Scrapbook Sixty One…



APRIL 2014




It seems logical to me that a deep thinking treasure searcher could use logic to determine an important clue to the location of the treasure. Is someone doing that now and I don’t know it? It’s not what they say on the blogs that may be significant, it’s what they whisper. f

262 thoughts on “Scrapbook Sixty One…

  1. I’m pretty logical. And I haven’t even whispered my solution to anyone, but I like it a lot! 🙂

      • If you’re listening good, and know the person he just quoted, then it might also draw you to an interesting conclusion….
        IMHO, it’s possible FF just told us why Stanza ONE (and ‘focusing’ on one particular word of that stanza) is important
        eliminated 3 of our 4 search states in one fell swoop.

        It’s a rough quote, so you’ll have to use imagination rather than perfectionism to find it.

        I won’t do all the work for you, but here’s my take:
        The person quoted had a career not unlike FF; scrappy beginnings and thru grit and imagination, managed a pretty adventurous, passionate, and interesting life.
        The person quoted had their life cut short far too soon – something I think FF was certainly worried about in 1988.
        Their name is a household name as far as I’m concerned, but I can see how some Gen Y and younger might not have ever heard of this person. Though I judge them for it. 😉
        They also have double letters in both their first name, as well as their last name. …Which just happen to be the exact SAME double letters in FF’s first, and then last, name.
        This person also wanted to serve this country in the armed forces.

        He’s undeniably associated to some degree with treasure chests, but more importantly I think is that quote was from a later career point (When nasty rumors and court cases were doing damage) and therefore referencing a later point in his career: Look at the TITLES of his works:

        –One of them happens to be FF’s street address and the very first non-poem clue given out.
        –One of them happens to be one of the very first few nonpoem clues AND is without argument, our general search area.
        —And one of them, from mid-century, is the very specific name of a very specific STATE. One I think is referenced inside of the first 2 lines of the poem.

        /My 2 bits, but I think this unusually short-but-sweet FF scrapbook entry is HEAVY with clues.

        • Map-
          We’ve discussed Errol Flynn for a few days on TTOTC. He was my first thought about the ‘whisper’ quote. I think you just spelled it all out for everyone here.

          Santa Fe Trail
          Rocky Mountain

          And Errol was famous for saying:
          “It isn’t what they say about you, it’s what they whisper.”
          Errol was referring to what people were saying behind his back, and he was always suspicious of Hollywood, especially in his more troubled later years.

          Errol Flynn tried to enter the military but was rejected on medical grounds; a great embarrassment for him. He also felt the tinges of being an imposter for his work:
          “I felt like an impostor, taking all that money for reciting ten or twelve lines of nonsense a day.”
          Was that as embarrassing to him as it was for Forrest getting caught being a fake cadet at Texas A&M, and later in Santa Fe when a little girl told him that “My father thinks you’re a fraud”, as many art dealers also thought?

          And what about Forrest’s feelings of inadequacy in front of his father on the banco making more money in 15 minutes than the cost of his Texas home? Certainly Forrest made up for being a fake cadet by being a notable fighter pilot and doing a lot for others- “We are all here only for the pleasure of others.”

          And Forrest also said “It doesn’t matter who you are, it only matters who they think you are.”

          Curiously, Errol was also known for several variations of the following quote:
          “Any man who has $10,000 left when he dies is a failure.”
          Forrest lowered that amount just a little bit and sculpted it on his bells.

          Errol had a number of other quotes that reflect Forrest’s bold character as well, such as:
          “I do what I like” (Ring a bell?)
          “My job is to defy the normal.”
          “My dream of happiness: …Looking out over nine miles of ocean, hearing some happy laughter near-by…”

          Errol was also an author, and wrote his autobiography (known to be a pretty decent and scandalous read):
          my Wicked, Wicked Ways (WWW)

          So what else is there about our Rogue Heroes?
          foRRest feNN
          eRRol flyNN
          wiLLiam kiDD

          Has Forrest taken on the exciting personas of his favorite rogue screen star and pirate, who also appealed to him because of their namesake dualities? After all, “All I have is my name.”

          No wonder he favors using two omegas instead of just one. The 24th letters (XX) mark the spot twice…

          I stayed at the Errol Flynn Suite at the famous El Rancho Hotel on Route 66 in Gallup, New Mexico, and my father was an actor during the same era as Errol Flynn (and was also Vincent Price’s roommate). Does that count?

          See ya at the movies. I give Forrest’s whisper quote two thumbs up.
          Hey, another double…


          • Good read and I bet most now will have forgotten their own good ideas and are scouring the waves for everything Errol. Happy hunting everyone !

          • This scrapbook is really making us all think.
            Looks like Map tried to whisper but Halogetter speaks to loudly.
            Halogetter- Interesting info. I do remember seeing some of it before from you…thanks. (XX…page 99 TTOTC)

            IMO- Forrest is now one of them (they)…for he is a good whisperer!

            I believe a whisper could also be considered a hint.
            Most on the blogs give great information but seem to also place subtle hints to draw out other post from searchers that may have the same thought process or just to make us think. Maybe he thinks someone is on the right track but they only write in whispers and the whole meaning is hard to put together.

            Logic…consistency, validity, completeness, and soundness.
            (I’m still working with numbers)

            He gave us a little more tall grass to work through.

            Back to focusing on the poem

          • Ronald Reagan also stayed in one of his hotels and the letters r and n are several times in his names as well. Santa Fe Trail here we come.

          • BuFFalo BiLL – MOO (My opinion only) it has nothing to do with double letters… but I do believe I have heard the whisper before and it whispers through all nine of the clues in the poem…

  2. Mr. Fenn I believe I know the location of the treasure. I would elaborate in private conversation if u were interested but i thought the safest thing to do would be just to surprise you.

  3. Logic and reasoning are the hallmarks of a astute student.
    Logic says this fits, reasoning says and this follows that.
    So goes puzzle solving.

  4. A curious statement indeed.

    Dal, do you know what prompted Forrest to write this, or was it altogether unsolicited?

