The Nine Clues…….Part Fortyeight


This is the place to discuss the nine clues…For instance:
What are the nine clues…
Is the first clue “Begin it where warm waters halt” ?

1,026 thoughts on “The Nine Clues…….Part Fortyeight

  1. I’m out camping tonite, up late with the baby who will NOT get to sleep, reciting the poem by rote to him. I guess he’s got The Thrill of the Chase in his bones because it’s 1:45 am & he is still going strong. He’s almost 3 but not much of a talker.

    I think we have decided that daddy searched on the wrong side of the river last year. We are now discussing how to tell mommy that daddy is going out on another hunt this summer. I have become convinced that “worth the cold” means you have to get your feet wet. Those feet that are supposed to be in boots.

    • hi tomwhat i have been too busy with hubby to log in. go you mind where are you searching state fine just nosey

      • Hope you husband has a speedy recovery Marie! How is he feeling? Will you be able to go out searching this summer?

        • we are doing great after another er trip this morning for bronchitis and some new meds. his pain is under control and he is feeling better. we plan to go in aug. when dr saids we can we plan to do a test drive to texas coast to make sure he can do it. thanks for asking. where are you searching i cant keep track of everyone.

          • I’m in the MT – WY camp. 🙂 I’m not sure I’ll get much searching in this summer though. 🙁

          • Sometimes shoulder arthroscopies are slow to heal. Maybe an ACP injection would greatly speed the process. If the doc hasn’t offered one, ask if he does them. It might just do the trick. And if you want more info about what’s involved, email me at

    • I think that if you say… Worth the cold.. Enuf times like a little kid , it becomes your effort will be vertical lol my 1 and a half year old son used to climb up the easy chair, up the back of it to the kitchen counter and you had to hurry up and grab him, cuz he’d all of a sudden be there! Lol He’s 22 now, but, since he said awhile back even a 5 year old can walk up to it and someplace a 80-90 year old man can go, it just might be up some stairs, heck if a 1 yr old can do it… Lol just saying….

    • That was a good comment you left for her on her story …Sadly I doubt she cares whether she is accurate or not.

    • Wait…What !! The last 4 lines of the poem is coded??

      Why am I always the last to know.

      As always great journal investigation… And these folks get paid to be wrong.

    • Thanks for posting that, Dal. I love how the article mentions that Forrest was “controversially excavating” San Lazaro Pueblo. lol! Now I’m going to feel guilty every time I turn the soil in my yard. Seriously, though, if every “professional” archaeologist…you know…the ones who claim to have a “right” to dig up the past…would write a book about their endeavors…LIKE FORREST HAS…then the world would be a much more enlightened place. From what I understand only about 1% of San Lazaro Pueblo has been excavated…and Forrest wrote a very beautiful and rather large book about it. Would the “scientific community” have done the same? We all KNOW the answer to that question and it’s a resounding “NO”. Of course, they’ll give us all the usual list of excuses, but from my point of view there’s really no excuse for it. I shouldn’t have to go digging around in a hidden storage vault to learn what “scientists” have discovered. I vote to have The Thrill Of The Chase Day renamed to Forrest Fenn Day.

    • As an investigator of the Thrill Of The Chase and the associated treasure chest. I must say I am shocked that you did not take time to attempt to contact Mr. Fenn and get the facts first hand. Yes sure it takes time to get it right. However in the end I would rather be known for getting it right, rather than showing the world how I wasted my time to become a journalist

      • Grrr sry Dal I did not edit it before posting. Was aimed at that so called reporter.

  2. @Charlie – on May 19 you directed a comment about Skippy and June to Nor, who is my cousin. Just wanted you to know that Nor lost interest in the totc and neither of us plan to continue searching Montana or elsewhere. But, good luck to you Charlie! Given your intelligent posts it wouldn’t surprise me if you find Fenn’s gold.

    • I am starting to look at the clues. It is too bad that there are not a whole bunch of little treasure chest to find in each Rocky Mountain state. When my kids were small they loved treasure hunts. In fact Easter became a fun and all night endeavor. I would hide a basket filled with toys and one big toy and some healthy edible things too. I purchased little plastic eggs and put a clue in each one. There were two baskets so I hid them and then worked backward with each egg and clue. I would help if they got stuck. It always lasted about an hour and was truly so much fun. I think it is a great way to get kids outdoors too. I remember the Goonies. Every kid needs an adventure somewhat like that. Anyway I wonder if it will be found almost by accident at some point. Someone building a summer cabin digging around and sees something shinny after digging and there it is. Don’t know but Fenn did get people out there with families looking. I think bring the kids and all along. If you don’t find anything maybe hide a little treasure yourself! All the more rewarding.

  3. There are nine clues, and nine sentences in the poem.
    I believe that each sentence contains a clue.

    That being said, it was on the morning news that a group of people searching for Forrest Fenns treasure were meeting up at the Chama River camp ground. So, I asked my mother if she would like to go on a road trip up there. Sure, why not. We took 84 a couple of miles north of Ghost Ranch, turned on 151, and took the single lane hard packed dirt road. We stopped at the Big Eddy pull out. There were lots of vehicles but no people at that beautiful spot. Then we went further up to the Whirlpool Camp ground and went down to a big mud puddle and backed out. There were some scattered tents but no people. Then we drove further up the road until we found the Chama River camp ground. It was full of tents without people. We found a group of women under a canope enjoying their drinks…a lot. I asked them if they knew anything about the Fennboree. They didn’t, but they said that there was some lady with a turquois necklass saying that she found the treasure. We laughed at that one. With all the tents but no people I fiqured that we must have arrived after the apocalypse. So, we went up to the Monastery of Christ in the Desert. It is an awsome place. Serene and beautiful, the brothers just eminate with a spirit you will not find in the city. My mother found all of her christmas presents in the gift shop. Treasures enough for me.

    The first sentence of the poem has the first clue, and so on.

  4. Another newbie, just joined. Thanks for such an awesome site, Dal.

    Here are what I think to be the 9 clues:

    1. Where warm waters halt – initial point/starting point, could be very general
    2. Take it in the canyon down – gives direction, bearing would depend on direction canyon runs downstream
    3. Not far, but too far to walk – not sure, anywhere north of 20 miles, probably less than 100.
    4. Below Home of Brown – key clue, find this and you’ve pinned down the search area. “Below” keys off of “put in”, so I think it doesn’t mean south of, or elevation-wise, but actually downstream/down-canyon from HoB.
    5. No place for the meek – not sure, might describe another direction (into dark woods or a narrow trail/ledge, for example)
    6. End is drawing nigh – still thinking about this, but agree with the obscure definition of “nigh” meaning “the nigh/left side of a horse.” so this is telling us to go somewhere finite on the left.
    7. Heavy loads and water high – I have a very good idea on this, and don’t want to share with the world. Mine!
    8. If you’ve been wise and found the blaze – no, not gonna reveal this either, until I exhaust my physical search and give up or someone gets there before me.
    9. Look quickly down – not sure on this, either. Will depend on the blaze.

    So, there you have it, my take on the 9 clues. I’m new here and would love to hear what you guys/gals think.

      • Are you saying that I have a fresh perspective? 🙂

        I will admit that one of my main fundamentals in coming up with the clues is to try and not repeat the same thing over and over. However there have been many good things said over and over which I incorporated.

          • Ah, your comment was sarcasm, I see. 😉

            I have been reading, but a quick perusal of this thread shows me that no one’s listed out nine clues (double-check, yes, that is the name of the post)…

            So now that I have enumerated specific clues for discussion, let’s discuss! 🙂

            FYI, I’m an old guy living in the Rockies, and I’ve been obsessing over FF’s poem for about 2 weeks now. Today was my first trip into the wilds. Came home with some good recon and a tweaked ankle.

          • if you use the control key and f key you will have little box come up that will help you search this site and older postings. i was a newie i few months ago i am tired and had a rough week so i will make this short enjoy your swim with the sharks. some are nicer than others and some are harmless IMO. use that search thing to look up some my thoughts on paddle, meek etc have fun. oh use IMO or sharks can snap at newbies.

          • I think there are some on this blog who could do a better job welcoming those new to the search. Yes, there are some information and ideas repeated by those are brand new. However, there’s a reason why Forrest made the statement that children would have an easier time with the quest. Let the new perspectives thrive, even if they come with some previously articulated ideas.

        • Welcome naught !

          That’s a great start for a newbie.

          The best advice I could give you – is go to Forrest’s web site and read the poem there. Think about why the poem does not have a title.

          Read the long story (found on the web) of MY WAR FOR ME. Pay attention to how he describes what he saw – the meadow etc…..

          Remember this is supposed to be fun and incorporate things that are – like rainbows, the wizard of oz – maybe even Judy.

          Buy the book – it’s a good thing.

          Good luck to you !

    • I think it is pretty straight forward and logical, which is how I tend to think. I agree almost completely. I believe “No paddle up your creek” is one though.

      • I could see replacing the “meek” clue with the “paddle” clue… I read somewhere that the clue could be paddle->oar->ore, saying that there aren’t any mines up the creek (abandoned gold mines are very common nearly everywhere in the Rockies).

        Or, it could refer to a creek to small for a canoe.

        • I think “If you’ve been wise and found the blaze look quickly down” is all one clue. But that’s me. There are laws in just about every state regarding navigable waterways so I agree with your comment. For me it does mean a creek that is too shallow to paddle up in a canoe or kayak.

        • Welcome Naught! It looks like Dal forgot to number this “Nine Clues” section so you wouldn’t know that this is PART 48 of “Nine Clues” so a lot of discussion has gone on about just what the 9 clues are and how to interpret each one. 🙂

          I think pretty much along the same lines as you do for the clues. I see the poem as being pretty linear so if we have the correct WWWH, we should be able to go on to the other 8 clues but, because of all the different interpretations possible for the clues, it seems no one has been able to get past the 1st 2 clues.

          There’s a ton of good info on this site and a good place to start reading is the “most important info” section. Good Luck to you and happy reading!

    • Exactly what I was going to say threerocks. I think both of those comments were unnecessary and rude.

    • Good luck Naught and Wekcone to the blog 🙂
      You will have fun on this adventure 🙂

  5. I think there are more than nine clues. “Gone alone” could be a clue pointing to hermit mountain, etc.

    “Hint of riches new and old” is another clue.

    I think these smaller clues will help verify your search location.

    Hind sight is 20/20. Once someone finds the treasure I think we will all be kicking ourselves.

    • Hey YSREBOB. Mr. Fenn has said many times that there are nine clues. He has also differentiated between clues and hints.

        • Yes and Welcome YSREBOB….Great blog name…Hints sprinkled in the book…Thrill of the Chase….says Forrest. And clues in Two Far to Walk “because the map is in the book”.

          Best Wishes, Lou Lee Bear

  6. Welcome Naught and others.
    Forrest said…Hear me all and listen Good. So we need to listen. Forrest has said all you need is the Poem and a good map.
    I am glad fresh minds are here. May you find a treasure everyday. Lots of really super smart people out there. But…the meek shall inherit the earth….Right?
    Good Luck and sweet dreams.

    Lou Lee, Chased by Bear in Jellystone Park and lived to tell the tale.

    • …anybody heard of the Singing river? Alabama and a small town named Muscle Shoals? What if the line “hear me all & listen well” refers instead to a moving body of water.

      Caught the Muscle Shoals documentary on Netflix, where some dude talked about his great great indian grandmother.

      She and the other Indians were relocated to Oklahoma in 1839. None of the waters there sung the way they had in ‘Bama, it took her 5 years, but she eventually walked back to the south.

      • I have heard of Singing Tree’s, I have one in my back yard. I will try to read up on Singing river. Thanks for the info. Lots of great Indian history to learn. I have many many books I have collected on the subject. So many tribes.
        Happy Hunting, 9clues
        Lou Lee Belle

  7. Hey Lou Lee,
    I think the Meek inherit the land? That’s why a few have said a cold creek is no place for the meek. Or, that it might be worth the cold, or no human trail? Just Say n’!
    Mark H.

    • This was the first thought I had as well, but since this is based on a bible verse and Mr. Fenn has confirmed that bible verses aren’t relevant I had to come up with something else. Joe Meek also seems like it could be an obvious solution, but I personally don’t think so. No offence Lou Lee, but I believe Brown is capitalized because it is a noun and not and adjective, so I think if meek was referring to Joe Meek it would be capitalized as well. The Websters definition of meek is “deficient in spirit or courage”. Mr. Fenn has said that there is no human trail in close proximity to the the treasure. I believe that for the first few clues we are in a vehicle and “put in below the home of Brown” is where we exit our vehicles. While there may be no human trail in close proximity we do know that Mr. Fenn made two trips from his car to the spot carrying a fair bit of weight in one afternoon so the spot can not be a terribly long distance from the place where he parked. So “From there it’s no place for the meek” I believe means that we are simply leaving the beaten path and heading into the wood. There is always a chance of running into some kind of wild animal in the Rockies and I believe Mr. Fenn is merely saying that the meek stay on the path or in their cars, and the mavericks make there own trails.

      • Hi, Seebee88

        Gosh no, offence, I Love hearing Every One’s Idea’s! Many have a different spin on things. Just because i post an idea, does not mean I think that is IT. We just dont know till the treasure is found. Meanwhile I am just sharing my Lowly idea’s on the chase. You guys are all way way smarter than me. RIght?

        Much Respect to Forrest and all that have served our country.

        Have a Happy Memorial Day. I will be remembering my Son on this day.

        Low Lee,………..bear

        • Thanks Dal. Didn’t expect you to reply to any of my comments but since you did I’ll say how much I appreciate all the work you and Goofy do running this site. It’s a great resource that many people clearly make use of. Like most people I’m not ready to give up my exact location yet but I’ve been lurking for almost two years now so I figured I should start contributing a bit. I didn’t want to continue this thread so I threw up some more of my thoughts on the bottom of the page. Thanks again.

      • Well I will say it again Seabee, when I said the meek verse in my post, I am fully aware Forrest said no bible verse. It was something I was just thinking about the other night. And As far as Joe Meek, I should of said too that my thoughts on that was just research I just did. And as I posted in response, We just dont know what forrest meant till the chest is found…Just talking idea’s.

        I have been on this chase along time and I KNOW these things because I have researched tons!!!! I am just sharing known idea’s from all my research possibilities. I dont take offense, but some people on this blog can’t wait to disagree with you, or try to prove you wrong!

        Forrest wanted this to be fun, not for us to try to prove how much information you know to tell other searchers they are wrong.

        Try to be nice everyone. Sorry if anyone took what I said wrong. If you read my posts you would of known I do not think it has anything to do with a bible verse. It was just something I said. Be Kind.

        Lou Lee

        • There are a few on here who seem to be rude and condescending but for the most part everyone seems very decent. Believe me though, I know exactly what you mean. I remember as soon as I found out about this treasure hunt I stayed up all night reading everything about it and researching. Like almost everyone I thought that I had it figured out two days later. I’m on the east coast so I could run out and hunt right away so I just kept researching. I bought TTotC and TFTW, read every book Forrest mentioned, looked for everyone named Brown in US history, studied every location Forrest talked about, bible verses, latitude and longitude, and much more. Joe Meek and the bible verse “The meek will inherit the earth” were my two first thoughts on that line. In fact it wasn’t until Forrest said bible verses weren’t involved that I had to change my solve. I know exactly what you mean when you speak of researching and learning. I personally got to a point where I realized that I had to be over thinking it and take a step back. Canyon down is driving down the caonyon. Put in is entering a river. Up your creek is actually walking up a creek. These are just examples and my opinions but I think that it really is as simple as defining the nine clues and finding the correct location.

        • Bible verses aren’t important in solving the poem because f said they will not lead you to the treasure. But, IMO knowing about f’s “Higher Hand” may be very important. Here’s an example: “There’ll be no paddle…”
          Here at T (cross) ere(before) e or L (both l and el) are references to God. B is also Hebrew for God and the Jesuit symbol for treasure. The chest may also be hidden in the cleft of a rock (Exo 33:22; Song of Sol 2:14) so once you are near the treasure location, biblical knowledge could help, imo

    • Mark H.
      I was pondering again what you said. Or what I said and what it might of meant . Anywho……Wouldn’t it bee cool if forrest gave you title to some land….in the Rocky Mountains. What if that was a surprise.!!! Just Imagine…..:) In the Chest, title….to the land.
      Secrets and Mystery……Fun thoughts.

      Lou Lee Bear, still hoping the treasure is waiting there for me.

      • Giving title to land in association to the treasure is an interesting idea.

        I have often wondered how FF can be sure the treasure is still out there. Someone could have already claimed it without anyone’s knowledge.

        Perhaps there is some kind of land title or a safe deposit key. Maybe a trust.

        Another option is that the treasure is close enough to FF so he can periodically check on it. I know I would if it was my treasure.

    • Hi LouLee ,Hi FTMBS

      I think it’s more like “The meek shall inherit the Earth”
      My opinion is I don’t have one.. =)
      If that be said , who says being meek is being weak.
      Or a meek person can’t handle the cold……
      or warm ……..

      IMO only

      Worth the cold, dose not pertain to that .
      So, hear me all and listen good.

      These are the clues them selves shrouded in words. Each stanza is a riddle , and there is a answer…

      • Just a simple way of saying I put the chest in the earth (brown) B low …


        Letter “B”

  8. If the clues did not exist when he was a kid, but most of the places did…. so, hoB for instance, is not some term for a place that he heard adults speak of when he was a kid, or some semi-famous persons’ home from way back or any other term that would go back in time. But tI could be something on a lesser scale that f thought up, after being a kid.
    So what does this line of thought do to hoB being a boyhood fishing hole???

    • That line of thought could rule out, places like Devils tower, the Blaze Mtn, all these place that had there names or nick names known for decades.

      • If the clues did not exist when he was a kid, but most of the places did…. This brings up another elephant in the Room.
        One or more of the places did not exist…. this makes me think that some event of nature is one or more of the places the clues refer too.

        • I should same “some semi recent” event of nature.
          That brings up a place many of us have looked, and Not found the TC…. so.. that brings up an important question, IS IT Buried… that would explain why many have looked there, but no one has found it.

        • Clues vs. Places

          IMO, just because the clue didn’t exist when he was a kid, doesn’t mean the “proper” name of the place didn’t exist.

          I could give you clues that lead you to Austin, TX without revealing the name, but the place name has been around for quite awhile. The clues on the other hand need not to have existed in the past.

          Scott W.

          • A place that we are trying to connect to home of Brown did exist (most likey), but not by the name of home of Brown. It may have been Bakers”s Hole or 7 mile bridge, and so on.

        • Musstag-
          He did not say “most of the clues”..he said “most of the places”..
          Are the “clues” and the “places” the same?
          I think he wanted you to fall into that trap…

          • Dal what do you mean when you say he did not say “Most of the clues” he said “Most of the places” ???

            From my understanding of are the “clues” and the “places” the same – the wording he uses for the clues he made up when he wrote the poem but the places those words are talking about I’m sure were there even when he was a baby.

          • the poem wasnt written when fenn was a child so the clues didnt exist until he wrote them as an adult. but the places they refer to did and do now

  9. Hi, fenntreasuremarkblogsite,
    When I was writing last night that verse came to me, so I wrote it. I have never thought of that verse in terms of the Chase. So I am interested in what others think of this.
    So to me “no place for the meek” means two things. Joe Meek got to the point were he no longer felt the Rocky Mountains were for him anymore. That was in Wind RIver Mountains. I have read the book a dozen times. Also it was not a place for Meek, when the Bears and Blackfeet were after him in Montana, near Wyoming too.
    The other “No Place for Meek” means to me, this country were Forrest hid the treasure is not a easy place, may have bears, fast running water, cliffs, and or all of these.
    This is what my research has concluded in the last 3 years. Its basic, I am looking for new idea’s. I don’t really believe it has anything to do with Bible verses. Because Forrest said so. But I never believed that even before he said it. There is a couple of Meeks in history!
    Personally I Love meek people, people who are kind and not mean, or arrogant. People who help those in need. Being Meek can be a good thing. Just don’t be so meek that you let a bear getcha….Right? 🙂

    Best wishes Mark H. and everyone on the Chase….

    Lou Lee Belle, a Treasure Hunter and Prospector, from Whoville!

    • Not that I think it is there, but the ghost town of Aldridge is also no place for the meek. Plus, it has everything:

      + Heavy Loads: The coal trams that ran above the trees carrying coal from the mine to the washer in town).
      + Waters High: Aldridge Lake is above the canyon that is below Devils Slide (which also looks like a blaze)
      + Home of Brown: Many of them here! the Joe Brown Trail to the east, the home of Brown at the junction to the north, plus the owner at one time of the mine was named H.F. Brown!
      + Blaze: Where the coal and coke was processed in the ovens, no longer standing but you can research where it was. It created a tarry substance called coke as a byproduct.
      + Tarry Scant: Perhaps this is related to the tarry looking, black, coke pit that was next to the doctors office and downhill from the school?
      + Warm Waters: Closest one would be Mammoth Springs, but Boiling River is also nearby
      + Riches Old: The mines
      + Riches New: The chest
      + The canyon down is the one that contains Devils Slide
      + The creek: Mulherin Creek leads right to Aldridge if you keep left (drawing niegh) while walking up it
      + The wood: Might be the Alder trees, or perhaps the wood from the remains of builds that fell long ago.
      + Aldrige means “sage” in German. a sage is wise.
      + FF could have taken one of the nearby roads to easily place the chest within < 1/2 a mile from his car.

      I can continue with more potential clues, but the point is none of them required me to use a bible, triangulation, a cipher, etc. All I did was try to think like FF would when he was young. He liked adventure, he lived near the area, it was abandoned while he was growing up. You cannot tell me that such an adventurous boy would not explore that area! Hell, he even talks about getting his pants red by sliding down Devils Slide!

      All that said, I do not think it is there, but it does sound like a cool place to check out! More importantly, it did not take a rocket scientist to come up with it.

      Worst case? I learned a ton of history about Aldridge and the surrounding area. will make it more exciting to visit!

      • Yep, I did that trip.. even climbed up the Devil’s Slide. A few others have also.

        It’s worth it, even though the chest is not up there (that I could tell). But I got a good feel for the area and I’ve been back a few times already.

        It’s a great place to start. If you haven’t been yet– this could be your summer for it. The Iron Horse Pub in town has a great deck and good food too.

    • In regards to no place for the meek. I agree, it could mean weak…

      To get out of the car in a place that one is uncomfortable in or unfamiliar with…is no place for the meek. I think this is where the poem tells us we have to put BOG.

      I was just think n’, and without using it as a ref to a Bible verse… although it works… That walking in a cold creek is no place for the meek, and it might be worth IT. Too, walking in a creek or along a creek would parallel no human trail. Probably won’t need a paddle?

      Now, I wonder if up is down?

      I do agree with SeaBee, that if it was Joe Meek or the Meeker Massacre, or a proper noun, it would be capitalized like the hoB.

      However, I also believe The Oregon Trail, Joe Meek, Lewis and Clark as well as what seems like hundreds of others are part of the Chase… Maybe part of the hard work f expected us to have to think about?

      Lou lee, I agree. BOG … No guts no glory!
      Mark H. Thanks!

      • Hi Mark H.
        My gut feeling is that the meek reference is meaning a not for the faint at heart, type thing. It could be a little of both.
        I sure have learned alot more about history. I keep reading more and more books on Rocky Mountains. I think Forrest mentioned a good map, because the old maps that I have, shows different names, than now in a few interesting places. I found a old Brown today. Called something else now in Wyoming.
        I am running up that road now….Its tying in with my WWWH.
        The weather in the Rockys is still….rain rain hail cold snow etc. I am waiting for the weather to change and to be more confident. I do love the rain. Everything is green-green, gives me a excuse to keep reading and researching…..

        Lou Lee, chased by Bear in Jellystone, treasure hunter from Whoville

  10. Where i live there are a lot of places with nick names, Devils hole, Hunky Hall (dance hall) many others, but there is a river that I told my grandkids that if you got a boat and set sail it will take you to China,,,lol,they looked at me puzzled, then I explained ,so now we call it the china river.,

  11. Haha, just watching BC & SD Kid on tv, did you see him shove that bycycle in that tiny creek? It was way short of water High.


    Every time I think I see something in the poem , a hint or clue I follow it to the end.
    But sometimes I just feel as if it right in front of our face. Sometimes I feel like F don’t want it found! At least not in this life time. I can see that chest in my mind eye, but all the various understandings have almost lead me astray .
    If all you need is the poem , then why would you need the book. Oh , the poem is in the book. And why would I need the map, the map is in Too Far To Walk.

    Context of my finds

    1. Coded … I have tried using simple codex applications to this poem . These are Military style de coding from WWII . During the War Poem codes were not uncommon at all . Most were tied 3 ways , A image that the poem was , simple text, and a coded message with in the text using the image to conceal it. It is based off 5 letter words and Utley, is locked by plain text ; one sentence ,or 2 before the simple text ends. Well , I tried for 2 years to see if he had locked it in the formation I have described. To my understanding I have found nothing.

