Scrapbook Sixty Two…

scrapbook

 

APRIL 2014

Some searchers overrate the complexity of the search. Knowing about head pressures, foot pounds, acre feet, bible verses, Latin, cubic inches, icons, fonts, charts, graphs, formulas, curved lines, magnetic variation, codes, depth meters, riddles, drones or ciphers, will not assist anyone to the treasure location, although those things have been offered as positive solutions. Excellent research materials are TTOTC, Google Earth, and/or a good map.f

570 thoughts on “Scrapbook Sixty Two…

    • Just because Fenn posted a short list of exclusionary info for searchers…that doesn’t mean he was creating a loophole scenario. I believe this SB was a general blanket statement to reel folks back in from the wildly extravagant and complex “solves” that were all the rage at this time.
      Fenn’s other comment about the unemployed redneck is another good gut check statement that should keep folks from straying too far into the abyss. I think this statement embodies the overall context of the Chase…open to everyone from every avenue of life who has some adventure in their veins…and some common sense in their cranium.
      Folks were close to the treasure early on by just throwing darts at places where warm waters halt….I think they just went the wrong way at that point…those silly first two clues…and which way to go…

  1. It is starting to sound like Mr. Fenn is wanting the treasure to be found this year. He is being very active with the hints.

  2. You mean to tell me the worrying about it and the head pressure that’s turning my hair white the foot pounds I’m packing around on my ache feet believing in god knowing a little spanish that there’s 1728 inches in a cubic ft. the double omega icon the fonts i read the charts on averages of lost treasures graphs and formulas treasure hunters use the curves of a good looking partner the magnetic attraction variation codes of ethics the depth icon on my metal detector the poem that is the riddle. The spy camera on my drone or the cipher of the words in the poem aren’t doing me any good in finding the location of the treasure. WELL SHUCKS IT’S NO WONDER I CANT FIND IT LOL Thanks Forest You just popped my bubble Got to Love it and You

  3. Apr 26, 2014

    Mr Fenn

    Thank you so much for TTOTC.
    The poem is all I needed, to go on my first search. I have not changed
    my search area, but now know I took a wrong turn out on the trail.
    I have learned so much. The poem certainly is about you. But it is also
    about geography, geology, ecology, riparian corridors, chemistry, habitat.
    glacial activity and footprints, rivulets, 10,000 years and more, much more.
    Whew.
    Tired just thinking about all the research I had to do.
    Then I had one last question to answer. Why can Mr Fenn say “ it’s a very
    special place to me, a very dear place to me, I always knew where I would
    hide the chest.” Well I do more research, and now I know, I know why you
    can say that. I know why none of us can.
    I’ll be back.

    Thank you for your service

    OldGuyFromMaine

  4. Well that clears up a few things. Google Maps is going to see a spike in visits and TTOTC is going to see another spike in sales! 🙂

    I got a feeling a lot of people are going to feel like they have wasted a lot of time; or they will just choose to continue to ignore what Forrest has been saying all along.

  5. I believe that is the second best clue yet, thanks Mr. Fenn! 🙂

    Perhaps now we will have fewer and more meaningful blogs to follow. (the whispers) 🙂

  6. Anyone interested in a slightly used collection of mysticism and alchemy reference books please contact me…
    Same goes for my “History of the Roman Empire” tome and “Think Like a Poet” guide.

  7. Dal,
    I completely agree. I try to always remember f’s advice to not over think it. I live in Taos, NM (also very close to my so-called “solution”). Huntin’ weather is good now everywhere, that is unless you go to the top of a mountain. But Forrest has told us it is not on top of a mountain, right. Wish I could post pics here so I could show you my awesome blaze.
    This is my third year hunting and hopefully I have gained some valuable insights.
    I would caution any first timer to not get very excited if you think you have figured
    out where the box is on your first try. This has been the actual experience of tens of thousands of actual searchers to date. Believe me, some of the best minds in the business have been stumped by Forrest’s charming poem, Good luck!
    Phil “Doc” Mason

  8. Mr. fenn your a mess I hope I don’t need to think my location over again. I have done lots of my own research and thoughts on this. I was wondering if I was the Whisperer on the blog !!!!!!!
    Lol

  9. Wow that’s a Heavy Load of a clue !!
    So the fact that cog’s Initialis letters also anagram together to spell “Coloma Montana” (a great old ghost town AND a gold mining site) has no chance huh? That’s a shame. 😉 it almost had my vote for ‘riches old & new’. This also means the 66,000 engineer links are out. Sadly , it sounds like the elimination acrostic in your poem is out too – that one actually hurts, since it kills 2 lovely viable sites that I was looking forward to revisiting (firehole lake and the glacial boulder near lower falls). I suppose in July I’ll just swing by again for the heck of it then 😀

    Well then, back to ” all you need is the poem “. ..and the book. (..and now I’ll have to download google earth.) Thank you sir.

    Down to 8 solves, ..keep em coming. 🙂
    Map

  10. Thank you Mr. Fenn! I appreciate the wonderful chase you have created and am reassured to be reminded that “simplicity is the keynote of all true elegance”. Sometimes a single book, a history of ones mans life well lived, a solitary act of generosity, can have a surprisingly and profoundly powerful impact on the spirit and heart of countless people. Its all quite extraordinary and I’m so grateful to be able to participate in it. You are a unique individual with a deep and loving soul whose light has helped me to restore the wonder and draw of “the woods” that I regret may have faded over the years. With much gratitude–I thank you.

  11. I believe that Forrest is “whispering ” to us. His comment seems to be reinforcing the idea that people should be focusing on a “logical” solution.

  12. Now I can’t help but wonder what WOULD help a searcher beyond what Forrest just mentioned. History? Lore? Local knowledge?

  13. Well Mr. Fenn I have to respectfully disagree about the usefulness of the listed subjects to assist me in my search.
    As I have been one to appear to overate the complexity of the search. I can say that I have used most of the items listed above to assist me in my solutions and they have helped….For I now know many locations in which the chest CANNOT be after a much deeper examination of those thought processes.

    If I post a list of all my other silly ideas… can you filter through them when you get a chance?

    I must say that all my research has educated me.

    I once read in a wise mans book.… “No time spent in thought is wasted and nothing is too small to know, so one should not let knowing a little bit be a substitute for learning more.”(TTOTC page 147) Great advice.

    I actually got to the point of thinking silva (silver) was Latin for wood.

    I am still going to my spot. I guess I will only count the days now.

    Its a cold, rainy day. Maybe I’ll build a fire and think a little more.

    Thank you for The Thrill of the Chase.

    • Did some thinking and still have a question.

      Is a metaphor a type of riddle? (I really don’t know)

      Was scrapbook sixty one a literal thought that we need not decipher?

      He did write “will not assist you to the treasure location.” Maybe there are many metaphors or riddles but they will not lead us to the treasure.
      Here are some of my thoughts:

      – He writes about tall grass several times (also see Catcher in the Rye)…I always had a feeling he was referring to traveling into the unknown or unfamiliar territory.

      – Brown Gravy references might mean… think about removing the clutter to see more clearly.

      – Jar of olives reference might mean… a tight clenched fist.

      – Open window references might mean… think clearly and keep your mind open.

      – Green/End of Rainbow/butterfly reference might mean… rebirth or new beginnings.

      I apologize if he really did have a ball of string that couldn’t fit out the door. I gave my thought on that on an earlier post.

      I also think a drawing or painting depicted in the book might contain a visual clue. Would this be a type of visual riddle which needs to be solved? (Do I forget this thought?)

      I do not think any of the above will lead to the treasure (maybe one item) but does anyone have any contradictions to offer?

      I thought the poem was in itself a type of riddle… but guess I will not find out till it is solved.

      If the chest is found this year, I would really like to see another version of TTOTC with no metaphors or hidden meanings just to see how far off I am.

      Also, there has been much discussion regarding clues verses hints. “There are also other subtle clues sprinkled in the stories.” (TTOTC page 133). I’m sticking with what’s only written in the book for now on.

      Travel Safe

      • I like your rainbow idea. I think that it can relate to the science comment he made in the past. There is a scientist who dealt with rainbows. I think that was his logic comment and also his wise comment. There is a place for this scientist that can make sense and he makes a reference to a fruit in TTOTC that will also tell you. If I were to go to the white light, I’d want to know how to get there by way of a rainbow. Rainbow is the one word he uses in his “directions” that I believe is the key word.

        • Yes! rainbows are a huge clue sprinkled in the book. IMO
          There is a town feature and a natural feature both named after an ancient rainbow subject, one in MT and the other in WY, and — as it happens one was very specifically named after the other. Both are near subjects/features/items named after waterfalls as well, and if you get boots on the ground and out in nature, you find that falls are an awfully reliable place to find those otherwise rare elusive rainbows. I’d be surprised if the TC is to be found in town, but then again, it might be just the kind of twist FF would use. 😉 He’s already been successful getting us into nature!

  14. Ah Mr. Fenn, you know I was just kidding about that drone solution. I was only serious about it maybe only a month…..maybe, only. I was giggling when I saw that you included drones on your list of things that won’t get you to the treasure. But you didn’t include history, yipee!!

  15. Hi Forrest. Thanks You so much for saying that. I really believed that all that copy and paste stuff on the blogs about Greek Gods and Movies, would never help anyone find the treasure. Eyes rolling……..All the Smarty Pants out there. Trying to prove it, confusing things. I will go back to my peom and maps and go up the creek, from the warm water and find my treasure and I hope its still waiting there for me……..tHANKS SO MUCHY fORREST!

    Lou Lee, Chased by Brown Bears in Jellystone park.

    • Well on the other hand, ……Did you have to let the cat out of the bag forrest? I was going with simple, and laughing at all the BS going on in the blogs with all the brains. I was Thinking…”They are too smart to find a treasure that Forrest would hide”. Now game on……..I am grabing my snow shoes and heading out the door right now…and bear mace…I wont forget the bear mace.

  16. Dal,

    Are you aware that recently, Sara from the UK, has indicated that they are making arrangements for coming this summer to the states to follow the chase? I’m sure Forrest is aware of this by now.

    It maybe that Forrest is going to give more hints now to get more people out in the mountains searching. This could be the year the chest is found. IMO.

    In my initial interview with Sara, she seems to have an interest in not only the chase, but also the history of the area being searched. I shared a number of thoughts with her, but no concise location. I believe she’s looking for a good story for the documentary they are making.

    • German-
      Yes. There are several productions going forward this summer from the USA, GB, Australia and Canada that I am aware of. Seems to me there are at least a couple thousand searchers who will be out looking this spring/summer. I can’t imagine why he would feel there need to be more just for the media. However, I do think he would like to see the whole country out looking. In that regard I am sure it is somewhat curious to him that there is more foreign press now covering the hunt than domestic press.

      My theory about why he posted this comment is that Forrest receives lots of email from searchers who are looking in all the wrong ways. They have used too much imagination. Many of their solutions are based on theories that require special knowledge or tools. When he looks at the blogs he sees a lot of the same kind of talk. He is concerned that more and more searchers will be swayed by the predominance of the “imaginative” psuedo-solutions on the blogs. Others will quit before they start simply because the hunt is being portrayed as some sort of intellectual, myth based fairytale. He wanted to spin things around in the correct direction. I think he feels that he owes it to searchers to make certain no one believes he supports the talk from the plethora of folks with more imagination than common sense. I don’t think he is saying that employing imagination is wrong. In fact, he has told us that imagination is useful, But practical, common sense is also important. I think that his posts on Scrapbooks sixty one and sixty two are just a reality tug for all of us.

      By my own observation I would depict Forrest as a very practical person with a very clever mind. He often approaches problems from a different perspective…He likes puzzles because he likes the challenge of solving them. But like most of us…if a puzzle demands too much work he will abandon it. A puzzle should be an enjoyable challenge…not unsolvable…and he made this for your average guy…not the Einsteins among us.

      • I am quite perplexed by the inclusion of “riddles” in this comment, and I wonder whether he really means it. It could possibly have the opposite effect (reducing the number of searchers, at least the number of searchers that don’t live near the Rockies).

        If there are no riddles or ciphers (including anagrams) in the poem, then everything is literal, and there is *no* hidden information in the poem.

        And if this is the case, then the only way to find the treasure is by brute force – simply trying different warm-water starting points, near a canyon, near the home of someone named Brown, etc.