  5. Is Forrest really asking if someone is doing this right now….or indicating that someone is?

  6. Dear f, Thanks for the chase.I’ve been searching for the treasure for 2 months at home. It has been fun without leaving Virginia.Believe me I want to go west. You have felt my logic whisper in the last few days. I am tuned like that ole 36 Chevy running 35 miles an hour. I’ve read TTOTC 3 times completely and spotty several times maybe more. It has been thrilling for me. I have thought I am in the right spot a few times and it goes wrong, this time I can not look anywhere else, this is it, the place you know. I hope maybe someday I will be able to get out there. Thanks again f f.

  7. You might want to type in whisper to search the blog. Read the post by anonymous. Has it been found by a kid? A kid who whispered to his mom “it’s coming right out of the rocks”. Hmmmmm

  8. here here, I side with you on that thought as well mr. ff.
    seems I am the only one on any blog that understands the source of the poem.
    you found the ash tree and with your poem, you have become a level 9 kenning writer and to think they say any thing above level 3 has been lost since the ancients.
    so my vacation starts in august, yes I know it is not the time of year your poem said it can be found, but I have other plans.
    enjoy, jml

  9. Forrest knows where I’m searching I feel that I have used my imigination, and knowledge, and logic . Only time will tell when I search again. I never change my location I’m stuck on one spot only

  10. Logic says it’s in a spot that is not accessible at the the moment…unless you put your nordic skis on…even then it is too cold in the wood, and the water is certainly high. IMO

  11. clearly we love to see our words in print and we try to get others to do the work for us or craftily get clues without leaving our living rooms. We all have spent way toooooo much time on the computer and should be taking kids out into the fields to look for arrow heads, listening to the winds, fishing in the streams, slowing down so animals cross the road, connecting with the past, buying a picture at the gallery, helping a child climb on a stature, having a good breakfast in a place that does not start with M, D or TB, and smelling the fresh air. When you need a good soak for your old bones, they can play and explore. If you don’t have kids, borrow some. Better yet fund a class field trip for some local kids for a day. They will see what your old eyes miss, they will play and tip and move things you wouldn’t even imagine. They will tell you when it is too far to walk, make you describe the difference between up and down the creek, and probably find the clue you missed. But don’t go alone, do as Mr. Fenn has done, encourage the village to rediscover the thrill of the chase.. you need kids to remember how to chase, to say the words cold, wood, home of Brown, blaze, down, to read a map, to tarry scant, and to discover what it means to reverently go in peace…

  12. Hi Forrest thanks for the Hints. I only hope that my secret is safe and I am on the right path. Happy Spring.

  13. Kind of like Aristotle…Architectural Logic?

    Mr. Fenn’s comments give hope to those of us that are certain we understand the poem and are only waiting on appropriate weather conditions for the recovery experience.

    I also cringe as well, as he often speaks valuable clues to those that do not yet understand.

    Makes me wonder how many of us will be on location at the same time, each watching and waiting on the other to leave so we can make the recovery unobserved.

    Hard enough to find out about the treasure during the winter and solve the poem, then wait for early summer to make the recovery, all the while wondering if someone will beat you there.

    Should be interesting to see…..


  14. Whispers are ignored. Somebody is saying the right things and people aren’t listening good. But who is the somebody? Even the somebody doesn’t know.

    • Cloud* Do you know where to start? “As I have gone alone in there, and with my treasures bold”. This is in the book. Look for it and you will know where to star. RC

        • I say that RC because you saying that directly to me made me think of something. I don’t know if it’s what you are referring to but it does affirm my starting point and I didn’t realize it. But I didn’t come to this starting point through the first stanza. But it does affirm it.

          • If that starting point is in the same state as I’ve figured based off that first stanza , I may see you both out there this summer. 🙂 Montana??

          • interestingly you can get Montana from the same source. But that is a weak connection. Again I have no idea if what I’m thinking is what RC was referring to. But alas, Mapsmith, I am NM through and through.

  15. Awesome it’s like he’s a Jedi master and we are the Padawan 🙂 I am taking this as IMO that maybe he’s reading the blogs and someone that might be posting but not all the time maybe are on some pretty good clues. It’s IMO and I possibly can’t imagine what Forrest is thinking.

    • My question and maybe it’s a error if Dal had to retype it but why did he only use one f ?

      • William-
        The one “f” is his. That was a copy and paste job. I did not retype it. He has talked about using one “f” vs two “f”s previously. He said he uses one because sometimes he is to tired to use two “f”s..
        I think he meant it as a joke but I think there may also be some truth to it…
        Let’s see what he uses next time..

        • he once sent me a note signed FF!!

          it wasn’t pleasant and rather threatening…a total misunderstanding and I hope he forgives me as it was before I regained my sanity in all of this.

      • William* How would you know if I were whispering to you in this blog? Only when you do not type back that’s when it is a whisper, agree?

        • I know it’s not me but thanks for the little confidence but I took what he said as a general statement and not really singling any one searcher out in general.

    • William* Do you know where to start? “As I have gone alone in there, and with my treasures bold”. This clue is in the book. Look for it. RC

    • William-

      I think Forrest might be saying that interpreting the poem requires both imagination and logic. I think he may be referencing some of the solutions people send him which are wonderfully imaginative but not so founded in logic. I don’t think he pays much attention to the blogs. But he does read email even if he doesn’t respond to it all the time. So I think he is trying to ground us a little bit by telling us that at least one of the clues is best figured out using logic rather than to much imagination. Of course this is all just my opinion and subject to counter-opinion from everyone 🙂

      • Thanks Dal I was trying to get a mind frame or grasp at straws to what he might be applying to be I believe we are on the same page.

  16. Forrest speaks again… most of us say ‘huh???’ and some of us say ‘that’s me!’.

    I suspect those saying the later should be saying the former.

    One more thing that Forrest has throw out that needs to be pondered; as if his poem wasn’t enough!


    • jcm-

      I concur.

      I am among the “huh?” group.

      DEEP thinking. Is deep a clue or just another adjective in the web of words???

      I could easily apply it to whispering while in a mineshaft that may run deep, but that seems too easy.

      So, I’ll just stay with the “HUH?”

  17. Thanks Forrest for adding more mystery to the screeching madness ! My physical quest is on hold until the throngs have subsided. The mental Chase lives on for me and has taken on a spiraling shape that grows smaller by the day. Thanks again for what you have done. It is a gift …that will last for quite some time.