    2. Coded ….. Definition of the terms and words in a breakdown of mathematical function.

    Okay so , Looking at PIE understanding of the words them self is quite fascinating. All language , at the base of it’s history was brought by a mathematical understandings of , ” Function to Understanding ”
    For instance the word Tool. Is a object made by man in order to create something.
    Same with early language , the Letter M comes from the Pictograph of 3 wavy lines, which indicated water . But the wavy lines were used first to depict or show its function . The wavy lines indicate motion.
    So if looking at it in terms instead of language you get a totally different understanding completely.
    For example
    ” As I ” Well as has a mathematical meaning , and the word I is the square root of negative one. So , as you move alone in the poem you get numbers … But , what do the numbers mean . Well I tried to cipher them by alphabet 1-26 a-z.
    Nothing !
    I Tried to follow a path in the definitions , and lead me to a flight manual of how to program flight controls….. ??????,,,,, To A computer language used internationally to program the language whit in the systems that are written in other Human languages .

    3. The poker trail … Easy (% )cards and a Joker 6 stanzas.
    Incorrectly written in the book as 4 cards and a joker. But F wrote it he must have meant it.

    4. HOB .

    A. Oil
    B. Fish
    C. Bears
    D. Fall
    E. Lisards
    F. Captian Brown
    G. Old Forrest Ranger Brown
    H. The Color Brown
    I . Dirty Water
    J. Brown Gas ” Fracking gas”
    K. Type of soil
    L. Type of Story Teller ” The Brown Story Tellers”
    M. Ethnic
    N. NOt a structure

    5. Warm waters Halts

    There has been a lot of comments on this topic.
    From , Clouds to dams .
    To F’s hart , to a mountain , to the divide . As the list goes on … and … on….

    But these are to me the least of the hints of the poem. Through every frustration , I get smarter. By this, it causes me to see in a different way , to become flexible in my mind with out breaking , I like it a lot. To feel the grind behind me that drives me to search for the logic alone ….this … Is like a great challenge of wits , and I like a great game of Chess. The point is , Frustration of this chase where’s on you mentally if you are really looking for this and not just trying to sound smart and posting any old thought. But , studying every day and then looking. Kind of like How many hours a boxer would train for before a Boxing match to win , at least 4 times what your opponent will ! I trained in martial Arts for 20 years and was the State of Florida Champ , for fighting , trust me this is a fact. F trained for 15 years. The question is who trained him? It would seem the Master of the Puppets is pulling strings in this Chase.
    ?…. Or is He …..?
    Maybe the fact is, we all can devise anything we want in this chase and we pull our own strings. Pick your poison so to say. That doesn’t mean that it’s ” The Chest ” Is not there , it simply means , It’s the Thrill Of the Chase and our reality was not F’s. His reality , well I guess you would have to read his book and ” Pick your Poison”.


    Our search has lead us to two States so far. New Mexico and Colorado.
    Which was more of a image to thought journey , and I missed the spot I was looking for by at least a 1/4 of a mile. So , I have to go back there and check again. Only , I found a more direct path recently ,One that my thread a path , and not be so difficult after all . Who knows it could be just another hook line and sinker left by a great fisherman . If so , and it is just that. Then I will have learned another 50,000 dollars worth of an education again , trying to solve what my complex mind wants ….. Maybe it’s a 3d mix between 2 computer languages ? New and old…. LOL just playing now . Have fun all . That is what it is about any way , having fun .
    Good luck in your Chase!

    • …started thinking Fenn means for us to camp out, spend a night in the woods. Fiddled w/ some codes as well, but what about his Lincoln Memorial comment? After reading up on that controversy I studied a bunch of sign language books. The hands in some of the photos look strange. Fenn can be a cruel master!

      • I disagree with your assessment of Fenn Theycallme9.

        It’s my opinion that Forrest is a grandfather and gentleman who appreciates those who get out in the woods, smell the sunshine, share it with families, and try to solve his poem employing logic. He says keep your kids close and be safe.

        • I think people are making this WAY more complicated than it really is. I get enjoyment when I see people looking at F-100 flight manuals, bible quotes, and other silly things. Is this supposed to impress everyone with their knowledge? Having been an engineer and computer scientist for over 30 years I could do the same, but I don’t, to me all indications show that it is not that complicated.

          Note: I’m not saying the chest is easy to find, that would be silly! But I am saying that you don’t need to be an engineering or theology Phd to solve it.

          He clearly states “they will not assist anyone to the treasure location”. And “those things have been offered as positive solutions” only means that they were OFFERED as what the SEARCHER THINKS was a positive solution. It does not, in any way, shape, or form mean that they were positive solutions.

          So anyone thumping the bible, riddling off mathematical equations, or running cipher analysis are wasting their time in my opinion. Even FF is unqualified to do that, and certainly no “simple average everyday family” is capable of it.

          I think the poem, a map, an research of FF’s life (perhaps even only through his TToTC book) is enough. I do not think he made it easy to find, and that was intentional because the goal is to get people away from the computer and out into the real world, the chest was meant as the icing on the cake.

          I do not know Forrest personally, never even met him, but I do believe that he is a man of integrity who would not lie about placing the chest. It is possible, but I do not think he would.

          • Scott,
            not only that, but obviously he’s in the kiss and tell group 🙂
            I’m in the kiss group as well.

            Read the book normally, then read the poem and think about every verse (over and over again), and it goes without saying you should know it by heart. Look for synonyms of every word in it and remember those (try and think like an architect while doing it, that means look for certain connections). Then go back to reading the book slowly and try finding the hints that are peppered within it.

            That’s his advice (minus the architect).

      • …some think the position of Abe Lincoln’s hands (Lincoln memorial/Wikipedia) was intentional ie. Abe is signing his initials. Variuos photos in TTOTC show some photoshopping, maybe some of the hands have been distorted.I have read where it is possible to hide binary messages in group photos of people.
        The beauty of this challenge is the human element, IMO computers will never reach that level of human emotion/ reasoning.

        • It is possible to hide many things in digital photos, we did it at Adobe for digisign. The binary data is encoded into the image while the image is coverted into the frequency domain and is not visable at all in RGB or any other space. This is how a copyright can be encoded, and will still remain (through redundancy) even after re-encoding, or even scaling/resampling the image. This is used in forensic science to authenticate security camera data for example (the hardware, if certified, is required by law to do this). Same is true for scanners and software that scans, for example it is required by law to implement certain code that can detect when someone is scanning money. In fact, you cannot export your scanner hardware or software that scans without doing this.

          Most people do not even know this happens 🙂

        • 9clues, while steganography and cryptography are interesting subjects; I don’t see Fenn using any of those techniques to give hints or convey information. He has basically told us he did not. Just my opinion.

          But for those that don’t agree and/or are interested here’s a site that explains the techniques in simple terms.

      • Theycall me9

        Where is the reference for the Lincoln Memorial comment that Fenn made. I dont remember and cant find that post.

    • Not this again….

      “Some searchers overrate the complexity of the search. Knowing about head pressures, foot pounds, acre feet, bible verses, Latin, cubic inches, icons, fonts, charts, graphs, formulas, curved lines, magnetic variation, codes, depth meters, riddles, drones or ciphers, will not assist anyone to the treasure location, although those things have been offered as positive solutions. Excellent research materials are TTOTC, Google Earth, and/or a good map.f”

      I read through thoughts and ideas, methods and theories, even guesses.

      But what I can’t figure out is Why those searchers who hang on every FF says or writes, Ignore most of what he says.

      • Seeker,

        I ignore most of what he says as well. However, since the poem is all we need to find the chest, and the last stanza in that poem tells me to “listen good”… well….?

        All I need to get down the road to the store is my own two feet, but putting on a pair of shoes before I go might make the walk a little easier. 🙂

        Maybe Fenn has (or will) throw us a hint to make the solve a little easier? I don’t know.

        Scott W.

  13. Had a thought last night I’d like feed back on. “No place for the meek”. When the poem first came did we know it was “in the Rocky Mountains” Only? Maybe that sentence is designed to tell us that, before forest told us himself in TFTW. If so, then it would definitely relate to Joe Meek and the Rocky Mountains being no place for him. IMO
    Any thoughts? When did Forrest narrow it down to the Rocky Mountains only?

    • Hey Kat,
      I researched Joe Meek quite a lot awhile back and came up with nada. That’s not to say that you might not find something. When he says no place for “the” meek, made me think of only “one”.
      If you go that route, a lot of research in your future. And then, tough to pinpoint a spot. Hopefully you can find something in that area, but, for me, in the end, don’t see f making it that simple. Joe Meek would be the first place everyone would look into when “meek” was said. That or sheep.
      I just think it would be as far as he can get away from those two things. But, I reserve the right to be wrong.:)

      • I took a hard look at Joe Meek too. You can’t count it out, because he was like Lewis and Clark, discovering Yellowstone and the Rocky Mountains. Yes it is not capitalized. But well maybe it is just meek, meaning in a not so meek place.
        Anyway, I really enjoyed learning about Meek and he is important in the Rocky Mountains.

        Lou Lee Belle, from Whoville

      • If you’ve looked for information about Joe Meek and haven’t found much, then you didn’t look very hard.

        Meek is mentioned at least once in “Journal of a Trapper”, which we know FF has read. There’s also a book about Meek (and written from his recollections) titled “The River of the West”. While I have never seen FF mention this book or Meek, it is a very interesting account of trapping in the same area and time period as Osbourne’s sparse journal.

        I recommend it as a good read for those in the hunt.

    • Kat-
      You are correct-
      In the beginning we only had “In the mountains north of Santa Fe”.
      He sometimes told folks who made the bold statement that it was clearly in the Rockies, that mountains north of Santa Fe could include the Appalachians or even the Alps…
      One of his first big clues was when he narrowed it down to the Rockies. Most assumed that was true even before he admitted it. But we had no guidance.
      After he handed out that clue some folks speculated that perhaps he designed it so that he could hand out clues over time..
      Such as Rocky Mountains, not Idaho, not Utah…and others that have since narrowed down the location.

  14. “Star Spangled Banner”
    “I Pledge the Allegiance ”
    “I’m proud to be an American”
    “God Bless the USA”
    “All Gave Some, Some Gave All”

    Thanks to all the soldiers for being so Brave, that have served this country 🙂 🙂

  15. Iron

    🙁 I’m going in to do one massage then help my daughter clean 🙂

    Enjoy your day at work. And it’s raining here I don’t know if it will ever stop 🙁

  16. Have a great day Everyone, and thank you for your Service to others and our Country. I have to work too. But I will be remembering those that have gone before us. Make everyday count!

    Lou Lee Belle, Making it Count!

  17. YSREBOB, I agree with the “Hermit” Idea, not just the Peak, after all he once said he wished that his bones might lay beside his TC, however, the deeper you examine this expression the more you realize he only said that as a hint, not a clue, and as you accurately pointed out, there is one significant difference between a clue and a hint.

    Hints are sprinkled here, there and everywhere, in his comments, in his Thrill book, but clues in his poem lead you closer and closer to the TC.

    For example, the first expression in the form of a hint may well be his first words: “Life is a game of poker, happiness is the pot, fate deals you 4 cards and a joker, and you play whether you like it or not”….

    Gambling? Las Vegas, (NM)

    Now where do warm waters halt?

    All along the east side of this map, or should we say at 90 degrees maybe? Page 51 from 141 Main (ST)could be co-ordinates, so is that a degree in Skippy’s future? Or just 90 miles to transport Olga’s ashes? Why 90? What is 90 degrees east of Santa Fe, plus 8.3 miles north at the edge of our map? Yep, take that exit on I 25? Where does that road go? Seems there is a fork thus two roads, both 161 to Golondrinas, which means “Swallows” in Spanish AKA Cozumel, which means Swallows In the Mayan tongue, so it was there Skippy tragically drown in 90 feet of water, in a cave at Cozumel, Mexico? If you continue on you will go thru La Cueva, NM. Just sayin? Buy the way the other fork in this road goes to Ft Union, NM, it is also on Hwy 161?

    All these places I mentioned are in the areas Where Warm Water Halt and cold waters begin on the east side of the Rockies. Mora River (Ora Mae) in pig latin, Cimarron River, means wild, the Candian River, the Vermijo etc.. all turn warm east of the Rockies, so does each river that exits the Rockies to the east, too numerous to name..but a few are Arkansas, Missouri, etc.

    Any thoughts?

    • Does any searcher think WWW halt could be tears as well as the above solve, perhaps there are two meanings to many or all of his clues, one geographic and one metaphoric, ff is so clever he constructed it with a multitude of meanings and if you solve one, you still must find the other to have the exact meaning of one clue.

      That is why some have solved the first two clues and did not know the significance of WHERE they were, so then went past the other seven not understanding how close they actually were.

      Imagine that Rainsville is a hint, La Cueva is a hint, Golindrinas, Ora Mae, I mean Mora, all hints probably have one meaning, but clues may have two, or more does anyone think along those lines?

      Tom Terrific

      • Tom,

        Way back, I was considering the tears theory. I associated the fountain at Angel Fire Memorial (the water disappears under the rocks) with the tears for the fallen. Even “a” hoB could be found there.

        But then I asked myself if a child would know where Angel Fire Memorial is, and what it meant?

        So, yes, I have looked at tears being WWWH, but have since dismissed it.

        Could be wrong though.

        All my opinion of course.

        Scott W.

        • You make a good point Scott, but define a child? Define a Kid? You and I know when girls start makin trouble don’t we? Well are we still kids, or children or what? The weird thing about puberty is not when it starts, but what it causes and of course, when does puberty end?

          It all seems to continue like this:

          The caravan of life shall always pass
          Beware that is fresh as sweet young grass
          Let’s not worry about what tomorrow will amass
          Fill my cup again, this night will pass, alas.

          This reality that is the world of physical
          Is in truth a temporal illusion, magical
          Into which we are born with a joyous call
          Rule the world for some time until we fall!

          There was a Door to which I found no Key:
          There was a Veil past which I could not see:
          Some little Talk awhile of ME and THEE
          There seemed–and then no more of THEE and ME.

          All my companions, one by one died
          With Angel of Death they now reside
          In the banquet of life, same wine we tried.
          A few cups back, they fell to the side.

          In later days I look behind
          And with remorse I only find
          Zestful youth, unaware and blind
          To passage of time, fate of mankind.

          The only constant is time’s passage
          Which is the same for both fool and sage
          To young and old time’s only message
          Engage in joy, put away your rage
          From the unknown set foot upon the stage
          And leaving this cage one day is your wage.

          We are the puppets and fate the puppeteer
          This is not a metaphor, but a truth sincere
          On this stage, fate for sometime our moves steer
          Into the chest of non-existence, one by one, we disappear.

          Just a small part of the Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam

          I hope this did not bore you, but if it did, so what?

          Tom Terrific does not care.

      • I think tears as well.

        He mentioned twice in TTOTC that nobody cries anymore but that thought is indelible part of him.

        Then we have the Omar Khaddam quote “tears wash out…”

        Finally in SB 96 (if memory serves) we have the warm-eyed woman that did his laundry.
        About this last one… I hope he didn’t phrased it as such just to mess with our minds 🙂

      • I tried the tear theory as well. But where I begin that is not the correct theory 🙂 🙂 🙂

    • The Fred Harvey reference led me to focus on NE New Mexico because of the Santa Fe trail/ Santa Fe railroad. I just can’t peice it all together yet.

      • Ahh..the old Santa Fe trail solve. I was convinced the SFT was the hoB for a very long time. As you know. Joseph C. Brown was the surveyor of the trail (hoB).

        What most people don’t know is that the map he drew is upside down and backward. E=W, W=E, N=S, and South= North. I played with “put in below” as meaning – below on his map, which would have really meant North.

        Anyway, I did not find it.

        Scott W.

        • Scott, A child saw Washington’s profile backwards. The ATSF symbol – NM & Vietnamese Cross of Gallantry? About a dozen more subtle refs… bald/skylight/dome, olive green paint job, 1940’s Hit Parade. Don’t give up. The Brown maps sound interesting.

        • To add to your input, the 8.25 miles clue mentioned quite often is in fact a “translation” of 66000 links given by Forrest.
          Links of course, of a surveyor’s chain.

          • it hard to go through all the interviews, postings etc. there are clues in a lot of places and dont get me started on HINTS!!!!???? LOL
            use the control key and f key to search info. it can be maddening.
            as for solves and our solve i will refrain from comment. time will tell and in aug we will get boots on ground. for newbies we have all nines clues solved in our solve and at least two supportive items for each clue.
            example: (not one of our clues)
            canyon down – canyon name is spanish for string
            book – Fenn had giant ball of string
            mountain near by – also called string
            again this is not a real clue but we have all nine clues with supportive facts and for hints in poem or book grand total over 52 points. we could be so wrong and delusional but IMO we are not.

          • Liviu, when I think the term “links” it is usually ref. to a golf course, but in your illustration above it makes perfect sense, another example of old expressions of measurements we no longer use, another example is “Twain” which is a nautical expression for sounding depth in say a river, a lake or a harbor as a boat or ship would travel across. The expression that comes to mind today is “Mark Twain” which means literally we are in deep water and safe navigation.

            Now why or what might the term “Mark Twain” mean in solving this hint?

            Samuel Clemens, AKA Mark Twain
            was a River Boat Pilot/Captain before and at the beginning of the Civil War, he went on to become perhaps the best known of all American writers and was certainly the best loved and had the quickest wit of anyone I have read.

            Did you know that Sam (Mark Twain) and the “Unsinkable” Molly Brown were both born in Hannibal Mo. Just 90 miles north of the start of the Old Santa Fe Trail?

            Both traveled west on the Old Santa Fe Trail and spent time in the Colorado Rockies.

            Do you think ff has read a lot of Mark Twain? Does Molly Brown mean anything to the solve of this poem?

            Just Sayin?

            Tom Terrific

  18. “one important possibility related to the winning solve” What the heck does that mean?
    Does he mean there IS just 1 or nobody has touched on the one that is key? Obviously I’d like to discover a theme, if that’s what it is.

  19. Here’s a thought I haven’t seen on the blogs yet – doesn’t mean it”s not though.

    No place for the meek. Perhaps he is telling us that the “place for the meek” is not the direction we want to go.

    It’s no canyon to the south
    It”s no water high
    It’s no heavy load
    It’s no place for the meek

    Of course the first three examples are NOT in the poem, but you get my point.

    If we take it in this context, then “if you are brave” still fits. You did not choose the direction of the meek.

    Imagine you have a choice to make, and one of the choices leads you to Sheep Valley. Sheep are certainly meek, so you would choose the other route.

    Not really an opinion. Certainly not fact. Just a thought.

    Scott W.

    • How about answering the riddle… Why is it no place for the meek? What or who is Meek?

      If meek are sheep then it’s in a place that’s no place for sheep, like in Sheep-eater or “Mountain Shoshone” territory because they ate big horn sheep.

      Or if meek are church goers then it’s a place where people not in church recreate on Sunday.

      Or if meek are afraid then it’s a dangerous canyon like the Gallatin which has countless white crosses from highway deaths.

      Or if meek are afraid of death then it may be a place of death as in a plane crash or claim jumpers death, Indian burial ground etc.

      Or maybe all apply. IMO ff applied many meanings to each riddle in his poem. The summation gets you closer.

  20. Tom Terrific,
    I agree, IMO it is correct that each clue (and perhaps each hint as well) has a dual meaning; an architect creates a two-dimensional representation of something that is three-dimensional. IMO finding the correct dual meanings is the “difficult but not impossible” part.
    “Have flashlight, will travel”

    • Geoff, I think you may just have hit the nail on the head with the “Architect” comment above, that exact statement was made by ff.

      Now where will that thinking lead us?

      Tom Terrific

  21. What about plane crashes…they are heavily documented. If Fenn is giving us Waypoints he needs reference points, landmarks, physical locations with staying power. In My Opinion written history/ record-keeping will be around much longer than a shopping mall or picnic table. Will an airport still be around in 100 or a thousand years from now?

    Sure natural catastrophes generate reports but that’s too large an area, whereas when a plane crashes, that area is fairly precise.
    Could his comment “one important possibility related to the winning solve” mean that few have considered this unpleasant reality?

    • I think a lot of searchers have considered plane crashes even if it hasn’t been brought up recently.

    • …you know Feb ’59 will always be remembered as the Day the Music died. Maybe a cornfield in Iowa is a bit of a stretch for Fenn’s chase. Incredibly Forrest was given a 2nd and even a 3rd chance at growing old.
      Many of his stories are of those departed. Anybody living into their 80’s will have to reconcile losing loved ones,

      Question is, did he slip a clue or a hint in here amongst all the tragedy? Not saying Fenn was a fan of the Big Bopper, just that he’s very subtle, and you can’t rule out a connection with the manner in which Skippy died. Obviously that kind of pain never leaves you.

      • There is a strong hint, in my opinion, in the story in TFTW of the tragic plane crash of two of his friends and their infant son.

        Many of the pictures in TTOTC Forrest next to the wing of a plane. He mentions wingman several times in both of his books TTOTC and TFTW. Robin Olds once flew his wing. It’s funny how there is so little said about the top ace of WWII. He flew a P51 Mustang. It wasn’t Bud Anderson or Chuck Yeager and it wasn’t Robin Olds. Who was it? I find importance in his name within my solve, not just his nickname but his given one as well.

        • Recently Don McLean shared a ‘small’ bit of insight behind American Pie. People Mag and reported on it if you want to google it. I mention this because it seems it may offer something more to your solve.

          • I did google the it even though you may have been speaking to theycallmenineclues rather than to me. Yes there are connections to the meanings he is giving and my solve. The words of the song itself has some parallels to my ideas about the poem.

            In my solve, the last stanza gives a precise measurement of how far you walk up the blaze. It is Forrest’s feet. What was once aerial bombletts are now areal bombettes, again Forrest’s feet. It follows the blaze, a representation of the greatest trail of all in the quest to find peace. And he did find it. The burden of the pain caused us is not so great as the burden of the pain we cause. But excruciating is the burden of the pain we feel when we are helpless to save the ones we love.

  22. Small correction, from above statement, Mark Twain was born a few miles from Hannibal Mo in a town called Florida Mo. However Hannibal was what he claimed as home.

  23. In TTOTC, Gold and More, forrest stated that he wrote a poem containing nine clues that if followed precisely would lead to the end of his rainbow in the treasure.
    Containing nine clues that…
    nine, not ONLY nine.
    IMO, you may need more than nine to walk right up to it with a smile on your face…

      • jd –

        I am going to give you now, the best advice – pay attention to punctuation in precisely what you said above.

        have fun – lot;s of clues – too many to count.

    • I’m sticking with nine clues and only nine clues,

      If I told you I had a can of Coke that contained 12 ounces, I think we would all concur that is was not more than 12 ounces.

      My opinion, of course.

      Scott W.

        • I have a six pack. It’s downstairs in the fridge getting colder. 😯

          • So, 12 times 6 is 72. Lol and the only “stake” that I’d lay claim to if I could is only gotten in Amarillo, Tx. By downing the whole 72 oz. In one hour!!!! Lol what a stretch!!!! Lol

      • Agreed. Seems we are back to what’s a clue and what’s a hint dilemma. As much as I agree that the poem has many hints… Those hint are interpretations to understanding nine clue, nine clues that will lead to the location of the chest.

        Question now is How to use the clues? Does the interpretation show nine linear steps? Do they explain just the location of the chest? Do the nine clues involve any mathematical calculating? Does the structure of the poem hold a clue? Or are the Nine clues the nine sentences with each sentence having many hints?

        What ever Method, theory or ideas a searcher has… The Author has stated 9 clues… to be followed precisely. That seems very specific to me.

  24. Jdiggins, I have been on five searches in my five years of participating in this chase and have had complete solves on the “9” clues in the poem on each solve area. Are there more clues in the poem? for me yes but it’s a “hint” in the 1st stanza. I had also found hints in the TTOTC book that had connections for each solve area. But my biggest problem was putting Forrest at those spots because they are not places Forrest has ever talked about or my research found. I always talk to a lot people and talk about the chase on all my searches, and by doing that I get Intel on the areas I’m at, and probably get more compatiction doing that too because of their interest in TTOTC. LOL But until recently (on my last search three weeks ago) I got info that puts Forrest in my search area, and info on the things he did while being there (this was not recently Forrest was there and I can’t say when it was because of the reason why). So now I can put him in my best solve area with all 9 clues solved plus four hints in the book are perfect fits instead of me just finding connections. Forrest has also told us searchers hints on the oldsantafetradingco blog that fit there and I completely missed them until now. I say this is MHO on all I have said, and find it true only to me. I have always believed all searchers solves could be the right ones because no one has the chest yet. I only hope I get there first because some people have talked about the area but they end in a different place. Only time will tell until I can head out there, Florida and vacation is a ways off, but not that far. Good luck to everyone. Bur

    • i told this before i think but its worth repeating. i asked hubby where he thought my favorite birding spot was and he name a couple of place i go real often but not my favorite spot. i go there often but i dont mention it much. i love going there . i think fenn’s spot is like that. its not in the book but in the clues.

  25. The nine clues, my best guess

    warm waters
    canyon down
    too far to walk
    no paddle up your creek
    heavy loads and water high
    efforts worth the cold
    brave and in the wood

      • I started studying the poem a couple of years ago. I must have spent 30-40 hours just trying to create a mental image in my mind of what the poem was telling me. But then I got busy, lost interest or whatever and stopped playing with it. It wasn’t until 6 weeks ago, when a friend invited me to visit him in ABQ, that I started researching with GE.

