The Nine Clues…Part Thirty

yellowThis post is now closed to new comments but you can still read the comments.

This is the place to discuss the nine clues…For instance:
What are the nine clues…
Is the first clue “Begin it where warm waters halt” ?

911 thoughts on “The Nine Clues…Part Thirty

  1. This site has been under attack since about 5pm. Hundreds of attempts to break into the admin area of the blog. So far no effect…
    Goofy builds solid security systems..

        • @42……First thing I would do is remove all your naked photos from the iCloud. 😆

          I don’t like Apple stuff. Having said that I bought four IPads and handed them out to the kids and my wife. Facetime and grand babies are a good thing. Grandma is happy and I don’t have to configure machines all over the country. Life is good.

          Don’t use unsecured hot spots (Starbucks, motels, restaurants, libraries, etc.) Using an unsecured hot spot makes cracking your information like fishing at a trout farm. For example when you login to your email on an open network you are sending your login information through the air unencrypted. It just floating there for anyone to intercept, they don’t have to touch your machine.

          I’ve been telling businesses for years to set up secure wireless hot spots. It’s fine to put the password on a big sign so folks can get online. They could use it as a promotion if they wanted……..Login password: TripleBurger3bucks

          Anyone can login to the network but what this does is setup encrypted communication for each device on the network. It makes it exponentially more difficult to intercept your info.

          Here’s a website that explains in simple terms some ways to help secure you device. It’s kinda long but everyone should read it.

          • Goofy – appreciate your helpful security tips. Already following all the safe practices mentioned, and will read the link. Thanks.

          • Also speaking of ways to protect yourself never plug directly into your ISP, always go through a router. The hardware firewall block alone will deter a fair number of hackers (well on your home system anyway). I was once reloading a computer that was acting flaky (did turn out to be the motherboard in that case) when I was in a training class in Oklahoma and in the middle of the night it started hollering about having a new virus a mere 3 hours after the load only because it was plugged directly into the Cox modem they were using. I keep an old router around for trips if I bring my PC these days.

    • wonder who that might be?! keeping the crazies out is like running from zombies in zombieland everywhere you turn there they are again! haha good job on protecting the fort Dal!

  2. I just recently found your blog and learned about TC. FF sounds like a man I can respect and I share many off his beliefs. I have ordered the books and look forward to being a part of TTOTC.

  3. I do not think someone who thinks like most people will ever have a chance of finding the treasure chest. Mr. Fenn knows that. That is why it is so difficult to find the hidden chest. We do not think it is that easy to find it, but make it harder and harder each time. The more we look, the harder, and further it gets from out minds. My advise is to follow the clues of the poem. If you have not found it that only means your way of thinking is the wrong one to find the poem with. Think in simple terms, and if your “way” does not work out, then think in even simpler terms. I think the poem is easier than we believe it is, and the poem is just an illusion of what Mr. Fenn really is saying.

    Remember the magic tricks magicians used to do at parties? I think the poem is like that. One thinks Mr. Fenn is saying something because it is “common” belief, and he knows that. This is an example: If someone were to ask anybody how deep is a hole, common belief is something like, “that is next to impossible to know”. Mr. Fenn would say something like, “why don’t you ask whoever dug the hole? It is my opinion. RC

    • Nice break down RC. There is always another way to look at it more simple or even more thorough. I was thinking a child might read the poem and say ‘maybe the first for lines are being said by four different people’, fairly simple. Follow each person’s story and you have your X.

      • the X is over the d in “and,” between loads and water. there are 9 lines forming this possible blaze. San Juan Fork is clear. The blaze is a kite. If i mirror it, the blaze is a butterfly. The string literally goes down “to the gold.” if i mirror it, the string becomes the 2nd antenna. i wish someone wanted to discuss this further.

        • i am always down to exchange emails. I def have had ideas ppl here seem to completely disregard. jjohnson2022 at gmail dot com.

          • Navigator, you’re right; some just disregard things they don’t agree with; which is fine and probably a good idea.

            But some of us don’t comment because we just don’t understand the line of thinking. It seems the commenter expects everyone to understand a line of thinking they have been working on for weeks or months or even years, so it’s obvious to them, but not to us. And they are being cryptic so they don’t give too much away; so it really gets difficult to understand what they are talking about.

            And lets face it……some of us are just plain slow. There are days I have no idea what folks are talking about. It’s way past anything I understand.

          • Navy – anyone who dismisses your ideas would be foolish as they are always intelligent and well reasoned thru. I hesitate to bother others with my questions, but appreciate the opportunity to exchange ideas. I have a couple of questions about my own approach I would like to email you. Ok to do so? And is your email secure.

        • Goofy, the commenter hopes, not expects. It’s a hope I’m not crazy in the lines of my thoughts, and that someone might understand, and might want to talk.

        • Navy & Leigh – I don’t have time today but would enjoy further discussing your kite and butterfly mirror image theories as my solve employs similar ideas. both types of images are hinted at in totc. Perhaps we can link up later today or tomorrow. Best, level42

        • cramer……I believe that I know what you are describing…..I’ve been there many times. There is certainly an X between loads and water. I’ve searched there among other places in the area. I can see why most people don’t get it, it’s not common knowlege. Keep searching and good luck to you.

        • Nice thread of hope, in the blanket of the chase. Open minds will change the world. Peace to Ireland….

          Looking forward to some focused convo on kites, butterflies, right angles, and more..

          I can’t help but think the solution is a combination of stories, hints, and clues that tie into a big picture that reveals ‘the spot’.

          Maybe 59 books and a lot of beers later you might find it.

  4. Remember Mr. Fenn is always telling the truth, but not all the truth. It is up to us to try to find out what “the other side of the story is”. RC.

    • Lol, so true! I had a brother like that. Best story teller ever! People loved him.. But u had to pick and choose what u wanted to take from them.

  5. FYI, I have been an active lurker for a quite awhile now as well as active researcher, thinker, and searcher in the field. I feel that I want to share some thoughts and contribute, or at least possibly share some thought provoking stimulation with others involved in the chase.

    Something interesting to ponder which has already been beaten on for quite awhile now.

    “Many are giving serious thought to the clues in my poem, but only a few are in tight focus with a word that is key.” From jenny kile mysterious writings

    What if the “key” word is not from the poem and just seems to imply it is from the poem? Some have referenced words described as key from totc as well but outside of the poem.

    Consider “in tight focus” implication, meaning the “eye” in tight focus, or an “iris”? Iris the goddess was the personification of a rainbow for example.

    Consider “word that is key”, possibly meaning exactly that, the word that is “key”, thus keyword is “key”?

    Read it over again and let me know what you think, oh and disclaimer, this is just my opinion, lol.

    • We have been using some words erroneously so it is next to impossible to try to think like Mr. Fenn. Our way of thinking has been pounded into us by the media, parents, teachers,relatives, book,etc. So we do not think about what words really mean, we just use them as we were taught how to use them. Most words have different meanings but most of us only know one, or two at the most. I think the best way, and probably the hardest way to solve the poem is to find out the meaning of every, and each of the words in the poem, and think logically, disregarding any former knowledge of the meaning of the word. I think that is a good way to go about it. Sorry for being so redundant. It is my opinion. RC

      • What about ..instead of the meaning.. But i how u cld use them?
        The many ways to say something without saying that at all but leading the general audience to thnk that ?
        Sorry, maybe thats lame!

      • I believe you are talking about the word HALT. For some reason, people think this means CONVERGE, as in where two rivers meet. But he says HALT. That means STOP. So, where do warm waters STOP, not converge?

        Again, this is just IMHO, but I don’t see how HALT can translate to MIX.

          • Thanks, Kyote. I won’t give too much away. Even if you guess the starting point, you have to get the distance right, and that is not easy.

            I can tell you I have searched that area high and low. I have one last spot to check there, and I am going to do it tomorrow. So, I am not too worried that anyone will beat me there.

            But, I love the race….

          • its too late

            i am now on your path

            the only path in the Rockies where there is water and then it stops

        • Intheknow: your confidence in the definition of halt is admirable and may correct, however, I also completely understand how some interpret it to mean “converge”. Think of the word “haltingly” and the fact that the word can be a noun, verb, or adjective. Poems in general are not easily parsed and this one is more difficult than it may first appear. On top of that, words like “halt” have so many different meanings, some common, some obscure, which is why figuring this poem out is so difficult. I think some focus on railroad stops because a “halt” can be a railroad flag stop. Challenging eh?

          • It is challenging. But, consider this: my WWH is so by both name AND action. I realize that Haltingly can be used in multiple ways, but even when waters are slowing down, due to mixing or elevation changes, they are still not Halting. I don’t think you spend 15 years on one poem only to use one word for lack of a better one, because it doesn’t rhyme.

            I am taking an extremely simple approach to the poem, but I have found some interesting things. For instance, according to my solve of course, DOWN can mean UP. For instance, what if you are standing at a point, and it says look down, so you look SOUTH, but looking SOUTH actually means looking UP, in elevation.

            Again, I could be ALL kinds of wrong. I like statistics so that I can analyze probabilities, and I have a better probably of birthing a litter of kittens than I do at finding the treasure. But, since no one has found it yet, I will have to both assume that I am right, and that I am wrong.

        • I see two ways WWH.

          1. Warm Waters that suddenly become cold.

          2. Waters that remain waters (i.e. do not freeze) but go nowhere….ever!

          3. My favorite…the sky. In fact here they not only halt but dissappear.

          C’mon folks. please add to the list.

          • A place where life halts, or friendship, faith or trust halts….a batttle field, a cemetery, a hanging tree, a broken treaty. A place where youth halts, a coming of age place, a graduation or military induction place, or a memorial of such an event ….

          • Wind & OldShadows: more WWWH

            1. basin landform (trapped h20)
            2. ‘warm’ meaning chemically altered by uranium would halt where there are no chemical deposits
            3. at the cross of Christ – His side was pierced, and warm waters flowed to a halt in death
            4. there are no warm waters where hydroelectric power stops
            5. In the Webster’s NC dictionary the words warm – waters halt at the word ‘watts’
            6. Oceans are warmer than fresh water, so you could argue at the oceans
            7. if your big toe is stuck in the tub faucet, wwh at your feet
            8. Forrest discusses how he hated childhood baths in a cold basin of water in a cabin without water/elect. WWH at his summer home in WYS.
            9. Ice: all flowing water is warmer than ice.

          • Mark – my last solve was hot, and all trails ran cold. I’ve been working on a completely new solve but not liking my HOB options. Have 2 targets in narrow focus, but not able to make the darn poem match as well as my last solve.

          • I was trying to show that sometimes, hot, warm and cold can mean something other than temperature. I do not think that is the case here, but you never know.

          • Mark J. – I agree with you that warm waters halt could and does mean something other. imo death, and the end of childhood innocence via war are the loudest statements made in the memoirs. Understanding “My War For Me” and Catcher in the Rye are critical to all on the chase.

          • jmb – trick tank, a new one on me. heavy loads may bezip lines, power poles, other man made contraptions high above.

          • Who does this sound like?
            You have talent, charm and luck. You can succeed in art and in any occupation. You attract peculiar experiences. Your power and protection lies in spiritual side of life. You are an enthusiastic collector and you will be tenacious in holding onto the things you accumulate. You have a good memory and should make an effort to have a positive attitude. Emergencies may raise your intuitive abilities in order to resolve conflict or situation. You become very creative under the pressure, and have quite original ideas to make the best out of it.
            You desire to inspire and lead, to control other’s affairs. You are giving, courageous and bold, action oriented,energetic and strong willed. You want to make a difference in the world, and this attitude often attracts you to cultural interests, politics, social issues, and the cultivation of your creative talents.
            The description surfaced while researching a place on a map that I hope to search and ties to Sloane’s German name. I think names and their symbolism are important to ff – imo.

          • No jmb, not near trick tanks. If they be wwwh, I’m too far north and the NM or southern CO searchers paying attention are in luck.

          • Underwood?
            From 1874 the Underwood family made typewriter ribbon and carbon paper, and were among a number of firms who produced these goods for Remington. When Remington decided to start producing ribbons themselves, the Underwood’s decided to get into the business of manufacturing typewriters.[2]

            The original Underwood typewriter was invented by German-American Franz Xaver Wagner, who showed it to entrepreneur John Thomas Underwood. Underwood supported Wagner and bought the company, recognizing the importance of the machine. Underwood No. 1 and No. 2s, made between 1896 and 1900, had “Wagner Typewriter Co.” printed on the back.[2]

            The Underwood No. 5 launched in 1900 has been described as “the first truly modern typewriter”. Two million had been sold by the early 1920s, and its sales “were equal in quantity to all of the other firms in the typewriter industry combined”.[3] When the company was in its heyday as the world’s largest typewriter manufacturer, its factory at Hartford, Connecticut was turning out typewriters at the rate of one each minute.

            Underwood started adding addition and subtraction devices to their typewriters in about 1910.

            Philip Dakin Wagoner was appointed president of the Elliott-Fisher Company after World War I (1914-1918). Elliott-Fisher became the parent of the Underwood Typewriter Company and the Sundstrand Corporation. In 1927 Wagoner reorganized the company into Underwood-Elliott-Fisher, which later became the Underwood Corporation.[4] The reorganization was completed in December 1927.[5] John Thomas Underwood was elected chairman and Wagoner president of Underwood Elliott-Fisher.[6]

            In the years before World War II, Underwood built the world’s largest type writer in an attempt to promote itself. The typewriter was on display at Garden Pier in Atlantic City, New Jersey for several years and attracted large crowds. Often, Underwood would have a young woman sitting on each of the large keys. The enormous typewriter was scrapped for metal when the war started.[7]

            During World War II Underwood produced M1 carbines for the war effort.

            In 1945 Wagoner was elected chairman of the board of Underwood, and Leon C. Stowell was elected president. Wagoner remained chief executive.[8] Olivetti bought a controlling interest in Underwood in 1959, and completed the merger in October 1963, becoming known in the US as Olivetti-Underwood with headquarters in New York City, and entering the electromechanical calculator business. The Underwood name last appeared on Olivetti portable typewriters produced in Spain in the 80s.[

            Deriving from the Old English “under” a preposition meaning “under” or “below”, plus “wuda”, a wood. The name was originally given to one dwelling at the foot of a wood or literally “below the trees of a forest”. The name may also be locational from three places named with these elements i.e., Underwood in Derbyshire, England, Underwood, Nottinghamshire, England. The surname is first recorded in the latter half of the 12th Century (see below). One William Underwude appears in the 1219 Assize Court Rolls of Yorkshire, and a William under the Wode in the 1332 Subsidy Rolls of Staffordshire. From the beginning of the surviving parish registers in 1559 there were Underwood’s recorded in Pickering parish, North Yorkshire, England.[2] On 2 January 1634, one Joseph Underwood, aged 23 yrs., embarked from London on the ship “Bonaventure” bound for Virginia. He was one of the earliest recorded name bearers to enter America. No less than seven Coats of Arms were granted to families of this name; a particular name bearer mentioned in the Dictionary of National Biography was one Michael Underwood (1737–1820) who practiced in London as a surgeon and as a “male-midwife”. The first recorded spelling of the family name is shown to be that of William de Underwode which was dated 1188, in the “Records of Bury St. Edmunds, Suffolk”, during the reign of King Henry II, known as “The Builder of Churches”, 1154 – 1189.

          • Wow jmbg! What a history, and an influential one which changed history’s written word literally and certainly influenced the trajectory of Mr. Fenn’s life. Thanks for an interesting read today. Are you further researching any of it to link it to the poem?

          • When the indians joined together and run the spanish out of New Mexico, was there a treaty of some kind that was broken
            Could be water (warm as in temp) then halting….. but to me “water seems to obvious”
            also “put in” is a phrase used by hikers to tell others which trail head they will be starting at…
            Remember Forrest is good with words…as we all know that…. good luck to you….

          • all of the rocky mountains freeze in the winter…… everything above 5000 ft . gee that should help…lol Forrest is an expert with words…. Things mean more than what meets the eye….

          • I will play along…

            what if it is “not” the “water” that halts…

            but “what” the waters “halt”…?

    • You’re right Steve……..We are definitely missing something. Is it mind numbingly complicated or slap your forehead simple?

      I tend to look at the poem like a Rubik’s Cube. It looks overwhelming, but the maximum number of face turns needed to solve any instance of the Rubik’s Cube is 20. You just need to figure out which 20.

      All we need is 9 correct moves to solve the poem.

      • G_O_G…IMO… it is slap your forehead simple…

        I sure hope I can head west in the next week or two to prove or disprove my solution…When I do, I intend to show everyone how simple my solution reads…

        I will do this because I will make only one trip to one location so it won’t matter to me if everyone knows what I found hidden in the poem after that…I will prove myself right or wrong…And I don’t believe I’m wrong on this one…

        “We are definitely missing something.” is 100% correct…Some won’t believe it even when they see it…

        “9 correct moves” is exactly right, in more ways than you can know right now…

        A Rubik’s Cube analogy is OK, but there is a better device to use which I will explain as I give up my solution once I’m on my way…

        You G_O_G will definitely get a kick out of this one!…

        • Sam Smith – I believe in the simple method as well, but with hidden confirmations found in the poem. That said, I believe Mr. Fenn spent 10+ years making it deeply layered and amazing! IMO the poem could be solved in reference to coordinates, poetry, history, fly water, types of trout, ecology, art, his mentors, his families names, Native American lore, and perhaps most importantly Forrest’s memories. (oh, and I forgot Uranium for GG & MkD).

          • Swan,

            All mighty interesting for reading I’ll bet, but much study results in little wisdom… For myself, everything I have is directly from the poem itself…From the words in the poem only…

            When I first started the chase over a year and a half back, I went looking at virtually every reference anyone might come up with on the blogs in my feeble attempts to figure out this poem of Mr. Fenn’s…Iwas all over the map with everyone else…

            It took a while before I realized the people that had been in the chase 2 years or more before me were still looking at and arguing over the same stuff that I was as a newbie…They still are today!…And Nada!

            Something just didn’t seem right, it just didn’t compute…Then, out of the blue, a searcher sought a collaborator and I responded…Details aren’t necessary, but we struck an accord and he shared his info with me after his last failed search…He knew his solution was incomplete…

            He asked me to finish the solution and we’d split if I could find the chest…Then he virtually disappeared, no contact since…It’s been 10 months now…No idea what happened to him…

            One look at what he showed me and I forgot everything else I’d heard discussed on the blogs…I realized exactly what I was looking at and haven’t changed my mind one bit…Just haven’t been able to afford a trip…

            If one must follow the clues precisely, I can see no other method working better than this one and the results it produced…
            I hope to know for sure very soon…

            I will give you one piece of advice…The most important statement that Mr. Fenn ever uttered was, “all the information you need to locate the treasure is in the poem”…He meant what he said…Heed his advice…

          • Sam Smith, I say this with the utmost respect… If I were as smart as you or inside of Forrest Fenn’s mind, I would need only the poem. But I do need TOTC book and my good map to play his game. Anything I read is to gain a bit of understanding about Forrest or his TC contents. Maybe he knew there would be others like me who weren’t genius level puzzle solvers and so wrote his companion books. You are correct about following the blogs. Before ever following a blog I had solved the poem fully myself and still believe my solve holds up against some of the best which have been posted, even empty handed.

          • I am in pretty much the same boat except the solution I have I came up with on my own. Is the the correct one, I don’t know. I just need a way to find out as I also do not have the means to go there.

          • Sorry to answer so late jmbguidry…Just saw the question…

            Don’t mind sayin’ I’ll be on my way to WY as soon as I can…

          • Not out for fun itct…

            Just goin’ for the gold…and no hunting necessary…

            Confidence rating = 100%

            You can laugh now… 😀

          • Sam –

            I was not laughing at you to begin with. I have my own thoughts on where it is =

            and you have your simple ones –

            just that simple.

            I have always thought the KISS principle was involved. If my idea is not correct – I would hope someone finds it within my life time.

        • Sam,
          I have always believed the poem to be simple and straight forward. I also believe the TC is in WY.
          Good Luck Sam in your search.