    • I think that the clue is an elephant because if he was a teapot he would have the other arm elbow sticking out and his hand on his hip.

  18. Forrest,
    You whisper too lightly in your book, you may need to speak up. There are some hints and clue I may have figured out.

    * woodmen of the world tree stump grave marker – buried standing up, with you epitaph on it.

    • oh yea…

      maybe this is the blaze and we know it’s not in a graveyard because this is a clue you gave us.

      • I found the Woodsmen grave marker on a search and it sat next to an abandoned mine. It had a dove perched on one of the branches with some very enticing wording. Someone had placed coins all over the stump. I tried posting a picture of it on one of the blogs but never could figure it out.

      • “‘Oh! Be men, or be more than men. Be steady to your purposes and firm as a rock. This ice is not made of such stuff as your hearts may be; it is mutable and cannot withstand you if you say that it shall not. Do not return to your families with the stigma of disgrace marked on your brows. Return as heroes who have fought and conquered and who know not what it is to turn their backs on the foe.'”

        Mary Shelley

        • Wus up Doc! Bugs Bunny……………………. How are you doing on the other treasure search? Is he still going to go through with the hunt?

          • Treasures never die, they just fade into myths……..

            This is it Will the grand daddy of all treasure hunts……

            There’s more than just gold wealth and fame involved here, something “hidden” …………

          • Rick the trick is to have a blast doing it! I have been 100 miles on a snowmobile, chased by bears, Slide down a hill on my butt, took a rental car mudding that I wouldn’t do with my own truck and most important of all I can take the Rocky Mountains off my bucket list! 🙂

          • I also forgot that I have been 12500 feet in the mountains with my brother, Drink beer in the country at a strangers house that we ended up on his property following a creek, Used snow shoes which is funny cause i’m from Florida, Sat on a log with my lovely wife on a mountain over looking the most beautiful valley that will be a memory for a life time!

    • Voltaire…nice!

      Well, I hope then that ‘a select few’ delay & wait until august so I might grab it in July when I’m off the teaching schedule and doing summer break… 😉

  19. This is the first thing I thought of when reading Forrest latest comment. The Bible, instructs a person ,when meditating on God’s word to speak in an undertone, WHISPER ,speak to yourself as you reason on the matter at hand, to get the idea implanted in your brain so that you can keep it there and UNDERSTAND it’s true meaning. Along with Dal’s thoughts I believe that this is simply what Forrest is trying to tell us. It doesn’t matter if you believe in the Bible or not, the idea of whispering to yourself is a proven method of reasoning on a matter. Best wishes to all!!!

  20. None of us will ever accomplish anything excellent or commanding except when he listens to this whisper which is heard by him alone.

    Thomas Carlyle

    Some people will believe anything if you whisper it to them.

    Miguel de Unamuno

    A secret is not something unrevealed, but something told privately, in a whisper.

    Marcel Pagnol

  21. Ah, Forrest. Your secret April fishing hole is ScrapBook 61, and we all chased your lure. Some solid bites, but bet on the illusive native.

  22. Rick I agree. The worst part of it, if I am wrong..I am done. Time to move on with life. But I do believe it will be a dark horse that takes it. And for Christ sake…most religions got it wrong on every level…doubt he will clue himself in on this little endeavor in the scheme of things.

    • So Cognito……Where is the Home of Brown in the poem? 🙂 Please do share…..Thanks

      • Most new-age students believe the color indigo represents wisdom. I believe the color of wisdom is light itself comprised of the entire spectrum of colors at once…excluding none.

    • Cognito, did Forrest spray bear ‘must’ or pee around the treasure to keep animals away? as in piem line “that I must go” You said we could ask you anything.

  23. My father always told me to “walk/speak softly and carry a big stick.” He is half Algonquin indian.

    • 23kachinas,
      What tribe is your father. Algonquin is the language of many tribes.

      • My father only met his father once on a weekend he took him out to the woods since he was essentially a love child. His father’s last name was Hawk and from Ohio. Never met that side of the family.

        • 23 kachinas,
          Most likely your father was from the Shawnee Tribe they spoke Algonquin, although the language varied from region to region and there were other minor tribes in the area that is now Ohio the Shawnee was the major tribe. FYI the name Ohio comes from the Shawnee name for the river by that name along the state border . The word Ohio means in Algonquin “something wonderful” which to Native Americans the river would have meant life ,food supply etc… I have found an ancient Native American legend that calls the first man and woman of it’s creation stories the Brown people. Which I found interesting and I am sure Forrest would know about. They were legends of certain Tribes in the Rocky Mountain area! Interesting I think!
          Also I do believe the name Hawk is listed in Shawnee register of names.
          By the way my Grandmother belonged to the Choctaw nation and my Grandfather was Cherokee and my other Grandmother was part Shawnee. Hence the name Kanafire. It was the name of one of my ancestors from the 1700’s. He was Cherokee and his wife’s name was Sookie. Hope you solve the poem just not before me!!!

          • Kanafire, thank you for the info on Shawnee – I’ll talk to my father about it!

            I’m not actively looking at this time so good luck to you 🙂

            You have Chowtaw/Cherokee ancestors looking out for you which must be an edge!

    • Because you have to complete the poem three times every thing is threes it begins first with the environmentalists and how the big company’s a re ruining our water forest wants us to open our eyes to this if you have found what I have there is no water to be found Forrest means good and by the way I am on my third phases I also found the title but the title doesn’t mean I own the gold what it means is the title to the poem because how you know if you found the place where warm waters halt you wouldnt that’s why he put the title so you would if you where right

    • Eddie-
      Do you mean when did he post Scrapbook Sixty One…?
      He sent it to me to post…that’s why it’s in his scrapbook…
      His scrapbook is mostly material he wants to share with searchers…material he wrote and sent…

    • A whisper is smaller than a voice or is it cause I was standing on it and had to speak softer. Steph congrats on your up coming search and take pictures.