        I have only one solve. I’m flying from the mid-Atlantic tomorrow to see if I’m correct. If not, I will probably end my chase and just follow the bloggers until someone finds it, that is, if I’m still alive by then.

        Doesn’t it seem strange, the countless hours we’ve all spent cooped up inside chasing online, and not what Fenn originally intended, spending time with Mother Nature. Paradoxical, yes?

        I go in peace …riparian…

  26. I came across an author named William Diehl, and he wrote a book called “the hunt”/ 27”. His notable work is Sharkey’s Machine and Primal Fear. It interested me because of his name, and also he is from Woodstock and died in Atlanta (Braves). Using his name and geography, I coordinated it, to the 23 and 24th line in the poem, but using his book title “The Hunt”.(title to the gold) Well inside the book, there is a character named Francis Scott Keegan (Francis Scott Key). Using the date that FSK died, I made it into a coordinate. And it put me on the border of Idaho and Wyoming. Literally on the border. Just south of Yellowstone on Fox creek and east of Death Canyon, in Targhee Forest. Has anyone checked that out? 27 seems to be a common number I feel. Just tossing around ideas.

      • THANK YOU seabee88. hubby ask me WHY i read postings like the above? i told him i enjoy lessons in logic. LOL
        i also find them sooo reassuring that our solve is safe.

      • He also said you may want to take a sandwich and a flashlight. Do we need a flashlight and a sandwich and a poem? Or does the poem turn into a sandwich and flashlight?

  27. Going to throw one of my old “heavy loads and waters high” out here. I was reviewing some old notes and couldn’t get it out of my head. It’s currently not part of my current solve, but I sure would like feed back.

    A commercial vessel, even small yachts for hire, have several markings along the water line of the hull. There are several markings on the boat to indicate where the load line should be depending on water type and season.

    So my old solve for this is that it must be associated with a boat. A “heavy load” would place the “water high” on the hull.

    The only place I could think of to apply this is the E.C. Waters steamship remains, but that has been picked over.

    Anyway, I liked this solve for heavy loads and water high at so point in the past.

    Scott W

    • Interesting Scott, very thoughtful observation. The words “no paddle up your creek” implies to me that I don’t need a boat.

      • I wasn’t implying you needed a boat, but rather putting the question out there is it related to a boat.

        Like I said, I could not make this fit, but it seems so perfect for the clue (to me). Just because I couldn’t make it work doesn’t mean it’s not right. 🙂

        Forgot to add IMO to my posts. Sorry Goof.

        Scott W

      • Darn, I like your thinking Scott, but I don’t have the time, nor the patience to consider a new search. It’s already consuming me as is. My wife is ready to send me for a compulsive disorder analysis.

    • q1 – I see water high as elevation – or north of heavy loads to the blaze imo

      • Yes – many do. I have had solves with and without elevation.

        Perhaps it describes a place. Something like Ore Mountain Lake. <– fictional. I made it up as an example of a place.

        • q1 imo – I think heavy loads and waters high is place and to me its sending me – north of this body of water to the blaze – im not trying to change your mind in your way of thinking just having a good conversation but like I said its only my opinion frank

          • How are you getting the direction north? I believe heavy loads and water high is also. Finding the blaze is something that I have put a lot of thought into. One of the things that the poem does not give us is distances. I loved pirates as a kid and in all the movies and books about pirate treasure, and I realize probably fictional, but they always said something like “Walk 60 paces north and then 30 paces west”, giving specific directions as well as distances. Since the poem doesn’t give us any directions as to distance, we go from “heavy loads and water high” to the blaze. To me, this means once we find heavy loads and water high we will have to search the surrounding area for the blaze. I think that it will be in close proximity but without exact directions and distances I believe some searching will be required to find it. All IMO.

          • I meant I believe heavy loads and water high is also a place. I also wasn’t trying to sound like you were wrong. Just wondering what words or line in the poem was making you think north is the direction you should go.

  28. I will preface this by saying that these are my thoughts and opinions so I don’t say it repeatedly throughout this post. I have been researching and trying to decipher the poem for two years now and these are some conclusions I have come to.

    Forrest has said that the poem is straightforward and a child could solve it, so a straightforward approach is the one I have taken. I’ll start by giving my interpretation of the nine clues.

    1. Begin it where warm waters halt
    2. Take it in the canyon down
    3. Not far, but too far to walk
    4. Put in below the home of Brown
    5. No place for the meek
    6. No paddle up your creek
    7. Heavy loads and water high
    8. If you’ve been wise and found the blaze
    9. Look quickly down your quest to cease

    I know that the nine clues are one of the most debated subjects. I know that many people believe there are clues in the first stanza or that the poem tells us where warm waters halt. I personally don’t believe this to be the case. I think that logically we begin at “Begin” and end at “cease”, and knowing that the clues are contiguous the other seven must lie between those two points. I have tried reading the poem with only stanzas 2, 3, and 4. While all of the clues are contained within these stanzas it is not nearly as poetic and we are missing some clues. Stanza 1 is an introduction, telling what he has done. Stanza 5 tells us why he has done it. Stanza 6 gives us a couple of valuable hints and closes the poem.

    Forrest has made the distinction between clues and hints. The other two lines that are often considered clues are “Brave and in the wood” and “Effort will be worth the cold”. I believe these are the two hints in the poem. In the wood rules out anywhere that trees aren’t present, I.e., plains, deserts, etc. Worth the cold refers to water. I tried to think of the only way we would be guaranteed to be cold, regardless of the time of year. Forrest has often warned people about the dangers of the Rockies during winter and I think the chest would be near impossible to find buried under snow so. Winter searching seems like an all around bad idea. Since time of the year isn’t related, the only conclusion I could come up with to get cold during the summer was water. Even though cold and warm are matters of personal opinion and preference, the majority of mountain rivers and streams stay around 60 degrees or colder. I don’t think there are many people who could argue that isn’t cold. So “worth the cold” is telling us that we will be getting wet at some point.

    As I said previously and Mr. Fenn has said, the clues are straightforward and contiguous. I don’t believe that there are any numbers, codes, latitudes and longitudes, or any hidden information in the poem. The clues simply are waypoints on a route. Once we know the correct warm waters we go from point A to B to C and so on.

    I’ll list some bullet points about a few of the clues.
    • Warm waters. Warm is always a word I have had a problem with since it is hard to define. Warm is a matter of opinion that differs from person to person, so it would difficult to define exactly where warm waters halt. Based on this I don’t believe it has anything to do with temperature. The only logical solution I could come up with was the New Mexico Game & Fish defined Warm Waters. Of the four states in play it is the only one that uses the specific term “warm waters” and the locations where they halt are specifically marked, giving a very precise location as to where to start. Coupled with the fact that Forrest has said warm waters halt in many places, this just makes perfect sense to me.
    • Not far, but too far to walk. This is another that I had to do some thinking on. Far and too far are also very vague terms. How far is too far to walk? I read an article about a gentleman who is walking around the globe and has already walked 12,000 miles. There is no distance that can not be walked. I don’t believe it is referring to distance but saying that we literally can not walk to the next point. In my solve there is a road in the canyon. Laws prohibit walking along interstates. The only way to get from my wwwh to hoB is by driving down the road that runs through the canyon. Sure, you could go on foot through the forest but technically that would be hiking. You could go through the river but that would be wading. So too far to walk isn’t a specific distance but alludes to the fact that we can not walk to the next point.
    • Home of Brown. I’ll come right out and say that for me this Brown Trout. I’m not ready to give up my specifics for this yet but my hoB is very specifically designated spot and it is not a fishery. I realize that this has been another point of contention and some will disagree with this. Whatever your opinion, I will say that I think Brown is capitalized simply to indicate it is a noun and not an adjective. If the poem said “home of brown”, that would mean a house that is the color brown. I haven’t counted the number of brown houses in the Rocky Mountains but I’m pretty sure that treasure would be unfindable if we were searching for the correct brown house.

    I know this is lengthy. These are just some thoughts and conclusions I have come to while doing two years worth of thinking and researching. Maybe they can give some insight to someone else. Thanks for reading.

    • I have found the stetment “warm waters” also defined in a official fishing document for Montana. It is in a pdf file if I remember correctly.

    • Seabee – forrest said that the treasure is north of sf so to me – wwwh is the starting point – from there you go north to water high you go north to the blaze – from there look quickly down – down is north to get in the wood from there you go north in the cold to where you find the treasure chest imo

      • imo – home of brown is not a place you go to – its just a land mark that tells you that you have the right wwwh

    • Great Post Seabee.
      initial thoughts are I would say you have the same lines of thinking as me for 99.9%
      I totally agree with your start-stop points of poem, and I too have mulled over ‘worth the cold’ for a summer search.

      I’m off to re-read your post.

    • Seabee88,
      I would like to applaude you for a comment that was very enjoyable for myself to read. You get a thumbs up for that one!

    • Nicely done seabee. Thanks for sharing…and helping. You have a clear and easily understood style and I appreciate your openness. I hope others can share their ideas here, much like you have, rather than launch into an argument against your opinions.

    • Great job Seabee. Your handling of the poem is solid. Twice today tha I feel child like. Getting stupider and stupider. Very humbling really, not stupid. I have been in the chase I believe since Feb. 2013 and have been getting wiser but at a slower pace than most.

      Today my Wwwh and canyon down= Canyon basin
      Too far to walk is a distance of sort
      HOB is wordplay

    • Hi Seabee, Thank you for sharing. I too thought very much like you when I entered the chase. I also observed similar observations from many other searchers, especially those that enter the search. So I believe your opinion is fairly close to the mark as far as the average searcher.

      Forrest said it would be difficult, yet not impossible and begs the question why has it not been found if the 9 clues are commonly accepted. I concluded two things:
      1) Clues are understood and straight forward but applied in the wrong geographical area; and/or
      2) There is a trick to interpreting those hints that lie within the poem that define the clues.

      I have since challenged my original beliefs and focused on option 2 while keeping option 1 in mind.

      For instance, we agree “in the wood” is a hint but does that mean it is physically in the wood, where wood is trees or is it a hint that defines one of the other clues and has nothing to do with physical location of trees? This is where I have changed my line of thinking. I have experienced and learned making assumptions can kill a solution and thus I have backed off from assumptions and I now try to look a little deeper and imaginative in what those stanza 6 hints mean.

      Hopefully in a month I will be able to expand on the different angles I have taken and introduce some newer incite on my progress and newer concepts. But in the mean time my Finding Fenn story illustrates how I interpreted “worth the cold” primarily as a key word concept while meeting it from a literal sense.

      Thanks again for sharing and it is good to see some relevant conversation.

      The Wolf

      • I am not trying to confuse matters for anyone nor am I expressing a fact or truth, just my thoughts and not even my opinion yet.

        If a clue subsumes more than one line where else to look for the other 8?
        For instance.
        1- Let’s go to cooler waters down in the canyon.
        2- Ah, its not far let’s drive down by Joe Brown house.

        Just thinking out loud sort of since I don’t have any great clues to share. Thoughts?

    • Great comment Seabee, and very well written. You make a good case for your solutions, and I agree with you on your straightforward approach.

      I have several solutions that almost agree with your nine clues exactly. I think most of us inject our personalities/resources into our solves and I find that interesting. I work in the Rockies/western US so I have access a lot of folks don’t have. But I never know where I’m going to be so I’ve taken the dart board approach. I can come up with a pretty good solution for any where I’m going. I’ve yet to come up with a gas up the truck and head out solution. Mostly because I already know what many searchers find out the hard way; which is the landscape of the west is vast and it doesn’t look the same on the ground as it does on google earth. It could take weeks or months to thoroughly search a very small spot on the map……

      I haven’t been able to nail down for certain any one clue; I have solutions that “brown” is everything from trout to trappers and even the governor of California. San Francisco Peak?

      One commonality I have found over the years with my solutions, posted solutions, and solutions folks have sent me is that some/many of the clues fit a spot perfectly; then we start contorting the clues that don’t fit……Some of the clues fit so perfectly the solution just has to be correct.

      There is one unique spot where all the clues fit perfectly. I haven’t found it……yet.

      • …yep Goofy, you & Seabee make some good points, a very calming post. Fenn said don’t over complicate the poem, but why write TTOTC in a dumbed-down manner. Yes he talks about making reading more interesting, sort of at the 8th grade level.

        Why did he over-use contractions in that book? I haven’t read his other non-treasure books, but his blog entry “The Mother of Indiana Jones August 24, 2000” tells me he can write a college thesis, if need be.

        Simply put, I hesitate to have ff lull me into thinking this solution is as simple as looking for a good fishing spot

        • Theycallme9clues,
          In the Important Literature chapter, f writes about The Catcher In The Rye. Did you happen to read the book by JD Salinger? You didn’t happen to notice an overuse of contractions in it by chance, did you?

        • I like how you said looking as opposed to finding that good fishing spot. This is his solution.

      • I thanked Dal up above but I will thank you also for all the work you do maintaining such a great site. It is an amazing resource for all of us here and it seems to be the first place newcomers arrive at after every new interview with Mr. Fenn airs.

        I absolutely agree with the fact that we inject our personalities into our solves. I have read interpretations of the clues and the poem that I would never have thought of because we see things differently. I think is simply because of the different ways our minds operate. Some of us are very creative in our solves while others are very methodical and analytical.

        I also know what you mean about contorting the clues. When I first read TTotC I was positive the chest was in Yellowstone and the Firehole had to be where warm waters halted. By the time I got done with a complete solve using that as my starting point my clues were so contorted and twisted that I realized it would never work. Not that I believe it isn’t possibly in Yellowstone or the Firehole isn’t WWWH, I just couldn’t make it work. The more time that has gone on the more I start to see when I begin to try to make the clues fit a location and realize I should move on if they don’t make themselves fit.

        You’re also right about there being one unique spot. We will have to agree to disagree about you being the one to find it though.

        • Thank you Seabee, I’m glad you enjoy the blog.

          Over the years I’ve come up with many different ways of looking at the clues and solutions. I can make a good circumstantial case for any clue or philosophy of looking at the clues, even the magical Zen solutions. I think I could make anyone’s great grandfather’s second cousin the key to solving the poem with enough research and magical conversion to lat-lon coordinates.

          Fenn said the poem is perfect, straight forward, and written by an architect. Simple does not mean easy; the solutions to many/most problems are obvious and simple, but can be very difficult to accomplish………That is how I look at the poem.

          This opinion is guaranteed for thirty minutes or thirty miles which ever comes first. 🙂

          • Seabee88, & Goofy yes when you put your mind set into the solves the connections can be to numerous to count. Seabee88 I too started in Yellowstone and my first two solves were WWWH Mamouth Hot Springs and both roads leading down from them to my special solve areas (long story to much to write). I also considered “Firehole” but seen the area I thought the chest would be and found it a very hard trek and washed that idea because Forrest wouldn’t have done that.

            Now back to our mind sets. If you’re only staying with just your thoughts (guessing) on connections in solves and not using solid facts in this chase then you are more likey “not” then “are” going to come across the chest IMO. I opened my mind after Yellowstone and I started to think “out of the box” like others back then, but again I kept thinking more in my direction then in the direction Fenn, the Poem and the TTOTC book hints were leading to go. Ok yes everyone does this but over time I have relaxed in my thoughts and research and only went with what was right in front of me, not chasing vapor trails. Forrest has always given us hints from the begining, it’s in the words in statements he has “said” or “written” out of context that the hints are hidden, and not the ones repeated time and time again. As for me Forrest has a certain theme about him through out his life, it’s like a hand jester that you do all the time and don’t realize it, so it’s hard to break. He has explained to us how to solve the poem over the years but we are not grasping it.

            Not sure how many searchers when on their searchs talk and question people in there solve areas? I talk to all I can from public officials, to shop owners, to waitress, to the everyday Joe walking down the street. You would be surprise the info you can get concerning the area your in and how it connects to this chase. Also in talking to them one of my questions is “do you know a guy named Forrest Fenn?”. If the answer is “no” then I go into the whole spill about him and the treasure. It’s funny how people will open up to you and really focus on every word your saying when you say there’s a chest with gold in it and I believe it is hidden in this area.

            Ok what I’m getting at is, it is hard to discuss your area of search with fellow searchers because of wanting to keep your dangerous Intel a secret, but complete strangers, who know nothing about this chase, are good for bouncing your solve ideas at. They tend to give you good information not knowing it’s info you are searching for. So with that being said I want to thank two special people in Colorado whom I meet three weeks ago on my last search for the best conversation I have ever had that has put me in the direction I needed to be. I will be out your way again soon. Hope your reading this blog as I told you about.
            Fellow chasers keep your minds open and research Forrest, the facts are there and don’t be afraid to ask “why” when you see a connection, if that can’t be answered then move on. Good luck in all you do.

            Dal, Goofy- sorry for not staying on topic here. Sometimes I like to give friendly advice whether or not anyone listens. LOL
            Thanks &
            Salud. Bur

      • In causal model statistical studies ,they may come up with different causal models that could fit the available data to attempt to capture the real causality of variables under study….to make the better choice they then compare the models with certain “goodness of fit criterion” and select the better one.The interpretation is that from the candidate competing models on the table, one model is selected as a better option but not as perfect as there could still yet be another model that performs better.. they say all models are wrong but some are useful.Unfortunately for Fenn treasure chase unless we come up with the perfect model,we can not get away with it as they do in Statistics:-)

        Tintin Treasure

        • how about woodsmen of world they offer cancer insurance etc to people

  29. Seabee

    Wwwh it differs from person to person
    I find that to be true 🙂

    • Mason has been discussed before. Don’t think anyone was able to confirm either stone working or fraternal order. If it was important, it would have shown up in memoirs, scrap books, or the poem which it never did.

      • I disagree that it would have shown up in memoirs, etc. Secrecy and silence is a core value of freemasonry. I do think there is a lot of masonic symbolism and metaphors in the clues. Even if he is not a Mason, there is enough public knowledge of Masonic “hidden in plain sight” symbols that he could make use of them in his puzzle.

        I see a striking similarity between these two quotes:

        Forrest Fenn, The Thrill of the Chase, My War for Me chapter: “When the realization hit me, at last I knew. If I cannot enrich those with whom I interact each day and cause them to be better for my having passed their view, then I have wasted my turn. That I succeed in this endeavor is not as important as it is for me to make a solid try. For if the try is sincere I have succeeded in whatever failure resulted…. So now, at last, at least I know. And if no one should ever think of me when I passed this vale, it will be of no consequence, for I have finally found my way and am at peace with all of it.”

        Albert Pike, who published a book called Morals and Dogma of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry in 1871: “What we have done for ourselves alone dies with us; what we have done for others and the world remains and is immortal.”

        • Nicely put together Jack,

          I do keep bumping into Masons and the one I was surprised about was Clark Gable.

          Did you know that Clark and Carol gave two parrots to Judy Garland? She named them Clark and Carol.

      • If you believe in hidden codes and messages, 6-24 is in the poem. six stanzas and 24 lines. June 24th.

        I hear that is St. John’s Day. One of the two Masonic feasts. Not my opinion. Just read it somewhere.

        Scott W.

        • Scott W. Thanks for the posting Masonic info. TTOTC has many references to 90 degrees, circles, pi, pyramids, etc which may correlate as well. Level, compass, plumb line are the tools of the trade. If ff was a mason, there may be hints at level 33rd degree mason which is cool since 3+3=6 and 6=F.

        • Yes and the other St. John’s Day is St John the Evangelist, Dec. 24, which is the day Forrest arrived home from Vietnam. Both are feast days of the Masons corresponding to the summer and winter solstices.

          He returned from Vietnam on 12/24/1968
          12/24 1+2+2+4 = 9 = the number of clues
          1968 1+9+6+8 = 24 = the number of lines in the poem.

          • From My War for Me chapter:

            “My experience beside the waterfall was on December 22, 1968. Two nights later I walked in my front door in Lubbock to be greeted by my lovely wife and two beautiful daughters. It was Christmas Eve.”

          • Seems to me that he was very meticulous and specific about giving us those dates. There may be a reason for that. It may be the framework that the architect used to design the poem and the puzzle.

          • Jack,

            I wasn’t referring to the day Fenn returned home. I was referring to 12/24 being the Day of St. John the Evangelist, as celebrated by the Masons.

            In my opinion, that date should be 12/27.

            Scott W

          • Oops, I stand corrected. The feast day is the 27th. The significance and symbolism of both St. Johns is the connection to the solstices.

          • Is it assumed that this date is the actual date that f returned and that it is coincident that it totals 9, or other way around?

  30. I agree about your Mason conclusions, however everyone on the Chase at one time or another seems to bump into them and the BSA???

    Yesterday Seabee, you seemed to make a few things more simple than ever before… and again you did the same today…
    I think, for the first time on this blog on any one line or word of the poem… we came to a consensus that “no place for the meek,” was in ref to being weak…
    Just dbl checking?
    And again today, your conclusions in ref to wwwh are as sound as any… Glad you decided to share your thinking!
    Mark H. All smiles!

  31. Help Me!

    one time F siad women have written to marry him. but that he needed them to have plane firs. anyone post link- thanx advance

    • Fenn said that 32 women have emailed wanting to marry him. He grinned while telling me he usually writes back and asks if they have an airplane. Of course he’s only joking because Fenn has been in love with his bride, Peggy, for 60 years.

      I new I’d heard that to but dint remember where.

  32. The Found Object Contest will be closing at 6pm Santa Fe time on Monday. If you have not entered and want to…now is the time..
    You can see the rules, prizes and the 65 entries we have so far at the top of this page, under the header photo, right side, hover your mouse over “Found Object Contest”.

  33. If you submitted an entry to the Found Object Contest but it isn’t posted, please let me know. It’s possible I missed some…

    • I love entering but like Iron Will, I have nothing cool to post.

      You have outstanding entries, so the judging will be tough.

  34. Lots of talk about the map on page 133 in TTOTC and what the nuggets might mean, over in the “in the wood” thread.

    I posted a link to a map over there and thought I would post it here as well for those not following that thread. I know there are many new searchers who probably haven’t found this map yet and I thought I should share it.

    The only thing I have ever noticed about those nuggets (that really caught my attention) is that the frog is pointing to the one that is extremely similar in shape to the “area” in the top middle. (my opinion of course).

    Actually, the shape straddles Northern New Mexico and Southern Colorado. Even the ridge in the middle of the nugget seems to follow the canyon on the map.

    Below is a crystal clear version of the map. I say “version” because there are some very minor differences. For the most part it is identical in my opinion.

    Sorry for the long URL.

    Scott W

    • hold the phone Scooter,

      You left out the other version of that map…Scotty I need more power!! Hasn’t anybody studied every nook & cranny of ?

  35. Again I find myself searching from my arm chair , looking for the 9 clues. Hmm …. 9 Sentences. Hmm. Must Have some thing to do the clue.

  36. Wild Bird
    Thank u for sharing that information 🙂
    Your an angel with wings 🙂

  37. Was having second and even third thoughts about posting this but know this is a major clue in the riddle that is over-looked by nearly everyone.
    However, since it is useless to go in search of the Blaze without knowing other information ( “you’re just wasting your time” as per Forrest), here goes. Obviously, the most important is where to start. I believe this is just as vital as WWWH when you get there to your final destination. I’ve mentioned this point before but almost in passing. I didn’t really emphasize how important it is. So, with a little more explanation and emphasis….
    “The end is ever drawing nigh” is NOT talking about your journey to reach the end. It is referencing the Blaze. The Blaze is ever drawing nigh. It is ever (always) coming to an end. It is useless to think you’re going to locate the Blaze at night. It is ever drawing nigh like the rainbow at a waterfall or the sun shining between the peaks of 2 mountains during a certain time of the day. It is cyclical with the sun. As the sun rises and is shining, the Blaze is visible at least for a short period of time. The Blaze is not some burned tree or a carving in a tree or even a rock formation.
    Hopefully, this will shed some light of a few peoples’ journeys to reach the end.
    And for those of you who question this, why do you think Forrest said to bring a sandwich? He was giving a subtle hint. The Blaze is visible during daylight, or at least during lunchtime.
    Oops, before I forget, all this is obviously IMHO.
    Take care and God bless,
    Kevin P

    • Kevin I think ff also said to bring a flashlight. If the blaze is visible at noon then it must be hidden somewhere dark.

      Thanks for sharing.

    • Kevin,
      I,ve not mentioned the idea that you have come up with on any blogs. But, I have considered it and not ruled it out yet. I have been in the chase since the fall of 2011. It is one possibility but not the only one. It is a good idea if you can figure out where to set and wait. Also there are a lot of good ideas that many are holding close and not telling. Perhaps someone even has it solved and hasn’t gone to check it out yet. Who knows. Good hunting too you.


  38. Hi all,
    I’m a newbe been armchair looking about four month’s. I have read most of the post’s from the past year and I have not seen this mentionted. I would like some of your input or thoughts
    The poem say’s I have gone in there alone. At first I thought a cave or a mine, some place only one person could go.But what if alone is not the key word here ,I’m now thinking “in there” like a paticular place, like a city park or sculpture garden. I know Mr. Fenn said dont go digging up old out-houses. But let’s say in a sculpture garden you find Brown then a Blaze ,and when you look down from the blaze there’s a dry creek bed at the bottom of a hill. At that point you would exit the sculpture garden hence, move away from the structures . That bring’s another question also, the sculpture garden is privately owned ,yet open to the public.

