO they don’t go together very well in the big picture and it sounds like you could be kind of stretching and rationalizing a lot to make things fit.

            Just trying to help.

          • Marvin,
            It doesn’t equate to full solution, just a possible WWWH. As far as that goes, here is my reasoning:

            The Biblical reference to the “lukewarm” church of Laodicea. Laodicea translates to “peoples rights.”
            Both TTOTC and TFTW are chock full of hints and/or examples of peoples who have suffered from inequality. For example:
            Amelia Earhart, Bella Abzug, and several other feminists are noted in his books. Feminists fight for equal rights.
            Hitler is mentioned, as well as several Jews. Of course, we all know that they have had huge injustices done against them.
            He mentions several Native Americans, and we know about how their rights were stripped from them.
            And that’s just a few. And I’m paraphrasing, but didn’t he end the TTOTC with a statement about why we can’t just leave each other alone and be at peace?
            Does anyone else see the theme? Lol.
            Regardless, at this point, I’ll be searching CO. 🙂

          • Good work. Good luck. Hope you find that illusive Brown.
            (Do I remember correctly,.. you lived in Merritt Island FL? My 2 & 3rd child were born there… back when Cape Canaveral was its neighbor, and a plains girl like me learned that the sea roars all night long.)

          • OS,
            Yes, I grew up in Merritt Island. One of the best places on Earth, in my book. Grew up barefoot on the beach surfing and swimming. 🙂
            I live 45 minutes north now and I have to say it’s exciting to swim and surf in the shark bite Capitol of the world. 🙂

          • Forrest has told us that the solution is in the poem with a couple of vague hints in the book. Therefore, I see the solution as 99% poem, and 1% book. IMO if you build a solution on a collection of themes that you think you see in the book(s), you may be working backwards.

            I believe that the book is primarily a fun collection of stories from his life (a memoir) and probably not a treatise on political and social topics.

          • I agree, to a point. I think he said there were subtle hints sprinkled throughout the book, if you know where to look. Or something like that. 🙂 I believe there are more than a few but I agree they are vague. He did say the book was helpful, along with Google Earth.

          • Mindy,
            He also has stated that the hints in the book are subtle and not placed deliberately to aid the searcher………….


            Beer will absolutely freeze…I guarantee it!

          • Michael,
            So that would mean that the two omega/horseshoes are not a hint because they are obviously deliberately placed. Not that I necessarily think they are a hint, but many people do.

          • Geydelkon,
            I have pondered this often. The friends who stated they saw the chest in his vault give a year I believe. I cannot recall if it was 2003 or 2007. FF SAYS he hid it within an eighteen month span of time between his 79th birthday and his eighty-first birthday. I have always wondered if he hid something there much earlier, in order to test his hidey spot. But perhaps there’s something or someone else in his hidey spot already….that he found many years ago. Maybe he knows nobody else but him has been there since because of the way he left it the first time he was there.

          • Rose from the BBC contacted me. They are looking for some serious searchers to ride along with in mid September. If anyone is interested give me your e-mail address and I will pass it along. I am busy with my job, so I cannot do it.
            dproudscot at msn dot com.

        • I don’t think the book is a treatise on social politics, either. I think he tells his stories in ways that show everyone is important, everyone has a purpose, and that you don’t need money to be important. You are important because you are. Everyone has a story. I believe everyone has a best selling story, if only they knew how to put it in words.
          Anyway, I just think that if there is any kind of theme in the book, it’s that war sucks all the way around. If people could stop taking what’s not theirs, if people could see people as important, no matter what, race, color, or religion, then the world would be a place outside of the grave where we might experience peace as a worldly ONE.

        • Michael,

          It’s ok. You aren’t talking me out of anything. I’m just trying to throw out some possible connections I’ve made from reading the book and poems 1000 times.

          I just put my sometimes idiotic ideas out there cause I don’t have a husband to tell me how nurse I am. Lol. Usually, as I research more, a couple new ways of thinking creep into my mind, and I post them to either encourage different thinking, or have them shown to be wrong.

  91. It better be! That’s one of the reasons i moved to Denver last year : ). I’ll be headed out to search N of Leadville this Saturday.

  92. I will be searching Friday 🙂
    Yep on Forrest Fenn’s Birthday 🙂

    I feel like a truck driver.

    JJ I shouldn’t be to far from u. 🙂

  93. Today is a good day. Hmm well lets see is the first clue WWWH or is it as I have gone alone in there?

  94. I think so, too…probably. Lol…I still haven’t completely finished researching, although I do have a viable solve (not my WWWH in AZ solve, but my WWWH in CO solve). 🙂

  95. “Go in Peace” … sounds like the last words of a last stanza to me.
    Is there a riddle here, telling me where to begin before I Begin?

    Do I … ‘Go down 4’ or ‘Begin on 5’… highway or page or something else?
    Maybe divide, like: 4 over 2 equals 2, because 4 one way trips = 2 round trips.
    Or simply 42? Like the box weight; and if you don’t want to lose weight, don’t drink diet sodas (if such existed back then).
    Maybe it’s a 4:2 ratio, like mom joining dad 2:1 against Ora Mae.
    Or when 2 equals 4, like two biddies that are married.
    Are there ‘42ers’ like ‘49ers? Is 42 some squad or military term I don’t know.
    A rail road reference? Or possibly the 42nd parallel across Wyoming.
    Or, THE 42nd PARALLEL by Dos Passos? The Forward (on Amazon) is very parallely.
    Or should I add: 4+2 … well, that doesn’t make sense, may as well multiply.
    Feet, degrees, yard lines, fence posts, phone poles, I’ve done it tired, and now I’m weak. I’m in the woods.