  24. First of all he told everybody to do there reserche first be fore going ing out there I made darn sure I was right before I wen t there it was in a public place before I was swarmed by to many nosie people I got it was what it was was a cement in pad with the wood frame still intact so when began to take away the wood out came the title that told me that’s warm waters halt so now I sta rt over you just had to have the guts to do it

    • dude, I’m usually cool with most ideas but seriously what the hell are you even talking about? This is what ff spent 15 years writing a poem for? Sorry…I mean your read the poem right?

      • Alright hank can you tell what his secret is there is more than one I’m not trying to be asmartass or nothing what I say are facts a s I know what is the secret to the whole poem its where warm waters halt

        • Uhh yeah cool then, I am not here to argue, but I am a realist I guess. Maybe I missed your point somewhere, no offense but your writing is a bit hard to understand…I just find it hard to believe this whole thing involves a cement slab and some wood frame you need to knock down – not ff’s style. I am not claiming to know anything – just another wayward searcher trying to stretch out the nugget. Good luck…uh with the knocking down wood frames and stuff…try not to get caught…hank.

      • And also hank is go to one of meetings where every public personhas a right to go and you willseehow these company lawyer s are running all over us I went and saw for my own eyes now they are planning on opening a new gold mine if the public dosentshow up they get there way and the creeks rivers lakes are going to get more e polluteed if we don’t show our stand and this is what Forrestwants us to see its more than the moneyits opening our eyes to what s happening one day we won’t even have a place to fish and warm waters halt in a catchment pond full of toxic

      • Listen to Fenn…ONLY FENN…not these Chicken in the Hen House Treasure Hunters. Some of these people will cheat you out of your mothers linens….so to speak.

  25. Cogs, I think I understand…sorta…kinda…what you are saying. Probably not the place for political rhetoric though, it’s about TTOTC. It doesn’t fall on deaf ears, there will always be environmental battles to be fought – I agree. I just don’t think that is ff’s agenda here. Maybe if more people get out in the woods, then yeah, maybe those people will also see a need to protect these wild places…and find some “treasures” out there. I’m not up for battling lawyers, but I have volunteered for years out west pulling miles of barbed wire fences from former grazing lands so antelope can have unrestricted access to the land – trying to do a little something. There will always be battles for the land and people who are just out to make a $/living off it (see this racist ignorant in NV right now) but let’s get back to the chase. If you want to have a dialogue on this topic elsewhere I would be more than happy to. Back to logic…where was I again…oh yeah, in the rocky mountains…somewhere.

    • who is the racist ignorant in NV that you mean

      and what did they do or say that makes them racist

      • It’s in the news…interpret it how you will…I will leave my political views off the blog…back to the chase

  26. Kids, Newbee’s…you rock it…your dealing with professional treasure hunters who will eek your ideas out of you for lack of better moments. Ask Dal, ask Fenn, Keep your ideas to yourselves.

    Cognito…I am pro FENN TREASURE

  27. “It seems logical to me that a deep thinking treasure searcher could use logic to determine an important clue to the location of the treasure. Is someone doing that now and I don’t know it?”

    Lean in so I can whisper F… The first clue is most easily solved by a person of age. Youngsters may never quite make the connection. And now you know your suspicion is correct.

    I hope to meet you soon!
    L. Mjolnir

  28. Must t not be that much of a pro I am the one who found the blaze I am the one who knows where his warm waters halt I am the one who knows where home of the brown is I am the one who found the title without the blaze you have no chance without my help I’ve been a hunter longer than you son so dont get mad at me for wanting to give some insight for you guys ask me a question and I will answer it excepet where the treasure is of coarse the reason I know these answers becaus e the blaze told me I just happened to be the one I’ve been on this hunt for three years got enough info to fill a truck bed any more bad responses ill quit and you’ll be hurting everyone who wants to know what I know and by the way Forrest knows who I am

      • Or, I should say what State you think it is in. Sorry…..Maybe you have something there, Cog..Adios!

      • Nm remberabout the ball of string he didn’t know what happened to it what he is hintingthere is he going to know what happens to his chest but believeme this has a lot more to do with than his treasure and his clues are in his books for example go in the thrill of chase book where he talks about when he watched his friend make a horse shoe and that startedthe whole thing you take it from there thanksfor being polite

        • Your welcome, Cognito; and thank you for being so open. If you want the treasure, I wouldn’t say much more on the blogs as to where you think it is. You may regret it later. Good luck in your search, Cog……..Adios!

  29. Too Far To Walk-
    Tales about a lifetime of living near the edge are related on these pages, and are presented with plainspoken words that don’t need underlining. From being shot down in Laos to meeting a prehistoric family, it’s all here in untainted color. Forrest admits to making his share of mistakes but whispers that, even at age 83, none have weakened his ardor for the chase. 278 pages 136 photos 76 drawings 1 treasure map

    • First of all to far to walk works in three phases your first destination too far to walk then it goes to not far then it goes to walk that’s another reason I’m telling you the poem goes three phases

      • As I have gone alone in there meanslbrary with my treasure bold meansbold letters in each chapter and also small bold letters in each paragraph so you take the first bold letters and in the first chapter and they spell this .over every rainbow your at is filled with tresure.then you take the small capital lettersand what those spell I won’t tell you

        • On the other hand, You do have a creative mind. I like your thoughts on this. I have looked at this formula over a year ago. Good idea,…Just kidding about the Drinky……..Wink Wink..

        • Cog, I’d dearly like to understand your thoughts here, but I guess I’m not quite sharp enough to be following. Are you talking about the intialis / Initial that starts most chapters (the big letter that takes up several lines)? Those seem to spell:
          TAWINMLIMLOIIMOMOASWTWBSOWTIAICNA. (counting the T&A from the dust jacket) – which, even if I really really stretch, doesn’t seem to give anything about rainbows nor treasure nor any truly useful anagrams*.

          the first literally boldfaced letters in the text of TTOTC seem to be the red ‘Do Not Touch’ on both pages 109 & 111. and then “Cancer is a terrible word.” on page 141. That’s it.

          *However, if you exclude several letters, you COULD anagram some fun words from the remainders, like:
          –Batman Station
          –Coastal Towns in Malta
          –Combat Mission
          –Anti-Socialist Law 😉

    • Wow. Spring is here, and unfortunately the squirrels didn’t gather all the nuts. I like f’s thoughts on the whisper. Maybe it’s best to be incognito!!