        I simply can’t mesh this comment with previous comments, specifically the comment that the finder will “go with confidence”, and that the poem was “written by an architect”.

        If you’ve ever gone searching in the woods with what you thought was a perfect solution, then you know how difficult it is to find something when you don’t know *precisely* where to go, and *precisely* what you are looking for when you get there. If everything in the poem is literal, then the poem does not give you this information, and I can’t imagine how one would go with confidence.

        Back to the drawing board; or not.

        • Dacoma you are right

          you arent going to find the treasure by searching every place the poem literally describes

          there has to be some type of puzzle solving. and it has to be hidden and not obvious otherwise someone would have it by now.

          the information already put out there by f tells us this is a puzzle that needs to be unlocked, and it can be, and you can know it with some certainty if you do

          so scrapbook 62 needs to be taken on balance with all that came before

      • He made this for the average guy not the Einstein’s out here???……….Now you tell me. No wonder I can’t find it. 😆

        I’ve always thought the poem is straight forward, very clever, but straight forward. I’ll admit all the hidden layers, cryptic, deciphering folks had me wondering. I thought if that is what it takes I don’t have a snow balls chance of figuring it out.

        Maybe defining “it” would be helpful. Fenn’s writing reminds me of when I was a kid unloading trucks; some of the boxes said “squash do not crush”. I always got a kick out of that every time we got a load of vegetables.

        There is a place out there that precisely matches the poem.

        • I think he made the poem and the chase for a person that thinks more like him and see the way he looks at the world. Forrest is a gifted thinker and it’s going have to take the same kind of person to do the same. Someone is going have to forget logic at some point to open their mind to imagination to complete this chase. If I understand somewhat what Forrest is saying that there is a person out there that is doing it, so its not impossible and it sounds like our window is getting shorter. IMHO

        • i dont think most of your average guys/gals could solve the poem, hence it is difficult

          it will take someone with an above average ability to work out puzzles at the least, but they wont have to have the knowledge of Einstein to be able to do it

          if you have the ability to think logically and are willing to persist and research, it is possible but not easy.

          in my opinion

          • Ohhh Chris..you naysayer you…
            I disagree. I think even “I” might be able to find it. The key is figuring out where he wants us to start. He’s said that often enough. He’s also said that the starting place is the most difficult part. So the imagination, I think, comes in when you start thinking about what he means by where warm waters halt. Ask a kid he said..which means to me that you don’t have to be Einstein. But I do think you have to be in the neighborhood to recognize where his warm waters halt…and that’s where TTOTC is terribly important. I believe the book’s role is to give you hints about where those warm waters that halt are at. I also think it provides hints to where his “special” place might be.

          • if you find it Dal, you will have proven that you had the logic, street smarts and savvy that was required.

            everyone would know, here is the man who possessed a sense of wanderlust, studied the clues in the book , and threaded a tract through the wiles of nature, and took the sure and direct path to the treasure.

            maybe it will be you. i see your solution is evolving. you say the hints in the book can get you in the neighborhood.

            thats good, and if you find the neighborhood, i will say, welcome to the neighborhood, Dal.

            but get here soon before the no vacancy sign goes up. i have been in the neighborhood so long … well, let me put it this way, the rent was still dirt cheap when i first moved in.

            here’s a helpful (imo) offering, take it or leave it. some hints in the book may get you in the neighborhood, but the hints in the poem are even better. unlock the zip code in the poem and it makes finding WWH a heck of a lot easier.

            also, kid = goat

          • Ha Chris-
            I’ve been in my area for over two years…
            So I don’t think I need a welcome from you buddy..

          • Dal, im glad you started off sayin ha 🙂

            you are right of course

            i used to be a confenndencaholic

            now i just pretend

  17. Dang, that’s a pile of posts above me. I must’ve been asleep. That is what I will be reading in a few minutes. Meanwhile, I am planning my next trip out. I will get myself a room, since it might be cold out. Then, because I am allowed to cross the street, I will. I will do as FF suggests and have dessert first, since life is short. I might even hug a homely girl if I can find one, I’m sure I will. I may head out west for an interesting wine before going to be pillowed down. Since, I will be staying next to Santa Fe, I will get up and go right down from the mountains north of Santa Fe. I will take my caged beast with me so she can take in the fresh air. She will want to pull me up, but even though she is tougher than I am, I will wrestle with her and take her down. I will be nice and let her rise a little. I will let her rest while I check for snakes. Then, I will head on to my friends cabin. I will visit there and play in the backyard. I like hanging out toward the back by the back wall. Why? I dont know, maybe because I feel like no one will be looking at me. I like when I can sit in silence and think to myself. Then, I think when I’ve had enough time to meditate, I will do a dance and, as they use to say in the 1970’s, “I’ll get up and get down.” I like to listen to music and dance. Oh, yeah, where was I? That’s, right… I will… sip on a cup of coffee. I will reach for the honey to sweeten my drink. I might add a little some thing high in proof too. I think the contents might land up being too hard to swallow. Too much caffeine can make my veins pop out. After all that, I’m sure I will have to sober up and try to remember why I stopped by my friends cabin. Maybe, I just needed a drink. Maybe, I shouldn’t stop by that cabin after all and stay away from hard booze. I might want to re think this. Let’s see… first, I better make sure know where my spot actually is. I hate I when I feel like I don’t make sense. I’m only around half of ff’s age. I wonder if knows if he is making sense or not.

  18. The truth is, after your solution doesn’t pan, you go to what is only human nature. You missed something, so you keep adding ingredients to your pan. And you dig ever deeper…..

    Sure, back to basics! But what are we missing? And what has f told us that is technically correct but we did not hear what HE whispered?

    I think I know WHERE but I just don’t know WHY. So WHY is …IT…..!

    • Just a little suggestion here, if you go to your “where”, be sure to take pictures and notes of the area (assuming you don’t find the chest).

      When I went to my “where”, I did exactly that (even though I didn’t find the chest on that search) and with the notes and pictures I took, I realized that I had the right location, but just the wrong spot. After addition research, I was able to isolate the spot down to a reasonably small and searchable area. Hopefully this year will be the year someone finds the chest and we all can go back to our normal lives… 🙂

      After getting your best solution, try to shoot holes in it. If it doesn’t fall apart, go for it. This is the only way to go with “confidence”. Then again, this is only my personal opinion.

  19. Funny how everyone gets something different out of a statement. 🙂 Bet Forrest is laughing over this one.

    Doesnt everyone start with the book, a good map and google earth? See you on the trail. 🙂
    Oh and LouLee, read that book again. 🙂

          • William, it’s a form of address. At least that’s the way I think I remember it to be.

          • RC, the question I have is… will I see you in the wood? Listen. If we were to both equally distant from a mirror and you looked directly into it, who would you see? You, me, or both? RC, I will be nice to you because you scare me… just a little. Don’t focus on me, focus on your goal and don’t stop searching. I would wish you good luck, but luck isn’t needed. Fennture out and enjoy your journey.

          • Slurbs* You keep dodging my question. I will answer yours. If we were equally distant from a mirror, and I look directly into it who would I see, me, you or both? How about it all depends. How far from the mirror are we? Am I facing the side where I can see my image,and yours or are we facing the painted side? I could be seeing my image,and you could be facing the back of the mirror. It all depends, but you did not ask me that so I could answer right? Now, one last time are you Mr. Fenn? yes, or no. No matter how you answer I will leave you alone. I’ll see you in the woods. RC

          • First , RC, we would both be on the reflective side. I can not, flat out, teach you Fenn speak, as I am not he. You brought a thought to mind with your “paint” comment… God sure “paints” a pretty picture, wouldn’t you agree? I am not an imposter. I am the original Slurbs. Whenever you are in NM, I would like to meet you. Not to bounce ideas off eachother, just to exchange some banter. Alert me, please. Or ring a bell or something… Thanks

  20. Well thank you Mr.Fenn!…maybe I’ll give my sanity a call an see if we can work it out 🙂 sure have missed havin it around..

  21. This has been a great journey and a rollercoaster of a emotional ride and I had a blast through the whole thing 🙂 my next and last search will be coming up and after that I will be complete with or without the treasure chest. After that search I wish all you the best and good luck and know this when you are out searching that if you don’t laugh to yourself on the trail you are doing it wrong.
    I had a dear friend tell me one time that if someone don’t laugh at your ideas, you are not dreaming big enough 🙂

  22. I thought I read in forrest posts, that he excluded fairy tales, Did anyone else see that? I wondered if this was edited, because I really thought I saw that? LOL

  23. I’m having trouble reconciling this statement with his other statements. He now says that TTOTC is “excellent research material”.

    But before he stated:

    Q: Are there clues in the book?
    Yes, because the poem is in the book.

    Q: Are there subtle hints in the book?
    Yes, if you can recognize them.

    https://dalneitzel.com/2013/04/17/2071/

    All of the information you need to find the treasure is in the poem. The chapters in my book have very subtle hints but are not deliberately placed to aid the seeker. Good luck in the search. f

    https://dalneitzel.com/2012/01/26/is-the-book-important/

    • Goof-
      None of this is an issue for me…surprise surprise!

      The book is excellent research material because it has hints in it. However those hints are not deliberately placed to aid the seeker because they will not take you directly to the treasure…ie you will not find in the book anything that tells you what “WWWH is…BUT you will find hints that tell you what area to look in for WWWH..

      I think all he was trying to say is that there are hints in the book but don’t expect to uncover anything that will take you directly to the chest…rather…there are hints that will help you narrow down your search area. I think many folks have been saying this for quite awhile…and I agree..
      In Forrest’s mind they are hints..not clues..
      Clues lead you closer to the treasure…hints do not..
      I’m not sure everyone agrees with his definitions but we know that’s his difference because he told us so…

      • I’m with Goof on this. Its conFUSing. Gotta add the reminder too that the book, deliberate clue/hints or not, is only 85% truth.
        And, IMO, I maintain there’s little proof/reason to think that ONLY WWWH could be the end-all-be-all ‘beginning’ of the clues. I have searched, and other than self-referential cites, I’ve yet to find anything from an indy news source that quotes FF saying anything other than ‘start at the beginning’ and ‘don’t mess with my poem’. Taken with the last couple scrapbooks, which re-iterates the poem’s importance, I have to stay firmly in the ” ‘AIHG’ = the beginning” camp. WWWH is clue #2 IMO.
        But hey, have fun in your camp. That’s fine. I’ll (hopefully) be with the riches new and old. (Friendly elbow nudge) 😉

        • Mapsmith, please enlighten me as to what you think is the first clue.
          I would love to beat my head against some besides WWWH.

  24. It would be somewhat ironic and quite humorous if Fenn put some kind of code/cipher in his Scrapbook Sixty Two statement……. lots of commas…….. just like in the poem………

    And he mentions “Magnetic Variation”…….. Is this the same concept as Magnetic Deviation? If so, then why put magnetic deviation lines on the map of the search area if this concept is of no use to searchers?

    The use of AND/OR in the very last sentence is puzzling……… “Excellent research materials are TTOTC, Google Earth, and/or a good map.” Read that sentence using just the ‘and’…… Then read it again using just the ‘or’…….. This sentence seems to suggest that a searcher could use all of the resources cited OR just one……..

    Also, there is a company called “A Good Map Company” based in Washington state……… So maybe use a “Good” map?? One produced by that company?

    EDIT: I guess the Good Map Company was formerly known as “Road Runner Maps”……… and I think they only produce maps of the Puget sound area of western Washington……… Isn’t Dal from around there? So maybe this particular scrapbook was intended for Dal…… To keep him from getting sidetracked with useless ideas? I don’t know…… just some random thoughts

    • magnetic variation = magnetic declination

      yep, he put magnetic lines of declination on the map. it is apparent to me (maybe just me,idk) that he put them there, not necessarily that they would help you find the chest, but they are a hint to something

      i think i know what that something is, but that’s not important.

      he then says here magnetic variation ” will not assist anyone to the treasure location ”

      yeah, ok. i could explain how that makes sense but then ultimately its like im trying to psycho analyze how f thinks and communicates and i’d rather just say this, you know what, im just going to trust what ive found in the book and poem.

      what ive found, there is enough convincing evidence that it was placed there to assist me in finding the treasure. what else do i need to know really.

    • Now Jason… Why the and/or you ask. Well, simple, Forrest is trying to pull the wool over our eyes.

