Rumors Abound…


Trying to squash a rumor is like trying to unring a bell. ~ Shana Alexander

I thought we’d try to explore some of the rumors and mysteries going around about the chest…it’s hider…it’s location. Many of these rumors and mysteries started with stories that have misquoted Forrest. Perhaps you have an opinion on some of these…or others. If so, feel free to comment. Please understand that not all rumors can be squashed. Forrest rarely remarks on rumors except to say that searchers should only believe the poem and what he has written in the book. There is a wealth of material both written and recorded using Forrest’s own words. There is also material surrounded in quotes which Forrest never said and never penned. So be careful what you believe.

Lets begin with a very misleading quote that appeared in one newspaper and two on-line journals in 2010. This was very soon after Forrest made his first public announcement and gave his first interviews about the existence of the chest. Those articles are still around today because, what once appeared on the web…stays on the web.

The chest is in New Mexico – Some searchers believe this to be an actual quote from Forrest. But it is not. According to Forrest this quote is inaccurate. Forrest has tried to correct the writer’s mistakes and has often said. “I never said it was in New Mexico.” In fact, he has written and said, “The chest is hidden in the mountains north of Santa Fe.” Although Forrest has never said that it is in New Mexico, conversely, he has never said that it is not in New Mexico.

The chest is in the Rocky Mountains – Forrest first narrowed the location of the chest to the “the mountains north of Santa Fe”. Later, he said “the Rocky Mountains”. It is not in the Appalachians nor the Cascades nor the Coastal Range nor the Sierra Nevada Range nor the Brooks Range. Wikipedia’s definition of the Rockies include only the mountains highlighted on the map below. This is the commonly accepted geographical region of the Rocky Mountains. Forrest would know this although he might be counting on us not to know it. Many people believe the Rockies extend into places geographers do not. The Rockies extend from Northern New Mexico northward to northern British Columbia. The Rocky Mountains do not exist in Alaska, Arizona, Nevada, California, Saskatchewan, Oregon or the Dakotas. It’s also important to realize that the lines where the Rockies end and start are fuzzy. Please keep that in mind if you start ruling out areas that are very close to the Rockies or because the first source you looked at said that such and such a range is not in the Rockies even though it is very close. Forrest has also said that the chest is above 5,000feet and below 10,200 feet.

The Rocky Mountains. From Wikipedia.

The Rocky Mountains. From Wikipedia.

The chest is in Colorado or Wyoming or Montana or New Mexico north of Santa Fe – More recently Forrest narrowed the resting place of the chest to be in one of four states. There is a map of these four states in the back of his book, To Far Too Walk. He has stated that the chest is somewhere on that map.

At least 8.2 miles north of Santa Fe – Forrest stated on another blog: “The Treasure chest full of gold and precious jewels is more than 66,000 links north of Santa Fe.”

100 links = 1 chain
66,000 links = 660 chains
1 chain = 66 feet
660 chains = 43,560 feet (660 x 66) = 8.25 miles

300 miles west of Toledo – Forrest has stated that the chest is “more than 300 miles west of Toledo.” He has also said “300 miles southwest of Toledo”. He has since admitted that this is a relatively worthless clue and will not help anyone to locate the chest. He has also recently said that by “west of Toledo” he meant “generally”. In the same way that the chest is “north of Santa Fe”.

I was very confused by this clue when I first read it from Forrest. I felt that all of the Rocky Mountains were generally west of Toledo, OH. So it was hard to imagine how a clue like this could help. It just seemed like a “non-clue”, in the same category as “not in Nevada”. Then one day I had a conversation with Forrest. I mentioned my aforementioned reasoning for believing that the clue was generally useless. Forrest lit into me. He explained quite strongly how West was 270 degrees and not a general direction…as in “it’s over there”. After that conversation I went home and located every Toledo I could find in North America.  It occurred to me that to Forrest, as a military trained pilot, West would mean exactly 270 degrees. How could I not realize the import of that clue from the start? I dutifully drew a line 270 degrees from each Toledo and closely observed where these lines crossed the Rockies. I plotted and applied the clues from the poem. I looked for how following the clues in the poem could land me near one of these westerly headings in the Rockies. One line actually crossed a place I had been considering. I was excited. I sped out to this place. I searched. I moved north and south of the line to allow for miscalculation or improperly calibrated GPS. I spent five days exploring the area for any kind of blaze…none was to be found. I returned home and recalculated all my lines and set out once again to find a place where warm waters halt and etc. that could lead me to a place near one of my lines in the mountains…but  I was skunked again.

Then one day another searcher shared a note Forrest had sent about the “more than 300 miles west of Toledo” clue. In this note Forrest confessed that the clue was, in fact, “worthless”. So I wasted a lot of time drawing 270 degree lines out of a bunch of Toledos only to find out later that Forrest meant nothing by this “non-clue”. In my opinion Forrest is like the Navajo “Coyote” character. He is a trickster. But the clue is real because not only is the chest hidden in the mountains more than 300 miles west of Toledo…but also because all of the Rocky Mountains are generally west of Toledo (OH) by more than 300 miles.

Searchers have been within 500 feet of the chest – Forrest did say this and he was quoted in the Hemispheres story in January of 2013 by Margie Goldsmith. Some people think that this would be a huge clue to any searcher who was told this.  Is it in fact a huge clue…?

Forrest has said the chest weighs about 42 pounds. The laws of biology pretty much demand that a 79 or 80 year-old man is not likely to haul that kind of weight very far on foot. So my guess is that the chest is probably within striking distance of some kind of road. That being the case, how many people do you think have driven down that road and passed within a reasonable proximity of the treasure, never dreaming it was there? Mr. Fenn is pretty frugal with any new information about where the treasure is hiding. Further, there is no reason to assume that the searchers who were within 500 feet of the chest were ever told by Forrest just how close they actually were. It may have been you. If this is a clue, I don’t see how.

Folks have had the first two clues correct – Forrest did write this as a comment on my blog in the story “Stephen Returns to the Blaze”. His exact quote from the comment is as follows:

“some folks correctly mentioned the first two clues to me in an email and then they went right past the other seven, not knowing that they had been so close”.

My interpretation of this is that a lot of people write Forrest with their ideas for the clues in the poem. I think some hope that Forrest might say something like “By golly, you’re right. You’ve guessed it.” Of course Forrest would never say that but my point is that Forrest hears a lot of ideas that searchers have for the clues in the poem. And at least some of them have gotten the first two clues correct but then went on to incorrectly state the next seven clues. Forrest keeps telling us that we have to start at the beginning or to start with the first clue. That may or may not be “Where warm waters halt.” Furthermore, he has said that trying to find the chest by starting with trying to identify “Home of Brown”, won’t get you anywhere. He tells us we must start at the beginning and follow the clues in consecutive order to find the chest.

Map in book shows where the chest is hidden – Forrest has said that there is no secret “x” on that map (page 133) anywhere so don’t bother looking for one with a magnifying glass.

Double Omegas in the colophon of the book – It was once relatively common for publishers to add their marks in the colophon of their books. Today, those devices and the colophon itself is rarely used. Since Forrest published most of his books himself and since Forrest is a collector of rare books it would seem a logical guess that the double Omega in the colophon (page 148) of “Thrill of the Chase” is Forrest’s personal mark. This could be, but I have not seen the double Omega in his other books.

Another idea is that at one time writers used the Omega symbol (the last letter of the Greek alphabet) to signify the end of their story. But typically, only one Omega was used…not two. Forrest has not commented on those marks and so it is possible that they are meant as a clue. I once interpreted them to be a clue to look near the Horseshoe Mine. Others have suggested they are somehow a unifying remark about the burros he saved. I now believe them to signify promises made and the end of a story for Forrest and his closest friend.

Postmarks contain a numeric clue to the lat/lon of the hiding place – Some searchers have tried to use the postmarks printed throughout the book as a numerical code to reveal the lat/lon of the hidden chest. Forrest has not commented on the postmarks. Still a mystery.

Tear in the bottom of the page of fishing photos in the bookSome searchers believe the tear (page 122-123) was placed there purposely by Forrest and is therefore meaningful. Forrest has not commented on that tear. I don’t know what to make of the tear but honestly, is every little oddity in the book to be considered a clue? Still a mystery.

Letters “CE5” on latch of chest – In the photo of the chest on the back of the TTOTC  dustcover one can clearly see the engraving “C E 5” on the latch. Forrest has said that the “CE5” was placed on the chest by him and that it is an accounting code that tells him what he paid for the chest.

The chest is buried – Forrest has never purposely said the chest is buried. He has always attempted to say that it is hidden. He has gone out of his way to correct the language of interviewers who say that the chest is “buried” (on at least two occasions Forrest mistakenly said it was “buried”, but I believe those to be moments when he was simply repeating what an interviewer said and he mis-spoke). Conversely, Forrest has never said the chest is not buried. I personally believe the chest is not buried…but it is hidden from view.

Surrounded by trees – Forrest once wrote to a searcher that the chest was not hidden in a tree but that it was surrounded by trees.  I suppose it is useful to know that the chest is not in a tree but the notion that it is surrounded by trees is definitely not a clue. Everything is surrounded by trees if you go far enough out. This is exactly the kind on non-clue a trickster would deliver.

Special spot – Forrest has said the spot is special to him. I suppose any spot with a million or so dollars hidden in it is a special spot. But I have always thought that the spot was special to Forrest before he hid the treasure there. Knowing Forrest and knowing his background and history will help me know what kind of place might be special to him.

Begin with the first clue – Forrest has reminded us over and over to begin at the beginning. That the clues are consecutive and that starting in the middle will get us no where. Without getting this first clue, he says, we cannot expect to understand the rest of the clues.

Oddities in the poem’s construction – Folks have recognized inconsistencies within the poem. One having to do with rhythm and the other with rhyming. Most of the lines have eight syllables but not all…Is this important?
Line #2 has six
Line #3 has seven
Line #7 has seven

Only one word in the poem does not fit the rhyming sequence. Why is that? Some have suggested that Forrest did this on purpose and in order to get the real clues one has to repair those errors. Forrest has not spoken about the construction of the poem nor about those idiosyncrasies in it. But poetry is an art form, not a science. Many poems never rhyme at all. Further, Forrest originally began writing the poem in 1988 so he has had a lot of time to make sure it’s exactly how he wants it. It is totally plausible that Forrest simply wrote it the way he did because he likes it that way and we should just accept it and move on. Perhaps we should not be trying to alter it. Once when I tried to substitute words in the poem he wrote me back and said “Don’t mess with my poem.”

What does Forrest want to happen with the treasure once it is found? – Forrest shared this note with us that he sent to a new searcher who wrote that Forrest was his idol. I think it illustrates beautifully Forrest’s humor, self-effacing character and desire for the future of the treasure.

“Don’t see me as your idol, set your sights higher. And don’t get old, it’s overrated. If you plan to join the Indiana Jones club you must have the right kind of hat, one that’s been seasoned in the soil and baptized in vinegar and sea salt. Let curiosity be your motor and adrenalin your fuel. If you find my treasure please give a little to someone who must otherwise do without and let the remaining baubles be seeds for your next adventure. Keep me informed about where you are and what you are doing.”

To the point-

I believe that folks who have been looking since the search began in 2010 have no more practical knowledge of the place Forrest is describing in his poem than the person just beginning their search. To wit: No one has found it.

Bottom line is that people have all kinds of solutions to the poem. There is no “one way” to decode the clues. This is certainly by design. The trick is to find Forrest’s spot by decoding it the way he has imagined it. Just because the first way you follow the clues have not led you to the treasure does not mean the 29th or 47th or 123rd time will not. Clearly, the clues in the poem are cleverly constructed. Don’t expect to match wits with a successful poker player, trader and trickster and win in the first round but don’t give up trying to understand his interpretation. Keep thinking about it and keep learning about Forrest and how he thinks.

Forrest has said that the chest is not supposed to be easy to find. Whoever finds it will certainly have to work at it. Remember, Forrest has had since the ’80s to contemplate a description to his spot. We have only had since 2010 to dwell on how to decipher that description.

I’ll try to update this page over time so check back…


(last updated October 2016)

484 thoughts on “Rumors Abound…

    • There were so many great proverbs and posters about keeping your mouth shut during WWII. But those were the first three I saw…so I grabbed em…

      • LOL…the “loose lips” one was always one of my favorites….besides “Rosie the Riveter” 😉 Really, I’m not that old yet, but I always had a thing for those years.

  1. Dal – I only “discovered” Fenn’s treasure on a recent flight to Costa Rica, when I read the Hemispheres article and was immediately hooked. I’ve been researching ever since including reading your blog. I have also recently obtained “Thrill of the Chase” (a great read!). I’ve not yet had a chance to hunt for the treasure, but do have some ideas and have already made plans to travel west. So I’m very much a newbie on the search.

    With regard to the rumors you have highlighted and dissected above, I do believe that the two statements Forrest has made, that searchers have been within 500 feet of the treasure and that folks have had the first two clues correct, are big. If starting at the correct place “where warm waters halt” is the critical first clue, and multiple people have correctly identified this location, then maybe the starting point is not as indecipherable nor require as much intense thought as many might suppose. Not that it is an obvious or simple clue, but at least one that may not require new chasers to try to be clever in choosing a starting point that nobody else has identified. For those who have read the book, his poem, and know a bit about Forrest, it may be one of the first few locations that pops into one’s mind. Of course, following the rest of the clues to the treasure is no simple feat. Just my thoughts.

    • I agree with you Murph..It may not be a clue but it’s certainly a morale boost to know that some folks have figured out that first clue. The part that keeps me sweating is what if one of my abandoned ideas was correct? Ha!…probably not!

      • I would love to know your abandoned ideas by my WWWH as you are in my top 4 for most likely to have been within 200 feet of all the sites. Plus the lunch offer still stands.

  2. Hi Dal- This is a fantastic post for us newbies. I just got the book at Christmas so I’ve been trying to catch up on all the blogs, videos, and responses. So many good ideas. Thank you for your informational blog and this very helpful summary!

    Slightly related to rumors, was the conclusion to Stephan’s blaze that it was indeed from a fellow hunter named JB as indicated by another blog?

    Now slighly off topic regarding location, I keep pondering about ff hiding it alone with nobody knowing. Assuming it was in the northern Rockies (as I hope), how could he pull that off without his family ‘team’ knowing? Driving say to MT would take a couple of days. His baggage flying commercial might raise some questions! Since you’ve spent time with him, do you get the impression that he’s still off on adventures and travel often enough that he’d easily have the opportunity to discretely go beyond a nearby driving distance? Just curious if you have thoughts on this.

    • Brian-
      I don’t know that there actually was a conclusion…only some possibilities. As far as I know it remains a mystery.

      Forrest is quite capable of driving anywhere he wants. He has annual business in Wyoming so he could have dropped it off on a business trip. His family has no idea where it is. Forrest has always been very independent. By his own admission in the poem, no one was with him when he hid it. A multiple day trip would not have been suspicious…just the opposite in fact. It could be close to Santa Fe but it could also be two thousand miles north…in my opinion.

  3. Questions have already been raised about some searchers favorite areas and whether or not they fall into the “Rocky Mountains” definition. I cannot answer those questions definitively. I would look at resources on the web like everyone else. One of the areas that has come under question is the Jemez Mountains in north central New Mexico. Who ya gonna call?… I checked with the Department of Interior’s US Geological Survey site. I looked in their publications index and found an abstract for a document that clearly includes the Jemez Mountain Range in the southern edge of the Rocky Mountains. If you cannot trust the USGS to give you the absolute skinny about a place in the USA…??
    Anyway..I know there are travel sites out there that claim the Jemez is not part of the Rockies…but if it were me I would trust what the USGS has to say about the matter. Look for yourself here:

    • As someone who lives in Santa Fe, here’s my 2 cents….

      Locally, the Jemez are considered only west of SFe, even tho they extend north of town. They’re also on the other side of the Rio Grande – different landscape there. No one (that I know of) around here considers the Jemez part of the Rockies. Being a stickler for detail, I think FF would agree with this, but what do I know?

      In geologic terms, the Jemez are quite distinct from the Sangre de Cristos/Rocky Mountain Range. The Rockies are tectonic formations; the Jemez are volcanic. I think the info on the USGS site refers only to the Jemez’s relative location and does not mean to say they are part of the Rockies…but what do I know?

      Not enough to have found the treasure, that’s fer sure.

      • The Jemez Range appears to be a popular spot to search, judging from the email I get. A fellow by the name of Jeremy reminded me that Forrest most certainly includes the Jemez Range in his concept of the Rocky Mountains with the following opening paragraph of his blog post of September 9th of 2012 titled, “The Brian Joyce Affair”:

        “Santa Fe is an interesting little city, tucked between several mountain ranges that make up part of the great Rockies. What makes the place different are the many characters who are attracted to it, and I proudly admit to being one of them.”