  39. I posted this a few weeks back at CC.
    Why is the blaze is “found”. Why not
    “If you’ve been wise and see the blaze,
    Look quickly down…”

    English is my second language, but to me, a blaze is something inherently obvious and striking.
    Trailblazers didn’t hide them marks in the bushes, now did they?
    Same with a horse blaze, or a white streak on a rock. It’s obvious and you don’t find it… you see it… because it’s a freaking blaze 😀 but you might have to understand it. Anyway I don’t believe it’s the case.

    In the stanza, he uses past participle in this verse then switches to present tense for the rest of it. Why?
    I say, He needed to use the word “found”. He could have used “find” just as well.
    I believe the reason is, that we have to construct/establish it… this way the blaze is absolutely Found by us.

    • Liviu,

      I agree with the blaze needs to be Construct / Establish.
      Now the question is, what method is use to do so?

      Fenn in a Q&A stated to the question, is the blaze a single object? In a words Yes.

      So with this line of thinking, the blaze may be many objects that create a single notable object. But is it just a trail of clues to be followed as in, start at point A go to point B turn at point C etc.
      Or do the points give a distinct design that will be found / seen when they are lined up properly.
      And another possibility is the points are needed to calculate or survey to the final point… the chest.

      I have always felt the elusive blaze is not a single object, such as a tree or a drawing on a rock, But deals with a design, not a path, that is placed through-out the poem. And in the end Constructs the blaze itself.

      • Last paragraph. That’s exactly how I see it, after all the poem was written by an Architect. Why people tent to brush over this little aspect?

        I considered asking you here, but I just asked my daughter instead, “what do you think of when I say Architect?”
        She said: blueprint.
        My wife heard me too and she answered from the other room: construction 🙂

        There you have it. We need to draw and construct it ourselves… ever nigh if possible 😉

        • Hi Liviu, I have thought that because the poem was created by an Architect…which, obviously, leads to a precise location…that maybe there is a beautiful water feature…like a waterfall…at that location. Great Architects like to incorporate beautiful water effects into their designs…like an infinity pool, for example.

          • That’s a beautiful ∞ pool, JC1117….
            Waterfalls are great too. More natural… like done by a landscape architect. I’ve have a little tiny water feature in my yard. It’s in the background of my parrot pin picture under “found objects” pg. 5… The birds and wildlife love it.

        • liviu,

          Blueprint, construct, design, create, all seem simple at first…Make the blaze… my dilemma now is what information in the poem is use to do just that.

          Is it the many physical place the poem seems to be telling the readers, is it the single place or staring point that has something there to be understood, is it the ups, downs, left, rights, ins, that tell us what to make?

          The there is the math side of it. Does the structure of the poem hold the the answers? word counts, stanza, lines, sentences etc.

          Of course some will say this is too complicated… it’s not the KiSS method. Well we have been told it’s difficult but not impossible and we have been told it’s straightforwards.

          But for myself… “straightforwards” does not mean “simple”

      • Seeker:
        Is the Blaze one single object? ~ Scout Around

        In a word – Yes

        • seabee,

          I’m not sure if you’re correcting my paraphrasing of the comment from “A” to “One”… which would be correct.

          Or just saying my thoughts of the blaze may be more than one object that creates a single design couldn’t be correct as the answers is a, yes to one single object.

          Either way… My thought has always been the blaze is a combination of things. The interesting point in fenn’s answer is ” in a word ”

          Most of the time he answers with a single yes or no. Then may add additional comments after. This one Q&A can give a double meaning to the blaze… The Blaze being one single object but only in the sense of the word Blaze meaning a trail of markers to follow. Which, if it is the case, the blaze can be more than one place, marker, etc. that shows a design that must be understood to finish the quest.

          Example; the area may consist of three points in an area. and this would be considered the over all blaze… lets say a triangle…where the last point is the location of the chest… the final 4th point. The triangle being made of three point creating a single [one] object.

          • I just posted it because you specifically said “I have always felt the elusive blaze is not a single object”. I respect your opinion though.

  40. I feel if it is out there, a cave entrance is where the WWH and deeper into the cave is where the remainder of the clues are which is why you cannot go directly to the HOB or to the blaze because you must pass the cave entrance to get there. It also is why you need a flashlight and a sandwich because it is a little ways in there and is dark.

  41. imo – I think that the blaze is a land mark and I also think it means summer just like I think that in the cold means winter this only my opinion

  42. I have never seen this interpretation on this or any blog before. By giving this interpretation, I may in fact give another searcher the breakthrough they need to solve the poem, as I truly believe I have…All is IMO of course. “Why not go get the treasure then?”, you may ask. Well…after over twenty searches, three of them having FILLED me with confidence, it is difficult to convince my family to give up things so I can go search for the chest. And make no mistake…even if you solve the poem and go directly to its location…you still have to locate it!! He’s not giving anything away. Once you locate it, you must retrieve it. If I am correct, retrieving the chest is probably more difficult than placing it was. Anyways, this is the clue I wish to discuss…From there, its no place for the meek, the end is ever drawing nigh. There’ll be no paddle up your creek, just heavy loads and water high. This clue takes you from “THERE” to a creek on the left, that you won’t be boating up, and that has heavy loads and water high, and is no place for the meek. Let’s discuss the word nigh logically for a moment. If we take the line literally, with direction in mind, either the end of the search is always getting closer, or the end of the search is always drawing left, as in the nigh side of the horse. Well, getting closer helps, but always go left helps more, IMO. So let’s contemplate the nigh side of a horse for a moment. When you mount a horse, you place your LEFT foot in the stirrup that hangs from the Left side of the horse, as you and the horse both face the same direction. If you place your left foot into the stirrup while facing the OPPOSITE way of the horses head, you will fail to mount the horse properly. So nigh is the left side of the horse as the horse and you look in the same direction. Maps work the same way. So in order to know which way to go on a map, you must orient the top of the map with true north, since that is how maps are drawn. If the poem can be solved using a map or google earth, is it not logical to assume that Nigh really means left, which is WEST when you are facing north, as in looking at a map? So the creek may very well enter the “canyon down” from the West. And I know (imo) it does…I just cannot prove it yet.

    • Good thinking Michael D. I think there is a 50% chance that you are correct and ‘nigh’ means ‘West.’ Also, what’s it called if you’re facing the same direction as a horse, and you put your right foot in the left stirrup?

    • Makes sense… what you said, the book he mounted the horse facing the back end. How would that fit in?

    • Michael using the compas points wouldn’t canyon down be south and nigh(left) turn you back east?

      Am I following your logic correctly?

      • all I am saying is if you are looking at a map as you face north, and the map faces north, down is south, and nigh is west. actual on the ground travel would be different…if you were traveling south, nigh would be east…but if you are just looking at a map, nigh is west, even if down is south…Follow?

        • Michael,
          Good points and logical to say the least. The true test for me is making sure I know what “There’ll be no paddle up your creek” means…

      • I’m in agreement with YSREBOB on this one, nigh can also be used as a nautical term and if you are “taking it in the canyon down” then you are going south (if my WWWH is correct) then nigh should be facing east. But Michael could also be correct if we are using basic land navigation nigh would be west as we look at the map. Or maybe all three of us are reading too much into it and it just means near. 🙂


    • The problem with all of your points regarding the word “nigh” is that you are using it as an adjective when it is in fact used as an adverb in the poem.

      • Hi Bee , this of course is OMO
        I diss agree. Completely Subjective of how you look at the quote. For One Nigh is close ” Just Nigh” so for it to be ” The end is ever drawing ” would delete the purpose of using Nigh . It means the complete opposite of the meaning and by that it is Subjective to call it a adjective , when if the sentence is seen another , it would then be a noun. Again Subjective.

        Or , Is it … Or is he just telling you the Name of the End
        The End is “Ever Drawing Nigh ” Subjective?

    • Believe it or not, that helps my solve.

      If I take my ‘no paddle up your creek’ and ‘heavy loads and water high’ solve, then apply your interpretation of ‘nigh’….

      The only thing I’m missing conclusively is HoB previous to those clues.

  43. Mindy

    Just beautiful about Mary, I’m sure she touched many lives 🙂

    • Thanks, Amy. She was someone I looked up too, and if I have to die young, I will strive to do it as gracefully as she did. 🙂

  44. Here is a good example of a random coincidence of hints and clues that will
    keep you awake at night.

    The inscription “Who teaches a child labors with God in his workshop.” is
    etched onto the education building at University of Northern Colorado in
    Greeley. The quote is Attributed to writer Horace Mann.

    Red, Black, and Green are the colors of the UNIA Pan-African flag. The
    flag is associated with a Jamaican political leader named Marcus Garvey.
    Marcus Garvey just happens to have a cultural center named for him
    at……you guessed it…..University of Northern Colorado in Greeley.

    Hank Brown was a Navy man. Hank flew forward air controller missions in
    Vietnam from 1962 – 1966. Mr. Brown was also the president of……oh my
    God this can’t be a coincidence………University of Northern Colorado in
    Greeley from 1998 – 2002.

    Unfortunately I can’t make any of the other clues line up with Greeley
    Colorado. Given enough time and research I think I can link almost
    anything together. Next I am going to check to see if Kevin Bacon every
    attended the University of Norther Colorado in Greeley 🙂

    • Good work YSREBOB, IMO there’s a major hint in these that will help you solve a clue. I’m not saying which one. Although I had researched these earlier and came up with the same things. That was before I found the (IMO) location. Now that I have the location, this serves as a reminder and reinforces my solution. If you’ve read any of my posts you know I (want to anyway) search Montana. Just saying one of these is a hint. Unfortunately, or fortunately, (if you don’t want the treasure chest to be found for a long time) it is hidden in a way that points to Colorado but if you can figure it out, it actually points to Montana. And not the hidey spot in Montana but just a hint. This is also how the hints are hidden throughout TTOTC. Hard to recognize and string together. But not impossible.

      I’m talking about hints here. Not clues. Truly when you find the location you realize all you really need is the poem.

      Let me clarify, I don’t want to “search” I want to walk up to it with a smile on my face. Once you figure it out, there’ll be no searching. I don’t need to look under a rock or in a tree trunk. Not trying to spoil anyone’s fun though. But I know exactly what I’m looking for. Again, everything IMO.

      • Thanks Ramona. I want someone to find the treasure so I can finally see how close I was to the actual spot.

      • I think so. 4002 is 2×2001, and we all know that 2001: A space odyssey was a movie. So 2x that is the sequel, which was 2010. So the solution is 2010.


        • Oh, I forgot to add that 2010 was the publication date of “the thrill of the chase”

  45. Here’s another fun tip then to add to your sleepless nights.


    I will only poet the first of my solve Im working now.

    First take every word for what it is a word , or a object if you will.
    So As I have gone. To look at this in a mathematical way using words as the actual objects them selves. so AS I HAVE GONE ….. alone in there …Then delete those words as instructed. And follow the law of have and have not , to un fold the rest if you can . It is very interesting . Although you may like what you see , the code of directions stop after ” Put in Below the Home of Brown . ”

    I have worked this a few dozen times , then a simple word I was stuck on changed
    the whole understanding of this solve , and lead us down a path of history and connection with the poem. Not that this is the Real Deal , but , it has a way better connection to the poem then before.

    My First solve landed in NM in the oil fields. I had found some very interesting things that are in line with a lot of the book . As My understanding at that time of Brown was hidden in the riches new and old. And I was sure of F’s comments about him and his brother in Yellow stone , and that bull pulling his car. F just could have said oil was spitting all over the place. But instead he used another term for it happening. SO , I was curious , and couldn’t find a string there > I was fenced , I was a little mad I guess , but then I was thinking , How dose a Indian Get healed when they are sick . To my opinion at that time I felt F was being spiritual about this and He said the Mountains were his church so , I figured with all the things he said in the interviews that he was a Indian. Im cool with that . So , I followed the Indian Road I call it. Finding out everything I could about them , then tring to find a connection . Well I did find a story of the Ancients and it sounded a lot like the Ute story tellers . I found the story was almost exact to F ‘s . Is he the Brown Story teller . If you don’t know this , You can google The Brown Story Tellers” And the stories pop up . I was floored at the time , I also found that it was 1600 chains from a 3 peak mountain that were of equal distance like the frog and refers to the boys playing marbles . The three boys are calling the game even. F never won that day , lol…. But the girls liked him … =) Any way the area where the 3 peaks are , look like the gold layout on the page after the poem. And matched so many other aspects of the poem , like where warm waters halt, where the water dried up from the heat. Okay well this area I speaking had that . In a canyon down … check . Not far but too far to walk … check , put in below the home of brown , Put in under the Oil well …. check , no place for the meek … check there is no one around here no one. The end is ever drawing Nigh, you have to get out of your car and walk about a mile and its dang hot…… check …. no paddle up your creek… check , theres no water and no place to waiver between … check . ….. Just heavy loads and water high … check … Tall rock cliffs ….. and it is hot and your water would be high all day.
    Wise and found a blaze… We found a line of trees that were blazed …. and I was still about 500 yards away from the area of interest at the time … All of a sudden a huge Co. elk jumped over a small tree about 100 yards from us , it looked at us and not in fear of us and jumped rock to rock down the cliff… I looked at Heather and realized it was getting dark . Something scared that thing … I think we should go .. We missed it by 500 yards …. But , as I thought about it . This area was more the Plato’s of Colorado , and not the rockies. The area I was looking was near Navajo City NM. A completely devastated area , taken over by oil fields , and fracking land. The city is deserted , I think due to the Cancer warnings back in the early years of its development. This are was perfect until I realized , what happened to the beginning of the poem , why would I have cost my self money and not re assured my search by this very point. Why didn’t I fit the beginning of the poem to the solve. What of corse he went there alone. He hid a treasure. But that is the tarnished concept isn’t it now. The story concept of the poem leads one to where they want to go . So busy and just pass right by it… Like I have also … I don’t have the chest ….

    Well Navajo city and the river ways around it are not in the Rocky’s , according to the Wild Life and Game office at Navajo Lake at least. So I have stopped my search there . The next on allows me to come back to NM.. And try one more time , except this is treaded.

    • Mike or MikeD very interesting indeed! Are you part of the “AS I” have gone alone in there Group that think the first stanza is the first clue?

  46. I’m looking for serious partners in Colorado and New Mexico. A film company in small regard is going to shoot my understanding of the poem based on the Environmental devastation I saw in New Mexico’s North western area. This area is completely taken over by oil fields and they are spending fast. So The solve above has a lot more to it then I posted. I never show all my cards , unless I trust a man I meet. Or , Lady .. thats few and far between it seems these days. He will be filming us off and on for the year , on all our families solves. The one posted above is Mine and my Son Mike Jr’s Understanding. Not a perfect place by no means , but it was a start and our first complete understanding of the poem.

    So If you would be interested please let me know. We will be doing our first in filming in the area above. Jake the director loves the environmental aspect of my passion of the first solve , so that will be our first area of searching , played to the poem and the data collected in the area of interest.

    • Honest Mindy , this feels right .. but so did NM
      I just try to use every thing I have to find it . I don’t know any more then you . But , this was really creepy in a good way . Try it… see what you see.. Process of elimination is always good in a treasure hunt. You find some thing great , you don’t, great you learned a old school game from the 1700’s on how to teach memorization. Fun Fact….

      I believe the Chest is only one part. There is a Key if you will . A method…. A way to understand how to unlock the poem . To me at this moment it is a Word. I don’t know if that means anything to any one else or not. This opened a whole other heep of Data , that seemed to lead to a place , with a reason and a connection to a person he knew. As to a Why , this he already knew , he did it tired and now he’s weak. That saying matches 2 areas in TTOTC.
      Saying that , He also mentions it in TFTW also . That book along with 10 others , have my full attention right now. Crazy thing is .. I just got done reading like 10 books , and to top it off I have class 4 days a week, and since Seeing Taos , I started sketching again . I used to when I was young, won state for a Pencil sketch I drew upside down of Sitting Bull , my favorite Indian. Which , I believe it was his Birth Day I was Born. On the same day of the week.

      Off topic , In Lyons Co . there is a statue right up the street on R.66 heading to Estes Park , from a bronze statue , it is a what looks like a twisted grenadier Island. Lyons a HOB? Na

      • Mike –

        I see lots of work you have put into this – good on ya.

        If you secreted a treasure – would you then go put that place in a book that you wrote? I don’t think so.

        His name is Forrest – did he put it in a forest?

        We think he placed it somewhere meaningful to him. It is somewhere beautiful. That to me right there would eliminate the oil fields. It’s not somewhere that’s hot – the poem tells us it is somewhere – cold.

        Good luck with your filming – sounds like fun.

        • Thanks and I would agree with you . But, don’t you feel it would defeat the truth if he didn’t put the directions in the book to the treasure? For instance the poem . And to clarify this solve a bit , We never read his books only the poem and the videos. We couldn’t afford the books when we came up with the simple understanding , ” What do Indians do when they are sick ” Thinking he would dance where he got cancer. I know most think the poem describes a beautiful place. And I to do also , but Where warm water halts, in a canyon down , not far but too far to walk , in below the home of brown , no place for the week ,
          end drawing nigh , no paddle up your creek , heavy loads and water high… Terry scant ,
          Just take the chest”submission” go in peace .
          Why I must go , effort worth the cold.

          To me these are negative in content, and I don’t hear flowers and streams. But , that is only one solve. These words can be taken at face value, but I don’t believe they are.

          For instance , efforts worth the cold simply means your hard work will pay off. Not that it will be cold.
          And again , In Colorado its 20 to 30 degrees cooler in the mountain . Last time we went up it was almost 80 in the low country, but in the low 50’s up there , which is chilly for some. Me I was sweating like a bear, where even 30 here is not cold to me…. Catch a wind off the ocean at 30 degrees and it will go straight through you.

          Any way Im not disagreeing with you at all ..
          Actually , I look at many different ways to unlock this thing. My only worry is , would any of us recognize it after so many different understandings. So , I try to stay neutral when looking.

          One more thing , it dose fall with in the map outline. This location.

          Final , I think his last words , if he were standing where the chest is and what he would see, is why I want to go back , all the thins he said , were present in that strange climate, coming right out of Carson to this area.
          It takes a lot for a man to do what he did … Give away what you have worked for your whole life…
          ” Why can’t I take it with me. ”
          Not all the time is a place meaning full and it be beautiful.

          thanks for the comment something always to think about . But again , follow the clues sprinkled in these stories ….. thread a track through the wils of nature and circumstance to the treasure. Another follow the clues in the poem and it will lead you to the end of my rainbow and the treasure…..

          Funny Rainbows are brown … Color is funny , Brown it’s self spectrums from Gold to Dark brown almost black… It incumbencies red , purple , blue , and a shade of gray. The home of Rainbows , Colorado. Not that I think it is in colorado just pointing out facts.
          Good luck and as always thanks for the comments and understanding .

          • Mr.D,

            You stated: “would any of us recognize it after so many different understandings.”

            That’s the million doller question. I can place the chest in every state with different theories and analogies. But for someone to be Confident [ as we been told ] would it not be an interpretation that as no questionable doubt?

            You also stated: “Funny Rainbows are brown … Color is funny , Brown it’s self spectrums from Gold to Dark brown almost black…”

            The Funny thing is Brown is not within a Rainbow. But made from those colors…Black is not a color, it absorbs all light and white is not a color as it reflects all colors.

            The thing about Rainbows is they represent dreams, fantasy and imagination…There is another commonly known interpretation of Rainbows but I’ll let you discover that yourself.

            And Cold meaning your hard work is relatively true IMO.
            “Your reward is give and worthy of the seek”

            But that is just one interpretation…

  47. Ok For Mindy…..

    “Put in below the home of brown ”
    Put below the home of Brown

    • If this line is taken as a cryptic container clue, one solve could be this: Take another word(s) for ‘below’ and place that in another word(s) for HOB. And find another word within.

      An example would be” Remove/Take put into Rocket/Missile.
      Mis[take]sile=Mistake. Which may be a clue when actual poem language is used.

      • Nice , I will post pretty soon the out come I have , I need to finish it first ,lol. Im lazy….
        But , that is almost the exact why Im looking now.

  48. imo I think put in below the home of brown is – put in (hid ) below ( north ) the ( of ) home of brown — its hid north of home of brown

  49. I think Fenn may have served up another entertaining red herring in the waterfall story. The face-fall references stymied me, and then the words ‘typeface’ and ‘font’ stepped out of the mist. (Check the etymology of font… down to agate). Fenn’s good friend Eric Sloan was first a sign painter & a master letterer. He even painted license plates for his car when he couldn’t afford buy them. Both published books, so I’ll bet FF and ES discussed the printers p’s & q’s during their friendship, and maybe for the $17 A SQUARE INC design. So the face-falls it might be a clever nod to that friendship. If there is a Chase hint here, I haven’t found it yet.

    • I think he also wrote the book on WWII codes for pilots. I will check that out for sure. They were close.

      • Maybe some of the editors on this Chase could tell us how common it is to name the ‘text’ used in their books…. (colophon pg.) Did FF do it in his other books? I’ve been oblivious to such info.

        Just turning stones over…

  50. I always say to myself. “What would Indiana Jones do?” It really works for me. I know that he would not bypass reading the books, or checking out websites; Indy would gather all the info he can!
    One thing that gets me. Indy never just gets to walk right up to it, and if he does, he sure never gets to go in peace!!! 🙂

  51. Here is some info to add to clarify 1600 chains . It is not 8.24 miles at all…. Wrong

    1 chain is 66 feet so the out come 20 miles. Not 8

    • What are you talking about Mikey? You should do the math before you spout off…..Here’s where I get 8.25 miles; what is incorrect about the calculation?

      First here’s Fenn’s complete comment:

      Forrest Fenn: Land Surveyor

      Since Richard mentioned the olden days lets harken to 1620 when universal land measures first became law in England and America. As you rode your horse into town you had to pass 80 telephone poles in order to reach a mile because they were 1 chain apart, or 66 feet. And each chain had 100 links, if you wanted to break it down further. Road rights-of-way also were 1 chain wide. And 80 square chains made a square mile, or 640 acres – and that was 1 section of land.

      But if you’d rather count fence posts you had to pass 320 in order to reach a mile because they were a rod apart, or 16.5 feet. And since everyone knew that an acre was 10 square chains (43,560 square feet) it was easy to tell how many acres were in your neighbor’s farm.

      Some aspects of those measures are still in use today in the horse racing business because a furlong is 10 chains in length, or 660 feet. You should feel smarter now because that’s so easy.

      If you want to apply those important figures into the thrill of the chase I will give you an additional clue. The Treasure chest full of gold and precious jewels is more than 66,000 links north of Santa Fe.

      100 links = 1 chain
      66,000 links = 660 chains (66,000 ÷ 100)
      1 chain = 66 feet
      660 chains = 43560 feet (660 x 66) = 8.25 miles

      • Goofy,

        What I got a kick out of when I first read it: telephone poles (ergo telephone lines) in 1620.

        • Me too Liviu, who knew… lol

          But really the whole 100 links = 1 chain is just our interpretation of what he is saying… Forrest never confirmed that is what he meant Correct? Forrest could mean something else altogether…

          • That is exactly what I was referring,

            First I don’t spout off. That is a disrespectful comment first off. Second mine was also and I apologies for it.
            Third , In which since I don’t give all my data out for one…. I was referencing to Eric Sloane’s book Return to Taos. Page 27 ,
            And I quote ” Up until a few years ago almost most roads widths were still limited
            to the old Land Grant measurements of “ONE CHAIN” (66 feet) wide , and to this day on any such road you will find rows on both sides , exactly 66 feet apart.

            Laugh if you will , but Old land rules still exist to this day . I’m in process of my Realtor’s License in Co. And I just finished up on Titles and land laws of the 1600. Funny still to the day we set our communities up the same way.

            So I was not spouting off. I figure a debate is not started with out a bit of coal is all. And to this kind of measure , i could have been right . Or , maybe it was just referring to a road you were supposed to be on .

          • No apologizes necessary Mike; I like point blank.

            You said, “It is not 8.24 miles at all…. Wrong

            1 chain is 66 feet so the out come 20 miles. Not 8”

            Are you saying the 8.25 miles north of Santa Fe is incorrect?

        • HA! I did the same thing on first read…..He didn’t mean there were telephone poles in 1620; but the way he said it did sound funny. He made the jump from 1620 to modern day quickly. However they did use the same measurements as in 1620.

          “In 1620, the clergyman Edmund Gunter developed a method of surveying land accurately with low technology equipment, using what became known as Gunter’s chain; this was 66 feet long and from the practice of using his chain, the word transferred to the actual measured unit. His chain had 100 links, and the link is used as a subdivision of the chain as a unit of length.

          In countries influenced by English practice, land plans prepared before about 1960 associated with the sale of land usually have lengths marked in chains and links, and the areas of land parcels are indicated in acres. A rectangle of land one furlong in length and one chain in width has an area of one acre. It is sometimes suggested that this was a medieval parcel of land capable of being worked by one man and supporting one family, but there is no documentary support for this assertion, and it would in any case have predated Gunter’s work.”

          • Exactly what I was referring, A treasure hunt is no fun if you don’t have fun doing it , now is it.

