The Nine Clues…….Part Fortyone


This is the place to discuss the nine clues…For instance:
What are the nine clues…
Is the first clue “Begin it where warm waters halt” ?

This post is now closed to new comments but you can still read all the old comments from this NINE CLUES page and all the others…

736 thoughts on “The Nine Clues…….Part Fortyone

        • Good question! I don’t really follow this stuff until it gets big…like a lottery. Then I pay attention (but only half-mindedly). I think the ‘Clones might’ve beaten the “Fuskers” ‘-) back in ’03. 58-53. In Lincoln.

  1. Well now my comment won’t make much sense….

    In response to Eds comment about pi day…. A feast of words and pie…

    Thanks for the new thread Dal…

  2. I still don’t have an exact location for my August trip, but a general location and am hoping that I will discover things that are not found in books or on maps at the location that will lead me correctly. If not, I hope to find my own treasures that were put there by someone else or God. Hi Dal!

      • Or,

        Finally, the little stream we were following narrowed and narrowed into a vertical canyon until nothing could get through it but water. I think Donnie became delirious because he kept saying, β€œIf we don’t change course soon we’ll end up where we’re going.” He wasn’t smiling. Then one of his stirrup straps broke and he had to ride on one leg. The crisis had arrived so we turned back for half a day until we found another stream to follow. Bad luck can always be trusted. f

      • I did wind up someplace else Goofy…
        on the ‘latex’ page.

        Thankfully, the comments rebounded here to the ‘latest’ page.

  3. Hey Ed- here’s a solve for ya:

    “Your EFFORT will be worth the COLD”

    Maybe this means that the circumference of ones ice cream bowl is directly proportionate to the distance you must reach across it..

    Pie a la mode?

  4. Well, here we are now, …’s the year 3,009 and our descendants are STILL searching for it…….. We don’t need the blog anymore, because we can just read each other’s thoughts. If Fenn was still alive, we’d just read his and go find it. But two can keep a secret, especially if they are both dead. πŸ™‚

    • Read each others mind… Oh crap. I’m in trouble,

      I thought that was what Death Bed Confessions were for.

      • Don’t’ worry Seeker, that’s in the year 3009, we will gone long before that, unless you want to be frozen until they find a cure for whats ailing you. LOL

  5. I have an inkling where it is just from reading a book and understanding that forest is a smart alec just like I am a smart alec have been all my life. I’m going to walk right up to it and grab it and return the bracelet to Forrest then head back to LA

  6. I would like to take a moment to examine one of Forrest’s clues. ” People have been within 500 feet of the chest ” ( Not exact words )

    How many of us have taken the time to think about how long is 500 ft?
    Consider a football field. !00 yds. 300 ft so roughly a football field and a half.
    Not a great distance to walk. What can we draw from this observation?

    For instance I notice some people posting because they really do not have a clue so to speak, unless active thought is given to the Chase I do not think anyone will get their solve just form posting ” I was here” posts. 23K put a whole new spin on my train of thought when she shared her bronze story with us.

    • Forrest comment people have been within 500 ft. If it was worded people have been as close as 500 ft that would be different. Within 500 ft could also be anywhere from 0.up to 500 ft to be within that perimeter of distance. For example if they were 40 ft away it would be within 500. I think everyone should keep an open mind to what within may or may not be construed as.

    • Chad-
      In 2011 Forrest also used the distance 100 yards and I heard him use 200 feet once. A person who I trust once told me that Forrest said a searcher had passed by it within 100 feet. I don’t throw this out to cause any confusion or heart-ache but rather for clarity..

      In the many times that Forrest has made this point he has sometimes said “searcher” or “searchers” and sometimes said “people”. He has used several different distances…”500ft”, “a hundred yards”, “200ft” and possibly even “100ft”.

      If Forrest looked me right in the eye and said “Dal, you’ve passed within a hundred yards of the chest.” It would help me only in a minuscule fashion…practically no help at all physically…but psychologically it would be a hugely positive push. It would not put me in a position to find the chest any sooner than I could without that information but I would, none-the-less, be pretty excited…but excited would not help me locate the chest.

      Why would this not help me locate the chest? Because of the vast number of places I’ve been and the thousands of miles of roads I’ve traveled. He didn’t say I was walking or standing or searching…he said I’ve “passed”. That could mean walked or drove or flew or canoed or???.

      So all the places I’ve been…while looking for the chest or just having fun would count. Any location I’ve visited in the search area that Forrest knows about would be a potential area for the chest. That is over 5,000 miles of road, a hundred miles of trails, 200 parking areas and campgrounds….you get the picture.

      Now…if Forrest told me that I had passed within a hundred yards of the chest after my first search in the Box of the Rio Grande, that would be something. Then I would be able to limit my search to the Rio Grande Box, a few campgrounds in the area and a mere thousand miles of roads in the search area as I traveled from Lummi Island to the Box and from there down to Santa Fe.

      But, since Forrest doesn’t appear to give this proximity information out on a personal basis what good is it? Well, that depends on how you interpolate it.

      For instance..since I first heard Forrest hand out one of these proximity hints I have believed that the chest is hidden very close to a place where hundreds or thousands of people pass by most days, such as a major road or a popular entryway or even a parking area. This idea ties in well with other things that Forrest has said about the chest’s location and about his hiding it.

      Am I wrong…probably…but having a plan is useful πŸ™‚

      • …i plan on keeping my mouth shut until I get back from a little search next month. How’s that for a plan

      • “In 2011 Forrest also used the distance 100 yards and I heard him use 200 feet once. A person who I trust once told me that Forrest said a searcher had passed by it within 100 feet…………..”

        ***Forrest Fire: Dal has stated above that at least one person has heard you say, “a searcher had passed by it within 100 feet…………..”. I am assuming this to mean the searcher passed by within 100 feet…of the chest???

        The information itself doesn’t trouble me too much, as I agree with Dal on the possible usefulness of it.

        But the fact that there was, at the least, one person who had that information which everyone was not privy to, does concern me.

        I know…. your game, your rules; if I don’t know the rules, I should play Canasta.

        But, would you care to “level the playing field” again by verifying that you did state ” a searcher had passed by within 100 feet of the chest???

        And, it would be nice to know if there are other “tidbits” of information, that some may know, which have not been disclosed to all who are searching????

        Thank you, sir, for the Chase and your time.


  7. Oh btw Dal, do you think Forrest is involved with the discovery of new kavas found in N.M. ? After all he is considered an expert in the field by some.
    I recently read a story about the discovery.

  8. what is the reasoning to “no paddle up your creek” means a small stream when the next line down talks of water high? Is “water high” either a geyser or water fall that also acts as a blaze?

    And I wonder which clue Forest was referring to when he said how surprised he was that no one seemed to be really focused in on and which was critical for a successful solve…

    • I always thought that “no paddle up your creek” meant a REALLY BIG stream, river or creek… Hence you can’t paddle up it…. Maybe you need to go during the the Spring “Run Off”…

      Does anyone know when the Spring “Run Off” is in the Rockies or does it vary with the area? Just curious like what month it might be…

      • Hi Spallies, Spring run off depends on temperatures and how many successive warm days. Last year I searched near Yellowstone on a warm (65) Memorial Day but the peak run off hadn’t yet started; creeks were low and easily forded. Just 3 days later the rivers were running high and swift.