      You see, the fact that his whole point has been to get everyone to think more logically, he threw the “and/or” out there to see if anyone would bite. Nobody has…LOL. I’m sorry to have waited so long to point out what he was doing, but I wanted to see how long it would have taken someone to catch it. I’m really surprised Goofy didn’t pick it up right away. Then again, I’m not sure what area of computers he is familiar with. Maybe he will enlighten me/us.

      So what is the “and/or” about? Simple, ‘and’ is a logical conjunction and ‘or’ is a logical disjunction.

      You just gotta love this man… LOLOLOL

      • Germanguy, just my opinion……….I don’t think Fenn is into computer science, logic gates, if/then, and/or nested statements, etc. I think he was simply saying that good research material would be Google Earth or a good map or both combined.

        Sometimes the most logical thing is the simplest.

        • Sometimes I see Forrest as a very intelligent intellectual, and I surely would not underestimate his knowledge base. However, I see your point. I’m sure you can see how the “and/or” caught my attention immediately. I could hardly keep from laughing, after his previous comment on using “logic”. I said what I did, because I wouldn’t put anything past him.

          From your comment, I guess you do have a working knowledge of programming. Nice.

    • TTOTC, Google Earth, and a good map are excellent research materials.

      for those of us with common sense i dont think this needed to be said. but not everyone has common sense, and so hearing it from Fenn is helpful for those who may have been veering off.

      i think the ‘good map’ comment is referring to the fact some maps are going to have helpful info that google earth does not have.

  25. Not all maps of an area have the same info on it. The one that has the correct info, would naturally be “a good map” IMO

  26. I think that most of the hints in TTOTC refer to the immediate area of the chest, not WWWH or any of the areas near the beginning of the clues/chase.

  27. I want to thank Mr. Fenn for those recent comments. They have helped me relax and continue to look forward to going out and searching my locations. I think they have done that for a good number of us.

    For the others, the comments seem only to have strengthened their beliefs that this whole thing is so much more complicated than it appears. Almost like it is some diabolical scheme on FF’s part.

    While I believe that there are those who conspire for evil within our society, I would not put Mr. Fenn in that category. He has put out a magnificent treasure in a chest that serves as a strong motivator for us to go out and search. But remember, the search is the greatest treasure of all (for most of us, anyway.)
    Am I wrong?

    And for that I am most grateful.

    I do not believe that I will certainly find the gold, but I do believe that my kids and I will certainly have a blast trying. They even bought me a long-desired metal detector for my 55th birthday (today). If it doesn’t detect the chest, it will most certainly find other treasures.

    As for the AND/OR comments . . . . really folks ?!

    He told us from the beginning that the poem held the clues.

    The book has hints.

    And I believe something close to – “you wont be able to see the treasure on Google Maps” (correct me if I am wrong; DG has no qualms doing so 🙂 )

    And I agree with Ken regarding the reason for a map with or without GE.

    But some have gone so far afield in their quests that he now has to say that THOSE are the excellent research materials (and no others.)

    Again, I applaud (loudly) those amazing feats of mental gymnastics that have produced gold-medal results in ingenuity and imagination (so much more fun to read than my students’ homework).

    In conclusion ( to this caffeine-fueled post ) I truly believe Forrest Fenn is indeed as sly as a fox, only not as cunning as one. 🙂

    • He probably wants to get us away from the typical locations and consider places like the Tetons or Glacial NP or trail maps. I just realized I’m probably wrong with what I’ve been saying on the blogs since he pretty much said that he hasn’t seen the key on the blogs.

    • MacSweeney-

      Don’t go giving out those Gold Medals just yet.

      Wait till you see my thoughts on scrapbook forty-six AND/OR fifty-nine.

      I got my metal detector in December…should have seen me in the yard trying to dig things up with a hammer.

  28. OOOoooppps!!

    OK, just looked up cunning to double check its meaning.

    YES, FF is as cunning as a fox, only in a good way.

    Didn’t mean to insult him. 🙂

  29. Forrest I think the blog on your web site should also be considered “Excellent research material” I find it rather insightful.

  30. Guess even fly fishers will be angling with bait after ff opened that can of worms. Glad spring is here. See you fishing… for treasure.

  31. OK, Here is my “dumb it down” version.

    I believe Mr. Fenn is trying to help us.

    Simple message….KEEP IT SANE, NOT THAT COMPLICATED!

    As an engineer, I lost my sanity in all of this searching long ago by trying to overthink Mr. Fenn by giving him more “engineering” credit than he presumably deserved.

    But, as an engineer, I greatly appreciate the simple “logic” comment.

    After miles of road rash, visions of grandeur, and a heaping of humility I have finally succumb to that which is obvious to Mr. Fenn….I am no match for him!

    • I don’t think he meant research tied to the treasure hunt; I think he thinks of “the thrill of the chase” as a game, (see the santa fe report video to see what I mean) and by research in that quote, he’s referring to academic-like research– I.e. his books are no good as reference material to cite in a thesis or other book.

    • There was a searcher that was making false statements about Forrest a year ago and Forrest sent a rebuttal to his comments. One sentence is the searcher in that text and the next was Forrest rebuttal to the sentence.

    • Perhaps you might want to read what he said again and understand the context of that write-up and why he said what he did.

      If you are looking for historical fact, you will unfortunately find plenty of inaccuries in his books, I know I have. Forrest does not claim every little detail he has written to be 100% correct, thus it shouldn’t be used for historical research purposes.

      Now using his book to find his chest, that is a whole different ball of wax. He has been very clear on how he feels about its use for that purpose.

        • Don’t worry too much about me, I tend not to bite, so I’m probably not too dangerous. 🙂

          If it makes you feel better, I look at this as only competing with myself; I am my own worst enemy in this game. Plus you have a leg up on me in your search area(s); you have far more of the clues figured out there than I do.

          Good luck Michael D!

  32. JohnR the statements he’s made present and past are mind boggling.
    Look at the first paragraph on his web page. It states “The book contains clues to the treasure’s location as Forrest Fenn invites readers to join in The Thrill of the Chase”. What do you think about that (lol) ?

  33. Once you begin to unravel that ball of string in his book there’s no stopping it. The key is not to let it drive you nuts or run you over. There is some type of method to the madness, i just haven’t figured it out yet.

  34. Dal, I hope you will allow me to post on your site. If I have ever posted here, it was long ago and I do not remember myself. I’m a regular on Chase Chat but I do check your blog daily as well. And I do enjoy your writing. My favorites have to be “Yellow Hat” and “The Shaft”. You should, as others have stated, compile them into a book. It would do well. I know I would buy one just for the reading enjoyment.

    In lieu of Mr. Fenn’s latest post here , I have some ideas I’d like to throw out here for those on your blog that don’t often post to Steph’s, I know some do. Let’s say for the most part we can agree to disagree on interpretations of the clues and the poem. To wit:

    1) Start at the beginning is not the same as starting with the word “begin”.

    2) Begin it where warm waters halt…is not the first clue, but part of the second.

    3) Begin it where warm waters halt…has absolutely nothing to do with H2O in any form, the meaning is totally different then most believe.

    4) When you know what the “I” in the first stanza and the “it” in the second really are you’ll see they are the same thing and why.

    5) Clues 1 & 2 produce the named location in plain English words. I have not messed with or altered the poem in any way, not even punctuation, just used the words as written.

    6) Everything is in the words of the poem just as Mr. Fenn said. It’s all hidden in plain sight.

    7) The words produced for me I cannot see as accidental or by coincidence, they must necessarily be by design, plain and simple logic.

    There is more, but I think this is enough to get a few responses with for now.

    Thanks for a great site, Dal. And the best of luck to all in this chase, you’re all gonna have to work for it however. It is my intention to get there first.

    samsmith

    • Hey Sam – sounds compelling !
      Can you hint about How the canyon and the blaze work into it?

      I’ve got a similarly confident solve in MT –( hoping yours isn’t there. 😉 …and that you won’t be there in /before July!!).

      Best, map

      • Hey map, best I can do is say “And take it in the canyon down” is a single instruction, all the words work together, and help in finding the location given by clues 1 & 2…

        The blaze is more complicated and I see it as having double usage, once in finding the location and also part of another clue.

        I’ll give you another hint: there is a “keyword” and a “word that is key”, they are both in the poem and are not the same. Everything is in the words.

        And you are safe, not in MT.

        BTW, the poem is not locked.

        Sam

    • Sam-
      I’ve enjoyed your posts on Chasechat. Regarding your 7 (why 7? Why not 9?) comments, which I also saw on the other site, I would say:

      1. Yes.
      2. Depends upon what you mean by the word ‘clue’.
      3. Did you really say that? Oh yeah, you did…
      4. Okay, you put this one about the ‘I’ and ‘it’ right in the middle of your list. Do you care to elaborate, or were you just using Krylon or Scotchguard for an extended period in an unventilated space? 😉
      5. Are you saying that since you have the ‘named location’ in the first two clues, you have the general location, or the specific location?
      6. Of course.
      7. Ditto.

      Peace,
      Halogetter

      • Halo…Nice to hear from you…I’ve enjoyed your interesting comments for a long time…Keep them coming…on 2) A clue is a clue, 1 & 2 are clear as a bell to me now…3) You betcha… 4) No order to my statements, two “I”s and two “it”s in the first two clues, all the same thing IMO, works out beautifully for me(P.S. not huffin’ or puffin’ anything right now, dagnabbit!, too good of a job to take a risk!)…LOL…5) Couldn’t be more specific…

        Got it? Got it!…run with it…

        Sam

  35. Dal,
    Am I wrong, or didn’t you one time clarify with Forrest what he meant by “starting at the beginning” and he replied with WWWH? I could be mistaken, but I thought that was addressed with him.

    • I tried…yes.
      Forrest has said in public, at least twice, that searchers need to start at the beginning, figure out where warm waters halt. The clues in the poem are in consecutive order. I don’t have the exact quotes but that was the gist and it was good enough for me.
      This response was in reply to a number of emails that he had gotten where searchers were starting by looking for the home of Brown first. I think their strategy may have been to start with HOB because it was easier for them. They had not been able to figure out WWWH. Forrest started by saying that searchers need to start at the beginning, figure out where warm waters halt. It cannot be found by starting in the middle…This may have been at a book signing…but I no longer recall.

    • I also find this comment from Forrest in ‘Stephan Returns to the Blaze’ as supporting WWWH as the first clue, though arguments could be made against it.

      “… All of this cyberspace verbiage is conspicuous by the absence of talk about where warm waters halt. Several months ago some folks correctly mentioned the first two clues to me in an email and then they went right past the other seven, not knowing that they had been so close. Alas, and dame fortune, so often a fickle and seductive wench, never spun her wheel to lure them back.”

      The article talks about a lot of other clues and ideas and then Forrest calls out how there is a lack of talk about WWWH and then talks about people getting the first two clues correct. You can decide if he is calling it out as the first clue or not, I know where I sit and see no need to argue given what f has said.

      I also thought this line from that write-up to also be interesting:

      Just so all you seekers know, me and the lads did not dig beneath that thar tree of ours. A mysterious fellow named “f” once sent us a curious poem, part of which said somethin’ like: “…while fools argue about the quest, he won’t even need a tool, as he carries out the chest.”

  36. Im a little upset that Forrest would release info like this. It took a long time to understand this poem and how to unlock its secrets. He just gave all new comers and folks that had not yet understood the poem an unfair advance. What about all the years of hard work i put into this and now others get to jump ahead, skip all that and go right to whats important. Forrest says hes a fair man but im not thinking so anymore. He said he didnt care it it was found now or later. If you dont care then stop clueing people in. In not fair to the rest of us who have put so much time in to get where we are.

  37. Forrest has said this so many times in so many ways. Now he’s said it with a concise list of very specific details, which also imply many other things not listed, for searchers to understand. He realized that the many other statements he’s made, such as that the poem is straight forward or that he’s not playing games, apparently did not have the intended effect.

    Do his recent clarifications make it easier for new searchers, in terms of uncluttering their path and giving them tools to wade through the thousands of ideas on the posts and edit them more quickly? Brad’s feelings noted above are reasonable. Perhaps, but Forrest posts what he wants just like everyone else, and Dal is certainly not inclined to block them.

    Forrest has said “All I had going for me was some imagination, hard work and a logical mind”. I think he’s made it clear once again that those traits are essential core qualities that a searcher would be fortunate to have in this Chase.