        So it seems quite evident that Forrest considers the mountains surrounding Santa Fe to be part of the Rockies. That would include both the Sangre de Chriso Range and the Jemez Range. I don’t think it matters much what the geographers or even other locals feel. What’s important to a searcher is how Forrest defines the Rockies…

        By the way, that post on Forrest’s blog can be found here:

        Thanks Jeremy…

      • Jemez range is where this Canadian boy thinks it is! Some internet research of this area suggest that all the clues could be part of this area. There is hot springs, that turn into waterfalls, with lots of nook and crannies caverns throughtout. It also happens to have a Brown Trout fishery near by. There is a dam area, high level pools, and many scenic areas to view and explore. It’s elevation is well over 5700 feet, so makes sense it can get cold. And sloghtly north of Sante Fe. Maybe?

    • I asked Forrest about the Jemez, since so many people have questioned if it’s part of the Rockies. He said that most people in NM feel the Jemez ARE part of the Rockies. Of course he didn’t say if he did or not…but I think you can lean towards he does believe they are with that comment which is more than we could do before.

        • i’ve only jumped into all this in the past 12 hours. but using google maps and my own intuition, jemez and the soda dam was the first spot that came to me. maybe it’s too simple. maybe people have been walking right by it still.

          or maybe not. 🙂

          • Gotta try it out Jason. If you don’t and someone else finds it there you’ll be up nights slapping your own forehead.


    Hi folks, I have my version of the Poem uploaded to a site so you can download it if you wish. I had to just throw it up with some other stuff and I will have to pull it back off in a month or so, so download it now if you want it 🙂

    I put up both mp3 and Wave versions, of course the Wave is better quality sound but it is 35mg’s so it would take longer to download…

    Remember, this is the poem put to music, with a chorus thrown in. More of a teaching tool than the next one-hit-wonder. “My” music is certainly much different from this song. I just about ran off the road trying to grab a copy of the poem so I thought it made sense to do this for myself. Maybe you will like it or at least it will keep you out of the ditch when driving…….

    Go to (no www) and click on the “Other” catagory in the top bar clear to the right side. Both versions are there. You can play from your desktop or right click and choose the “Download” option.

  5. Brian, i was hoping to get more details on Stephens blaze or this JB guy. Also, if any relation to 500 feet was connected to a single researcher yet and where can I find these blogs where Forest commented. Thanks.

    • Dustin- The info I read about the blaze is just right here on Dal’s blog! Two posts “Stephan finds a blaze” and “Stephan returns to the blaze” plus a very lengthy comment section. The other blog link below has a 9/21/11 article of the author describing her husband JB’s trip. The timing is right for him to make that blaze. I don’t know anything more about the 500 ft comment. Good luck!

  6. Nice post, Dal. Can we quote Forrest as saying it’s definitely in the Rocky Mountain range?

    One rumor I would like to see addressed is that Forrest took two trips to hide the treasure. Do you have any information on that one?

    • Not sure what you are asking Beno…
      Are you asking if I have his exact words? I do not, but I have been with him twice when he stated unequivocally that it was hidden in the Rocky Mountains. He did not have a map in front of him so it is uncertain how he defines the Rocky Mountains. It is certainly possible that he includes fringe areas that may not be included in an “official geographers” definition. So, my thought would be to interpret the mountain range broadly. But no matter how broadly you interpret them I believe it’s fair to exclude the Sierras, Cascades, Coastal Range and Appalachians.

      As far as the two trips rumor goes…I have no information about that except second hand…and I believe that is how rumors perpetuate. I have no first hand information about how many trips were taken. But let me say that it makes sense to assume that he might not have wanted to carry all 42lbs at one time from the vehicle to the hiding place. If it were me I certainly would have made two trips from the vehicle to the hiding place, one with the chest and the other with the goodies then put them all together when I was at the actual hiding place.

      • Thanks Dal. I just meant did you hear the Rockies thing directly from Forrest, a question you have now answered.
        Two trips from the vehicle… now why didn’t I think of that?

  7. I added a new point by Forrest to this post. It’s quite charming…
    What does Forrest want to happen with the treasure once it is found?

  8. I’ve decided the treasure is definitely in New Mexico. I base this purely on the notion that this will be the only place Ill likely be able to search. :). Great resource page dal!

    • That’s as good a reason as a person is allowed to come up with. NM is beautiful… The Sangre de Christos…the Jemez …lovely country.

    • Don-

      Cool! I have not been there since last fall. I noticed that the park crew found it and thought it was trash until they opened it up. They went ahead and left it there…That pleased me. When were you there?
      I figure after days of searching for Forrest’s cache it’s a relief to have something a bit easier to go after…

      • Dal,
        We were there in September of 2012. We walked down that trail to the river. Lots of Bear marks on the trees. It was great weather we were all over the park. I think it is there it was our second time there. Just my opinion. Anyway lets talk soon. If your going towards Santa Fe let us know. I cannot remember what I left in the box. I think I was the second notation in your book. It was nice to find it.


  9. “You have to find the first clue in order for the rest to make sense.” Since I don’t have the book I can’t search into this more. Has anyone used the poem as a map to decipher his book?

    • His book is filled with tales of his life and experiences. The stories in his book actually help to decode the poem rather than the other way around. I’m one who believes in the notion of understanding how Forrest thinks in order to fully crack the code. You have to get the book, although Forrest insists that all you really need is the poem. I believe him when he says that, although the stories in the book fill in the gaps and really helps one to understand the man that is Forrest Fenn. Forrest Fenn is, indeed, a self-made man and , in my opinion, a true renaissance man.

  10. I am pleased as punch to know that what Forrest wants to happen with his treasure is exactly what would happen if I were to find it….save for the fact that Forrest would be reunited with his bracelet at no further cost to him. A slight gesture of gratitude for the most awesome adventure I and my equally adventurous man have ever embarked on. I can only hope that no one finds it until we can actually get on the trail and be IN the chase instead of just post-chase. And I do have a favorite Indiana Jones hat I wear on adventures that certainly has been seasoned with dirt, vingar and sea salt *S* Did I mention that I love a good puzzle?

  11. Looks like I’m slow to the party. *bringing wine* I didn’t get this blog sent to my email for some reason. I don’t think I realized the exact year he wrote the poem. Interesting. Also, my husband and son met with Forrest a couple years ago and were told that he made at least two trips. So that could lead to it being further back in the woods or it could lead to him not ready to give up that sweet bracelet till he revisited the chest. Could also be that my husband got the story wrong as they had walked in sweltering heat down train tracks for miles in hopes of not being run over…so he might have been a tad delusional at the time when that information was received.

  12. Ah…said the grasshopper. But was that two trips from the car, or two single trips from home? I know that forty two pounds of hard square metal box on one’s back would hurt anyone.

  13. I’m not sure how helpful that information is really. I mean I guess if we knew it was just one trip…then it would have to be close to a road…although is it possible that he could have taken a horse or atv into the woods? When I was looking at Tolby Creek…they have horse paddock areas at the base of the trail. Could that be why he mentioned the Red Canyon trek on horseback? I don’t know if he still was riding when he was 79 when he hid it…but I know he drives just fine as I was in the backseat last week. So why not. Although I’m pretty positive my husband got it right and it took two trips to place it where ever it is…so maybe it’s not so close. So I think that information is non important.

    • I have to agree with Stephanie on this one. It simply isn’t relevant at this point. Work first on the clues in the poem. If you can narrow it down to a specific area then you can worry about whether he took one trip or two trips…
      However I reserve the right to disagree with Stephanie about the horse or ATV idea. Forrest has said that after he hid it he returned to his car. Forrest pulling a horse trailer or ATV trailer? Can’t imagine it. In fact I’d be very surprised to find out that he’s ever driven an ATV. Imagine for a moment Forrest at 80 riding around on an ATV…
      Sometimes I think Stephanie wants to find the chest so bad that she throws red herrings out just to keep other searchers from making any progress at all…
      That chest…in my humble within walking distance of where he parked his car and he’s given us plenty of clues to indicate that exact scenario. In all likelihood the hidey spot is near a road…perhaps 500 or so feet from the road where many folks have passed right by it. That’s Forrest’s kind of humor…

        • FWIW:
          No reason he couldn’t have put 42 lbs or more in a sled and dragged it behind him in winter. 42 lbs sliding behind you, on snow, is nuthin’.
          I drag my kids this way almost every winter, and collectively they’re adding up to about 90+ lbs pounds now.

      • I agree in spirit Dal…However, I also recall him saying he remembers driving on a dirt road for a long time…I don’t think the road is that well travelled.

        • Micheal D,…. Do you remember when he said that about driving on a dirt road for a long time and what it was in reference to? Was it when he hid the chest? Or some other time? Did he say this in an interview or e-mail, where? Hope you can remember. Thanks.

  14. Maybe not an ATV…we have considered taking ATVs back places, because we don’t have any horses(they won’t let us check them at the airport *smile)…but in email I just told you that I really did believe he could have taken a horse back in the woods. I’m trying to trick anyone.

    • Forrest was also quoted saying “take a sandwich” which leads to a thought of a day trip. I do not believe it was a horse. But I do believe its farther than 500 feet. Not far, but too far to walk is a catch. What does this mean? Another form of transportation? Swimming? Climbing? Also quoted “take a flashlight”. Is this a reference to a multi day trip? If his past has told us anything its his camping experience. Or is this a reference to a cave or somewhere else dark?

      • The “take a sandwich” quote has nothing to do with the distance from where he parked.
        “Not far but to far to walk” is from the poem and has nothing to do with how far the treasure is from where he parked either…
        But I agree that the “take a flashlight” quote could very well be a hint about the kind of place the chest is hidden…and what you should bring when you get to the specific location.

          • I have written posts on this blog about some spots or areas I’ve looked in. Beyond the posts I am not willing to talk about specific places. I will say that I have looked in 5 States and now feel confident that I know 28 places where the chest is NOT hidden… but who knows? Maybe I was right next to it and just didn’t see it…
            In my humble opinion though..I have not been close….yet!!!

          • Thanks a lot for the input. I have a bunch of locations and good leads but as you said.. Unless you find it know one will ever know whether their spot was a hit or miss.

        • Here are some of the early talks about flashlights and sandwiches…folks were on it even in early 2012. Stephan and his blaze stories have comments too. They were separate quotes….

    • Hey thanks Stephanie for chiming in… it’s great to have a source for that, even if it turns out he just meant two trips from the vehicle. I don’t think you’re throwing out red herrings, actually I think you’re being really helpful.
      Same to you, Dal… how do you interpret “take a sandwich”? Does it just mean in case you get lost, have more on hand than a Baby Ruth?

      • I didn’t bother interpreting “take a sandwich.” To me it’s just another throw away…like 300 miles west of Toledo…If you are going to be gone long…take a sandwich and if you won’t be coming back before dark take a flashlight…
        It’s like saying “watch out for bears” or “take your time and look close” or “take a raincoat and matches”…These are just things people say…
        But if you feel the need to make clues out of them the meanings could be many..
        Take a flashlight because
        1. it’s hidden in a cave
        2. you can throw the flashlight at a bear to distract it
        3. you can see inside a pile of rocks with it
        4. you can use the flashlight to signal search aircraft if you’re lost
        5. you’ll need a flashlight if you’re out in the evening
        Take a sandwich because
        1. you might get hungry
        2. the bears might be hungry
        3. you should make a day of your time in the woods…
        4. you can sell the sandwich to a ranger
        5. you can feed your sandwich to a squirrel while you sit and ponder the beauty of the area

        • Dal, I think the suggestion about “a sandwich”
          was a minor hint. I have reason for believing
          this. FF didn’t say “food”, “a snack”, or
          “something to eat”. This minor hint doesn’t
          really guide the searcher, but does lend a small
          bit of support to a correct solve.

          The above is just my opinion. Yours may differ.

        • Take a sandwich….Fenns a rich guy and hung out with other rich guys. Perhaps the solve is in an area that is extremely expensive. The average redneck with a pile of kids can’t afford $14.00 for a slice of crappy pizza and $5.00 for 1 draft beer…plus tax. Bring a sandwich, 6 pack, banana, a pie, giant dill pickle, jar of olives…and sleep in the truck.

  15. Dal, this is the most helpful article I’ve come across as an obsessive Johnny-come-lately to The Hunt! Thank you so much for putting this together. I admit I am still stuck on the first “warm waters” clue, even though I am a native New Mexican who has always been fascinated with southwestern history and geography: Folsom Falls, Elizabethtown, Jemez Springs, there are so many starting points that make sense! Forrest has me running the noggin on all cylinders, how refreshing! Next time you’re visiting my beautiful state I want to buy you lunch (or even better, take-out sandwiches!) to thank you for all the work you’ve put into this blog!

  16. A sandwich and a flashlight. Hmmm , I bet it has something to do with a light-snack….

    • LOL….I like your thoughts. I also think the sandwich/flashlight thing is a non-clue. I’m a big hiker of the woods. Done more than a few mountains too. Short trips, long trips doesn’t matter. I always take a flashlight and something to eat. Why? Because it wouldn’t be the first time I came out of the woods in the dark after hiking all day. I might get lost. It gets darker faster in the woods. And I’m always hungry anyway. I’m surprised he didn’t mention to bring drinking water.

  17. The thing to keep in mind is that Forrest is telling you one way to get to the chest, but he might not be telling you the only way to get to the chest. It may be a 6 hour hike to do it the way that the poem describes, but you may also be able to drive the car to 500 feet from it, walk over and drop it off. I think the sandwich implies that it takes a while to get there, I’m thinking that the poem directions are probably a half day from the starting point, hence take a sandwich to keep you going.

  18. Ditto! Helpful post, Dal. As always, thank you. Some new nuggets to consider and a few thoughts I had discounted to be re-examined through a different lens. As for the book, albeit a good read, it’s a train ride to distraction. The main takeaways for me (besides the great stories) are waterfalls and the chest is “concealed.” Otherwise, way too much to over analyze. My opinion. As Forrest says, all you need is the poem (and a sandwich…and a flashlight!). That said, I sure would like to figure out the meaning of pg. 146. What’s with the bird and the crescent moon? Where did the trees go? Is that Forrest?

    • Dave-

      I agree. I think there are two schools here. One is like Stephanie’s. She looks for clues in the book that will help her decipher the poem and there is so much in the book that it’s a very studious and repetitive process. My school reflects the notion that the book is a great asset to help me generally understand who Forrest is and provide insight about his unique logic but it does not contain any serious clues or at least none that I feel strongly enough about to use as a keystone to help hold my interpretation of the poem together.

      Forrest himself has sent us mixed messages about the book. On one hand he has told us that all we need to find the treasure is the poem. On the other hand he has also said that the book has supplemental clues. In this post I’ve tried to include some of the things that searchers have questioned about elements in the book. Are these things clues? I don’t know but by and large I tend to ignore them and concentrate on the poem and specific things Forrest has said about the poem. I try to use what I know or think I know about Forrest and his personality to interpret the poem. The poem is a puzzle…Forrest’s puzzle..he constructed it and to deconstruct it I feel I have to think like him.

      Having said this..I have also spent a great deal of time looking in and around Yellowstone because that place is so special to him as is evidenced through the stories in the book. I’ve also tried hard to understand the meaning of the double Omegas in the colophon of his book. So there are parts of the book that even I cannot completely ignore as I piece together a meaning for the poem.

      • Really good points, and certainly I have been a student in both classrooms. I think it also depends on whether you are in search of “where” or whether you’ve found it and you are now trying to narrow it to “where exactly.” I like to humor myself and think I’m the 500 foot guy (person) and the book introduces a lot of possibilities (too many) into that equation. I have my favorite (and only) site located, but now it’s a matter of deciphering whether it’s 9,000 ft. or 11,000 ft. up the mountain. BTW, I don’t think people give Forrest enough credit for his endurance at age 79. After all, he was quoted as saying he wants “sweaty bodies” out there looking for the treasure. That would be me…cold too.

      • I’d add a third school too. It might be called the gnostics who think there is some hidden secret knowledge/code in the book that gives a major clue. Sadly, I subscribe to all three viewpoints on any particular day!

    • That illustration is as odd as a duck. Maybe there was another story that it illustrated but the story got pulled and for whatever reason, the illustration stayed…
      If that’s the case I’d like to read the story…

      • When a detective enters a crime scene the first thing he does is observe the area carefully. The objective is to discern what belongs and what does not. Sometimes what does not belong is equally important, if not more so, than what belongs there.

        • On that same line of inquiry, (fellow Holmesian 😉 ), a good investigator may make sure to note what belongs there but seems to be missing from the crime scene. e.g. If there’s clearly a gun, where are the bullets…? (fired or otherwise)

      • Odd indeed. I interpret it as something related to the near vicinity of the treasure’s location. The trees make sense for my site; the bird and moon, not so much.