    • Ryan, my interpretation was similar to yours…”no paddle up your creek” refers to very small creek, trickle of water, or creek bed that may be seasonal sometimes wet, sometimes dry. There is a perfect spot north of Battleship Rock which fit the poem so well. I’m only releasing this spot because it has been searched dozens of times over the past 4 years. I liked it because the Little Bonita Creek is not on most maps, has no sign, and barely a trail (“not a human trail in very close proximity”) leads there, which you have to find on your own. It is a pleasant 5 minute walk along this creek to a splendid waterfall (“heavy loads and water high”)…most local folks don’t even know of its existence. And I think whatever the heavy loads and water high turns out to be, whether it’s a waterfall, geyser, etc, it’s also The Blaze. cynthia

    • My guess is probably in an aquifer.

      No paddle up your creek, gotta submerge.
      End is ever drawing night, nighttime
      Water high and heavy loads, deep water/ big rocks
      Been wise and found the blaze (sunlight/sun)
      Look quickly down, underwater.

      • Perhaps Random…but don’t forget that Forrest intended to die at this spot. Leaving your bones with the chest and smelling the sage are a lot harder to do underwater…in my opinion…

    • Yes Slurbs waiting patiently …….
      I wonder at times If I should go sooner, or just wait till June what do u think?

        • When I know my path is clear, Amy. I know June will be great, but if my path were good today I would not give it another thought. My search would be on! So, as soon as I’m comfortable with my path.

      • The problem I had recently was far more snow cover than anticipated. It seemed like an awful waste to go all that way and then not be able to get to the spot. Certainly more frustrating than if I’d waited for the right conditions.

    • In Jackson, WY today, snow melting, 50 degrees. 2 feet of snow at the entrance to Teton Park. Sloppy going, still…..

  9. opps not5 the first! Ariel a blaze is a marker of some type. Check out the link to Blaze under Searchers Discussions to see what some of the searchers think it is. What is the marker in the poem is a million dollar question, when you find it you will be very close to picking up the chest.

  10. Aerial

    My Blaze burns all the time
    Forrest says they will go STRAIGHT to it. πŸ™‚

  11. Caesar:
    Who is it in the press that calls on me?
    I hear a tongue shriller than all the music
    Cry “Caesar!” Speak, Caesar is turn’d to hear.

    Beware the ides of March.

    What man is that?

    A soothsayer bids you beware the ides of March.

    Wrong place to post….just wanted to tell everyone have a great March 15.

  12. Are we supposed to go to all where warm waters halt, or do we find it in the poem? How do we go about ffinding what that is? Would it be more difficult to find what that place is, or is it harder to get to it? Is that place not usually visited because nobody has been closer than 200 feet as far as we know? Personally I think the treasure is somewhere at Manby Hot Springs. Those springs are not ‘hot’. They are warm to me(@98 degrees f) I have checked the area so many times but cannot seem to fit the poem in tthere.So many other hints have pointed that area out to me.RC

    • RC,

      I guess I just don’t understand you?? You say where you think it is probably every week. Now, either you don’t want to find it yourself or you got some issues? Because, I don’t know why anyone would ever say the precise area of where they ‘think’ it could be or where they ARE currently searching, …..but thanks RC!! Personally, I’ve never been there, but it looks good on paper. Sounds good to me!! Although at least 5000 people have already searched there, …..but, I’ll go see if I can find it there with my new bronze sniffing blood hound. I’ve trained him well over these last couple of years to find only bronze objects and he does his job pretty good, but only if it’s buried less than 3ft. πŸ™‚ Again, thank you RC!! If it is ever found, I’ll be sure and give you half price off my book on how it was discovered.

      • RC, RC, …..this is the headless Arthur Rochford Manby!! You’ve been looking around my springs for tooooooooo long. Why can’t you just leave me alone and let me have some peeeeeeeeeace…………. The treasure is not here, …..I spoke with the phantom and he said to search somewhere elllllllllllllse. Let it go…… Let it go…… Search somewhere else for a change………. Don’t waste your life anymoooooore………..!!

        • Where Warm Waters Halt is and always will be “TEARS” So, where would ff cry, with his father who is obviously the other person who knows this special place, two can keep a secret if… and William Fenn is deceased. Until everyone see that wwwhalt is a dual meaning of www. and Tears, we will not have solved the first two clues…Just thinkin out loud, if you agree write me and I will tell you why this works, not just because it is in the poem but cause it the ony place that makes sense. Book or otherwise..

          Tom Terrific

          • Does any one think for a moment that WWWhalt is Hot Water? If you think about how many Hot Springs and pools there are in the Rockies, it will boggle your mind, also how many warm rivers to the east and west of the Rockies are considered “Warm Waters” by the various State’s Game and Fish Dept’s ?

            Obviously a name like “Cold Water” does answer where Warm Waters Halt so what makes sense to solve this, is near there and where the early searchers either stumbled upon or guessed, was simply a matter of ‘PROBABILITY’ because probability will eliminate thousands of impulse guesses base on the huge # places (statistics) of hot springs etc..just in NM there are hundreds, let alone Wyo, Co, and MT..Saying hot springs is as a location is tantamount to saying “Brown Trout” is a steam for home of Brown, the probability if guessing the correct stream is hundreds of thousands to one.

            So get real with this search and use feelings, first, logic second and utmost what is most probale.. Can anyone hear me now?

            Eliminate territory, find a likely Marvel Gaze near wwwhalt and always remember that you must be WISE to find the Blaze, because you will not find it being just lucky, being wise means finding the trail, nothing more or less, does any one think the Blaze is something else? If so why must you be wise to locate it???

            Tom Terrific

    • RC,
      Could the problem be that WWWH is not a place? Fenn as said or used the words meaning or means [ as far as I can recall ] when he has made a comment on WWWH.

      I would like to see if there is anyone that can put a statement to WWWH as a place, that Fenn made. If so that would be very helpful.

      Some statements I recall are: There are many WWWH and most are North of SF.

      If you don’t know what WWH means you might as well stay home.

      A few got the first two clues correct but they may not have known or didn’t understand the significance of where they were. {assuming WWH is one of those clues}.

      { all of the above are not exact quotes…just my recollection of them.}

    • Time for a commercial;
      If you are watching Dancing with the Stars on ABC, and you like the way Suzanne Somers dances, please vote for her at this number:


      If she wins I’m sure she will thank you on Dal’s blog. f

      • Forrest, it’s my first time to watch Dancing with the Stars, all for your talented friend! Of course I’ll call in a vote for Suzanne!

      • Forrest

        So u do watch Dancing with the Stars πŸ™‚

        Absolutely I will vote for her I just turned it on πŸ™‚

        • I will watch it but I have to wait till later I’m on the Pacific Coast.
          Please don’t give anything away!!!
          I have not watched Dancing with the Stars in a long time does my vote count if I am watching it later on the West Coast? Maybe I will just call now I know she will be great!

          • Spallies…yep..your vote will count. I just voted for Suzanne and Tony..
            Long live the Thighmaster!!!