            I love Gunter’s work and respect this valuable information as I did his. Logic to me is a flower , everyone has it and all bloom differently. I respect yours as always, I was only referring to the way I felt F used it is all and commented quickly with out speaking my mind. Sorry , Im working on expression… I feel even though it was inferred to width , it was lining a road , you could count your milage by poles. In that case the milage was 20 miles. I should have just said that I guess…..

          • I don’t think 8.25 mile is what he was referring . Not that the out come was incorrect. Sorry . I read that stuff you posted before and it never left my mind…. Yes you are definitely correct. I point black shot out there and should have spoke my mind . Sorry again .

            I just feel that F is using the knowledge he obtained in his life to lock this thing.
            I think Sloane had a huge part in f’s life . So I would understand it in this direction due to their friend ship. But first off…. why would F even say that ? Look I could be wrong It could only be wide in reference . Idk but it is a point of interest right now in my search .
            Next time I’ll try a smaller hook…

          • If you are interested in some more of the history that measuring has had in America, I would suggest this book.

            It is a really interesting read. Explains why we have roads called Meridian and Division (survey terms) and why when you are driving on a north-south road out in the middle of nowhere and there will suddenly be a jog in the road for no apparent reason (longitude correction).

      • Oh I love the 660 ft thing … Cool a megalithic yard . I have only herd of them in Artichiture. I had no Idea it was used in racing … Cool
        I think I herd it broke all the way down to one quart.

  52. Sorry Goofy I read Forrwst’s comment again and yes it would appear he is being very specific… I don’t know what I was thinking questioning something so clearly specifically stated from Mr Fenn…

  53. All,
    My current area of “nine clues” research involves the change in the poem from present tense, to future tense, to past tense, and back to present tense. (This structure doesn’t seem to be poetic, as, IMO, it would have been easy to write the poem without it.) So I’m trying to review my favorite search area, thinking subjectively of the path to TC as partly future tense (perhaps looking ahead at one particular point) and partly past tense (which I’m currently guessing means that at one point in the quest, it would be helpful to retrospectively review part of the path that has already been taken). Perhaps, IMO, only then will it be possible to find the blaze.
    “Have flashlight, will travel”

    • My solve’s main weakness is the HLWH line. I am trying to see more meaning in that line. There are pack trails, waterfalls but these don’t seem satisfactory. I will hit it up another day.
      I hope all our travelers are safe and warm and dry.

  54. Hey all , My mind is on a certain concept right now…

    How would you recognize the clues in the poem .

    9 clues 9 sentences , right? So How do you find where the clues are.

    My take is , The first stanza is one sentence. So 1 clue?

    The Second has 2 sentences , so 2 clues?

    Idk just putting it out there… But is it possible ?


          • Thinking on being in there 6/24. I should have 3 extra sets of better eyes than mine too!

          • now i am confused. where are you coming from that it would take from now to aug to reach Nm. once you get there where are you searching.

  55. Mr. D no the clues don’t work like that lol first just solve WWWH that is the starting point 😉 and Geoff – F said don’t mess with his poem ! bahahaha the poem the way F has it is perfect !! every single line is key – and if you alter that you will make it things much harder than it needs to be lol

    • Thanks for the comment . If I may add. If that be true , the first solve is wwwh , then
      Lets play a game shall we . A word game , using the words as objects them selves. Add lets say what you commented “The poem the way f has it is perfect!! every single line is key”… and no doubt to that , but if that is so ,

      Then , Begin !
      It where warm water halts.

      Have fun, thanks for your comment . Please be more descriptive with your words , Thanks

  56. Begin IT where warm waterS halt
    AND take IT in the canyon down – so what is IT ? lshidmtamsfo!!

    • dont make it so hard if Mr. F is going in there a lone with TC bold. he had to take chest with him he took “IT” the TC!

    • Eager B—-
      Didn’t Forrest say, “Don’t mess with my poem?” Even you stated that. So why are you capitalizing words and letters here-and-there to read some clue which isn’t intended? On that same logic, let’s just un-capitalize Brown.
      And even Forrest said in an interview that the entire poem isn’t needed for the solve. It’s just risky to eliminate some lines or words that may appear trivial. No, those weren’t his exact words but that was the basic context of his response to a question.

  57. lol Mr. D it can get you on the right path that’s for sure 🙂 I seen earlier in this blog where someone named Randy I believe mentioned to Dal about the hot springs stop at a certain altitude and Dal said altitude is not a specific place and that it needs to be a specific place – personally I think Randy is almost there he just hasn’t worked it all out yet lol

    • Eager B—
      It’s too bad you don’t realize yet that your solve is missing one important element. It may meet all the qualifications and lead you to a certain location but if that location is not a place that holds a near and dear place in Forrest’s heart, then your starting location was wrong. So, unless you can logically conclude why that is the correct location, please don’t waste your money on a round-trip ticket from Boston. And just because the spot may be a beautiful fishing spot along a gorgeous river or something of that sort, that is not a good enough reason. So, I’ll just sit here laughing while you’re scrambling trying to find that location before the 18th. Hmmm, where could it be? The location that Forrest Fenn holds in his heart that gave him some of his fondest memories. Hurry, Eager B. Time is ticking……

      • how cute Kevin – you think it’s a fishing hole LOL that’s why you have not found anything yet – you think HOB has something to do with fish too ? perhaps Brown trout right ? the only problem is they are not native to North America – and let me also guess you think WWWH has to do with fish as well right ? the problem with all that nonsense is that there are too many fishing holes to ever lead you to one spot (It’s vague) that’s why it’s wrong but when you have the winning solve it can only BE ONE SPOT ! so you keep laughing and soon I’ll be posting photos of me and that Chest 😉 and one last thing – every single line means something – when you catch up then mock 😉

    • And when I started listening to what Forrest was saying and not assuming what he meant, I finally got it. Read the poem. Start at the beginning. Time is wasting. Hurry, Eager B.

      • when/where did he say it was near and dear? Or is that you assuming? He did say we would be surprised.

        • Yes, believe me. You’ll be very surprised. And see, you’re assuming. Not one of my clue solves has anything to do with fish. When did I say that? And I wasn’t trying to be mean. I just don’t want you to waste your money. Ask anyone here on the blog and you may have your eyes opened. There are many, many solves that start at the ‘perfect’ spot and end in the ‘perfect’ location. I just know you are going to be very surprised in about a week when you come back home empty-handed. Once again, read Forrest’s poem. Start at the beginning. Hurry, hurry, hurry. Time is still ticking. The 18th is approaching very quickly.

        • Forgot to add. You’re right, he didn’t use those words. He actually said it’s a place that’s very special to him. If you’re interested in listening to the interview, I’m sure you can find it.

        • Eager, you are smart to play the poem, and smarter yet if you know thy opponent. Study FF and his memoirs.

          If nothing else I’ve learned a lot from Forrest by studying his interests, humor, his-story thru memoirs, other books he’s written, and scrap books.

  58. imo – here is some to ponder on – Forrest said if he was standing where the chest is it would be under water so this is what I think – heavy loads meaning snow waters high meaning flooded – although the blaze is a place I think it also means summer there for it being summer the snow will melt the rivers and the creeks will over flow and flood where the chest is and your quest to look for the chest will cease this is only my opinion frank

    • I also think wwwh is a place and I also think that begin it where warm water halt means begin it when all the snow has melted and the over flow has dried and the chest is no longer under water this is also an opinion

    • Frank,

      You stated :
      “Forrest said if he was standing where the chest is it would be under water so this is what I think –”

      Did he say, “under water” or “wet”?

      Big difference.

      • seeker – I read somewhere in this blog that he said that if he was where the chest was he could see trees smell pines and see mountains and that the chest was under water I did not see wet

        • Frank,

          This is the first comment i came across. a Q&A from Mysterious Writings blog. There are many I have read using the word “wet…” I don’t recall ever seeing “Under water” as a term fenn used. So if you can find “his” exact words… that would be very interesting.
          The constant problem with blogs, interviews and other comments is most get the quote wrong.

          elementsMr Fenn, in relation to the final resting place of the chest, which of the 4 natural elements (Earth, Wind, Water, Fire) would mostly compromise it resting? ~ James

          “I know what the question is. I don’t think earth can hurt it, under the right conditions wind might affect it, it’s probably already wet, and look at what fire did to the twin towers. Nature makes her own rules, James, so I try to not be absolute when talking about her.”

          • seeker I could be wrong – it must of been raining when he said it then it would be wet – I will stick with my comment that its under water remember its only an opinion

          • That’s fine Frank, just let me know if you come across the comment you’re referring to, I’d like to read it.

            If true… I doubt it… it would kill a lot of theories and create new thoughts. So it would be important, at least for myself to see it.

        • Frank i dont think the chest is in water or under water. water levels can go up and own due to weather just ask us in TX. also i would not want a child going into water. germs if its stagnate, critters etc. and if water is effected by wind the chest could come open as the waves go back and forth. i think in water has to many variables.

          • wilderbirder – imo its not always under water I wish I could say why – but I would be giving to much away

          • frank if you are thinking of a steam that is dry and then wet. go watch a creek bed under a flood watch. water can was away houses and large rocks. that chest would not stay in one place.

    • Frank..I don’t think he ever said that. He mentioned what he would see and smell if he were standing where the chest is. He also said at one point that the chest was probably wet..he said that in the winter when there would be a lot of snow in the mountains..
      He has NEVER said the chest is underwater..

      • thanks dal its been awhile when I read it – I must of been thinking about my solve – which it it might of been wet my solve where I think the chest is is under water thanks for your help

        • ok dal – sorry I didn’t finish what I wanted to say you got me by surprise I thought you were on the hunt and my wife was waiting to take her to the store – I remember now what its all about now – sense my solve is under water and he said the chest would be probably wet I thought if he would of said under water he would of given out a big clue so I got it as that’s what he ment and couldn’t say again thanks and good luck on your trip and on your hunt frank

      • Dal – shouldn’t you be out beating bushes and turning over logs? It’s might late in the morning to be blogging. IMO, of course. 🙂

  59. I posted this in another forum and wanted to throw it here too since there appears to be a lot of conversation going on. This is a little off the direction, but my co worker came back from the Abiquiu area and showed me some of his pictures. Has anyone noticed that on the entrance sign to the Christ in the Desert Monestary, that it says “Peace” above it? As in the poem “just take the chest and go in peace”, would be an interesting way to have double meaning, by not only going in peace (peace of mind knowing you solved the riddle), but also physically going into the property labeled as “peace”. Just my thought. Dal has already mentioned that the Rio Chama area is constantly searched, but again, just my thoughts.

  60. Not sure this is the right place to post this, though it does pertain to what I think is one or two of the clues. I don’t see a discussion in itself of ‘heavy loads and water high’ though I have seen many postulate that this means a portage. So, I’m just going to hit upon my thoughts here.

    I don’t think the blaze is a clue, per se. Because a blaze is a….well, you know by now…. and if you’re on the right path, you don’t need a trail-marker. So I’m going focus on the line before.

    What is a heavy load? I’m reminded of a line from a song from one of my favorite hard rock groups…. ‘Silence is a heavy load’. But that’s not it.

    What, exactly, is a heavy load?

    Physical- It could pertain to military ordinance, a train, a pipeline, a landslide, a pack on your back, a canoe you carry on a portage…..

    Spiritual- Silence, aloneness, cancer, death, a secret.

    Combined with ‘water high’ I get very little hits- a water tower stop from a steam train, a lake near a pipeline or military base, or where many people died.

    I love spitballing ideas.

    • rathmon – I think the blaze is one of the most important clues in the poem – so is quest to cease – and in the cold . imo

        • Q west Q east? Mark that spot and now find a point similar for north and south.
          Just an idea

      • sorry ment to say worth the cold – im a one finger typer and by the time I get to what I want to say I forget that and my age doesn’t help matters any

      • From what I’ve read, FF said HOB is the key besides WWWH.

        I take his statement about the blaze being seen at night (or something of the sort) as a ‘roll the eyes’ moment. ‘in a word, yes’ was his answer…. And I’ve said that to people who have asked me the dumbest tech questions possible.

        I have to think that ‘heavy loads and water high’ has to be a key to being on the path.

      • A lot of people think the blaze is a big clue, I’m not one of them. I just think that ‘if you’ve been wise and found the blaze’ means that you are already there.

  61. This is not part of my solve, but it did make me think. This is from a six year old. I only asked him about stanza two.

    Him: What does halt mean?
    Me: Sort of like stop or disappear I guess.
    Him: Oh.

    Him: What is “it”?
    Me: I’m not sure.

    Me: So what do you think?
    Him: Easy. Go to the desert and climb down in the canyon.

    Me: What about that home of Brown part?
    Him: I don’t know. I guess where the other colors live too?

    I may just have to ask him some more about the poem. He did as good as any of us, I suppose.

    Scott W.

    • Scott W, that’s great! I Love children’s responses 🙂

      The other colors party below the roof of Crayola house…

      Macaroni & Cheese Mango Tangos with Fuzzy Wuzzy Brown,
      while Razzle Dazzle Rose dances with Screeming Green Inch Worm ~~•

  62. lia I hear you 🙂

    but to be honest with you the poem is all that is needed – the words wont change no matter what anyone else looks at and the secret where will still be the secret where 🙂

    The poem is not that tough – its tricky yes but once you figure out WWWH it will all start to make sense

    I’ll give you a little clue though don’t think like a fisherman lol think like a pilot – if a pilot wants to navigate you to a point on the map he isn’t going to start talking about fish – in fact i’ll give you something more – maybe he liked to hunt in the Big Banana Forest and you identify Big Banana Forest because its so famous and so u begin to hunt there but later you find out It was the wrong Big Banana Forest and yet everything he said about hunting in the Big Banana Forest was true – but just not in that one 😉

    It’s called MISDIRECTION

  63. Eager Beaver – of course you are correct that all you need is ‘in’ the poem…but Forrest has said read TTOTC several times and then the poem; also that a good map and google earth are helpful tools. I believe he was shooting straight.

    • Of course the more info you can draw from can help but it can also hold you back – The extra info such as in TTOTC (Now you have to decide what applies and what does not apply) as with the poem IT ALL APPLIES 😉 the extra help is there for those that need it I know and I get that – all I’m saying is that I found no need for anything other than that poem it’s clear as it is. And all the additional clues offered by FF are fact but they are not really saying anything that can’t already be found in the poem. Everyone is different what works for you might not work for me and vice versa so if you feel the other stuff helps then for sure use it 🙂

      I wish I could just say to everyone this is WWWH is but it’s just too big of a clue to do that wouldn’t you agree ? 🙂 🙂

    • Shooting straight hmm..GE IS ABSOLUTELY NECCESARY NOT “just helpful” as you say. IMO

  64. OK who wants to know the 2nd stanza ? LOL I’m tempted to just put it out there for everyone it’s making me crazy already bahahahaha

  65. I had thought the solution was meant to be simple as well and when I came up with one I felt like I must be wrong because so many people were coming up with such complex theories about the poem.

    • The solution can be simpler than you can imagine! Or more complex! Or just so so! Nobody has solved it! Follow your own lead and I hope you find it. Good luck

      • I agree, and in my opinion, I’ve already found the treasure. Hope. Although it doesn’t pay the bills, it gives you something to dream about. But I’m a romantic.

    • Eager B—-
      You know I’m just giving you a friendly jab from a fellow searcher. I’m just trying to get you ‘motivated’. : )
      Anyhow, good luck next week in NM.

      • TY Kevin –

        Everyone see seems to have their own take on the poem but in the end we will see who had it right I guess

        Good luck with your search out there Kevin and be safe !

  66. eager beaver, email me the wwwh you speak of, its my user name and I would like to know what you think it is. I am interested in anyones ideas,

  67. to all newbies. it is very hard knowing your secrets and wanting to prove to everyone what you know. be wise and share things to help others with your solves but not yours.

    know what you know and it does matter who believes you! get BOG and find it. then share. i came so close to giving away my solve and i guessed part of two solves of others. i honor them by not posting their info until they search. our boots on ground will happen in aug. it is driving us nuts not to tell anyone and not being able to search.
    good luck to all searchers be careful and safe and over all have FUN.

        • I was just having a moment and thought I don’t know the old coots middle name hehe

        • Why are you so astonished Gypsy? I consider you one of the veteran chasers….you shouldn’t have to ask a question like that.

          • I know right but I never knew his middle name and I needed it fast and Burke well I would of never guessed that haha

          • lol I can see what you’re saying…I did a google search of Forrest Fenn, and Middle name and came up with no hits (going off the presumption I didn’t know)

            You should trust PuttPutt though….he happens to be the authority on Forrest’s family tree. 😉

          • That’s great to know he did jump right on that lol we should play trivia about Forrest haha keep our minds sharp

          • Will, I cannot, in good conscience, let you believe I am anything more than your peer, and certainly not an expert at anything! But I thank you for the compliment. 🙂
            Question, will, did you abandon co? You just mentioned to dal you were headed that way?

          • Do you remember that show, think it’s called, “What’s My Name?”? The line was, “will the real so and so please stand up…”. Sometimes I want to shout that out! If you know what I mean!!! 🙂

          • Putt Putt..
            I am plenty old enough to remember that show. It was actually called “What’s My Line”. The panel had Bennett Cerf and Arlene Francis..among others..
            But here’s a piece of trivia that connects that show to Forrest.
            Skippy’s son Crayton appeared on that show when he was about 12.
            They had to try and figure out what he did for a living..
            He was actually the youngest licensed master plumber in the USA.

          • LOL PuttPutt funny on the Whats My Name comment 😀

            abandon CO? My CO post was merely a misdirection 😛

        • For Astree… “Will the real so and so please stand up” “sew and sew”… “a needle pulling thread” 🙂

    • 🙂 Diggin Gypsy

      Fenn, Forest Burk 8-22-1930 M Lillie Gay Simpson William Marvin Fenn


      This list his middle name “BURK”
      without the “E”…

      This also list first name “FOREST”
      without the first or second “R”….
      your choice which it is….

      This is a source, but not a birth certificate.

      Hope this helps you Diggin Gypsy

      🙂 The GOLF C&CS
      🙂 Best Knowledge I Have…which may b knot much


        Biographical Information

        Forrest Burke Fenn
        State of Birth:
        Home State:
        from the library of congress.

        Also from …

        The beat of the drum and the whoop of the dance

        Type of Work:
        Non-dramatic literary work
        Registration Number / Date:
        TX0006570297 / 2007-03-16
        Date of Publication:
        October 1, 1983
        Date of Creation:
        The beat of the drum and the whoop of the dance.
        Copyright Note:
        C.O. correspondence.
        Cataloged from appl. only.
        Copyright Claimant:
        Forrest Burke Fenn, 1930-
        Forrest Burke Fenn 1930-

        Hope that helps.
        Also, concerning the Library of Congress…. Don’t they need to correct their data on Forrest? They list him as Korean war with no mention of the Vietnam war?

        • 🙂 Iron Will

          Thank you for your Post & Links Iron Will.

          A Note on the source of 3 Bell Links, there may be typos or errors in their lists, a disclaimer.

          🙂 The GOLF C&CS
          🙂 Vietnam not listed, nice catch, Thanks

          • 🙂 Not Obsesse

            🙂 The Government Code & Cipher School
            🙂 PBS TV show ENDEAVOUR series
            🙂 Series #1 Episode #1
            🙂 Title : GIRL

            🙂 The GOLF
            🙂 A good walk spoiled treasure hunting

            🙂 The GOLF C&CS
            🙂 4 now, another shot with a Spoon #3

  68. if youve been wise and found the blaze look quickly down your quest to cease – just heavy loads and waters high – your efforts will be worth the cold

    • 🙂 Anna

      Your Welcome Anna, 🙂

      Thank You for kind Word that is not Key 🙂 & words that are

      I make no claim of Accurate data only 85%, not The Official Document.

      I thought your interest might include June, as in Name and number .
      6 stanzas
      24 lines

      🙂 The GOLF C&CS
      🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 Today is June 5, 2015 Day #1684 of Chase

  69. Most people probably believe the treasure was put in a cave no one has ever been in. The first mistake you make when reading Fenn’s poem is to create a mental picture. Grandeous imagery won’t get it done IMO mostly logic.

  70. What are clues and what are hint’s
    Hi ,I’m still new at this but here goes. This is my take on the poem .I broke it down into what I think are Hint’s verses clues
    The Clues are all, Hands on. A person could actually go out and touch something.

    1. Gone alone in there= clue (a physcal place)
    2. WWWH = clue (also a place)
    3. canyon down= clue (Canyon)
    4. Home of Brown =clue (Home)
    5. no paddle up your creek= clue (creek)
    6. heavy loads = clue (loads)
    7. and water high = clue (water)
    8. Blaze = clue (? a physcal something)
    9. in the wood=clue (wood)

    Now hint’s
    A. hint of riches new and old = hint
    B.Begin it and take it = hint
    C. not far but too far to walk=hint
    D. no place for the meek, the end is ever drawing nigh= hint
    E. if you’ve been wise and found = hint
    F. look quickly down = hint
    G. Hear me all and listen good =hint
    H. if your brave= hint
    I. worth the cold=hint

    Nine of each , only my opinion ,I don’t know if it’s right or wrong. but I would like some input ,if you see something I have not, thanks.

  71. Sort of Metes & Bounds, directions & descriptions.

    & I dont get the ‘gave the trove” either…. a lotta that around…. typos or cryptic messages?

  72. Ramona sent me this. She found it on a Facebook page. Iron Will might be here then..maybe others.. It’s a good show so if you do plan to be out here and want to be involved give them a shout.
    My name is Jennifer, I am an associate producer for the Travel Channel original series EXPEDITION UNKNOWN. The show is hosted by Josh Gates who is a life adventurer with a degree in archeology. The show follows Gates as he investigates iconic mysteries around the world.
    Our team is preparing to film a story on Fenn’s Treasure very soon. We are trying to locate someone who believes that Fenn’s Treasure could potentially be hidden in MT, WY, or Yellowstone. If… you or anyone you know would be interested in participating in our program please feel free to contact me at your earliest convenience at
    I look forward to hearing from you soon.
    Thank you,

    • That’s really cool, Dal!
      Love that show, he’s pretty funny.
      Will, you should do it!

      • I wouldn’t want to embarrass myself on a national program lol . If I recover it I’d contact them for some kind of show reveal maybe. But I don’t need any more than you guys to hear about my failures 😀

        • well, will, we all have failures that’s how we succeed! if we didn’t make mistakes how would we ever know if we were right! If you only knew how much I embarrassed myself…but I crack up at myself now I think it’s the most hilarious thing in the world!

    • FYI If you going to be in the YSNP the week of June 11 thru 20, you have a good chance of being filmed if you want to be. As my luck, this was my original dates that I had planned to go. I’m glad I already made my search, nobody in the search area sure was nice. Not sure that I could have waited much longer any way. I glad I didn’t make a fool out of myself on TV. Good luck everyone.

  73. You ask a good question Adam – keep working on that angle 🙂

  74. Hi all,

    I found this interesting from “Classification of Rapids, Water Level, and Canoeists”

    the link is-

    Under the heading “Water Level”

    High water is discussed and a term used by canoeists/kayakers is the water is heavy-

    “H, or High. Water is becoming difficult to handle. The river is well above normal stage. Canoeists may refer to the strong currents as “heavy.” Small debris may come floating by, a warning that the river is dangerous and better left to skilled kayakers or canoeists whose craft are supported by flotation bags.
    HH, or High-High. Very heavy water. Hydraulics are complex. Even slight gradients become treacherous. Debris frequent. Only for experts.”

    Could this refer to-

    Just heavy loads and water high.

    It may help, it may not…???

  75. To the gang,

    This is live from Colorado, we had a safe drive in. The Chase will start tomorrow 🙂
    Forrest I love the adventure , thank u 🙂

    • Amy, I was glad to hear you made it safely. I was a little worried. I’ll bet it is a beautiful morning there. I wish I were there. Maybe I should say we wish we could be there. Yup, let’s use that. Did you take some fishing poles?

    • I hope you find it Amy….you always have a nice smile to give all of us. Someone like that deserves the better things in life 😀

    • To Amy, live from the house… Live your Adventure to the max! Don’t forget to enjoy the wonder of the great outdoors as you search. I look forward to your photos with treasure in hand!!! Best of luck.

  76. Clue one=
    As I have gone alone in there and with my treasures bold, I can keep my secret where and hint of riches new and old.
    Clue 2=
    Begin it where warm waters halt and take it in the canyon down.
    Clue 3=
    Not far, but too far to walk.
    Clue 4=
    Put in below the home of Brown.
    Clue 5=
    From there, its no place for the meek, the end is ever drawing nigh, there’ll be no paddle up your creek, just heavy loads and water high.
    Clue 6=
    If you’ve been wise and found the blaze look quickly down, your quest to cease but tarry scant with marvel gaze just take the chest and go in peace.
    Clue 7=
    So why is it that I must go and leave my trove for all to seek, the answers I already know, I’ve done it tired and now I’m weak.
    Clue 8=
    So hear me all and listen good, your effort will be worth the cold.
    Clue 9=
    If you are brave and in the wood, I give you title to the gold.