  19. Wholly agreed! I’ve met some mighty strong 79 year olds that could still whip a few behinds when it comes to stamina. Forrest is no stranger to hard work and digging around in the dirt for artifacts does hard time on the knees and back. Forrest stays active both physically and mentally. Maybe he isn’t the big “tea” drinker his stories might lead one to believe. (red, black, green *hint hint*). But I’m betting Peggy makes sure he stays healthy 😉

    • Bonnie, do you think that the colors of tea are really a hint?
      If so, would you like to explain this?

  20. I had an email this morning from someone who appeared concerned about “professional” treasure hunters. I think her concern is that she feels its hard and even discouraging to compete against “professionals”. I don’t. Here are three reasons why:

    1. A professional is a person who makes money at something. So the difference between a professional writer and an amateur writer is simply whether or not the writer gets paid to write. So I think its fair to suggest that a professional treasure hunter is one who has been monetarily rewarded by hunting for treasure. I suppose its possible to say that a person who goes out to a public park with a metal detector and finds quarters and watches and rings is a professional because money is made doing it. I also suppose that there is great variance in the kind of work professionals do. Some go out on Sunday afternoons and look for lost items on the beach with a metal detector. Others spend their time searching for and then salvaging gold off a Spanish Galleon in the Caribbean. This is also true with professional auto mechanics. Some only do brake jobs. Others are part of a NASCAR team and tear apart a couple of engines a week and rebuild them. Most of us are amateurs at what we do for fun. We have a job as an accountant or teacher or chef and on weekends we write our great novels or tend to our gardens or work on the family car. My point is that just because someone is a “professional” and has actually found something does not not necessarily prepare them for the kind of hunt that this one is.

    2. Professional treasure hunters do not often have a puzzle poem to work through in order to find their treasure. This treasure hunt is certainly about getting outside and looking but it is also about interpreting the poem. Hardly anyone is more equipped than the next guy to hunt down this treasure. A “professional” has very little, if any experience in interpreting poems…certainly no more than you or I….so don’t sweat the “professionals”. Unless they happen to be a professional poetry interpreter…ha!

    3. As someone already pointed out, Forrest wants families to look for this chest. He wants it to be fun. My opinion is that he didn’t give anybody an advantage over anyone else.

    • I think the key difference between a “professional” and a regular joe, is that professionals usually have investors. So they are beholden to find something. They owe money so the stakes aren’t just for the fun or glory. I just don’t know how many people would invest money in a poem… Having said that, if anyone wants to invest a 100,000 or so in me looking for the treasure, email me…I’m sure I know exactly where it is. 😉

      Seriously though, I’ve always held that the fun is in the hunt and not the reward. I’ll be happy with whoever finds it, so long as they’re not jackasses about it. Ie, those guys going around saying how easy the poem is to figure out and they know exactly where it’s at but just haven’t gone and looked to pick it up… Sorry, that’s my two-cents, Ill shut up now. 🙂

      • I’ll toast to that. Those remarks made by an obnoxious couple of pseudo-searchers about knowing where the treasure is…or that they found it, have probably persuaded a few new searchers not to look and that’s too bad. Forrest has said this week that the treasure is still there. The folks who make comments about finding it are just trying to spoil everyone else’s fun.
        I looked up anti-social behavior the other day and discovered that deception, use of aliases, aggressiveness and lack of remorse are all features of what Psychiatry calls an Antisocial Personal Disorder…Okay..okay I do have more than one email address and I am not sorry about it…but I don’t think I am the one that is a sociopath…ha!

      • Hey Oak…haven’t heard from you in a while. I think the fun is in the chase and the reward 😉 If anyone’s just doing it for the chase…they can send me the chest when they find it *smile* I’ll even pay for shipping to Chicago.

  21. Funny you should mention that, Dal. I was just reading an article the other day about a “professional” crew of treasure hunters who bagged the big one finding a chest of gold valued at $10,000. I guess they got a prize too. Most rely on geocached logs to help find their cache with, perhaps, a few coordinates thrown in for flavor. I’m not concerned about the “pros” out there since this treasure requires deciphering the clues down to the tee. No coordinates included. The person or people who find this one will have succeeded because they had the best interpretation of the clues and put forth the effort in going far enough to find the treasure. I find that this is kind of like digging for diamonds. The more you dig, the better your chances of finding gems. The hole you give up on could have been hiding the big one, just one more shovel full and you could’ve had it all. If one gives up the trail too soon, they may, indeed, be the person who came close, but not close enough. Close enough only counts in horseshoes.

    Thanks, Dal, for your huge contribution in the hunt. I especially enjoyed the addition of “what does Forrest wants to happen to the treasure”.

    I will be happy for anyone when the chest is recovered. I only hope we have the chance to search before someone else gets there. At least then I can say I was truly a part of this exciting adventure. 😉

  22. In the interest of clarity I must respectfully disagree with Bonnie, as much as I hate to. She said that close enough only counts in horseshoes. But Close enough also counts in hand grenades. f

      • Hi daljust wondering that you’ve been on the hunt since the beginning of this thing,so tell me how does a man from Washington hear bout a story like this when it first came out, I just barely heard bout it last year, tell us a little bout your story, and bout what this all means to you,your obvioustly very involved with keeping this blog going and seem very passionate bout it,what motivates you to do it?

      • Yes, Dal, that is a clue. It very well may mean we have to go in with hand grenades to uncover the treasure chest from its “hidey” spot 😉 Not sure how the rangers and animals would feel about that though.

    • ROFLMBO! Forrest is correct on that one. Ok, I’ll go one farther….close enough is just fine with a shot gun too. 😉 No worries, though. I gave up my guns a long while ago. Even before I gave up my bow. (darn, I miss that bow)

    • Astree, the comments don’t necessarily follow in the order received 😉 As long as you aren’t confused about the clues in the poem, you’ll be alright. Sit down…have a glass of wine, cheerfully provided by Stephani. The crackers and fish spread should come around shortly as soon as Dal shows up again 😉

  23. Also, Dal, thanks so much for all the articles, the tireless efforts you put into the thrill of the chase.

    When Forrest mentioned Rocky Mountains, was it pretty certain that it was that specific range, or could it also have been “mountains that are rocky” (like, say, most of them).

    There was also some blur surrounding the “west of Toledo” – it has also been quoted as “southwest of Toledo”, if I recall, but have only seen Forrest actually saying “west”. NOw, regarding west and a pilot’s bearing,.. Forrest is quite crafty.

    Thanks again.

    • I guess you could go on for decades questioning everything he says and what he meant by it. But I choose to believe that he meant the Rocky Mountain Range. It’s good to be cautious but I think you can be overly cautious too. At some point, if you don’t believe some of the clues you can’t move forward.

  24. I’m not really sure how to get Forrest a note but I want to let him know that his treasure hunt has sparked the imagination and excitement only my 9 and 7 year-old boys can conjure up. I ordered his book after reading the story in United and they insisted I share it with them. They have immediately started all of the research they can and are planning their own expedition in the back yard. I’m pretty sure it’s not there. Anyway, thanks for sparking it for them. It’s just great.

  25. Just want to remind folks that haven’t seen the Forrest Fenn videos to give them a look/see. They were recorded last June at his home in Santa Fe. He speaks about his life, his achievements, his disappointments and I believe there is a great deal to be learned about the man who hid a fortune for someone to find. My mantra is, “the more we know about Forrest the more likely it will be that we can understand his poem”. Videos are here:

  26. Dal
    On Feb 1 you stated that Forrest said this week that the treasure is still there. If you don’t mind, what is your source for that comment? How do you suppose he knows? Does he go to the location for a periodic inspection? Thanks for maintaining the blog!

    • Steve-
      I have no idea how Forrest knows. It’s what he told a new searcher. One can only imagine how he might know. Just as one can only imagine all the lovely goodies that make up the treasure. I don’t believe there is any value in wasting time on how he knows. My mind is occupied with where it could be hidden and if he says it is still there…that’s good enough for me.

      • Forrest may have used a lojack mobile tracker powed by a litium battery or powered by a solar pack…If not and he wants one I’ll be happy to place it in the chest for him.

      • I had not considered that Forrest would use electronics to track the treasure. Like you, if he says it is still there I am willing to accept that it is still there. In the absense of electronics, knowing that it is still there might be a great clue to where the treasure is not located.

        • I don’t think he’s keep track by electronics. He’s said numerous times (prior to his comments this week) that he no idea if the treasure is still there. If it were electronic surveillance of some sort, then he would have known if it was still there in the past

    • Shoot! Does this mean we should be deciphering Fleetwood Mac’s songs now too? Truly, I be befuddled then LOL

  27. I must say the first thing I thought about after “horseshoes” was hand-grenades but maybe that just shows my age, From a child I always heard the two together. Maybe an odd place to insert my first post. dal, I have been following you for some time (silently) and must also thank you for your dedication to the cause, also, Stehphanie, though I have only recently been following your blog. I indeed find the whole “treasuresphere” totally engrossing. I have the good fortune to live just south of Albuquerque and 1or2 day trips are easy to make (not that this has brought me any luck in my quest) I spend an inordinate amount of time with Google earth searching for inspiration, far more than actual time in the field. I was fortunate enough to spend a number of years in the Jackson Wyo. area in the 70s. Not that it has been any help in the “treasure quest” but my God those were some of the most wonderful years years of my life, I got to run whitewater rapids in my own boat, I took “Exum” climbing schools 1&2 day course which scared the S**t out of me but I got to do a 120′ free rappel when the climb was over, a reward of the most extraordinary kind. Forrest I know from which you came and I understand the “thrill of the chase” and I consider myself so lucky to have experienced it all, I long for more, though achy bones and limited time take their toll I wouldn’t have missed it for anything. AND don’t intend to quit now.
    Thank you all for perpetuating the dream.

    • Well, I’ve never had my hands on a grenade nor had the need to which might explain why I didn’t think of it. I have been around horses and horse shoes, however.

  28. “We shall not cease from our exploration
    And at the end of all our exploring
    Will be to arrive where we started
    And know the place for the first time”

    So does that mean it’s at a place he was when he was a child?

    • Is that a clue or is that a broader comment about birth and death and the path we take between them?

      • But he’s talking about the poem leading to the treasure when he says that. Anything he says seems to be a double entendre though…so there’s no way of knowing for sure…but just sort of fun to kick around and splash some water on what he says.

    • Returning to where he grew up was my initial thought too. There is little in the book about growing up in the “wilds of Montana”. Are there other autobiographical writings that indicate where he had lived in Montana as a kid?

      • Yikes Brian…stand by for the deluge of corrections your comment is about to receive concerning your perceptions of Forrest’s early life in Montana…

      • Have you read his memoir Brian? He spent his summers with his family in West Yellowstone as a kid which is just outside Yellowstone National Park. They had a cabin there.

      • …mind…so…sleepy…tonight… Yes, for some reason I was thinking Yellowstone = Wyoming = West Yellowstone. I guess being geographically impaired is not helpful for me; good for all of you though!

      • I was mixed up about that too at one time. I think one of my favorite parts of this is learning about history and geography. If only students could learn this way…I think they would gain ambition from it and retain what they’ve seen is much easier I think then retaining what you read.

    • I think it could a hint, combined with recent scrapbooks, that might indicate that both a plain and complicated reading of the poem might be useful, but in the end, we’ll see the plain reading would’ve be good enough.
      Or, the TC / poem route from where he went ‘alone in there’ all the way through to ‘the cold’ and ‘ in the wood’ happens to bring you around a giant circle… Back to just behind your starting point 🙂
      That’s be a dang good trickster move.

  29. I tend to favor Dal’s interpretation of those lines….like coming full circle in your life through your experiences. Events in our lives are like markers in time, growth rings in a tree, They mark turning points that have led to maybe deeper understanding of the roles that we play in life and, later, how each experience (both negative and positive) connects to the other formulating who we are, how we think and the values, characteristics and even the ethics we hold dear. The one thing we all dread when considering our final story is that we end ruefully wishing we had done more, loved more, helped more, shared more. We all want more in the end, I fear. More time. But a full life is a blessing. And sharing that life is a lesson to anyone who understands it. It is not that we should envy others, but rather that we etch out a life full of experiences of our own. Coming full circle with a belly full of life experience allows reflection on the wonderful surprises that our ride took us to. It gives us satisfaction. It gives others hope. It may even cause us to laugh out loud at our own antics on our death beds. I might rather enjoy telling a wildly funny tale to my grandchildren rather than bemoan my ails and pains as I slip over the edge and onto another journey. Leave them smiling at the very least, if not in a great roaring belly laugh over the predicaments I got myself into and the things I did to extricate myself.

    • Bonnie, that was beautiful! If we all thought like that the world would be a more beautiful place.

  30. Heres a thought, Maybe the end is the beginning. When yea think about it and then think about the poem, it makes a lot more sence. The best place to hide something is in plain sight.

  31. Rember the movie , The Shinning ? The boy doubled back on his foot steeps to get away.
    I dont think the circle works quite right, the moon n stars would half to line up for that to work out.
    We all take it for granted that we start here and end there, perhaps that isnt so. Im just thinking outloud here.

    • If we started at one place and ended up in the same place to find the treasure, then there would be no reason to go around in a circle to begin with, no? All this circular arguing is making me dizzy.

  32. Thanks for the Shinning reminder. I’m quitting the chase now…I’ll never be able to go back into the woods. I thought I was afraid of bears…Jack Nicholson is scarier.

    Back the way you came is an interesting idea…I mean you take the canyon down…but then he says water high…so you go back up where the water is that you started at? I like talking out loud…it’s fun coming up with ideas.

  33. Stephi, I keep telling ya, it’s not the bears you have to worry about. It’s the mountain lions 😉

  34. Or maybe he is just saying that many of you have started in the correct place, missed what you are looking for, and while many have moved on to other places, maybe you’ll find yourself back where you started because your first spot was probably the best spot

    • I like your theory, Jeremy. It sounds not only plausible, but much like Occam’s Razor.

      “when you have two competing theories that make exactly the same predictions, the simpler one is the better.”

  35. First off, It’s already been said that he took the Treasure in in parts. Not all at once. So the theory that it’s just a piece of paper doesn’t make any sense and the fact the it might be next to a road is thrown out the window as well. If he took it in in pieces it wouldn’t make a difference how old he was or the Weight of what he was carrying. Although you might struggle getting the chest back out of the Woods.

  36. Something makes me think Dal has been close by on one of his trips. After being up all night reading every post etc I can I think Steph and Dal were on the right track awhile ago and I think another poster even said the area it is in. “It has to do with the poem and how you interprete it” someone very smart said. Well what if you are over analyzing the poem. Just because Forrest is a clever guy would make one think that was his intent all along. Maybe we need the KISS rule here. I hope I can get to a location I believe is the spot and it is somewhere Dal has been to. No offence Dal but I just think you were 500ft from it but did not look in the exact spot. Who says a “blaze” is a mark on a tree etc. What if it represents a blaze ( fire ). Just thoughts I am sure others have thought. Actually more me writing my thoughts down to interprete them better.

    Carry on all!!

    • I thought that about Cimarron,NM. It seems to be everyone’s favorite spot if your looking in NM because the clues can match up so easily. So what if we’ve all just passed it up? When we were there….we would drive slow after getting all the clues to match up and looked at the trees lining the roadway. We thought maybe that’s why people are missing it….and why he can see it’s there even if he doesn’t go right too it. If you see the blaze on a tr ee or road sign as your driving and look down you can see the chest…but only from your car as you drive by. So maybe it’s near the road that way. Maybe he’s buried most of it, but you can see the side of it from the roadway only…and not when your walking through the woods. Just thinking…..

  37. As a man who spent more than 20 years searching and researching for the Lost Adams Diggings [and knew every moment of it ‘where it was’, no sooner to discover where it wasn’t before I knew where it was some other place] I can say in all honesty I know where it is. So do a plethora of others, all of us actually destined to confirm where it isn’t.

    But I’ve digressed.

    What I intended to say concerns those of ‘us’ who’ve correctly interpreted the ‘first two’ clues [which natually we all believe we have].

    Fact is, the man has a mind like a mousetrap, as testified by the poem and recognized by anyone who’s studied it intensely. There’s no way of actually being certain which clues are the first two. That poem has more potential clues bouncing around inside it than bubbles in a boiling teatpot.

    I’m not wishing anyone luck finding it because I want it to still be there when I can afford to arrive on the scene. Which is going to require a bit of time and hoarding what’s left after I’ve provided bare essentials from my SS pension check for a while yet.

    Just saying. Nice blog. Thanks for sharing the info. J

      • Jeff-
        Your blog is darned interesting…
        I really like the food photos and stories..

        Click on Jeff’s name to go to his blog.