    • After researching the peace ‘symbol’, the line ,” go i’N’ peace” makes more sense to me, personally.

      • Goof, Im sayin, it looks to me like the poem starts at stanza 5. Now why would someone put the first two stanzas on the bottom? And then tell you to read it over and over. Probably a structural oversight.
        Yeh, I could be crazy, so don’t think about it.

        • Well, I’m 5150 –

          Old Shadows –

          I like the way you are thinking. “WOOD” is very important but will take some digging to find – IMO.

          Look to the difference in punctuation from his web site to the book. I am talking about the poem. That will tell you were to begin. 🙂

  96. Received the Necklace today!!!! It is beautiful!!!! Will send some pictures next
    week….going on another search……bringing it along for Good Luck!!! I may have to use that wish !!!! LOL Will forward pictures from the search area with the necklace……..I want to Thank everyone !!!!! Truly Laura

  97. “As I have gone alone in there”. This is the first clue, or hint , or whatever you want to call it. If any searcher has not found this out they could be looking for all eternity and not find the treasure. I will tell you guys a not secret anymore. Read the poem and get a clue. Then read the poem again, and get another clue with a different approach. Read the poem again. Do you searchers see it? Arthur Manby gravesite waltz. What is that mean? Does he mean a marker like a cairn. Is that the gravesite? The cairn could be the gravesite. The Cairn could be tarry scant with marvel gaze. What do you think? Do you see it?

  98. That’s awesome Laura can’t wait to see it

    I believe there are a few searching over the weekend

    Good luck and remain safe 🙂


  99. RC on August 14, 2014 at 9:52 pm said:
    What does Mr. Fenn mean to go with confidence to Arthur Manby’s gravesite? Does anybody know?

    where/when did Forrest say this. curious because i found a possible connection between Manby and the treasure hunt. but i dont see Manby hidden in the poem anywhere, at least not yet

    • if there is a connection, i believe it is the same thing hinted it with the experienced skinner

      this being a reference to the sales “jerk”

  100. What is “down”? Now that is the question for me. If you have found a blaze and know it’s a blaze because it says its a blaze….then what the heck does “down” refer to regarding “look quickly down”?


    1. straight down vertically (puts me in the creek)

    2. down the line south (in the creek first and then the wood)

    3. down the vision line from blaze (in the creek and then the wood)

    4. down stream (I am all wet)

    I am beginning to think that finding the blaze only get’s you to the middle of the solve…..or just the creek. The remaining stanza’s provide the directions and clues to finish the puzzle.

    I think the TC may be VANISHING before my eyes as all options are viable at this POINT.

    Any thoughts? Anyone? Beuller? Beuller? Stephanie from Chicago?

    • I vote for #3. I believe the blaze is supposed to show you where it is. So I don’t see the chest being “down over there” or else the blaze won’t be doing it’s job. It must be close. As for in the creek. I believe it would be a dry creek bed if it’s in one…but the fairies dance in the river bottoms over rocks. So if you see any fairies…it’s a sure thing I think.

      I loved Ferris….could relate cutting class and going to Cubs games with friends 😉 My brother named his 3rd daughter Sloan(it’s Sloane in the movie) after the cute girl. I think his wife was aware of “the why” LOL.

      • I agree with Admin number 3 makes the most sense and that is what I use in my solve. Also I know there are 9 clues but IMO sometimes 2 clues point to the same place.

  101. This is going to be interesting. Here is a question to all the Chasers.

    What year do you think Fenn placed the treasure in it’s final spot?

    • Year doesn’t matter but the date does, Dec. 20 (Your effort will be worth the cold).

    • it has been my theory that there is a reason the postmark //friday 5 june// is the only one shown twice within the pages of the book

      and it is the one shown in the picture of the chest at the intro to gold and more

      f said he hid it 2009 or 2010, and friday june 5 happens to be a legitimate date in one of those years, 2009

      • Chris –

        That’s exactly what FF would want you to think – that he hid it in 2009.

          • The only reason it would matter is – if you are in a spot that it wouldn’t matter at all – you are probably in the wrong spot.

            Why would he give two years if he simply hid it when it didn’t indeed make the poem wrong.

            I know I am not saying this clearly.

            If Brown was a trout – why would he give two years – I don’t think he rented a car – so I don’t think he could be traced.

            I have a reason he gave two years – directly related to my spot.

        • What we do know, based on published articles: (The New Mexican, I think…)
          1. He started writing the book on April 15 2010.
          2. At the time, the treasure chest was already in the Rockies : (and arguably, for “some time”) he said he’d started getting concerned it was out there and he hadn’t published his poem yet.

          So the chest was hidden before April 2010 is all we know for sure. Could have been anywhere from January 2009 to Early April 2010 for all we know.

  102. I Google why would someone would put beer into a Ziplock bag and the only thing that comes is to make a ice pack cause beer won’t freeze!

    • Maybe it was beer still in the can or bottle. If it was ice cold, some persnickety folks might not want their flashlight and sandwich to get soggy from the condensation on the bottle..
      In a modification of that theory, when I was out looking in WY a few weeks ago I ran into a couple of guys hiking back to a stream who had their camelbacks filled with beer…

      • I still get amazed of what you will find in the middle of the forest. Wife and I seen a guy hiking with a back pack and just speedo on, took us 10 minutes for that one to sink in before we looked at each other to ask was he only wearing speedo!