    Clue one hints at the wwh location. Clue two further assists in the location of the beginning, and tells us direction of travel. Clue three gives us distance. Clue four tells us what to do when we reach the end of the distance and arrive at the home of Brown. If we have the correct beginning and the correct distance and direction of travel, we WILL arrive at HOB. At HOB we “put in” to begin the search.
    Clue five tells us the end is to the left, and describes the creek in enough detail to allow us to deduce which creek it is. Clue six is the most important and it is confirmation you are in the correct location. Clue seven is a more subtle reaffirming clue. Clue 8 also reaffirms earlier suppositions. Clue nine seals the deal by giving you the missing information needed to narrow down your search when you arrive. The poem is a route description. Our job is to find the route. I believe I have. We shall see. Soon…All IMO

    • Michael D…
      which state are you concentrating? I am in the NM school of thought.

      tintin treasure

    • OK nine sentences, 9 clues to be interpreted, nothing new here. Clue 1, 2 3, 4, 5, 6 tell us something…great. 7 & 8 are ” subtle reaffirming clue” ? “reaffirms earlier suppositions” ? If those two sentences are just a confirmation of an earlier clue…How can they be a clue themselves if you already know the first 6 clues?

      “Clue nine seals the deal by giving you the missing information needed to narrow down your search when you arrive.”?

      I’m lost, how does a “clue” narrow down something [ a previous known clue ] if you already traveled the route by the previous known clues? This would leave clue 9 obsolete. as the prior clues led you to a place…what ” missing information” would there be if you arrived at the place you are supposed to be.

      IF you’re { you or anyone } going to explain your theory, method, Idea… could you at least give examples to match your comment. This says nothing that has not been said 10x a day for almost 5 years.

      Sorry folks but these discussions are drying up… IMO…

      • I wouldn’t be so hard on him…he actually has very sound reasoning. IMO, he is right on the clues. Clue 1 is a bigger picture of location, Clue 2 is a magnified version of clue 1 and where you actually start the “Pirate Treasure Map” journey. Then at clue 6, you are officially within 200 feet. clues 7, 8, and 9 along with clue 1, will tell you how to find the the exact spot of the treasure. That is why Forrest used the word “contiguous”. Michael’s reasoning is a little shady for 7-9, but I understand what he’s getting at.

        • Curious – how do you arrive at officially within 200 feet after clue 6 ? My understanding of the clues if I had to break the entire poem into clues and hints would mean you first need all 9 clues before you could possibly be near the treasure at which point the hints remaining would then help guide you to the treasures exact location so that you are not left with just turning over stones and looking under every bush you find.

          • Officially in my opinion as mentioned above. In my solution the blaze is 200 ft give or take 10-20 feet from the chest. I read the rest of you comment and no, in my opinion, once at the blaze, you are in the search area of the chest. the next few clues tell you how to zero in on that 200ft….and one of them is very ambiguous (cold comment). Just a note, my 1st clue ( the first stanza) isn’t talking about Forrest, or the treasure.

        • I agree with Iron Will and with Michael. If you don’t get it, that’s ok, but just appreciate that people are still sharing their thoughts.

      • seeker – as far as discussions drying up – it could be helpful for the new people just starting out – you need to chill and let Dal run this blog frank

        • Wait… What? Who the heck said I’m running anything? My comment is just what I stated.
          Maybe you should re-read it… S-l-o-w-l-y.

      • My take here Seeker ,

        The sentences are broken into stanzas right ?
        Ok , so how many sentences are in each?

        My take on how the clues chain together is exactly that. The connect, by a distance , or circumstance.
        And through those will you be able to put a x on the map.

        After recent solves , I have one in Montana. Very direct, but it was found by intense digging , tired of looking and at a flexible time . Connects a lot of data from F’s life ,
        and actually leads to a blaze that is noticeable. No big deal we all have found places like that. But , only until I had been in over a Dozen National Forrest’s did I realize one very important detail. There are Blazes every where!
        How are you going to even recognize it even if you seen it. Unless it is directly related to F personally. That is the interesting part of that very point. This blaze is with in the boundary of the terms…. Why did I bring this up you may ask?
        Well seeker , I have had a heck of a time to get out here , and Im thankful for that , and every time I look for the chest , I find my self learning some thing new , and meeting new folks who are all very smart and interesting. You are in our self a treasure and every human being is also. This is the largest lesson I have learned through this chase. Everyone’s opinion is important , as well as how you come across as a human being. So , don’t give up or let the Chase bother you, or even the comments made by new searchers , We all feel that way after a few solves Im sure. Take care Brother….. Have fun and good luck to you in finding what you are looking for. But , A fresh eye , some times opens doors to other understandings , that may give birth to a valid concept.

        • Here’s what I read:
          There are stanzas.
          And Sentences. (1-2-1-1-2-2)
          They connect by distance or circumstance.
          They make an X?
          I have a solve in Montana.
          It took work, and I’m tired.
          It has a lot of Fenn data.
          It leads to a blaze.
          After many searches, I know there are lots of ‘blazes”, but the true one must be directly related to Fenn personally.
          My blaze is in the “boundary of terms”
          [ OK, I”ll ask, why did you bring this up?]
          Because I meet new and smart people, every human is a treasure, and fresh eyes may be a good.

          ???? Is there more here????

          • Yes OS a bit more… The words are misunderstood in F’s poem , it’s like a logic puzzle , leading somewhere. You know it is but to where? I have 3 very solid solves at this time. But , I don’t have the chest.
            But , your solve may lead to it. That was my point to seeker. Never give up on something you have a bead on . No matter what anyone say’s.

            I also have 3 solid solves, One in Montana , and it took work also . I have been on his trail for 2 years solid going on 3. Yea , you could say I have also put in a lot of work , and I Am also tired. Sometimes my kids question the whole thing. It is not about just the Hunt thats for sure. Even if my solves are wrong, Ill still keep looking.

          • Im putting this as a reply to my own post, but is for Mike who replied to that post.
            Thanks Mike, my problem is your saying that you “throw out ideas” for us. What I see you throwing out is not really ideas but observations of the obvious, affirmations of some private interpretation, followed by statements of resolve to continue in your wonderment and upbeat outlook. I am confused and not enlightening by your paragraphs. Confidence and boasts without explanatory evidence is just vapid BS. You did say something in a post farther down this thread that did give me a new idea to think about, and I thank you for that. And I admit, I probably missed many of your posts. You said negative commentors should put up or shut up (you said it nicer than my paraphrase) … so here is what I have thrown out recently, off the top of my head… some off the wall, some maybe useful:
            Hear me = Herma = boundary marker
            List-en good… list = selvage or edge
            Go down 4 (stanzas) to: take the chest & go in Peace = go down Highway 4
            Waterfall & fall on face = Font & Typeface
            Block out Philly = see the long view to CO, or to the Metes & bounds memorial on the OH/PA border, & 1785 ordinance.
            No Paddle (spank) = do not switch
            Local war memorials = asterisks to the DC wall of heros
            chest = trunk
            I don’t kow if these are original, I just haven’t seen them beaten to death, and they are discussable ideas. Now I’m tired too. Good luck in your searches and solves, & stay open to fresh eyes and voices, new ideas are appreciated.

  77. Amy, Glad you had a safe trip. Enjoy your chase and stay safe. Sending you luck from the home front in Arkansas.

  78. Hello Treasure Chasers and fellow adventurers. Pops has finally stabilized and my Daughter and I will be heading out to Northern NM on Wednesday. Will be travelling in an suv with WWWH on the back window. AZ plates.
    We plan on pursuing 3 of our areas, fishing, gold panning and sight seeing.
    Look forward to meeting some fellow searchers.

    • Good to hear things are going well enough with your dad so that you and your daughter can get out on the road for an adventure. Have Fun!

  79. #1 start, direction, distance
    #2 general location within a few hundred yards
    #3 starting point of your path
    #4 follow the path it will fade
    #5 path has ended
    #6 visual verification of your precise location
    #7 begin a new direction to a known point
    #8 stand at that location look to the west and take in the beauty of it all
    #9 make visual contact with the chest

  80. Seeker, and other negative commenters…

    I really don’t give a flying fudge what you think. I simply am throwing ideas out just like everyone else. I am sure you would love for me just to spoon feed you my solve but I am not to that point yet. Instead of complaining why don’t you come up with some creative non-sarcastic comments to stimulate discussions rather than whining about repeat information on the blog… I know one thing for sure…a negative nelly won’t find the chest.

    • And there it is, Michael D.

      You made a comment that had contradicting statements. Example your clues 7 and 8 are In your words “subtle reaffirming clue” and “reaffirms earlier suppositions” And I challenge you to explain how they could be clues if by your own comment their just subtle and supposition of earlier clues?

      There was more, but I’ll save time by saying what I stated before.
      …”could you at least give examples to match your comment.”

      You want a conversation “about” the 9 clues? I’ll join in every time as i have in the past.

      But instead of answering the questions presented in my comment , you complain that I asked, obviously taking offense to my question…if that is so, why bother making any comment on the subject? or do you just want a pat on the back.

      You said, “Instead of complaining why don’t you come up with some creative non-sarcastic comments to stimulate discussions rather than whining about repeat information on the blog…”

      You’ve been around for sometime, on all the blogs…I find that last comment hilarious. No whine and chez party here… Sarcastic? I call it straightforward.

      • seeker – I consider this case closed – lets just be friends and move on to better days

    • enough with them negative waves Maury… Woof woof! 🙂

      In your corner here Michael d!

      • Micheal d please remember Mr F said to go in confidence. dont waste time trying to prove what you know. if know something know it dont share it. the proof will happen if and when you get BOG and find TC. you have nothing to prove to anyone on blog just your self.

  81. My take on it is that the poem not only contains nine clues, but hints and instructions as well. Straightforward, the poem is a narration of your quest, but the details need to be deciphered. The instructions, in my opinion, read a little like “First… next… and last…”

    1. Begin it…
    2. From there…
    3. The end is…

    How you fill in those blanks depends on how you decipher the rest of the text. I believe “the key” FF refers to can be found in one of the two longest lines.

    I have not solved it and I do not have nine clues. This is just how it reads to me and how I approaching it.

  82. Thank u everyone. This poem to me has been like ” Everlasting” 🙂 🙂

  83. ” To all who are thirsty” drink plenty of water 🙂 🙂 I was just in the hot tub and felt dehydrated lol 🙂

  84. you supposed to take 30 minute breaks and drink water ang get in the shade – didn’t you learn anything in kinder garden lol

  85. As I have gone alone in there
    And with my treasures bold,
    I can keep my secret where,
    And hint of riches new and old.

    Begin it where warm waters halt (fishing hole name, not physical presence of warm water)
    And take it in the canyon down,
    Not far, but too far to walk. (go by boat)
    Put in below the home of Brown. (fishing hole)

    From there it’s no place for the meek, (this will come later)
    The end is ever drawing nigh; (waypoint A and fishing hole name)
    There’ll be no paddle up your creek, (waypoint B)
    Just heavy loads and water high. (pull the boat)

    If you’ve been wise and found the blaze, (between A and B)
    Look quickly down, your quest to cease,
    But tarry scant with marvel gaze,
    Just take the chest and go in peace.

    So why is it that I must go
    And leave my trove for all to seek?
    The answers I already know,
    I’ve done it tired, and now I’m weak.

    So hear me all and listen good,
    Your effort will be worth the cold. (in the water, don’t be meek)
    If you are brave and in the wood
    I give you title to the gold.

  86. Forrest said a child could figure this out and they could if they had the right map.

    As I have gone alone in there
    And with my treasures bold,
    I can keep my secret where,
    And hint of riches new and old.

    Begin it where warm waters halt (Kiddie Pool)
    And take it in the canyon down,
    Not far, but too far to walk. (go by boat)
    Put in below the home of Brown. (Texas Hole)

    From there it’s no place for the meek, (this will come later)
    The end is ever drawing nigh; (Death Row)
    There’ll be no paddle up your creek, (Simon Creek)
    Just heavy loads and water high. (pull the boat)

    If you’ve been wise and found the blaze, (ET Rock 36°49’33.04″N, 107°39’21.39″W )
    Look quickly down, your quest to cease,
    But tarry scant with marvel gaze,
    Just take the chest and go in peace.

    So why is it that I must go
    And leave my trove for all to seek?
    The answers I already know,
    I’ve done it tired, and now I’m weak.

    So hear me all and listen good,
    Your effort will be worth the cold. (in the water, don’t be meek)
    If you are brave and in the wood
    I give you title to the gold.

    • I like your solve, GeoJack. Good luck with that.
      I also try to fit in the various other hints that FF has given.
      But I also wonder, is this the sort of place that FF
      would have once wanted to leave his bones?

  87. What we are taking as fact:
    ♦Located above 5,000 ft and below 10,200 ft. – Elevation 5600 ft.
    ♦At least 8.25 miles North of Santa Fe, New Mexico – yes

    Two people can keep a secret if one is dead. Plaque on rock commemorating a person overlooks ET Rock.

    Bring a sandwich, there is a bench to sit on overlooking ET Rock.

    ♦ “There isn’t a human trail in very close proximaty to where I hid the treasure.f”. – trail is over 30 feet from resting place.

    Less than a couple of miles to and from location.

    Can’t post pics of Blaze, but ET Rock has it in it.

    Rock jutting out from shoreline has large recess under it.

    I sent Forrest this solve in Nov. He posted Scrapbook 112 days later.
    He also posted in Scrapbook 104 the signature page in his Fechin book. Look at the Stephen Spielberg signature. The letters & E T have been added.

    Read Dal’s description of where he thinks the hidey place to be:

    I think that it is not buried. But I do think that it is under foot and under the surface. So, to say it is not buried would be deceiving because some would say that it is buried…under rock.

    I say this for a couple of reasons. First I think Forrest has explored a lot of cave-like locations in his time. I say cave-like because I don’t think all of them could be classified as a cave so much as an overhang covering a space….like Mummy Cave, which is not really a cave so much as an overhang. Open enough to provide a good view and fresh air. Yet it provides some protection from most rain/snow showers. A good view of game trails along the river in front of the opening. A good place for First People to hang out when they came to the Shoshone River to fish and hunt…just as Forrest’s family used the place to have their lunch.

    I believe “no place for the meek” is telling us that it takes some courage to go into this place. Maybe you have to wiggle or crawl into it. It could be narrow opening to a cave. Or the entrance could be in a peculiar location in relation to where people typically stand when they visit this area. We know he said that it is special to him and that he “discovered” it..

    Although it takes some courage to investigate, it does not take mountaineering skills or advanced climbing skills or super-human courage….yet you cannot be meek…which is why the place is likely known only to him…no one else had noticed it…or at least investigated it. Forrest might know this because inside were Indian tools. Still laying in the dust…unmolested. No one had been into this place for hundreds of years…until Forrest came along. He feels it will remain unmolested for a long time to come. Even if he gives us a roadmap that tells us where it is…and so far he’s been right.

    When he uses the word “discover” I believe he was referring to the concept that not everyone would see it…would know it’s there. He didn’t know it was there until he “discovered” it. It’s not obvious. I suspect it is a hidden opening in rock…and I further believe that most people come to this area by being on top of it. Perhaps the road is above. They park their car and walk out on the rock ledge to gaze at the view and snap a picture. No one looks to see what is below the ledge. The entrance is on the wall of the ledge where they are standing but they have no idea…nor do they care to investigate…that research was left to Forrest.

    I think this ledge and the cave-like orifice below face a body of water. I think people come to this ledge often. It may be a famous “kodak moment” location. A view of a beautiful stretch of trout stream or a vast mountain meadow of wildflowers. Tourists above have no idea what is just a few feet below their shoes. And that is what makes it so likely that so many have been near it…but of course they had no idea about the treasure below.

    Look at the image in GE. (ET Rock 36°49’33.04″N, 107°39’21.39″W) you can see the rock ledge that looks like an aileron on an airplane sticking out of the shoreline about 18 feet. There is an opening under it that extends very deep back into a cavity.

    • Jack it could be possible, why do you think so many have returned empty handed. I believe the reason is because of elaborate imagery cooked up by our minds (that you just described so well). Where in the poem do you find this? It’s possible the treasure could be under a rock in the middle of a cornfield next to a rest stop. Don’t let your mind lead you astray, it is your best friend and worst enemy. You must learn to hem it in with logic. Logic and imagination can play in harmony but there must be rules. Good luck!

    • Jack the scenario you present might be but why do you think so many have returned empty handed. I believe the reason is because of elaborate imagery cooked up by our minds (that you just described so well). Where in the poem do you find this? It’s possible the treasure could be under a rock in the middle of a cornfield next to a rest stop. Don’t let your mind lead you astray, it is your best friend and worst enemy. You must learn to hem it in with logic. Logic and imagination can play in harmony but there must be rules. Good luck!

      • 68U LOGIC LOGIC LOGIC. you are so right our egos and what we would do get in the way of solving poem. the one big thing we thing searchers forget is in Mr F ORDINAL PLAN he was suppose to be very ill with cancer when he did this he was going there to die. sick people dont travel far or walk far. plus he had to carry the chest in and walk out and carry treasure in. and in final plan he got to walk back to car. so that first trip in to canyon is a SHORT trip because it had to be done at least three times in original plan and four in final plan.

        logic is the solve

    • Have a great search day Amy. Looking forward to hearing about your adventures!

    • Good Luck Amy. hubby said you are nice and hopes you find it if we cant. take care and keep us informed.

      just case we are looking for good crow recipes for you and because we may need them too LOL

    • I’m just now reading this, Amy. Good luck to you. If you look three times and think of home, you will find it. 🙂

  88. this is my take on the first stanza imo – I think it says what the place looks like – and where he hid it – in that place – so my story starts with stanza one – one day I sent my son after some spark plugs – go to the auto store and get them – the auto store has a large spark plug on top of the building and at the far end of the store is where youll find them (stanza one ) go to where warm water halt street – keep going till you pass a gas station called heave loads -that tells you that you are going in the right direction – keep going and you will pass blaze street – when you get to in the wood street – you can start to see the large sign of the spark plug on top of the roof and theres the store go to the far end of the store that’s where they keep them and that’s the story of the spark plug

    • Frank,

      I have jumped back and forth with stanza one. I have looked at it just as you stated, and many other way as well.

      So I question my self, is this stanza a clue or a hint? if a hint what is it hinting at. Does new and old mean NM, giving a place to start? Does it mean the Trove… the journey you are undertaking…or a subtle suggestion how how the poem reads?

      instead of see the poem and this stanza as “only” fenn talking, could it be that he is telling of an event or narrating?
      The use of words in this stanza has made me think of how they could be used differently to the average first reading… as everyone did when reading it the very first time.

      IF Gone alone is past tense, could it be he is talking about the past itself, not so much his travel, but Human travel and habitation. The story of us or ” i ” as in knowledge of self. Gone “alone” as in the definition of the First, and the words “in there” is the travel. Could “Keep my secret where” also be past tense with the same line of thinking as “where” in a time span. Fenn puts a story with every object he finds / buys etc. Is it not the what an Archeologist does? attempt to find the answers to The When Where Why and Hows of us or ” I ” knowledge of self?

      So personally can see the the 1st stanza read as such, using the definitions of the words with a bit of a twist.

      I or us traveled from the “old” World to the “new” World “alone” [ first ] with their possessions [ Treasure ] they keep their secret with them [ two can keep a secret if one is dead ] “where” in that time period until the riches of knowing is found.

      I know this is not a popular line of thinking to most, as some would say it complicating the poem. That is fine, I say that it is more straightforwards then just attempting to follow a random set of directions without the knowledge to the meaning of the poem.

      So could it be the WWWH is a time period… old and new… meaning past and present and the way the poem is needed to be read? And as Fenn as stated you need to know where to begin.

      This is just a single theory in the attempt to see the poem through the Authors eyes. And IMO is the reason for a poem vs. hiding clues in the stories of the book… a poem is all about the Interpretation and use of words presented by the writer.

      So now I have a starting point, a meaning of the poem, a location of travel and the significance of all those.

      Right, Wrong or indifferent. I’ll ask you [ or anyone ] to dissect that line of thinking… To discuss the possibilities or Improbabilities of the theory. it that not what this thread is about ?

      “This is the place to discuss the nine clues…For instance:
      What are the nine clues…
      Is the first clue “Begin it where warm waters halt” ?

      • hi seeker how many dents do you have on your fore head from banging it against the poem? we have quite a few ourselves.
        how we came up with our solve is we started at SF. Fenn has said that is his home. “SF has been good to me” i think that is close.

        if you have ever know someone very ill with cancer they can not drive or travel “not far” and must ride in a car. we know Mr. Fenn drove to the place because he said so. if he made two trips to hiding zone keep in mind the distance when done has to be X by 4. so 1/2 mile trip carrying 25 pounds (just a guess/round off number) becomes 2 miles to walk total. keep in mind his original plan and the fact he was suppose to be very ill.

        we think IMHO any where south of Denver is his limit to travel if he were to become ill enough to do his ORIGINAL plan. we know his said all four states but we just don’t think he could travel that far to YS without help and he said he did it alone.

        • wildbirder,

          I like your opening question lol. Correct me if i’m wrong… fenn was treated for cancer in 1988, the poem { by fenns own words } took 15 years finalize, the book came out in 2010. So at age 79 some 20 plus years after having and recovering from cancer he set out to hide the chest.

          Why would it be a problem for him to drive anywhere, by himself with no difficulties or help?

          The question I would like to know is, from the interview with the comment of the smells and sight of the location of the chest comment… just prior… was [ paraphrasing ] …moved from TX to NM to recover or heal? That to me is more interesting than pinyon / pinon nuts.

      • I like your thoughts seeker and I also found a map in ttotc but not the one that looks like a map

        • JD,
          What do you mean, i’m on something? Oh! on “to” something.

          Maybe I should switch my thought to Colorado… if i don’t find the chest, at least I’ll be happy about it. lol

          • Sure, seeker, colorado is gorgeous! Spent my single digits there.
            Of course, back then, mile high city meant something different. 😉

          • If a clue leads you to the treasure, and the hints back up the clues, then, begin it where it says begin it. Clue #1. Begin IT.

      • seeker imo – lets just say that the chest wrote the poem – for me new and old is a hole – for me bold is the omega -the opening of the omega is where he put in hid the chest so as I ( the chest ) have gone in there alone – with my treasures bold-I (the chest) – can keep my secrets where and hint of riches new and old (in a hole ) new – before – old after – new – before it was a hole – old – after the hole was dug – begin it where warm waters halt – imo – is to me is what holds water – is it a lake – a dam- that’s where we start looking and the only way we are going to know is where the real hob is and let me just say this all of these clues you are not going to find them with out a google map -imo – wwwh is the first step – you do not go to home of brown that me is a land mark -that’s why it says not far put to far to walk – don’t walk there- or don’t go there – 1 wwwh 2 hlwh -3 blaze – 4 in the wood 5 the chest – this is only my opinion I hope this helps – sorry it took sometime to answer I type with one finger

        • OK frank,
          It seems to me that for you, the first stanza hold only hints, and the wwwh is your first clue, is that correct in my assumption? If so sure I can see that as well. But should WWWH be a holding of water, [ and “not” a dam…] How does one know of or find the body of water as the first clue?

          If the clues are in consecutive order, then something in the first stanza should indicate to where that body of water is, correct?

          This has been the dilemma for me if WWWH means a location of water and is the first clue what bring you to an exact locations of it? I’m not asking you to tell me or anyone else where that location is… but to explain / discuss the thought process.

          • seeker imo the first stanza has nothing to do with anything that has to do with water imo it only tells you what the place looks like and and the spot where its hid imo

          • Seeker, If I may jump in here….The clues are in consecutive order but the hints are not. So find the hint that leads you to the first clue then go from there.

            In my book, I explain all of this and answer most questions that has been put up on the blogs. I think that you and everyone will benefit from reading my book.

            Again, the hints don’t need be in consecutive order. There is a hint that gets you to wwwh.

            Hope this helps.

      • Seeker, The trouble with blogs is that the reader cannot discern inflections and tone. I took your previous post as a “Shut up if you can’t provide anything new” type of comment…and perhaps you did not mean it that way at all. So I will attempt to answer your question without “giving it all away”. Clue one and clue two combined together give us our staring point, for example, I have gone alone in there could mean a single letter I is in the name of wwh. .Ie. Agua Frio. Take it in the canyon down tells us direction of travel from the beginning…Go South down agua Fria Canyon. Not four but two four two walk give us distance…perhaps a pace count. Next we “Put in” below the spot we just arrived at, which will be the HOB, for example, put in below the bat cave 242 paces south in agua fria canyon. This is where we actually enter the canyon to begin searching for our next clue. The next clue tells us to stay to the left, and find a creek that is described as unpaddleable, and has heavy loads and water high…perhaps a waterfall and large boulders in the creekbed. We know we have the correct creek when we find the blaze, which is an unmistakable marker to the Fennaholic…Perhaps an FBF, a rock cairn, or the waterfall itself. Now we can search in earnest. My opinion is even if we KNOW we are in the correct location, we still must “FIND” the chest…otherwise someone could just happen upon it. The point is, the blaze, at least in my solve, is the clue that confirms you are indeed in the correct location to begin the search in earnest.So why is it that I must go and leave my trove for all to seek tells me there is a fork in the creek and I want to take the south fork. So hear me all and listen good your effort will be worth the cold refers to getting wet, and also refers us back to the clue in the beginning of the poem, about wwwh. The last clue tells us to search in thw wood and to be brave…perhaps a log jam, or beaver den, or a concealed wooden crate is the wood. I already have definitions for all of these clues before I leave my house, which is exactly what FF has suggested will be the case. All of this is in my opinion, and these clue associations are fictitious, and not a part of my real solve…but they demonstrate my approach. I cannot go into detail about the alternative hidden double meanings in clues 7, 8, and 9 without giving too uch away, but I hope I have illustrated my thoughts well enough for folks to understand my approach to the solve.