          • Thanks to all you guys and gals for the good luck wishes…Think we all could use a little now and then…

            @itct…not being disrespectful with the comeback, it was a tongue in cheek comment…I’m not really a smarta**, just come across that way sometimes I suppose…

            I must necessarily by cryptic when I comment here…Too many very astute people on the blogs…It is easy to give this away if I’m not careful, it is that simple and straight forward…

            @Swan, Rick, G_O_G, Mark, and others…The KISS principle works well with this poem…Mr. Fenn used a simple device to hide information in the poem…It took another to show it to me I must admit, he deserves his share for that…

            The beauty of it lies in the fact that absolutely nothing gets changed in the poem, not the words or their arrangement, not even the punctuation…

            It is a simple trick with words that worked very well here…I’m sure everyone will appreciate how cleverly Mr. Fenn used it in his poem when it’s exposed…

            It does result in the location we all seek…When I can reveal it openly, I’m certain you will understand…

            Til then I sit here certain of the location of my retirement fund yet unable to travel to recover it and take it home…It’s frustrating and aggravating to say the very least…When I can remedy the situation, I will…I feel the chest will still be waiting when I can do so, it’s that well hidden…

          • The straightforward part is what I have a problem with… You know that Sam… Here’s what I mean.

            When reading or looking at the poem what is it, that is so straightforward? the way it is read… the way it is designed… the way it is interpreted…etc. This IMO is what confuses most searchers… How can a straightforward literature be so difficult at the same time? that no one as discovered the chest.

            Some have got the first couple of clues correct… but did they even know it?

            Everyone reads the poem for what it is… a poem. Or some even read it as a story, are we actually doing it correctly?! I’m not one to pick apart everything Fenn states, but “Difficult but not impossible”, “straightforwards” and “over complicating the poem”, statements seem to throw me off, more than help.

            If some had gotten the first few clues correct, How did they not know the rest of the clues!!! is it interpretation or something else?

          • @seeker…My perception is that the major block to solving the poem is interpretation…

            No two humans think alike…We are each the product of our being raised in a particular environment unique to each person…Even siblings, raised together have differing thought processes and methods of interpreting the world around them…

            If all were alike and thought the same, we would be nothing more than drones in a giant species colony…But we, as humans, possess free will to think, believe and act according to our individual needs and desires…

            What may seem simple and straight forward to one person may be a stumbling block incomprehensible to another…I know this because I am human…You cannot see through my eyes anymore than I can see through yours…I cannot possess your thoughts as you cannot possess mine…

            In this poem I found something simple to me…A trick as I see it for hiding more than is readily available to the eye in a reading of a story, a poem or whatever you may consider Mr. Fenn’s writing…

            Once I saw this trick, it became straight forward to me what he had done to hide information needed to locate the chest and the method I must use to read the directions given…What had been difficult to comprehend became simpler to understand for me…

            How to read it, the design he employed, and the interpretation of what he was saying all became clearer for me…I cannot do this for you or anyone else…I can explain it from my perspective, but can you comprehend it’s significance from yours? That is our difference as humans…

          • Sam Smith – I believe Forrest and his dad would encourage each of us to “grab every banana” and enjoy eating the fruit. So, in the spirit of the chase… will you disclose your interpretation secret to me as your mentor did for you? I’m reaching for a branch of bananas and will try to be a worthy student. Someone had to ask 🙂

        • Sam, I have been thinking about what you posted al day. Yes, I enjoy all your post as well. Yet, you say “prove or disprove”. It tells me 100% does not fit. Sorry but that’s how I read it like kEEP iT sIMPLE sAM? Just a little kiss theory. I normally don’t call anyone but home.


        • Sam Smith – I would like to talk with you offline if you are willing. Your comments over the last few days alluding to your solution are, as I would say, reminiscent of how I would be apt to describe my approach to solving the nine clues; and we are in the same state. Some high level questions would quickly flush out if our approaches might be similar, and if they are, I would enjoy additional talks with someone thinking somewhat along the lines as I do. Let me know if you are interested.

    • open your mind to “secret” as the word that is key. (a possible word that could be key AKA it’s what they whisper… ) backwards, secret=terces i’ve thought it meant 13s (as terce is 13 in spanish). but “begin it ‘where’ ” (backwards from the earliest where) erehw terces which translated could be
      e row 13 S (the S in wiSe– row 13 S) i do believe you physically draw the blaze on the poem.

    • I dunno, i know that there is a certain way to read the poem that u end up with the spanish word for key, and i thought i was onto something, but ill be danged if i know what it is.

  6. *.*Winter comes early to the high country. snow on the ground in portions of Montana today as low as 5000 ft. Warming back up, but go prepared if you’re in the mountains.

  7. Spend your whole life time exploring hunting packing and treasure hunting in the mountains. After you do that for about 40 years then and only then you will know and understand what FF is writing about. There are some that comprehend clearly with ease . IMO

  8. I think it is important to figure out the direction words. Generally down would mean go south, but if it relates to water, going down the stream could mean go north if the river flowed that way, couldn’t it?

    • And I know many of you have been working on this for up to four years and there is no way I can look through all that has been said to see if this has been discussed…so…could you tell me if you have considered that another meaning of halt is a small stop for a train and that warm waters may be the pacific ocean? I know FF loves history, but has he talked about specific train related stories?

      • Kat; trains and narrow gauge trains have been a favorite of many searchers. Very interesting history, and more widespread than you would think.

        I remember a few talking about the Pacific Ocean, Gulf of Mexico, and the Gulf Stream.

        • Lol..lots of questions..I have 2 ways of interpreting the clues and 2 different spots I’m interested in. So think I will wait to see what nuggets I can get out of his books about my train interpretation first. They should be here (Wa state) in a few more days.

    • As a matter of fact yes trains have been discussed alot. This solve made it into a Santa Fe newspaper.

      Ride the train down the canyon along the Animas River to Silverton, Colo. From Durango, Silverton is at a higher elevation. However, “take it in the canyon down” refers to a direction, not a lower altitude.

  9. look up the warm waters of the gulf of Mexico. Now if we were in the mountains and I saw a small stream and i told you to follow it till it halted you woud go untill it flowed out of the spring at the source. you would then come back and tell me it halted where it began flowing.( Right) out of the spring.

  10. Aspen/Kat..
    I think that if a person was following Forrest’s poem like a map and found themselves on the Yellowstone or Madison or any number of rivers that flow into the wide Missouri and taking it in the Canyon down…you could go either downstream., which would be north
    down cartographicly when your map is properly oriented, which is to the south.

    Explore all options would be my suggestion..

    There are so many options…
    So many choices..
    You can be at this for awhile if you don’t make the right choices..or maybe even if you do…

    • dal could you point to the picture where ce5 is on the treasure chest I cant find a picture clear enough to see it thanks

      • Frank-
        If you have a TTOC book..I think the pic that shows it off best is the back cover. I don’t have my book with me..maybe someone can check on that…
        There was a guy who posted a great pic of it with the CE5 enhanced…
        I’ll see if I can figure out where that is..
        I’ll be back..

      • Frank-
        Three things about CE5 mark on the chest..
        1. Forrest sent Deb an email which she shared on the blogs. It stated the following:
        “The CE5 cannot help you in any way. It is only my cost code to tell me what I gave for the chest. That information is on the blogs somewhere. You have an inquiring mind. f”
        2. Here is the location of Ed’s “enhanced” image from the book:
        Look here:
        3. All this talk came about because of Pam Sheltron’s claim that she found the treasure. A crucial element in her solution was the CE5 mark. According to Forrest she did not find the treasure…and Forrest told us that he never even heard of the location she claimed as the solution to the poem until Pam started talking about it. So I would be very cautious about giving that mark any weight.

        • thanks dal I will take your advice I just wanted to see it for my self didn’t know if it was true or just talk thanks again

        • Dal,
          I never thought CE5 had anything to do with the trove location but I do feel the contents including the chest can provide insight. Couple of things that have bothered me about the explanation.
          1) “That information is on the blogs somewhere.” – have you ever seen that information prior to that comment? – I haven’t.
          2) Cost code – the trove was purchased long after the gallery was sold so why does he need to put on a cost code? It was only bought for one reason.
          3) FF was upset when the silver bracelet was cleaned up and the patina removed because it changed it from the original state. Antiques are best untouched. So why put a mark on a 13th century antique?

          The Wolf

          • Wolf, I’ve only been following blogs for 2 1/2 years, and not all of them, but, in all the discussions about CE5 that I have seen, I’ve never seen the statement about CE5 being a cost code so I agree with all 3 of your points. Even if it was a cost code, why put it in such a prominent place as it mars the look of the old chest? Wouldn’t you put a cost code on the bottom of the chest on a sticker that could be easily removed so as not to leave a permanent mark? The CE5 mark and Forrest’s remark about it just seems strange to me.

          • Wolf-
            I don’t read the other blogs except for Richard’s and Jenny’s. So I don’t know what was out there in the bigger picture. I do not remember anything about it elsewhere (but I have the retention skills of a colander). I searched CE5 on the comments on this entire blog and the earliest mention is JD’s in April of 2013:

            Your second question…I can guess, but honestly, I don’t know. Only Forrest knows. But I believe him when he says that it will not help me find the treasure. So I am happy to forget about it. I have so many concerns and questions about the poem and the location of the chest that if Forrest is going to tell me up-front that CE5 is nothing that will help me find the chest, then I am happy to move on to one of my other 5,000 questions.

            Your third question…
            Many collectors mark their collectibles…museums mark them and catalogue them so they will know the price paid and date of purchase and where it came from. These marks are not necessarily placed in a way that damages the object. They can often be removed without damaging the object. I remember seeing dinosaur bones, fossils and other wonderful objects that had a dab of white paint carefully applied and on the white paint was scribed a code in black letters…not unlike Forrest’s CE5. This code led to a citation in a catalogue somewhere that gave the history of the piece..where it was found, by whom, when, how much the museum paid for it…etc…
            Some would be appalled that a museum would apply such a mark…Others would say that it is an essential part of collecting for the greater good. The provenance of a piece is sometimes as important as the piece itself.
            Without having the chest in hand it is difficult to determine the mark’s permanence. But I am guessing that if Forrest put it on it was only intended to last as long as the chest was not exposed to deteriorating conditions and that the mark would disappear long before the bronze would be effected by exposure to sun, water, snow, etc…

      • Another little bit opf info, not that’s gonna help, Forrest mentioned in one of the interviews with Lorene, that he paid $25,000 for the chest.

        I always thougth that CE5 was his coded sticker price of $35,500 not what he paid (of course C=3 E=5, CE5=355)

        I can see him paying 25,000 and sell it for 35,000

  11. Down: to or toward a point away from the speaker or the speaker’s point of reference.

    Look quickly down? Vertical?

    • Sally,

      Down choices in my view. Down south, downstream, down vertically, down-the-line, down your nose, and best of all….

      quickly down, your quest (?) to (2) cease (omega).

      all courtesy of GE.

  12. Just a reminder, Forrest did state that “Not ever word is a clue”. To me that means not every word or for that matter, every sentence is a clue.

    • you are talking about the poem right?

      what he said was related to the book TTOTC

      Not every noun in TTOTC is a hint.

      regarding the poem he said

      There are a few words in the poem that are not useful in finding the treasure Phil, but it is risky to discount any of them.

      • This after the fact statement from FF is one that I find very interesting. Not all the words will help locate the trove… But the still seem to be necessary to the solve of the poem.

        We all have done the counts of the stanzas and the number of lines and the number of sentences etc. Are the number of words use important to the solve of the poem? The total?, the sentences count?, in each line?

        Why are they risky to discount them? is the question that needs answering.

  13. The 4th line of the poem feels very unnatural. The rest of it flows very smoothly, but that one is uncomfortable. The “and” doesn’t fit right. We know its on purpose, he refined the puzzle for years, but why the word “and” at that spot.

    ____ AND hint?
    If secret and hint, then the word “where” in sentence 3 becomes the uncomfortable word. Put in only to make the rhyme and rhythm work?
    If not secret AND hint then what is “AND hint” continuing?

    I hope i explained that well enough! Is anyone bothered by that AND or even notice this?

    • Well Kat, I probably shouldn’t respond because I’m a math guy. I passed college English/lit out of pure pity from the professors. Add my Texas accent and some folks don’t think I speak English at all.

      To me the “and” in the second line is the one that doesn’t fit. It’s like he forced it in to match the fourth line which does make sense to me. There’s no need to go into a dissertation about how wrong I am and how I obviously don’t understand simple sentence structure……I concede, I’m sure you’re correct. If you were from Texas you would just say:

      Thanks for the reply Goof……..Bless your heart.

          • For myself, I’m not too concerned on the proper use of words and placements. I’m more interested in why they are used.

            Most searcher dismiss the capital letters in the beginning of each line as poetic writing. This may stand true in poetry, but as Goofy pointed out some words seem forced and I believe there is a reason for having that “And” or any of the other words Capitalized and placed.

            In one instance they are used in combination with hoB. I have yet to find another use for them, if there is one. The other words, such as There’ll, you’ve, it’s… seem to be placed for reasons as well…. There will be no paddle up your creek,… works quite well, but add another words to that line. is there a reason the Author wanted just 7 words in that line?

            Just food for thought.

        • Ed, that’s it. That was the only stanza I could not make work. It is perfect. You get title to a bone.

          • Gey, good luck on your upcoming trip this Sunday, but you never know if someone (perhaps The Phantom) may have already beaten you to the punch or should I say gravy bowl. Don’t forget to take along your waders & head lamp just in case & look over your shoulder as you go down that hill; you never know if there is someone or something watching your every move; I’ll be there with you in spirit, as your heart pounds with anticipation. It’s the uphill battle that will be the killer, but once you’ve reached the top you’ll experience complete exhilaration.

          • Thanks Anne, I do know exactly what I am looking for. There really isn’t much climbing. I only have to search between 5000 and 5100 ft in elevation. Yet, I do have a feeling someone will be watching. It will take me 2 days to get there. The first day I will be watching them blazing in all kinds of directions. Then I will go in, not far, on the second day to pitch my wagon against the western sky that only last for a short time. I can’t wait to smell the fresh air and the Ponderosa’s around the bend.
            From there, is my last stop to show the world that it isn’t there anymore.

            Anne, I will keep you and all the chasers in my thoughts as well. Peace

      • Goofy and Kat,

        The “And” does not bother me. I think the placement is important, but of more importance I believe is the use of a comma throughout.

        For example. “Begin it where warm waters halt And take it in the canyon down” There is no comma after “halt”. To me, this means that these events/situations occur simultaneously.

        In my latest attempt at a viable solve, “it” indeed begins WWWH and simultaneously “it” begins when you start down the canyon. In fact, I have two different scenarios for “it” that are mile apart and both take you to the “put in” point.

        Similarly, “If you’ve been wise and found the blaze.” no comma after “and”. In my solve attempt the blaze is exactly at the point of being “wise”.

        Also, “just heavy loads and water high”. No comma again. Suggesting that “heavy loads and water high” occur simultaneously.

        So far….I excel at failure …so TIFWIW.

    • I have posted this before but I will throw it out there again for discussion. Lines 2, 4, and 6 begin with And (capitalized). Line 8 ends with Brown (capitalized). Butterfly = flutterby. And = Dan. Line 8: “Put in” And = Dan Brown.
      That is only one of the “aberrations at the edges” of the poem.

      • well not that the whole poem is proper sentence structure but on this one it is correct in that a comma before ‘and’ is used when followed by an independent clause which line 2 is not

        • Chris,
          You seem to have a good library of quotes. Do you have a reference to the “double omega” that I’ve seen several searchers mention in their comments? Thanks!

          • when you say reference, do you mean how it is connected to the Chase to begin with? i believe that is because of the double omega colophon at the end of TTOTC

            as far as Forrest talking or writing about it, i dont have anything in my notes.

            i will tell you 2 things i can think of off the top of my head. first was the scrapbook related to Diggin Gypsy and the blue truck, he put the double omega at the end of the story

            second thing was somebody asked him about the significance of the double omega and he said something about it was known between him and Eric Sloane and they would take the secret to their graves.

            on the second one i never saw anything directly from Forrest, it was a post on this blog from Dal repeating what he heard from Forrest

            if i am getting it a little wrong, Dal might remember it better

  14. Since the comments about the postmarks, I’ve been looking into them a little bit. I’ve noticed a lot of them are dates of atomic/nuclear importance. I’ve noticed there are a lot of possible references to the elements and even alchemy. Like the alchemical symbol for tin. I’ve seen it in a few drawings in the books. If iron has to do with Brown, the chemical symbol is Fe.

    A few of the postmarks have the year blurred in a way that looks like a nuclear symbol between an S and a 3. Or it could be an O between an S and a 3. An interesting thing about SO3 (sulphur trioxide) is that it shows promise in the treatment of cancer. However, this is a pretty recent discovery, and unless Mr. Fenn received an investigational treatment, it’s unlikely he knew about it at the time he wrote the poem or the book.

    • Well, now I can’t find the link where I found that info. I’ll try and find it after work. I’m pretty sure it was SO3 that I was researching, but that night I researched a few different chemicals.
      So, disregard the treatment for cancer part til I find the link!

      • Got it. When I researched SO3, I found the SO3 Hyperthermia treatment for even late stage cancers. Mexico is one of the leaders in this type of treatment.
        So, sulphur trioxide causes cancer, and SO3 treats it.

    • Mindy-
      You have a great way of explaining your thoughts. I never seem to find the middle ground of too much or too cryptic. I find coincidences where there are probably none, so most are welcome to just discount my post. Not sure I agree with your chemical compositions but I have thought that in someway alchemy comes into play well before I read about Augustus Allen Hayes?
      Before reading your story I was hoping the chest would be found soon so I would spend less time thinking of a solve.
      I wish my friends would have worn their red hunting caps-you might have met along your journey.
      Not that I think it is in Tarryall but have you drawn an X on the state.
      I would like to see someone named Joe find the chest!

      • Lol, Joe. I would like a Mindy to find the chest, too!
        I did see a couple of guys walking through the brush toward a truck. But by then it was starting to rain.
        I don’t think it’s in Tarryall. If it is in Colorado, I think it’s between Tarryall and Buena Vista.
        If it’s in New Mexico, I have an idea of where it might be.
        I’ve decided to try to rely solely on the poem for a while–I think my mistake is relying on the “hints” in the book too much, and also by the “hints” people on this blog give. There are great ideas here, but I’m realizing more and more the longer I focus.
        One: the poem is most important.
        Two: I believe Mr. Fenn employs rules that remain consistent.
        And three: the correct solve will be slap in the forehead simple.

        One of my friends used to say he was “simply complex.” Seemingly a paradox, but not when you think about people with autism or Asperger’s. I work for a surgeon, and his mind works in a very complicated way. I have Asperger’s, and I’m also a writer. I’m the one that takes his complexity and explains it, either to patients or in brochures I write, in a way everyone can understand.
        For example, he’ll say to a patient, “You have sacroiliac piriformis and we can treat that using autologous plasma, Zanaflex, and horizontal therapy and neuromuscular re-education.”
        The patient looks at me with a WTH? look.
        I say, “What Spock means is that you have an inflammation of your sacroiliac joint, and we treat that by taking your own blood, spinning it in a machine to separate the growth stimulating plasma from the rest of the blood, then inject the healing plasma into where you hurt. After that, we will further stimulate healing by using mild electrical impulses on your hip and lower back.”
        So, I guess what I’m saying is there is always a way to “dumb down” even the most complex things. 🙂

        • Mindy, I like your 1,2,3 approach and I am fully on board now with “dumb it down”, but I also believe the paradox is complex. Check out the Pinocchio Paradox…right up Mr. Fenn’s alley. Hidden or not hidden? Truth or Lies? Dumb and dumber? It is right under our noses. You seem like the sort who could help sort this out.

  15. So some say “they found the spot” but been there for years, have you considered looking elsewhere? and how did you figure out that it was the “SPOT” in the first place, was it just because it lined up with the poem?

  16. Im a student of Mayan Mythology and we were recently studying Mayas Influence in the early Americas… in Mayan mythology the God of Earth or what could be loosely translated too “Brown” was the God that came from the ground and according to the myth he had brought forth treasures from below … the rumored site of his appearance and dissapearance were the same and if the texts have been correctly translated .. the mayans had built a temple and it is suppose to be somewhere deep in the rockies…

    Just food for thought….

  17. Thank you Dal and GOG for this blog and keeping it safe.
    It is cold here today and it was yesterday too! Squirrels and turkeys running all over the place – I think we do not have enough firewood for the winter if this keeps up. I pray for global warming only to keep another ice age from coming 🙂

  18. Going on another search tomorrow. Be on the lookout for Dottie, my wife, and I. I will be the one wearing a full brim camo hat. Dottie will be sporting her leash and my wife will be wearing who knows what? Dottie, I’m told, is black. See you in the Rockies!