    And when Forrest says that TTOTC is excellent research material, it’s understood that the poem is the most important part of the book. He made a similar comment regarding TTOTC, without mention of the poem specifically, on the back of the map in tftw.

    He said that Google Earth and/or a good map are excellent research materials, implying that perhaps someone without access to GE could still do the research with maps. After all, he might have begun the Chase before GE or even the public internet was integral to daily existence. And still not everyone has access to GE. The possible benefits of looking at older maps, or different types of maps emphasizing different kinds of information, are a consideration.

    So re-visit the poem, the book, the maps with a fresh outlook. New searchers, steer clear of the gobbledegook, if you can decipher exactly what that is. As Musstag said, this is not a NEW direction, just a more detailed and louder yell by Forrest saying what he has always said.

    Those among us who have a complete solve with great certainty may be headed for the mountains. The words in the poem tell a story that direct you to the exact location of the treasure chest.

    Forrest has offered quite a lot of detail in the last few posts, but I do wonder if he’s expecting the overwrought status quo of the blogs to continue. Remember that he also hears a lot from people who don’t post.

    I think Forrest feels that his simple words often fall on deaf ears, that his calls are not heeded, even though he said to ‘listen good’ right off the bat.

    SYand42lbsHeavier,
    Halogetter

    • Nice words Halo, couldn’t agree more. I have enjoyed all the research I did before the recent comments, mostly history stuff, and don’t feel this changes anything. For new searchers there is still a lot of work to do, and even the people who have been around for a while still can’t figure out wwwh – save for a couple out of the thousands (if that is one of the first 2 clues.) You can’t just come into this thing and read the blogs then go walk the chest.

      I understand kinda Brad’s comments, but this is ff’s chase, his rules, and we either ante up or we don’t.

    • Halo,

      You make an excellent point! Forrest started writing this poem 15 years prior to placing the chest. Back then there was no computer use for research, at least not the way it is now. Google Earth wasn’t even open for use till 2004. I think that when he says research it’s not the PC at all. I think there is a more logical way than that!

  38. Time to power down and get outdoors…

    “It is the marriage of the soul with nature that makes the intellect fruitful, and gives birth to imagination.” – H.D. Thoreau

  39. Regardless of all that is said and stated FF says the poem tells u where it is at !!!!!!! So I’m sticking with that 🙂

  40. Some people who are not involved in The thrill of a chase think we are crazy I know my clients think so I just laugh 🙂 it’s been fun

  41. Yes it has, and who cares what anyone else thinks about it? I could think of many things we could be spending effort on that are less rewarding. 🙂

    • He posted a picture of a fox in his backyard taken with one of his security cameras. It was in an early scrapbook. I don’t know which one.

      • dal,

        check out Fox island not far from you…just south of Seattle. Look at it from Google Earth. The Fox looks like a hound.

        Also, I found the dog on a bridge bleeding out from a bullet wound, and four cards and a joker in the snow images on Mt. Rainier. Plenty of other “book” references as well.

        These references now only server to diminish my hopes of finding any treasure associated with them.

        It is fun to find them though.

        • Ex-Governor of this fine state and Ex-Chair of the Atomic Energy Commission, major booster of nuclear energy, Dixie Lee Ray lived on Fox Island. I have been there. She had mud-babies on her beach. I still have one given to me by Dr. Ray. A mud baby is a curious geologic formation caused by the action of the ocean on ancient mud deposits.

  42. Amy, Not that I’m aware of…Dal…? I know he has been compared to a maverick and a coyote. He is as sly as a fox tho! ¥Peace¥ Donna

  43. In the book it says that sometimes its wise for the fox to dress as the hound. He also has a night time photo of a fox by his pond, I believe its in a scrapbook?

  44. The firSt blaze will lead you to the second blaze that is the book with that book you will find what this poem is all about you have ño clue i hold all the power to this poem besides forrest so believe what i say maybe we as a whole can get togther and i will show you where warm waters halt

    • First of all you guys dont even understand what is going on here i do because i own the blaze i own the title to the gold but that dosent mean i own the gold it just gives me titile to the poem that is where warm waters halt thats all the title means now how will you know where warm waters halt when the titles gone but i did you guys a favor i left a note that will say your to late but that dont mean the gold has been found but it means you founnd where warm waters halt i didnt have to do that im just being fair but anymorre smartass comments i will quit giving clues

      • I can’t be judgemental cause if I tell my solution you would probably think the samething about me, but feel free and i’m going to lurk for awhile. Godd luck and happy huntings!

      • Oh and by the way imo are the easiest clues in the books if you need help on imo just ask it is the the second phase of where warm waters halt from there is really where the the poem takes its place

        • Maybe if you put some punctuation in your comments they wouldn’t sound like a madman ranting. Also trying to lord power over people about ‘owning titles’ doesn’t help your case. Set your comments out more constructively and you will probably get more constructive responses.

        • Cognito, put your money where your mouth is, I am not saying your wrong ,but you have admitted that you haven’t found the gold but hold title to it. So, if you are confident in your solve I will put up 20k of my own money against your 10k (2:1 odds). If you find it based on your theory the 20k is yours otherwise I prefer cash not check.

        • Cognito, I understand what you are saying! Here is a translation for those that just dont understand what he is trying to say…A library holds valuable intel, and may have some clues too! In a library, you have to whisper and listen to what the whisper says. There are many books with gold titles. WWWH is listed in one of these books, finding WWWH, is where the poem is concentrated.
          Am I right? I plan on visiting a very important library while on my search…good luck all! ¥Peace¥ Donna

          • Oh, strike, spark, zap, poof, . . . how does that go now ?!

            Another thought you’ve sparked, Donna.
            Perhaps this is new only for me, but

            Warm – Waters

            at the top of a dictionary page or other reference book. Hmmmm

            Perhaps that is what Cognito is referring to. I, like most, have been somewhat baffled over his entries.

            Anyway, world, in case that possibility sparks any other thoughts. . . .

            I apologize if that has been mentioned before.

            Cheers.

          • Donna,
            Very cool! That makes sense. How did you manage to decipher that? I don’t believe I stand much of a chance with people like you in the chase. So could you please drop out of the chase. LOL
            Kanafire
            P.S. Almost forgot, thanks for your replies in scrapbook 61.

      • No need for rude language, cog. I think the community agreement here is that No one can truly claim full understanding / knowledge / confidence until they have their fingerprints on the bronze chest and a photograph to prove it, until then, we all preface our comments with a polite “IMO” or “my POV” or “I’m thinking that…”
        Yes, I can see how you, me and everyone could claim to own the title to the GOLD; FF has given us poem readers’ the permission & the title, so I can see your POV there. If the blaze is a part of public lands, which most likely it is, I can also see how we all ‘own’ the blaze, too. What this what you meant?
        And Did I read this right? :You physically left a note at the point where warm waters halt?

      • I can’t argue with that, Deb.

        I think Forrest always intended for the poem to end with a grand finale of sorts. This is a nice touch by him to give at the end, somewhat like the endings of TTOTC and tftw. He certainly wants to Give us reason to smile at the end…

        Halogetter

  45. Some of us know exactly where that chest is huh cognito. We just can’t get to it because it’s all locked up 🙂

  46. Be patient with cognito. Each of us participates the best we can, and so far as I can tell, we all have the same results to show for it…at least in terms of finding the treasure anyway. NADA (which does not refer to the value of your car)

  47. OFF TOPIC-
    FYI…There is a new story about the treasure hunt in Backpacker Magazine’s May edition. It’s quite nicely done as a searcher by the name of Brian Mockenhaupt wrote the story, meets with Forrest and takes us along for the ride…
    You can find the magazine at most every magazine rack…or you can get a digital subscription for $15 over at zinio.com and read it without leaving the comfort of your 25″ screen.

    • Thanks! Good article , new (magazine-made) map, new pictures of FF’s treasures, and most interestingly, they’re claiming the treasure value is now…
      Ahem
      ….well, let’s just say, quite a lot more than the 800,000-3,000,000 range from before. 😀

      Well worth the 4.99

  48. crazy night for me last night in researching the Chase

    ive been trying to hammer my own solution relentlessly to see if i can figure what if anything is wrong with it

    been doing this for months and could not find anything wrong and it was getting me all the more convinced i had this thing locked down, then last night , my continued willingness to scrutinize what i thot i was so confident about, really paid off

    i found what the major holes were in my solution, and realize why they were. the specific spot,that i havent really been able to search yet, i don’t even need to. i realize now the treasure is not there w/o even having searched it.

    the crazy thing about all this is, the thing that ive thot was the blaze, for more than a year now, i now realize it is not the blaze.

    so why am i smiling as i type this. man, what an adrenaline rush.

    • Bravo, Chris, for using your imagination, while maintaining steady balance on the terra firma of logic. It’s exactly this kind of out-of-the-box thinking that will crack this nut wide open.

      Incidentally, if that is you behind cognito, let me just say right now that you’re a genius. If not, I think your buddy Nick P. missed an opportunity for greatness.

  49. one time Forrest said something like, the person who solves the poem and finds the treasure he thinks they would be the kind of person who wants to shout it from the roof tops

    well, that is definitely the kind of person i am

    • Best of luck to ya there CY when ya go for the gold, and I really mean that…I am afraid all you will get is wet however…Nevertheless, I will be waiting to hear that victory shout if you should succeed…I will be among the first to congratulate you on a job well done in that event…Have fun and please stay safe out there…

      Sam

      • Yes if I feel this is the area it was easy to figure out The area is on a map but I didn’t need a map. We all think we have that location . And of course we all whisper to ourselves about it . I just think I know the poem . Like everyone else does. We are all Chasing 🙂

      • it is a physical place

        if you solve the first clue, which tells you where warm waters halt, then you will know what Brown is

          • Hmmm, intriguing.]speaking personally, I haven’t even the first idea of where to begin. Did you Amy, and Chris have to travel out to find WWWh, or would it have been possible to guess from your place of residence?

          • Danboy
            I figured out my location by poem then I went to the location twice I feel that I found Wwwh and from the top of the mountain down it all makes since to me now I will go back one more time

          • you can figure it out from home, and i would say F pretty much hinted that with his last post

            having the right kind of map helps

          • Hey Chris Yates, I remember wishing you luck last year around this time. Same goes for this year. Be safe out there…

  50. Yes been to my spot twice found a blaze on a tree so I’m digging this time at night lol looks like How ff would blaze a tree this will be the last of the thrill for me I can’t search any other area than this location cause nothing else makes sense to me

    • You seem like a determined chaser Amy hate to see you give up. It don’t make since to you because you have to read the book and go to the right location 🙂

      • I have read that book 8 plus times and from my starting point to the very end all makes since to me even put a scrapbook together if everything explained

        • Yes I’m very determined but financially I can’t keep searching I have one more chance it will be soon and soon can’t get here fast enough:)

      • Gypsey
        Can’t wait to explain it. This way others will know not to search that area after I explain it be sometime in June when I will post it

    • Amy don’t dig. I don’t think FF would bury it. The laws are quite clear on digging on all types of lands. There is no way he buried it.

      • “No digging”. That’s your opinion, Brad, and might even be shared by some underinformed folks in LE, but not the law. The actual law is different in different zones , and for example, in national parks it’s not only legal to dig, there are even some backcountry camping-related situations where it’s Required. ( Boy Scouts carry spades for a reason. )

        The law in federal lands such as national parks regarding digging is that “artifacts” may not be dug up and removed — these are defined in one case as anything of pioneers or natives from 1880’s or earlier. FF’s treasure dated from c. 2010 is well outside that jurisdiction / timeframe and will continue to be for well past our lifetimes.

        In other words, he never said it was buried, and he never said it wasn’t. 😉

      • CY,
        I know you seemed to have had a spot for a while, and maybe you were talking numbers from the book (could have been someone else, sorry.) Did you have to start from scratch or just modify your spot based on ff’s comments in SB62?

        • i didnt have to start from scratch. i think i have the right wwh and home of brown

          FFs comments didnt affect my thinking. i just had a nagging feeling that if i searched my new spot that i had been convinced about now for many months but have not checked it out, i was going to be wrong again

          i tried to tell myself rather than be so convinced i should pretend like ive already searched there and its not there. my previous failed searches are what spurred me onto new thinking so i thot why dont i try to do that before i even go this time.

          thats not easy to do, and the more i tried to hammer out what could be wrong, i couldnt find anything wrong and the clues that seemed to point to the spot seemed more solid the more i tried to find something wrong.

          then finally i figured something out the night before last. major breakthrough, i know now the spot i was planning on going to isn’t the place. more than that i shouldn’t say at this point.