        • Michael D

          First let me start by say… Im not the type nor will ever be, one to dance around what I’m saying. I have been told many times I’m too direct even to the point of sounding inconsiderate. But to be honest that is just my personality. So you won’t see smiley faces and rainbow lingo in my post. And you are 100% correct “The trouble with blogs is that the reader cannot discern inflections and tone.”

          I can only hope someday I may have the writing skill of Fenn, Dal, and other.

          But you answered some of my questions and concerns… so thanks for that. My only reason for these posting on these sites is for discussion about the poem. If someday we meet in the field, the coffee is on me and we can shoot the breeze on anything that comes to mind.

        • Imo and I have my own difficulties trying to recall how this works but most of you will get it quite easily. I think I had n. Halt as ice. I do recall I used waters as a verb. So place where warm waters ice. Or where warm weather melts ice/snow. I had it as the Triple Divide. I have shared some of this before but don’t have much new to offer and we have new folks aboard who may benefit from the word interplay with nouns and verbs

  89. IMO the poem has the clues in order. (ff said do not mess with my poem) the first clues get you to the blaze and the rest lead you to the location from the blaze. none of the clues in the poem refer to the blaze or describe it. you must have the books or read the blogs and stories to figure out a blaze. also IMO only a very few of the stories have anything to do with the treasure. However, if you only use the stories that fit the poem, they unlock the poem and present to you a starting point and a description of a blaze.

    • Dave I like the thought of as you said. “the first clues get you to the blaze and the rest lead you to the location from the blaze.”

      But there have been many comment from fenn stating the book is a good reference, the poem will lead you to the chest, there subtle hints in the book if you know what to look for, the hints in the book were not deliberately placed etc.

      So If what you say is possibly true…”none of the clues in the poem refer to the blaze or describe it. you must have the books or read the blogs and stories to figure out a blaze.”

      Does this make the poem unsolvable on it’s own? if the blaze is only found outside the poem.

      • seeker – imo – I asked a friend to tell me what is a blaze he answered – flames it has something to do with fire so if I think the blaze is also having to do with heat – that’s why I think the blaze also means summer imo why do we have to wast time reading books when all you have to is read the poiem and find the meanings hidden in side the poem just take what we learned in school and don’t over think it imo

      • Seeker, The clues do not describe the blaze, they lead you to it. The clues are a set of instructions on how to get there. And when you get to the blaze there are other hints that help you find the remaining clues that lead to the chest. Fenn is very crafty. Have fun searching everyone.

        • Ritt,

          When you say, “And when you get to the blaze there are other hints that help you find the remaining clues that lead to the chest.”

          Are you saying there are clues At the blaze, other than the poem?

          I don’t see the clues as most do. The WWWH, the canyon, etc. for me is a journey to be known. The clues are with in those, yet still within the poem itself.

          My thought is that once your at the location were the poem takes you…you need the other information in the poem… some are meanings.

          Example. “The End is ever drawing nigh.”

          This could mean, everything eventually comes to and end or the end of your travel is near, and / or The end by the meaning is, a boundary or border.

          Drawing can be approaching, art, and / or pulling towards, drainage

          Nigh, is near or left side.

          Using those as well as ” ; creek ” meaning a narrow passage… You may find yourself, “west” of a ” boundary” line, on the opposite side of of a “narrow” “drainage” or seasonal run off / over flow.

          That is one of my actual clues. I don’t see the same picture of creek, hoB, canyon, or even the blaze as others. But it is told in the poem. IMO

          Are there directions in the poem? Yes… i just see different ones as well as different clues.

          So what is it you see at your Blaze?

          • Seeker, Yes, there are hints at the blaze and in the poem. When you have been wise and found the blaze you will see. That’s is all I can say here. I’ve spent over a year writing the solution to every clue leading up to the very final spot. Of course it is within the 200 ft. that Forrest has mentioned. People should really read my book, they will be amazed and sadden at the same time. The solve uses a combination of logic and imagination, it is straight forward and the clues are in consecutive order. For 12$ it will take you “There.”

            Most everyone has gotten a piece of it right, just not all of it, and not the right starting area. Put it all together and you’ll see.


          • Um yeah, No. I’m not buying your book Ritt. That’s why I come to the blogs and discuss the clues, It’s free. And I don’t need to open an Amazon account… dang those folks want more info on me than my Proctologist.

          • It’s okay if you don’t want to buy my book, Seeker, and, you don’t have to open an account if you do, anyone here on the blogs can order direct from me Just send me a private message on Stephanie’s site.

            I know you don’t need my or anyone’s best (clues) advice, but you really won’t be getting it for free on any of the blogs.

            How long have you been searching?

            Good luck.

        • Ritt,
          You said, ” they will be amazed and sadden at the same time”.

          I assume amazed and saddened that they just spent $12 on a book about how not to find Fenns treasure?

      • Well, I can say that the poem is solvable to get to a general area like a five or six mile area. But, I honestly do not think that you could find the “one tree” (wood) that denotes the blaze without knowing the blaze.

        • “Seeker, Yes, there are hints at the blaze and in the poem. When you have been wise and found the blaze you will see. That’s is all I can say here. I’ve spent over a year writing the solution to every clue leading up to the very final spot. Of course it is within the 200 ft. that Forrest has mentioned. People should really read my book, they will be amazed and sadden at the same time. The solve uses a combination of logic and imagination, it is straight forward and the clues are in consecutive order. For 12$ it will take you “There.”

          Most everyone has gotten a piece of it right, just not all of it, and not the right starting area. Put it all together and you’ll see.”

          Ritt: unless you found the chest, this is just an opinion, right? Goofy and Dal make everyone else say IMO, SO my question is, Do you have the chest?

    • David… You seeker and all the others that think there isn’t a clue in the poem that talks about the Blaze are ALL wrong! IMHO. But who am I to know …. Until July….

      • Apparently you are wrong James, Where did i say there isn’t a clue in the poem that talks about the Blaze. Never once, here or any other blog.

        That is not my opinion… that’s a fact.

        Is this were I insert a frowning face?

  90. I like to read the poem blending the words together to make new words. For example, “Heavy loads and water high” becomes “Heavy load sandwater.”

    I googled sandwater to see if it’s a thing, and sure enough, it’s a FEN!

    I don’t really think this is a clue; just a happy coincidence 🙂

      • Adding to your thoughts Michael, perhaps FF found an old mill stone or whet stone, a worked stone of some kind in the area, simply used what was there to conceal the treasure. Perhaps an old threshold stone or grinding stone. I’ve turned over small boulders in the past to discover they were used by ancient NA’s to grind berries.

    • Lois, that’s a great find! You could add to your discovery Heavy could mean water as “ea” indicated water for the Spaniards who hid treasure.
      Of course Forrest mentioned he only read pirate stories. So unless the Spaniards were also pirates Forrest may not have used ‘ea’.

      • Anna, would that be E for España and A for Agua? You sound like a fun person to go treasure hunting with.

        If I remember correctly, Forrest was asked if he was familiar with any other treasure maps. (I think this was asked because treasure maps generally have uniform rules, like the starting point is always north of the final clue, or something like that.) Forrest’s answer was that he’s only familiar with pirate maps. I personally believe he’s familiar with the Spanish Trail and many of its signs and symbols, even if not a map per se.

    • Sounds good Lois.

      Mr. Fenn wrote “So hear me all and listen good” for a reason.

      Don’t pay any attention to people that use more than one exclamation point.

      Go with it and good luck.


      • Jdh or anyone have ideas on why Mr. Fenn wrote “So hear me all and LISTEN GOOD” ??

        1. Herme has been discussed as a boundary
        2. sounding out like a child.
        3. Listening for animal sounds like owls, otters, or snakes – as a warning.
        4. Hear FORREST good – forest sounds in a place not for the meek.
        5.listen to each letter.

        WHY GOOD, and not well?

        Perhaps listening for a sound through wood which rhymes with good??

        • Not saying WELL when it is expected might be a way of drawing your attention to a well.

        • Hi lia,

          I think the emphasis be might need to be on “hear ME all…”. Hear who? Hear Forrest.

          I don’t think good has any significance other than to rhyme. I think wood may be a clue as to where you should be at this point (perhaps in a forest… hear forrest, don’t read forrest) and I think he’s saying that this is where your effort will pay off. (I’m keeping “cold” to myself) The pay off being the chest.

          Good luck with your hunt,


          • Jdh – I have similar thoughts about hear me, but will think on what it means to hear Forrest. Thank you for your kind response. Lia

  91. I believe the poem does not tell you what the blaze is, but it tells you how to get to the blaze, and you will absolutely know it when you see it…only opinion…and my blaze could be removed, but it would not be feasible to try…

  92. And all you need or should use is the poem….then go back and read the book to help you firm up you are indeed on the right path…the clues, IMO, are so subtle, it would be next to impossible to pick them out before you had solved the poem…but afterwards, they start to appear.

  93. And no place for the meek could mean north of the church, If these are all directional clues, but what church? Lol

  94. Wow, thats the first time so much has been disclosed, hope there is no midnight remorse.

  95. Michael H, you said look quickly down in the poem brought you effort….
    I see,

    • Well, since everyone’s sharing like it’s happy hour…here’s my nine clues…sort of…I think…

      1. Begin it…
      2. Take it…
      3. Put in…
      4 . The end…
      5. …look quickly down…
      6. Just take…
      7. …that I must go…
      8. …I’ve done it tired…
      9. If you are brave…

      So, yeah, those are my directions, if you will. But hey, me no have gold!!! 🙂

      • very good that like ours very simple and short. blogger try to make it to hard

  96. Begin www halt and take it to canyon down not far but far to wal put in below home of Brown (from there) ? Where? Any thoughts thanks

    • I think everyone here has thoughts on this! Mine is the Rio Grande, which I think Dal said he explored extensively.

    • admir – imo – why take it in the canyon down the poem will just send you back up to wwwh

  97. Had a nice adventure today the weather was beautiful the scenery was awesome, unfortunately I did not find the chest, I think someone took the blaze lol 🙂

      • hi frank where in NM are you searching and where do you live. we are in N. TX and are searching in NM too but cant go till aug

        • amy – I cant go searching until sept or early winter – when thing have dried up

          • Frank

            Your waiting and your missing out
            As much rain as we have had it will never be dry 🙂 🙂 lol

        • sorry wildbirder – that comment was ment for you as to where I live im from Hobbs nm as far as to where im searching all I can is north of santa fa – no hurry things are still pretty wet where I need to go – good luck to you and hope you can make it in aug.

    • With all the rain you’ve had,you mightn’t need the blaze. The Tc might be just lying there all exposed .
      🙂 Good luck, Amy. Smile all the way to the bank.

  98. amy i am sorry but i am torn on this issue. frank leave it in NM please

  99. at 37.152511, -105.732523 on google earth their is a label that reads the box

    • Don’t forget that strange structure to the right. I’ve seen a couple people try WWH to be the sand dunes in alamosa or i believe there is a hot springs in the area. Theres also Brownie Hills nearby.

  100. Ritt – what is the title of your book? U.S. It possible to preview a couple of pages before purchasing? Thanks.

    • Thanks for the information that I asked you for Ritt. Best wishes on your book.

  101. You are correct michael d. You will know the blaze when you see it because it refers to all of ff’s interests . And you are also correct, it can be moved but is not practical to do so. What I meant in my post earlier is that unless you know about who ff is, you will not be able to recognize the blaze when you see it from the poem alone . And btw, why would anyone sell a book if they do not have the treasure. And moreover, why would anyone want to buy a book that does not have a solution. all of this is IMO

    • Yeah endofthechase, I don’t see the draw for this one either. A fictional non-conclusive book probably 15 percent true and 85 percent made up which is supposed to be about a true story… Oh I can see the ones and ones of people after this book.

  102. I don’t think you should be able to pitch your book on this site., time and time again. I do not think very much of you for doing that.

  103. OK as Dal said at the top of this page: This is the place to discuss the nine clues…For instance:
    What are the nine clues…
    Is the first clue “Begin it where warm waters halt” ?

    YES that is the first clue Dal –

    As I have gone alone in there – H
    and with my treasures bold – H
    I can keep my secret where – H
    and hint of riches new and old – H

    Let’s say for a moment that FF hid the treasure in or near a mountain – you first need to locate the mountain (the 9 clues are needed to do this) Some of the hints are used to zero in on the exact location of the treasure once you have located the mountain while others are used to help with the clues.

    In the first stanza (The first 4 hints) do nothing to locate the mountain but help zero in to the treasures exact location.

    Begin it where warm waters halt – C
    and take it in the canyon down – H (The 2 hints here are to the clues)
    not far, but too far to walk – H
    put in below the home of brown – C

    From there it’s no place for the meek – C
    the end is ever drawing nigh – C
    there’ll be no paddle up your creek – C
    just heavy loads and water high – C

    If you’ve been wise and found the blaze – H (Notice here past tense)
    look quickly down your quest to cease – C (Notice here back to present)
    but tarry scant with marvel gaze – C
    just take the chest and go in peace – H (This and all remaining hints
    help zero in on the chest)
    so why is it that I must go – H
    and leave my trove for all to seek? – H
    the answer is I already know – H
    I’ve done it tired and now I’m weak – H

    so hear me all and listen good – H
    your effort will be worth the cold – H
    if you are brave and in the wood – H
    I give you title to the gold – C

    • 1 alone into grave
      2 he said would die with the chest
      3 his secret 2 people keep secret if 1 dead
      4 old rich/full life and rich after life

    • this is a nice breakdown but are you saying that there are no hints for the clues? No hints for WWWH or the HOB?

      • The two lines in the same stanza are subtle hints to WWWH and HOB but they are not that difficult to figure out really – the key is just keep working the problem until it can’t be anything else but –

        I have now got my ticket and will leave Boston to arrive in Santa Fe on the 11th 🙂 guess I will see if I am right nor not lol

  104. Sorry, Musstag……. I didn’t mention the name of my book until, Anna asked.

    Sorry for upsetting you this way……I will be more careful not to mention a book again. I will go to the networks, I hope that is okay with you.

    Good luck…..

  105. Most of us here have found the ‘perfect solution.’
    Remember, when you find that ‘perfect’ starting point and end in the ‘perfect’ location, you also have to consider:
    It’s a place that’s “,,,very secret and very dear place, private.” “…very special place to me, otherwise I would not have done it. I couldn’t just take it out and bury it in the ground someplace. I think that was a crucial part of it.”—FF

    • Kevin, thanks for the link & the refresher… I had forgotten those words came from ff’s mouth. The postings implying some Eden-like imagery had fuzzed my focus. Apologies. FF also said in this clip, “The secret is to think and analyze.” … sorta conflicts with that ‘ Imagination trumps knowledge’ thing. Left foot, right foot, which one leads?

  106. I, too, believe the treasure to be in Yellowstone, and have zeroed in on a search area.
    Forrest IS Yellowstone, IMO. Both fought ravages in ’88 and both survived, and came back stronger and more beautiful than ever.
    On June 27, I will be driving my Wrangler, sans top and doors (my 17′ Old Town will protect in case of rain) from Everett, Wa to begin my Chase. Yehaa!
    I just need to figgure what to bring for Dal’s cache (fun stuff, margie!)
    Btw, I’ve never been to YNP, and I’m STOKED!

    • Great song; “This Must be the Place” by Talking Heads is a good one, too.

  107. Amy, don’t eat bacon or sausage before you head out on the trail today. You don’t want to become LouLee Chased by Bears;-)

    • anna, Who said I ate Bacon or sausage to be chased by bears? You have never read my story. I never did anything wrong. I am well experienced in the woods, and because I have spent alot of time in The Woods, and I know all about how to handle myself there. Just simple camping can bring a bear into your camp. I have seen it. Even with proper food care, etc. You can have bear encounters. I know all about this, because Like I said I have experience with back country, I spent weeks “Out there” on trails etc, hiking, backpacking, fishing, guiding, collecting, treasure hunting, and Prospecting. So don’t make stuff up that is not true about me. 🙂

      • Good morning Lou Lee.

        Please re-read my comment. It doesn’t say Lou lee ate bacon or didn’t follow back country rules.
        It merely says you don’t want to be chased by bears as Lou lee was.

        Perhaps I’m mistaken, don’t you always sign your name Lou Lee who was chased by bears in Yellowstone. Just wanted Amy to be safe on the trail and I wish you the same.

        It would be very enjoyable to hear your story about being chased by the bears and I’m so happy that you survived!

  108. Not familiar with this one but love Disco inferno! What a beautiful day in CO!

  109. Forrest did u see me today? How many times did I walk by the chest?
    I felt like I was so Hot but yet can’t seem to find the blaze or wood lol 🙂 🙂
    So I must be Cold 🙁
    I think our blazes are 2 different things I will tell you mine if u will tell me yours 🙂 🙂 ha ha ha oh how funny. 🙂

    • He must not want that turquoise bracelet very badly. How does he expect us to return it to him if he won’t even tell us when we’re warm or cold? Hehe

      • Forrest u need an intercom out there that way u can say ok stop now look straight up its right in front of you. Now look down, there u go now look under that ground, bring me my bracelet back 🙂

        • How about a GPS phone app, where FF can track searchers from the comfort of his home, and send signals when he sees we’re close to the treasure?

          I’m sure someone would build it if he would use it! Man that would make life easier!

        • Amy,
          I see you too, look up, I am in GE to the west of you and south. Oh, by the way I see Dal carrying something heavy, oh never mind it is a 12 pack.

        • Smart girl. You’ve figured out where the tracker is. I wonder? 🙂 “She will be pleased when she see,s it”

  110. I love u guys 🙂

    Lord knows I’m trying. We will see what tomorrow brings 🙂

    • Its early in the day, you could be out searching till 9:30 pm, this time of year. I hope you find it soon. Good luck Amy and keep your eye’s out for other treasures. 🙂

      Lou Lee, Chased by Bears in Jellystone park and lived to tell the tale.

  111. Forrest, let’s play ” Who wants to be a Millionaire ” you make up some questions and we will answer them 🙂 whoever wins gets a BIG ClUE. 🙂 lol ha ha

    We would all be winners because we know how to use google lol 🙂

  112. I think I have a real close idea where the treasure is. I will give you the info if you follow it and my info helps I would like a percent of the treasure anyone game?

  113. Six Questions More with Forrest Fenn he says, “Many are giving serious thought to the clues in my poem, but only a few on in tight focus with a word that is key.”
    Tunnel Vision? Both words are key but the Tunnel is the answer. I think I know where. If this sounds like I am on the right track or this may have merit . Lets talk.

  114. So, does bad luck come in threes, or is the third time a charm? Shot down twice and cancer = bad luck. Surviving each = good luck.

    How many LICKS does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop? Mr. Owl said, “Thhhree.” I would argue that it’s 579, but I tend not to argue with Owls.

    And what’s that thing in hockey called? A hat trick? What IS that? 🙂

  115. Has anyone ever considered the following? I’m sure it has been discussed somewhere on the blog, but I can’t find it.

    What are the odds that the Fenn Clovis Cache sat in someone’s basement, passed down through the years, with no back-story? My wife’s grandmother can tell a story about every thing handed down to her through multiple generations. Heck, she could tell you what so-and-so had for lunch when a particular picture was taken.

    What if…. Fenn knows the location of where the Fenn Clovis Cache was found in 1902 and has kept it a secret all these years? What if, the poem is directions to this location? It sure would explain a lot about the 1st and 5th stanza.

    It is said to have been found in a plowed field or in a bag in a cave. The field location was discounted as unlikely due to the fact there was no plow damage. Using analysis of trace materials, it is thought to have been found near the borders of Idaho, Utah, and Wyoming.

    The number 42 keeps coming up in my solves from time to time. I suppose one can make anything fit just about anything if enough effort and massaging is applied, but here the number 42 separates Idaho from Utah. 42nd parallel. For you “Toledo” fans out there – Toledo is just a smidgen south of 42.

    Anyway, I’m just wondering if the chest is hidden in the same place the Fenn Clovis Cache was found. I would imagine this place would be pretty darn special to Fenn.

    My solve puts me in this general area, and I made the association after the fact.

    All you ever wanted to know about Clovis Caches, including Fenn’s, can be found here:

    • Q1werty1,
      I appreciate you sharing you thoughts. It’s not like I take them and run with them, I don’t. It’s just that they are enjoyable to read. I no longer can be very analytical beyond the moment. But it is nice to read analysis. If I were to search and find anything of value based on even a small portion of your shared thinking 50/50 is my first offer. Slim be the chance.

      It is also refreshing to see “sharing” of new ideas. New to me at least. New every morning almost.

      • Thanks Uken2it.

        I figure giving the area of my solve won’t really help anyone since WWWH and the blaze clues are so, well, unique. I’m hoping so anyway. 🙂

        It’s just that the idea of the chest being hidden in the same location as the Clovis Cache is kind of cool. It’s almost as if Fenn might have suspected this line of thinking when he said on the Today Show, “… not in Utah or Idaho…”. That leaves Wyoming.

        And the date he purchased the cache is interesting to me. 1988.

        Scott W.

        • Although I haven’t made any real statements or assumptions above, I am adding “IMO” for the Goofmister. 🙂

          Scott W

        • Scott, it’s very cool to think about the treasure chest being linked to an ancient cache. That would be one very appropriate answer as to why the place is special to ff.

    • very compelling thought. I recommend the Tankersley book, In Search of Ice Age Americans. Harold Erickson discovered the catch in 1963, Crook Cnty WY, never documented the spot, but there were 12 clues that might lead to the cache site. pg 119.

    • q1,

      Some good thoughts. I have attempted to think about the “special” many times…Although it seems almost everyplace fenn talks about is special or as meaning to him.

      The 42 has been a discussion for a long time with so many different ideas and usages for it. The one that caught my attention [ as I’m a counter of the poem ] is… from the A in “AS… to the T in “treasure” is 42 count with letters and spaces.

      Does it mean something? or is it just a coincidence? Who knows.

      But personally like 44. As I said I’m a counter, and if you count the 9 sentences, 6 stanzas, 4 lines per stanza and 25 capital letters or the “structure” of the poem you get 44… most like to talk about the capital B in brown, but dismiss the other capital letters as poetic writing. Just seems to me after 15 years of working on the poem, they should mean something.

      Just my thoughts.

      • Seeker,

        As much as I want to be a numbers guy, I try my best to leave them alone. My math and computer science background tend to pull me that way from time to time, but I resist the temptation.

        I do look at clues and SBs and try to associate the words and stories to nice even lines. I’ve found quite a few, believe it or not. One of the scrapbooks lead me to a particular city. That’s when I found out that it was on, you guessed it, the 42nd parallel (dead center).

        I’m passed the “B” in Brown. However, even when I finally post my solve after my next search, I probably won’t reveal the hoB; the “blaze” ,if you want to call it that, probably so.

        Scott W

        • I’m picking up what your putting down q1. As much as I like the SB and Q&A’s The main reason I like the poem “only” [ that is just me ]
          Is …”Contains 9 clues that if follow precisely….”

          How exact is precisely? for me that is a spot 10″ x 10″ and to get there the poem should be that precise in nature. Maybe that is why so many are looking for coordinates. Lets face it, are coordinates not a blaze of sorts. Maybe not the conventional thought of a marker but fenn doesn’t think conventional, at least IMO.

          Just like ” Take it in ” the canyon down. Is this a boots on the ground travel or could TAKE IT IN mean line of sight or as another pointed out earlier “tight focus” or in her words Tunnel vision. What is it that we may see at tat point?

          I try to think of different usage for the poem than just first thoughts. We all been there…

          Good conversations…………

          • Seeker,

            I too believe that the poem is really all you need, and I don’t go searching for other hints and clues BEFORE I put a solve together.

            However, I see no harm in looking for confirmation after-the-fact. We can’t discount the clues given after the poem was written.

            Example – How many people trashed their solve after Fenn stated WWH was not associated with a dam?

            What about those with solves before the minimum elevation was stated (5000 ft)?

            I guess what I do it try to convince myself a solve is incorrect by searching the blogs for contradicting information. Sometimes I run across interesting coincidences during that process.

            Scott W.

          • seeker – its my opinion that the only time that you put boots on the ground is when like Forrest when he parked his car and walked to the spot to hide the chest

          • seeker – think Latitude and Longitude 🙂 That’s what I think he gave – as you said how else to bring someone to a 10×10
            that would have to be pretty accurate.

            If you write a letter you can’t just put BOB on the front and the postman goes oh yeah I know where BOB lives lol you write the full address – so how to do that in the mountains ? Think PILOT and then ask how would a pilot navigate.

    • Scott way back in the beginning I liked the idea of his special place being the location where his Clovis Cache was discovered. That’s a great area with lots of interesting places but I could never put together a complete solution there.

      One interesting coincidence; the Fenn cache contains one crescent which is important for the fact that it’s the only known example ever found in a Clovis cache.

      • Goofy,

        The neat thing in my case is that I had the solve before I realized it was in the approximate vicinity of where the Clovis Cache is thought to have been found.