    • Slurbs
      I hope u have a wonderful adventure
      I will pray that u are safe glad your wife is going with u .
      Can’t wIt to heR what u may find:)

      • @ Slurbs – enjoy your family trip, and let us know when you’re back. We look forward to a great story and will try not to discuss the really good stuff in your absence. Did you know Mr. Fenn often gives the best hints when you’re out of cell range on the search? Just kidding!!

  19. This morning I had 11 finches in my yard and 8 robins . But then a raven flew in and scattered the party.

    • Your raven mad chap and it ain’t the Birds that are dangerous it be the snakes in the bush… Black is a friend you can trust if you must and Ravens are a little like rainbows. They be coming and going… O and Clever as a Fox with wings.. Lucky see’n a Raven. 🙂

  20. What do you all think of this? Something or nothing?

    Eric Sloane wrote a book entitled, “Reflections in Black and White.”

    In TTOTC or TFTW (I can’t remember which), there is a photo of Mr. And Mrs. Fenn presenting “Hail to Peace” (in color) to a hospital.

    The original “Hail to Peace” was a black and white lithograph.

    Anyway, in Eric Sloane’s book, he says, “…the coloured painting is meant to deceive the eye, but black ink cannot.”

    So, maybe there are some hints in the black and white artwork?

      • There are many discrepancies between the original and the Duveen Brothers painting. The one that stuck out most to me was the x in the lower left white corner of the original is missing in the Duveen.

          • Swan, I read that. It’s very interesting how it ties in to so many things. And I love how he tried to bring back ringing bells instead of lighting fireworks for July 4th.

          • Mindy, especially interesting how it ties in to Forrest’s bronze bells and sentiment behind burying them. Personally, what I enjoy about Eric Sloane is his love for 18th 19th century Americana. The barns and bridges are about all that’s left in the west without visiting museums. I enjoy perusing “Seventeen Dollars A Square Inch” just to get lost in language and details; Sloane’s exquisite penmanship; and B&W sketches. He was truly what we refer to as a Renaissance man – equal parts artist, thinker, philosopher, etc. What a mentor!

          • “Fruitless” I.e. The fruit is gone. Says he’ll still look for “treasure” not “the treasure”….the beginning and the end…

          • hi jmbguidry – you would enjoy “Seventeen Dollars” ff’s storied words honoring Sloane’s work. Understanding what can be understood about ff through other sources is an enjoyable diversion from solving clues. The literature and history interests me, and how that plays into f’s agenda for ttotc.

  21. D.Gyps – Not sure if you had a mentor in your formative years, but I often wonder how my life may have turned out differently under the tutelage of a mentor who recognized gifts and knew how to encourage them. I had great parents, but they let me carve out my own paths. How many 17 yr. olds mentor themselves? not me, and that’s why we’re on this blog rather than painting canvases 🙂

    • Gypsy – your name brings back great memories! Every summer our family visited Virginia City, MT on the way to Ennis where my dad fished the Madison. If you’ve not yet visited, Virginia City is an authentic gold-boom ghost town with mystery and stage coach robber’s history to fill a child’s head with reveries. My favorite source of entertainment was an antique arcade with “The Gypsy” who told your fortune audibly. She still resides in Virginia City and because of her rarity is worth $6-10 million. You can also see Club Foot George’s foot in the museum; and rot your teeth out on penny candy. (hope you enjoy your namesake in the article)

      • Wow cool info I never went to virginia city I was so close to it wish I did now thank you for sharing that swan 🙂

        • Next summer, we need to grab lunch in Bozeman or West and plan a day searching together in Montana. I am threading a new tract on my map through nature’s wiles since I bombed out this summer. Enjoy your evening Gyps – I’ll bet Connecticut is nearly dressed in her splendid fall glory.

          • Ok swan I’ll let you know when I’m there 🙂 and yes right now the north isn’t so bad to be in But i would rather be home in georgia :-)with my rooster john Wayne and my lil Henny Penny

  22. Gold Fever 11 finches an 8 robins for a total of 19 birds. 19 is not a number I have ever given much thought. Is 19 anybody’s favorit number?

  23. Exactly matches my thoughts on my number one search site. May I ask if you are referring to a site in Montana?

  24. Windsurfer- New to this, and trying to learn how to reply via iPad so not sure that my above question was placed as a reply to you. I agree with what you said about simultaneously for WWH/ down, and about the wise and the blaze, by chance are you searching in Montana. Your post sounds like my #1 spot.

  25. Has anyone seen rich’s mountainwalk .org blog? Did he find it? I hate to buy into rumors or perpetuate them with mentioning but what do you guys think?

    • he says he is moving on to new adventures.

      thats all i see there. not sure what else you are reading into it.

      he says he will still enjoy sending people down fruitless paths for Fenn’s treasure. if the treasure was found, wouldn’t make any sense to say that would it? no it wouldn’t.

    • No he’s not found it. Him and his wife are retired and they’ve been planning on selling and traveling for a while now. He’s a super great guy. I was fortunate to meet with him and his wife a year or two ago. I believe their kids live in different places and I think that is also what perpetuated the sell and travel plans.

      Although, I wouldn’t count him out. He’s been searching since the beginning and as you can see from his blog, he’s a smart cookie 😉

  26. ok, well i dont know if some of y’alls info is correct on the CE5 cost code being 35K, but let’s assume for a moment that it is

    why does he say in TTOTC that he paid too much for it and he has since revealed that “too much” was 25k ??

    • Chris-
      He has been quoted as saying he paid $20K and at other times that he paid $25K. I am not certain how the figure jumped to $35K. Probably the same way the value of the treasure started out at almost a $million and three years later Margie was saying it was worth as much as $5million…
      It seems to be part of the human condition to increase the value of all objects…(with the single exception of anything I might invest in)
      This KOB story by Gadi is from 2011…note the cost of the chest at that time.

      • thanks Dal

        i havent seen that article before. 2 things i find interesting under “things Gadi knows about Forrest” ..

        Knows how to use google very well

        Says home of Brown “very important”

      • Dal,
        I ventured the $35500 figure as a possibility, when I read a comment that CE5 is his code; assigning a monetary value to an item.

        I’ve seen some car dealers looking at the gibberish code affixed on the windshield when asked about the price. I realized they have a basic system of letters and numbers.
        I thought that maybe just the same, Forrest put a price of CE5(00) or otherwise: 355(00).

        When I listen to the interview with Lorene and he mentioned $25,000, I thought that probably once bought, he decided to sell it, and he would do it for 35,000.

        But all this brouhaha about the CE5 and the revelation that he wrote it (doesn’t matter if it’s what he paid or what he would sell it for) begs the question: why?

        It’s hard to put yourself in somebody’s shoes, much less in Forrest’s, but if I would have found the perfect chest for 20-25G’s with the intention of fill it with A MILLION dollars worth of gold then hide it in the mountains to be discovered 1,000 years from now, I surely wouldn’t spend a fraction of a second thinking about writing down the price.

        So, WHY?
        I think that he didn’t always thought of that chest as the perfect vessel for his treasure, and maybe at some point he even thought of selling it.
        It’s not what he (blank) it’s what we believe he(blank) 🙂

  27. i think i know what WWH is. that is my opinion of course

    if i were to throw one hint related to my interpretation, it would be this ..

    ‘warm waters halt’ is not referring to the waters no longer being warm.

    think of ‘halt’ more in line with the definition of ‘cease’

        • It seems like a very plausible WWWH.

          Don’t worry, I’m not close to it and no intention of going either.
          Wait do we still talk figuratively? 🙂

          Shoot an email to:
          liviu dot xmas at gmail

          I’ll tell you my latest take on WWWH; it’s like you’re describing it.

  28. Dal
    I just checked Forrest’s blog and unless I can’t find it (which is possible) it looks like the post saying that the treasure is still out there is nowhere to be found (?) did they remove it or am I blind?

  29. Earlier there was a discussion about journalists writing that the treasure was hidden in New Mexico and how this led some to believe that Forrest actually did say that he hid it in New Mexico…including me. This was the reason I began looking in NM.

    I pointed out that of the two reporters I had contacted who wrote that the treasure was in New Mexico, one admitted that she made that part up and the other could not remember if Forrest said NM or not.

    There are good reasons to consider NM as the location of the hidden chest….but simply because a “writer” says it’s there..or worse, says that Forrest says it’s there is not a good reason on it’s own.

    I want to point you at another article. This published just about a year ago in the inflight magazine for Emirates Airlines. We all know that Forrest was not telling anyone just a year ago that the treasure was hidden in New Mexico. Yet..there it is..the opening statement of this story claims exactly that..Why? How can that happen?

    This is the entire magazine, 33mb worth so it will take awhile to load up. Once it does..Forrest has the cover but the story begins on page 106.

    Journalists are people who get things screwed up just like I do sometimes…
    My point is that I don’t think we should place any trust that a journalist has gotten even the broadest facts correct. If you see something by a journalist that flashes against everything else you’ve ever heard Forrest say…it’s probably a misquote or the journalist just misinterpreting what he/she/it heard.

  30. WWH…
    Tears that dry up?
    People that die… He always mentions his friends that have passed. ( understandably)
    Isn’t our bodies 65-85% water?

    Don’t laugh!

    • Our bodies are about 60 percent water [source: Mayo Clinic]. Water regulates our body temperature, moves nutrients through our cells, keeps our mucous membranes moist and flushes waste from our bodies. Our lungs are 90 percent water, our brains are 70 percent water and our blood is more than 80 percent water.

    • Now that I’m thinking could be where he stopped crying a place that made him happy good point teabag

        • Like the tear theory might be something to do with being sad but happy like us in Colorado sad we miss daddy but happy we in the spot he loved Good thinking

      • Hey i got one.. And the five second rule don’t apply to me cause i was making pop tarts for the dogs..
        Diggin Dipsey!

      • Some food for thought a little out of the cracker box but could the fist two lines of the poem be describing where WWWH’s, could “as i have gone alone in there and with my treasures bold” be describing Forrest bathing all alone in the Firehole river with no clothes on, that would be bold , and and yes he was with his family jewels

        • Hello 49 Dollers, You know, it takes balls to get the family jewels out…where they might be exposed to would-be thieves.

          I’m not a thief, but I do have a few things of my own that I consider jewels. They may not be jewels to someone else…but if they were ever taken from me I’d consider it to be a real kick in the nuts.

          I’ll admit, however, that my jewels are not what others might call a “sparkly”!

          “I’ve always wanted a SPARKLY…of my very own!” 🙂

  31. Again, and through the night, some great ideas from all the chasers. The mood continues to the avail. So now I will sign off for now with these lasting words. For me, I too found my church in the mountains. I shall give it one more try before I die. Thanks Forrest.

    Here I sit upon a table
    With a gambler and a thief
    And I talk upon a preacher
    Of some unknown belief.

    Such are the varied people
    That meet in a border town
    Where (drinks) are used more than water
    And more freely taken down

    Here a Negro and a Chinaman
    A Hebrew and a Greek
    Here from many a varied climate
    Strange men there fortunes they seek.

    • Are you or phantom going to your spot tomorrow? If so, when? I think was there this summer and ran into 3 other searchers- Beautiful place but my only regret is not posing long enough for the camera to get a shot of me!! (Freeze for at least a few minutes!!) if you let us know when you’ll be there I’ll take a screenshot and post it if you want! That’d be pretty cool souvenir eh?

    • Hello Everyone, I only have a few minutes to post. The wife and I were very excited to get all packed up to go on this venture. I got to work early this morning to finalize a few things and it went down hill from there. I hit the trifecta in emergencies. I will write Dal and explain. Unfortunately, we are in a holding pattern. All the family and I are doing fine. PEACE

      • Funny you should say that you’re in a holding pattern, Gey. Me, too…again! Work Shmerk!…that’s what I say! It’s a catch 22, isn’t it? If I could just escape from “another day…another dollar” I think I have a good chance at finding…(bringing pinky finger to lips)…ONE MILLION DOLLARS!

        I’ll send an email to explain. I think I know how you feel, Gey. It’s ridiculous when you think about it.

        • I’d like to say that I DO think one million dollars is a LOT of money even if Doctor Evil doesn’t…and I’d REALLY like to go find it. 🙂

  32. 9 and 13 coming together today so the convergence of energy lines can only explain the begging of a time of hope in the days ahead. Chance does not explain and Fenn does not have this level of knowlege so i remain captivated by THE THRILL OF THE CHASE to discover more about Him. The REAL Joker… 🙂 looking forward to meeting you High One.

    ps. just another pawn in the game of life…

    • Pieces of 9 – curious. Since you posted for us, will you explain the convergence? and in your opinion who is the ‘real’ joker?

      • Forrest speaks of a Higher Hand that is who deals the cards and one of them is a joker which is what people call chance because they don’t know the real Joker. When you get good luck who do you thank?

        As far as convergence goes think of a curve ball that crosses the plate at the right spot for a strike if its in the strike zone. Now you have a chance to hit . With luck… 🙂

    • navyi – no worries, perhaps another time when your email works? btw would like to discuss the bones of kites and points to tie off for symmetry, perhaps centter balance which seems important for flight. let me know when email works if you wish to discuss.

      • It seems to be fine now, my router may have just been hot. Cant imagine why. But this is me still and sober of course 🙂

        42 please email me!

  33. On the typewriter thing what a amazing trail of history maybe that’s why I’m having trouble finding the current Location Underwood. Anyone else turning over every log (right and left) they see…. 🙂 On a role…

    • Your idea of finding the great hint to the Underwood typewriter is, IMO important and a really fun. It just kind of fell into place when I was searching for something else. It’s not in the history of the machine – or anything like that.

  34. Finding Our Way Home

    Life is a maze full of misguided turns,
    The more you live the more you learn.
    The longer it takes to choose the right way,
    The better the chance is that you’ll go astray.

    The paths all vary from whence they begin,
    And they all lead to nowhere we’ve ever been.
    There’s no right way to get there, but when you arrive
    You will finally discover the meaning of life.

    The twists and turns of the paths you take
    Carve the life that your memories make.
    Living well is not a straight line.
    Of course your path will be different than mine.

    But we share our paths through the stories we tell,
    To those who would listen, then share theirs as well.
    Sometimes our paths cross, and may run together
    And we find someone else that makes our lives better.

    The time always comes that a person takes stock,
    And realizes forever is just too far to walk.
    No matter where we begin, or what we may say,
    All of our paths end just the same way.

    So follow your dreams, and hear your heart sing.
    But choose your paths wisely and mind what you bring.
    Because life is too short to ponder too long,
    Try to study the music and you might miss the song

    By Michael Dill

    Dal, what happened to the poetry page? I cannot seem to locate it anymore?

    • Very nice Michael D and so true. Have you always been a poet or is this a talent you recently discovered?

    • Terrific poem Michael. Your philosophy fits nicely with Forrest’s poem. I tried to match up phrases philosophically, but didn’t do it the justice you or Forrest would.

      {Michael D’s poem in brackets}

      As I have gone alone in there
      {of course your path will be different than mine}
      And with my treasures bold,

      I can keep my secret where,
      And hint of riches new and old.
      {No matter where we begin, or what we may say,
      All of our paths end just the same way.}

      Begin it where warm waters halt
      {The paths all vary from whence they begin}

      Not far, but too far to walk.
      {The time always comes that a person takes stock,
      And realizes forever is just too far to walk.}

      From there it’s no place for the meek,
      {And they all lead to nowhere we’ve ever been.}

      If you’ve been wise and found the blaze,
      {But choose your paths wisely and mind what you bring}

      Look quickly down, your quest to cease,
      {Living well is not a straight line.}

      But tarry scant with marvel gaze,
      {Because life is too short to ponder too long,}

      Just take the chest and go in peace.
      {Try to study the music and you might miss the song}

      So why is it that I must go
      And leave my trove for all to seek?
      {The twists and turns of the paths you take
      Carve the life that your memories make.}

      The answers I already know,
      {There’s no right way to get there, but when you arrive}

      {I’ve done it tired, and now I’m weak.
      You will finally discover the meaning of life.}

      So hear me all and listen good,
      Your effort will be worth the cold.
      {But we share our paths through the stories we tell,
      To those who would listen, then share theirs as well.
      Sometimes our paths cross, and may run together
      And we find someone else that makes our lives better.}

      If you are brave and in the wood
      I give you title to the gold.
      {So follow your dreams, and hear your heart sing.}

      Anyone else out there hear their heart sing when hiking in the mountains?

      • 42

        Michael D
        Great work, quite enjoyable read. You have written it with intention, and purpose, and that makes a great recipe. Thank you for sharing. 🙂

      • I wouldn’t discount your own talents, 42.
        Quite impressive
        Interpretation of michaels beautiful words.

      • 42 –

        Great Job – one of the best interpretations I have read.

        I am hearing you and listening with my dreams flowing in my heart.

        The wind will take me there soon.

  35. Some Pbody needs to roar up on this Poem and role across the finish line. Cuz I’m fixxin to power slide into home base and let the dust fly. Dig in and get er done or hang up your black hat bro….

  36. There goes my imagination………..?
    Actually My fixins take a long time to prepare,cook and cool……..and thats why they are worth the (cool)cold but still warm. It’s also where warm waters halt(in your mouth) they are that good!!! By now you should know I’m a lot better at braggin than cookin…. 🙂
    f. did say imagination is important.

  37. I got a different take that most people. All nine clues take you to his secret place, where his treasure is ( his rainbow, or happy place). Once you find yourself in there you understand what he is trying to tell you. You are half way there. Now, one has to figure things out. How do all these physical features in that place have to do with the treasure chest? Mr. Fenn is a very common-sensical person. He wanted us to wind up in that place to see nature. It is no accident. Everybody winds up in that place if they are close, but yet too far, because we have not figured out what is the significance of all the clues. It is my opinion,once your are there, you have to use your imagination on how those clues pertain to the chase, and not his rainbow place. RC.

    • RC,

      That all well and good. The treasure is in a secret spot, his rainbow, his happy place. How do you Find his happy place?
      you stated ; …” Once you find yourself in there you understand what he is trying to tell you. You are half way there. Now, one has to figure things out. How do all these physical features in that place have to do with the treasure chest?”

      How does the poem even get a searcher to that area? It sound like your working from the middle out. if the clues lead you to the happy place are they not leading you precisely to the chest as well? and if the nine clues just lead you to this place, are you saying you need to use the clues again [ a second time ] to locate the chest?

      I’m a bit confused

    • Wholeheartedly agree with you RC.
      I believe I found Forrest’s beautiful “rainbow place” in the wilderness where his treasured memories he shared with those dear to him are his true treasure which he can take with him to heaven’s mountains and streams. His ‘happy place’ is internal, not external and each of has to find that place of peace alone, and humbled – which is not attainable through earthly goods. IMO the place of peace is attained alone on each individual’s journey. The unfortunate blockades to finding that internal joy and peace, are created by man in all forms of slavery and war which Forrest understands on a deep level. I’m guessing Forrest hopes individuals and families alike will find their treasures in fond memories forged together and enjoy nature’s solitude and magnificence. Many have done that and moved past chasing the gold. Thank you Forrest for reaffirming through the chase what I already enjoyed… peace, treasured family, friends, and memories. May each of us on TTOTC find the important treasures.

        • Raven & Diggin, don’t be deceived by my sentimental moments, I’m still plannin on sliding in sideways yelling, “What a ride!” with a sidecar full of gold.

      • Well and good 42 but I have to say that I really want to find that chest full of gold. Its the challenges in life like this chase that keeps me motivated to look, to work, to ponder, to share ideas. The beauty. the love, the peace and splendor is why I continue to wake up every day and breathe–without it I surely would perish. On the other hand, The Chase and other challenges in life is what gets me out of bed.

  38. Just passing this on, I use FreeMind, a free mind-mapping program:

    It allows you to put all your thoughts down, (catergorized/branched how you want them) on one jpeg. It has many features and gives you the big picture on one page which can be printed. Just a few minutes with the instructions and you are building a mind-map. I feel it’s perfect for the chase. Here’s a tip; I found that my first mind-map was growing too large for one page so I broke down the catergories into individual mind-maps. Peter

  39. I feel for all of you who are looking for an “Underwood” typewriter.

    I don’t believe UNDERWOOD is the make – it’s another brand. Underwood – is Forrest being tricky again. Perhaps Underwood is a different hint just by itself.

    IMO the typewriter will lead to the “Key” Word.