          • William,
            you must be referring to the “other” Rick on this blog…I do Not wear speedos… :mrgreen:

        • I was in France 10-15 years ago hiking and ran into two couples backpacking (in 35 degree weather) with just boots on!

        • I remember going to a beach in Germany about 13 years ago and seeing an 80 year old man in a speedo.

    • If you take beer out of a can, you’re left with an empty aluminum can.
      Beer also makes you pee, which is a primal lure. 🙂

  103. Slurbs you are a funny guy lol. Switching back is in the dictionary and it was discussed in a question. I know you wouldn’t dream of intentionally trying to silence me…tch tch lol. Cheers.

  104. westyellowstonenews.com/mobile/community_notes/article_b826c621-c324-54e1-8844-3bd8207ad8cf.html

    • Great find Sally! They called him Bubba. Wonder why? 🙂

      Looks like Bubba used that blog to post some of his first drafts.

  105. Where did the fact that the treasure is below 10,200 come from? That’s not a clue on Fenns site?

    • Zatara
      Forrest first said that about a year ago in an interview with Bob Boze Bell who wrote about it in TrueWest Magazine. Since then Forrest has verified to searchers that he did make that statement to Bob and he has repeated it more than once since that time in TV and radio interviews as well as book signings.

  106. Crhis Yates* Manby’s name is in the poem. Look for it. It took us(My brother and me) 11 months to come out with the name. Do not let the poem cloud your mind. Good luck in the hunt.

  107. There are a few words in the poem that are not useful in finding the treasure Phil, but it is risky to discount any of them. You over simplify the clues. There are many places in the Rocky Mountains where warm waters halt, and nearly all of them are north of Santa Fe. Look at the big picture, there are no short cuts. f

    So I deduce from this is that Mr. Fenn is saying if you ‘over simplify’ your going to get many (incorrect) WWWH locations. And since Mr. Fenn is suggesting not to ‘over simplify’, then the ‘big picture’ will yield much fewer WWWH options to check out – and probably just one. What do you think?

    • What about where warm waters halt is a park. Yeah, a park. So you would start your search in the park-ing lot and work your way down the canyon.

    • sounds pretty right on to me Sidd Finch

      i would add that the HOB and the Blaze can be known with confidence

      the ‘big picture’ relates more to WWH

      • I’m with you on this Chris. Perhaps my ‘guess’ is correct on WWWH. I have not seen it mentioned on this or other sites. I’m sure a few others are on to it as well . . . and not going to give it up for obvious reasons. I’ve had my ‘blaze’ in mind for about a year now. I believe I have HOB, and perhaps the Blaze. Fortunately, I will have the opportunity to get out there for another look this year to see if my Blaze works out.

    • taking into consideration some of the things that was on this web page previously, there may be some hints here at amelia earhart which i just noticed may be in a certain line of the poem

      in this new audio file the first 2 numbers mentioned are 39. you can hear Mr District Attorney later in the recording, this is mentioned in TTOTC on page 39 and this show began airing in 1939. amelia earhart disappeared at age 39 and was declared dead in 1939

      • Wow 23, great find. The mystery deepens…
        I have an idea about how to use the numbers but I’m still wondering about the colors.

        • IMO red, black green and infinity is the Vietnam Veteran’s colors (Air Force). You can draw a figure 8 with the missing color yellow. It’s a stretch I know, use your imagination.

        • Look at this image green/black/red: http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41XR32Hd39L._SX342_.jpg
          Draw your finger along the yellow bands in the form of an 8 on its side. Infinity. Yellow is missing color but infinity is there.

          IMO this site is about memories from Vietnam, also Direct U.S. military involvement in Vietnam ended on 15 August 1973 which is what some have cited as the countdown date.

      • I spent a couple months on this very thing and am familiar with those broadcasts from that research(Interesting!).

        He talked about having the radio. He spoke about being in an electronics class in the AF. There are beacons at airports. So I felt he could have installed one that worked off either solar power, or some other power that he would be able to “hijack” from a tower or something.

        I found a list of airports that coincided with words in his book that were unusual. I think Kismet was something I found related to that…can’t remember how.

        I thought this is how he would be able to know if it was still there. I even bought a shortwave radio(He talks of Peggy being short in the car and other mentions of short). I even tried to hire someone to teach me about that sort of thing.

        Ok, this is over and beyond. I knew that he has an electronic door opener thingy. A lot of them have keypads in them(he spoke about his dad using the telephone), but I couldn’t remember if his did and I couldn’t get close enough on Google Earth to see if it did. I felt I had some numbers that worked and I felt maybe he could have rigged his “doorbell” to record the location of where the chest was if you punched in the right code. (stop laughing). I flew to SF only to find out his doesn’t have a keypad. He had talked about the guy ringing his bell over and over and also spoke about people digging in his neighbors yard(really?…didn’t seem plausible).

        So then I gave up on that idea.

        • Guys, I’m telling you, I’m very certain that website is a commercial / TV show -related site. Very likely one of the cable shows that have come by asking for ‘talent’. They want us to be curious. To do their marketing for them.
          Further theories:
          —Regulars who suddenly disappeared could be possibly in the casts.
          —the producers have one or more sock puppets / astroturfers here, stirring the pot and supposed ‘mystery’.

          In any case: It’s all about marketing.


        • Forrest is certainly allowing the WordPress countdown site generous use of his name.

          • A little clarification

            WordPress provides free web page building software. Here is an excerpt from their page at WordPress.org:

            “WordPress is web software you can use to create a beautiful website or blog. We like to say that WordPress is both free and priceless at the same time.”