      • You don’t even what he meansabout spring may one day I’ll tell depends on how you act now go get some nuts

        • To quote a philosophical Diggin Gypsy, “then go get it” Happy hunting….

        • Cog I know a answer to a question many have posed. I tried to contact you directly and failed.
          in order to see if you had the same answer.
          I will not pose the question here. If by chance I find a way to contact you I will pose the question and at which time you give an answer I will know if you are onto something with your 3 phase research.

    • Cognito i know exactly what your talking about. It also has another hidden message in it which i think describes a very important place.

  30. hes basically saying that all the solutions on the blogs is incorrect and the whisper is people telling him the correct answers. It’s what the people on the blogs are saying to him but not on the blogs for everyone else to hear. 🙂

  31. “How do you like to travel?
    I’ve always been independent and somewhat impulsive, and I like to do things without a goal or strategy. There’s a freedom in not making decisions until the last minute. My best hours have been flying at 500 feet, looking for Indian ruins or following a river through a winding canyon, not knowing or caring where I might spend the night—even sleeping on a riverbank if there’s no motel. My wife cringes when I tell her these things, because she thinks roughing it means no room service. But she’s always allowed me to just go do it. How can life get better than that?”
    -Margie Goldsmith, Robb Report

  32. Or walking from Cleveland to Chicago 343 miles in 13 days because your just plain bored and you don’t need a fancy plane………

    “The adventurer is the great outsider” Unknown

  33. My hope is that I am the (or one of the) “deep thinking treasure searchers” Forrest is referring to. I have searched endlessly for any indication that anyone else has figured out one of the clues that I have solved and nobody has. My findings have to be right, no question….. At this point I am more interested in solving the puzzle than anything!

      • Hello grubbder…..yes, I have and feel I’m just missing one small part of the puzzle. My last trip was especially interesting as I had the opportunity of meeting Forrest. Right out of a storybook…..what a nice guy!

  34. Even the slightest whisper will echo in the canyon. Logic is always good, but gut instinct has never failed me.

  35. One thought I get from the last part of the statement about – it is not what they say on the blogs that is significant, but what they whisper – is that whoever this/these deep thinkers are, they are not shouting at the top of their lungs and proclaiming how they are the ones who have figured it all out. When one has confidence, they don’t feel the need to justify, prove, and proclaim just how correct they are, they are like a deep, quiet, smooth flowing river attracting little attention compared to those people who are like the roaring rapids of the shallow and fast moving river who continually seek ego justification and attention from others due to their own insecurities and lack of confidence.

    So perhaps we can pretty easily figure out who we don’t need to worry about finding the chest. 😉

    • BW…and, the plinth of the poem, could be the first stanza, giving hints as to what to research logically. The “begin…” would be the actual start!
      Uh oh, BW is the “Poem whisperer”!

  36. Cloudclover1 * The clue where to start is in the book. It is also in the poem. You will have no doubt as to “where warm waters halt” is. Read the book carefully,line by line, you will come across it. just be patient with you reading. Read 1 page everyday and study it until you come across it. “As I have gone alone in there, and with my treasures bold”.

  37. RC, ff says if you figure out wwwh, then you can figure out the poem… You appear to be shouting this message repeatedly. I’m looking forward to reading about your treasure chest recovery story!
    The beginning of the clues, all 9 of them is “Begin it where…”. FF has said this time and time again.
    In every poem, there are three main parts, introduction, main body and summary. The first stanza should not be ignored, I agree, it sets the tone for the adventure, stating purpose. He alone, hid a ostentacious treasure in his private hiding place that project historical nuances.
    Seaching thru TOTC, there are several locations that he went into alone. A waterfall, canyon, fav fishing spot, under a wagon, in a jet, in the jungle, a ten mile hike on a river, in his vehicle to hide bells in the desert, in a shower…
    So, IMO, that describes the final resting spot of the treasure.
    WWWH is a logical culination of numerous hints throughout the poem, and yes, that includes the first stanza. It sets the tone or train of thought.
    Stepping off the soap box. I’ve let off my steam and will close the drapes to the yellow sunshine, light a candle and take a nap in my hobbit hole. ¥Peace¥

    • Donna* My comment was toward Cloudcover when I want your attention you’ll know. Thank you! RC

      • Come on RC…public blog, public response. If you want to have a private conversation on a public site, give your email to them. Please re-read my comment! I agreed with you. I stated why the first stanza WAS important! Sorry you didn’t catch that! Hopefully you won’t catch the other clues and I beat you there! Peace dude!

        • Donna were you referring to clues in your comment? If so, I think I caught a couple…

          • Hank, very observant! You listened as well as heard! That was a “whisper”!!!

          • Hank, I know a few people who are studying my area! I put 2 + 2 together from the poem & TOTC, then used google and a topo map to confirm. Just listened to Mr. F’s “whispers” ! I may be wrong, but atleast will enjoy a good bath if I am!
            Good luck! ¥Peace¥

  38. Everyone is getting anxious to get out on the hunt. Soon it will be a race to the finish and I think this will be the year the treasure will be found. Good Luck to all!

  39. True CJ. Its pouring cats and dogs now and snow on the mountains. Cold.
    * I have this feeling that Forrest wants to say alot more. And figured a way to
    get the most out of this one statement-clue. I think it must be very hard for
    him not to say so much more. I think he gets alot of mail, but not from me. I
    know some people have emailed him so much, he has ask them to stop.
    Poor Forrest, he has to read all this crazy stuff. And not say anything much.

    • I agree Lou Lee. I seldom send and email to f, probably only 3-4 in the last 2 years. Poor Dal gets more mail from – Sorry Dal. 🙂

      Forrest probably wants this over with sooner rather than later so that he can get his life back too!

    • I would not say” poor Forrest”. I think if he chooses to read any of this, it is most likely a source of entertainment along w/ some really good belly laughs. IMO…

    • See…..I just had this feeling forrest wanted to say more. …And I was right. He did and quick. Its gona be a great
      Hunt! What will he say next?