        • Thanks, Dal. I have many more stories than I have time to upload, I envy your ability to regularly update your blog. I travel for a living, so lots of good food and drink stories. I just completed my first survey of the site I feel the treasure is hidden within, but no immediate success. Still feel the location is valid, though, so will regroup for a future visit. In the meantime, saw a part of the country I had never visited before. Beautiful. Can’t wait to bring my family.

    • Actually, Forrest is quite clear about what the first clue is. WWWH.
      If you’ll do the research thoroughly you can eliminate a lot of traps that crop up with quick conclusions. Trust me. I’m a boots on the ground searcher.

      • Phillip…
        and what is the solution to WWWH, that first clue exactly?
        Since he made it quite clear…

  38. And, incidently, is there a way to subscribe to this blog by email? All I see is the various facebook, feeds, etc, and the WP subscribe option. I’m on a slow dialup and I’d love your blog better if I could get email notices when you post, as opposed to trying to discover it by more roundabout methods. Such as looking for hints of new posts in my most recent interpretations of the poem.

    • Old Jules-
      I placed a button near the top on the right sidebar for subscribing..It’s labeled “follow blog via email”.

  39. Hey Dal ..taking your advise…..Im only 2 weeks old in the chase……..but I find that “put in below” sounds and looks like “pueblo” and capital “B” in Brown may then apply to “Pueblo”….lol….is that Mr.Fenns type of humor? It would also make the clues timeless,tracing cities in history is not that hard… Would he do things like that just based on the sound of the word?

  40. HI, has anyone brought up Arthur Brown? He was a painter and did an old painting of the Old Faithful area, which is downstream from Gardiner Mt, where just into the park you can swim in the river (used to be nude) where hot springs flow… after shooting down the “trout” idea, I found Arthur Brown on (i think) antiques road show. The area of Old Faithful is ringed by trees. And in 1988 Yellowstone had a terrible fire, (blaze) I haven’t looked yet what that fires’ circumference was but that may be an idea.

  41. Would anyone be able to email a picture/copy of each page in the book that has a postmark on it?
    Thanks, Ray

    • Ray-
      That would be a large number of pages and also inappropriate since Forrest’s book is copyrighted and copying copyrighted material is frowned upon in this country.

  42. Wow, I’ve really enjoyed reading through all of these comments and ideas! I have a few ideas of my own I’ll share. As far as the whole ending where we started thing goes, isn’t there a road in Yellowstone that is some kind of loop? I haven’t gotten my book yet so I haven’t seen the picture of the bird and crescent moon… But since the moon indicates night, is it possible that the “bird” is actually a bat? That would certainly lend credence to the whole cave theory. As far as FF knowing that the chest is still there, I wonder if it’s not a counter weight in some kind of Indiana Jones-esque contraption. Maybe when the chest is moved, it causes a very visible reaction to occur sort of like if a flag was suddenly raised or something. I doubt it would be a flag, but I used that simply to get what I meant across… Also, has anyone found any kind of connection between LBJ and a giant chair monument in one of the Carolinas? One more thing…what if “Begin it where warm waters halt” simply means the letter S? (the final letter in the phrase) Then you would PUT IN the letters from “below the home of Brown”? I’m thinking along the lines of poetry codes here. The poem is just too,,,imperfect in proportion to the time and thought FF said he put into it! All those capital letters… Forrest also said, I believe, that the person who finds the treasure will have studied and read and re-read the poem and THOUGHT. He said basically, if I interpreted what he said accurately, that once solved, there would be no ambiguity, and the finder would go confidently to the chest. I believe there is coded information in this poem much like they did it in the Big Wars. That is where my efforts will be concentrated. At first, I was all gung-ho to hit the road and check out 8 or 9 “likely” sights. But then I realized that all of those areas had been searched, searched, and RE-searched by hundreds of people. That tells me that the obvious areas are decoys. Not to sound too cock-sure here, but I was born for this! I am going to find it. I will return the Man’s bracelet and quietly disappear… I have literally had dreams of this happening all of my life. I ALSO have a chest. I’ve been filling it with trinkets, shiny things, and small collectables with the plan to bury it under a glacial stone on my mother’s land up here in Northern Wisconsin. I was going to create a cryptic map and leave it for my nieces and nephews when I die…the nature of my items are such that they will increase greatly in value as time goes on. I have planned this and worked on it for 20 years or so (I’m 43) and all of my friends and family are aware of my “Box” and my plan for it. The kids always want me to get it out so we can go through it. We often trade stuff and the box is always growing. So about a month ago when I discovered this kick-ass man and his awesome gift, I was amazed, So were my friends and family. Perhaps Forrest and I are kindred on some level…I want to move to Santa Fe ASAP but I need a job! How ’bout it FF? Do you need an assistant or butler? A driver maybe? Seriously, let me know. Again I love this blog! You guys are great! I’m sorry for going on and on so long but I’m loopy on the bean! ; ) (that’s coffee to you). Peace and prosperity!!!

    • Argus, you said,,,”Also, has anyone found any kind of connection between LBJ and a giant chair monument in one of the Carolinas?” can you please elaborate on this? did you find it in an acronym? I wonder due to there also being a ‘big chair’ here in NM also. 🙂

  43. HAHAHAHA …..It seems like this was a pretty lively thread, until I posted! Am I missing something here?

  44. I will jump in…
    Argus, good on ya for leaving a chest, that is a great idea and I am sure your nieces and nephews will be pretty psyched to find it one day. If I owned anything more valuable than an unopened six-pack of beer than I might do the same. Until then I hunt for the trove. I agree with much of your thinking. There are certainly places that I feel are decoy areas. If it is like he says, and that there are only “hints” in the book, then mentioning specific places, especially in YNP, are just too obivious. That being said, FF is like that and once you think a place is too obvious, there is the chest.

    I also agree in that you need to study the poem. To me it is a riddle, with roundabout sorta references to some of his favorite authors, friends, places, historical sites, etc. Just have to figure out which ones. I have come across some things in reading of certain authors that is just too coincidental to be accidental, but I can’t put the two together…yet. I am still arguing the thought that when he said rocky mountains, it could be a pile of rocks, or some mountainous regions that are rocky. And north to me is also 1 degree above Santa Fe. Maybe I am just keeping my search are too big. It seems like too many people are coming up with the same ideas, and going to the same places, and coming back empty handed. There are endless possibilities, and endless ways you can stretch to make you “spot” fit. There is no way in my opinion that FF would say “move with confidence” if you are only left to search out canyons and rivers, running all over 2000 miles of mountain range. I have a couple ideas of WWWH and it is not just one place, it is a “thing” that can happen in several different places, (sorry, too reluctant to divulge) so I will continue running around. It’s nice out there though!! Enjoy…

    • I appreciate the reply and wise input hank. I think I know to what you are referring vis a vis WWWH. If I am correct, it’s something very large and very slow? Man! I just can’t wait to dig into my treasure!!! Everyone’s going to DESPISE me in two to three weeks when i appear on the news holding a placer nugget the size of my fist! I have recently located a sight that matches all of the clues really well, but also boasts an un-named water fall that supposedly has a cave behind it, and the general area it is in is a name that I pulled out of the title of the poem using anagrams! (with no extra letters) But I’ve said too much. Hopefully it will pan out though. Hey, go to YouTube and check this out; Then tell me. Is that not an intriguing sight for this treasure? Pretty cool even if its not though. Okay. Hittin the rack. G’night. peace and Prosperity

      • Argus33, confidence can sometimes be a good thing, but
        you should expect skepticism from us unless you provide
        more evidence that your solve is a good one.

        As far as “decoys”, I don’t think Forrest would try to send
        anybody on a wild goose chase. But he probably does
        know that folks are likely to go traipsing off into the
        mountains — which is what he wants them to do — based
        on some pretty flimsy beliefs about the poem’s correct

        Good for Forrest! This hunt is about 6 years old now,
        and I think he has succeeded beyond his expectations,
        regarding motivating people to get away from their
        computers and couches, and go hiking!

        Good luck to you. Please be safe while searching, and
        also at all other times. I suggest you think “out of the box” compared to other people . . . ya know, the ones that have already searched the “popular” search areas.

        My thinking is frequently “out of the box”. I applied this
        method in my solve, and I believe it helped. Only time
        will tell, of course. I will report regarding my search experience shortly after I return from my next physical search (I have spent so long searching online that I think I am quite ready to “move confidently” right to the
        correct location); that is expected to be in early September of this year.

        The above is just my opinion. Yours may differ.

  45. I really can’t speak to the hygiene part, but I do know that some chili is mighty toxic 😉 Be careful of eating chili then looking for treasure. the chili might lead other seekers right to you! :-O

  46. Kym- A big chair in NM??? Please send me whatever info you have on that and I will then PM why I think it could be important.

    • Argus, you can reach me @ chosendiadem at, also it is on the way to one of the beautiful New Mexico waterfalls. It reminds me of the Lincoln Memorial and if it is there, I believe that it is right on the edge of the aspen grove there. 🙂 I haven’t checked it yet, planned on it but haven’t gotten there, so if anyone truly doe find anything by any directions that I give ,I just ask that you #1 GIVE, not sell, Forest his bracelet back and bless me with a decent sized finders fee, because I need to get out of debt faser than I’m doing it! 🙂 lol love ya’ll, Kym

  47. Hey Kym. No. That link just sent me to some MSN website. Do you have an email address? I am on FB as Andrew Miller Webster. Hit me up there so we can take this private. You show me where that is, and I’ll explain to you why I think it could be important.

  48. Check this out ya’all;

    “Now, what if I wanted to secret a can of Dr. Pepper under a rock in the cooling waters of a rivulet somewhere in my allotted public acreage?”–Forrest Fenn

    “We just had to forego a few luxuries like Dr. Peppers and downtown movies”–Forrest Fenn

    Take the link to the commercial and give it a quick look. Interesting choice of words at the very end…
    What do you think?

    • Argus33, one would have to secret approximately 10 cans of Dr. Pepper 10 to achieve the truly bold 97 calories that FF speaks of. 🙂 Does seem as though he may have enjoyed the commercial. Either that, or the Dr. Pepper people in Plano, Texas are listening to him!

      • Argus33, I like the energy you have for this, it echos much of what I’ve been thinking. Good luck with designing you’re own treasure hunt. We’ll be looking for it.

  49. The Pet Holocaust–By Argus33

    Evil did I dwell; lewd I did live.
    So many dynamos!
    Reviled did I live, said I, as evil I did deliver
    Step on no pets.
    Are we not drawn onward, we few, drawn onward to new era?
    Rise to vote, sir!
    Dammit, I’m mad!
    Senile felines!
    Was it a car or a cat I saw?
    Stack cats!
    Meet animals; laminate ’em.
    Doc, note I dissent: a fast never prevents a fatness. I diet on cod.
    Drab as a fool, aloof as a bard.
    Never odd or even.
    Won’t lovers revolt now?
    Draw, O coward!
    Ten animals I slam in a net.
    Go hang a salami; I’m a lasagna hog.
    Lived on Decaf; faced no Devil.
    Lonely Tylenol.
    Live not on evil.
    Ma is as selfless as I am

    Poems are often filled with encoded information. I wish I could solve the code I’m sure is in The Thrill of the Chase! ( By the way, the above poem I put together,….every line except the title is the same backwards as forwards. Palindrome!)

  50. Hello guys and ladies I also been researching for the treasure but don have the book I am only asking for a small favor can anyone please send me a good quality picture of page 133 of the map to my email.


  51. Ok folks! Most of you are really in the game! One thing to remember, when Forrest says something, it may mean just that! Don’t think too hard on it. Don’t make something it is not. Sometimes things are hidden in plain sight and that is why you miss it! Everyone thinks Forrest speaks in riddles when he says it like it is. No lies. Just not the whole explaination! Everyone seems to be missing the “blaze” clue. Study Forrest some more and the clues to that part will match perfectly. Dal, you provided some of those clues, and don’ t even know it! We shall see this May when we hit the trail of the Chase! Remember me. Then you can say, “She tried to tell us!”. Be safe, and only take a flashlight and sammy if you plan on staying out late…quoted Forrest!

  52. Dal, Has FF confirmed or denied that that the treasure is still there hidden? It seems possible that it could have been found and that we are still looking for it. When was the last time that it had been confirmed that it was still hidden? Has FF checked its location or is there a gps device imbedded I the treasure box. just wondering? Keith

    • Keith-
      Forrest last confirmed that it was still there right around the New Year. No one knows how Forrest knows. Lots of speculation from lots of corners but nobody knows.Forrest will let us know when it’s found. Keep on looking is my opinion..

      • I’d like to thank Forrest, personally, for caring so much (and you, too, Dal). I’d like to thank him for caring about people and the thrill of life with it’s many mysteries and twists and turns and for inviting us all to discover those twists and turns for ourselves…and to discover ourselves in the process. I’d like to thank him for being so generous with his time and talents and resources to create such an amazing adventure. It’s like Treasure Island…except for REAL!…full of love and hate, happiness and sadness, life and death, the Thrill! …and the distance Too Far To Walk. I’d like to thank him and all those people working countless hours to construct such an amazing monument which history will record to stand the test of time.

        To whomever finds the treasure, I ask where is the glory in anything gained without sacrifice? I say there is none. Everything that “improves” us is gained either through our own sacrifice or through the sacrifice of another. When our lives are improved through another we are thereby indebted to that person (or Person). At the very least we owe a tremendous debt of gratitude…and hope that they will forgive us our debts as we forgive our debtors.

        As of this moment I have not found a bronze chest full of golden treasures…but I have gained a new perspective and a new love and appreciation for the treasures that have always surrounded me…if only I will open my eyes to see.

        Thank you, Forrest.

        (I hope to meet you some day.)

    • I’m still amazed the GPS idea is still being floated around.

      No GPS, no device, nothing like that was ever added in Forrest’s inventory of the chest. What benefit or advantage would anyone have if Forrest said there is a GPS device in the chest?

      There’s really only two solutions in why Forrest doesn’t mention why he knows:

      1) The chase is a hoax and the only way to keep it alive is to say it’s still out there but you can’t tell how you know that

      2) Telling us how he knows would be a big clue.
      Ex: And I think this is very likely: the chest can be seen from the road. Possible a common route between Santa Fe and Taos. It doesn’t matter if people are following Forrest, only he knows when to take a little glance over. Only he knows exactly where to look.

      Those who have been hiking deep into the woods or along trail or way off. Remember its not far, but too far to walk. Has anyone thought this means you don’t have to do much walking at all.

      • I always thought there could be another option – a motion detector trail camera with solar powered cell connection that could send him a picture of someone recovering the chest. Then he could hide it anywhere – Well, it’s a thought! 🙂

      • The Low Road between Espanola and Taos is heavily traveled and in most places it is a twisting two lane road that at times can test even experienced persons driving skills (as lots of Texans have found out about Winter ice the hard way). I agree that he would want to be able to access the location again, and probably has. Dunno if travels to Taos are part of his current agenda. Read my post below. Yes.. It is very doubtful that packing in with Mules or Helicopters was the method. He drove close enough to hike in the reasonable distance to place the chest in it’s hiding place. It is not a hoax. He is a man of integrity and such a flagrant act against his upbringing would unreasonable. Wealthy persons don’t need to play that game. He wants this found and he would prefer it was prior to his passing on. That is why the clock is ticking, the chase narrows. What was Forrests’ favorite painting done by his closest friend Eric Sloane?

      • What people seem to be forgetting, is that he said …this is a very private/personal spot, near and dear to his heart. It’s a spot he thought deeply about, that meant a lot to him. A place where something special may have happened, or something that changed his life. Not laying by the road. Not in the middle of a highly populated area. A place a man would go and look into his heart and contemplate his life. A place that symbolizes his life. A place that won’t change for years. It will be the definition that shaped his life. It will be his soul’s final resting place, so, yeah, it’s going to be a fantastic place for him to go home to.

  53. I had a couple of hours to kill yesterday so I sifted back through some of the past threads… Boy, there sure is a lot of info and comments on this blog! I went back through the interviews and listened to the ones I couldn’t remember. Watching Forrest talk about the stuff that makes him tick is a hoot. I especially like the San Lazaro 03 interview where he schools us on the difference between a European dog skull and an indigenous one. For some reason I found it humorous listening to him talk about the soup bones rattling around in the cookware and how the lack of protein in them keeps them from decaying…All really cool stuff ! There is so much info gathered here and I am grateful for it….

  54. I cannot believe that everyone thinks 42 pounds is a lot of weight. Try laying 250-300, 62 pound concrete blocks 8 hours a day 5-6 days a week. Then you will laugh at 42 pounds!!!

      • I’m 57, packed in approximately 45 lbs and at near 7000 foot elevation it took quite an effort…and I am acclimated to Northern New Mexico because I live here. I got a hand full of cactus needles too today. Ouch! That’s always a nice part of the location too. We have critters here that can put a man down in no time too. Gotta be very mindful of where you are at here. This year we have had a good crop of rattlers too. Respect New Mexico or pay the price!!