            Some individual/group known only as superadmin for now, has created this mystery web page wherewarmwatershalt using WordPress. The link: http://wherewarmwatershalt.com/hint-of-riches-new-and-old/ shows you the rest of his/her site. If you navigate through the entire site it contains general info about Forrest and the chase and appears to be set up for a blog but never got that far.

            I run Linux (Ubuntu) on my computer and used “Inspect element” on the odd web page to gather info about it. A lot can be learned but for now it’s basically counting visitors. My personal opinion is they are just messing with us.

  108. I’m having a hard time believing Fenn said this even if he did the chest would still be susceptible to rain and snow if it was in water. I think Tony interpreted Fenns answer the way he wanted to see it.

    Tony Dokoupil
    But as you frisk and refrisk the poem for its meaning, keep a few more clues in mind: some people have suggested the treasure is under water, plopped in a river where Fenn loved to fish or swim. They are wrong, I know, for in a moment of exuberance, Fenn said so. He told me the chest is “exposed” to rain and snow, and could be scorched in a forest fire. He told me the box, which is just 10 inches by 10 inches, is unlocked—suggesting it’s someplace where it is unlikely to be toppled or otherwise thrown open.

    • Yes, imo TonyD is overrated like his horse. He also has great imagination when writing about facts, and seems to possess none regarding the poem & chase.
      A. The chest , if in a lake, pond, or river in the Rockies, would experience different water levels during different seasons, sometimes by several feet, so for 3 or so months each year it may very well be exposed to rain, snow and fire.
      B. unlocked doesnt mean unsecured/ready to spill. No where has FF said that he didn’t wrap the chest is a glad bag, ..nor bungee cord it closed. (as just 2 examples off the top of my head…)

      • Yea he seems to jump to conclusions without much information. I don’t think I would let Tony eliminate water spots. I’ve seen too many bad fact reports to by into this. I mean almost instinctively reporters ask Fenn which state he buried it in. Fenn uses the term “secreted it” do you really think Fenn would give Tony a clue about the treasure not being in water and then not repeat that somewhere else?

        • Full Definition of TARRY

          : of, resembling, or covered with tar

          Hmm tar protects from water.

  109. Slurbs

    I searched some today I looked for u. But did not see u as I can’t find the blaze either so would u like to tell me what your blaze might be. Since we search close. Lol
    Nor did I see the wild beast today that is supposed to be caged.

    I will be searching tomorrow and some on Sunday then I head back home.

    Are u searching this weekend.

    The only blaze I see at the bottom is a F on the bridge look quickly down it’s water no wood except up on the land is some trees or a tree right by that .

    I guess I just don’t get it 🙁 lol

    At the bottoms tomorrow 🙂

  110. Where the “theme” of unity, brotherhood, and acceptance tie in with Forrest rainbow, IMO:
    “As Native Americans, we believe the Rainbow is a sign from the Spirit in all things. It is a sign of the union of all people, like one big family. The unity of all humanity, many tribes and peoples, is essential.” — Late Thomas Banyacya, Spokesman, Hopi traditional elders, Hotevilla

  111. The nationwide releaser date for the Wizard of Oz was August 25, 1939. Monday will be the 75th anniversary.

  112. Along the lines that Chris suggested, write down the letters HEAR ME AL.. The first four letters are the first four letters of Earhart, and the next four are the first four of Amelia. The rest are nearby. I agree that this is about 1939.

    • By choosing just the right combination of letters from the last stanza I get: “Elvis in the House”. Maybe Elvis is the “riches ….old”?

  113. Friday at 4 will be free but maybe still in work clothes.

    My kids are home for the weekend for our annual seafood boil. Forrest Fenn’s name came up in conversation and I am pretty sure i heard my kids talking about a mental institution! Are we all crazy?

  114. One more possibility. Red, black and green are the colors of the Pan-African flag. In 1920, the Declaration of Rights of the Negro People of the World was adopted. Article 39 reads that “The colors, Red, Black and Green, be the colors of the Negro race.” One more 39 to add to Chris’ list. Perhaps the 8 represents August?

    • Pretty sure these colors are reference to the three colors of tea he mentions in “Tea With Olga” and they are in the same order as they appear in the story…so with that, what does a white 8 reveal?

      • I noticed the connection to Tea with Olga also. The thread that ties it to the Pan African colors may be Olga’s name which translates from Russian to English as “Blessed Freedom.” Just a thought.

      • They also ate Oreos then, too.

        8…eight…ate white

        What’s the color of the “middle” of an Oreo. (that all kids, old and young alike, like to eat first!!)

        c’mon guys, get outta that box!!! 🙂


    • Some postmarks look altered to be 39’s. Of interest in Too Far To Walk that Fenn owns Amelia E’s pilot’s license and it shows up on page 232. Are 23/32 impt. #’s?. Inside flaps of 2F2W show AE’s last flight over the ocean with fishing/western sketches from the book. Seems out of place. anyone think Fenn has plans to take last flight like AE? Talk of Wizard of OZ makes me think Fenn has things in play he’s working out behind the ‘curtain’ – my opinion – a newbie here.

    • One technique for solving puzzles is called “working your way backwards from the answer.” In short, if you can make an educated guess about the final answer, you can potentially reverse-engineer the steps needed to get to it. It can be very effective, but, unfortunately, it obviously only works if you guess the right answer in the first place.

      Here is an example.

      I believe that a major theme of TTOTC is The Wizard of Oz and associated rainbow allusions. The movie was released nationwide 75 years ago on August 25, 1939. Let’s say I want to generate that date.