      • Yes, Lou Lee, I think these latest Scrapbooks show that f may be ready for the treasure to be found. The hunt has been going on for a long time and although at one time he said he didn’t care if the treasure wasn’t found for 100 or 1000 years, or longer, I’m not sure he realized how demanding publicity, emails, book signings, etc. would be on his time and energy. It will certainly free up my time too when it’s over! 🙂

  40. “poor forrest” I say to kid…..I am sure lots of laughs too. And a few, Oh Brothers!

  41. RC,

    Thank you for the ” I have gone alone in there” clue in the book. Perhaps it is correct or perhaps not. My experience is that every search I have made matched with something, someone, or someplace in the book…yet still no joy!

    But here is something for everyone to ponder as a suggestion.

    ff states …it’s not what “they” say on the blogs that may be significant, but what “they” whisper.

    what if…

    “they” and “they” refer to different “they’s”? This ties in nicely with what RC’s comments have led me to.

    But then, ff states “may” be significant. I read this to mean that what “they” state on the blog is somewhat insignificant, but what “they” whisper IS SIGNIFICANT.

    Based on this. Does anyone have the same idea of what “whisper” may refer to as me? Not saying it is right. But I think “whisper” may be closely related to “brave”.

    If you want what my current thinking is on what “whisper” might refer to, I will provide, but keep in mind my batting average is the same as everyone else’s –.000

    • Windsurfer, ok, I’ll ask…what do you think ” whisper” refers to? And how is it related to brave? Great insight, by the way! ¥Peace¥

    • Has anyone used the phrase whisper in an email to F? I did about a year ago ‘You’ve got to listen when he whispers’. Do many people use the word whisper in their emails to f/

      • No I scream cause he is a lil deaf !!!!!!!!! He can’t hear you whisper tom .

          • Don’t make me kick your a$&&@@& Tennessee I’m
            Only loud on the weekend

          • I could hear you all the way here at The Land Between the Lakes . Must be the weekend

          • We’ll you know how us southern girls are On weekends tailgates down and let’s get this party started

        • fellow searchers….. I see there is a recent comment from another Tom and I really don’t want my words or another persons words to be confused. I am the Tom that has been communicating with you all (my poem “COFFEE WITH FORREST). I will now be using the name Tom H for further blog dialogue. Thanks!

  42. this is the best i can come up with after some thought on his comments

    if hes saying ….. its possible to think deeply and determine an important clue, and wondering if anyone is doing it, and saying its not what they say on the blogs thats significant…..

    the inference i would take from that is that in what Forrest is reading on the blogs, no one seems to be determining an important clue. there hasn’t been any discussion of significant clues on the blogs.

    he asks, is someone doing that and I don’t know? its not what they say, it’s what they whisper. i think f is trying to genuinely communicate that if someone is, he doesn’t know. and so its not what they are saying, its what they are not saying.

    so i don’t think the whisper is referring to someone emailing him, because if they were, then he would know, and i am concluding that the ? F is asking here, is asking because he’s saying, is someone doing it, because i don’t know.

    • Chris I read a lot of your post and I find them useful but ask yourself why would Forrest even make that statement if he wasn’t sure. If that was the case it would be like this ( “It seems logical to me that a deep thinking treasure searcher could use logic to determine an important clue to the location of the treasure. It’s not what they say on the blogs that may be significant, it’s what they whisper. f” )

      • well my mind has gone 10 different directions on what f might mean or reason for saying

        if you figure out what it means William, dont whisper it, shout it out so i can hear

        • Chris, I tend to agree with your interpretation of Mr. Fenns statement. I think he is saying that if someone has the solve of a major clue that they haven’t been sharing it on the blogs and the whisper statement is a take off of the Errol Flynn quote that goes something like ” Its not what they say about you that matters its what they say in a whisper”. That’s a really rough quote so please don’t whip me for being inaccurate. I think some others have already made the connection to Errol Flynn’s quote but I don’t think that it would be fruitful to now direct attention to him rather than to Forrest (and his interests) and with his poem. All of this is said with the understanding that I too am not holding the treasure although it keeps beaconing me like a lighthouse in a storm. I’ve been waiting a year to check out my spot! Hopefully this spring I will (get and/or make) the chance.

  43. Good advice I have been stuck on the whisper comment not really sure what it means just yet

  44. And keep my secret where… Normally u whisper secrets I’m still thinking on this

  45. for real ole coot are you trying to
    Make us all lose our minds What the heck are you talking about !!!!!

  46. IMO…Smart searchers will only hint/whisper their conclusions, if they say anything at all. THEY are the ones confidant. They don’t need to toot their horns. The quiet ones are the most dangerous, silent but deadly. (Sorry-lol) You get the idea.
    Just remember, FF’s two loves…rivers and pueblos.

  47. “Is someone doing that now and I dont’ know it”…….I think Forrest is asking that question from the readers perspective.

    • Good call, Tom.

      And perhaps Forrest is the whisperer. He often bends perspective in his writing.


  48. His statement reminds me…..of the new add….You don’t need a hotel room…till you KNOW you need a hotel room…….LOL LOL

  49. To whom it may concern,
    Here’s a tid bit of information that I,ll say out loud. A lot of the discussions (IMHO) seem to get way off topic. And here is the tid bit to think about, that you may already know, but I will put it out there anyway. It may help someone! Some of the ancient Native American cultures had a legend of creation that says when the Great Creator or Spirit made the first of the ( Brown ) people , note the legend specifically says”Brown” referring to their tribe ,(not my words but how the story is told ).This story of course was passed down by word of mouth to each generation and this is the part of the legend or story that I thought some might find interesting. And I do believe can be tied into history and the poem without going TO or BELOW any reservations. Maybe this can start a serious discussion about research instead of who knows where it,s at. I hope this is not offensive to anyone,it is not my intent to start an argument or offend. One reason I put this out ther is maybe it will help someone in their search. And if you think revealing this information is unwise. Look at it from my prospective which is I DO NOT need the money at all. And if I should find the treasure, it will all go to charity except Forrest bracelet and maybe a trinket to keep as a sovenior . Best wishes to all hunters. And remember the thrill is in the chase,not the find. That will only be momentary. We have here an opportunity to make new friends and have some fun in the process.Thanks to Forrest Fenn!!!