  55. I agree about the conditions to deal with being important that Forrest had when placing the chest. I had some ideas pop into my head during our hike in today to the possible location we’ve determined. Steph.. did (does) Forrest own a 4wd Jeep or Subaru AWD at the time (maybe a Forester)? Why is this important? Because there are Forest (Forrest) Service roads that are well suited to such (into the woods) ; but would be an absolute disaster with only a hiway use car on those roads. So the distance from the hiways to the “not too far” walk would be better determined by the vehicle available. See? It matters. I live in Taos County by the way, on a Forest Service Road, I’ve never seen anyone try to drive a Buick sedan or such on our road. The transmission would be laying behind that car if attempted in short order. Not for the meek. I drive the Rio Grande quite often. Yes.. I also agree that between Santa Fe and Taos (the low road, not the high road) would be an easier drive, even in his condition at the time (fighting Cancer is not an easy thing on the body for anyone at any get tired easily and then weak! The drive is 70 miles one way and gets slow and tiresome at Espanola and points North). How far is reasonable to walk in to the hiding place with around 45 lbs in a backpack, or lets say two trips at 22 lbs? 800 Meters? What if there is a small (50 yards) easy incline down to the creek where no paddle would help anyway? Doable?

  56. Dal,

    Why doesn’t Forrest list the clue “below 10200 ft” on his official website if, in fact, he quoted it in the True West magazine interview in December 2013? He has indicated that searchers should only believe the poem or anything he has written in the book. And I am assuming his official website. In otherwords, can this clue really be trusted as fact as you say on your site? Thank-you in advance for your response.

    • jon-
      Only if you believe what Forrest tells us. If you think he’s trying to trick you than you shouldn’t believe what he says.

    • First , it’s a hint not a clue IMO. The only clues are the 9. And since ff links Dal’s website from FF’s oldsantafetradingco website, it technically IS on his site, one click away.
      Second, you can hear/watch for yourself when he says “its not on top of any mountain ” — look up his oct 2013 bookstore appearance. Toby made a video, I think.

  57. you are right, it is a hint…a hint that has never been official for me. not because it helps my solve but because it is not in his book or poem AND he seemed impelled to give an answer, any answer, secondary to the interviewer asking for a hint/clue when he was not planning to give one. This was MY impression of that one isolated paragraph in True west 12/13. Everybody wants a hint everybody wants a clue, gimmie gimmie gimmie. How irritating it must be for him at times. Certainly, given the number of times people have asked him for a clue or hint, some responses would be questionable. We would have twice as many clues at our disposal otherwise.

    also–Mapsmith, there is more to that mountain top quote as you may be aware

    • RC
      I believe it was in a Nov or Dec, 2013 issue of True West Magazine. It was part of an interview between Bob Boze Bell and Forrest. Bob said Forrest made that statement in his column. Later a searcher asked Forrest if he had actually made that statement and he said yes. Since then Forrest has said that to a number of folks in various media stories.

  58. I dont’ know if anyone else has commented on this, but I count 3 lines with less than 8 syllables, not one. Sorry if this has been explained somewhere else and I missed it.
    Second line has 6.
    Third line has 7.
    Seventh has 7.

  59. “Tear in the bottom of the page of fishing photos in the book – Some searchers believe the tear (page 122-123) was placed there purposely by Forrest and is therefore meaningful. Forrest has not commented on that tear. I don’t know what to make of the tear but honestly, is every little oddity in the book to be considered a clue? Still a mystery.”

    I don’t think it’s a mystery anymore.
    The same exact tear is also in TFTW pg 94.
    It appears to be a generic background picture in which the graphic designer chose to place pictures on top of.

    I know it is exact, because you can also see some of the same discoloring & stains.


    • That is interesting Jake……But do you realize you are talking to yourself; asking a question then answering it. 🙂

      Then again, that may be fairly normal around here; I have long discussions with my dogs about the solutions they come up with.

      • Winter has arrived in Northern New Mexico. Not below zero yet but getting close at nighttime. The roads are muddy during the day so we leave early to shop in town and purposely delay going back to the homestead until the mud freezes again. The cycles of life here revolve around nature. It is one of the changes required but it really is not only needs to accept we are not masters of our environment.
        It could be the torn pages are hints of importance, in both books. It does no harm to consider. We already know that several clues are included in the book(s) in addition to the poem. One day the person that locates the chest and returns the bracelet to Mr. Fenn will see those clearly. I hope with all my heart that Forrest gets that bracelet back in his possession before his time to “go west” as we who are pilots say, has arrived.
        There is something I might mention as a long time resident in this location. The waters in Winter are usually much lower and calmer therefore clearer than any other time of year. To be successful at fishing in Winters means having an awareness so the trout do not see you or your shadow. Sneeking up on the river so to speak.. The water at other times is usually clouded and turbulent. Difficult or impossible to see through.
        Lets presume the treasure box is in water, which makes sense being made of brass. I mention this about being in the water not only because of the poem clues, but also that Mr Fenn knows as an avid fisherman that such locations are special here. There are only a few water sources that are accessible from hard surface roads. The first in mind is the Rio Grande, next the Rio Chama, Rio Caliente, Rio Pueblo. It is possible a public access lake might be the location.
        A person must be brave to reach into the waters in Winter here. It’s understood anyone will “quickly remove” whatever is in the water, feet or hands for sure! Below the house of Brown is the starting point. Where near water is such a named place within a reasonable driving distance from Santa Fe..North of the capitol city? From Santa Fe to Taos usually takes about 1 1/2 hours if the traffic in Espanola is light. Marrón is the Spanish word for Brown. In his condition at the time Mr. Fenn would have probably not felt like driving more than a two hour one way journey. Anyone scanned the area maps using locations for Brown or Marrón? How about Sectional Maps such as Mr Fenn or myself might be obligated to use when say… scattering ashes of a friend from our aircraft? Having Cancer does not in any way prevent a pilot from legally flying if he or she still holds a legal medical.

          • Lets presume one trip to lug 40 kilos total into a backwoods area. He was tired..then weak as the poem goes. About 2 hours drive…then packing in the box + item weight (without being noticed)..probably 20 kilos first…then the remaining items..another 20 kilos packed in from the road access..the another 2 hours drive back to Santa Fe. It matters when he did this also because for quite a while the route was much slower..we couldn’t drive 65 mph North through the Pueblo’s as we can now. I’m not that age and it’s a task and a days drive to and from the Capitol city. Makes me tired just thinking about lugging in the items to the hiding spot! Cancer and the treatments take a lot out of a persons energy. I imagine he’s not been back to the spot since. My point is Colorado and points North are in my thoughts less likely than here in Northern New Mexico.

          • Good point DG,
            “It was 15 years from the time that I got cancer (1988) until the time that I hid the TC, 15 years”
            “That’s why I told people I buried the treasure, that I hid the treasure when I was either 79 or 80 years old because I don’t want the exact date to be known because I’m afraid somebody will go check the rental car records & mileage”
            So was it 2003 or 2009 or 2010? Either way it was at least 15 years from when he was diagnosed & when he hid the treasure from what he is saying.

            Anyway Vern, I don’t think he hid the treasure in NM. The torn pages could be a hint, but I don’t think so. Good luck in your search & stay safe.
            Why would you need an airplane to get the treasure in NM when you could drive?
            Collected Works Bookstore interview someone in the crowd asked Fenn: would you take a partner along & he answered: Do you have an airplane?
            That interview was in Santa Fe I believe……….

          • Forrest flew and scattered the ashes of his friend who had died from Cancer over Taos (Pueblo) mountain. That indicates to me he was still an active pilot at the time the treasure was hidden. The fact is that on aviation navigation charts are names of intersections used in instrument flying (sometimes VFR also), which would be known. “Under the house of Brown” in the poem. Just a of those intersections of airways could easily be named brown or the spanish word marron. The names of these intersections usually have no association to anything on the ground, but they are GPS coordinated.
            It is true I could drive rather than fly to the location. And yes..I have an aircraft I can fly from my property. Its not the same construction as Forrest owned in the book photo however.
            Perhaps you are correct about being farther than NM.. why would Forrest be concerned about discovery of rental car records? In NM the distance is not so great even to the Colorado border, he’d drive his own vehicle. If a longer distance, say, 200 miles or more..the better to fly to the local airport (North of NM) near the final hiding spot, transfer the TC to a rental, and hide it in the predetermined location. One of the advantages of private ownership of an aircraft is privacy in travel. It’s possible to do this and never speak to another person. Me thinks it’s time to peruse the charts..

          • Unless Forrest surrendered his airmans certificate to the is valid until death. What “expires” at this time to maintain a Private pilot or higher certification (and that ruling is now in the Senate being made much less strict) is the Medical. For a Private pilot rating that means a “Class 3” which pretty much means if you can fog a mirror you’ll pass. A class 3 medical is valid for 4 years at a time. All US rated Private Pilots or higher also must have at a minimum what is known as a “bi-annual flight review” performed by a Certified Instructor. With Forrests background flying missions in high performance fighter aircraft the bi-annual exams would about like any person passing a test to see if we can ride a bicycle. Renting an aircraft would not be a problem because of the mentioned bi-annual flight review being done at the same business at the local, most often, municipal airport. At the Santa Fe airport is an FBO (Fixed Base Operation) that offers rental aircraft as well as having CFI’s on staff for the noted review.
            Trust me.. a piece of cake for a man with the aviator skills that Forrest still has. The bi annual flight review being “negative” by the way does NOT “ground” a is only for the purpose of the pilot being assured of being competent and so that insurance coverage is met. The F.A.A. can also perform a “ramp check” and if the bi-annual is not noted as “passed” there could be a fine. It’s not a usual event however. Performing a bi-annual also allows rental and of course the required insurance coverage for a rental aircraft. Forrest, or any other pilot for that matter, can easily opt for what is known as an LSA aircraft. This means NO medical or such required. Only a drivers license and that Forrest declares he is able and competent to fly and the aircraft itself has certain performance limits. Because he already has Turbine, Multi Engine, Instrument certifications there is no exam required by the F.A.A. All of this is what Forrest could have done…not that is what he did. Those charts still might have the clue. For me it does open the possibility that New Mexico isn’t a sure deal where the TC is.

          • Vern – I know my reply to you is VERY late,…but,…thank you for this complete explanation.

            You wrote:

            “Unless Forrest surrendered his airmans certificate to the is valid until death. What “expires” at this time to maintain a Private pilot or higher certification (and that ruling is now in the Senate being made much less strict) is the Medical.”

            Ergo,…I still think my cartouche-like hillside blaze reads:


            Airforce Airman Forrest Fenn for-Ever

            Thank you! 🙂

          • Vern – And here is the clue on the VFR chart for West Yellowstone Airport I found:

            There is an ‘E’ which is the last letter in ‘Madison Range’ over my spot,…where my hillside blaze resides (which also ends in E),…and can be seen from a Piper plane (or a rented one):


            I think the extra ‘E’ is a tribute to the memory of Eric Sloane,…who had a extra ‘e’ at the end of his name. And the “for-Ever” translation I used for that ‘E’ in my blaze,…is because Erics’s real name was Everard:

            “The end is ever drawing nigh.”

            As ff made a counter clockwise circle in his plane to land at West Yellowstone,…that for-Ever ‘E’ would be farthest to the left of the cartouche-like “drawing”. And “nigh” means the left side (of a horse).

          • Vern – My post above was in relation to this that you wrote:

            “The fact is that on aviation navigation charts are names of intersections used in instrument flying (sometimes VFR also), which would be known. “Under the house of Brown” in the poem. Just a of those intersections of airways could easily be named brown or the spanish word marron. The names of these intersections usually have no association to anything on the ground, but they are GPS coordinated.”

            Since YNP is a KNOWN “home of Brown” bears,…my guess is that “intersection of airways” you mentioned might refer to that distinction.

      • Yes Goofy, I do realize I’m talking to myself. I don’t have a choice, I have lived alone for at least 7 years now. Keep in mind I have several people in my mind which I converse with all the time, sometimes out loud. They think your OK, but you should stop licking yourself!
        BTW, my pets have told me where the treasure is located & you know they are smarter than humans.

  60. The search has exposed many of my psychological fault lines and flaws as a person and that is my own fault. At first it was good for me and gave me motivation to go out and explore on my own and I learned a whole lot about history, art, and all kinds of things. I visited almost every place in the search area mentioned in the books, smiling with the happy stories and crying at the sad ones. Unfortunately I became obsessed with it and I began to grow frustrated and started losing myself, partially from reading the poem too many times. When I was a kid I would play monopoly with my siblings. It would be fun at first but by the end the person with all the property would end up being pushing everyone else around and then the game wouldn’t be fun anymore. I started feeling the same with the chase…I started feeling bullied and poked and started doubting everything and said things I shouldn’t have. I got frustrated and scared. The olive jar in the box and the story that mentioned it and some other things that happened made me think that Forrest was trying to say that he was a bully and I got upset and thought I was trying to stand up to the bully for myself and I thought I was defending others as well. I was bullied as a child, as we all were I’m sure and the only thing that made it stop was fighting back. Unfortunately things got worse when I tried that and I fell into a deep depression…I’ve lost sight of what’s important and lost myself. I now realize that I was and am a bully in many ways and bullied Forrest and possibly mislead others and for that I’m very sorry. I will probably never know his true intentions with the chase but I now know what parts I want to focus on and that is being a nicer, better person. I live with chronic pain and it adds to me being a prickly person but that is no excuse. I think I mis-interpreted things and I don’t deserve to find it and have quit looking for the most part, though it pops back up in my mind at times, but I hope others continue if it makes them happy. I lost the key to happiness and am working to find it again. I’m going to focus on improving myself now and being nicer to other people in every way possible. I’m just beginning and I know it’s going to take time. I hope anyone that I have upset or offended can forgive me but if they can’t I understand. Over-thinking leads to unhappiness and that was my downfall.

    I think Forrest is an honest, open book and is just trying to be nice to a stranger and get people to go outside more.

    I have shared what I think is the starting point before, grand prismatic spring, and now I’m going to share what I think is the ending place to be nice to a stranger. I think it is at his favorite camp site and fishing spot on the madison at baker’s hole campground near west yellowstone…right on the border of yellowstone national park, either buried in the camp fire or in the sand and rocks in the river. Why? I think this is about him being Indiana Jones and where he first started looking for artifacts, a clue from the beginning of the too far to walk book and his secrets of san lazaro pueblo book.

    • I don’t think the ole coot gonna go throw his dieing body on a camp fire spot rem he wanted his bones left there Your story sounds like a lot of peoples A lot get so into it they lose sight of haveing fun and relaxing and they spend to much money looking and get more stressed out . Never spend what ya don’t have and never put the hunt before important things 🙂 I believe the treasure is out there he just made sure we was gonna have to work for it 🙂 to find it 🙂

        • Plus he said it ain’t near a human trail so that cuts out bakers hole campground 🙂

      • Diggin gypsy, if you think the phrase “the ole coot” shows
        as much respect for Mr. Fenn as he deserves, I’m afraid
        I don’t agree with your assessment / attitude / choice
        of words. It’s great to be young. I hope you live to be
        as old as Mr. Fenn now is, and I hope you do it in good
        health and happiness.

        Now, I’ll be the first to admit that for me, this chase is
        important for financial reasons instead of other, “more
        wholesome” ones (such as exercise, enjoying nature’s
        beauty, becoming a kinder, gentler person, taking care
        of the environment, etc.). But I have a lot of respect for
        the gentleman.

        Good luck in your search. Please don’t tarry too long, because I am “hot on the trail”, with a very high degree of confidence in my solve, having tested it for a long time, looking for flaws and weaknesses. So far, I haven’t found any. By early September, I should have returned from my next boots-on-the-ground search. I will report on my experience.

        The above is just my opinion. Yours may differ.

        Please stay safe, and don’t be angry. If someone else
        finds the TC before I do, I won’t hold it against them.

        • Hahah andrew you don’t know the ole coot as I do he is a ole coot and always will be to me since the day I met him. Forrest fenn is no greater than anyone else except that he has a lot of money And that’s all .

    • Pete – Thank you for sharing your thoughts and feelings about The Chase. I think the experience has been a crucible for many,…including me. And I am much stronger now.

      I also explored the “If you’ve been wise and found the blaze” aspect of The Poem,…when I stayed at Campfire Lodge (where they have LOTS of those),…where I found one of those long squared off logs (that they used to reduce creek flows but came originally from part of the Hebgen Dam). It created a wind break for a fire pit on a sand bar at the confluence of MY creek and the Madison River (just across MY creek from the camp’s boundary). I didn’t have a shovel,…but I moved some of the sand around. It was just downstream “below” my Wise Owl Blaze.