    • The home of Brown I am interested in is just over 10 miles from where I think WWWH is located.

      Just sharing my thoughts, not discounting anybody’s solutions:

      I am of the belief that the line “Not far, but too far to walk” means just as it states. So, a couple of miles or less, IMO, would not be too far to walk. I believe it is saying you should drive a vehicle (or a horse….but for me, it’s a vehicle) from WWWH to the HOB. Then you park (put-in), and then hike on foot from that point, heading into mother nature without the protection/comforts of your vehicle (no place for the meek).

      Anyway, my point is that I believe, as the poem states (too far to walk) that the HOB must be a good distance from WWWH. It’s simply too far to walk. Could one walk it? Sure, one could walk anywhere for any distance depending on the person. So we need to know the distance that Mr. Fenn feels is too far to walk. In his book, TFTW, he mentions in his preface, page xiii, that the “river distance was about ten miles” that he leisurely walked while fishing over 3 days. He says “the river experience cemented my connection to that special country and I promised myself that someday I would make the trip again.” To me, “the trip” is the 10 mile river walk. Later he mentions that it is a great disappointment that he never made it back to make that trip again, “For me now, it’s just too far to walk.”

      So I come to the conclusion that the HOB should be approx. 10 miles from WWWH….IMO.

      • I take it the book is the guidelines to the clues but he’s not giving you the actual locations where to start but the areas in which to look in. Some have mention why a little talk about Cody and no talk about Colorado so if I was a betting man that is where my focus would lie. IMO

      • My put in below the HOB( my HOB is not at the put in site) is 8.25 miles of road down canyon from my WWWH but the stream that I am following with it’s extra curves could very well be 10 miles.

      • HOB does not exist. Not the way most think it does. The clouds are white but sometimes grey. the rain is clear as is the HOB

      • Up that is some mighty fine logical thinking. Most refreshing to red something that actually makes sense.
        Care to share privately wwwh is?

        • Chad,

          Thanks! Sorry, I don’t care to share where I believe WWWH is located. I hope to make it out there this summer….the less competition, the better! I have no issue with sharing how I interpret the clues, but I don’t want to share the actual places involved in my solution.

          • I feel the same way, Up. It’s maddening, but until you’ve exhausted your site, it has to be a priority to secret it.
            This July though, beans will be spilled. .. Hopefully with tinkling of coins too. 😀

          • Not a problem, I fully understand. I have many observations and thoughts I keep to myself. Others I share nothing ventured nothing gained.

      • An interesting point, Jenny. Perhaps the 4 cards that Fate dealt us on page 5
        are MT, CO, WY, and NM. ?
        That does make wonder/worry where (or what) the Joker might be, in that hand.
        FWIW: When I asked a child where the treasure was, he said ‘under the X’ and when I followed up, matter of fact snd a little impatient, with “okay, but which state has the X?” with perfect timing he quipped “we’ll, TeXas , of course”.
        (Though, if other states were truly up for grabs, I’d vote for Injun Joe’s cave )

        • I once found an X on a sign with two omega looking symbols on each side of it. I researched the place and the reason the X was there was because there was a divorce and the husband opened up a place and called it something like U bitch U so the wife would have to see it when she went to work. They made him change it to UXU after that. It reminded me of the son of a bitch statement he made and all the X wives his friend had. It’s near Cody. That was one of my only X searches.

          • T.S Eliot wrote a poem called Time and I believe this is the meaning of the double omegas. In TTOTC he talks about where two points in life converge into one point in time. I believe Forrest is more Philosophically than biblical or Spiritual. I believe if you don’t understand the person how are you going to figure his clues. IMO

  51. Great to hear all of your thoughts of late. In the past, I too thought that WWWH referred to “wet” water as Chris states….although I assume wet means the obvious, but perhaps Chris is as clever as Mr. Fenn and his “wet” means something different.

    My current solve is premised on the the water being “dry”, which is why it “halts”. I too have taken a totally new out of the box approach to the poem, and the solution now appears to be as clear as one of Mr. Fenn’s bells to me.

    What makes me think I am wrong once again, is that this location has attributes that once again match perfectly with key references (so called subtle clues?) in the book. All my other searches have also had these references and I am running out of chapters.

    I find it difficult to believe that as Chris states – if you know WWWH, then you also know the HOB. I think each clue requires its own decipher. My current WWWH and HOB could be hundreds of miles or a few miles depending on where Mr. Fenn went alone in there.

    Any way, best of luck to Chris and Amy

      • Au contraire Ritt..
        There are many places where warm waters halt, depending on how you define the words “where”, “warm”, “waters”, and “halt” and their combined contribution to the phrase. However, there is only one spot that Forrest has in mind based upon his definition. This is the one everyone is trying to figure out…
        Good luck!!

    • When I first started searching my first interpretation were that WWWH and HOB were the same thing or were right next to each other since the words put in just sounded like another way of saying where to begin. But as I consider WWWH and HOB to be two of the nine clues, I don’t believe that Mr. Fenn would waste one of the nine re-iterating a previous clue. Each are separate and have unique information to lead you to the chest. My solve has quite some distance between WWWH and HOB. I don’t even go to HOB.

  52. Thanks, Dal, good luck to you also…..I truly believe that Forrest’s and my definition is the exact same one, because it logically fits in with the home of Brown and the rest of the poem. I can say with the up most confidence that I am on the right track to finding the chest…..I know that there is at least one other person that is on the same track…..I hope he/she doesn’t beat me to it. Good luck to everyone and enjoy the hunt…..Please be safe, don’t go where a 79 or 80 year old man couldn’t go…It’s in a safe place……..Adios! 😎

  53. Hello Gang,
    it has been awhile since I have posted anything. I have lurked just a little bit here lately and I see everyone is still trying to figure out where to start…lol…I guess I have not missed much.
    I took a time out from trying to solve the poem. Then I picked up the book and read it a few more times. From the beginning when I first started looking into this chase my area that I believe the chest to be in remains the same. The latest responses from Mr Fenn still works for my area.

    Keep in mind not to over think…how could asking a child help if the solve is too deep minded…?
    K.I.S.S.

  54. OFF TOPIC
    Rumor has it that a party of 4 searchers had to be rescued in Yellowstone National Park on Sunday. The group is apparently okay. According to authorities criminal charges may be laid against them. The names and the charges have not been made public yet. Authorities also said that this is not the first time searchers for Forrest’s treasure have gotten into trouble in the park…stay tuned..

    For crying out loud…
    Be Safe…Be Legal

          • I would say the park is still open for ideas but you have to follow the laws. You can’t just go in there and start digging up things.

          • Don’t know Forrest says he can hide the treasure where he wants to he pays taxes lol some people or cops have to throw that authority around u know they don’t make much money a year but they have to act do big and bad. They should let these searchers off the hook they are only having fun and trying to find a chest

          • Hank-
            That would be HUGE! But I can’t see that happening. Rationally…there are three million visitors to YNP every year. Some get out of their cars and stand next to a bison to have their photo taken. Next thing you know someone is badly injured or dead. People fall off cliffs and get arrested for collecting arrowheads and using metal detectors….No one has suggested closing Yellowstone to tourists because some get hurt or because the park is “dangerous”. Same with Forrest’s treasure. It would be wrong, I think, for Forrest to announce that it’s not in a national park because some folks get hurt looking for it. Additionally, can you imagine what would happen next? All the mountain parks would want the same announcement. Then the State parks, monuments, picnic sites, campuses and woodlots. Next the private land owners would want an announcement so folks don’t trespass….

            I don’t think he can afford to narrow it down that way. There was a lot of pressure after the Bandelier incident last year to have Forrest announce that it was not there. He did not.

          • Or, alternatively, they could enforce the law, which, If I’m not mistaken, is the job of law enforcement professionals.

      • Who’s to say William. They were definitely not very well prepared and obviously did not do their homework!! This is perhaps a good reminder that this so-called game is no joke. Going into a situation without the appropriate planning can often lead to disaster. It happens often and w/ sudden consequences. I think Forrest has reiterated that searchers should not venture anywhere that a 79 or 80 year old man wouldn’t go. My opinion on that is, that he meant a normal elderly person, not a perennial subsistence hunting mountain man that hasn’t seen asphalt since 1950. Be logical for Pete’s sake!!

        • I agree, they might not had a GPS or enough food or water to get back to the car. These things are second nature to me cause I love the out doors. You can drop me off in the woods and a day later I will have a steak diner and bunk bed ready for you!

      • Amy, if you have to dig at night, your location is apparently incorrect! Forrest’s morals are way too high to have placed the treasure in a place as taboo as you are searching. He joked about people digging, and using heavy equipment, to find his treasure. That should be a clue that no digging is required. I implore to you to please reconsider your solution, we don’t want to read an obituary about getting shot digging or your arrest report on tv! People need to remember, it is in a thrilling place, possibly within public view and is “secreted”, but not necessarily buried! Be safe, be smart! ¥Peace¥

    • Gee, Yellowstone?? The durn chest is in New Mexico, but don’t tell everyone. Forrest has his rebel streak but I’ll bet $$$ he did not go so far as to place it in a National Park. I’m pretty sure he’d stick with National Forests and BLM ground. Oh, and I’d just about bet my life it is not on Native American ground or private property.

    • Gee, Yellowstone?? The durn chest is in New Mexico, but don’t tell everyone. Forrest has his rebel streak but I’ll bet $$$ he did not go so far as to place it in a National Park. I’m pretty sure he’d stick with National Forests and BLM ground. Oh, and I’d just about bet my life it is not on Native American ground or private property.

  55. Yay Ken! I have been waiting to see someone say that. All this hiking into areas that only Rambo could get to just isnt logical.

  56. I don’t know if it’s the same people, but I am assuming it probably is. Maybe they were skinny dipping. I don’t know how else you would be arrested. Maybe one of them came up out of the water with a trout in their mouth and hadn’t gotten their fishing license? I think Forrest said something about being on the Madison in a place where the rangers won’t let you anymore. I can’t remember why that was though. Maybe Forrest was such a good fisher guy that he they closed that part of it till the trout population can have a little privacy. Ok, those are my ideas. I’m thankful they are safe.

    BTW Dal, as of today, Jeff no longer works. Looks like our search schedule has opened up till they decide to do surgery.

    • Skinny dippin lol omg we should write there story for them. 4 Indiana jones wanna bees skinny dippin for treasure in the Madison washed down stream to nine mile bridge where happy lil china men and woman welcome them with Lots of Say cheese :-). Haha

  57. lol Go search there and you can hang out with us in our new igloo digs. I don’t think there’s much chance of you finding any treasure there though unless you go up the road to the Cheese emportium.

      • Certainly a reasonable idea that thats where his rainbow ends, imo.
        I have 5 or 6 possible/viable places still to check in WY and they are all more or less in there with yogi & booboo, including 2 different falls and a lake named after heat. One of the falls is impossible to get to this time of year though… But MT the treasure state is still very much my favorite

  58. We just got the news about an hour ago(packing and filling up the tank as we speak…now where’s that poem?). There is a chance his work will come up with a way he can stay, but it’s pretty doubtful.

      • Phillip, I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt…

        Lots of people using these blogs don’t make it clear to whom they are responding.
        You are starting to sound like a “non-thinking” searcher.
        If you were intending to make this reply to Stephanie, then you have some wires crossed. You don’t have a clue as to what she is talking about.

        You have already been posting that people who don’t search in your state of choice are wrong. Perhaps you want to tell us where we should “all” be hunting.

        Do have a good day! 🙂

  59. I love this site, you guys are all great. I hope to make my first trip out sometime this May. I do feel I have the solve but I want to make it fair. Being that so much awesome ideas are thrown around here. So I will share a little piece at a time before I depart. 🙂 Happy Hunting!