      As Chris pointed out, the revised website at http://www.wherewarmwatershalt.com is raining 39s. The story of the Pan-African colors yields another. I would think that if someone went to enough trouble to challenge us with this, it would have a simple, unified solution.

      I can call the 8 August, but I’m still missing my 25. I can assign letters to the two real colors red and green: R and G. Perhaps we can view the black rectangle as a “blank.” R is the 18th letter and G is 7th.

      7 + 18 = 25.

      Therefore, August 25, 1939 >> Wizard of Oz.

      On the other hand, a quiet day on Monday would quickly verify that this incorrect.

      • Eliza… What app is everyone using for the “wherewarmwatershalt” website that allows you to see numbers and colors and codes???

        • James, when I go to the website wherewarmwatershalt.com I am typically going there on my smartphone. To get the colors or, in the past, numbers, I just touch on the rectangular blocks. I reckon that would be akin to a left click on a computer mouse. Hope that helps. I use no apps for that site.

    Just before a buddy and I left for our 3rd “adventure” , I read where a couple’s daughter tragically slipped off a trail, near the falls in Yellowstone. Now we haven’t even been home one day and I read about this Russian student who went off hiking alone, only to be found dead after a search…

    “MOOSE, Wyo. – A Russian student who went missing in Grand Teton National Park has been found dead.
    The body of 20-year-old Aleksandr “Sasha” Sagiev was found in the park Friday. The student from Nizhny Novgorod, Russia, was reported missing Monday after going for a hike.
    After a three-day search, Sagiev’s body was discovered below a steep traverse, known as Cache Couloir, in Glacier Gulch. “

    It’s very unfortunate, when a persons’ greed, circumstances and or desperation outweigh their commonsense. There will likely be more of these unintended consequences, before Fenn’s treasure is discovered. Doubtful we will see the likes of Warren Buffet or Bill Gates hosting a modern day treasure hunt.

    Our society needs more hero types like Fenn, a philanthropist with the desire & means to help others-who are willing to help themselves. How sad is it, that we’re so coddled these days, that everything has to be sanctioned by Reality Television .
    Sure let’s get our attorneys together, come up with a catchy idea, blah blah blah

    • theycallme-

      There is no evidence that the Russian fellow or the family of the little girl were interested in, or even knew about Forrest’s treasure chest. Millions of people from just about every nationality in the known universe visit Yellowstone and Grand Teton each year. There will always be accidents resulting in death or disabling harm. but probably many fewer such accidents than happen in just about any city in this country with over a million in population…

      Reminding viewers to be safe is admirable but tying these tragedies to the treasure hunt is uncalled for. Neither the Park Service press releases about these events nor the media reports I read tied these two deaths to Forrest’s treasure and I don’t understand why you feel the need to draw such a conclusion or even suggest that is the case.

  116. Over the past month the posts in this Nine Clues section just get curiouser and curiouser. Maybe there’s an Alice in Wonderland theme.

  117. @Chris Y. – I’ve trailed the convo’s here. Can’t decide if there’s psudos who like to keep searchers running in circles. Plenty of paths of logic, both linear and abstract. How long have you been on the search? -Steve

  118. From the WWWH website: the number 369218 corresponds to the exact color green used in the third box.

    This is an interesting bit on infinity:
    John Wallis is usually credited with introducing ∞ as a symbol for infinity in 1655 in his De sectionibus conicis. One conjecture about why he chose this symbol is that he derived it from a Roman numeral for 1000 that was in turn derived from the Etruscan numeral for 1000, which looked somewhat like CIƆ and was sometimes used to mean “many.” Another conjecture is that he derived it from the Greek letter ω ( omega), the last letter in the Greek alphabet.

    And further on, it says that an infinity symbol turned 90 degrees is representative of an hourglass. So, the infinity hourglass on its side shows us that time is standing still. The infinity sign shown up and down like an hourglass shows us time is running out, which seems to be implied by the countdown clock.

    • Mindy – Nice find with the RGB Hex # for green and the infinity symbol as an hour glass.

      • Nicely done Mindy! Love your visual hour glass on it’s side representing eternity. As Forrest has confirmed he is a ‘spiritual’ person, it would be interesting to understand his views of eternity; or read his personal interpretation of Little Gidding.

        For anyone further researching Mindy’s great ideas on color codes, it may also be helpful to know RGB codes are used for on-line color representation and CMYK codes are used in printed color presentation materials like Forrest’s books. As he has published books containing high quality art plates I feel Forrest may also be familiar with CMYK color codes. below is a link to understand the difference.


  119. Some folks are afraid to go to bed and 30k die on the roads every year but all we hear is how a handful die in nature. You can’t have freedom without risk. I think thats a rule fenn lived by… 🙂

    • @Piecesof9 Re: risk/freedom
      If one person dies in the wilderness it’s a tragic story of great personal interest. If thousands die in war torn countries, it’s quickly discounted as “news.” Every person matters. We are all connected. pray for peace in each individual heart, so that peace can be accomplished on earth. IMO Policies don’t change the world… changing people one heart or friend at a time could change our world.

      • Swan, that reminds me of a Native American poem I read earlier, which seems to fit nicely with the themes of freedom and equality and living together peacefully.