      Much later,…I discounted that location,…because fly fisherman walk a fishing trail nearby (when ff made his comment about “close proximity”). Plus,…people across the creek would have easily seen his remains,…had he chosen that location for his final resting place.

      • Pete – The reason I kept saying “My creek” in that post,…is that Montana stream laws dictate that the sand bar I described is in the public domain,…so the bronze chest would belong to ME,…had I found it at that fire pit.

    • Pete, I am not one to use the blogs very much. However, the fact that you use the word “forgive” and even care about -forgiveness- says a lot. Pick up your copy of the book …the Good Book (Bible)…and as you read, study and learn to pray – just leave all that other baggage behind you. Be strong and learn to live in everlasting peace. (Please don’t expect more of a reply than that out of me.)

    • Pete, thank you for sharing. I don’t think that it was Forrest’s
      intention that anyone get too obsessed with this treasure hunt,
      not to mention physical danger and even death!

      Good luck to you. I think the hidey place of the treasure is at a
      pretty magnificent specific location. Many, many people who are kind of familiar with the “local area” may not know that this specific location even exists (not to mention its magnificence!)
      for several reasons: 1) It’s not “in close proximaty” to a human trail of any kind; 2) The magnificence can only be seen when one is right there (not hundreds of feet away).

      By the way, I think there’s a pretty important hint that Forrest
      keeps repeating that he has the mind of a 13-year-old (not his
      exact words). it helps us to understand the person that he is,
      and many folks on this blog (including me) believe that there is
      some importance to this, related to solving the poem. Not only
      is it important (to a correct solve) to think like a child, but in my
      opinion, the year Forrest was born plays into the solve, give or
      take a few years. It relates to what was happening when he was
      young. Not on a world scale (i.e., Hitler coming to power), but
      more about American culture. This will be explained by me

      I don’t think Forrest would throw himself, with his last dying breath, onto a campfire spot, unless it was at the special,
      magnificent location. And there are several reasons for it
      to be special and magnificent location, in my opinion. I am
      reluctant to give too much information right now, but the names
      of things did help me greatly in my solve . . . and I intend to have
      boots-on-the-ground to test my solve, in less than 3 weeks.

      The above is just my opinion. Yours may differ.

      Good luck to all searchers. Please be safe.

  61. Andrew,
    I hope you don’t mind if I jump in here. And DG is a big girl who can talk for herself… I don’t want you to think I’m playing prince charming and saving the damsel in distress idea.

    I don’t take DG term to be a put down or disrespectful, but more a term of endearment.
    It really depends on one’s personality and location and demeanor to get the gist.
    Example ~ the word coon can be highly offensive in some areas, while in other location, it is something altogether different.
    Web site;

    See “Coon”.
    A raccoon. Also a friendly name early mountain men called each other.

    Not all words/terms mean what we think they mean. Call it slang, call it urban definitions, call it mountain man vocabulary…call it what you will.

    My point to interrupting was, to point out how easy we can misconstrued words… not unlike the challenge before us… to decipher the poem.

    • Well said seeker!

      Andrew Jef, Diggin has a different relationship with Forrest than most other searchers and has earned the right to call him an ole coot. Thats my take on it.

  62. It’s very entertaining to go back and read stuff written in 2013. A few of the people sound like they may have wound up in mental hospitals. Maybe not. Or maybe they were already in them when they were writing. Who knows? It is amazing to see how many have joined the search and then left—-or at least they no longer blog.

    I find this to be quite a lot of fun though. Good luck in your searching.

    • Yes, Joe Sparrow, I agree with you that this thread makes for interesting reading. It provides some useful perspective for newer searchers like myself. And it’s amazing to me that so many of the posters from 2013 no longer seem to be posting. Have they given up on finding the chest, I wonder?

      Would be kinda nice to view some other old threads, for additional “historical” perspective.

      Ken (in Texas)

  63. Dal, I have been curious about something for several years now, so I decided to ask you about it.

    Above, you wrote: “Further, Forrest originally wrote the poem in 1987 …..”.

    Was “1987” a typo?? Or has Forrest mentioned to you that the first draft was possibly written prior to his getting cancer and conceiving the idea of the Chase??

    Thanks again for hosting and answering all the questions!

    (if you have previously answered this question and I missed it, I do apologize for the repeat)

    • Loco,
      There is an auto interview with fen and Granddaughter present, that mentioned 1982… I dismissed it as a simple slip on fenn’s part because the interviewer mentioned 1982 as the onset of cancer or the thought of the chase challenge.
      But like you it did stick in my head. I also recall recently another searcher posting parts of that interview that Halo posted a while back with 1982 and a question mark next to it.
      You may recall the interview… fenn’s GD said she would like to have the bracelet handed down to her. [ going by memory, the hearing is not what it use to be, but i’m still good lookin, so take this with as paraphrasing ].

      • Seeker, I believe the interview of which you speak is:

        Interviewer: You bought the chest around that period (1982)?………. Forrest: “Yeah.”

        That could well have been a slip-of-tongue or not hearing clearly. At any rate, the question was about the chest.

        I am just curious as to what Fenn may have said about the Poem, some 3 years, or longer, in the past.

        • The reason I mentioned the date as to your inquiry to the 1987 date.. I thought fenn bought the chest specifically for the chase. Just a curiosity on my part.
          I have as question that has been difficult for me to find… so rumors abound is a good place to ask… do you recall a comment about the double omegas will not assist in finding the chest?
          I seem to have remembered it and simply let it go, not unlike wwwh is not a dam. So I never kept it or remember when it was said.

          • Same type of wording Frank. But two different topic…not unlike Latin, codes Bible drones etc. Comment stated… will not assist in finding the chest.

            But yes it was stated about the lettering on the chest

          • Seeker,

            I don’t remember it. I checked what I have when you mentioned it back in August. Also spent awhile looking foe something that might relate to it…..nada.

            Maybe JCM has something. Or Jake, he said he has transcribed/saved a lot of stuff.

            🙂 I just hope Dal sees my post so maybe I can clear out that corner.

          • Seeker-
            I checked the blog for the word “omega” and came up with about 10 posts where that word appears but none of them are inside a statement like that from Forrest…nor anyone quoting Forrest…
            I can’t remember such a quote…
            If that quote exists it is not on this blog…

          • Ok thanks… I mentioned it back in Aug.? Wow. My mind is slipping more and more these days… well, thanks for checking anyway Tom.

          • Dal,
            It’s more than likely that I have heard or or read so many after the fact comments, trying to line them up, make sense of them, use them as helpful tools etc. I may have cobwebbed the thought on the omega dilemma… I can’t find it either. lol. With loco’s hound-dog instincts, and others chiming in… I’ll call this one dead in the water.
            Thanks for checking though.

    • LOL!!


      Would you ask Dal my question above. The one that started all of this? It seems to have gotten lost in the mix? 🙂


      • You mean the one;
        Dal ~”Above, you wrote: “Further, Forrest originally wrote the poem in 1987 …..”.
        Was “1987” a typo?? Or has Forrest mentioned to you…”

        Ok, considered it asked. I to was wondering the same when you asked… but my mind always wanders and wonders, and I jumped in with my question… you know me!.
        Just glad it doesn’t bother you as it does others.
        Hey Dal, would you mind answering the final double jeopardy Questions? Inquisitive minds [ loco and I ] would like to know… thanks.

        • Seeker, Loco, not that I know whatever Dal wrote, and not knowing his answer, but gotta say, it has to be a typo if true. With his being diagnosed in Jan 1988, and one night laying in bed and contemplating his fate, I can see your question, and would like to know. It has to be a typo, right…?

          • charlie,

            If you will go to the top of this page and scroll down to the paragraph titled “Oddities in the poem’s construction”, you can then read what Dal wrote, in it’s entirety.

            Sure it could be a typo, I gave him that out in my question…… I just wanted to verify that’s what it is, without assuming anything.

  64. Seeker, and others,
    My note on the double omegas is:
    “the relevance of the double omegas will go to the grave with the man who wrote the poem” f
    Sounds to me like this could be a hint, similar to the way that “two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead” could be a hint.
    “Have flashlight, will travel”

    • Have you heard of the “Shalam Colony” in New Mexico? It is associated with a book; “Oahspe” which means: Earth, Sky and Spirit. ( Apparently, it was written while under the control of a “spirit” and consists of 900 pages).

      When Forrest refers to “the man who wrote the poem”…..I am reminded of this odd, (unique) book.

      Might Forrest be familiar with…”Automatic Writing?”

      I wonder in what capacity and method he knows of that might have something to do with the circumstances of how TTOTC was written.

      Just curious.


      • TTOTC Preface, in part:

        ‘This book is my ninth in twenty-six years of casually recounting the things I enjoy most. My books have to write themselves or I struggle. This one did.’

    • Geoff,
      This comment is interesting to think about as to what fenn could be implying. I mean, is that what we do….
      So a few thoughts of mine are;
      Don’t ask about them, and I’ll tell you know lies.
      They are the same as buried vs, hidden and I don’t want to say.
      They mean nothing, but again, it’s up to you to figure out. [ not unlike, it’s up to us to figure what the clues actually are and decipher them ].

      And yet it still make one think about the “grave” in the comment.
      Fenn enjoys words, we all know this. And in one SB someone mentioned recently, the word Furrow was used. Some definitions of the word with examples are; wrinkle [in skin ], groves [ in plowing rows ] crevices [ in a hand ]
      Fenn as used canyons in the same manner… cracks or groves in his hands.
      Some of the definitions and meanings of double Omega are; top, finishing, summit. [ old Greek meanings ]
      And we have the word Cold in the poem to one meaning of it use is dead or cold dead.

      I can’t help to see a connection to many words fenn uses in so many different venues that relate to death in very subtle instances, as well as words in the poem.
      Finished – end, canyon down -crevice, Cold – dead, Grave – put in?
      Sure they could just be words in different context to mean different things at those times. But still interesting to think about.
      And imo, the difference between a simple dictionary definition for a word, to what a word meaning / usage is, and how it was meant.

  65. secrets – grave -(pit) – the beginning – and the end – the first and the last – dead —buried – the omega – imo

  66. Geoff – I think that’s the comment seeker is talking about and what I can remember people started taking it as or something to do with the bible

  67. I hope I don’t run out of replys – ther other thing that I can see above I said buried but it could mean thumb where a stone was placed over the entrance in a scrapbook some where is him sitting on the ground resting drinking water with his arm resting on a stone covering the entrance to a hole in the wall of what I call a pit but that’s just my opinion hope it helps

  68. im looking for the pic but I found another picture on scrapbook -83 – that gives you an idea of what im talking about notice the hole on the wall that to me is is what stanza 1 is about with the omega imo

  69. please excuse my spelling years of not spelling some words and some not ever having to spell them is not easy – but I try I think the world is tomp

  70. p denver I guess what im trying to say is what the picture in 17 where his arm is resting on the round stone with a hole in the backto me he is saying this is how I hid the chest in a tomb and the the stone covers the opening to me that part is the bottom of the omega if you will – to me he went in there – new and old is a hole old is the hole in the ground that was already made the new is the hole that he made in the wall of the hole just like the pic forming the omega and that to me is stanza 1 but all this is just an opinion other minds might think different but this what I see thanks for the question hope I make sense

  71. That 1987 was definitely an error. I apologize for that. I also had not updated that material since 2013. It had a lot of old information in it and definitely needed refreshing. I hope it is up to date now. Please let me know if you see something else in error.

    • This statement may be questionable although I do think it is the place to start.

      (Forrest keeps telling us that we have to start with “Where warm waters halt.”)

      • Is that a true statement Jake? The poem says to, “Begin it wwwh and take it in the canyon down, not far, but too far to walk.”, but has Forrest ever said this was the first clue? I think not. I think that he has repeatedly said to start at the first clue, but he has never said that this line was the first clue. Correct me if I am wrong. JDA

        • Ya JD, I agree,
          I think this statement should be amended to the 1st clue.
          I can’t recall him ever saying to start there.
          Forrest has confirmed we need to know WWWH.
          I am sure dal or Goofy will address the issue.

        • Jda Forrest has always led me to believe warm waters was where to begin he would say you must first find where warm waters hault

          • Warm Waters is where you begin your quest or search – YES – (Or so some believe) – but is that the first clue? Possibly not, and Forrest has never said, to the best of my knowledge, that wwwh was the first clue. That is the discussion. JDA

          • I’ll go back thru my emails but he always said I must find warm waters hault first so sounds like the first clue to me I’ll review my emails He also said it to several others .

          • That’s interesting Diggin,
            I know you have been at this a lot longer than I & most here.
            Did Forrest ever say to you that you need to start at WWWH?

          • I found two one he says the poem will take you to the treasure but you must know where WWH is The other one l asked have I got any clue right and he says have you found WWH yet ? So I take it as that’s the first clue

          • Thanks Diggin,
            Sounds logical to me that WWWH is the 1st clue, but maybe you could copy & paste this info here for all to see?

            I don’t like to go from hearsay even if it’s from his wife.

          • DG;

            We read what we want to read I guess. From what you said, I would say that – YES – wwwh is the first step in the quest to find the treasure. Just because it is the first step in the quest, does not, in my opinion, make it the first clue.

            Without the lines above, “As I went alone in there…” even IF you find the blaze, and look quickly down, you will not know where the treasure is unless you have figured out where “in there” is.

            You will have completed your quest to find the treasure, but will leave empty handed, in my opinion.

            But then again, what do I know? NADA – JDA

      • I removed that statement along with several others yesterday. Please read what is on this page now rather than before the information was changed and let me know if there are still problems.

  72. Interesting thread. Lts of insight into how the folks in the beginning approached the Chase.

  73. “Forrest revealed to me that the first clue is the most important, begin it where warm waters halt.” -Josh Gates, Expedition Unknown 11-18-2015

    If you can believe Josh Gates then biwwwh is the first clue.

    • Ritt,

      I have this one to add as well;
      An important clue
      One thing Fenn will say is that most people are missing the most important clue; “begin it where warm waters halt”. When you solved this clue, he shared, and the others will fall into place. “If you don’t know ‘where warm water halts,’ Fenn said, “you don’t have anything.” It’s not much, but it’s a start.

      Note; I didn’t add or take away any quotes. What I find here and in the quote you presented and If not mistaken a Daily Beast interview may have suggested the say thing… they are all interviewers / reporters making the claim. I personally have not seen or heard a direct quote from fenn about exactly what is the first clue or where to start.

      As you said; “If you can believe Josh Gates then biwwwh is the first clue.”
      What the interviewer themselves think what the first clue is, is speculative at best on their part. I have to wonder why… if these interviews were recorded [ example Expedition Unknown ]… Why, why none of them show/hear fenn saying it?

      “Personally” all it seems to be doing [ the supposed quote ] is selling the interview and no facts. { we told you here first on this station … updates @ 10.}

      • I personally take any article or clip where it is a reporter telling us what f said with a grain of salt because as we know f is very good at” its not what I said but what you think I said” and it’s hard enough to decipher what exactly he’s saying with a direct quote without adding an element that is notorious for not getting things straight. With the first clue being so important I use great caution unless I know it was f’s words as they came out of his mouth.

        Here is one place that f did address the topic:

  74. I have to ask the question.

    Forrest has been interviewed many times & some, maybe one of the interviewers have been castrated by Forrest for falsely publicizing & twisting things in the interview.

    I believe Billie Frank is a honest & accurate journalist & I would have to think seeing Forrest & her, work & live in the same area, if there was anything false in the published interview, Forrest would have taken action as he has done before.

    I am going to buy into WWWH is the 1st clue solidly seeing there are many people stating he said is so. Diggin Gypsy, Josh Gates, dal’s old comment above that was deleted & the other interview I did not transcribe as well as countless other searchers that have not gone to the dark side.

    If you were in Forrest’s shoes & someone interviewed you & published some of the info incorrectly, would you try & do something about it, seeing you are in that position to do so?
    I think so & he has.

    For those that say WWWH is where you begin or start but not the 1st clue to figure, I ask you then, what is a clue?

    I think a clue in the poem is something you have to figure out that is vague.
    I don’t see anything vague in the 1st stanza unless your way over thinking what is stated. Further more, the clues are in consecutive order & once you go forward, you can’t go back whether in the poem or on the ground.

    This is all just my rumor.

    • I agree people have to make it harder than it prob is. Begin means here’s your first clue now go get it 🙂

      • Sorry DG – I just can not agree. Begin your quest at wwwh, but clue #1 (to me at least) is Stanza #1.