      • Inthechase, helpful input on underwood. Thanks. I hope Forrest isn’t applying or implying the archaic German/Norse meaning of wood which means ‘violently mad’ or ‘insane’ and is spelled wud with an omega replacing the u. Yikes!

    • Lets see, are you referencing a Barr, Continental, Consul, Erika, AMC, Optima, Adler, Bluebird, Corona, Hermes, Olivetti, Remington, Royal, or perhaps an IBM Selectric?

        • I think he’s telling us it’s under wood – as in the forest – under trees. I do not think he would have placed it under a log – due to fire.

          The reason I think that is – he said “Google does not go down that far” – so I think the trees are blocking our view.

          He thought of everything.

        • Oh, I forgot the Blickensderfer…..I think that was the first typewriter. Just kidding. This talk of typewriters is way over my head….just wanted to join in even tho I have nooo idea what we are talking about. In my head I can hear my momma saying “Your talkin just to hear yourself talk…”. Oh well, she is right once again.

          • Raven –

            OK – since your being so nice about it –
            it’s the eleventh one you mentioned.

            But be for warned – it will be meaningless to you unless you have first studied the area in depth.

      • Raven….I would be….if I only had one of the pertinent editions of one of the books/collections/editions involved in that single part of the solve. Trust me….you’ve only just begun!!


    New Colorado and the Santa Fe Trail

    This book above was posted by Forrest after his story – Prehistoric Thoughts.

    I found it was interesting – even though I haven’t read it yet – it has the same drop letters as are used in TTOTC. It may even use the same type face.

  41. Have anybody noticed that Forrest seem to differentiate a clue from a hint , he states there are only nine clues in the poem yet in the second sentence he states “hint of riches” is he implying that there are nine clues but an untold number of hints ?

    • 49 dollars –

      The way I see a clue is directional and will lead you to the spot. The way I see a hint is anything else. Ha I could be so wrong.

          • He said there are nine clues in the poem – I really have not spent much time on that. He also said in the chapter Gold and More – there are clues sprinkled in the book. Hints are fun. Clues are major fun.

          • I heard him say that “in the wood is a clue” in one of the videos. . I don’t remember what brought that up, but he said is casual and quiet and then the subject whent on like they didn’t really catch what he said.

    • 49-
      Forrest actually told us that there is a marked difference between his clues and his hints. This came about in the spring of 2013 when he told us that he had never given out any clues.

      This statement flew in the face of many things that he had been telling us that certainly appeared to be clues. Some thought he was telling us that he had lied to us. That what he told us was a distraction. Some were very angry with Forrest.

      It took some time for us to sort it out but what he meant to say was that there are clues and there are hints. The clues are in the poem. Things he has told us outside of the poem are hints…not clues.

      Forrest tells us that a clue will get you closer to the treasure. A hint will not.
      According to Forrest each clue in the poem will get you closer to the treasure. While telling us that it is not in Idaho or Utah will not put us any closer to the treasure.

      I see his logic but at the time there was nearly a revolution when he said he had never handed out any clues other than those in the poem.

      • Dal, thanks for the insight and your blog .I do believe there are hints and clues in his books but hints within the poem is what im curious about , i guess it should be obvious since the second line in the poem states”hint” also Forrest does state there are subtle clues sprinkled in the stories yet not deliberately placed to aid the seeker,that must of been quite a challenge, i mean to unintentionally have clues among the stories, though the preface and epilogue are not technically stories. perhaps thats where you can find a deliberately placed clue

  42. Forrest said he was born 100 years too late. What was happening in the USA 100 to 184 years ago? Anyone notice that wagon in his back yard and the fact he practically dragged Nic from dateline out to see it and how he really emphasized 1880. It is also on the back cover of “too far to walk”.

    Anyone notice the connection between that wagon, that year and a similar wagon and the post he made about Diggin Gypsy? You know the post the one he used the double omega to end the post.

      • July 24, 1832 – The first wagons crossed the Continental Divide on the Oregon Trail at Wyoming’s South Pass when Captain Benjamin Bonneville and Joseph R. Walker navigated one hundred and ten men with twenty-one wagons into the Green River Valley.

        • Oh and Levi’s were invented! That was a good thing!
          Joseph Smith said an an angel sent him some gold records ….
          And fur trade was goin on..
          Levi’s or Fur?
          How bout wearing some furry Levi’s while scratching some gold records!
          My kind of nite!

          • Mirror lake has great borders and historic pictures are a nice fit for the feel 🙂 check it out! My trip was fruitless to the point but maybe you’d have more luck

          • I hear Joseph Smith asked the angel where he buried the gold records and the angel replied, “I hid them. I never said I buried them…but that doesn’t mean they’re not buried.” 🙂

          • No, Gypsy. I’m just making stuff up…but supposedly the gold records found by Joseph were in a cavity under a large rock …according to what he said later. i.e. not “buried” …just covered.

          • So he buried the golden records? Or hid em? Lol

            Niagara Falls…
            Step by step… Inch by inch…
            Slowly I turn….

          • Oddly enough, I had thought about how similar the Joseph Smith box under the stone is like the picture of the indian girl picture from tftw . A square pottery box… interesting. .. is that a sword on the box? It makes back to back “f”s that would make a nice blaze..

          • decall – i think you’re onto something. the two sided F imo could be the blaze and mirrors old spanish blazes marked on trees to indicate gold or silver mines. Now, finding that blaze is another big if. The tftw story is either a red herring, or placed to assist in uncovering the tc. I can’t decide which one. Definitely a square peg in a round hole.

        • Consider this about that wagon. It sits on the Santa Fe Trail…not the Oregon Trail, not the Spanish Trail. The Santa Fe trail goes right through Forrest’s property. He lives on “Old Santa Fe Trail”.
          He also had a wagon out in front of his gallery…that wagon is still there too. The Santa Fe Trail never crossed the Continental Divide so if your connection is the wagon out in front of his place and the divide…hmmm it begins to wither…

          But before you get too crazed about wagon trails consider this..
          His office is filled with Indian items…war bonnets, moccasins, beaded clothing, painted ceremonial buffalo skulls…etc etc..why would a wagon trail be any more important to him than an Indian trail?..

          His lab is filled with items from an Indian Pueblo that was abandoned…where did those indians go? Why would a wagon trail be any more important to him than the trail those early puebloans took when they abandon San Lazaro?

          He has written that when he sits at his pueblo he can see the Spanish coming up the Gallisteo Creek. Why would a wagon trail be more important to him than the trail Cortez took as he entered New Mexico?

          Forrest has stated that he and Eric Sloane wanted to build a covered bridge together but their wives wouldn’t let them buy a there a covered bridge connection ΩΩ ?

          My point is that if you start looking for connections you will find them around every corner. I think research on Forrest is more important than chasing down every loosey goosey connection…

          • I think I’ll stick to my own theory of it’s just in a spot where he had the best times with his dad family or friend fishing I’ll stick to not over thinking 🙂

          • I agree.. Funny though …looking at those two omegas together… Looks like the backside of two wagons side by side.
            Has someone already said this?
            Maybe jus means their on the same trail mentally

          • But why would he put that on my story the omegas ????? Not wagons either it meant I’m
            A lot like eric sloane lol lol or the the beginning and end. Beginning of someone getting rich and the end of his rainbow that will continue to rack my brain all we can do is guess cause he will never tell

          • Gypsy: IMO one of the more important things I’ve heard Forrest say about any searcher is in your blue truck story Forrest ends with double omegas. “If I was a betting man, I’d bet on this gal.” (paraphrased) Forrest is a betting man Gyps – and he’s betting on you for the win! Go get that treasure!

          • Swan, read your comment and made me think… Its cause DG likes old stuff..well we all do … Were always digging into old things looking for new treasures . Jus like he did when he found the knife. Funny thing is.. like the knife…its usually junk with a great story !
            More importantly i think forrest was saying DG will look in the more unusual places.. Less planned ones. Guess you have to have an eye for hidden junk!

          • Actually … U absolutely do… Anyone that uses formulas remain confined.. And as my sis.. I’ll tell u honestly…..U really have some outside thoughts, in fact there all outside all over the place! But so perfectly innocent..and ingenious!
            Im proud ur my sis… And we make a good team!

          • Thanks for the info Dal –

            I would agree that loosey goosey (I like that) connections are not good.

            But If you discover a direct hit – with covered wagons – I think you are in the right spot.

            At my spot there is such a sign – it’s so big – you can’t miss it. it tells the history of the area – and about the wagon trains.

          • Oxbows or yokes were connected by double trees; or a single tree if one oxen.
            Oxbows are also the language of the stream for an omega shape curve.

          • Hey Dal, What is this I saw on Stephanie’s blog where she is saying that FF told you where he hid the bells?

        • yea maybe you start at the warm springs in Guernsey Wyoming where the water temp stays at 70 deg all year and they halted to wash their clothes and then take the emigrant trail down to Farson ,no not far, take the route Meek did not take, Oh the Lander trail , that’s a road well travelled by searchers. oops i spelled travelled like Forrest

    • Hi Wolf, are you able to direct me to the post about Diggin Gyps and the wagon with the double omegas? Plugging Gypsy into Dal’s search engine didn’t yield that post.
      If you know which scrapbook, thank you.

    • Wolf, as what I presume is my solve he is actually talking about 2 events. I took that as a hint but it was not a clue. You have come very close with the hints you address. You are dangerous and a deep thinker. I enjoy reading all your posts.

    • I will add one more connection to keep it on track … there is a link to “… and marvel gaze”

    • Amy – Yes, I recommend “Seventeen Dollars a Square Inch.” You’ll enjoy Forrest’s storied words about his mentor and friend; and of course Sloane’s artistry interpreted through an unusually beautiful outlook on life. The book is expensive, but if you will pay the postage to return it to me, I’ll loan you my copy. Let me know.

      • Swan
        Absolutely thank u and yes I will return it. My email is amyyork2@ yahoo. Com or just call 903-521-7881
        Thank u

  43. 200 years ago today…

    Oh, say can you see by the dawn’s early light
    What so proudly we hailed at the twilight’s last gleaming?
    Whose broad stripes and bright stars thru the perilous fight,
    O’er the ramparts we watched were so gallantly streaming?
    And the rocket’s red glare, the bombs bursting in air,
    Gave proof through the night that our flag was still there.
    Oh, say does that star-spangled banner yet wave
    O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave?

    On the shore, dimly seen through the mists of the deep,
    Where the foe’s haughty host in dread silence reposes,
    What is that which the breeze, o’er the towering steep,
    As it fitfully blows, half conceals, half discloses?
    Now it catches the gleam of the morning’s first beam,
    In full glory reflected now shines in the stream:
    ‘Tis the star-spangled banner! Oh long may it wave
    O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

    And where is that band who so vauntingly swore
    That the havoc of war and the battle’s confusion,
    A home and a country should leave us no more!
    Their blood has washed out their foul footsteps’ pollution.
    No refuge could save the hireling and slave
    From the terror of flight, or the gloom of the grave:
    And the star-spangled banner in triumph doth wave
    O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

    Oh! thus be it ever, when freemen shall stand
    Between their loved home and the war’s desolation!
    Blest with victory and peace, may the heav’n rescued land
    Praise the Power that hath made and preserved us a nation.
    Then conquer we must, when our cause it is just,
    And this be our motto: “In God is our trust.”
    And the star-spangled banner in triumph shall wave
    O’er the land of the free and the home of the brave!

    Maybe Forrest wanted to meet Francis Scott Key?
    Sorry jus having some fun!


  45. Good work both of you…
    Forrests chest s till out there buried I guess since no one has found it and well yes I do have a detector 4 sale to anyone who knows the location 🙂 gold detector that will be not a chest finder. 🙂

  46. Germanguy,
    I always let everyone know in MY solve what portion is YOUR contribution. My solve and Your solve are VERY DIFFERENT. So I would appreciate a little less muscle flexing in the mirror by you in regards to MY solve. I give you ALL the credit for stanza six….THE REST IS MINE. As you so eloquently stated when we partnered up, anything other than your spot is wrong.
    Michael D

    • Michael

      I wouldn’t worry about Germanguy and what y’all have discussed about the solve , even if u feel that you are yall are right about the location I think it’s going to be a Long time before the chest is found, even my solve is complicated in what direction to go.

      Just be nice about it, it’s ok
      And surely if he found it he would split it with u. Or u found it u would split with him since y’all have come together on what y’all think it’s about. Look at how much land has to be covered or an area before it’s found. Just sit back and Relax !!!!!!! 🙂

      • Amy, sorry that my ex-partner is bally hooing here. He has my email address, and could have just sent me an email if he wanted to, but it seems he wants to vent his frustrations in public. When we finish that search he stated that he wasn’t going to search anymore, but wished that someone would find the chest so he could go on with his life. It seems not knowing, is getting to him.

    • ??? Where did this come from, and why??

      Dal’s blog is not a place for personal attacks. If you have something to say to me, send me an email! Otherwise, keep this cr@p off the blog. Show a little respect for others.

    • I think you need to find the chest before you flex your muscles about YOUR SOLVE. Your solve is just as WRONG as everyone else unless you find it.

      • In fact MD and GG I’ve been thinking, the two of you are no different than newbie searchers. In what way you might ask, well a newbie starts out with out a clue too. IMO

  47. Forrest, if you’re out there, I was curious if you were a test pilot in any way in the air force, and what were some of the funnest things you did in the AF while not at war?

  48. oh man someone get me an aspirin. all this wasted effort putting the cart before the horse is giving me a headache.

    there is a separate thread specifically for this, for everyone who wants to spin around in circles on this unnecessary and pointless subject, except for the one person who may find it, if that even happens.

  49. You are correct Chris this should have been put in the legal stuff thread, but since GG started it I thought I would add to it. Maybe Dal could move it over there.

    Why is it everyone gets upset about discussing after finding activities? Sure I have heard the cart before horse line many times before but I see it as no different than continuely talking about codes (declination) and ciphers when FF has already ruled that out.

    At least this information is useful for someone at some time in the future, and more importantly I wonder what kind of searcher would not want to know some of this background information when they embark on their first search.

    It just might keep them out of jail, paying fines, getting shot at or becoming the main character in an ongoing media story about “the idiot who broke 27 laws searching for the treasure”

    Take two asprin and call me in the morning!
    The Wolf

  50. Funny how no one has every mentioned Edward S Curtis.

    Curtis did his pictures in Brown/Bronze. The chest has that funny inventory control letters written on it CES.

    Always wondered if it was the letters of ESC where really refereeing to Curtis.

    Curtis’s motto was “To the Beautiful'”

    Mister Fenn,

    Was wondering if you have anything in your collection done by Edward S Curtis?

    Have something unique and one of a kind in my Native American collection.

    Actually the piece would rewrite history for Curtis and the Indians.

    if I hear back from you I’ll share it with you. If not just take it your busy:)


    • Then again it could be inventory letters and romantic nonsense……..

      There is no room in the universe for ugly math or theories.

      If your solution isn’t elegant and beautiful………..then you don’t have anything.

      If you don’t have any beauty in your life……….get some.

      Nothing wrong wanting beautiful people and things in your life:)


      Looter Treasure Hunter Archeologist

      • Hi Rick,

        You have presented an interesting person. In the short time I read about him – he could be included. I am not, how ever seeing hints as yet.

        One item I found is – Earnest Sharpe Jr signed his guest book on find a grave.

      • Rick – thank you for putting into context some of poignant Native American images that we’ve all seen. I was unfamiliar with their photographer Edward S. Curtis. He is an interesting comment in the history of marital affairs too. Known as ‘the man who forgot to play’ and who forgot to take care of his devoted wife. I’m always amazed at how God works through imperfect vessels. We are all broken sherds or cracked pots in our own way, and yet beauty is revealed and preserved through each human being.
        And, yes elegance matters. I’m working on my Elizabethan penmanship to write a a thank you note to Mr. Fenn for the treasure in a style befitting a Romanesque trove.

        Do you think E.S. Curtis owned the chest at one time, and had inscribed his initials?

        • No believe Fenn put CES there.

          When CES was first found (believe a companion of Dal’s) Fenn treated as it really had nothing to do with the poem

          That’s how I treat it……………….

          Was wondering at the connection of Fenn and Curtis that’s all:)

          • You can bet your last $50 that Forrest has some Curtis photos in his collection, and may have contributed to Museum displays as well. Many of the plates for the photos were destroyed by Curtis himself to prevent his wife from reprints. Sad, but the photos would be quite rare because of that unfortunate bit. Some NA’s believed that photographs stole one’s soul. Anyway, I love the beauty of the sepia colored photos which reveal a life long lost and look into the windows of another soul.

          • Swan I see your $50 and raise you $100

            So do we have a bet for $100?

            Know Fenn reads this board and he would be the tie breaker if he so chooses, to play:)


          • Rick, are you referring to my statement that ff has Curtiis original photos? Please clarify, and then game on. Double or nothing is fun if stakes aren’t too high. Note: I may not be on blog much today so anxious to see answer later.

          • Swan where going to have to do a US Postal Money Order

            If you can email me at


            that wayI can send you my mailing address.

            Sorry have been moving to much money through PayPal………

            Been buying a lot of paintings and artifacts:)

          • Rick – I didn’t see evidence of ff’s email to you posted here. Did I miss it? Please post it with your public Archaeology work or business address as that is my only method of forwarding. I will no longer email others on this blog as my email was hacked again this morning, as were other security issues. Dal’s site is secure, but someone out there is playing games with my email account that I won’t tolerate. In fact after this post, I won’t be on the blog. don’t forget address and ff email to you.

        • Swan you said:

          “You can bet your last $50 that Forrest has some Curtis photos in his collection,”

          Either YOUR statement is True or False

          This is the bet Swan for $100.

          • Ok Swan last night I asked Forrest by email if he had anything by Edward Curtis in his collection.

            His reply back “No.” Have a copy of both emails.

            Now don’t take my word for it feel free to ask Fenn yourself.

            After that when your all “Swanned” out please feel free to send the $100 via
            Paypal to:


            In return I will post that Swan is just that a beautiful loving Swan and not a ugly duckling:)

            Fair enough your Grace?

          • Swan your statement is present tense:)

            “You can bet your last $50 that Forrest has some Curtis photos in his collection,”

            “Presently” Fenn has nothing of Edward Curtis.

        • Swan

          Thanks for seeing that you lost the bet for $100.

          Have Forreest’s email and answer. I don’t know how he would take it posting a private message and using his name like that in a public fashion.

          If you email Forrest and asked him “Hay did Rick ask you if your owned anything currently by Curtis and you said No.”

          It will be very clear the matter is resolved in my favor:)

          Then feel free to email me .


      • Looter ?? you don’t look colored or a mexi (not a racist) but can’t imagine you doing illegal things…

  51. anyone have a link to the interview or whatnot where FF ruled out codes or declination, or know where i can find it?

  52. @ Rick – The Native Americans called Edward Curtis “The Shadow Catcher” and here is possible link to Mr. Fenn via a group of Santa Fe investors:

    Around 1970, Karl Kernberger of Santa Fe, New Mexico went to Boston to search for Curtis’ original copper plates and photogravures at the Charles E. Lauriat rare bookstore. He discovered almost 285,000 original photogravures as well as all the original copper plates. With Jack Loeffler and David Padwa, they jointly purchased all of the surviving Curtis material that was owned by Charles Emelius Lauriat (1874–1937). The collection was later purchased by another group of investors led by Mark Zaplin of Santa Fe. The Zaplin Group owned the plates until 1982, when they sold them to a California group led by Kenneth Zerbe, the current owner of the plates as of 2005.

  53. Hidden may mean hidden from knowledge. If you figure out the last clue, does that mean you are in front of the treasure chest, or does it mean there are no more clues for you to solve, and something else comes into play? Maybe there is another step that has to happen before you actually can have the chest in front of you. Any takers? RC.

  54. Just because Mr. Fenn said the treasure chest is hidden in the mountain north of Santa Fe NM it does not mean the treasure is physically there. I mean, the word hidden is very tricky, or anything that Mr. Fenn uses for that matter. To me, the treasure may not even be physically in the mountains north of Santa Fe New Mexico. Maybe the treasure is only hidden, or secreted from knowledge. Yeah Mr. Fenn said once that “The Treasure chest full of gold and precious jewels is more than 66,000 links north of Santa Fe, but he does not say New Mexico this time. I may be wrong but who knows?! Another possibility is that the place where the treasure is hidden, or secreted is not the same place where Mr. Fenn buried, or engulfed it. We should be asking precise, and very well thought out questions when the time comes to ask. RC.