  60. As I am thinking outside the Taos Box, “not far, but too far to walk” could be – close, but if you walk you have gone too far. RC

  61. On your third phase of the poam warm waters home of thebrown are next toeach other maybe about three feet apartand warm waters are under those fake rocks the city came out with you see them all over on your second phase of thepoam home of brown is ups and below thEre is wells far go thats when warm waters halt in wells them you take far out of ñot to far and change walk to go and you get wells fargo from there you take it to canyon there you will the airplane navigation towers thats one reason he shows planes in his book this clue will give it away the treasure is hidden in a veterans retirememt area

    • please STFU already. You spew off such nonsense. If you are so sure why are you trying to convince everyone else? Just go get it then. What’s the problem?

    • Hey Cog man you really are giving this thing away dude. I’m picking up what your laying down. You really didn’t have to give the whole thing away like this.

      • Well, Ed . . . if you can make sense out of all of cognito’s clues, and it leads you to the treasure, then you deserve to find it. 🙂

  62. Rember when he watched his freind forge a horseshoe and that started the whole episode the bookis publised by forge compañy the symbol is a vail with flames on the top that is the blaze he forged two books mine is numbered there is one more out thete maybe he has it dont know what i say are the facts

    • FWIW
      In Greek / Roman myths, the flaming veil is sometimes the symbol for Vesta, goddess of the hearth (the warm home fires, always burning) and maidens aka virgins.
      FYI One of the famous authors FF likes, Shakespeare (not in “as you like it”, though), used the term Vestal Virgins in reference to the female priests of her order.

    • When you look for booklook in the biblical sectioñ and at this phase look quickly down your quest to cease he means the letter c the author will be carey the book will be oscar and luciana you will find a newspaper artical called terrifing thrill

    • When i found the blaze iquckly looked to cease i tore the apart looking there was nothing then about two weeks later i figured he meant the letter c so i went back to library i rember the blaze.sayimg if you domt mind the q andps there it was qs and ps writyen on the side of the book when i opemed it thete was the articale

  63. The chase was fun at first but now I just want it to end whether i find the chest or someone else does. I think we should form a group to figure this out once and for all. A place to share all thoughts with no secrets and no holding back. If anyone is with me here is my email and lets talk real. Brad3928@aol.com we can create a forum where all info is welcome.

    • I dunno. I can see about 100 ways that could go tragically/terribly wrong and only 1 or two ways it might go how you want it to. Best luck, but do tell — why do you want it to end??? The thrill, the chase, are both so fun- …

      • it’s an obsession. It’s like reading a book, watching a movie or playing a video game. You can’t wait to see what happens next or how it ends. In any of those scenarios the end will come and you will see but with this the end may never come and I will never know the answer and to me that is torture. There is nothing fun about it to me anymore. I just want to know the answers he already knows. I don’t care about the chest or the gold. Money comes and goes. I make a decent living and can say I am comfortable that way in life. I just want to know why and how. It’s time. The only reason anyone searches for something old is to learn how and why or what? That’s what I want from this experience. At first it was the gold but now it is the answer.

        • Yep. I made a similar comment last week, Brad.
          It’s as if new chapters keep getting added to a book and you never get to read the final one. How long can one hold off the climax?
          I know I can’t for long. OOooops. Did I say that?!

          As for cognito, I think he lives happily in his own world, so we should just smile and say, “That’s nice,” to his comments. IMO

          • I think Cognito is “interesting” to say the least. I am certainly not the greatest person to speak in behalf of “the least”. Cognito certainly can’t express himself, in writing, very well, but for all we know he’s a real fart smeller…I mean, smart feller.

            I, personally, don’t know him. I think he should be commended for all he thinks…and all he does…and all he thinks he does. 🙂

          • I hope so Amy! I hope you find it and please if you do tell me all those secrets!!!

  64. Called Yellowstone and asked about the Indiana Jones in the River with possible charges being pressed against them. Its a great story about these guys taking a canoe and pick ax into the park somewhere around the Madison river, got in to trouble and had to be rescued. The Public Affairs Rep said the story should be posted on their website in the near future but not sure when. He said they have had a few instances dealing with “these treasure hunters” and that their news release coming out “hopefully should deter treasure hunters”.

    For those not sure, it is illegal to float down the Madison river within the park.

  65. So I have a good map, I have my WWWH, HOB, and my Blaze, and a compass. I just don’t have a compass. I guess it doesn’t matter since mag variation doesn’t matter, since it only offers a ‘positive solution’.

  66. I actually like Cognito’s commentary. If this is his/her normal communication, then I applaud him/her for engaging with us. If he/she communicates like this to us by design, I applaud him/her even more because it seems difficult to me, but I do enjoy reading it. It does seem to fly in the face of “don’t overthink it” however.

    • I just don’t like his cocky attitude about it, like he already has it. If he is so right he should be running to pick it up and not trying to convince everyone that he is right. That’s all I’m saying.

  67. Hi Brad,

    My only concern with your offer to form a site where we can share all of our detailed knowledge, is that I do not think it will get us any closer to the solution. I am happy to share all the places I have searched and plan to search right here , but just because I did not find anything doesn’t mean it isn’t there…although my pride pretty much convinces me it isn’t there. Kind of like I know for certain that my golf shots always go exactly where I hit them.

    Hang in there buddy, we share your pain.

    • I just think it helps to bounce ideas off each other. Some may see something that you dont and vise versa. Its easier when you have someone to help that also knows what is going on.

  68. Why do you think he took out Utah and Idaho? Those states seem to have offered great searching grounds. What is the reasoning for that?

  69. I am content to have this Chase go on for however long it takes. The anxiety has subsided for me and it has become relaxing in a sense. It’s like watching an old movie and seeing something new each time. Good luck all !

  70. OK, Here is how I see WWWH…..This can be alot of places, not just one. Warm waters halt or stop whenever they mix with cold water. From there is goes down a canyon. OK so……Is there just one place warm water halts….NO. So we need something else to go with this…..What so you think of this? And how on a map could you find WWWH? Hundreds of this situation. So again….Something goes with this that makes it unique. Anyone?

    • Ok here we go im going to tell you about imo how will you know your at the right place iwill tell you how you will find the wordhere scatced on the wall and beside it there will be a rainbow the color of kennedys burbi n. Bottle on the.lower right side also you will fimd.his buck horn. And his.buffalo on the wall

      • Ahhh…you are searching next to the “Bourbon” bottle…everything is becoming crystal clear now. I still can’t help but wish you luck, sounds like you found…uhh something there…enjoy.

          • You dont understand he makes the clues hard to find the color is there for areason if you found what i found you would understand bu it is people like you that will never find it rember what he said and these are powerfulwords imagination is stronger than knowlege

          • Cog – do you have a running count for the number of clues you have to your solution?

            I’m sure I am completely wrong here, but I could have sworn that f said something like all the info you needed to find the chest was in the poem and that the book can help you with the clues in the poem. I guess I missed the part where f explained that the book provides excruciating detail and an untold # of clues for finding his treasure in addition to the poem.

            My apologies, but I am having a hard time drinking the steady stream of clues you are spraying out of your fire hydrant.

    • I believe WWWH is one spot, it is so simple once you know…. somehow this comment got posted below accidentally.

    • Where warm waters halt is a metaphor for the name of a location on a map. When you figure out the first three clues, wwwh becomes easier to locate, but it is still not a gimme. Sip some red, black and green tea and then re-read the book and the poem. Then look at a map when you find out where the poems first three clues take you.

  71. My current focus as to WWWH is based on insights provided by RC which led me back to the book where Mr. Fenn states in one of his airplane escapades that “he was all alone”.

    So the poem begins with As I have gone alone in there (his plane). Begin it WWWH (the sky). May not be right, but it works. Cold water in the ground heats up, rises and until it halts (evaporates). Then it gets cold, forms a cloud and rains down again. Take it (the plane/treasure) down the canyon, put in (land) below the home of Brown.

    I have located a place that fits this scenario along with a bit of Cognito strategy for
    If you’ve been wise (Y,Y,Y…more than one Y anyway) and found the blaze.

    Still working on it, but I did find the “V” for victory at the end. I hope the bell will finally ring true this time, but I am not anxious to get another giant dose of humility so I will not be venturing out until I have a craving for some humble pie.

      • The canyon dowm from there you will find kennysdam imo heserverd three terms as mayor of alb then became a taxi cab driver on the plack it will say i have done itweak and now im tired meaning th water thete is to be found thats it no more clues for now mI

          • You got itn now that you know look in his books and your eyes will of how it was right thete and you didnt even notice

        • Sorry. Still not following. He wrote a book(s)? And a dam was named after him.
          This sounds interesting. Nothing else to do until the snow melts in CO and I can get out there. But the plaques I saw on the statue of him in Civic Plaza just had his name and another had some faces on it. Nothing about tired and weak. You sure about that?

          • MacSweeny, when are you heading to your spot? Might see ya out there….

          • Hi Hank-
            I wanted to make it the last week of May, but then more family issues came up. Now I’m hoping sometime after June 14th. Look for a white ’98 Camry cruising the highways and byways around Ouray / Silverton. Grand Canyon state front plate.

  72. So the agreement was if I did find the chest You all would apologize to me, and if I didn’t find it, I’d wear a pink tutu….So crow doesn’t taste all that bad if you cook it right….

  73. I freely share I was in Colorado…. And I believe whole heartedly in my WWWH, But I wish I knew for sure whether down meant south or downstream….This would cut my chase in half. Some of you people on this blog underestimate our then 79 or 80 yr old host IMO!! Believe me I bet he could out hike half of the people on this blog even today!! Just look at what the guy does as a hobby!! Buries bronze jars 3 feet deep in the desert?! Oh, and goes on archealogical digs for weekend relaxation!? The chest is in a safe, hidden, secret, dear, private place to Fenn!? In an Eagle’s nest on the side of a waterfall is a safe place for eggs too….but you have to go get them if you want them! I’m not saying FF rapelled down a waterfall and stashed the chest…but what I am saying is bring a flashlight and a sandwich, and do not under estimate the ability of FF to coyote you and I into thinking he’s a weak old man!!! Hogwash! If he’s thinking 100 to 1000 years to find it, its in one heckofa stash spot my friends…nobody is going to happen apon the chest…? Why is that? No place on the planet is safe from people….If you think you might be the first person to walk a spot just look around long enough and you will find evidence that you aren’t even the first person this century to walk that spot!! No, he’s able bodied and crafty with his spoken words…and a GENIUS of a writer!!! It is sad that I cannot share some of the things I have figured out (albeit with help from this blog) without giving away geography….and I am not done in there by a long shot! I will not go anywhere else from now until it is found or I am dead….Anyways, I went there twice and I will go there again!! My needle in a haystack just became a needle in a haybale…All of this is only my own humble OPINION. The chest will be found in a REMOTE AREA, SELDOM VISITED BY PEOPLE IN GENERAL, and specifically difficult to access. It WILL be buried, entombed, sepultured, covered by wood, or otherwise hidden from view. NOBODY will happen apon the chest…this means if you are there, you won’t know it’s there unless you are looking specifically for it! Which also means there MUST be a blaze when you arrive that only a fennaholic would recognize as a blaze..any tom ,dick or harry would only look at it in a casual and non-informative way…

    • I think you are so right with the last sentences. Thanks for the picture, I really wish I had some ruby slippers right now. 😉

    • Michael D-
      Thanks for coming back and sharing your ideas with us.
      Now wipe that egg off your face and figure out where you went wrong.

    • Bravo Michael! Only a manly man could be so humble and look so darn cute in a pink tu tu. I tend to agree with your thoughts on the chest being hidden from plain view although my guess is that it isn’t in as a remote place as you say. Also, my intuition tells me that the blaze is subtle and easily overlooked even by Fenn followers. Hope to get to my spot this spring to see if my inner bird is leading me to the right spot or just playing games.

    • Michael D you certainly are brave – love the tutu! While I don’t agree with everything in your solve, much of what you say is true, especially the last few sentences. I do believe that people who are not into the Chase will not recognize the blaze, and maybe even some people who are in the Chase!

    • Hi Michael D,

      As a long time Santa Fe resident (nearly 40 years), and a hiker who loves to voyage far into the remotest points of the wilderness, I will tell you that I have it on very good authority, from several different local sources, that Fenn was and is known to be formidable hiker.

      I routinely hike with 40 or more pounds. It is not as difficult as people might think, especially if one has a lifetime’s commitment to physical fitness. My great uncle worked on the family farm in Texas and as a mechanic until the age of 80. He was as strong as steel….And remember the 80 year old who scaled Everest last year. Those who think they are going to just walk a little ways from their car and find the chest might want to think again. Those who think that Fenn was a typical 80 year old physically might want to think again.