        One Sentence = 1 clue. Works for me, otherwise too many unused lines. Why would Forrest use only 1/2 of the poem for the clues, and 1/2 for what? Banter? I think not. JDA

        • Hehe it’s ok we can disagree JDA it’s what makes the world go round I know the conversations I have had with the ole coot and I have seen where he has told others the same so I’m
          Good with my first clue and the omegas were at the end of my story I must have gotten something right or
          Maybe even 2 clues why would ya wanna bet on a girl that was going in the wrong direction Just a thought

      • JD,
        So you begin at the 1st stanza & then you begin again WWWH.
        There is only one 1st clue, not 2.

        You have deciphered or figured out the 1st stanza, correct?

        Would that not constitute, the 1st stanza is where to begin the quest?

        • LoL Jake you assume where to start and the first clue has to be one in the same. It very well could be…then again, it could be just what you want it to be.

          • Seeker & JD,
            I already know Seekers thought.
            Does the 1st stanza point to a physical place in one way or another as to say, medicine wheel is not found everywhere but only in certain areas or another example, is the 1st stanza connected in any way with a place?

            If it is, then this is a clue you had to figure & seeing it’s in the 1st stanza then it must be considered the 1st clue.

            Catch my drift or did you drift off?

          • YUP Jake – “in there” is an actual place. THE actual place that the TC is hidden. You do not yet know where that place is, but it is absolutely a place. JDA

          • That’s right JD,
            You have to figure out a place where the treasure is from the 1st stanza.
            But you cannot figure out where you go in there unless you figure out the 9 clues in the next stanzas.

        • Jake;

          I kinda read Stanza #1 like the Preamble to the Constitution. It is the lead-in that makes the rest make sense.

          Looked at another way, Stanza #1 is like the preface to a book. The actual book starts at page 1, of chapter 1. The point-to-point map-quest begins at Biwwwh., after the preface or preamble. JDA

          • JD,
            Does the “preface or preamble” have to be figured out?

            It’s very basic to me that when we 1st read the poem, we have no idea WWWH but yet the 1st stanza is pretty straightforward.

          • Yes, it does have to be figured out, but it takes 8 other clues to figure it out. As I said earlier – “in there” is THE place that the TC is hidden. Figure out the other 8 clues, and you will know where “in there” is. JDA

          • JD,
            When you figure out the 9 clues in stanzas 2, 3 & 4, then you will know where to go in there is.

            The 1st stanza is the ultimate catch phrase where you think it’s the beginning.
            Your mind is telling you this is the place to start & he has done a great job of persuading most of you here in that.

            Too simple for 9 sentences to be nine clues.
            Don’t you think he thought of this simple thinking? LOL

          • Jake/ JD
            I agree with you both, “in there” is very important and tells you where to look. Like just about everyone here I have a very simple, yet crafty solve.

            I found my blaze, and below it is an area for one person to fit, I hope the find the TC this weekend. Last weekend I had a lot of bear activity and it was not safe to go “in there”.

            Thanks Casey

      • Yes Diggin gypsy,
        They have to make things more complicated for themselves.
        Maybe because they watch too much TV with all the drama & scenarios to figure.

        Someone tells you where to begin & you decide that is not the beginning…….

        I wrote a poem with 9 clues & you can start where you want, “you guess” but in the 2nd stanza I say “Begin it where”.

        Oh, I didn’t get that memo.
        Where do I start or begin Forrest?
        Can you help me with what I just completely ignored?

        I’m sorry, I don’t believe you or what you wrote in the poem.

        • You DO begin the physical point A to point B quest at the beginning of Stanza #2.

          I follow Forrest’s words exactly. I am NOT ignoring what he says. I DID get the memo.

          Part of what the memo said was to read the preface, THEN begin the quest…made up memo folks. Forrest never published or said anything about a memo.. Jake’s and my fabrication, used for explanation. JDA

          • So how can the clues be in consecutive order if you have to figure out the other 8 clues after the 1st stanza?

            You said:
            “Yes, it does have to be figured out, but it takes 8 other clues to figure it out.”

            Does not look like consecutive order to me when you put #9 in the 1st stanza & the rest of the clues after that.

            Riddle me that?

          • OK I mis-spoke.
            Clue #1 = stanza #1.
            Clue #2 = Lines 1,2 & 3 Stanza #2
            Clue #3 = Line 4 Stanza #2
            Clue# 4 = all of stanza #3
            Clue #5 = all of stanza #4
            Clue #6 = Lines 1 & 2 stanza #5
            Clue #7 = Lines 3 & 4 stanza #5
            Clue #8 = Lines 1 & 2 stanza #6
            Clue #9 = Lines 2 & 4 stanza #6

            1 sentence = 1 clue = JDA

          • You didn’t have to post it JD although I’m glad you did for others.
            I already know your punctuation theory.

            I will say it is a logical way to think if you think punctuation’s play a roll in the 9 clues.

            I also think that when it comes to poems, punctuation’s take a back seat to the words in the poem.

            The question mark should make you rethink this thinking & look for something more reliable. Why else a ? would be placed so deliberately?

            Just seems to easy for all those institutionalized peckers out there. Oh, look at that, there are 8 periods & a question mark. I think the 9 clues are within these puncs.

            If anyone thinks it’s THAT easy, then you mize well play checkers with your pet.

            Words trump punctuation in poems & capitalization doesn’t mean a thing either.
            I would be more comfortable with no periods, semi colons, commas or question marks in poems.

          • OK JD,
            So, do you need to figure out any of the 8 clues in stanzas 2 thru 6 to know clue #1 in stanza #1 ?

            Very simple question seeing you miss spoke several times on different dates about this.

            I know our solves evolve & change throughout time but just seems to me you may be in the cart ahead of the donkey.

          • DPT;

            I certainly have never thought of Forrest as a simpleton. Do you even know what it means? If not, here is a definition:sim·ple·ton
            noun: simpleton; plural noun: simpletons

            a foolish or gullible person.

            A man does not get to be a multi-millionaire by being foolish or gullible.

            If I were you, I would know the meaning of something before I use it in such a slanderous way.

            Forrest may be plain-spoken and straightforward in his speech, but certainly NOT a simpleton. JDA

    • Jake there are quite a few articles with ‘ buried’ treasures used to describe the hunt, and not ever time did fenn correct it. If fact he said he doesn’t want to say either way, to make it a fact one way or the other.

      But do you truly believe that fenn would volunteer a correction on what is and is not the first clue in any venue? Especially since this clue has been stated its must or stay home.

      There is no majority rule in the chase… that is a assumption all on its own.
      You can believe as you like, but wouldn’t you rather know facts instead of being lead by the nose, buy the majority.

      To state wwwh is the first clue is only an assumption at this point….but I think is safe to say wwwh is not a dam.

      • Well for the record the ole coot also said he burried it in a interview he did one time so even he gets messed up with words:-)

    • Begin-initiate-start-to set in motion-to begin an activity-take first step into something, etc.

      How does one know where to begin/find the correct WWWH? Perhaps the information is in the first stanza.

      • Actually pd, for me at least, where it is, is found “IN the wood” of stanza #6. The IN of IN the wood then replaces IN there in stanza #1, and this tells you exactly which wwwh is the right one. At least it works for me. JDA

        • I see it the way you read it JD. But I also read it as a double meanings.
          Worth the cold search and in the book.
          I think the poem has a lot of double meanings in it. That’s why I think forrest said. I wouldn’t change the poem I’m happy that the poem said what I wanted.
          Seem like it might be telling two story’s. O well just my thoughts, could be looking at wrong.

  75. in my mind stanza 1 is not a stanza to travel but a place to travel to at the end the 2nd stanza wwwh starts your trip to canyon down where I take it in to hob where I travel to heavy loads to the blaze in the wood to the place where my quest ends – if wwwh is the first clue or not that’s where my travel begins al this is my opinion

    • I don’t think that the poem says what is wwwh or where it is something that I have to figure out in my own and think what is wwwh and then look for the where I don’t think that there is that many in nm where I search and what I think it is but my gas tank wont be full until I know for sure of the what and the where

      • you know after commenting what I said above and going back to the poem – I found out that I was wrong – yes the poem does tell you where wwwh – the poem does have every thing that you have to know to get there – sorry

        • You were able to figure it out with reading the poem over just one more time? Good for you. It took many, many re-readings and a bit of research for me to figure it out. JDA

          • JDA I have been reading the poem for over 4+years and like you have done at times I miss spoke and I did say I was wrong

  76. I know it may have been covered before but at the top of this post it says someone has been within 500ft. Was the within 200ft comment I have read somewhere not an accurate quote from Mr. Fenn’s mouth?

    • Buy the ranch? Have you ever translated the word “mess” to Spanish and looked at the synonyms?

      No? Oh well.

        • Ok, sure.

          What if the key to understanding Fenn’s poem is looking at English and non-English synonyms, homonyms, and Fennonyms? There are lots of people looking in NM. In NM, there are lots of Spanish place names. In particular, Ghost Ranch vicinity in the northern eligible area seems to be a concentrated collection of correlations. So does Chase Ranch vicinity in the eligible NE side.

          What if Fenn actually does slip in a word here and there in his communications that can be translated as a hint? What if by using the word “mess”, he’s also hinting “ranch”?

          – Google “translate”
          – English –> “mess” to Spanish –> “lío”
          – Click on the link at the bottom of the section to “13 more translations”
          – See “el rancho”
          – See my joke in previous response “Buy the ranch?”

          And what if none if this reasonable and he keeps using the same phrase “don’t mess with my poem” because he’s just a simple-minded thinker? Why not use a different word each time like “reorder” or “change” or “modify”? Why continue to emphasize the word “mess”?

          These are the nuances on which a linguistics analyst will focus.

          • I think the statement by F about don’t mess with my poem was only stated once & wasn’t repeated using different words like a lot of other statements so I don’t think he continued to emphasize this word.

            It’s possible he has slipped out hints here & there but to have them translated to another language other than Native American languages don’t work for me.

            There are plenty of Spanish labels in the other states & not just NM.

            Are you saying: Don’t ranch with my poem?
            Just doesn’t sound right to me….

          • “don’t ranch with my poem” …

            No. I’m suggesting Fenn uses specific synonyms, homonyms, and made up words with intentions of communicating hints. Not that the word can translate directly and be meaningful in the sentence in which he uses it, but that a word used in a sentence can be a focal point for a hint. If you also agree to this approach, I can then suggest we start to see common theme word patterns appearing across these translations, like “stairs”, “rope” or “knot”, “camera”, “post”, “grave”, “pie” (Spanish word) or “foot”, etc. These same themes can also be found in TTOTC stories.

          • What you suggest EC, cannot be proven either way.
            It’s possible but seems to be a stretch to place words in his book(s) that would translate to some other language giving a hint especially considering he has stated that the hints in the book(s) are not placed deliberately.

            We do know that he knew about all the hints in his book(s) except for 1.
            Knowing they are not deliberately placed would tell me he just wrote the stories fluidly from his mind through experiences.

            “I would like to reiterate: Please go back to the poem and look at maps for your answers. Not every noun in TTOTC is a hint.”

            How many times has he said to go back & read the poem?
            What language is the poem in?

          • 1) The poem is in English.
            2) I only focus on the poem, TTOTC and his comments in the past few years, starting with the NBC further clarifying hints.
            3) I suggested he is hinting, not with every noun, but hinting.
            4) Had he deliberately placed hints to aid the searcher in TTOTC, he might have said “look only in Rio Arriba County, NM” or “translate some words to Spanish”. Those would be deliberately placed hints to aid a searcher. Otherwise, using language like one uses in their puzzle is not deliberately placed hints, it’s just a continuation of the puzzle. He’s said many things to try to bend our minds around interpretations. Consider this is also one of those.

          • We are in different boxes EC,
            I appreciate your feedback & sharing but don’t agree on the translation to Spanish.
            If I plan to visit or live in another country where English is not used too often, then I would make an effort to learn the local language & culture.

            I believe F was born in America & the language at the time was & is……

            Would it not be deceptive if the translations were in Spanish?

          • I would also like to add, I think there was an interview with F with a Spanish speaking person this year & I believe F needed an translator.
            Or is that all part of the ruse?

            OK, who got that video/audio handy?

          • Ruse? I think I need a meaning translator with you, Jake. Some of your word choices are more harsh than I would choose.

            I use Google to translate words to different languages. No specialized knowledge is needed. If I were being interviewed by a Spanish-speaking interviewer, I would also need a translator.

          • I don’t know, Jake. Maybe you should ask him. If I were to speculate, a translator is someone who can real-time and professionally convey the sense of the conversation in language that is not one’s native or mother tongue.

            Picking apart a puzzle and applying translations using google or a Spanish/English cross-reference is not the same as communicating real-time, and the former requires no specialized knowledge.

          • Well EC,
            We are at a stalemate seeing neither one of us has the proof.
            But I like to keep the rational thinking about the clues & not sure you need to use Spanish but I never heard F say you need Google translate.

            IMO, you stretch things well beyond the breaking point & I’m fine with that knowing there will be one less competitor.

          • E.C. You, and everyone else, seem to ignore Fenn’s comment about this.

            And the word may be used colloquially

            Colloquialisms are often geographical in nature, and used in everyday speech. Words that have a formal meaning can also have a colloquial meaning and the meanings can change over time.

            So a colloquial word could be a Spanish word or any other language for that matter. Perhaps from a different time period. Many places in the Rocky’s with strange names that have a different meaning colloquially.

          • Commenting on my chance being less than yours makes it personal, Jake.

            As long as we’re looking at personal aspects, like last time, I again find your racism to be problematic and shameful, and I find your intellectual inflexibility to be limiting to your options. Good luck.

          • EC,
            I am so shameful I do not want to use Spanish words to solve Forrest’s poem.
            I think you may be acting as a racist with the poem being written in English & only want to translate to Spanish.

            Zapatos en el otro pie!
            Ah! the world is full of of hypocrites.

            There was something interesting Forrest said in that interview after being the question was translated & he read the 1st & second stanza & said: “OK, that’s the 1st part of the… I think there are 24 stanzas… that’s the 1st few clues…”

            “That’s the 1st few clues” after reading only stanza 1 & 2.

            Hypocrites all around…

          • @Goofy – ignoring? Perhaps I just haven’t evolved the product to this level yet. For me, creating a new word list and connecting relationships is only a time consuming task. Short of moving there and hanging out in a grump-home, getting the list of colloquialisms and their relationships is the challenge and would definitely speed up the process. But it’s exactly in line with the process/system I’m using now. It’s just an extension of synonyms and homonyms, like how to prepare Fenn’s crazy words. Good advice, though. I’ll start looking for these. I’ve seen some “New Mexico Spanish” references in older documents.

          • EC –
            “look only in Rio Arriba County” and “translate some words to Spanish” … thanks for the indeliberate tips, I’ll try to keep them in mind

    • @JF Spanish or French? Wasn’t there a letter written in French to Mr. Fenn, who asked here if someone could translate it for him?

    • I agree not to mess with the poem, a blaze is always going to be just a blaze no matter what language it’s in, and you’ve got mail Jake.

    • Cholly, you might be right. He mentioned French as the name of a street where he grew up, and in reference to a grave marker from a war. My point is not that Spanish is the key, but that not only English should be explored. We translate meanings in our head. Why not translate words and see where they take us?

      • E.C. agreed! When does ‘walk’ become a hike? Always enjoy what you have to say even though I think you were the one FF was referring to when he said get back in the box! lol! I’ve been off the blog for a while, noticed some personal compulsive need to blog-in to often and decided to take a break.

      • Perhaps one could say that all “Germanic” languages are in play? Interesting if one takes the time to explore where words originate…take for example the word “thug”…it comes from an interesting background….

        • He also shows us that he transforms Laotian words for us, like “Tchepone, Laos” into “(Chapone to us)”. Considering his mention of Comanche’s catching chickens, would this not be something to look at through a different lens?

          • E.C. – I would not go out on a limb and say that I would rule ANYTHING out. The book(TTOTC) wrote itself …blah blah etc. etc. The poem on the other hand took how long ? Just because fenn said he felt like an architect doesn’t mean he didn’t use some tricky vocab. words or “creened” definitions. He has admitted that he makes up words to suit his needs…so I find it easy to explore all of those angles.
            Do I personally believe the poem will be solved using Spanish, French even Comanche interps.? Not exclusively would be my answer.
            The poem is going to lead the write person down the right path for the raht reasons Wright to the chest.
            Don’t listen to the ones that share so willingly all of the dribbling same info that has gone forth for years. None of that has worked either. AND, who is to say that everything posted here is what a poster Really thinks? Is it not possible that these same folks just like to write nonsense to see where it goes and to be in the popular view? I think there may be a bit of that here and there…but heck, a story is a story and some hear know how to right, write? Carry on…

          • Strawshadow – perhaps, yes, there may present be some of the negative attributes to that. But in my case, it is very specifically related to a field called link analysis within network theory.