          • Thank you Dal! And according to Patrick Duffy she made a lot of money from that πŸ™‚ I have no idea if that’s true but I don’t think the “Man from Atlantis” would lie about anything…

        • Let’s get Physical πŸ™‚

          Suzanne 68 years old still looks good.
          I loved Threes Company πŸ™‚

          Forrest u should listen to Abracadabra by Steve Milker band. πŸ™‚

          If only I could say that word and the chest would appear πŸ™‚

      • Well, I want to find out what that green drink was that Suzanne offered you Mr. Fenn. It’s working for her…high energy level.

        • I liked those Lime green boots she fad on , or was that leg Warner’s ? πŸ™‚

      • Forrest. Now you Want us to watch Dancing with the Stars? LOL Your funny! …..Ok, I will, what ever you want!
        If she wins will you give us a special clue? HEEHEE

          • Forrest, I really admire S.S. Ever since I picked up her books at a yard sale, she has great recipe’s for losing weight. I really admire her for her strength after losing everything in the fire of her home. she is a great Lady.

      • Gee Forrest, I don’t know if I can do that since that is time I am usually casting bronze but maybe I can convince My wife to do that for you.
        The Wolf

  13. Hello hello hello… whoooo, it’s been a tough couple of weeks. Sorry I’ve been tardy. Much to catch up on, or do you say Katsup??? I’m hoping it won’t take too long.

    Anyone find it? Just kid n”.
    Mark H. Checking In!

      • Thanks bajaau.The number worked and i was able to vote 12 times.Lol thats the first time i have ever cast a vote on a network talent show.Did anyone catch her performance? I missed it.

        • I caught the performance “Let’s Get Physical”
          She and her partner did a excellent job πŸ™‚
          I wonder if they get to choose their own music.
          Suzanne looks to be in great shape. She also seems like she’d be a fun person to be around. No wonder f likes her… Smart, beautiful, and easy on the eyes…

  14. Suzanne – You go Girl

    Here is a quote from her that we could all apply to the chase –

    Somers is partnered with Tony Dovolani and Redfoo is partnered with Emma Slater. “The better we can be, the better they can be,” Redfoo said of his partnership with Slater. “We have to step up to the plate,” Somers added. Both called it an amazing experience that they are grateful to be a part of.

    When asked what they want people to learn about them from taking part in this show, Somers said, “That when I’m given an assignment, I give it 100%.” In fact, this accomplished actress and health advocate is on her 26th book, which comes out in April. Redfoo said he wants people to know, “If you can dream it, you can achieve it.”

    One thing is for certain, they are both in it to win it!

    • Your funny Suzie…

      deb, May inquire about your rock gravatar? I like it for some reason. Are those heart shaped rocks? I assume you collect rocks… I remember the other one you used to use.

      • Yes, various heart shaped rocks found on walks with my husband and kids. Some more abstract, but thats what makes it interesting. πŸ™‚

        Lately I have been thinking about rock art projects. πŸ™‚

  15. For somers reason I think Forrest may watch a few episodes of Dancing With the Stars this season.

  16. (It) may be the thrill of the Chase. The fun is in going out and discovering “new” things. Someday a lucky soul a thousand years from now may stumble upon the chest. (Anything is possible)

  17. Sally, I am kinda like you, we are both rootin for Suzanne to win, and I am sure we will vote, and vote often,,Hear that Forrest Fire?

    Meanwhile back to the Chase:

    I want everyone to take part in a statistical quiz with me, I shall tally an actuarial summary, that is what is the most likely physical place for your thoughts on the actual geographical spot for the first two clues in the poem?

    Where is your spot and why do you think that.

    Do not include in your answer the other suspected 7 clues and do not be afraid of anyone finding it before you get there, this is simple Statistical Analysis in action, It is not a perfect sample by any means, but it will reveal to you some important avenues for thought.

    If you do not want to share that is fine, please do not answer with something like I know where it is but I am not talking. That is a waste of mine and your time.

    If you would like to share in private, send me your response to I will not name names just stats.

    If you ask any good detective to follow clues, they try not to be mislead by unimportant or trivial, unlikely scenarios.

    I will tabulate both those answers here and in private to show all searchers interested the power Statistical Analysis to reveal likely locations in the Rockies.

    Since no one seems to have a codex, an anagram or other template for locating the “Special Place” perhaps collectively we shall analyze the most likely spot from which to start the Chase.. The last know location of the Treasure Chest was Santa Fe, NM and it has obviously gone North in the Rockies…Where? How Far and why?

    Tom Terrific

    • Tom the chase is fun but don’t get too caught up in it. A trip a year with the fam is good. Have fun with your statistical analysis.

    • Tom,
      Statistically it won’t work to help narrow down anything. This type of analogy has been done many times. Most believe the area, either to start and/or finish is in NM. Why anyone would limit themselves to this range is just nothing more than a guess… That is where he lives or he wouldn’t leave his wife behind for a long period of time to travel to the hidey spot or he’s to old to travel far.

      Maybe a better question is; Are the first two clues physical or do they have a meaning that brings a searcher to an area.?

      Just throwing that out there.

        • Amy,

          Where is it? how far from SF and why do you think that?…..sorry just joking.

          I have been thinking that the First two clues don’t mention a physical place as much they tell the reader what they are looking for.

          This maybe why a few got the 1st two clues correct and didn’t understand the significance of where they were. or didn’t know they had the clues correct.

          But now i’m curious on the meaning of your place…if you care to tell.

          • Seeker

            Lol in June I will tell where I started. So maybe it’s not physical but it was for me due to I’m not a hiker . It is an amazing view πŸ™‚

          • Seeker your thinking is exactly what will never solve this poem.

            You actually said nothing about any real spot as in a physical place, just that you think there is no mention in the first two clues of where that is, now ask yourself how did the early searchers get there, very close and miss the other 7 clues? Perhaps a few hundred feet?

            An effective solve includes teamwork and the most likely location, which is a real geographic place. It will be in the Stats which I will be compiling based on real locations and responses from searchers.

            ff’s hints may be metaphorical but they represent ff’s (very real) special place. My personal solve will not have any more statistical weight than someone who believes in say Browns Canyon Colorado, or Yellowone etc. Stat built upon others is a collective process of narrowing the odds, a picture will evolve, not unlike dealing of 47 cards face up and predicting the last 5 exactly. I cannot call this random sampling Scientific, but what have we got to lose? Seeker, do you have a real place or are you waistin time?

            The reason we read these blogs is for fantasy, entertainment, and to perhaps one day say we found the TC. Until a better solve come along “HUMOR ME” or no comment.

            My major at Northwest MO State was Economics and minor in Statistical Analysis which is today an Actuarial and Insurance Stats minor. I spent 44 years working for one of the largest Insurance companies in America and we managed a profit 44 years in a row despite great losses and adverse rating with the competition.

            Remember, when no other method for solving something this complex works you turn to Probability or what is most likely based on what you can hang a hat on which will emerge in actual numbers, unlike metaphors that show at least public opinion and many heads are much better that just yours.

            Tom Terrific

          • Tom, your wording to a searcher who, for the very least, has been at this for a long time leaves alot to be desired so-to-say. You can run with stats all you want, they will be stats of FAILURE. Since you are so statistically inclined, you know you need a valid sample to run ANY probability/statistical map. So lets see, sample size= how many 80 year old, rich, wanting to leave a legacy, U.S. hero, modest, romantic poets do you know, or have heard of, hidden a treasure chest in the Rocky Mountains worth say 2-3 million dollars, given clues on how to find it in a poem, and written a book about it somewhat. Well, my sample size is ONE. So should I enter that value in my SPC program here or have I made the point?
            Attacking Seeker because he just gave his take on your post wins NO brownie points here. If you are so beat on your solve than I would like to try an experiment. I have yet to see you solve or attempt to solve one line in the poem. So, solve line 16 for me. That’s an innocent line that will not give away to much. I will post my solve after. “Just take the chest and go in peace”. Alot quicker than having to get a valid sample size to run a statistical analysis on guesses.