    • Just because Mr. Fenn said the treasure chest is hidden in the mountain north of Santa Fe NM it does not mean the treasure is physically there

      actually, that is what it means

      • RC –

        How many times does FF have to tell you IT IS THERE.

        Perhaps your brain is on overload – as happens to the best of us in this chase . Gat some rest.

      • Chris Yates* I never get into an argument with any searcher as to how one interprets the meaning of words, but if you study the meaning of the words in the statement I wrote, you will find out that I never said Mr. Fenn is lying, but that does not mean I am lying either. I will not respond to anymore statements. Thank you. RC.

    • I for one will come to RC’s defense. I think he raises a good point here. Suppose that what the poem’s solution leads to is another final clue that tells you where to claim the chest. Most of his statements about following the clues in the poem leading to the treasure, it will be waiting for you, etc are still valid. I think we need to keep our minds open to that possibility. It also would be another interesting twist to the quest and something that it seems he would possibly design.

      It also is a way to insure the chest isn’t stumbled upon by accident. Just saying don’t discount this possibility.

      • If you guys don’t want to believe him that’s fine, go find Bigfoot, that would probably be more profitable anyway. But do your research before commenting.

        I said on the Today show that the treasure is not associated with any structure. Some people say I have a desire to mislead. That is not true. There are no notes to be found or safety deposit boxes to be searched. The clues can lead you to the treasure, and it will be there waiting when you arrive.

        • That’s the quote I was paraphrasing. I believe him that there are no notes to be found or safety deposit boxes, but that doesn’t rule out a symbol inscribed on a rock, or one of his bells or jars, or several other scenarios and it is not misleading because the poem still would lead to the chest.

          Just a possibility, not necessarily a fact. Keep an open mind.

          • I knew exactly where to hide the chest so it would be difficult to find but not impossible. It’s in the mountains somewhere north of Santa Fe.

            Jack, as you can see from the above statements, Forrest said he hid The Chest in the Rocky Mountains

      • Jack* I know you are keeping an open mind. I am not saying I am right,but why not keep an open mind? I am not to one not to question how a statement is given, just because one ‘knows’ what a word means it does not mean he, or she is using it correctly.RC

    • After my first “solve” I would have said I totally agree with you RC…I now consider the possibility that that place itself was just a single clue. Hard to believe after all that work it would only be one clue, but it is a pretty big treasure. I wonder if we didn’t find the same place haha! It seemed so clear and precise. Argh! I definitely see where you’re coming from though 🙂

  55. @42
    My first encounter with Edward S. Curtis art was introduced to me by Amelia Earhart. We were walking to the Farmer’s Market and a picture of Amelia Earhart with a whole bunch of men caught our eye. She was at the Indianapolis 500 with a lot of the racers, etc. She was the only women in the picture. The owner of the gallery Douglas Kenyon invited us in an that is where I saw my first Curtis Gold Tone photograhph. Beautiful and moving images.

    • Homecoming76 – great story and interesting connection to Amelia Erhart and Forrest’s interests. I grew up in the nw – his rich sepia tone images of “the people” captivated me. My parents enjoyed Native American history books and purchased photos from the local historical society.

  56. @Amy
    Just sit back and Relax!

    It was the shortest summer, It was the longest summer, it was the spring of hope, it was the winter of our discontent! Whoa sorry I shouldn’t be mixing Dickens ans Shakespeare. It was the Spring of hope and it was TBD! Trying to Relax as Summer comes to an end!

    • Pooch
      What does T B D mean?

      That is my motto just Relax 🙂
      I have plenty of time to figure this beautiful poem out and save money for another trip next spring or summer 🙂

      • And why is everything said to be at the END and where at the END .

        And some think you Begin it and End it in the same place but that’s impossible to me because of take it in the canyon DOWN and put in BELOW so how do u get back UP to where u Began 🙂

        • And the mountain I hiked I will Never Ever be able to hike it again because it was Tough
          I don’t enjoy walking UP a mountain but I can sure come Down easy with a smile on my face 🙂

        • Amy, It’s confusing to me as well. IMO the solution to the poem is linear and you follow the clues in order. We’ve been told such. I “think” the circular theories play out in literature Forrest references and in the journey of his mind and spirit rather than a circuitous trail. So in essence, treasures that were important as a kid (family fishing, sunshine, peace of mind kids enjoy before the cares of the world engulf our minds) are finally the most important treasures again as an adult – after a life chasing the American dream or chasing away damage to ones heart and mind caused by war, etc.
          We go full circle and hopefully are whole at the end of our journey.
          Make sense?

  57. Little help here please.

    A number of folks have mentioned a “key” word in the poem. What is the reference behind this belief that the poem contains some sort of key word? I do not recall Mr. Fenn ever hinting at such a thing.

    Anyone have any insights on this?

  58. Forrest said something like….Searchers are keeping a tight focus on a word in the poem that is KEY. I remember. Much debate about the key word. I think the key words are WARM, Brown, and MEEK. Anyone got the exact quote?

  59. warm, Brown, meek. ff has since stated that there are many places wwwh . So I think you need to know Brown to narrow in on the spot wwwh.

  60. People feel that because forrest said peeps have been within 500 feet, that it must be an easy yet odd place. However why do you think its not for the Meek, if its so close to a trail head etc?
    It cant be that easy is its not for the meek…right?

      • “Only one person has ever been within 500ft period…everyone else 4500ft.”

        Wonder how he would know that.

        • Did Forrest say “everyone else w/in 4500 ft?” I’ve not seen that, can you provide the reference McElroy? or anyone else?

      • Gold Fever – something has been buzzing around in my brain about that 500 ft comment. Did ff say 2 searchers have been “within” 500 ft. because imo “within” implies all measurements from 0-500 ft. and could be they were within 12ft or 240 ft, etc.

        WITHIN: preposition
        inside (something).
        “the spread of fire within the building”
        synonyms: inside, in, enclosed by
        inside the range of (an area or boundary).
        “a field located within the city”
        inside the range of (a specified action or perception).
        “within reach”
        not further off than (used with distances).
        “Bob lives within a few miles of Honesdale”
        occurring inside (a particular period of time).
        “sold out within two hours”
        synonyms: in less than, in under, in no more than, after only
        “within a few hours”
        inside the bounds set by (a concept, argument, etc.).
        “full cooperation within the terms of the treaty”

        **Can someone Pleeease clarify that statement?correct interpretation makes a huge difference on where I look.

        • 42,

          The only thing you can gather from that statement (because of Fenn’s use of the word ‘within’), is that it’s no more than 500 feet. He set the maximum distance and nothing more. Anything else is conjecture.

        • 42 my info came from another searcher not sure where his comments are so take with a grain of salt. He stated that the chest is hidden somewhere in the range of 4,500 ft from a main road. I think he said he believes f left stuff behind like a trail of “things” specifically he mentioned a cup.

          • That comment sounds like one person’s opinion. I’m pretty sure it’s not anything Forrest has said. Dal’s Cheat Sheet has most of the information/facts/statements that Forrest has said. The 4500 foot statement and a trail of items with a cup has never been mentioned by anyone here that I am aware of. Have you done a search for that statement on any other blogs to see who said that and why they think that? Personally, I think it’s a lot closer to a road and parking area than 4500 feet! 🙂

        • I think he said a man but there may have been a woman with him?? So they were within 500ft but then why is this news article saying 200ft. Why are these PPL missing the chest?

    • Question posted 6/9/2014:

      You said in the past that the chest is not in a dangerous place; yet searchers are searching along Cliffside’s, raging water, and other seemingly dangerous places. Could you please elaborate or qualify your statement in which you said” The chest is not in a dangerous place”

      Edward, thanks for the question.
      The treasure is not hidden in a dangerous place in the normal definition of the word, realizing that there probably is no place on this planet that is safe under all conditions. Bloggers have quoted me as saying that a child could walk up to the treasure. I don’t think that’s an accurate quote because a three year old girl would have a problem without some help. Remember, I was about 80 when I hid the chest, and had to make two trips.f

    • Hey Lou Lee,

      My latest attempt at failure has 3 potential “meeks” that all coincide at the same location for the most part. One has been mentioned here a good number of times, the next is rather scary, and the final one is in season. All are very basic, but again do not forget that my attempts have to do with failure..

  61. After reading so much of your writings. I do believe I know about where it is located. I haven’t worked in 6 months. I will try to come up with the money to head that way. Thank you ahead of time forrest.

  62. Now this is interesting… I remember betting a guy named John Brown on whether he would find the treasure. He taunted everyone to take his bet at 50:1. I put up $5000 and he put up $100 (his $100 says he would find it by Jun 30).

    He didn’t have the integrity to pay – lol

    I am sure you guys will honour your bets.

  63. Do recall that. You have never misplaced my trust so I know you would keep your bet.

    At the same time your not an idiot and a better be right on that betting.

    Money is a great teacher, it gives very painful and pleasurable lessons:)

  64. Rick, I know you will keep your bet as well. I agree money is a great teacher and sometimes that is what is required in order for some to learn – lol Good luck!

  65. @Amy

    TBD – The Big Day! I couldn’t have thought of anything better! Thank-you for always being so positive!

    • Poochy Poo 🙂 lol I had to say it 🙂

      Thanks I always think Positive . And I give Thanks everyday for the things in life that I do have. 🙂 !!!!!!!

    TBD 6-24-2015

    • An attempt by you to get back to the treasure at this point is not the Joker you say? Thanks for clarifying that the chest is not in water. Thanks again Forrest.

      IT IS BOTH(its not funny when it rains) you have to cancel the outing…?
      why can’t anyone on this blog talk like a normal person?

  67. Dal et al…..
    I apologize for posting this random thought…but I needed a sounding board. Thnk you in advance for your understanding.

    While I admit that we live in a complicated and unfair world, full of hate, greed, intolerance, cruelty, injustice, and self righteousness, I simply cannot understand the absolute hatred one people can have for another people based solely on what their respective governments have said or done to each other in the past. As a PEOPLE, many have been repressed, conquered, slaughtered, or otherwise slighted…but as a PERSON, many have risen above these barriers, to succeed, educate, overcome, survive, thrive, make do, or change things. Why must we follow the leader when we know in our own hearts and minds that leader is wrong? Why is it so difficult for like minded people to come together on issues they agree upon, regardless of ANY other barriers that may be present between them? I don’t care for ANY religions….however, most religions have within them something positive to take away regardless of a person’s personal beliefs. Why do we focus on our differences? Earth would be such a nice place to live if we all concentrated on our commonalities. Family. Friends. Love. Peace. Food. Water. Clothing. Shelter. These are basic human needs we all have in common. Why do we focus on territory, tribalism, nationality, race, color, creed, money, and power? Teach a man to shoot, and he can go to war for you. Teach a man about his enemy, and he can find a common bond in being human.

  68. Michael

    Interesting thoughts
    I believe we are only passing through this life on earth , I hope everyone will make the right choice just look up and u will see the son . 🙂
    This life can be tough and all we can do is pray for peace., and for the world. And for the government of the USA because they are wrong in so many ways. 🙁

  69. I believe “the blaze” can be seen on Google Earth. FF: “all you need is the poem and maybe Google Earth and/or a good map”.

      • Diggin –

        Here is what I know that FF said about Google –

        “Some searchers overrate the complexity of the search. Knowing about head pressures, foot pounds, acre feet, bible verses, Latin, cubic inches, icons, fonts, charts, graphs, formulas, curved lines, magnetic variation, codes, depth meters, riddles, drones or ciphers, will not assist anyone to the treasure location, although those things have been offered as positive solutions. Excellent research materials are TTOTC, Google Earth, and/or a good map.” (Dal’s Blog/ Scrapbook)

        And this one posted on Toby’s blog.

        “No. It isn’t. (Responding to the question whether or not it was possible to find the treasure without leaving your computer and Google Earth.) There’s not a picture of the treasure on Google Earth…because Google Earth doesn’t go down far enough.”

      • Diggin

        someone asked f if the blaze can be pre determined before you search. f wouldn’t answer the question and so i doubt he would answer that one

        i can answer for you tho, if you want 🙂

        • Yea I asked a question on jenny kyles site about the blaze but my brain stays scrambled I forgot what I asked lol

          • Hi gypsy,

            I remember your question (Is the blaze one single object) Forrest responded with (In a word yes) I laughed because I was thinking his response was a trick answer. Think about this if I said the White House was the blaze…and lets say it was more than one object because broken up by an entry house etc…Really it isn’t a single object but in (a word) it is one object. Maybe thats not a good analogy perhaps a fault line would be better like maybe the San Andreas fault. Same fault line in a word but maybe not all connected together.

          • Ohhhh thanks Sally I was racking my brain wondering what I asked lol. Dang I hope he ain’t being tricky 🙂

          • Diggin gypsy,
            To the best of my ability to understand, F is not being tricky; rather, he is being as accurate as humanly possible.

            Happy “Talk like a pirate day” to everyone!


    • Mikael – seeing you have the statement in quotes, that must be an exact quote f made somewhere… I would love to have the reference and see or hear it for myself.

      Good luck producing it… sorry, just have to challenge statements that are not correct; but am happy to be proved wrong if f did say it!

  70. Dal

    Remember the 2 photos I sent to u
    Was wondering if u are going to post them on the photo blog . I hope I sent them correctly:)
    Thank u

    • Amy –

      Dal’s a busy guy – and we all appreciate him. Just send him the photos again via e-mail – mark in the subject line ” photos” – then he will not have to dig for them OK?

  71. Swan

    Thanks for seeing that you lost the bet for $100.

    Have Forreest’s email and answer. I don’t know how he would take it posting a private message and using his name like that in a public fashion.

    If you email Forrest and asked him “Hay did Rick ask you if your owned anything currently by Curtis and you said No.”

    I’m sure he wouldn’t mind resolving a bet.

    It will be very clear the matter is resolved in my favor:)

    Then feel free to email me .


  72. Food For Thought:

    Fenn states he hid the chest in an afternoon. Assuming that is true and assuming he drove to where he was to hide the chest, how many hours would he travel to the location.

    Anytime after 12 P.M. would be afternoon. If he were to leave, let’s say, 6 A.M., what would be the distance (and time) he would travel and get back in time for dinner? He mentions a flashlight and a sandwich, so we know he is covering lunch. But in order to “Keep his secret”, he would want to get back in time for dinner. Any theories out there?

    • German Guy, I don’t think you can nail down where he drove from and where he returned to. Fenn basically has unlimited resources to get what he wants done.

      If he drove from his house he could easily get to anywhere on the enchanted circle; and many other places. But who’s to say he went back home or started from his house. He travels extensively to many different events. He recently bopped down to Suzanne Somers house for a little get together.

      He could have left a golf game in Colorado Springs and been back before anyone knew he was gone. I could come up with scenario to fit just about any place. The only things we know about him hiding the chest is he did it in one afternoon, he made two trips that afternoon to hide it, he returned to his car, and he was about 80 when he did it. Anything else is just conjecture.

      Did I miss anything?

      • Goofy,

        All good points. However, IMO this would be a lot different then “bopping” done to Somers’ place. He had a plan and it seems he followed it to the ‘T’.

        I see the focus on time and distance from his remark of ‘doing it in one afternoon’, and ‘having a sandwich and flashlight’ as supporting this idea.

        Let’s face it, isn’t most theories on this blog ‘conjecture’?

        “I don’t think you can nail down where he drove from…”. Can we really imagine that Fenn drove around with a chest full of valuables in his trunk, until he decides to go bury it? Aren’t we possibly stretching it a bit?

        “I could come up with scenario to fit just about any place”. True, but I’m proposing to share my thoughts on just one of those ‘scenarios’, time and distance. We can always make Fenn out to be a Super Sleuth, but seriously, he was about 80 at the time.

        Since we both have our own ‘opinion’ on this, let’s just agree to disagree for now.

        By the way, thanks for your perspective.

        • Your welcome……Best I can tell we agree……most everything is conjecture.

          If you want to conjure up something to back up your spot that is fine……but it is no more correct than anyone else’s. He regularly handles and transports items many times more valuable than the chest; it’s nothing new for him. The chest could be anywhere. To restrict a guy like Fenn with his imagination and resources from doing anything he set his mind to would be a mistake in my opinion.

          But it’s fine if you want to……Good luck.

          • Goofy, I understand your posts here because they make sense and you keep it simple.

            i agree that, anywhere that F wanted to hide the Chest in the allotted search area, he could have done so. where he hid it, he worked it out, and nobody was none the wiser.

          • Goofy,

            “If you want to conjure up something to back up your spot that is fine……”. Why do you assume I am conjuring up something to back up “my” spot? I have no need to do that anymore. I offered up my “Food for thought”, purely to stimulate conversation. Nothing more.

            I reread my original comment and couldn’t find anything that suggested I was addressing “my spot”.

            Please don’t read more into my comments than are there. Thank you.

            It’s great that you are our “Devils Advocate”, but let’s try to keep it friendly.

          • I apologize and stand corrected…….You don’t have a spot, you’re just conjuring.

            I am being friendly………You asked for a response so I gave you one.

    • Here’s my theory german:

      The gold is guarded by a tricky leprechaun, but—because no one sees the same rainbow and rainbows don’t “end” (they’re circles)—no one ever finds the gold or the magical mr. fenn inside of his forested fen.

      Maybe he said sandwich because there are picnic tables; and perhaps the flashlight to look inside of the hideyspot in leprechaunville.

    • I have to assume that the afternoon comment is true and at the same time very misleading. He could have driven to private property deep inside public land. Hopped the fence walked 500 feet, stuck the tc under a rock, same thing for the contents, been back home for dinner. Now for you and I to get to that spot could be a two day hike, or we risk trespassing.

  73. Hey, whoever recommended scrapbook 62 thanks. I’m just getting going on this chase and theres some really good stuff on that page. any other suggestions would be welcome to get me up to speed. Man is there a lot of stuff here!

  74. I for one do not think the Fenn treasure will ever be found. The blaze is too subjective. I think even if a person were to get close they might as well be 1 million miles away. A box that small would be next to impossible to find and the poem being so vague means the chest will stay hidden for eons. Forrest said the blaze could be alot of things. The thing is this, the poem doesn’t have enough info to find the chest. I bet if we took any searcher on this blog and put them within a 1 square mile of the chest they couldn’t find it in a year of searching. Don’t misunderstand me, I think Fenn hid a box but do the instructions really work? I’m dubious. My OPINIONS.

    • Your not the only one. Many of us are wondering how from the poem a person determines what the blaze is.

        • Interesting idea Chris. Would you mind elaborating? The poem just says “If you’ve been wise and found the blaze” and thats a big if. I googled find and here is what the dictionary has to say about that. O’m going with definition #2

          verb (used with object), found, finding.

          to come upon by chance; meet with:
          He found a nickel in the street.
          to locate, attain, or obtain by search or effort:
          to find an apartment; to find happiness.
          to locate or recover (something lost or misplaced):
          I can’t find my blue socks.
          to discover or perceive after consideration:
          to find something to be true.
          to gain or regain the use of:
          His anger finally helped him find his tongue.
          to ascertain by study or calculation:
          to find the sum of several numbers.
          to feel or perceive:
          He finds it so.

          • No, Chris. The ‘blaze’ is in the poem. When you have solved it (poem), you will also find that it is located in the area you are searching as well. But then again, this is only my perspective, isn’t it. 🙂

            BTW, it can be seen on GE.

          • I agree GG if you meant one can find what the blaze is in the poem. Also, one can find where the blaze is from in the poem and outside he poem. It’s the last 200 ft that is tricky.

        • Stanza 4 supports that idea. Fenn’s words “you only need the poem”. But then again, wisdom (if you’ve been wise) will give you the insight to recognize the blaze when you see it.

          • GG it appears being wise and finding the blaze are not connected. You have to be wise for whatever reason AND you have to find the blaze. Separate things.

          • Sally,

            The line is past tense…”If you’ve been wise and ‘found’ (not find) the blaze”. That’s why the and connects the two.

    • Maggie, The poem instructions/clues/hints led me to a very precise location of a “blaze”. But, that is only half way through the poem to the treasure…and in fact could be 1000 miles from the TC. It was encouraging however to find a blaze this precisely.

      The path to the blaze used geographic/geological/physical features and could be done with a good map and feet on the ground. Interesting that my initial thought of the blaze can be seen on GE, but the actual blaze in the wood cannot and the first led me to the second.