            Using downloaded GNIS feature names from, the associated long/lat and an algorithm for proximity tolerances, limiting elevation ranges for the final stanza, joining an English and Spanish thesaurus list with corresponding translations, and a few new algorithms I had to build (and continue to train) for homonym word relationships, partial word homonym and synonym matching, and Fenn’s outlier crazy words like “aur paur” for “naked”, I’ve been able generate several hot-spots worth researching. For example, Yuque Yunque turned up as related to “anvil” and “found” from an historical text I used related to NM. That was a surprise, especially after seeing John Dunn Bridge had a relationship to “Brown”. I’ve been posting interpretations of the analysis generated around this on HOD. I sometimes get distracted trying to explain these findings to a racist d-bag.

          • My very specifically related findings to a field link called analysis within theory network channels enabling me to delineate the findings of deciphering the poem are quite elaborate considering the clues need to be translated into an alien articulation beyond what methodical people would sanction as perceptivity of colloquial knowledge.

            Somehow I think we are skipping over the simple nature of what it is….

          • Jake;

            You said (Quoting EC I believe),”My very specifically related findings to a field link called analysis within theory network channels enabling me to delineate the findings of deciphering the poem are quite elaborate considering the clues need to be translated into an alien articulation beyond what methodical people would sanction as perceptivity of colloquial knowledge.”

            I don’t need an English to Spanish translator for this, I need an “English to Old Geezer” translator.. What the heck was EC saying? It certainly overloaded one of my two functioning brain cells. JDA

          • Guys – Amazing news!
            I’ve been using my fluent Spanish language skills to translate this stanza;

            “Би тэнд ганцаараа явж байна гэжМиний эрдэнэс тод хамтби шинэ болон хуучин баялаг нь хаана нэгэн нууц болон зөвлөгөөг хадгалж болно”

            but I’m still really confused..

            …oh wait, I just remembered that I don’t actually possess any language skills
            (darn it all..!!)

          • @Curious Hobbit – with no specialized knowledge in language translation, you were able to mostly convey a concept in Mongolian, and therefore also prove my point as to why this is a possibility. Maybe not exactly how you are putting it together, but close. Even if you’re ridiculing the potential.

          • thanks E.C

            finally someone here appreciates that I’m accidentally special at interpreting sino-russian-mongolian language dialections and hydroglaphics
            – I sorta feel like a human Rosetta-stone E.C, but shorter.

            ( ..btw, don’t tell Dal that I’m fluent in russian E.C, I think he might be a communist – I’m pretty sure he is)

          • @Curious Hobbit – funny you should mention the Rosetta Stone. The presence of it in TTOTC is what tossed me down this translations path. I’m still seeking Fenn’s Rosetta Stone, but finding a curious hobbit’s worth of coincidences while trying to wade through “Chronicles of Young Indiana Jones”. Episode 4 with Tolstoy has Gypsies, baseball cards, and a discussion about logic. Every episode so far has a bunch of coincidences.

          • Kind of…but I was really just saying that folks should just tie their own darned flies, and see what they catch…I tied a few last week but I had to let em go cause it just didn’t seem right.

  77. Does anyone have the link where FF said: “the chest was not hidden in a tree but that it was surrounded by trees”.

    Dal’s reference above posted Jan 27, 2013 is the oldest, but I also found: “Not in a tree, surrounded by trees” on Jenny’s site but it was not tagged as a direct quote.

    Any info on this would be appreciated.
    (Is this why it’s in the “Rumors Abound…” post?)


  78. Just an interesting thing for anyone interested in foreign languages- try a free app like itranslate…copy and paste the poem and translate into Spanish. Then copy that and translate back to English. Then copy that and go to French. Then the French back to English. Then repeat with German…no, I personally didn’t use Spanish, French, and German in that necessary order, and I did use more than three for my ‘experiment’ but I found the results extremely interesting and revealing. No just as far as foreign language….but the process itself lends to automatically substituting synonyms and homonyms for both words AND phrases. You may be fascinated, as I was, with what phrases appear in front of you. Or maybe not. But I enjoyed the time I spent looking into it and figured I’d share. Hope someone else might enjoy the angles as well. 😉

        • @WY Girl – Jonesy’s point is basically the same thing as what I’m doing, just with a specific focus on looking for a collection of points within a specific data set.

          Translations of words do not give the same results as translations of verses or stanzas because context is then weighted and starts to skew the results. Fenn focuses on words and phrases as a puzzle. Even when he’s clarifying a fact-checker, he says things like “I call it a memoir”, or “age-cracked is not a good phrase”. I’m not suggesting a translation of the poem will yield positive results. I am exploring translating (in the case of synonym possibilities) and transforming (in the case of homonym possibilities) words and word fragments to help solve a place-names mapping puzzle.

    • Online translaters are garbage, they do not properly translate because they do not take into consideration the context, but have fun with it.

      They are the reason why we have jokes such as:
      “All your base are belong to us”

      Google it.

      If you want a real translation, get someone who knows the language. I do not think it will be worth the effort though, just a good way to learn another language.

      The USA is one of those countries where the population for the most part is not multi-lingual, to release a poem that requires language translations would not be a wise thing to do IMO. Then again, perhaps the Chase was targeted at New Mexico where you might find a whole lot more Spanish speakers than lets say Montana or Wyoming.

      • Family story about language… Greek immigrant uncle got job on RR in Montana around the turn of the century. Speaks minimal english. Overhears two bosses talking about a newly hired crew and one asks the other, “Are they Greeks?” The other answers “Naw, their swell guys.” Greek uncle interprets “swell” as meaning non-Greeks It lasted for generations in my husbands family and is still used as a family joke today … sorta like the word goy in Yiddish, or gringo in Spanish.

  79. HA! Jonsey1…. Cant wait to try it …. after Festivus and New Years craziness.
    Right now I’m finishing all of Ellliot S. Barker’s books and the endless killing of anything wild in New Mexico. He was a pretty remarkable guy though.

    • It only takes 5 minutes. I’m certain Elliot would most likely approve. ) Just don’t kill any European Peacock Butterflies or Fluvial Arctic Grayling, K?

      • Then again, whatever floats your boat. I’m more a fan of Pavlov than Frued as I like to see specific measurable achievable goals and results. No offense to fans of clinical psych, I’m just a behaviorist myself and got better results examining strings of words and phrases for synonyms than I would airing a bunch of grievances around a pole. (Although one does adorn my living room, I don’t find it useful in productive objectives. It’s great for entertainment though)

        • @Jonesy1 – I’m also a behaviorist. Easier to apply game theory with reasonable outcomes.

          And you’re so weird. lol

      • Jonsey1@

        Finally we have something in common.
        I am currently an avid fan of behaviorism too, and (although I’ve often been accused of being bad at it)
        ..I’d still much rather be praised as a bad behaviorist, than to lack any sense of behavioralisticness whatsoever, I reckon.

        btw, what’s with the pole?
        ..are you training to be a fire-fighter?

        • The pole? Lol. That was a thinly veiled Spanish reference to the laundry, and the horse, in my weird living room. Never made it to the dry cleaners apparently.

          • *or you could just Google Festivus if you actually want an answer that would make sense to anyone besides E.C.

          • yep, totally on the same page,1J@nsey.

   (just to be clear) you send your pet horse to the dry-cleaners, whilst dancing around an under-paid Polish immigrant (in your lounge area) for entertainment, while reading scarily heavy books with long boring words?

            ..and where (on Earth) do you possibly find the time for all your fire-fighters training activities?!

            ( you’re a bit weird Jonsey@1 (tbh)
            – but I like you)

    • a) Sorry, can’t buy into behaviorism… when the treats stop, the behavior stops…. so who is training who? whom?

      b) I don’t live large…remove the lampshade from the floor lamp, voila … the Festivus pole! … very practical. Would like to change the gift giving day to the day before Thanksgiving, and all gifts to be cash, so every recipient could exercise unfettered honest biological greed on Black Friday… an eminently entertaining and practical holiday sport… I’d call it The Day of Mirrors Miracle, a day to see ourselves as ourselves.

      c. I love ellipses …

    • @Sparrow – I probably don’t need to say it, but convert it back to Spanish and you have a reasonable word fragment homonym for Fenn’s porcupine, quill / feather, potbelly pig, “Porky” allusions, and synonym allusions to mud and dirt, suggesting Rio Puerco. This is what turned up for me. Maybe ya’ll see it differently.

  80. So, after going over the FACT of Forrest NEEDING a Spanish speaking translator for an interview it has become evident that the poem & book(s) do not need to be translated into Spanish in any way or form.

    There are already enough rabbit holes in the book(s), statements & poem.
    Why create another that would multiply into the millions.

    I remember when Forrest said to get back in the box & many overthinking searchers were floored & began to change to a more simple theory.
    But, as we see this affect wore off quickly & cannot help stubborn searchers that can only think one way & not be able to adjust.

    You can lead a jackass to Waters but they only see Aguas.

    • Jake speaks the truth.

      I guess translations are just another way to look for confirmation bias, especially if your solve happens to be in New Mexico. It is funny how people are surprised that Spanish words happen to match locations in a state with a large Spanish speaking population. But I digress….

      • Just for own info. Not saying the poem needs to be translated, but if you want to know about places you live or are searching in. Maybe you should do a little research before meaning so ignorant.

        The name Montana comes from the Spanish word Montaña and the Latin word Montana, meaning “mountain”, or more broadly, “mountainous country”. Montaña del Norte was the name given by early Spanish explorers to the entire mountainous region of the west.
        Montana state moto: Oro Y Plata
        Spanish (Gold and Silver)

    • No, Jake. Your logic is flawed and your evidence is still an assumption. But, after your continued personal attacks and online bullying tactics, I don’t care any more about your posts.

        • Seriously! Are you guys gonna fight all day again. I get it, this can be frustrating but going at each other isn’t helping anyone. You both have valid ideas, so get along and play nice 🙂

          • Yep Jake, but I believe in this game you gotta be flexible in your solve. I can’t tell you how many times I thought I had a solid solve and then had to tweak it cause I kept digging for more information. Keep digging Jake, keep digging ( for information that is). I think there’s a lot of merit to your area. Someday someone is gonna dig deep enough……so on second thought, you and EC just keep on fighting cause I’m off to do more digging and the less competition the better 🙂

          • I agree Wy Girl,
            Keep on digging.
            My digging at this point is being done with a trowel & brush, slowly & carefully removing the dirt & debris.

            We must remember when we are digging & hit a large boulder or something solid that blocks the way, we must not explode it or turn it into rubble & just fill the hole back in & dig a new one.

      • c’mon E.C, you got thicker skin than that, mate

        if you can intelligently respond to my (well intended) teasing earlier, with such eloquently admirable tact – then you can easily tolerate a nylon fur-ball, whose lived his entire life on a dusty sesame-street set, in a trash-can, with all those darn annoying happy kids scattered everywhere.
        (I’d be grumpy too, tbh)

        but at least Jake is straight up and doesn’t pull punches
        ..and that’s a respectable characteristic in anyones book.
        (I’m sure that when he finds that darn treasure, he’ll happily give you half, as a sign of his remorse)

        ( ..I’m pretty sure he will E.C – no honestly)

  81. I think I cracked the language translation rumor…. Can you see it?

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    4nÐ w17h m¥ 7r34$µr3$ b0£Ð,
    1 (4n |{33p m¥ $3(r37 wh3r3,
    4nÐ h1n7 0ƒ r1(h3$ n3w 4nÐ 0£Ð.

    B391n 17 wh3r3 w4rm w473r$ h4£7
    4nÐ 74|{3 17 1n 7h3 (4n¥0n Ð0wn,
    N07 ƒ4r, bµ7 700 ƒ4r 70 w4£|{.
    Pµ7 1n b3£0w 7h3 h0m3 0ƒ Br0wn.

    ƒr0m 7h3r3 17’$ n0 p£4(3 ƒ0r 7h3 m33|{,
    7h3 3nÐ 1$ 3v3r Ðr4w1n9 n19h;
    7h3r3’££ b3 n0 p4ÐУ3 µp ¥0µr (r33|{,
    Jµ$7 h34v¥ £04Ð$ 4nÐ w473r h19h.

    1ƒ ¥0µ’v3 b33n w1$3 4nÐ ƒ0µnÐ 7h3 b£423,
    £00|{ qµ1(|{£¥ Ð0wn, ¥0µr qµ3$7 70 (34$3,
    Bµ7 74rr¥ $(4n7 w17h m4rv3£ 9423,
    Jµ$7 74|{3 7h3 (h3$7 4nÐ 90 1n p34(3.

    $0 wh¥ 1$ 17 7h47 1 mµ$7 90
    4nÐ £34v3 m¥ 7r0v3 ƒ0r 4££ 70 $33|{?
    7h3 4n$w3r$ 1 4£r34Ð¥ |{n0w,
    1’v3 Ð0n3 17 71r3Ð, 4nÐ n0w 1’m w34|{.

    $0 h34r m3 4££ 4nÐ £1$73n 900Ð,
    ¥0µr 3ƒƒ0r7 w1££ b3 w0r7h 7h3 (0£Ð.
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    • Very, very clever. Did you work it out, or did you create and run a computer program to get the results. Again, very, very clever. JDA

    • I see a clue here: Ðr4w1n9 n19h;
      1n9 n1
      191 North
      Gallatin Rd.
      Gallatin Gateway.
      North Intrastate Gallatin Highway;

      I guess we see whatever we want to see & from what I can see, I am blind.

      • I felt sorry for the millennials that may be reading these blogs, so I left the poem in a state they can understand. It was probably a mistake though, they would need to leave their safe spots to go search! 🙂

  82. This one is for those who might be searching in Montana or Wyoming…

    As ah have gone alone in thar
    An’ wif mah treasures bold,
    ah can keep mah secret whar,
    An’ hint of riches noo an’ old, cuss it all t’ tarnation.

    Begin it whar warm waters halt
    An’ take it in th’ cennyon down,
    Not far, but too far t’walk. Shet mah mouth!
    Put in below th’ home of Brown, as enny fool kin plainly see.

    Fum thar it’s no place fo’ th’ meek,
    Th’ end is evah drawin’ nigh;
    Thar’ll be no paddle up yer creek,
    Jest heavy loads an’ water high.

    Eff’n yo’’ve been wise an’ foun’ th’ blaze,
    Look quickly down, yer quess to cease,
    But tarry scant wif marvel gaze,
    Jest take th’ chess an’ hoof it in peace.

    So whuffo’ is it thet ah muss go
    An’ leave mah trove fo’ all t’seek?
    Th’ answers ah already know,
    I’ve done it tired, an’ now I’m weak. Shet mah mouth!

    So hear me all an’ lissen fine,
    Yer effo’t will be wo’th th’ cold, cuss it all t’ tarnation.
    Eff’n yer brave an’ in th’ wood
    ah give yo’ title t’th’ gold, cuss it all t’ tarnation.

        • No time, just used a dialect translator…

          As ah’ have gone alone in dere
          And wid mah’ treasho’ mans bold,
          I kin keep mah’ secret where,
          And hint uh riches new and old.

          Begin it where warm boozes halt
          And snatch it in de kinyon waaay down,
          Not far, but too far t’walk. Ya’ know?
          Put in below de crib uh Brown. ‘S coo’, bro.

          From dere it’s no place fo’ de meek,
          De end be eva’ drawin’ nigh;
          Dere’ll be no paddle down yo’ creek,
          Just heavy loads and booze high. Lop some boogie.

          If ya’’ve been wise and found da damn blaze,
          Look quickly waaay down, yo’ quest t’cease,
          But tarry scant wid marvel gaze,
          Just snatch de chest and go in peace.

          So’s why be it dat ah’ gots’ta go
          And leave mah’ trove fo’ all t’seek?
          De answers ah’ already know,
          I’ve done it tired, and now I’m weak. Ya’ know?

          So’s hear me all and listen baaaad,
          Yo’ effo’t gots’ta be wo’d de cold.
          If ya’ is brave and in de wood
          I cut ya’ title t’de gold.

      • Just playing around with an online Dialect translator. Sorry for the spam Jake, JDA, EC, etc.

        I owe you all a beer or four.

    • Cute, so if its in NM, and you know where it is…. why haven’t I seen pictures of your find? But hey that’s ok…if everybody searches in your town, all the competition will leave our’s. IMO

    • I’ma guessin’ if I can’t figure it out in plain English, I’m not gonna figure it out in this one here either. 🙂

  83. About the “500′ from the treasure”- people have been assuming horizontally, but could the distance be due to someone flying over the treasure? Just a thought

    • I suppose that’s always a possibility. Either way, how would it help anyone find
      the TC? IMO.

  84. Well the FAA has the minimum altitude for most areas for planes and helicopters at 500 feet.

  85. So, I was wondering if when he took the two trips, did he take them to the same spot? Blaze-Quest to Cease Take the Chest, and then two more lines…. In the cold

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