          • Charlie,

            I understand your comment to Tom. And I do personally appreciate what you had to say.
            I don’t know how long Tom as been on the hunt for fenn’s trove. But to answer is question i have many time put my thoughts on physical places / solve on this blog and other over the past 2+ years.

            Tom my comment to your survey is it won’t work… It’s been done a number of times… Toby and Wolf did similar ones and each coming up with different results. Buy Hey, if folks want to tell you their first to clues, where they are and how they came to that conclusion to you in a personal e-mail for your eyes only…more power to you.

            It’s ok with me if you want to bang heads with me. I’ve done it with SamSmith over coffee [ By the way Sam it’s your turn to buy…just saying! ] Wolf and I have smacked down each others solves, as well as others. But we still listen to each other.

            Folks can get tied up in their one and only brilliant solution, that they close their eyes to anyone else thoughts. I have seen this happen so may times in the past i have lost count. So for you I’ll throw this example out.

            Two words in the poem that by definition have nothing in common, nor do they point to any physical place. But with a little imagination can place a searcher in an exact location…just by their meanings and how they work together.

            So if they happen to be the First two clues…they are not physical places themselves, but can lead you to one. Where now you need to understand what the other 7 clues are and how to use them or follow their directions.

            Just thoughts, for those who look at the poem differently.

    • Tom, I think someone ran a survey, a while back, of what state searchers believed the chest was in. I will say my answer is in WY.

        • Charlie, and Seeker, I mean no disrespect, to anyone, just askin for same and a real sample and since a lot of people respect you two I will first answer Charlie’s line 16: go in peace:

          On my honor, I will do my best
          To do my duty to God and my country and to obey the Scout Law;
          To help other people at all times;
          To keep myself physically strong, mentally awake and morally straight.

          I will even state here that answer is written all over this poem and furthermore that all the language of the early 1800 to 1890 that is used throughout the poem, like “ever drawing nigh”, and “Tarry Scant” was the common language used up and down the Old Santa Fe Trail which borders the east side of the Rockies from Trinidad to Las Vegas. There is even an ancient home of a famous American Trail Blazer who is buried in Taos, NM and he worked out of Fort Union, up and down the trail which bears the name of ff’s trading company, his original home is a museum and has a Blacksmith Shop where they create animal traps and custom make horse shoes. This man was a villain to Navajos, Jicarilla Apache and the Comanche’s did not care much for him neither, nor did Old Mexico.

          Seeker, this is not about banging heads, it is about cooperation from as many heads as possible and see how many of the intricate facets of this poem may be revealed.

          Even if I said exactly where I feel this is and many pass there in the right season, you still have to be 200 to 500 feet off the trail and something this small is easily disguise so good luck.

          • Tom, I do think Forrest has tried to live by the principles of the scout code which aligns with his Code Of The West philosophy:
            To help other people at all times;
            To keep myself physically strong, mentally awake and morally straight.

    • I agree with Seeker; in my humble opinion a statistical analysis of a one time event is useless. A good detective also knows it may be the second, third, or forth event before a perpetrator is caught or pattern determined.

      I don’t think a statistical profile of Fenn will help either. Many of the folks here could tell you what Fenn’s favorite foods are, what color all of his clothes are, what kind of shoes he likes to wear, what books he likes to read, what time he likes to get up or go to bed, etc. etc. Under β€œnormal” circumstances we may be able to statistically predict what he would do fairly accurately. But hiding the chest is not a normal activity. He would know people would research everything about him. He would also know how well the locals of any given area know the landscape.

      Just for an example; one could make a good case for the chest being in New Mexico or Wyoming based on Fenn’s fondness and familiarity with those states. I would say the next state he talks about most is Montana. He hardly mentions Colorado. What does this tell us? Under normal circumstances we might be able to predict his preference.

      Some say it’s in Colorado because that’s the state he talks least about.

      The only statistical crowd sourcing model that might help is if you could get all of the solutions along with the date that were sent to Fenn. I don’t know how many hundreds or thousands that would be. You would need to figure out a way to prove the information you are being sent is accurate and the sample you are using is large enough to be meaningful……You could then statistically figure out what the first two clues are. Then again, it can be statistically determined what the best numbers are to pick for the lottery……..

  18. Ouch ! I just fell off the turnip wagon…I was going to post something and have forgotten what it was…

    • Ken, when you fell did you bounce? Was it a good trip? πŸ™‚
      More often I read without comment, how about you? Such a beautiful day today, I hope you are having a good one also. πŸ™‚

      • Great day Deb ! As you know, I do not say much… just could not help it… and no, no bounce, just a thud.

        • I hope the thud didn’t hurt, Ken. I had a Filipino friend explain to me the difference between falling from a high place and falling from a low place.

          Low place: Thud! “AAAAAAAAAAAAH!”

          High place: “AAAAAAAAAAAAH!” Thud!

          I am forever grateful to him for explaining that to me. πŸ™‚

    • Welcome to my world Ken.

      Aside: I have no consistent locations for any clues in the poem. Change several times each month. I mean States as well as which lines are clues.

  19. Need a little help from Dal’s Blog community. I have measured my walking distance from where the car has to be parked to the location of the treasure chest at approximately 1.87 miles using Cal Topo. There is approximately a 1,117 ft gain in altitude. My question is does that seem reasonable for Mr. Fenn at 79 years old. Keep in mind he has lived in Santa Fe for a long time and the altitude there is over 7,000ft. So he would be accustomed to the altitude. Whereas, I live in Las Vegas and our altitude is just over 2,500ft. So going anywhere over 5,000ft I am going to feel it. But is that a reasonable distance and altitude gain carrying an extra 20 to 25 pounds? Thanking you in advance for your thoughts.

    • Hi Ramona,

      On my search last summer I had about 2 miles and about 1300 ft altitude gain up to 8600 ft. It was exhausting doing it once with a light load, never mind twice with a heavy load.

      I live at sea level, I’m in my 40s, and not in bad shape (I walk 4 flat miles a day here at home).

      Based on that, I now think the altitude gain should be under 1000 ft. But that’s just me… Two miles would seem to me like a reasonable distance with 500 to 800 ft. altitude gain.

    • @Ramona, that is a pretty significate gain for that distance, but not unreasonable. I think Fenn can do that even now if he so desired, so yes. Take into account he may not have been the one carrying all the weight. He may have had a horse to help. All possible. So, imho, yes he could make it, and yes, so can you.:)

    • Ramona – since the vote is split 1-1 I’ll break the tie at least temporarily. I think that kind of a trek – in and out twice – with that elevation gain and carrying a load is beyond what he meant when he said “don’t go anywhere a 79-year old man carrying 42 lbs. couldn’t go”. I vote no.