      I believe the clues/hints in the next stage of the search after finding the blaze require the use of imagery on GE…but the precision still eludes me.

      I believe the final stage will require feet and chest on the ground.

      I believe the poem will lead precisely to the TC, but I also am in agreement with your 1 sq. mile challenge…as you know some have already been within 500ft, 200ft,50ft…and perhaps closer.

      I will say this. If Mr. Fenn has buried the treasure, then I do not believe it will ever be found. So much so, that if Mr. Fenn ever states that he buried the treasure, my hunt will be over. If it is buried inside a cave like some of the relics he has found, then I believe you can find the cave so buried would not be as problematic I suppose.

      • Wind, That seems hard to pinpoint. Which line would you say tells you what the blaze is? My thinking in this would be “So hear me all and listen good, Your effort will be worth the cold.” and someone mentioned cross references as a way of finding the blaze. I found a poem mentioned on Jenny Kiles site titled “In The Wood” I find it interesting for 2 reasons. Both are poems and Fenns poem says I give you “title” The title of this poem is “In the Wood.” I’ve heard many far out ideas. Sometimes I feel untethered while reading some of the more bizarre solves. Anyways heres that poem.

        In the Wood

        Herbert Edwin Clarke (b. 1852)

        THROUGH laughing leaves the sunlight comes,
        Turning the green to gold;
        The bee about the heather hums,
        And the morning air is cold
        Here on the breezy woodland side, 5
        Where we two ride.

        Through laughing leaves on golden hair
        The sunlight glances down,
        And makes a halo round her there,
        And crowns her with a crown 10
        Queen of the sunrise and the sun,
        As we ride on.

        The wanton wind has kissed her face,—
        His lips have left a rose,—
        He found her cheek so sweet a place 15
        For kisses, I suppose,
        He thought he ’d leave a sign, that so
        Others might know.

        The path grows narrower as we ride,
        The green boughs close above, 20
        And overhead, and either side,
        The wild birds sing of Love:
        But ah, she is not listening
        To what they sing!

        Till I take up the wild-birds’ song, 25
        And word by word unfold
        Its meaning as we ride along,—
        And when my tale is told,
        I turn my eyes to hers again,—
        And then,—and then,— 30

        (The bridle path more narrow grows,
        The leaves shut out the sun;)
        Where the wind’s lips left their one rose
        My own leave more than one:
        While the leaves murmur up above, 35
        And laugh for love.

        This was the place;—you see the sky
        Now ’twixt the branches bare;
        About the path the dead leaves lie,
        And songless is the air;— 40
        All ’s changed since then, for that, you know,
        Was long ago.

        Let us ride on! The wind is cold,—
        Let us ride on—ride fast!—
        ’T is winter, and we knew of old 45
        That love could never last
        Without the summer and the sun!—
        Let us ride on!

        • Maggie, that In the Wood poem by Clark reminds of a sad song from the 70’s called Season’s in the Sun by Terry Jacks. but what do you think In the Wood has to do with ff’s poem? And i also think there could be a cross that’s important.

  75. this is from the bozeman daily chronicle

    Based on some emails, Fenn said he believes they have come within 200 feet of the treasure

    i havent seen a corroborating independent statement from Fenn on this, and journalists reporting what Fenn told them in articles have been notoriously riddled with inaccuracies, so take it for what its worth, which may be ‘nada’ lol

    • If this is correct then someone recently after the 500ft comment got closer. Then we had the phantom post. Whole episode is making me wonder.

        • Lou Lee –

          Here is a recent post –

          From Dal’s blog –

          SEPTEMBER 2014

          Only The Phantom

          This ode to the chase was forwarded to me from a searcher who wants to remain anon because he thinks he knows where the treasure is and doesn’t want the birds to give away his secret. Everyone will recognize that it’s a take-off from Edgar Allen Poe’s Quote the Raven Nevermore. f


          The phantom is mentioned nine times in this –


          I am looking for older times he used the word Phantom – will let you know.

          • Many people here believe he was shot down in a F-4 Phantom –

            Actually it was a F-100D Super Saber – which the Phantom replaced.

            I asked my husband (he worked on the phantom) in the Air Force –

            Then I looked it up –

            Here is the recorded record of when Forrest was shot down.

            20th December 1968

            USAF F‑100D (this is the plane)

            55‑3647 SD 306th TFS
            31st TFW
            USAF, Tuy Hoa hit in the forward fuselage by AAA near Ban Kate in southern Laos Maj Forrest B Fenn ejected, rescued by HH‑3Eof the 40th ARRS next day
            [see also 24th August 1968]

          • Thank You so much for sharing. I saw this, but did not take a look at it, but I will now. What is the name of the thread? Your so kind.
            Lou Lee …chased by bears in Jellystone park.

          • Please note – this is not a direct quote from FF –

            It must be in the videos –

            I am still looking – anyone else know ?

    • Chris – I have emailed f once and the reporter 2x and no responses from either. It would be nice if f confirmed the statement, but for now, I agree, not putting any credibility into the statement.

  76. Has this already been discussed….
    The picture of the treasure chest on Dals site is different than the one in the book.
    Hope im not bringing up dead horses… But i jus realized it

  77. On the subject of WWWH, here is another approach:

    The Buckman Direct Diversion (BDD) is a new, reliable, sustainable and safe public water supply and is here to meet customer water needs.

    The BDD brings excellent quality drinking water from the Rio Grande to serve the City of Santa Fe and Santa Fe County in a way that will provide a safe, reliable and sustainable source of water. The BDD will provide as much as 60 percent of the annual water supply for more than 100,000 customers, delivering as much as 15 million gallons per day of treated drinking water. Normally, the BDD will operate at about one-half of full capacity.

    From the Veterans’ Memorial Highway 599, accessible either from I-25 south of Santa Fe or from Hwy. 285 just north of town, exit onto Camino La Tierra (NOT the La Tierra trailheads!) and head west through the Las Campanas subdivision down Ancho canyon. After 5(?) miles, take a turn off pavement onto OLD Buckman Road. Follow this DIRT road about ten miles, passing by the entrance to Diablo Canyon and HorseShoe Bend. Just before you reach the Rio Grande, turn right onto the small BLM road signed 26X. Drive a couple hundred yards through the tamarisk and mud puddles and find a place to park. In very muddy/sandy conditions, passenger cars may want to park on the main road to avoid 26X.
    >>>Bring a shovel to dig your car out of the sand!!<<< 4WD prefered vehicle.

    latitude 35.832 and longitude -106.157. The road meets the river a little way further

    The elevation is 5,538 feet.Less at the river.

    Approximatly 8.5 miles north of Santa Fe.
    A great place to stash a body where it won't soon be found.

    • We were out that way earlier in the year, not as part of our treasure hunting, just checking out the Rio Grande at various locales. [I remember having to take the correct Buckman road!] There was actually a lot of security around the water plant on the left just before the river – – barbed wire, “you are being videotaped” signs, etc. Pretty quiet spot for river access itself, though.

  78. germanguy, fundamentaldesign, & all you searchers who agree that the blaze can be determined from the poem – I don’t think it can be. However, if y’all have figured out the blaze, evidently none of y’all know the search location. So y’all who have the blaze should team up with those who know the location. Location + blaze = treasure. Why don’t y’all do that?

      • Hmm Becky. I think the poem will get you to the area where the blaze is but there is nothing in the poem that says what the blaze is SO THEN WHAT? Figure out the poem and can’t figure the blaze.

        • Sally follow the yellow brick road. There gotta be a Kansas connection here/ \don’t you think 🙂 Maybe Oz would know.

          • STW, that’s great but your idea requires special knowledge. Forrest said your average Joe could solve the poem without knowing stuff like that. 42 thank you for your contribution. I’m thinking your right about x marking a general area then narrowing quest to more specific area (a trail or just a general direction to go not necessarily a trail) but then ULTIMATE blaze evades me. I’ve been thinking though; is it possible blaze might be timing sensitive. Sunlight or something like that (a blaze of light that when sun is at certain position it would illuminate an area) I guess for me it seems that what the poem is saying is we should already know what to look for before we get to (x general area) and then our more specific area or direction.

        • Becky, Sally, 42- This is all just my way of solving the poem which probably isn’t correct.

          FF is clever enough to hide the general location of where to start your quest in the poem. Also he is clever enough to hide a description of the blaze in the poem. Sometimes magician’s hide things in plain sight. So, though you could be right in saying we can’t determine the blaze from just the poem I’ve taken FF’s abilities into consideration and focused on how he could have pulled it off.

          I’ve mentioned a few times on the blogs my thoughts on how I feel he gets us to the general location from the first stanza. I’ve mentioned recently how he probably needs to describe to us in the poem where we are to start our vehicle travels at the general location and where we need to stop our vehicle at or near the blaze to do our proper search site searching.

          I’ve mentioned a few times how I came up with my word that is key and where I think that it is placed in the poem and why. I could have the wrong word…

          I’ve posted a photo of my blaze on the one of the blogs.

          One reason why I won’t say my blaze today is that I don’t think the blaze that we are looking for is so site specific that it only works in one location. I think it’s a rare thing to see out there.

          So I would keep it simple. I think 42 is on the right track in his above post on how to determine the blaze. I did use one online map that had something listed on it that you don’t see everywhere else. I used an historical event that’s in the historical record but is too small an event to make a history book.

          So who knows….

          • I am confused by how the word HOW is used … I don’t recall any place where you told us HOW you came to your keyword, but maybe I missed it.
            I hope I am not too picky, but HOW requires some real objective specificity. I know it’s often used casually, interchangeably, and confusingly with that slippery WHY word. The grammatical confusion was once clarified for me with this comment: Science only answers the HOW questions … it connects the dots, the cause to effect. Religion and Philosophy only answer the WHY questions … plunk it down a priori.
            The example given to me at the time was Rain… HOW it rains – vs – WHY it rains (molecules, heat, gravity, etc. – vs – Angels are crying/ Farmer’s Almanac/ always does this time of year, etc.) …… or maybe it was a discussion about the invention of the barometer where the scholastics ‘WHY’ answer was “because nature abhors a vacuum.” A kind of truth, but not very useful.
            I know, a thousand examples of challenge & contrariety are gonna start flying, but please consider what I am trying to say. I think it will help clarify some of the discussion. At least I hope it lessens the use of HOW when there is no HOW there, and I can stop searching the threads for it.
            Fundi, I’m guessing that your statement just means, ‘like I said before’, not really referring to HOW you deduced your keyword. If I’m wrong, please tell us again HOW you came up with your keyword?
            How and Why distinctions also enter my thinking in stanza 5 at “the answers I already know.”

    • Becky, German, Fundamental, old Choctaw – in line with Becky’s thinking, if you know the blaze, and it doesn’t give away your place, why not just say what you believe the blaze is.

      I have my search area narrowed, but have not searched my area yet. Here are my meager Blaze offerings:

      IMO there could be 3 blazes. 1. solve the poem on a map gives you X at [general location] 2. Solve the poem again for narrow search area [trail] 3.find a specific type blaze at the exact location [treasure chest]. A ‘meld’ of 3 solves of the poem – from broad to specific.

      Note: when Forrest responded his blaze is one thing “in a word yes” the letter Y in yes could serve as all three blazes; as could forms of water, or the color White, or a “W” or “UU; or a Trail

      I believe the 1st blaze is an x on the map that you must plot. I disagree that learning about Forrest Fenn is unnecessary. If you were trying to determine where Abe Lincoln or JFK hid a treasure, you would read everything about the men to determine what and where were important to the man and then plot your X to search area. I believe the 2nd blaze is white. The 3rd blaze will be recognizable IF you ever see it.

      Would APPRECIATE anyone’s help with directions found in the poem. I plan to search an area but am struggling with solving anagrams, etc in the poem.
      On the ground search I learned is daunting w/o the exact directions, and I can’t seem to pin point them in the poem. Thank you for any help.

      • 42 I don’t mind saying what my blaze is imo it is correct a palm tree of stone that stands alone amongst spruce it really is a sight

        • 42 I will help you by sayindgo back and read stephan rreturns to the blaze everyone didnt believe in his blaze but I did and found it I have took it a little furtheralong

          • OldChoctaw, do you hail from AZ, CA or FL in the land of concrete palm trees and flamingos on the lawn?
            Funny comment. fasstforwarding to stephan returns to the blaze for a pina colada under the palm trees.
            In the end, the best advice I’ve seen and will follow again on next search is: Go somewhere beautiful with a person you enjoy and make memories together. Doubtful I’ll ever find ff’s tc, but living an adventure has been great. Spectacular scenery with friends or family adds up to chicken soup for my soul.

        • 42 I’m a okie born and raised fished and hunted my whole life this has been great fun for me and my family have had 4 exciting hikes hasn’t been expensive either we stayedin tents and took out food but imo I’m very close to finding the chest and if I don’t I’ll get another day and night in the great outdoors

          • Right there with you Choctaw. my family has enjoyed a few great search efforts too, and food was not expensive because all we ate was trail mix (didn’t want bears joining us) and burgers at night. Son especially loved getting out of a big city to hike, smell nature, see it up close. We live far from search area but burn ff miles to get there. I pay all bills on one credit card to acquire airline miles. very excited about next trip with friend. just going to enjoy hiking simple trails, laughter, friendship. don’t have a new solve developed enough to be thorough on the ground. best wishes and happy fishing Old Choctaw.

      • Hey 42, Your thought on the X is intriguing to me regarding a general area. For my current area of interest I actually found a blaze at the X which also coincided with having been wise. The poem then becomes the trail, but looking down ain’t so simple. For me the first blaze is white, the second I posted a picture of, and have not found the third as you defined it.

  79. Armchair Adventures !!!

    Very funny – I mean that in that in the best way.

    Old Shadows – you have a great sense of humor – and so does Forrest Fenn, Dal, and so many others. This humor will play a part in the chase – imo.

    • Thanks. Im surprised. Especially since the new VIEW SOURCE doesnt refer you to pg 29-35ish in the architects brochure, which is a challenge in itself to understand. Guess I shouldnt be surprised; by now, we dedicated leafs floating on this babbling brook are pretty good at finding the flotsam. øø

      • That’s exactly why most here are not in the running – they just don’t dig deep enough. 🙂

        • Itct… I have a Q, please think about it and see if you find agreement. Do you think there are more aliases on these threads than ‘Forest Fire’? I think I find 3, maybe 4 … all speak in different voices, but there an detectable authenticity to their plumes.

          • I think our friend might have missed his calling as an actor. 🙂

            Not only this blog – but others as well.

            And, for those who think he does not have time – he makes time.

          • Thanks. Cofirmation trusted.
            I wish I had that much time too, but somebodys got to make the meals and scrape the underwear.

          • CJ –

            Do fish swim?

            No, Dal could not tell. Period. I am not going to tell various ways to do that as it is off topic. Believe me – it can be done.

          • Oh, I know it CAN be done without Dal knowing, but would Forrest bother to do it? I just don’t think so. In the end I guess we will never know for sure unless he tells us. 🙂 Why are you so sure he does? I certainly could be wrong but I haven’t read any posts by anyone who seems to have the same “voice/style” on the blogs as Forrest has, or who has given any hints or made statements that seem like they came from him.

    • Sixer – thanks Jenny for your terrific website – Mysterious Writings. It’s anything but dull and well written! Enjoying your questions with Forrest.

  80. Came into town to get a wifi connection and perhaps more. Another great day will come today. I got additional pics of the Mummy Joe site and met McCullough, took pictures and off to the race again. We found the hint in the tree. So now we will see whats near the wood.

    • Search the West – I’m calling Dr. Oz right now. He knows all about chests and what’s inside, and will give me directions to Columbia’s teaching hospital.

        • SearchtheWest – just kidding about asking Dr. Oz. – everything is fine.
          Just out of good ideas on a complete solve. How does anyone figure it all out? forest fenn was a genius to make his poem fit almost anywhere in the Rocky Mountains, and he’s a good sculptor too. Did you see the photos on Jenny Kyles site?

          • I did I peered at it through both eyeballs. He F is an astute man with a razor sharp wit and a knack for telling stories that say two different things. You know under the radar sorta deal. I like the peace sculpture. I think Karl did a great job. I think The Great American west is such a beautiful place—lovely landscapes. Enjoying the latest sunset magazine ‘Monument Valley’ article. Oh and I like old ccowboy tales too. John Wayne stuff.

      • Thanks Dal, we will be going into where no chaser has ever been. Yet, I am sure they were there and didn’t even know it. I seen the footprints on my good map.

    • Ok Dal if you are hinting that this is a clue then I will play along.
      There are many instances of FF’s association of bronze. Before his art gallery, he cast bronze. There is the story of the school kids and the bronze that he tells in TTOTC.

      Now I know many are kind of sensitive about the chest being buried in 2003 because that would mean that Forrest is lying to us when he states when he was 79 or 80 when he buried it. Yet in his last post he is clearly caught with an untruth because those pop (tin) cans lids. Tin is actually used in 25% of the worlds pop cans.

      So maybe the 79-80 is a hint and not a lie as well? What kind of hint? What is bronze made of? Copper and tin and some zinc. The chemical number of these elements tin+copper and tin+ zinc add up to 79 and 80. I know you can argue atomic number 79 and 80 is gold and mercury of which case that is another story.

      But then again it could be about a buffalo… I couldn’t find an atomic number for buffalo.

      The Wolf

    • dal on the ce5 I have one more question to get my truck out of the sand and move on do you know what state this lady went to look for the tc she didn’t find thanks

      • frank-
        I don’t know which lady you are referring to. But to my knowledge the first person to spot the mark now known as CE5 was a German journalist visiting Forrest in 2013. The reporter simply asked Forrest what was the meaning of the CES mark on the clasp. That was the first time it was brought up that I can remember.

        • ok dal thanks that’s the lady I was talking about now I can move on just didn’t know – the story behind it

  81. Here’s one for everyone:)

    Maybe the chest has already been found packed out and the bracelet not sent back to Fenn………

    If Fenn knows they can just reach out and take it then I would imagine he should let us know that their in that type of position.

    This when he came out with a few and a dumb fish under a Lilly pad.


    • Rick- you seem really intent on referring to the dumb fish and lily pad every few posts. Are you wanting someone to inquire about it, or do you just keep forgetting you already posted it several times?

    • Rick, calling someone dumb repeatedly usually sends the message, you are unwelcome…get packing. Why swim up for another morsel of dummy treats and get clubbed? just saying.

      Observe FF, Dal, or Goofy old Guy, they serve up agreeable Scoobie Snacks and we all keep swimming back for more.

    • Rick calm down.
      I don’t think the Big Mouth is your mouth but I would have to check your teeth to say for sure… 🙂
      How late do you stay up before you call it a full day…
      looks like you posted after 2:00 my time that’s to late for me.

  82. It was a large mouth bass cruising just under the lilly pads and it wouldn’t take the food he was throwing to it

    • Rick or Old Choctaw: I remember reading that scrap book with the big mouth bass comments a while ago and it was Mr. Fenn speaking. So why is Rick/Indiana taking the reins? Not sure if pretending to be Mr. Fenn or maybe you know him. sorry, it’s a confusing line of dialogue. Does someone actually know if there is a person or just a bass forrest was feeding in his pond?

      IMO – the poem is vague, and for obvious reasons ff has to keep some comments vague, like talking about feeding fish.

  83. What, scraping underwear or STW’s ccowboy? He’s having so much fun, me too, but mine is just the blessings of senility.

    • Lol…and I forgot the period “.”

      Oh well, not trying to be serious, just 2 A.M. Slap happy 🙂

    I am headed out for a couple weeks. I will most likely be away from internet access. Goofy has graciously agreed to dust, take out the trash and winterize the old blog in my absence. I should be back around the 5th or so of October. If you see Ezmerelda and me on the road, wave…If you happen to run across Ezmerelda axel deep in sand, look around, I’m probably nearby pounding my head against a sympathetic rock..

    • Great news Dal. I wish you all the luck. This time could be a charm. At least we know there’ll be another interesting story to share. Be safe.

    • You’ll be missed! Have fun (thrills), and be safe.

      If Ezmerelda has the possibility of getting her axles in sand (not snow), then that is a clue as to where you are searching.

      We’ll keep and eye on Goofy while you’re gone (ha, ha).