      Also, in terms of “special places” in the wilderness, those of us who are gifted with the experience of going deep into the wilds know that a purity and magic exists there which does not grace those places more trammeled, no matter how majestic they may be…

  74. imagine the Chase is an onion….the poem would be the outer dry skin…the clues in the poem are the outer layers of the onion….but the heart of the onion is in the stories people….but you cannot see those layers until you successfully peel the onion a layer at a time….Forrest Fenn will make history as one of the best storytellers of all time when the chest is found…things are not always what they seem from the outside looking in….

    • Michael D

      I don’t post often so please allow me to be a bit long-winded, hopefully some people will be listening.

      First, welcome back, I was a bit harsh on you in response to your post a few weeks ago, but in participating in “The Chase” I have seen a lot of people come and go who were “sure” they knew where it was; 100% confident, knew without a doubt and yet, came back empty handed. Your blog post rubbed me the wrong way and I think you are a good person.

      I say it is important to watch out for grizzly (Brown) bears, but even more important to “look out for Karma”; Fenn believes in Karma, and I try not to ever be too cocky. Be humble or get humbled. This is a very difficult puzzle, “many layers of onion” as you correctly say. I will allow myself only 99% confidence in my solution because I have made 5 trips and I was pretty “sure” about all of them, the first trip more than any. I live a long way from NM and CO where I first searched and they were all long drives home, I assure you.

      Now, I have to convince my wife who has been very patient and supportive as to how and why I am so “sure” again. The difference is one year of solid Full Time research and 5 empty-handed trips under my belt. I have spent a lot of time and money on this, so my next trip will be my last and I have been trying to find a reason why I am wrong for a few months now, and I still cannot prove my solution wrong. When I read Fenn’s “books” (all of them) I see hundreds of clues. That cannot be coincidence. My imagination cannot be that good can it? I have a lot of confidence but I do not have the chest in hand either…yet.

      I have had some great experience and I have learned a lot about history and ridden a few steam-engine trains thru the Rockies, so beautiful and memorable. I have gone out into the wilderness alone. Fantastic experiences and well worth it. Thank you Major Fenn for being the catalyst.

      As I scolded you before Michael, I think it is in bad form to disclose Any clues or give any hints so I will not, sorry, don’t ask. I have worked too hard. If I go and fail again maybe I will write of my specific ideas to try to stir your imaginations.

      Like Brad said on these blogs a few days ago, Fenn is starting to accelerate his clues and wants it found, soon IMO. I am preparing Big Time for one more trip. That is the key. Make sure you are prepared and have done your research and can honestly say you have 99 % confidence, then maybe, maybe there is a 1 in 1,000 chance you are right. I am unemployed so money is tight but my wife is on board and will be waiting for me to return, just like Peggy was with Forrest all those 60 + years. Forrest, please– if you continue to be clever, I am hearing you loud and clear. Your secret may be revealed soon enough.

  75. there is so much truth here, i cant help it, i am getting high on truth

    hit me another bongload of truth brother

    “there MUST be a blaze when you arrive that only a fennaholic would recognize as a blaze..any tom ,dick or harry would only look at it in a casual and non-informative way…”

    i will tell you this, the blaze is where the poem says it is

  76. Michael D…ditto! Great sentiments and observation! I agree with you 100%. This is not any easy thing, we prey of the coyote, does! Just wish I could reduce down to a particle of dust and float into his brain and walk around his memories. I would find that one special “first time” memory and go to that spot. I feel that is where the chest is secreted, a place he shared with his dad. One that helped him grow confidence, provide, and made his dad proud…hum…a topic he has not talked about before. Sorry, I degress. There ya go, Mr. Fenn…Just trying to be logical! Am I close?! ¥Peace¥

  77. OK, Michael D. I see you have returned. Cog…What ever……I still think you are creative and too much drinky. LOL….can we just get back to MY WWWH. You get too diverted. Welcome back MD. So warm water or no?. and Oh……WWWH, does halt at a Glacier…..That is backwords…We are going UP…..A creek….

  78. oops… I mean some say WWWH at a Glacier. I mean to say, It does NOT halt at a Glacier. Unless there is something along these lines that are warm and I have not come across this. In my search, would be a rare thing.

  79. OK so I would like to say that WWWH is a very specific spot. Very, very, specific spot, and if you don’t find it, you don’t find the treasure………..imo

  80. Everyone say’s they know where WWH, but they do not know where the treasure is. So…..gator……Where is it? Everyone seems to know…….Do Please hint. at least .

  81. This has been fun reading. This is certainly no place for the meek. I found my WWWH in the answer to a child’s riddle. My Brown is banging his head on it. I have little expectation of actually finding the treasure, but it will be fun to go look.(I don’t even have a solve beyond the sixth clue.) The chance to chase in person is drawing nigh. Next month will be my first foray into the forrest. Wish me luck, as I wish the same for each and everyone of you. Especially my fellow crazies.

  82. Michael D
    Are you still planning on coming to New Mexico in June? I’m hoping we can meet for drinks/dinner and trade search stories. Cynthia

  83. OK. Forrest said that an architect wrote the poem ( I assume he was referring to himself.)
    So, my brain says, logically, “structure, form, design”.

    Has the thought of a crossword puzzle been mentioned before, Dal?

    Maybe you have to start with the first clue to have parts of the next clue and so on and so forth. Just wondering and occupying my mind while I fidget here at work, chomping on the bit to get searching.

    • My solution created a puzzle of words, but not a crossword puzzle. It’s hard to describe the “puzzle” I came up with, plus I don’t want to go into detail.

      But, the crossword puzzle idea is definitely a nice thought, and I did try something similar at one time.
      FF at one time said something like once you find contentment, everything else has fallen in to place. That statement did not necessarily have anything to do with the search, but you know how everybody uses everything he says as a clue, I’m not exempt from that group of people….because you never know. So, I thought, maybe if you list all of your locations for each clue, you’d get the word “contentment” going in a vertical direction. That wouldn’t work since contentment has 11 letters, and there are 9 clues. I did manage to get the word contentment when using the area name that I believe the chest is located in 3 times instead of just once. Additionally, the words of the places were off-set from each other, and not in order. So, I quickly came to the conclusion that he was just making a statement, and probably had nothing to do with the search, or more specifically, the solution. But, you never know….maybe it does, and I just have the wrong locations!

      I can’t wait to get out and search. We have our 3rd son due at the end of June, which is great, but complicates my ability to get out to the Rockies to search. If I get out there before he is born, and I just happen to find the treasure, I’d have to give serious thought to at least giving him the middle name of Forrest!

      • UP-
        I like your idea about forming the word contentment. It just may be that the poem was written with such a lateral-thinking-problem-solve in mind. Keep it up.

        And a big congratulations on your third son. Lucky guy!!

        Hope to see you out in CO sometime.

  84. OK Lou, I thought I was hinting, I can’t give my whole solve away, just yet. I am heading out west on the 20th, I need for the chest to still be there. I am just not looking forward to being in the wood, the rest of the trip should be awesome, except for that damn wwwood.

  85. There’s no assurance, upon casual observation, to know how well-travelled a location has been in the past based upon lack of evidence of signs, marks, or other evidence of humans. Many places were previously settled or well-travelled and later abandoned for years or centuries. There are many places in the Rockies where humans have lived but are now long gone. There are deep wildernesses in Central and South America where you could be standing in a remote jungle of old-growth trees that is apparently untouched by humans, and just below your feet is an abandoned settlement that hasn’t been ‘discovered’ yet. Many settlements around the world are being discovered by ground-penetrating radar. Nature reclaims and conceals.

    Nobody is going to happen upon the chest, because Forrest designed it that way. In selection of his location, and specific hiding/placement of the chest, he set it up so that it could be found only by someone who had solved the poem correctly and was overtly looking for it. That does not mean it’s impossible to find it by accident, just highly unlikely.

    The chest could be remote, but the chest location could also be readily accessible yet still satisfy the criteria that Forrest set out for it. I believe he has also made it very clear that it’s not extremely difficult or dangerous to access. He knew exactly where to hide the chest; he didn’t need to seek one.

    I agree that a casual hiker, flyfisher, etc., would not recognize the blaze as significant of anything. I believe this because the blaze, and every other element in the search as known by determining the correct solutions to the clues, have all been there long before Forrest and will continue to be there long after. The solutions to the clues lead to identifying essentially permanent elements (relative to lifetimes of people), as long as those elements are not altered or destroyed by dramatic environmental changes. The poem is an architectural drawing (an analog) that tells of a path that takes place in nature rather than of man-made elements.

    “The poem is really not so much written as it is an architectural plan.”

    “The treasure is where an elderly man put it so I suppose your kids would be in a safe place if they found it.”

    “Technology is not going to help you find that treasure.”

    “My best hours have been flying at 500 feet, looking for Indian ruins or following a river through a winding canyon, not knowing or caring where I might spend the night, even sleeping on a riverbank if there’s no motel.”

    “I knew where I wanted to hide the treasure chest, so it was easy for me to put one foot down and then step on it to get to the next foot. That’s what I did.”

    “I warned that the path would not be direct for those who had no certainty of the location beforehand, but sure for the one who did.”

    SYand42lbsHeavier,
    Halogetter

    • Yes, Halo, a very nice collection of quotes.

      The comment that sticks in my head is the one where ff gets back to his vehicle and laughs to himself asking, “Did I really just do that?” (my paraphrase)

      IN MY MIND, that would be the comment of one who did not have much time to think about what he had just done.

      Thinking out loud: [ He put the chest in a hollow he created from a rock pile, covered it up with some larger rocks to secure its place, turned with a smile on his face, and traipsed chuckling back to his vehicle only minutes away. Glanced up to the location one last time, looked up and down the back country road he came in on to see if he was detected, and hopped in. Then, as he fires up the ride, secures small items on the passenger seat, buckles up, shifts into Drive, and laughs to himself with his question.]

      If he had taken it on a long, arduous journey, IMO, he would have had lots of time to ask himself that question. By the time he reached his vehicle, he would have, IMO, been thinking of other things, like where he was going to dinner, what he would tell his wife about his trip, etc.

      That may be 100% incorrect as to how it happened, but it sure makes me smile.

    • “I warned that the path would not be direct for those who had no certainty of the location beforehand, but sure for the one who did

      where did this quote came from? thanks

  86. Would appreciate everyone’s thoughts and opinion on the following.

    1. How far is the chest from the blaze?

    2. If you are going up a creek and your effort is to be worth the cold. Must you at some point be in the creek in order to find the treasure?

    • Windsurfer,

      IMO:

      1. In the immediate area of the blaze, but not necessarily directly below the blaze. I’d say within 15 feet of the blaze, give or take. To me, he says “quickly” because it’s in the immediate area (the word quickly is related to the word immediate). Look quickly down = look in the immediate area.

      2. I believe your effort will be worth the cold is telling you that you have to cross the creek at some point. I don’t think that necessarily means you’d get wet….maybe just your feet. There’s always a good chance of getting at least a little wet while trying to cross a creek.

    • Windsurfer-
      Been thinking about your question 1. for a while. Still trying to decipher if the chest will be found right after I find the blaze OR if I will need to go to another location from the point in which I look quickly down (How far down will I have to Look? What direction?)
      I am trying to ensure I have several other ideas in an area/location when the first thought doesn’t pan out.
      So I’m at 3′ to 3/4 mile from an initial spot in which I view the area. From that spot I’m looking at 3′ to 500′ from there.
      Not sure if this makes sense but I really intend on being thorough.

      I do not plan (at this time) to actually be in a creek.

      • Your creek will be dry also built of cementhats where heavy loads come in and when he says your quest to cease he meansthe letter c as in culverto whatever thats aroundte blaze that that begins with c the creek is nothing more than amarker

  87. Hi all, I am trying to locate some information on the various types of land usage. I noted on the map it has the different governing bodies for a given type of land.
    I recall reading something sometime ago on this subject. Can someone direct me to those blog entries please.

    • Chad-
      Not certain what you are looking for. I assume you have the map. The land types are color keyed. The key is on the map. What else are you looking for.

      • I am looking for the rules associated with those colored keys for land usage etc. It was some time ago that I had read a discussion regarding the rules. I think it was on the previous blog. Example: A person may not remove artifacts from federal parks.