    • Ramona,
      Here’s a link (and a pretty close approximation of what he said) to a 2013 radio interview that included Forrest’s grandson, Shiloh. Shilo’s comment is at about the 34:45 mark

      β€œβ€¦it’s cool to get out with him, and he’s sprightly for my grandad, and he can walk circles around me going uphill at 10,000 feet.”

      • Thanks for the link Joe, I hadn’t heard that. I’m going to take Shiloh’s word for it then and believe Mr. Fenn can and did. Good luck to you Joe.

        • Ramona,
          You’re welcome, and you’ve made a wise choice, IMHO. I believe it’s a mistake to underestimate Forrest – in any way!
          Best of luck in your search, and be safe.

  20. While I like numbers and I do believe they may play some part in the solve. I do not agree with statistical analysis in narrowing down a probability as Tom is suggesting, while I applaud the thinking outside of the box, I think we have to solve the clues to get a place to know where to begin. Running a statistical analysis of search location States is not practical in the solve, especially as the guess is speculative and not factual, most statistical analysis is run against an accurate baseline. As an example, that would be like me walking into a first grade class and surveying the students with the question, “Where is Disney World?” If 5 of the 10 students say “California” I’m not quite sure how that would help us get any closer to “Orlando”. Just sayin

    • J. Scafto, it is not necessary to find the place to begin, it has already been done! 2 searchers were able to solve the first 2 clues successfully (ff) so since that is a known quantity and a time line when it happened has been established, think of it this way; ok you do not have to out run the bear, just out run the guy or gal behind ya, yes? Who were they that guessed or figured it out in 2011 to 2012. Now pose your question to those first grade kids this way “How many of you have been to Disney World?”, so it is much more important how we ask and compile the answers. Then ask those 5 who were there where it is…Caprice?

      Tom Terrific

      • Boy this guy is really pushing it with the sarcasm. (want to just tear into his solve), anyway, I’ll play Tom. Montana. Montana to start, Montana to walk, Montana to end. (Lol, caprice) Crackin me up.

      • Very good, Tom.
        You find out who the two are and ask them. If you want statistics, don’t forget it’s those two against thousands.
        Please, give it up. Treasure hunting is not a democracy. I can understand why you want everyone to send you their solution. It’s not going to happen, forget it.

      • Tom, believe me, I do get what your driving towards and I admire the confidence you have in the analysis, but again all FF said is something to the effect that two people had solved the first or first and second clue. The problem is he didn’t tell them they did and they obviously don’t know they did or statistically speaking one of the two would have had a definitive starting point and solved the riddle within the last 3-4 years. This has not happened! So again, the only way to create a base line to compare data to is to have some point of reference that is irrefutably accurate. Otherwise you have only speculative information, which would bring me back to the point of the necessity to solve the clues. Mr. Fenn is an intelligent man, further he had years to develop a poem/riddle to bring someone to his “Special Place”. I don’t think he wrote the riddle based on averages and statistics, for this reason I feel that it cannot be cracked employing this method. I am not trying to be “Danny Downer” or rain on your parade, I truly hope your method works for you, I wish you only the best of fortune in your adventure.

        • I fall in the camp that holds to there being 9 clues in the poem which need no manipulation. I am open to hints within the poem (lines or stanzas that are not part of any clue) that may be brought to the surface with more indirect methods. For example line one might be read in light of something else in the TOTC book.

      • Lol! I do Capisce bud, if thats what you were trying to say! But again your response posses questions for which you still have no answer. First, you DONT know who they (1) or (2) people, that solved a clue or two are and likely they don’t either. Two, regardless of how you re-word a question, a person with no definitive answer still can not provide anything of value. If you run an analysis on apples in an orange grove I don’t think its going to bring you any closer to an answer on how to make orange juice.

  21. just came across the poem and treasure hunt today,can’t find a place to throw out my ideas so since i came across this page i might as well do it here.

    ‘ As I have gone alone in there
    And with my treasures bold,
    ‘I can keep my secret where,

    i think this means that despite his treasure of a said million or so worth he is able to walk in without hiding,either prompting the treasure to be small in size or that the path leading there to be either devoid of people or tight-lipped ones.

    ‘And hint of riches new and old. ‘

    kinda stumped at this ,could either mean its a treasure that contains not only what he found in his youth but what he recently uncovered as well.

    ‘ Begin it where warm waters halt ‘

    There are many different ways to interpret this but the one that jumped into my mind is that the warm water here might refer to the shower rooms for houses,that or maybe a place where the water is legit cold,say a stream that turns cold after a small waterfall or such.The question nagging at me is why say ‘Begin it’ ,what does it refer to,the treasure? or his journey to the hiding spot.

    ‘And take it in the canyon down, ‘

    kinda a no brainer, just saying he passed by a canyon/went down to one.

    ‘Not far, but too far to walk. ‘

    Considering his use of water in the poem is quite extensive i’ll assume he is talking about a stream or a lake,though it should be something that causes him to take a longer route around a certain obstacle,a lake,a stream with a stream current,a ravine etc. Therefore a alternate method aside from walking as to be used,a car to go around ,a boat,a kayak,a swing etc.

    ‘ Put in below the home of Brown. ‘

    Din’t do enough research to figure this one out,though i find the fact he used ‘Put in’ rather than just ‘below the home of Brown’ rather interesting as well how he used ‘home’ instead of ‘house’.

    ‘ From there it’s no place for the meek, ‘

    Probably means its dangerous from there on,though meek isn’t the word to use there so probably means it isn’t a place for the unprepared.

    ‘The end is ever drawing nigh; ‘

    when i searched for the poem the words ‘ever’ and ‘drawing’ were switch in certain websites,though i’m not sure if it made a difference.For some reason I thought of the fact that it means that death is always closeby the first time i read that part,therefore i’m going with that thinking,if that is indeed the case it means that the searcher or the placer of the treasure has to go pass a area that is dangerous,the edge of a mountain,a stream with a strong current or a steep sloped road.

    ‘ There’ll be no paddle up your creek, ‘

    with this i would assume the line above has something to do with water,a stream maybe,though it might mean that there is no easy way to handle while crossing something.

    ‘Just heavy loads and water high. ‘

    again with the water,he really loves it i think, though the term ‘heavy loads’ is interesting,just what does he expect the searcher/treasure placer to be having on them? and ‘water high’,does it mean a high tide,a particular area that is deep or that the person would have drank alot of water and has to pee? xD

    ‘ If you’ve been wise and found the blaze, ‘

    i wonder what would happen if you are in fact not wise,not made it this far perhaps . The blaze ,i doubt it would be a fire signal,so going along with the fact that it would take quite abit of travel time it might mean Sunet,that is a blaze as well after all,or maybe a unlucky forest fire.

    ‘ Look quickly down, your quest to cease, ‘

    Nothing to shout about about this sentence except the ‘looking quickly down’ why quickly? whats wrong with taking your time,in both this line and the next he advises the searcher to make haste,there should be a reason in that,one that i can’t place my finger on.

    ‘ But tarry scant with marvel gaze, ‘

    as i said,despite the supposely amazing veiw he asks the searcher to make haste.

    ‘ Just take the chest and go in peace. ‘

    Here he just tosses out the fact its a chest to people thus making the person not have to stay longer to wonder what he is searching for.Though the go in peace part doesn’t make sense as he was chasing ther person off in the last 2 lines.