        The problem I now have is that my solve does not lead me to a cave, grotto or rock shelter that I can ascertain from GE.

        So if my hunch is correct, then my solve might not be as complete as I thought it was. On the other hand, perhaps I just need to be there to see it. Or… the two are not related and it is all another fabricated coincidence in my mind.

        I will go regardless. I hear the scenery and fishing is superb.

        Scott W.

    • I spent a few months last year puuting together a very similar silve, but referencing his first ever found arrowhead, the one that started FF’s love of discovery.
      However that ran out of steam as I just couldn’t make it fit…then againi am in UK, so what chance do I got if I need Boots-on-the-ground..??

  116. WOOT WOOT – got my ticket and on my way – leaving tomorrow and arriving on the 11th 🙂

    • Good Luck! Knowing you are flying into Santa Fe rather than Salt Lake City eases my mind. 🙂 Although it looks like you will be driving North quite a ways since it will take you two days to get there from Boston.

      Have fun!

      Scott W.

  117. THANKS Q1 🙂 Yeah I am headed to NM that’s where my solve leads me.
    I thought you were searching NM as well – ??

    • eager,

      I gave up on NM. For now anyway.

      My initial focus was Valles Caldera (you need to go there BTW. Just to see it). I was lucky enough to be able to drive my own vehicle in. Had to buy a fishing permit months in advance to do so. Not sure if it is the same rules now that they handed it over to the parks department.

      I then shifted to Bandelier since it is perfectly bounded vertically at 5000 and 10,200 feet. Also a cool place.

      I turned the search into a vacation and spent some time doing “fun” stuff too. The hike up to Lake Katherine is well worth it. I did a one way trip by being dropped off up top and picked up down by Holy Ghost campground (mostly all down hill or flat)

      Needless to say, I don’t have the chest, so what do I know. 🙂

      Have fun and see some of the awesome wonders NM has to offer. FYI – if you decide to soak it up in Manbry Springs you might get an “eye-full”. :0

      Scott W

      • bahahahaha something to think about that’s for sure 🙂

        For me this is going to be recon with hopes of being able to pick up the chest but if a 2nd trip is required that’s the way the cookie crumbles lol

  118. Over the past 2 1/2 plus years have heard many areas discussed by many searcher, and was wondering, now that more information is known has those search areas changed from past thoughts.

    Just curious. A question to all, Using your interpretations of the nine clues. What is the size of your search area? Your actual travel from start to finish.

    Example: all in one state… involving two or more states… out sight the “map” area to a single state…out side the Country and through many states…all within 100′ or a 100 miles.

    • That’s the right question seeker 🙂 Hey what state are you searching in ?

      • eager beaver,
        I guess I could have start this all of with my thoughts, so hear it is.

        I now have two theories I’m working on…My first starts with a Time period that leads me from the eastern hemisphere to the western hemisphere { ok ya’ll can stop laughing till i’m done} which brings me through Canada, to the USA and one spot in a single state, down to a garage size location.

        Now my second theory is Two clues in the poem lead to a single spot where the other seven are “used” at that spot. all in that same state, obviously. But all in an area less than 50′ …

    • Seeker,

      Most of mine have all had a start and finish in the same state. An exception would be one where I started in CO and ended up in NM. That would be the Toltec Gorge area.

      Distance – all fairly close from start to finish.

      Scott W

  119. Today is Treasure day 🙂 🙂
    Third time is a charm 🙂
    I need a home run today 🙂

    • I think it may be in a cave or where a brown bear may live have you looked at that.

      • Strike 3 🙂

        James we found a deep cave today it was really cool nothing was in there but us lol 🙂 🙂

        • James I have a pictures of that. When I pist my solve u will see
          We are now professional hikers lol 🙂

          Forrest I was brave and in the wood but that blaze is hard to find. Maybe I need eyeglasses 🙂

          • did your son show you what was sent to him and like someone else said think with imagination left side brain think backwards.

  120. 24 eyes on the ground must equal at least 24 boots on the ground or more if there are a couple of dogs in the mix. Well that’s not a miilipede or a centipede but it sure sounds like a STAMPEDE!! Stay out of Amy’s way today! Good Luck!

  121. Has anyone considered that “the end is ever drawing nigh” is a hint that the end of the Chase must be solved with your imagination as in the (left side of the brain) ? Just something to consider if you are getting stuck in the poem..

  122. Yesterday I finally made it out to my search location. Today I’m just now being discharged from hospital after being treated for heat exhaustion. I underestimated the combination of the heat and altitude, coming from the east coast and ended up paying for it.

    I’m going to post my full solve here as I won’t be going back. I didn’t get a chance to fully search the area so it’s possible it might still be out there. I’ll post a little now and the full thing later when I’m feeling up to it. My searched focused on south end of bear trap canyon, along Barn Creek, above the dam. There were a number of illustrations in the book that took me to that spot.

    The first illustration was Gypsy Magic in TTOTC. It’s not news that the lead dancer’s upper pant leg looks like Lake Ennis. However if you look closely, you can actually see the outline of both a fish (Brown trout) and a fishing fly within that depiction of Lake Ennis. The next item in that illustration is the fire. The flames from the fire match up with the creek patterns coming into the south end of bear trap canyon. Just above the right flame, there is an “X” that is formed by two crossing blades of grass and the smoke just to the left of the “X” match a contour on the east side of bear trap canyon just above the dam where Barn Creek comes in. The wood in the fire form an airplane. So the finding of the blaze and looking quickly down I believe refers to seeing that area from a birds eye view. There is a second blaze formed by my namesake (three rocks) further up Barn Creek near where Speing Creek joins Barn Creek. The area of land in between Spring Creek and Barn Creek is very similar in contour to the golden frog in the “gold and more” later in the book. The three roughly round gold nuggets each correspond to distinct rock outcroppings on the north end of Barn Creek/Spring Creek and I believed the treasure was under a tree opposite of the middle of those outcroppings. There are about 9 more illustrations across both books that all point to this area. I’ll post the full thing later on. Oh and WWWH is hot spring creek that enters Madison river at the north end of bear trap canyon. Interestingly, that junction is just about 8.25 miles from where barn creek enters Madison river. All of this IMO. More to come later. Going to get some rest for now.

    • Sorry left out another thing. It is too far to walk from the north to the south end of bear trap canyon because the trail eroded away years ago. Also, in Gypsy Magic there is a photograph of “Main Street Cowboys” above the illustration of the gypsies. At the Barn Creek location there is a grass covered plateau above that entire area which is referred to as “cowboy heaven”. More to come. All IMO.

      • Hope you feel better. I just sent Eager Beaver an email last night reminding him of the altitude and what it does to flat-landers.

        Dehydration is a bummer. Spent a day in the ER in Alpine, TX with my daughter while she got IVs to re-hydrate her. Weather was great in Big Bend, but you still need to drink the water even if it is cool weather. Altitude compounds the issue.

        • Thanks q1, am definitely improving throughout the afternoon after getting IV fluids this morning. This is really good advice, appreciate you passing it along.

      • So sorry you fell ill threerocks. Rest, rehydrate and regain to resume.
        Btw, is one able to see the snow blaze where Blaze Mt gets its name, from the Lake Ennis area?

        • Thanks for the good wishes Mosey. Great question about Blaze mountain. I honestly don’t know. I’ll be driving back through Ennis on way back to catch flight out of SLC on Friday and will look for it during the drive. Will let you know what I see.

          • A few months ago I was thinking, if the clues led me to the area of Ennis Lk,, climbing to reach ‘waters high’ I would look for the snow blaze from that vantage (perhaps it being the only view of it in the area of search)
            Good luck, Threerocks!

    • Fenn 5 searchers nada. Amy, Dal. Not saying anything but we’ve all come up empty. I personally have been out 12 times. Good advice on the heat thing. Stay put to the fall heart index can be brutal.

    • 3R,
      While reading this, I’m reminded of the Fenn quote:

      “All of the information you need to find the treasure is in the poem. The chapters in my book have very subtle hints but are not deliberately placed to aid the seeker. Good luck in the search. f”

      If the pictures and illustrations were designed to contain hints then they were deliberately placed and I would have to say that disqualifies them as being of any use in the Fenns opinion. You’re not alone….others persist in trying to get clues out of them but I don’t know why.

      • Colokid –

        What I think he meant by that comment – was that the chapters, themselves, are not placed in any order. He let his editor place the chapters. . Well, that’s not too hard to do as they follow his age……. IMO what he said, has nothing to do with the placement of what is INSIDE the chapters. The only thing that means to me is that the number of a chapter is probably not important.

        If you go back and reread what he said with that in mind – it explains that the statement does not get you very far. I think all the drawings in the book are hints – in one way or another. The Gypsy Magic drawing is very telling. Now if I could just find out why – I would be in better shape.

        The poem is in the book. 🙂

        • Inthe,

          Oh geeze, I guess that’s possible but to me that’s a fairly labored interpretation. He has implied many times that there are only few hints (not many hints) so I think you’re really stretching to say “all the drawings are hints”. Lastly, I think most people, including 3R, are violating what he said about the difference between a clue and a hint. 3R is using his illustration information to move closer to the chest. In fact I’m not sure he used anything from the poem at all (guess we’ll have to wait for his full story). As you recall a hint doesn’t do that.

          I’m having a hard time remembering where but he addressed the illustration-as-clue issue in an interview, I think, around the time that TFTW was just about to be released. He described how he contracted the illustrator to draw whatever he (illustrator) wanted with no directions from himself (Fenn).

          I’m totally fine if folks want to head down that path though. Just pointing out that it goes against Fenn’s clear directions.

          • Colo –

            I have never been one to count – clues or hints. That is not until the very end. 🙂

            A few could mean many things. Nine clues? Yes – over and over – again and again. Just when you think you are finished – you are not. Simple – but deep.

            We will see…………………

          • Colo, the poem suggests a searcher needs to be wise to find the blaze. Wisdom is gained from a variety of places but usually comes from some prior knowledge or experience. An instruction to gain wisdom and obtaining guiding information from the books still lies within following the poem. Saying everything you need is in the poem, does not rule out an instruction from the poem to go and gain wisdom to aid in its interpretation. Forrest made an interesting scrapbook post some time ago about seeing patterns in the designs in his shower walls. He may have been providing subtle direction to do the same thing with some of the illustrations in his books. There are more illustrations which I’ll post later on which all point to this area. In the end I’m not really putting this information out there because I want to be right. I’m doing it because I invested a lot of time and want to be helpful. I’m not headed out there again so if it’s there and it helps someone else find it then that’s great. All of this is IMO and you can take a look at it if you find it of interest or move on to other ideas if not. Either way, best of luck in your search.

        • Itct, me too! Gypsy Magic is indeed interesting. I know it’s right in front of me and I see a lot, but not enuf! Oh boy, you don’t want to get me started on the drawings! Talk about making yourself sick!!! 🙂

      • IMO the illustrations are like a Rorschach test. The mind sees what it wants to see. I think Humans are predisposed to seeing patterns and faces in photographs.

        • YSREBOB that might be true. Just to give you some additional context for these interpretations, I’m a practicing radiologist. I also run a well known research lab looking into new imaging approaches for diagnosing neurological diseases. That give me any more baseline information than anyone else here (though it has apparently left me woefully unprepared for the physical rigors of the higher altitude great outdoors) but I have spent the last 20 years of my professional career finding order in visual patterns from imaging and histopathology in diagnosing disease. From what I can see, the number of hints present in the illustrations which seem to repetitively focus on a few key features across both books seems like more than a coincidence or random interpretation of patterns in the clouds. This is all IMO.

          • Sorry, that should read: “that does NOT give me any more baseline information”, not that it does as listed above!

        • YSR,
          Not just illustrations. Look at all patterns people come up with in the language. That’s why this poem is so successfully insidious….F knew once folks struggled a little to understand the poem they would overlook the obvious and make it more complicated than it needs to be. Mission accomplished.

      • Yes, and I wish I could find a comment fenn stated about the illustration … Drawings in the book.

        So take my next few words with a uncertain knowledge… Fenn stated he had no influence or directed the artist in the drawings.

        Whether the comment was on here or in a Q&A I’m not sure … But it was some time ago.

        But again. I have not quote myself, just recalling from memory. Maybe another searcher has it at the ready.

        • As I said about I think it was around the time TFTW was about to be released. There was a video of him working with the illustrator and others. Or perhaps one of the book signing videos….in Taos?

          • I think I remember Danny? Saying he and Forrest went back and forth working on the drawings? Thats just off the top of my head as well I would have to go back and check.

    • 3R,
      When you get around to writing up the full story please include your take on the 9 nine clues in the poem and how those relate to your search area. That’ll be the test as to whether your method holds up.

        • 3R,

          I find your solve interesting…however…I agree with Colokid.

          3R…you said and I quote…
          Forrest made an interesting scrapbook post some time ago about seeing patterns in the designs in his shower walls. He may have been providing subtle direction to do the same thing with some of the illustrations in his books.

          IMO…Mr f was saying people are seeing clues/hints EVERYWHERE.

          Only the poem has the “Clues” to move someone closer to the chest…the book has hints to help explain the clues…just mho.

        • Thanks 3R, and hope you recover fully- as a flat lander from SC, I will definitely take heed of your experience. Though I daresay my experience with humidity should help.

          I think you’re wrong about the whole ‘wise’ line- because I’ve met naive people that know more about life than educated people, and that ties into FF’s thought that a child could solve the poem.

          • Rathmon I totally agree. There are a lot of books mart folks out there with terrible street smarts and who think much more in the concrete than the abstract. The interesting thing about many of these illustrations is that the adult mind has a concrete idea about what they should represent. However a child may see patterns more openly because kids tend to be more imaginative and less likely to immediately sort a pattern into a concept. I also totally agree that one can be both naive and wise. For the sake of the poem and staying true to the poem, my take is that the “wise” statement just opens it up to searching for some background information to help inform the nature of the blaze and what it might represent instead of being confined very rigidly to what is present in the poem itself.

  123. 3R Glad you made it and hope you are doing better. I think that I was lucky to do my search the last week of April. Temp in the mid 30’s to upper 40’s or I may have been in the same shape.

  124. Thanks NO, this was one of the first really hot days here. Bad timing but I’m glad to have made it out of there just a little worse for wear. My chief concern was the wildlife before I got out here and in the end it was just plain old lack of water and heat.

    • 3R –

      I don’t think most people realize at a higher altitude – the full intensity of the sun. We too – became hot while hunting and ran for the shade. We had lots of water – that probably saved us from a similar fate. I hope you are better and continue on your journey – just take it easy. 🙂

      • Thanks, we definitely didn’t have enough water and underestimated how quickly you can get dehydrated in the high and dry heat. When searching it can be really easy to get behind given that the focus is all on the surroundings and finding that perfect location that all of your research went into. It’s early in the season as well. Hope everyone stays safe. It was kind of funny, we saw lots of fresh bear scat on the way out that wasn’t there on the way in and almost didn’t give it a second look as we were so focused on getting back to the car. Interesting how perceived threats can change so quickly.

  125. Well, after 4 years, seems to be no difference between the mechanic or the college guy. Zip & Zip.

  126. Okay, here is the full solve, as promised. All of this is IMO, and all of this is shared in the interest of being helpful and not making any assertions that my take on this is any more valid than anyone else take on this. If nothing else, I hope it is an interesting read.

    Here are the illustrations throughout both books that I found to contain hints:
    1 TTOTC – Page 31, Bessie and Me: (a) Bessie = yellowstone lake, (b) postcard of his family to the upper left of Bessie = west yellowstone.
    2 TTOTC – Page 33, My spanish toy factory: Hebgen lake formed from the shadows of the three figures. Ennis lake is formed from the pants of the left leg of the left most individual. The three marbles I believe represent the three rocks found on the first left fork of Barn Creek at the Bear Creek Canyon dam, and the pants from the individual the second from the left represent the tree on the left fork of Barn Creek where I believe it is hidden.
    3 TTOTC – Page 43, Gypsy Magic: This is the illustration where it all started coming together. The “blaze” or fire in this picture represents creek patterns in the south entrance to bear trap canyon on the north side of Ennis Lake. With that as a reference, the “X” formed by the blades of grass just above the blaze and to the right gives an approximate location of where the chest is located. The picture of the “main street cowboys” above the Gypsy Magic picture represents the open pasture Cowboy Heaven, which is located just above the Barn Creek area (and Fall creek/Trail creek as well). The upper leg from the lead gypsy represents Ennis Lake. There is an outline of a fish (Brown trout) and a fishing fly into this depiction of Ennis Lake. The lower leg, I believe shows the land area between the first fork of Barn Creek, including the shoe illustrating a tree with a base containing a hollowed out area.
    4 TTOTC – Page 133, Gold and More: Several clues are found in this one image. (I) The frog nearly identical in pattern to the hill that lies between the first fork of Barn Creek and Spring Creek. (ii) The three roughly round nuggets I believe correspond to three rock formations north of that left fork and north of the peninsula between the forks. The sizes of the rocks and distance from each other match those formations very well. (iii) taking the middle nugget, the long nugget, and the frog together, I see an inverted tree trunk. If the coin represents the treasure, I believe it is hidden under the roots of a tree that is opposite the middle rock along the left fork of Bark Creek (aka Spring Creek). (iv) Finally, using the same formation I can see a Y that has been tilted on its right side. GE shows the middle rock outcropping of the three rocks contains a Y on its right side.
    5 TFTW – Page 57: The cute brunette under the south window I believe represents the canyon exiting Ennis Lake to the north. Her face represent Ennis Lake, the vertical bands along her mid section match with columns along the east side of that canyon, her right hand points to the hill between the first fork of Barn creek, and there is even a small Y to the right (south) of her hand that represents the small creek that I could not find a name to that is just south of Barn Creek and originates on private land.
    6 TFTW – Page 196: This was another very informative illustration. Towards the bottom left of the image I see Ennis Lake with the bridge crossing on the north end. Further up I see an area corresponding to the unnamed creek just to the south of Barn Creek, which I believe is expanded to the right as the route that the gentleman with the ax is ascending. The top half of the illustration I believe represents the hill between the first fork of Barn Creek. The three stumps to the left I believe represent the three rock formations along the left fork of Barn Creek, and the stump with the rope around it in an “X” formation I believe represents the area where the chest is hidden. Interestingly, the top right portion of the lower stump forms a pattern in the “X” tree which seems to indicate a hollow area under that tree. Looking even closer, there seems to be a faint outline of a chest (though it seems to have rounded edges), in some type of hollowing under the tree. Finally, each of the three stumps seem to match the rock formations very well – the lower stump is large with jagged edges, the middle is smaller but seems to have the “Y” pattern on it, while the upper stump seems to have more of a regular pattern to it.
    7 TFTW – Page 11: The hands in this image have an interesting appearance. Both seem to possess the peninsula type shape similar to the land mass between Spring Creek and Barn Creek. Zooming in on the individual to the left, an outline of a tree is seen that is roughly in the same location as where the middle rocky outcropping would be located. The base of that tree seems to be located along the left fork of the creek in this area.
    8 TFTW – Page 8: Looking at the illustration of Forrest’s father, his hand, the posterior potion of his upper arm, and his ear seem to bear some similar to the three rocky outcroppings. Interestingly, the posterior portion of his upper arm has the sideways “Y” that is located on the middle rocky outcropping, and just posterior to the sideways “Y” there is an “X”, again indicating an association between these two.
    9 TFTW – Page 201: Once again the sideways “Y” similar to what is present on the middle rocky outcropping is seen, this time below the arm of the individual sitting under the tree. Opposite the “Y” is an “X”. Also in this image, the tree isn’t quite right, the wood becomes greater in diameter towards the top. Flipping this illustration upside down it becomes apparent that this is an inverted tree and once again shown is a hollowing at the base of the tree.
    10 TFTW – Page 237: Tree trunk is shown with three bullet holes. The $100 bill is located over the middle of the three bullet holes. Additionally, the two holes to the top are closer together than the one to the bottom, similar to the relationship between the three rocky outcroppings north of the first fork of barn creek.

    Taking all of the above in the context of the poem, below are associations. I don’t have the clues defined to a perfect 9, but have associations for the high points:
    1 Warm waters halt: Hot Spring Creek out of Norris Hot Springs, which enters the Madison at Warm Springs landing.
    2 Canyon down: Bear trap canyon, following down (south) on the map.
    3 Too far to walk: Path from the north end of bear trap canyon does not connect to the south end, due to erosion/landslides on the trail over the years.
    4 Home of brown: Lake Ennis
    5 Put in: Initially I thought this was Barn Creek, but that was way to overgrown for us to make any progress at all, even staying with the creek itself. I believe this refers to the small un-named creek just south of barn creek based upon the TFTW page 196 illustration and looking at doing the final alternative, (Trail Creek) twice in one day. Interestingly, this “put in” location is right about 8.25 miles from WWWH.
    6 No place for the meek: Likely Barn Creek or small un named creek south of Barn Creek.
    7 End is drawing ever nigh: Believe this corresponds to left fork of Barn Creek.
    8 No paddle up creek: This is a small creek which cannot be navigate by boat.
    9 Heavy loads, water high: TC along Barn Creek coming down through the canyon.
    10 Wise and found the blaze: The blaze in Gypsy Magic helps point one to the right location in relation to creek patterns. However, the BOG blaze is also the middle of the three rocks along the left fork of Barn creek.
    11 Look quickly down: I believe this corresponds to taking a birds eye view from the Gypsy magic blaze, and also looking down from the middle rock blaze.
    12 Effort will be worth the cold: Wasn’t entirely sure on this one. Have two potential explanations. First, the hike up Barn Creek or the small un named creek to the south would be nearly impossible in the Summer due to all of the vegetation along the creek/canyon, so this might be advice to search this location in the cooler part of the year. Alternatively, this may relate to some activity needed with respect to Spring Creek.
    13 In the wood: under the tree, across from the middle of the three rocks, on the south edge of the left fork of Barn creek (Spring creek).

    As a final note, before falling ill yesterday, we found a tree that was unlike any other in the vicinity. It was formed by a very large old tree that had fallen onto a newer tree, creating a triangular hollow under the two. I swept the area with a high quality metal detector and found nothing. We (a search party of five adults and 10 kids) investigated the entire area all around the trunk and all along the fallen tree length. We searched up and down Spring Creek (left fork of Barn Creek) and there was nothing else that came close in terms of appearance. Maybe our solve is completely invalid and we were on a wild goose chase, maybe it was once there, maybe we were close and just misinterpreted the final clues. Who knows. All I know is that, I’m putting everything I know out there in hopes it might be helpful to someone else. Best of luck to everyone on the chase. Hope one of you are successful.

    • Just as a final note, we came up Trail Creek in our approach yesterday, much longer than coming straight up through Barn Creek but it takes you along a trail the entire way right up until the last 200 ft. where you have to descend a very steep hill. This proximity of the trail to the search location was also interesting given Forrest’s previous statements about how close searchers have been to the TC.

    • What a waiste not trying to be rude then U end up in ER. I think you should ask for a refund. How many times have we seen highly subjective interpretations of book and scrapbook hints. I’ve seen dozen of your solves each and everyone is empty handed. There is nothing mathematical it’s all imagination…not knocking u or anything but all the time searchers run out west looking for stuff without any numbers. ITS 10x10x5 FOR GODS SAKE!!

        • I’m not as rude as Gold fever but I do concur with what he is saying. It seems like your solve is based entirely on things in the book. Since Forrest has said the poem can be solved without the book I just don’t think solves like this work.

          • Thanks for your comments seabee. I would encourage just taking a look at the illustrations I noted before writing them off entirely. There’s some interesting information there which supports the poem and is not a solve separate from the poem. As always this is all IMO. It’s a lot of information and it might be easy to chalk it up as another rambling solve that doesn’t hold any water. It may still be in the end but there really are some interesting patterns which match that area. Good luck to you on the chase.

          • I read both books a couple years ago but I gave up on finding anything useful in them. If the poem can be solved without them they were just a distraction to me. Forrest has said that there are subtle hints in the book. At first, my point of view was very similar to yours. Studying all the pictures and locations mentioned in the book, thinking one of them had to be where the chest is. For me though I realized I was looking too hard. I was looking for clues, not subtle hints. After putting down the books for a while and focusing just on the poem I started to see what I perceive as the hints in the book. There seem to be two big things that Forrest is passionate about: history (and by history I mean artifacts, art, collecting) and fishing. Google searches are based on popularity and the number of hits a site is getting but when the chase first started if you Googled “Warm Waters” one the fist entries that came up was the New Mexico Game & Fish site and the fishing regulations. So even without the book this definition of warm waters made the most sense to me, and then when I read the book and realized how great Forrest’s love of fishing is, it just reaffirmed it. If I didn’t have the book I wouldn’t know that about him. I believe the hints in the book are that subtle. Forrest is a fisherman, and my solves all revolve around fishing. A side note, but I found it interesting that Forrest mentions every type of trout (brook, rainbow, cutthroat) in the books but instead of saying brown trout he used the proper name “Loch Leven trout”. I just found it interesting that he made it a point to avoid saying brown trout even when he was talking about them in the books.
            But hey, everyone has there own point of view. Like the others said, congrats on actually getting out there and looking. I haven’t yet so you’ve already been more “brave and in the wood” than I have. It’s the thrill of the chase that matters.

          • Seabee, thanks for sharing your perspective. Appreciate you taking the time to do it.