      Looking forward to your report. 🙂

    • Good Luck and Safe Travels Dal! Looking forward to seeing your write-up of your adventures. They are always interesting, and very funny too! 🙂

    • “pounding my head against a sympathetic rock”

      The Red Badge of Discourage – otherwise known as:
      The blaze of Dal 🙂 🙂

      • That sounds like the makings of a song “The ballad of Dal”

        Maybe put to the tune of “the ballad of bilbo baggins”

    • Have a good trip……don’t worry about a thing we’ve got everything under control. Too bad you’re going to miss the annual Thrill of The Chase swimsuit edition.

      Did anyone else notice he’s leaving right before the Fall Equinox on September 22nd? The trees will be a blaze soon and falls first chill is griping the mountains. Probably just a coincidence.

      Drop in and say hey if you get a chance…….Oh, pay no attention to the beeping sound coming from Ezmerelda.

      • Dal, we will expect to see you in Goofy’s swimsuit edition wearing waders. I have a great place for you to check out on the Madison IDT has been checked before. Easy access with Ezzie. Feel free to pull my email from website – if you find it there, its all yours. I’m looking in another area, so pleeease don’t move that chest again on me! haha! 🙂

      • germanguy – ever wonder if anyone reads the extra goodies? I enjoyed your article about Sharp and Hauser studying art together in Munich, and loved the drawing of Sitting Bull wearing the monarch butterfly hat. I dreamt about a large white monarch last night, so it caught my attention. Do you know what butterfly’s symbolized to Native Americans? My question may be tied into clues – given the perfect imprint on the gold nugget adjacent the gold frog in ttotc.

          • Germanguy – thank you for the flutterby reference. The information was engaging, and while I’m not at all superstitious, two nights running of the same dream makes you curious if there is a meaning. bringer of dreams, and color meant luck or death. I’ll fly with the lucky one, since I’m not ready to soar on my final flight yet. Are you in solve mode this fall or out searching?

          • Search scheduled within next 2 weeks (hopefully) xxxxx xxxxx XXXXX XXXXX
            fingers and toes crossed.

          • Germanguy – glad to see you’ve traded in your uuu’s and rrr’s for xxx & XXX. After reading your uranium solve, I realized I’m in waaaay over my head. I’m artsy and like learning about ff’s life and history of his collections. my solves are lighthearted like sunlight playing off the riffles of a river. many of the hidden hints in his vignettes fly over my head on busy days helping friends or running a household. I’m just happy to go on another outdoor adventure, not caring much about clues or gold. the gold will be the quaking aspens this trip – love hearing those beautiful gold dollar leaves rustling in the breeze. Autumn is a wonderful time to breath in all of Creation’s splendor.

    • Go get it Dal, we still haven’t found it. I took a wrong turn and I hope to get back on track by the end of the day. Anyway, we did lots of inquiring on the meek. Interesting it isn’t there anymore since near and far. We did stumble on a Brown and we took history flying lessons.

      Funny we found a Grace Williams Fire Fall cd sitting high. Then near by we found a geocache. Last entry was in 2010. Then looking down we found double omegas and a cross in stone but could only be seen if you are looking south. It was a real positive day. So we are finishing up tomorrow and then heading south for the winter.

      Peace to you brother and have a very safe return.

    • Safe travels Dal. To give you something to think about on your drive…Is that a CE6 on Coca’s tab I can see when I zoom in? lol

    • Just seing this post. Good luck Dal, and safe trip. I’ve been a bit preoccupied, glad to read some are still able to search.

  85. Safe travels Dal. Ezzy will see you through, I am sure. If you do get lucky and locate that pesky bronze box maybe the ol’ girl could get a complete overhaul, and parked on your new mantle…

  86. @Rick

    Maybe the big-mouth bass isn’t dumb but maybe he is just preoccupied by something under the lily pad. Or worse yet maybe he is getting old and doesn’t see things as clearly as he used too! Do bass get preoccupied?

    • Rick, and Nancy……..Big mouth Bass can’t be dumb if he got Forrest’s attention to come out with the statements, ‘word that is key’, ‘it might be found sooner than I anticipated’, and feeding fish food to the large-mouth bass. In fact he must be ahead of everyone in the race to the chest. Maybe he enjoys watching all the hoop-la on the blogs just like Forrest does. Maybe he can go and get the treasure anytime he is ready….and Nancy, perhaps you are right that he he is preoccupied with more important things, i.e., family, or other endeavors.. -)

      • Oh, I forgot, he said ‘a deep thinking treasure searcher could use logic to find an important clue to the location of the chest’ and later said ‘he was getting dizzy and needed some Extra Strength Tylenol.’ The big mouth bass has him really confused. The big bass has only been loud in emails to him, not on the blogs.. whispering correct answers to his clues in the poem. Maybe he doesn’t really know if the TC has been found and that makes him nervous because big mouth is not saying anything…….Maybe big mouth bass needs an answer from him as to, what to do, but he won’t answer.

        I wouldn’t take big mouth bass lightly…I believe there is something fishy going on, no pun intended, but maybe, just maybe the TC has been found. Use logic!

        • Ritt i dont think this is anything that complex and i dont think there is anything nefarious going on

          when Forrest finds out the TC has been found he will let us know

          if one of us bass find the TC we would let Forrest know. it’s too easy to let F know anonymously, if one wants to remain unknown, for anyone not to do that

          i do think someone is getting close. its possible someone may have recently even figured it out and just hasnt made the trip yet.

          but that is just pure speculation on my part. all of us fish really are the ones who are in the dark here. we dont really know if any of our clues are correct, or are we even close, and how close are we.

          or i guess someone can say they know because they are so convinced by the clues. but do we ever know really?

          • IMO…

            “if” someone was sending Mr f emails with some of the correct solves to the clues…Mr f would “Not” be giving “food” to that particular fish.
            Either we believe Mr f or we do not, he has “clearly” stated that he will never give anyone an unfair advantage. So giving food to that one fish would be unfair to everyone else in the chase.

            It is also my opinion that the talk about the largemouth bass is not a hint but something else in what Mr f talked about in that scrapbook is.

          • Rickinflorida, the food that f gives out is for all of us to chew on, it is not an advantage for anyone. He likes to tell stories, no one knows what they really mean, if anything. In the eye of the beholder.. one can make it what ever they want. Good luck, Rif.

          • Chris…..we may never know, because it may never be found, at least not in our lifetime. But, if someone does find it I hope they would let F know, he probably would already know. Somehow I think he has a joker up his sleeve. lol.

        • Much ado about big mouth >

          I ask…how would the bass know he’s the bass?
          Forrest doesn’t whisper back or confirm who’s close. So how would you know?? Anyone who assumes they’re the bass is arrogant, ignorant, at a minimum presumptive. Even if my solve was incredible, which it’s not, I wouldn’t believe I was the bass. Who thinks they are the bass?

          • I think Samsmith has a good idea about his solve, I think he maybe the one, he seems so confidant about it and he has yet to go out and search. I think you’re right ,Chris, someone is close. Don’t get me wrong, Sam has never said that he was the BM Bass, or even said he knows where it is. He just has promoted a different way of solving the poem. Sam is a good guy, I wish him luck. And, if the bass has found it he would surely know that he is the bass. My guess is that he”s/she’s close.

          • Chris, ritt and 42,

            It only takes one “important” clue to blow the poem wide open. Mind you, I said “important”.

            If the poem contains 9 clues, it wouldn’t be impossible to find that 1 “important” one. With this kind of reasoning, finding 1 would be easier than finding all 9. That would change the whole focus of the search, don’t you agree?

          • me, i dont mind if anyone thinks they’re the big bass. its part of the fun of the whole thing.

            if you think you’re NEO (lol) , you’re the one who has cracked it open, thats what motivates people to do what Forrest intended. he said he wanted sweaty bodies out there searching

            we all know its just a bunch of noise until someone puts their hands on IT.

            i was guilty of that more than most, but the more failed searches i got under my belt, the false confidence and boasting slowly went away lol

            now i just hope to go quietly out there some night, and quietly come back …. shhhhhh


          • Chris, ritt, German –
            Yep, I agree with you all. I forget about SamSmith because he swims quietly with confidence. Would be of interest to see his method and solve.

            my key word and word that is key are different than what I’ve seen mentioned. I follow Windsurfers advice to search a beautiful place so that I’m never disappointed. after a few searches, I’m not sure my heart would hold out if I actually saw ff’s treasure.

  87. Dear Mr. Fenn. I have been intrigued to your “chase” for perhaps, a little over a year now and still hope to find you well. Finally!!!, received your book(TTOTC), as a birthday present this year and enjoyed reading, laughing and logically trying to decipher your poem. Although thinking outside the box has brought me to so many solutions but never a logical one. I finally have one that I can’t get away from. Even if I’m right or wrong, I feel your playing a game of poker, somewhere, perhaps where you really won that turquoise bracelet. (I heard it was a pool game but I’m still not sure about that). Either way, my “www” halt, is at the card table. (sure, you all may be friends but that stops, when you all sit down to play a game of cards). Canyon down, could be the card holder (shoot)? Could home of brown be called the little machine that draws the cards?(A Brown or brownie) I don’t know. No place for the meek, could be the “river” from there, the end is drawing to and end (last card). Maybe your holding a “rainbow” of cards, lets just say “ace of hearts, 5 of diamonds and a 2 of spades. The river card is a 4 of clubs. The last card is a 3 of whatever, because if you look quickly down, now you have seen the “BLAZE”. Nice straight!!! Although I always thought the blaze in poker was a JQK, I just can’t figure that in right now. (Look around the table, proud and can’t believe you just got this hand, voila!!), IF YOU ARE WISE, look quickly down your “chest” and to seize, just take the pot and go in peace. (tarry scant and marvel gaze: bye everyone, and thanks for that turquoise bracelet) !!! “Done it tired” could also be the “bicycle” cards you were playing with. I don’t know… From here, take these 5 numbers, then apply them to your Rocky mountains, with your poem. I’m so tired now from thinking but it’s my best solution thus far. ( Except for my first). My solution to the poem brings me to around Tesuque, NM near the Casino or near White Rocks, NM. I think I’ve found your map, some call it the “Running Man, I think it’s the Flying Man”. (I also think it’s the treasure map!!!) Thanks for your time…with love and peace, Lois.

    was sent twice. I sent this statement to FF, no response….just thinking outside the box. Done with the chase…but have a lot more info…deciphering the poem if anyone is interested. Like the Beowulf and paddle meaning.

    • Chris,…..You just need the last clue.

      Jenny Kile, Mysterious Writings:

      Question posted 7/4/2014:

      Forrest, What’s the minimum number of clues that we need to solve to find the treasure, assuming that we follow the clues in order? `Serge Teteblanche

      Just one Serge, the last one.f

        • You need all the ingredients to bake the cake……..I believe he did say that too. lol
          I guess that when you get to the blaze you need to pour on the sugar (Babyruth) to finish the job.
          And, don’t forget to throw in the flashlight and sandwich. lol.

          • One can’t find the HOB without first finding where warm water halts. I’ve heard people say they can reverse engineer the poem. I don’t think it’s likely. Clues validate clues. Like connecting dots. Good luck!

          • Personally I prefer almond snickers, one for breakfast, lunch and dinner. Throw in a couple cokes too. L if e takes alot of energy sometimes. Does anyone else out there drink smoothies? Everyday I blend a killer mix. Banana, Apple, Cucumber, Blackberries, Avocado, Kale, yogurt and rice milk. Suzanne, you’d be jealous!

          • Where ever the next gust carries me. “Oh, tell me wise sir, Where are the treasures? And the wise man replied, “Wherever you find them”

    • Chris,

      In order to start putting a puzzle together, what is the minimum number of pieces you need to start.

        • chill like a Villon mon reggie music it all good no need to stir a night before xmas and all thru the wood not a brown in the wood !stir mix a lot think with all do respect !

          • I don’t quite see ff jammin to some reggae vibes but the man has lived and been around.
            But who knows, cancer patients have been said to go north to Co.
            Maybe he did blaze in the canyon down. I’m sure every stoner in the country would love that.
            However, the blaze is something much more pure and simple I imagine……….all in opinion.

          • HI Cowboy
            What ya been smoking it no good how much you pay??? What time you go to bed after 12 you use military time 🙂 I like to hit the sack by midnight but hey some guys are tuff they be up till it gets ruff…

  88. I had an inner ear infection once, a most unpleasant experience and I hope never to endure again. When it struck me it was not the nausea I disliked, it was that no matter how hard I tried to walk down the hall and keep going straight. I could not overcome the vertigo. The part of me that controlled my balance was off, even with my eyes seeing where I wanted to go and mustering all of my conscious might to compensate the imbalance, I still walked left into the wall.

    It’s funny how a tiny inner ear infection took control of what I wanted to do and I kept hitting a wall.

    It’s 2 A.M. and I wish I could sleep, too you who can, may your dreams be pleasant 🙂

    • I had a very mild inner ear infection. I was fine unless I turned my head to a certain angle, then I too would be bouncing off a wall. It was very annoying.

      Hope you were able to find your rest.

    • Indiana, sorry you’re not sleeping. everything seems worse and off balance without rest. And you had to absorb quite a few comments on the blog about the bass yesterday including my own. Sorry. Weekends are a great time to recharge your soul with a nap, book or tinkering with your archaeology stuff. I’ll say a prayer for you.

  89. I was just wondering if anyone else has had any negative interactions with Forrest because I just experienced something that totally shocked me. I have been in the hunt for over 2 years, have made 12 trips from the east coast to the Rockies, have spent well over $15k, and like many, have sacrificed a lot for this hunt, fully aware it was my decision. I have also been in contact with Forrest on many occasions updating him on my adventures and search areas and his correspondence has always been pleasant to where I certainly would consider it having led to a relationship. I just returned from my 12th trip during which I discovered a curious connection with Forrest. I happen to own something very personal from a poet that he quoted often in his book. I mentioned in my email that I felt bad that the object was stored away while he was sharing all his stories of his many artifacts with the world, so because of his interest in the poet, I asked him is he was interested in buying the object. I then wrote, in what I thought was an obvious joking way (and only because I felt we had a relationship from the search), and I quote “I don’t suppose you are interested in trading valuable hunt information for it.” Now it would be one thing if this was the first time I contacted him, but I also sent him a 12 page memoir of my searches for which he favorably commented and told me to send a copy to the Library of Congress. Anyway, I then continued with an update on my 9 clues and my search and finished by saying I was disappointed I did not find the treasure but at least I was able to share the story of this poet’s object with him. To my surprise, Forrest responded with the following: “You insult me sir, and you are not worthy of the search. please do not contact me again. f” I can only assume he felt I was serious about trading the object for hunt info, as ridiculous as it seemed to me when I wrote it, so I immediately replied to Forrest to apologize and explain, but I never heard back. It bothered me for quite a while so I sent a follow on email a few hours later explaining I was just joking and how sorry I was for even making fun of something like that and I hoped he would simply give me the benefit of the doubt and reply to tell me he understood but I heard nothing back. I am not leaving any details out but without knowing why he got angry I guess it is hard for me to explain anything else about this. Anyway, still very upset that he reacted that way and was just wondering if anyone else had any similar experiences. With all I have been through I really feel let down by Forrest and although I have confidence of my 9 clues I am no longer motivated to keep searching. I know Forrest is held in high regard in the court of public opinion and I am a nobody, but I do feel I did not deserve a response like that and even if he misunderstood and took me seriously, then to have my clarification and apology ignored.

    • Sometimes old men get grumpy and its usually because they don’t feel good. They generally don’t mean it…if he was a friend before he will always be a friend… he deserves that for the time he spent corresponding with you when he never had to in the first place. Focus on your positive memories and not the negative ones and eventually you will understand.

      • Ctron, I would leave forrest a lot of slack in your rope. He doesn’t know any of us except a handful like Dal, etc. and couldn’t possibly read intentions. I like What Dal said… Be careful what you write or if you write at all. No badgering, no begging, no whining. Lastly, when making assumptions try to assume the best in others.

        • Sorry if I came across like “oh he’s grumpy”… I guess I should take that back.!
          I meant …we all have off days and that email probably came across wrong…don’t throw away the good memories on a simple misunderstanding.
          (BTW, im married to an old man and he does get grumpy! hehe! but he’s a good man)

    • “I don’t suppose you are interested in trading valuable hunt information for it.”

      Sounds like an attempted bribe to me…
      I’ll bet Forrest get’s a lot of offers like that..real ones..
      It may not be clear to him that you were joking…

      Intent and emotion are often hard to gauge in text when someone can’t see the smile in your eyes as you write something.
      My guess is that Forrest gets hundreds of emails a day and not all of them are good or fun..
      I know he gets threats…requests for money..criticism….begging… badgering…

      This chase is not always fun for Forrest…
      Maybe he skimmed over your note and simply saw the line that sounds like a bribe..
      Maybe yours was the 10th note he read in a row asking for clues…
      Who knows…
      But clearly, you’ve got to be more careful what you write…
      Humor, is hard to convey in text..

      • So well stated, Dal.

        Can you even begin to imagine the pressure on Forrest, when every single word he says is scrutinized over and over.

        He has told us – the poem is straight forward, and in my opinion so is he. So, any impropriety, of any kind – will be ignored by him. At least he told you, why you are no longer able to speak with him – he could have just hit the delete button and you would have been wondering why – forever.

        Ctron – thanks for your post.

        • Thanks everyone for all the support and advice, this blog is truly an extended family, all of us sharing in common sacrifices and frustrations as a result of this hunt. I guess it wasn’t so much his email that upset me but the fact that he didn’t give me a chance to explain and instead coldly ended our correspondence. I know it isn’t easy being ff and I told him that often.

          • Ctron, Forrest may have ended correspondence not coldly, but abruptly for internet security reasons. His emails must get hacked by people trying to see solves sent to him, and listening for what we call the whispers about the treasure location. He’s mentioned police and others are advising him about safety.

    • Hi Ctron, We sent several emails to Fenn with no response but continued to communicate because we were having fun and after all he put his email address in his book. Then one day he responded in a way that hurt our feelings. I replied to him that a simple please stop would have sufficed. I sent a few more afterwards that summarized the remainder of our search with no response and have now stopped sending email to him. I’ll add that we’re pretty sure we know what the “Nada, awe” means in Asphalt Art and it isn’t a compliment. Good luck.

      • It is a play on words, I do not think he directed it to anyone.

        Sprite Zero – Nada, he could have also called it Zilch
        A&W – Awe

        • I’m pretty sure I have an email that would make you rethink it. But you are entitled to think what you want.

      • Thanks for sharing your story crazyfamily. Forrest said in his book that he did all this for the searchers, to give them the thrill of the chase that he had his whole life and while he shouldn’t have to deal with inappropriate behavior, f put himself in a position as a role model which is not always easy. I think about professional athletes who forget that they play the game for the fans and without them, there would be no game. Without us searchers there would be no game either so we are entitled to at least some respect for that in addition to simply being human beings. If anyone does something unintentionally wrong then they deserve to have an apology accepted (within reason) contrary to what Raven said below. I like to think I have and always would accept a heart felt apology because we all make mistakes.

    • I have to wonder why you feel it necessary to air this spat in public. It appears that Forrest took offense at your suggestion that he trade search info for your poetry item. That seems like a pretty reasonable response to me and although his reply was sharp and blunt, I think it was more honest to do that then to just ignore your email. Since when is someone obligated to accept an apology and clarification? Your complaints aired in this forum now add insult to injury in my opinion. You might have given him a little more time to digest your apologies before taking a swing at him in public. Also, I wonder why you and some other people who have spent time and money searching for the treasure feel that somehow their investment creates a “debt” that you are owed by someone (Forrest?). That’s a frequently repeated refrain made by other disgruntled searchers that is particularly galling. Don’t spend money that you can’t afford to spend–or don’t complain about it if you do. One can only imagine the ugly side of people that Forrest has had to grapple with after beginning this chase. Give him a break for goodness sake.

    • Tread carefully around the Fennster and don’t step on his toes. My guess is he gets a ton of emails and everyone thinks that they can get something out of him.

    • CTron,

      That certainly seems out of character for Forrest, to react that way. I can understand your feelings in that regards.

      I myself am in periodic contact with Forrest, but usually mostly on non-search related things. The problem I see in using the written word, instead of oral communications, is that sometimes words can be mischaracterize when their read. You see, in normal person to person communications, we not only hear the other person’s words, but we can also observe their body language. Of course, this confirms for us what we are hearing the other person say.

      I wouldn’t concern yourself with the email for now. I’m sure Forrest reads these comments and will understand how you feel and if he misunderstood your intentions, will either email you or comment here. So, I’d calm down and wait see.

      Besides, did you get him before he had his morning Tea?