    ‘So why is it that I must go
    And leave my trove for all to seek?
    The answers I already know,
    I’ve done it tired, and now I’m weak. ‘

    Kinda of don’t understand this part,except he wants to justify why he placed the treasure maybe.

    ‘ So hear me all and listen good,
    Your effort will be worth the cold.
    If you are brave and in the wood
    I give you title to the gold. ‘

    Worth the cold,either he thought someone will clear it during the winter or during the trip to the treasure the searcher will get cold along the way,so maybe,again,water.In the wood though might mean the search will go pass a forest maybe.

    and thats about it ,i’m sorry if i take some meaning too literally but i think some parts shouldn’t be taken too deeply, and as i’m typing this with 4am in the morning do forgive some typos or weird thoughts.

  22. ah,i wrote that before reading the cheat sheet,so if the cheat sheet is correct then some of the stuff i wrote there is completely shot down,too lazy to correct myself therefore i shall just leave it there for u guys to correct on ur own

  23. I was reading about the poem in 2012 for the first time, if you were corresponding with ForrestFenn@ earthlink before that I may have a treasure chest to share with you. All you need is to review your old emails and there is a hand with 7 aces and 5 card and 2 jokers.

    • sounds to me like you cannot solve for yourself. By all means, do what you do. Looks like Seeker has a little backing. Probability being he, at times, has good posts.

  24. Had a client call today to schedule a appt . First thing he asked was have u found that chest , I said no I go in June . He said I read the poem and I have no idea where it could it be , or where u would begin, I laughed and
    said that’s why it’s been 3 years for me I research all the time πŸ™‚

    Forrest the first time I read your poem I said Good luck with that and laughed. I had no idea I would have gotten so involved πŸ™‚
    Glad I did πŸ™‚

  25. Ramona,
    Here’s a link (and a pretty close approximation of what he said) to a 2013 radio interview that included Forrest’s grandson, Shiloh. Shilo’s comment is at about the 34:45 mark

    “…it’s cool to get out with him, and he’s sprightly for my grandad, and he can walk circles around me going uphill at 10,000 feet.”

  26. To be honest, I think there is a much higher probability that you’ll get to a solution (and hopefully the chest) with the poem, rather than statistical analysis. Supposing 85% of respondents say that for them WWH in NM, and of those, 30% say, specifically, Ojo Caliente; what has that told you, if the chest actually resides in Glacier National Park, Montana?

    • I agree. If 100% of the respondents have the wrong interpretation of the poem, you will never be closer to the chest even if 10,000 folks reply. This is a misplaced application of statistics in my view.

  27. Just another person wanting to take a shortcut.

    But now instead of just the poem, …’re dealing with people and emotions and numbers that WILL NOT ever be reliable. Good luck with that!! Although, it sure would be a terrific way for others to get you even further away from the chest than you already are. πŸ™‚

    Tom, you want some numbers, here you go:

    ♦This poem written by Forrest Fenn contains 9 clues that if followed precisely, will lead to the end of his rainbow and the treasure.

    ♦The treasure is in one of 4 states: Montana, Wyoming, Colorado or New Mexico
    ♦Located above 5,000 ft and below 10,200 ft.
    ♦At least 8.25 miles North of Santa Fe, New Mexico
    ♦ β€œSearchers have been within 200 feet”. Huffpost interview 02/04/15
    ♦ β€œSome folks correctly mentioned the first 2 clues to me in an email and then they went right past the other seven, not knowing that they had been so close”.

    All you’ll ever need……….

  28. he sez all you need is the poem…. << That came to mind as I just saw a TV commerical, for something..???… anyhow, one guy had his golf bag filled with drivers , his friend sez, " All you have in the bag is drivers" and the guy sez, Yes "thats all you need right?" I guess he planned on only holes in one…?

  29. Charlie, and Seeker, I mean no disrespect, to anyone, just askin for same and a real sample and since a lot of people respect you two I will first answer Charlie’s line 16: go in peace:

    On my honor, I will do my best
    To do my duty to God and my country and to obey the Scout Law;
    To help other people at all times;
    To keep myself physically strong, mentally awake and morally straight.

    I will even state here that answer is written all over this poem and furthermore that all the language of the early 1800 to 1890 that is used throughout the poem, like β€œever drawing nigh”, and β€œTarry Scant” was the common language used up and down the Old Santa Fe Trail which borders the east side of the Rockies from Trinidad to Las Vegas. There is even an ancient home of a famous American Trail Blazer who is buried in Taos, NM and he worked out of Fort Union, up and down the trail which bears the name of ff’s trading company, his original home is a museum and has a Blacksmith Shop where they create animal traps and custom make horse shoes. This man was a villain to Navajos, Jicarilla Apache and the Comanche’s did not care much for him neither, nor did Old Mexico.

    Seeker, this is not about banging heads, it is about cooperation from as many heads as possible and see how many of the intricate facets of this poem may be revealed.

    Even if I said exactly where I feel this is and many pass there in the right season, you still have to be 200 to 500 feet off the trail and something this small is easily disguise so good luck.

    Reply ↓

    • Language from earlier times was not confined to the Old Santa Fe Trail. But beypnd that, I believe that FF has suggested that the poem is about geography rather than history.

      ” it is about cooperation from as many heads as possible and see how many of the intricate facets of this poem may be revealed”

      I agree that there are many intricate facets to the poem, but I thought you wanted to perform a statistical analysis on WWWH. If you’re seeking to expand that to all nine clues, you probably have all the info you’re ever going to need right here in the archives. Every line and almost every word has been analyzed and discussed ad nauseam. It’d be a long job, but you could probably go through the many opinions expressed here and find trends (borne out by the preponderance of boots on the ground in certain locations). But in the end, it’s about individual interpretation, and so I doubt whether all that labor would produce any more solid direction than spending the time thinking about the poem as a meditative exercise.

      • Voxpoops, I never said I wanted to expand my analysis to any subject past the first two clues, if I spend all my time reiterating what I said I get no where, so carefully review what has been said and stick to the subject please.

        I continually wonder if people impulsively write without really examining my original premise. Yes it will take some thought so if you feel you are revealing your solve simply say nothing, but I am reminded that the problem of moving this search to another level of understanding is a lot like try in to heard cats.

        So think of it this way Lead, follow or get out of the way.

        Thomas Paine and George Armstrong Patton. Not meant in disrespect to you sir.

    • Tom, just saw this post. I did say I would solve that line if you solved it, but the boy scouts code. Come on now, I know I said it but I just cannot. Not from the boy scouts code. Maybe you just took it as a joke, either way, for me to spill the way I see that line, I would be giving up: my architecture of the poem, 13 alpha/numeric letter values, what 9 is, 2 reference pages in the book, and an explanation of what the “spot” looks like. I just can’t do it from the boy scouts oath.
      I don’t mean to beat you up, not at all. Seek can answer for himself, he’s a smart guy, maybe I just read into the tone of your words as sarcastic and reacted. In general, I think everyone on this site is smart, and enjoys a little challenge. We’re not playing tic-tac-toe on here, we are all chess players here, I guess I just took it as someone coming in and saying they are far above the others here and I have degrees to prove it. Basically calling me,us,all, stupid. I know you do not think that way now, so I apologize getting sarcastic with you. (But really, the boy scouts oath):).
      Anyway, to recomment on your stat/analysis idea, we can see by everyone’s comments that your asking for info that is to personnal to searchers. Specifically, WWWH. Alot of people have that being close to the spot they have searched and researched for years. That’s why I said your “wording” should be different. I think a better way to analyze something like that would be to ask what state everyone is in, compare to the report Toby came out with long ago, and see if the general census has moved and to where. People will give up the state they are looking , no problem, you can then analyze what was popular belief than and now. With that, you can maybe narrow down where others may think WWWH. All without using words like “caprice”.
      Who knows, you may be able to put something together nobody else has thought of. That’s deeper thinking, and would be respected by all IMO.