        • The artifacts law in national parks applies to items left there from the 1880’s or earlier. FF left/lost this ‘lost & found’ item c. 2010
          so yes, don’t take the natural/national treasures of the park, but it’s okay to collect other people’s 4-years-old litter, even if it’s worth 1-3 million $. 🙂

    • Chad, Back Country Navigator for phones and GE both have overlays that can be added. I have the one for BCN on my android and love it.

  88. My first comment – been “reading the mail” for months. Hallogetter – the first really cogent post I’ve read.

  89. IMO…begin with a warm water byway that runs down into a canyon, (thus halting and merging with a colder source forming a “y”, continue not too far, put in below hob (pueblo), cross over to nearby creek feeding into river via waterfall, (this is off tribal land now), blaze in the same area, near falls. Won’t go into further info location. This is my second spot. My first in WY/MT.

  90. Before i could get to the wood that held the title i had to break apart a square wall he built with stones that were so tightly built it was unbelievable the effort and time to build it, the wall was about three feet long one foot high and two feet wide it had masonary bricks on top of each corner in a little while i will tell you what the title said stay timed

    • It seems you can’t be sure of anything, many people have crazy ideas out there, but who’s to say that they’re not right? And, some have what seems to be great ideas, but again who’s to say that they are right, including mine? You just don’t know until it is found.

      Enjoy every minute of the search for this is the “Thrill”….the hunt(chase)that is…after it is found the thrill will only be a flash of memory, brought up to your attention when some sight, smell, sound or even sense or taste happens to strike it up. Good luck to everyone in the chase. Thank you for the chase Mr. Forrest Fenn…………Adios! 😎

  91. Have anyone heard of.rafter b this ahint by the way if you guys want go astray look at ansel adams photos below the photos it reads homee of the brown

    • In totc book where he sitting in one of the sites he unearthed he is.sitting beside some rocks those are some he used to build the wall i was talking about i have some of them in mypossition

      • When he was a dishwaser he became invovled in a group call the toadsters they were harmless it was just a.fun thing to do thete hang out was at imo if you go to secondculvertyu will see there on thecement bank there symbol and on the water.you will see water high on the other.side you will see a type of.blaze same one thats. In the book also the wood.grain in the book itsows the same ecact same stairs at imo also at the top it it shows the walk way path on top of the.dam and.one of the reasons. He shows.twins.in his.book is.because there are twin towersat IMO

  92. Hi all first time on the blogs be nice 🙂 !!! I don’t get it if you have worked it out why havent you got the chest ?and to all the people that say they know where it is why haven’t you got it ? It all seems to me like a lot of hot air !!!if I worked it out and I THINK I have I would not tell anyone for fear of eating my own words or someone else finding it !!! I’m flying from the uk in the next few weeks to my location !! With this said what should an English man do if they find the chest ?

      • This much I know to be certain. Who ever finds the chest will know what to do. No doubt in my mind at all.

    • I think most people who intimate that they know where it is are in the same boat you are. Waiting for weather, time and opportunity.

    • Top three things an Englishman should do if he finds Forrest Fenn’s Treasure Chest…
      3. Move to the Cayman Islands
      2. Pay the American Taxes
      1. Leave the chest where you found it.

      No disrespect. I couldn’t help myself.

      Good Luck & Travel Safe

    • It was mentioned once before, finances or obligations…who knows. Sometimes no amount is worth losing time with a loved one, or is a marriage and family worth ones pipe dream. Sometimes a person’s wealth is measured in the moment.

      Welcome to the States….we are BIG! Good Luck!

    • Wow! The UK! Well first off, I would like to know if anyone has traveled further than this to search for the infamous treasure. Bet there are some folks from Tokyo land, but that might be a tie…need to look at my Treasure Map to determine a winner.

      Well Mr. UK, we are so pleased to have you join all the searchers who have thus far been unblemished by success.

      My best advice is to have a great adventure and plan on finishing it off with a great big Texas style piece of humble pie…preferably a al mode …to pay tribute to your French neighbors.

      We wish you the very best of luck. If you find it, just let us know so we can celebrate a return to normalcy.

      Here is a safety tip for you. MIND THE GAP!!

  93. The question of ownership (if found) keeps surfacing. Consider this……Forrest is asking that the finder return the silver and turquoise bracelet. Does he really want that back?…….think again. OK…..you find the trove…..meet with Forrest to return bracelet. Simple, hand over the entire chest, Forrest says thank you and says “here, I would like to give this chest to you as a gift”…… Simple, you now own it!

    • It’s a metaphor…I am sure he would at this point for all the unexpected grief…like to be part of the end game…hence the IOU, IMO, wouldn’t you? Cart before the horse.

      • Here is what I believe: Forrest Fenn hid a chest filled with described items.
        Imo he would not waste time with an alias in any forums, he has books to write lol.
        I believe he may read some of the posts in the blogs just for some entertainment and possible inspiration for the next clue?
        Personally I take a lot of what FF has said as truth no matter how vailed in double meanings it may be. Now if you wish to chase a IOU be my guest, I am going for the chest.

    • Reply to my last comment…….sorry for the poor
      explanation. Yes, I believe he really would like to have his bracelet back and this would be done in the aforementioned exchange with Forrest.

  94. Saw a blog on here about a section of land at Yellowstone that is in Montana that might allow for someone to keep it.

  95. Ok now go to thrillof the chase book and find the pages that have the wood grain on the top is the walking path at lmo just remember imo is just part of chase Pp

    • With all due respect cog, what the heck are you talking about? I looked at every page and as others may have found no wood grain… Now you may be talking just to be talking. IDk. Know this: it is better to let people think me to be stupid, then to open my mouth and remove all doubt.

  96. I think the poem tells a story !!!!!!!:)
    After I search sometime in June I will post the story . As I have said it is my last search due to that I live in TX and work and responsibilities seem to take all my time. But this has been so Thrilling to me and I did make time for my research it has consumed me. I do wish every searcher the best of luck and safety . Thank u Dal for doing a lovely job with this blog.

  97. Hey there Cognito,

    I think you may be on to something…or on something…not sure. But, I can see how you might think that the “Blaze” is in fact the book. If you read the book cover to cover. Close the book or the “blaze” as you suggest, then look quickly down. What do I see? Yup! The chest full of the treasure on the back cover. Now, if I can just scan the image, put it into my 3-D printer, then voila!!..The treats are all mine!

    Great insight Cog. Never would have thought of it, but most sincerely I do love your commentary. It makes me think.

  98. Bog..im sorry Cog, I guess intsCog, you seem to be so beneath the shadows, i question your sincerity. However, your commentary as fun and deceptively amusing, it does take away from the journey at hand, why we are here, to find the treasure, to find fulfillment and better our own lives, to grow along the way and be better people to those we call family and friends, and share the experience, whether we are the ONE victor or not. We are the chasers who seek something beyond what daily life offers. We are the ones willing to venture. So person behind Cog, ty for adding one more layer, maybe a sorta boring, sorta not boring layer to the chase. But in the end, you add nothing more than a surreal layer of shittnappy doodles to the awesome search at hand. And PS, if Cog is ff, i am ffff and will never find the treasure, he is sure to move it, bc I have the solve and he knows it!

  99. Is it just me, or have others noticed that Cogs last couple of entries are so much easier to read? Almost perfect grammar. Hmmmmm

  100. Dal…..perhaps you can help with this one. Having trouble with the fact that Forrest included “riddles” in his list of things that people do not need to “know about” in their search for the treasure. I just can’t get around that.

  101. just because something offers a good solution or a positive solution doesn’t mean it’s the right solution. the fact that he said magnetic variation in this statement drives me nearly mad. I guess all I had was a positive solution

    • Navyigator,
      Fenn saying magnetic variation “will not assist”, means just that. It’s the same as if he said that “it is not part of solving the poem”. Don’t let it get to you. Aside from pilots and a few others, it has no meaning to people in general. Fenn wrote the poem so that it would be solvable (eventually) by anyone.

  102. That is correct. I’m not letting what he said effect my location because we have all used those tools . The poem tells u where it is at period use whatever u need to find the chest . Imigination is the source !!!!!!!:)

  103. http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/good

    good
    [good] Show IPA

    adjective, bet·ter, best.
    1.
    morally excellent; virtuous; righteous; pious: a good man.

    2.
    satisfactory in quality, quantity, or degree: a good teacher; good health.

    3.
    of high quality; excellent.

    4.
    right; proper; fit:

    Oh yes ! A “good” (proper) map

    http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/property?s=t

    Origin:
    1275–1325; Middle English proprete possession, attribute, what is one’s own, equivalent to propre

    A property map !

    http://www.casadelgavilan.com/gavilantrailmap.html

    Map of the Casa del Gavilan Property and Trails

    Someone want to whisper/ssh this ?

    It’s not what they say it is what they whisper.

    SSSHHHHHHHHHHHH

  104. OK. For all of you that have not put boots on the ground. Be careful. I have been looking for 2 years, and have been on 9 trips to “my area”. After leaving
    Texas at about 500 ft. ASL, and going to over 8000 ft., I get Mountain sickness.
    The last time, I was so sick from the altitude, that I thought I might die. You have
    to get used to the altitude before going to high. I always take my bear spray, and very glad I did. All I am saying is that you have to go slow and drink lots of
    water.

  105. Interesting how he puts GE on the equal with TTOTC but IMO he didn’t go far enough. He should have said mandatory material= GE

  106. I am a traveler of both time and space echos in mind.
    Some things to take into consideration;
    Imho Forrest hid the chest under something, so no need to dig up yellowstone. A fisherman without bait may roll over a log, yes?
    A good tracker follows foot steps.
    Would nine miles be too far to walk?

    Chad

    • It’s good to have guys like you hanging around, Chad. 🙂 There are so many things yet unknown. Should we demand a recount? Btw, I see you like that song, too.

      “Oh, Pilot of the storm who leaves no trace, like thoughts inside a dream…

      Oh, Father of the four winds, fill my sails, across the sea of years…

      …They talk of days for which they sit and wait and all will be revealed”.

      • Thanks JC,
        Often I think this just has to be wwwh and ask myself now where is the hob? Like a table top puzzle solver I try to fit the pieces together. Noting that many places can fit the descriptions given in the poem. Sometimes I just have to sit back and let my mind rest. In so doing a new perspective reveals itself. And so starts another avenue to follow. Ahhh the chase starts with the first step. 😉

  107. Tosses yet another worn copy of the poem on top of the stack of well worn copies covered with notes and perceived notions about astronomy, codes, cyphers and the like.

    Another night reading the poem as if it were a mantra, awaiting an insight to move to the forefront of my mind. Clearly a reread of TTOTC is in order.
    So many questions play on my mind. Like if I was in the area of the chest
    could I see WWWH and HOB?

    Meh going to bed and to sleep on these questions and a half dozen others.

  108. I think thAt this topic posted in the scrapbook section, eliminates the question Jenny asked about the C word in Feb of 2016. The info ff gave at the top of this scrapbook elimiNates riddles, and many other topics. Some of these scrapbooks, IMHO, are extra credit riddles or puzzles. IMHO, I would add geography to that last sentence ff wrote, of course; it goes hand and had with maps.

  109. You do know which question I am writing about right? Not TLGFI , but the one asking if clues are in these scrapbooks. (Little girl from India)

  110. What if:
    What if you were go to word 62 of this scrapbook 62.

    Some searchers overrate the complexity of the search. Knowing about head pressures, foot pounds, acre feet, bible verses, Latin, cubic inches, icons, fonts, charts, graphs, formulas, curved lines, magnetic variation, codes, depth meters, riddles, drones or ciphers, will not assist anyone to the treasure location, although those things have been offered as positive solutions. Excellent research materials are TTOTC, Google Earth, and/or a good map.f

    Word 62 is “and” in “and/or a good map,f” Since he has directed you to word 62, what if you were to anagram: and/or a good map,f
    The anagram of “and/or a good map, f” is “Do pod of anagram” meaning Do container of anagrams. This is why he does not mention anagrams in his quote. He wants you to go to word 62 and anagram it.

    Is it a coincidence that word 62 of scrapbook 62 directs you to the beginning of the solving of his poem? WHAT IF?

    • The quote from this Scrap Book is from this Scrap Book. You are viewing the origin. Scrap Books by Forrest on this site originate here. Hope this helps, Bal.

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