    • Ctron, Let me tell you about an experience at the death of a dear friend. I always thought she was MY best friend. At the funeral I saw everyone so sad and crying and my thought was, they are not as sad as me, because she was MY BFF. But a thought hit me like a hammer. Everybody in that room thought she was their BFF, because of her personality. Loving, giving and caring to everyone. I believe that is what has happened here, even if the majority of us have not met Mr. Fenn we all feel we know him, and maybe get to casual or comfortable in our correspondence. A friendship can only develop face-to-face over time. What we have in this chase is a working relationship. You don’t have to be BFF to work together. Working relationships have ups and downs, but you reach a medium ground to continue the necessary goal.

      Just how I see the situation.

  90. CTron that’s a shame, hopefully f reads your follow-up emails or will see your post on here.
    I use to email him and since have stopped due to the fact that i felt like i was intruding in his personal space.
    I see the misunderstanding being rectified in the near future. f is a kind and understanding gentleman imo.

  91. A mans word, his name and integrity was very important to men of mr.fenns era .even a friend would get the same response thr world would be a better place if we all was brought up this way joke or not it will take time to amend it hope it works out for you.all you can do is apologize

  92. “You insult me sir, and you are not worthy of the search. please do not contact me again. f”

    I just read your post Ctron. It is unfortunate that you are treated that way.
    FORREST, how can you judge your audience on who is worthy or not. You don’t have that power. You have insulted all of the chasers.

    • not to nit pick, buy you do not have the power to decide when and if I have been insulted, which I have not.

    • Mark beat me to it……..

      So who made you the insult maven Geydelkon? Why do you think you can so arrogantly speak for all the chasers? You certainly don’t speak for me.

      Ctron, there’s an old saying, “One ah crap, and you lose all your attaboys.” You just lost all your attaboys; you can whine about it or you can go about fixing what you did. Some things you just don’t joke about. Right now you are a slime ball or just have really bad judgment; in either case it’s not something that will be rectified over night. Saying you’re sorry doesn’t make it alright….. It could take a long time, but maybe he will forgive you.

      • Goofy, after reading the replies here I thought long and hard about why I included that silly offer in my note in the first place and the bottom line is that anyone who has been in this hunt for as long as I have (which f knows) knows how careful he is about giving out info, how he goes out of his way to keep things fair, how rich he is (financially and emotionally) that money means nothing to him so when you look at what I said it was apparent (at least to me) that it was just a silly statement. There is, however, no mistaking intention after being called a slime ball by a stranger.

        • Ctron, I don’t know if you are a slime ball or not. Like I said, you either have very bad judgment in my opinion or are a slime ball. I was thinking you just made a really dumb mistake, but now I wonder. If you actually have been in the hunt as long as you say you have then you would know how many times Fenn has been attacked and would know what you did was totally inappropriate. Getting your feelings all hurt because “a stranger” said you might be a slime ball looks like you’re trying to redirect the discussion to what I said; which is a typical tactic of a guilty person.

          • Wow goofy, at least when I made my mistake to f, I apologized, that was my point all along and my point to you. You are judging me then call me names for an honest mistake which I took full responsibility for (don’t you remember I said I immediately sent f an apology). Look inward. I don’t know you so rest assured, my feelings were not hurt a bit by name calling…and certainly no redirect either since I said all along I realized what I did was wrong…read my note above to carzyfamily about what we searchers are to f, maybe you’ll get it….peace

          • Goofy,

            Back off. There’s no need for you to feel like you need to be the conscience of the blog. You did the same thing to me when I sent Michael D. on the last search. With all your raving about safety and such.

            We are all ‘individuals’ here and for the most part, adults. None of us here can say that at one time or another, that we didn’t have our own individual “brain farts”. CTron just had his. End of story, move on… Please!

          • Now who has hold of the reigns in Dal’s absence? Time to pull back on the riegns and say, “whoa, Nellie, woah!”

          • Ctron, from reading all your comments I lean toward you made a dumb mistake. Being a seasoned searcher you would have to know how many times Fenn’s integrity has been attacked and understand why he responded the way he did and why your offer was inappropriate even in jest.

            As you would also know from being a long time searcher I don’t have a problem calling Fenn out when I think he’s in the wrong, but this time I understand and completely agree with his response. He can’t compromise the integrity of the chase.

            Now, what’s going on with the “Asphalt Art” post I have no idea. He dug that hole and he can climb out……..But that’s another discussion on another post.

          • Chris,

            Funny, I didn’t understand that either. Maybe he saw unusual activity going on there. Who knows. I’m sure he’ll enlighten us soon.

          • Chris, apparently he was incorrect about the date he acquired the Coke can (I didn’t research that). We can discuss that over there if you like.

    • I try to keep an open mind. I hear an opinion in f’s response and a demand to not contact f again. I may, perhaps, given a similar statement as f gave. Mine would have had been said with a touch of humor using the same words. If you would take what I said as serious, the joke would be on you. All joking aside, I would take the request to not contact him again as him being a serious request. I know it is hard to sit on ones own hands, but if that is how the cookie crumbles, then sit on those hands and try to smile. Good luck to all searchers and stay focused. I, myself shall find a chair fit for an f, and ponder my outlook on the environment. When I get to such a throne, I shall sit and tell all, “I’m on it!” I wish all reading this good health and if you have ailment, may it be alieved. Life is too short to not dust yourself off and go enjoy your desserts. Forgive and be forgiven. Peace

  93. I wasn’t insulted it’s his game you are playing and was offered a bribe by one of the players don’t put this off as if it was mr. Fenns fault

    • Yes, a bribe was offered. Yet, as far as I know there is no rule book. What have we all done to find out more information. I will do what it takes and I have done just that. I will use what ever tool necessary within the laws of the land.

    • old choctaw….as I said in my note, it was not a bribe, it was truly meant as levity. I agree it can be interpreted as one since emails cannot convey feelings and expressions. It was my history with him that I thought would give me the benefit of the doubt or at least a chance to explain and apologize if something was taken out of context because I don’t feel like a stranger to him. Nonetheless, I never meant this to turn into bickering so let’s just say I am ok with it, learned a lesson, and we all should move on…

      • CTron,
        I’m not as sympathetic as most. I can see both side to this story. Your impression of being misunderstood, Fenn’s impression of being insulted. My thought don’t even relate to the interaction of those e-mails. What i can’t wrap my head around is the emotional displacement towards, not only the challenge, but to the Author as well.

        The only “relationship” was that two people sent e-mails and for myself, I have a hard time calling this a “friendship”. Unless my definition of friendship is is totally wrong… I just see friendly correspondence between two folks. Not unlike a couple of guys shooting the breeze at their favorite coffee shop. Did you ever have fenn over for dinner? go on hikes? fishing? see a movie? do anything together on a friendship level other than e-mailing an author of a book?

        Over many many months I have seen a change in attitudes of a lot of folks whom taken on this challenge to solve a poem and let their emotions completely get the better of them, even feeling resented.
        Would you feel the same way about the guy at the coffee shop you BS with from time to time, in the same scenario?

        This internet time and area, sometime confuses the hell out of me.

        • Seeker, I never called it a friendship. The point I was simply trying to make is that he and I corresponded enough that I felt he knew I would not try to bribe him. That is all. It was an indirect request buried in a large email and did not come as a one line demand from someone he never was in touch with.

          • CTron, read carefully…

            My quote; …The only “relationship” was that two people sent e-mails and for myself, I have a hard time calling this a “friendship”. Unless my definition of friendship is is totally wrong… I just see friendly correspondence between two folks. Not unlike a couple of guys shooting the breeze at their favorite coffee shop. Did you ever have fenn over for dinner? go on hikes? fishing? see a movie? do anything together on a friendship level other than e-mailing an author of a book?…

            my example, you hardly had a any “relationship” as you put it. which you made imply a friendship of sorts. I just simply responded to what I see, through your explanation. Not a friendship and Not even a “relationship”… Just two folks talking about a subject – not unlike two guys talking BS over coffee. So why are you upset about it ?

            You stated you spent …”over 2 years, have made 12 trips from the east coast to the Rockies, have spent well over $15k, and like many, have”…
            { and this the killer part for me personally}…
            “sacrificed a lot for this hunt, fully aware it was my decision”.

            what impact does this have on the e-mail exchange- other than it seem like a complaint. What Sacrifices were there that YOU didn’t create yourself and whom is to blame for YOUR decision making?

            If the shoe was on the other foot…I’d bet it would hurt.

      • Ctron it was a mistake you owned up to it we are all like family I say we get back to solving this poem the quest is still upon us lets live from this moment on

      • I don’t think Forrest can have many friends, it’s the nature of this game. Why continue to email F he isn’t a relative of yours? Someone mentioned hacking, there’s a possibility he thought repeated emails were suspicious.

  94. Wah Wah Wah .. halt ! The issue here seems to be that Forrest was put in a position that was not of his liking. He ended that situation. Period. IMO this should not have been aired out at all. Just call it a lesson learned…Peace and harmony

  95. I was looking at Google maps this morning and a thought occurred to me. Why haven’t we considered possibly opening a group under Panaramio. Then use it to submit pictures (photos) of the places that we have searched. Google Earth would review them for approval and if appropriate, post them in their maps with geo locations. This of course would be for those who finish a search in a area. Others could later, do the same.

    This would be so neat, because not only those of us who are here in the states could follow along with Fenn’s treasure hunt, but also those who live in distant places.

    Just a thought.

    • I think that’s a great idea.. I often wondered why that wasn’t being done already…. Process of elimination… Then I remembered that some folks would rather let others beat a dead horse.. So then I never mentioned it!

      • Sweettea,

        Never let others try to influence your thinking. Always follow what your gut tells you. That’s what makes us all unique.

    • Were in manitou springs/pikes peak area right now/this week and many areas have “no service” and won’t Geo-locate….noticed the railcar en route named ‘the phantom’ coincidence? Or conspiracy? Haha. Can’t wait for the sun to come up again tomorrow, it’s cold!!

  96. OK change the subject already… I say give him a million and he will sing for you or shut up but that does not mean he should whine if he don’t get the contract… What’s the bottom line? Fenn put a plug in for DR pepper 10 and did he get pay? What was that commercial about check it out if you don’t believe me. Now he is hoping to get his full name on a coke can? This guy is publicity crazy(calling smashed coke cans art) but I’m not. So can we all be friends? Soulmate has more to do with common genetic dispositions….Hay I would love to see FENN on my next 12oz can I wait and see? The ball is in his court its his game he can make new rules or restrictions….Live and let die… or was that live and let live…

  97. I wonder which hidey spot Dal is tartopping for this time. How remote of a place is it? Away for 2 weeks. I’ll bet it’s Montana.

  98. Goofy
    I’m checking to see if my post button is working correctly . I do appreciate u helping me today and for your fast response 🙂
    And I have a post button now thank u 🙂

  99. I like the way Forrest is when he responds to some of his Emails. He sure keeps it real. He seems to be a no nonsense kind of guy with a smidgen of rebellion and humor put together. A person never knows what to expect. LOL So expect anything. Forrest you Are def. your own person Cheers

  100. i think maybe the young boy and girl you hear reading the poem is connected to the hint about show the poem to a kid

    if any readers over the age of twelve don’t see a little of themselves in this mirror, then maybe they deserve another turn.

    captain kidd and dream tie into this as well imo

    • Chris, I agree with you. IMO dreams have something to do with interpreting the poem and everything to do with discovering Mr. Fenns treasure… That’s what kid’s dreams are made of.
      ..•*•..zzZ. I’m trying to remain a kid at heart in my solves.

    • Chris –

      I still am not convinced that it is not being done by someone else.

      If whoever is doing this – would show me one great clue – OK

      The entire thing has not shown me one thing I didn’t already know.

      • Here’s something you might not know. Dal Neitzel is an anagram of “Tell Zeidan” one of the most famous dig spots in the current world….also I’m in manitou searching right now, and half the maps about this place are wrong. Neither may be of help to you, but at least they’re new to you! 🙂

        • Jamie –

          I did not know that – are you by any chance a mind reader?

          Now that is digging really deep in another area !!

          Prehistoric finds in Syria – tell you what – I won’t be goin there. I find it fascinating that U of Chicago is doing it.

          Happy Hunting and some maps are wrong – even in this day and age – when by now, you would think we would have gotten it right.

          • Inthechase- haha no mind reading, my grandfather was president of the u of Chicago…great grandad was pres of university of Chicago and Were related to lewis and Clark. We Still have some of their journals so I see this all differently. No bulls**t I swear.

          • OH MY Jamie –

            I am impressed ! What a wonderful family history.

            IMO – Chicago will play at part in this chase.

            I love the history of Lewis and Clark. The journals that you are so privileged to have – are they telling you anything that would apply to this race?

        • You can research “Tell Zeidan” that Jamie, above mentioned. It is one of the largest archeological digs in the world. Very prehistoric. I do not believe that particular dig has much to do with the chase – but other digs do. 🙂 – IMO – The stamps they are finding there – researchers think are pretty interesting.

  101. Apparently someone isn’t so sure anymore. There is less certainty in “there”. Wherever there is you know wwwh hob………[]

  102. I guess it’s a good time to buy and read “Too Far To Walk”. I held off purposely so that I could winnow out info that was not necessary. That did not work so I might as well pile on some more !!

  103. thought I’d throw this out there for a possible clue discussion, has anyone noticed that in chapter 45 of TFTW Forrest describes a bullet hitting Alexander Hamilton, on the hundred dollar bill, in the forehead. As far as I know, Alexander Hamilton wasn’t on the hundred dollar bill. Also, FYI, one of the guys in Lewis and Clark’s party had the name ‘Alexander Hamilton Willard’

    • also…

      There is a creek in SW Montana that was named after Alexander Hamilton Willard – it has been since changed to ‘Grasshopper Creek’

    • Evil Dick-
      I can’t imagine how Alexander Hamilton might help (No TFTW yet) BUT after reading your post and then seeing the “…small denominations…” in the Little Beaver story I did some research. Have you seen the back of the 1901 Ten Dollar bill (aka Sawbuck).
      Lewis and Clark, a Bison (feet not in mud) and an X.

      More trivia–Hamilton portrait faces left?

  104. Bannock is a really fun place to visit too. Near Grasshopper creek, Im sure there is going to be a rush in traffic there soon. LOL

    • @ Lou Lee – I’ve been to Bannack, an authentic ghost town where tumble weeds and the wind keep one company while conjuring up scenes of stage coach robberies and vigilante justice. The town unveils a snap shot of adventure and daily life much like Mr. Fenn does as he brings to life the artists, cowboys, and Indians he’s known and collected. I appreciate the human side of his treasured journeys back in time to our American West. Thanks Mr. Fenn, looking forward to your next story.

  105. Inchaseto…I have no idea- I follow stuff on larks I imagine that could be good or a hinderence as well. Odd links though. I wrote wrong about great granddad he was president of Rockefeller, grand was Chicago. Between all that and lewis and Clark I’m overwhelmed with conspiracies and endless paths/special places in manitou. Just flew out here from ohio for first search!! So excited!!

  106. jdiggins Happy Equinox Eve to you! We nuts need to gether all of our squirrels and get ready for winter! 🙂

  107. All that I could remember was that I was not supposed to forget something

    oooooooooooooooooooooooohhhhh …..

    (a lightbulb has just lit up above my head)

  108. Did forrest say that people are starting to focus on a word and that was the key to unwravelling the poem?

    • A lot of talk about a keyword when in fact it may have been just to refrence a chapter which mentions tight focus.

      • Tex and Ed –

        Here is exactly what FF said –

        ” It is interesting to know that a great number of people are out there searching. Many are giving serious thought to the clues in my poem, but only a few are in tight focus with a word that is key. The treasure may be discovered sooner than I anticipated.”

        As I stated above – the key word you will find with a typewriter. Typewriters have keys. IMO 🙂

      • Ed, do you recall which chapter mentions in tight focus? I’ve ruled out many key words, and working towards my short list. IMO it’s not the likely contenders as in meek, paddle, or blaze, but then in past searches my brain was addled and my vision a brown haze.

  109. Fun fact ‘o’ the day…there is a grapette fan/collectors club here. (And around the country) a cool “artifact” they LOVE is antique metal sidewalk markers. Could be a fun blaze somewhere…if not a meeting may be hilarious to attend anyhow!! Just sharing the laugh 🙂

  110. It seems logical to me that a deep thinking treasure searcher could use logic to determine an important clue to the location of the treasure. Is someone doing that now and I don’t know it? It’s not what they say on the blogs that may be significant, it’s what they whisper. f

    Ok here I go again. Chapters for whisper, logic and tight focus.

    Seventeen Dollars a Square Inch
    Dancing With The Millenium

    • Ed –

      That sounds right to me. Logic is IMO the way he did it. It is not as hard as most are making it. Wouldn’t it be logical to write a straight forward poem – no tricks – so later if found, people are not mad at you. Difficult but not impossible.

      • Oktoberfest started 2 days ago. I am going to try and make my own pretzels this year. Unfortunately, I do not think the home owners association will let me set up a beer tent.

  111. “…end of my rainbow.” Early gravel road built turn of the century heading north out of Santa Fe called ‘Rainbow Route’.

    • Inthechaseto – got a kick out of the legends of America link. Code of the West, timeline, and old west slang vocabulary. Now, I’m contemplating if any of the 100 year old meanings apply to the poem. ff frequently says he was born 100 yrs. too late. thanks for the link itc.

      • 42 –

        I got a kick out of it too – so many I did not know. Dang, I sold my horse – well, I guess I’ll have to go rent one or two.

        • Rent one and ride with a friend – always more enjoyable. Used to ride a Paint or a Sorrel with a friend picking cherries off the orchard trees at the lake when I was young, but haven’t been on a horse in many years.

          thought their use of Paddle was of interest. and loved the use of Peacemaker. Ha! I think there is a revolver now a days called the Judge.

          Paddle – To go or run away.
          Paint – A horse with irregular patches of white. Kin to Indian ponies, they were strong and tough but never grew very big. Painting the Town Red – Going out on the town for a fun, sometimes wild, time.
          Pair of Overalls – Two drinks of whiskey.
          Pal on – to associate.
          Pancake – A derogatory term for a small English saddle.
          Pan Out – To pay well, prove profitable.
          Parade Chaps – A pair of chaps strictly for show. Might be worn for the grand entry parade at a rodeo.
          Pass in one’s chips – To die.
          Peacemaker – A Colt revolver

  112. Don’t doubt, it was a compliment.
    Are you sending me on another search? I am an unworthy, a mere Pinocchio playing among the real live boys.
    Jimminy says ‘Hi’, and that I need to start another pot of coffee for this legendary journey.

    • Old shadows
      Good luck on your journey, fill your thermos with coffee. I’m on my journey right now and feel the end is nigh. F has sure made a great journey for all of us. Enjoy 🙂 from the tops of the mountains to the bottom of the seas ………cherish the little things…..they are there for all

      • Good luck to you Mr. Hope, Here’s to the memories. Wish I could be there at the finish line but I can only take the Sentimental Journeys with Hoagy.

    • I think f had a speech impediment growing up and couldn’t say “w” among other things. That was what he called “Edward”. If you listen to his interviews IMO his “w”s seem forced and learned. I’ve tried to read the poem in a “child’s” pronunciation but only make few forced connections….

      • Joe, whose life experiences extended past both extremes, lived alone in one room that had an unshaded light bulb hanging from the ceiling. His space was so small that he sat on his bed while he worked.

    • I see said the blind man. Still am not seeing any clue whatsoever.
      It is possible they are just trying to get our ISP numbers – ?

  113. Did f. ever say what the big D Dragons bracelet was worth… we would play harder if we knew it was worth MORE…. when the lotto goes sky high you know what happens. Why is everyone but f. putting a figure out? 🙂 then again how would that help find it…

  114. Has anyone read “hush a bye baby” by George Manville Fenn? I’d love to discuss on a google doc.

  115. ITCT… re: your 11:07 am post to me …. ???
    “Perhaps you need some new sayings to inspire you – and new meanings to words that you only thought you knew the meaning of – like the word “wood”.
    … maybe you are referring to a past post of mine about the Delphic oracle about wood… That a ring of wood would protect Athens? That prophesy was interpreted as a navy of wooden ships. Is your ‘wood’ perhaps referring to a ring of Conestoga’s, those Ships Of The Plains?
    I was told at the time of that post that ‘wood’ was old western term for “saddle’, so the legend link wasn’t for the wood reference…. was it?

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