    • Kanafire what makes you think people arent researching that? Maybe we just arent spreading it around. Never under estimate other searchers. 🙂

      • Deb,
        I hope you were not offended in any way by my comment. I realize that people are researching many subjects. All I was doing was trying to throw out a subject for conversation and research to anyone that had not heard of that. I am not concerned with finding the treasure other than enjoying the ride and solving the puzzle. And I realize you do not know me, but I never underestimate anyone. I’m not looking at this as a competition because as I stated before I do not need the money. Like Forrest I have made my way in life and made a lot of money in the process. One way I did this was by running across a legend/story that in this case turned out to be true and there was definitely a pot of gold at the end of that rainbow. I don’t think I’m any smarter than the next person.It’s just that when I came across said story for some reasonI knew the answer. Thanks for your input and best wishes in the hunt.

        • Kanafire thank you for your insight. Although I have no claim to fame or money I love treasure hunting. Yes it is the thrill of the chase that appeals to me. Nothing compares to having an adventure.

          So to all I say go forth and find your adventure.

  50. Whisper-whisper… ever play telephone?
    Anyhow, I have a question about the Scrapbooks … Who creates/chooses the opening item? Dal or FF? What determines when & why one scrapbook closes and another one opens… and more importantly (to me) on what dates were scrapbooks 60 and 61 first released? I ask, because “whisper” now seems to be a point of discussion in this scrapbook, and I don’t recall much prior discussion about it or about “Listen Good”. I may have missed it. I do not follow the blogs as closely as some. I do think “Listen Good” comes pretty close to being a real clue, and recently I submitted a comment about it on THE BOOK thread. But even more recently my little mouse ears picked up some sonar blips on an industry-v-environment document that convinces me with 96% certainty on NM. I used to be 50/50 MT/NM. Perhaps if I had a keel like my Indiana cousin, I wouldn’t need that margin of error! But I digress… about the scrapbooks— the two opening dates please. Thanks in advance.

    • Old Shadows-
      You can see the date each scrapbook (or any other post on this blog) was created by looking at the URL. In the address bar at the top you will see a date..that date is the date it first appeared.

      I don’t understand your question about “who chooses/creates the opening item?” I don’t know what you mean by “opening item?”

      • Ohhhh…After pondering what you said Old Shadows I think I know what you mean by “opening item”..
        So…when you click on the orange title “Forrest’s Scrapbook” on the right hand side of the page at the top…it opens up to the last 5 or 6 scrapbook posts. The one at the top is the very latest…I think that’s what you likely mean by “opening item”.
        So all the scrapbook posts are sent by Forrest..(maybe one or two were not but I said that on the post).Forrest sends them to me in email and I post them on the blog. The Scrapbook was created as a place for Forrest to share his thoughts with us in a more searchable and easy to locate fashion than a comment which can get lost among the tens of thousands of comments that are here…Does that make sense?
        You may not have noticed..but the Scrapbook posts…or pages are all numbered. When you first open up the scrapbook it displays only the first few. If you scroll down to the bottom there is a button that you can click on to see the next oldest set. Eventually you can go all the way back to scrapbook page number one…BUT if you read them that way you will not see the comments. You can only read the comments on a scrapbook page if you open up that page all by itself. To do that you just click on the page’s title when a group of them are displayed..For instance…if you click on the title Scrapbook Fifty Nine… you will open up just that scrapbook page and all the comments will be displayed below it…

        Hope this helps..

        • Got it… thanks Dal. What I meant by the opening item was the actual “post” at the top of each scrapbook. I thought I had read some that were not by FF and assumed they were mostly yours or submissions by others, and some were by FF. But all your effort clarifed what I needed to know. So thanks again.

  51. I tend to follow the blogs, rather than comment too often. I do this, only because IMO, I feel I have the poem solved. Whether it is the correct solution or not, going there and picking up the chest is the only answer to my quest.

    I will say this though, in the past few months a couple of people have made comments that pretty much put me on notice. I can’t say who they are, but I will say that they have come very close to being very “logical” in their thoughts. Working with computers since 1972, I spent most of my work experience in thinking logically. So after trying the “literal” method in my first search (which didn’t pan out very well), I took a more logical approach. So, to me, Fenn’s comment makes perfect sense. To coin a phrase, “Don’t throw logic to the wind”. 🙂

  52. Of course the correct coordinates will take you right to the treasure. Forrest forgot to mention that.

    • i remember long time back when f said something like, if you had its coordinates you would be able to find the treasure

      i noticed that he didnt say, you would find it, but that you would be able to

      • Right. They (Coordsinates) could be for the starting place WWWH they could be for the area. Could be for the 15 sq miles to search. Do we really think Forrest would pinpoint the exact location on the ground? Maybe… Maybe not!

        • Sunny…Forrest was making a joke when he said “Of course, if you had the coordinates you could walk right to it.”
          I have no idea when he said that…maybe a year ago??
          We bring it up from time to time. But it’s of no value. He didn’t actually give coordinates nor did he hint that any were hidden anywhere…

  53. Kanafire, the Zuni indians make a yearly trek on foot to a salt lake south of Albuqurque [sp?], the birth place of their origin. Would make a great location to hide the treasure, but it is south of Santa Fe! I know a lot about the Native Americans, my hubby is Choctaw/Cherokee. If I don’t know, I will sure ask! Mr F knows this! Thanks for your comments! ¥Peace¥

    • Donna,
      So very cool!!! about your husband’s ancestors. One reason I say that is my grandmother was Choctaw and my grandfather was Cherokee and my other grandmother Shawnee. Thanks for the information on the yearly trek. The one thing I thought of concerning the Brown people legend was the tragedy that took place in Yellowstone during the Indian wars. But,I don,t think Forrest would use a tragedy like that as part of the solve to the poem. Of course, it is just a part of history now. Thanks again!!! and best wishes in the search!!!

      • Donna,
        I thought I had better correct one comment that I had made above. I called it the “Brown people legend” ,but instead it was part of an ancient legend about how man was created by the Great Spirit. I think that it would be awesome if you were to ask Forrest about the legend!