  30. Checking in. It is nice to read about all the snow and chilly weather which is not the case down South! I typically look forward to autumn but I yearn to quickly escape the heat much sooner and enjoy spring flowers rather than autumn leaves. I wonder if April showers really bring May flowers. Maybe I’ll stand in the rain for a look-see.

  31. I have been concentrating on put in below the home of Brown for 2 days, I think I now know what that means now πŸ˜‰

  32. Voxpops

    I have 3 meanings but the one I just thought of makes more sense.

    Forrest thanks for giving us all something to think about πŸ™‚
    Your just so smart , and your choice of words are out of this world πŸ™‚

  33. Anyone – When did Donnie die? He must have originated in the Yellowstone area where FF’s family vacationed every summer. Isn’t that how they became friends? I mean, he didn’t know him in TX, right? I’m trying to decide who the dead person is in the “two people can keep a secret” quote. Was Donnie still alive when FF hid the treasure? I know it wasn’t Eric Sloane because he died earlier. So again … when did Donnie die?

    • Becky, If you know Donnie’s last name, a search should turn up the date of death.

      Do we know for certain that the other person is dead? Im not so sure. Forrest’s statement “two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead.” doesn’t possitively identify ‘the secret’ as the chest’s hiding spot nor does it say that one of the two people is dead. It’s a tricky statement meant to be as elusive as a grayling trout. imo

  34. lia020 – I do. His complete name is Donald Joseph Heath. I can’t seem to get any info showing me his date of death. I’m hoping somebody else has has better results. Even though that quote may not really pertain to the search, I’m still curious about it. Donnie’s death, I mean. I wonder how old he was.

    • Becky, I couldn’t locate a date of death. June lived in Bozeman at one time. Searching there turned up a reference to a Donald J Heath with FennHeath properties. Not sure if Donnie and June had a son or this is someone else.

      • I believe this is Donnie

        Last Residence:
        78752 Austin, Travis, Texas, USA
        BORN: 27 Jun 1929
        Died: 12 Feb 1996

  35. Amy,

    Your ideal, Mr. Fenn said, there is no loyalty to creativity…so why do you think you are allowed to carry on in your over confident theory? No doubt you have made it known to him. You smile and talk of circles, Browns Hole and somewhere in the middle? If you cannot connect the beginning to the end….which it does, if you understand the poem. It does, within 8.2.5 miles. IN MY HUMBLE OPINION. No Comments. It’s complicated.

    • Leave Amy alone! She, as everyone else, is entitled to her freedom of opinion and speech!
      Unless this was not an “attack”, in which case, my apologies! πŸ™‚

    • Claudia

      πŸ™‚ All my Rowdy Friends have settled on down . πŸ™‚
      I sure hope I’m correct on the beginning and the end. The end won’t be so bad after all there is something special there. πŸ™‚

        • Near indians jones

          Lol yes I obviously have a lot to say πŸ™‚

          Sometimes I blow the blog up πŸ™‚

  36. Amy, the book sells at Old Santa Fe Trading Co for $95. If it’s similar to Forrest’s other books I’ve seen they are beautifully made and well written.

  37. Tom terrific,
    I feel the need to interject on your line of thinking. “Two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead” is a saying that has been around for a long time. It simply means if you want to keep a secret, you cannot tell ANYONE else. IMO Forrest is not being literal when he uses that phrase. He is, and always has been, the only one that knows where his special place is. After all, if his father knew, perhaps he told his wife who told her grandson…etc, etc. Someone else knowing the spot is HIGHLY unlikely….UNLESS that someone was alive in prehistoric times and Forrest was actually the second person to discover the spot, along with a prehistoric burial or something. Nobody else has been there in recent history, or what kind of hidey spot would it really be? Also, to address the statement that FF made that it would be unlikely a person would come within 12 feet of the chest and not find it…Think on this. Nobody is going to HAPPEN upon the chest, FF’s own words. This statement along with the other leads me to believe it is hidden in such a way that unless you are actually searching for the chest, you could walk right by it and miss it. so it MUST be disguised, buried, cached, camouflaged, entombed, or otherwise stashed. If it is in a cave, it must be hidden from non searchers, since lots of people explore caves and holes, but nobody is going to happen upon the chest.

    Just my two cents.
    Also, If searchers mentioned the first two clues in emails but went right past the other seven, and this was early on in the chase, it seems logical to me that the first two clues bring you within reasonable striking distance of the chest, since FF laments, “Not knowing they had been so close.” and that the first two clues are most likely descriptors of physical locations, not hidden cryptic coordinates or far off locations.

    • Michael D – I like your reasoning on all counts. One thing irritates me, though: he said that no one is going to stumble across it, yet at the same time he says that if it is unlikely that if someone were within 12′ they would not find it. I suppose that implies that it’s in a cave or similar location, but then he said that you won’t need a flashlight. And that it’s not in a dangerous place. The list of possibilities starts to get pretty small. Any thoughts on that?

      • If my line of reasoning is correct, it’s not in a dangerous place, but it’s in a rather awkward place, and one that would require you to be very accurate in pinpointing, if you’re going to have a reasonable chance of finding it.

      • Spoon, Where did you find the comment that it is unlikely that if someone were within 12β€² they would not find it? Was he talking about searchers or a passersby being within twelve ft? I thought that I have read, or heard it in an interview, that someone could walk within 10 ft and would not find it if they weren’t looking. kinda the same thing, if you were a searcher. I agree that it means that it is covered or in something.

        • Not Obsessed – that comes from SB 78. Here is the quote: “Second, I have not said that a searcher was closer than 12’ from the treasure. It is not likely that anyone would get that close and not find it.”

          From where did you get the 10 ft statement? This could get interesting.

      • @spoon,
        I believe he is implying it is in a location that is highly unlikely to be frequented by anyone but the person that correctly solves the poem…Of course, he leaves room for the possibility that another human could come within 12 feet of it and not be a searcher, by saying it is unlikely a person would come within 12 feet and not find it….unlikely instead of impossible…recent comments have confused me though….
        I know the chest is wet…ff, and yet originally we find his bones at the same location…so wet cannot = submerged, unless it is in an underwater cave, but then how do you see the mountains, and smell the pine needles? So snowmwelt wet? Rainfall wet? Mist of a waterfall wet? Dew wet?
        Also, he said he would smell Pinyon nuts…I am not convinced that was an error…I am convinced that is what he wished he had not said….because it limits the search area to New Mexico or Colorado, or a TINY bit of southern Wyoming, and decreases the elevation range to about 9000′. That is a game changer for me personally. So I am looking in Pinyon/Juniper forests in Colorado or New Mexico between 5000′ and 9000′ (roughly), in a canyon. I just cut my search area by more than half….of course, I could be dead wrong too!!