        Rainbow Tribe

        The sun rose on a magical new day…
        Over the whole earth they came,
        The people of every colour,
        Sister, Brother, Father, Mother
        Traveling over many a land
        People of the Rainbow
        Children of the Way,
        with a fresh glow
        Finding their way
        Star within…
        More and more joined,
        a song for the soul…
        A new way to live,
        A new way to see,
        It happened this way…
        And a new song,
        It came from within
        If you can find the Star,
        Within then you will find…
        What is… What was…
        And what will be… you see,
        It happened this way…
        from within,
        The people of the Way
        The Rainbow Tribe…

        – Author Unknown

        • Mindy, thank you for the poem.
          It’s difficult to watch the news without losing faith in humanity.

          changed hearts = changed lives
          peaceful hearts = friends
          friends = peace

  120. With all the mentions of finding people’s names in the poem, has anyone noticed that LEWIS MERIWETHER is in the WWWH line?

  121. I admit I’m a little behind on the clues found on that website. So I’m asking out of ignorance. Could the 39 clues that people are picking up be a reference to 1839 rather than 1939?

  122. I dreamed the other night that I had been reincarnated as Captain Kidd and went to Gardiner’s Island looking for the treasure. It scared me so badly I was jarred awake and don’t remember whether I found it or not.

    hmmm … he doesn’t remember if he found the treasure … or the island? 🙂

    • That comment by Forrest, which is rather intimately associated with the poem preceding it, would certainly qualify as an aberration on the edge. It’s quite a non sequitur if taken on its own, so it provokes wonder as to why he said it like that right there.

      foRRest feNN
      wiLLiam kiDD

      Two adventurers. He’s presenting a poem to us with clues to his treasure hiding place and then talking about William Kidd and his treasure that he left on Gardiner’s Island that isn’t there any more (although some dispute this despite the historical evidence).

      Looking for a treasure that’s not there. And why is Forrest saying that he went searching for it in his dreams (conveniently the ‘other night’ as he types away), and why was he ‘scared so badly’? Scared to actually be Captain Kidd, or lose his treasure and his freedom, with impending execution? It does sound like a child waking up from a scary but confused dream.

      And of course he was ‘jarred’ awake, not jolted, shaken or stirred. Possibly jarred like his mini-autobiography and grey hair, or his buried bronze jars with the ingenious screw lids, or feeling ‘jarred’ by John Charles whatever waving that thing in his face.

      The timing of this phrase brings to mind several things that he brings up out of the blue at his speaking engagements, many of which I believe he prepares ahead of time in anticipation to the event, when the right moment arrives. He speaks differently off the cuff, and there are tells to read there.

      This brief but action-packed phrase cleverly conceals its own intent, but the story may be significant despite its distance from the Rockies.


  123. Slurbs

    Exactly how do u know where I search? Only 2 people and Forrest know where I search.

    • Amy, I think Slurb’s beast sneaks out on reconnaissance missions to gain insider knowledge about searches.

      • Andesite

        Interesting that I did not give Slurbs any info
        On my location but it does not matter because I obviously can’t find it.
        Soon after I post solve maybe someone else can find it. If they are interested in this location. My solve is so interesting that the whole world needs to know. Especially in this Gloomy world.

          • specialklr

            there was one time Forrest said people ‘figured’ the first 2 clues

            but then said, I don’t think they knew it

            that would seem contradictory to me. did they figure them out or not. it leaves open the question if they really did figure them out

          • just when you think another door in the conversation can’t be opened, Chris Yates opens one more. vn CY. im about ready to go search 300 mile west of Toledo and see what i find.

          • From questions with Forrest on Jenny Kiles site:

            Question posted 7/1/2014:

            Mr. Fenn: In the past when you have said that several people had figured out the first two clues and then went right past the other clues, would you say that they got lucky and just happened to go to the correct starting area, not fully understanding the poem, or would you say that they did indeed solve the first two clues by understanding the poem and clues? C

            Searchers have routinely revealed where they think the treasure was hidden and walked me through the process that took them on that course. That’s how I know a few have identified the first two clues. Although others were at the starting point I think their arrival was an aberration and they were oblivious to its connection with the poem. Playing a hunch is not worth much in the search and those who start out by looking for the blaze, are wasting their time.f

            Chris, they got the first two right, but they didn’t know that they were right; the real question is if they moved on to other areas, gave up all together, or are they still searching and trying to figure out the other clues in the correct area because they are confident they are in the right spot.

            Note that last year between spring and summer, f changes his wording from two to several; unfortunately, he has been quite on the topic for almost a year now, except to say that a man has been closest, but so have some women… So there are the several.

            This is the tough part of this challenge, unless you find the treasure chest, you don’t know if the area and clues you are chasing are correct or not and you can end up chasing your tail in one area for a long time until all ones confidence turns to disappointment, or until you run out of funds if significant travel is required.

          • JCM-
            I agree with your assessment
            Searchers have routinely revealed where they think the treasure was hidden and walked me through the process that took them on that course. That’s how I know a few have identified the first two clues.

            Forrest is telling us that some got the first two clues correctly. They may or may not have moved with confidence but they got the start correct. Of course I don’t know, but I feel strongly that at least some felt confident in the first two and went on to make a correction at number three and are working that out..or number 5 out, as we speak. I feel just as confident that some who got the first two correct gave up when they didn’t find the treasure..or the blaze..and lost confidence in their solution or ran off to try the next most interesting sounding solution.

            In my opinion many on this blog have had the first two correct but screwed up after that. Additionally, IMO, many have gotten a lot more than two clues correct but finding the blaze and the actual hiding spot has evaded them.

            I say this because statistics alone will tell us that out of thousands of people trying their hand and given the clues Forrest has handed out, it stands to reason that some have gotten it nearly correct.

            If this blog is any indication of the numbers of people out looking with 5-6 thousand hits per day, I think a lot of folks are trying. It stands to reason that MANY have gotten lucky and figured out the first few clues…but then why haven’t they discovered it? In my opinion it’s because of it’s snarky hiding place. Even if we find the blaze we may miss this incredibly clever hiding place. As Forrest has pointed out..no one will stumble upon it…
            It’s a very unique place and so..people give up…they don’t even know they have come so close..