        • Kanafire, each tribe has it’s own creation story, so dont know which tribe or pueblo people you are referring to. They (stories) are as intricately beautiful as the most lovingly made moccassin or pottery jar. From turtles, dragonflies, coyotes to mythical giant beings, they all depict the beginning of a people. Its fun to see the difference in the stories with the geographical areas. Love your input and appreciate a kindred spirit! Thanks! ¥Peace¥

  54. Dal, if you would kindly
    answer, did Mr.Fenn include the picture along with this?

    • That photo is one that I took of him. When he sent the comment for his scrapbook I asked if I could add that photo. He said yes.There are no clues from Forrest in that photo.

        • Hey….don’t feel funny…..I blew the picture up myself. No under estimating here at all.

          • Hey thank you Tom..Nice to know it’s not just me, someone needs to repair the chipped tile by the fireplace 😉

  55. OK, I’m going on record here to say that I went and searched, but did not find the treasure. However, after coming home and re-reading over the poem, then all the blogs and hints from Forrest, I am more confident than ever of the treasure’s general location, so will go back one LAST TIME to prove myself wrong. LOL. As an engineer, I may have to face the fact of not being able to solve this poem, and I don’t like that. But I have met a lot of nice people and seen a lot of neat places in NM while searching, things I’ll write about in my next book.

  56. OK Donna,

    Here was my thought on “whisper” and the possibility that what “they” say on the blog and what “they whisper” might refer to two different things.

    First – what “they” say on the blog should refer to all of us.

    But second – what “they” whisper might refer to the following.

    To find the treasure you must be “brave and in the wood” Aspen trees are also known as “quaking” aspens, “trembling” aspens, and yes…”whispering” aspens.

    If one is standing in the midst of “trembling” or “quaking” aspens, you might best be “brave” and stand still so a to hear them “whisper”!

    Plenty of aspens here in Colorado. Here is also another out of the box thought that RC led me to regarding “I have gone alone” in there.

    In the book, ff states ” I was all alone” during one of his plane trips. Could be that he went alone in there refers to his plane and with his treasures bold could mean the chest was on the seat beside him?

    Warm waters could mean the clouds as some have suggested. Take it in the canyon down could mean prepare to land. Put in below the home of Brown could be an airport landing strip in the mountains below the home of Brown.

    Anyway. Just some different thoughts on the matter, but I have indeed found a very special place that fits this scenario. Whether it is special to ff, I have not idea.

  57. Just a general comment……Bravo to Dal for creating and maintaining a “one stop” site for the searchers and those who might be considering joining the band!…..simply outstanding!

  58. So i am heading to my final spot soon. It looks promising but well see. I will say this, if i do not find it on this last trip i sure hope someone does find it this summer. I am soooo ready for this to come to an end.

    • Ditto and AMEN to that, brother!!

      It’s like trying to find the last chapter in a book. We keep adding chapters, which is wonderful, but where in the heck is that last chapter. Will we ever know who dunnit !?!?

  59. I wasn’t serious about packing. Jeff needs to get some tests done, before we an make any plans.


      “Logic is often divided into three parts: inductive reasoning, abductive reasoning, and deductive reasoning.”



      trea c
      1.three; the digit “3”
      2.third-grader; pupil in the third year of school
      3.a class of third-graders
      4.(uncountable, mainly used in the definite) the third year in school, or the third year in gymnasiet De barnen går i trean. Those children are in third grade.
      5.(uncountable, mainly used in the definite) third gear
      6.a person who finish a competition as number three

      *** apartment with one kitchen and three rooms^^^

      Here The Trea Sure Lies

      “Situated across the courtyard from the main house, the guest house was originally the housekeepers’ quarters of Casa del Gavilan. While the guest house does not have the “vigas” contained in the remainder of the Casa, it offers more privacy and room for a family to spread out without being too far apart. Numerous windows make the guest house the brightest of all our guest rooms. The two rooms of this suite adjoin through a shared bath with a shower”

      2 bedrooms and a bath makes 3

      And for those who have been there knows a kitchen is also part of the guest house addition.

      Just Saying !

      • OK enough teasing !

        Here The Trea Sure Lies

        Here the Uncountable Sure Lies

        Uncountable possible places the Box is Stashed.

  60. dal, Can you be so kind as to tell us when exactly date and time forrest sent this scrapbook to your email?

  61. As I reread this from statement from Mr. Fenn, I can only think shhhhhhhh. Anyone else?

  62. Errol Flynn “… it’s what they whisper” quote is another reference to La Buse, whom Flynn played as Captain Blood.

    It seems to me all of this hinting is trying to lead us to thinking about La Buse, and everything that was (correctly or incorrectly) attributed to him, including the later fake cipher that included references to Edgar Allen Poe.

  63. A few comments for everyone regarding this famous quote by Forrest:

    “It seems logical to me that a deep thinking treasure searcher could use logic to determine an important clue to the location of the treasure. Is someone doing that now and I don’t know it?”

    So what I see in this statement is two parts;
    1) A deep thinking searcher (some one listening the right way to interpret the poem’s clues)
    2) Doing that NOW and I don’t know it? (Stanza #5 of the poem)

    – We know the poem contains 9 clues
    – We also know they start at BIWWWH or WWWH (Line #5)
    – We also know that 3 or 4 are in Stanza #2, a couple in Stanza #3
    – We also know that the remaining 3-5 clues are in the remaining Stanza’s
    – We know that Stanza #5 contains the only Question in the Poem
    – The Answers referred to in:
    “So why is it”
    “The answers I already know?”
    “And NOW I’m weak.”

    OK – the poem refers several times to both Forrest and the Searcher.

    Forrest refers to himself in the poem as: I, Me & My
    Forrest refers to the searcher as: You & Your

    This famous quote refers to both Forrest and the Searcher in exactly the same way except instead of “if you’ve been wise” it’s if you’ve been deep thinking…

    And instead of Forrest “Already… knowing” he is NOW referring to what we the searchers might be discovering (what WE might know about the poem’s clues).

    If this is the case then its possible that Forrest is HINTING that the “Important Clue” or “Hint” is contained in Stanza #5…


  64. This is probably one of the top 10 Scrapbooks that are most important in the chase for the finning solve!

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