            Of course we will not know if my frightening theory is correct until it’s found and then we will know by the thunderous sound of thousands of hands slapping thousands of foreheads all across the country.

          • just when i thought i was out, they pull me right back in…

            there must be a very fine line Mr. Fenn must draw to not give any info that would not level the playing field. Man/Woman… it must remain oblivious to the solve i am sure, imo.

            But doesn’t any wonder why 500/200/100/50/12? very similar to the search frames to google map.

            so looking to a new location. seems i have under and over complicated this chase in the right way in the wrong spots.

          • Dal, I agree Forrest said ..no one will stumble upon it…
            But I also remember that he said …if you are 12′ from it you would see it.

            Does that say no one will stumble to within 12′ of it?

          • Special-
            I take that with a grain of salt..I’ve been with Forrest when he picked up arrowheads out of the dirt in front of my nose. I didn’t see them. He saw them instantly..
            Another reason I am cautious about people injecting their skill and knowledge into my situation..
            In about 1980 I filmed a story on Tom Brown’s (the Tracker) Wilderness Survival School for CNN. The school was specifically for preschool aged kids and their moms. As I approached the group at their third day of camp in the rainforest of the Olympic Peninsula I was stunned to see 4 year old kids wielding knives with ten inch blades as they deftly bled, gutted and skinned deer they had snared earlier that day. It was a great visual and the story both intrigued and horrified moms all across the nation..
            Later I got Tom to walk along a trail with me as I interviewed him about the value of teaching young kids about wilderness survival..as we were walking and talking he pointed out to me how most people generally look out at the world but don’t really see it. That our observational skills have become dulled over generations of shopping malls and supermarkets. There has been a disconnect between the need to survive beyond the need to make enough money to go to 7-11 and buy a pop-tart. I asked him if he could give me an illustration. So he pointed up the trail ahead of us and said..”Well, most people today wouldn’t even see that doe and fawn right there.” So I pointed the camera up the trail and scanned the area for the doe and fawn..I didn’t see either…I pointed the thing back at Tom and said,”What doe?” To my utter disbelief Tom said “Right there, 8 feet in front of you on the right side of the trail in that big mess of ferns.” and pointed at where they were. I panned the camera around and looked exactly where he was pointing..no deer..I took my eye away from the reticle and looked at the spot carefully…no deer. I slowly advanced toward the spot, the camera lens pointed in the appropriate direction..Nothing!!
            When I got about two feet from that deer and doe I finally saw them. They were hunkered down in the ferns like garden gnomes. I would have starved to death before I ever knew they were there. Tom claimed he had known they were there from about 40 feet away. Needless to say, I was pretty unhappy with my observational skills and considered it lucky that no one had ever made me walk “point” in Vietnam.

            So, just because Forrest doesn’t feel I could miss the chest if I was within 12 feet of it means that Forrest wouldn’t miss it…but the same does not necessarily hold true for the rest of us mere mortals.

          • So, Dal….Do you think someone could solve the nine clues in the poem and still not find the TC?

            I do believe that is possible. IMO the TC is hidden so well one could pass it up many times before they notice it; that is why one should not give up on a really good solve. One that you have gone with confidence of course.

          • Very interesting, Dal!
            I am a hunter, sometimes I don’t see the thing I hunting. One must know what they are looking for quite well, and even then may miss it.

        • Spcklr,

          i always felt 12′ meant that it was at the bottom of a water hole. More exact a fishing hole/home that ties in to it all. Who knew this special spot? Wish I did, sure if you swam to the bottom of the right hole where it is cold you may find a rock of james bond proportions with a rainbow of an amazing history. You may even need a flashlight, cloud cover could even determine that fluctuating factor. But regardless after a swim who couldn’t go for a sandwich?

    • When you read RRSS, you will know. RRSS… remember. Don’t look for RRSS. RRSS will just appear in one of your day to day doings.

  124. Hello everyone. I am off to Deadwood again. Yak at y’all Friday night or Saturday morning.
    Please don’t find it while I’m gone!

    Michael D

  125. I m just not getting the brownsboro high. It’s funny cause we live 15 min from brownsboro in Texas lol

        • Ok so here we go where I begin is high and I take that with me. When I get to the bottom there is a sign that says what I just saw up high
          Hmmm is that my blaze then I look quickly down and search away from that sign into a different area no trees just brush hmmm that’s all I have for my blaze 🙂

        • Specialklr and others, RRSS has nothing to do with locating the treasure chest. Sorry if that comment missled anyone. The comment was to Amy/Duane only. Only they will understand it. I think f might understand as well. Other than that, rest assured that RRSS will not lead anyone to the chest.

    • Old if you want my 2 cents here goes. I think the chest has a box around it (tar covered shell) sitting in a p oo l of water UPRIGHT.

      • Does anyone know where the word cistern is used in either the TTOTC or TFTW?

      • My two cents is this…Mr f has said several times that he was born 100 years to late. IMHO…we need to stop thinking in todays times and think back to 100 years before f was born. Mr f has made comments and again IMO he has given us hints in his SB`s that reflect back to that time period. Back in the “Mountain Man” days the trappers would “cashe” their belongings…that is where and how the chest will be found.

        • Because of the word “tarry” ship builders in England were referred to as tarries because they would be covered in tar. Now I can’t prove its in water thats just my thought BUT why tar?

          • About being in water… several 🙂 days ago I had this picture in my head:

            Somebody, when entering a body of water that is waist/chest high, would carry his/her gear lifted above their heads.
            i.e. “heavy loads and water high”

            Why do that? because there is no canoe/boat and therefore no paddle either.
            i.e. “there will be no paddle up yout creek”

            To summarize, one possible interpretation of this stanza is that we have to go up a creek where portage is not possible, and then we have get in a body of water (our creek or maybe a lake), either to cross it or to look for the blaze.

          • @Liv,

            So, in essence, you are suggesting that those lines may indicate a need to “ford” a waterway?? 🙂

  126. Michael D i am also off to Deadwood tomorrow. Oh I mean work. I hoipe to check in occasionally but definitely on the weekend too. Everybody have a good week!

  127. If u really want something bad enough you just have to go and get it. Ewwwy Ewwwy really . 🙂

  128. my theory that f hid the chest june 5 2009 i dont think can be correct

    he would have been 78 years old and i believe he said he hid it when he was 79 or 80

    this has made me realize that hiding it at 80 yrs old seems unlikely. there was only a 2 month gap from his 80th bday until the release of the book. dont think he would have wanted to hide it that close to the release

    • According to news articles posted on whatsablaze :
      Well , he started writing the book April 15 2010, and said the chest was already out there and that’s WHY he started writing then — so imo while I don’t know exactly when he hid it, it seems it was hid between Aug 2009 and April 2010.

      It’s possible he hid it earlier though, and he got his age wrong. 😉

      • It is my belief that f hid the chest back around 1999 or 2000 and then went back to add to it 9 or 10 years later. That is how he knows an 80 year old can make the journey. I think that I’ve heard that he had family and friends looking for the chest well before he wrote the book. If they weren’t searching, they were at least aware that he had hid it.

        • Slurbs – f recently said he hid it in two trips in one afternoon, not that this topic makes much difference for finding the tc.

        • Ah, but that would contradict the friends who were interviewed and said they saw the chest in his study as recently as 2003 and 2005…

        • slurbs, I would like to understand your thinking on this post:

          It is my belief that f hid the chest back around 1999 or 2000 and then went back to add to it 9 or 10 years later. That is how he knows an 80 year old can make the journey. I think that I’ve heard that he had family and friends looking for the chest well before he wrote the book. If they weren’t searching, they were at least aware that he had hid it.

          Write me at Geydelkon at wildstones.com

      • I feel he may have hid it in the winter. He was looking for the lowest water time January/February. This is a good time frame for all states of search. The traffic would be low at a spot special to him at this time.

        Map and CY, I believe you may be both correct, he was 79 and did hide it in this year of life.

        Mr. Fenn seems like a man that goes when it is time. If he did hide it in the winter of 2010, it would seem likely he would get on it and start that book not much shortly after. For how long after he hid his secret could he contain before laying out his eloquent memoirs.

        all in my opinion respectfully,


        • I believe he hid it in late November or early December of 2009 after Mimi Sloane had past in October 2009. I believe that only Forrest’s dad and Eric Sloane new of his secret spot Forrest may have thought that Eric may have discussed the spot with Mimi so he waited as long as he could until that time. Just MHO.

          • It really doesn’t matter when he hid it except for maybe car or truck rental receipts. Other than that I’m sure he’s been to his spot many times before, otherwise he wouldn’t have chosen to hid it there, He may have even been there several times in 2009 preparing the spot to hide the chest and then one day he went and hid it in one afternoon making two trips from his car or truck. IMO he did make some preparation for hiding the TC before actually hiding it so that he could do it in one afternoon.

            He is a man who thought of everything in this endeavor so why wouldn’t he have preplanned this most important step?

            Good luck to everyone…..Think and be logical.

        • drawing the timeline out seems to be the path of detective work i distain. you turn up deep emotional roots that give leads but at the cost of understanding pain that someone else endured. finding the special spot may just require doing so and i feel reluctant to think that direction.

      • Dal- wasn’t there some discussion a year or two ago about a weather event or some sort of natural phenomenon happening around the time he hid the chest? I only have a vague recollection of something along these lines being said somewhere here on your site and may be completely off base with this thought.

  129. Only Forrest knows. I have no idea been searching all day . No Chest but it’s ok . Will be headed back home . Had a nice weekend
    Thanks Slurbs for some info today I just can’t grasp it I guess
    🙂 !!!!!!!

  130. Surely surely there is a mark on something to let u know if u are correct when looking 🙂

    • Amy I think you are right about a mark to identify it. But I don’t think it would be the letter F or double omegas or an X or anything that obvious. My theory is that correctly solving the poem will reveal some symbol connected to the solution. He could place that mark at the hiding spot and it would be meaningless to most people seeing it. But if you correctly solved the poem you would understand its significance.

      • I believe that the blaze is a W carved with four diagonal lines. A few other odds and ends:

        A lowercase omega looks like a w.

        I can keep my secret W here.

        1939 is viewed by some movie buffs as the greatest in the history of motion pictures. The first sensation: Gone with the Wind.

        GONE W >>> GO NE >>> W

        Finally, don’t forget where the treasure was hidden at the end of It’s a Mad, Mad, Mad, Mad World.

        Happy 75th birthday, Wizard of Oz!!!

      • IJack, I sorta agree, except for the omegas… because if “the end is the beginning” per TS Eliot, then something like Omegas might be at the starting place.

        • I think there are omegas in the middle of the chase. They will confirm that you are on the right trail. But, I’m not so sure about any markings at the TC site. You will just have to be in the right location and use logic to find it.