        • Hi Michael,

          I like your ideas, but you make a leap in logic by assuming wet cannot include submerged.

          In my limited understanding of archeology, submerged in stagnant water is really the only way a person can be certain his or her bones will still be there many years later.

          • Muset,
            That is interesting, and I was unaware of such a thing. I guess I just figured in a canyon=moving water…but I have widened my view of the horizon now, and I thank you for it!!

        • Hey Michael D – thanks for the feedback. I like the way your mind thinks; I don’t agree with everything – particularly the pinyon nuts – but you have a nice way of developing your logic and communicating it.

          FF and his wily ways, it’s hard to know when you can take his words at face value or need to figure out what he really means.

    • I see this is coming around again. Could I toss out my thoughts on this I mentioned a long time ago.
      Let’s say I send a email to Dal. And in that email I type the poem.
      Now logically all 9 clues are in the poem.

      This statement would be true.
      Dal received emails from a searcher. He mentioned the first 2 clues and went right on by the other seven.
      Now if someone else did it, then it would become plural.
      The statement you guys are talking about says nothing about solves or places the clues refer too. (If they refer to places at all. Lol I am not saying they do, I am not saying they don’t)

      All I am pointing out is we (the searchers) should not be assuming anything and just go by the words he uses. Look for the sentence structure and try to to read into it. That is what trips most people up. We want hints. We want him to talk directly to us individually. It is the same thing I think Woff and Dal talked about before. People get so hung up on “their” spot that they start to stretch things and make things fit. The statment he said a while ago about an email is really no ataent at all. Someone emailed him the 9 clues. For all we know they could have typed the whole poem to him.
      A while ago someone said he said someone was not within 6ft of it, and no closer then 12ft. (My personal favorite).
      Well so is the moon.
      Theood is not with 6′ of it and the moon is no closer them 12′.

      Just my thoughts again

      • Arrrg-
        I agree, it’s important to be cautious…
        Forrest is very good at allowing searchers to believe he said something he did not say…

    • Not bad info for 2 cents. Does it come with a money back guarantee if not completely satisfied?

  38. Michael D, I agree with everything you said, except one important part not that it will lead us to the TC, but if ff will answer the question of “Who” else knew the Special Place, he will say it was his Father. Who is deceased.

    If I am wrong let Forrest Fire tell me I am wrong and I will retract my statement.

    Tom Terrific

    • Tom – I have seen you make this sort of statement before. Seems to me that you implicated Dal (not by name, but by occupation) as having shared this info about Marvin Fenn. Why is this important to you if it isn’t going to move you any closer to the chest?

          • Tom-
            What are you talking about?
            There could never have been a suicide pact. Forrest’s dad took his life years ago Forrest is still here…what kind of pact would that be…???

          • Alright Tom….I regret asking the question. Let’s remain cognizant that Forrest reads this blog from time to time and that some subjects might be sensitive in nature. You stated that this info wouldn’t move you any closer to the chest so there is nothing more to discuss here anyway.

  39. I agree Michael, I don’t believe FF used any type of mathematical formula to formulate the solve. I think the early searches who solved the first few clues were close but didn’t realize it. I also think that once the WWWH has been cracked it will answer the obvious, what State you are in which lead you to the hoB. My guess is that where the WWH is not very far from the hidey spot and the hidey spot is even closer to the hoB. My question is what are FF’s nine clues? Are they the periods that end thoughts, for which there are nine or are they single fragments of various sentences? I obviously like many have my own theory on this, but don’t know 100% as I am not FF. I can make educated guesses only and my guess has been that they are the end of thoughts rather than fragments.

  40. Seeker, Goofy, Amy, and others,
    Here are three ideas IMO about the nine clues and many hints:

    Remember that “an architect” creates a two-dimensional representation of something that is three-dimensional. (In this case, IMO, the poem is a representation of the quest.)

    Remember that “the clues are in consecutive order” while the hints are “not deliberately placed”; IMO this describes a physical path, and not one that loops back on itself.

    The nine clues (and many of the hints) IMO seem to have dual meanings; finding the dual meaning seems to be IMO one of the keys (but not the key word) to solving the poem.

    “Have flashlight, will travel”

    • Geoff,

      “not deliberately placed” referrers to the book only. I just wanted to clarify that. [ and assume that is what you meant].

      I believe there are many meanings to each word, Phrase, line, sentences that should be used in conjunction with others. The one thing I did from the start was to find every usage for each word and was surprised to find how much each word works with another.

      Cold, was an interesting word as it has so many meaning.

      warm…halt…canyon down…ever…Heavy loads and water high…cease…peace…seek…will… in the wood. and others are words that would not seem to have the same meanings but they can be interpreted as such. If you look up just those word you’ll find a commonality or one meaning for all of them.

      Multiple Meanings of the words and phrases IMO help bring the poem into a singularity but only after seeing how all the words work with each other. I suggest to also pay attention to fenn example in a Q&A on ” twisting” a word to make it work.

      One I like is the words “In the wood” First sounds like just being in the wooded area. but also means in a coffin…An area between a treeline and open Field…in the saddle…the center of a horse’s hoof…etc.
      Now with a bit of a twist; the bone in the hoof is called the, coffin bone…saddle is a Mountain pass. etc. So many meanings to all the words have specific meaning to understanding their commonality to each other and how they work in the poem.

      Now we ave Cold: as in dead. In the wood: as in coffin. Horses hoof bone called: Coffin bone. End : dead. Cease: dead. Will : death. Heavy loads and water high ; a burial or ceremony of such. as well as others words, and on and on…

      IMO I don’t see a clue that stands out in a single word or line as much as understanding the meanings of them to arrive at a single clues. So for me, Just to look at “Cold” as a temperature leaves out so many meanings that fall inline with other word meanings.

      Look up the word ” I “. And tell me who is I in the 1st stanza. keeping in mind a poem is all about interpretation and may need to Twist it a bit.

      just food for thought.

        • JJ,

          I’m just actually following directions… read the poem, again and again. I’m presently reevaluating The poem in a different manor. And my starting point in the poem is in Stanza 5. When I hear the poem is ‘straightforwards’ as well as ‘If you know where to start’. it tells me to think of where fenn may actually meant the reader to start working on finding the clues by all the hints in the poem.

          The meaning of the poem can be straightforwards and not have to start at stanza one or begin it where. For those who are starting in the second stanza and say you can’t start in stanza 5 and be straightforward and in consecutive order are doing the same as myself starting in stanza 5.

          There is a proper way to read this poem and at this point that is my main goal. To know where to start. both in the poem and on the ground.

          It maybe a wrong avenue to pursue But nothing is out of the question till proven wrong. Keeping in mind the clues are in consecutive order of their answer and usage.

          My one big question is to fenn’s comment that…there are many WWH in the Rockies and most are north of SF…So I ask this,
          What is WWH that can be very specific and there are many of them?

          And how does the poem narrow that down to the correct one?

          My answers to those question are not found in stanza 2…But the answers starts there. And the same for the other sentences in the poem.

      • Seek, seeing your posts lately makes me believe you are getting closer to how I am interpretting the poem. I don’t know if I’m scared or happy someone else sees what I see. You need the letter values. so much opens up after that. But I think you already have some if not most. 2 will be to could be too. Like 4 is for or 22. The wood,cold, coofin is right on. As far as a clue (hint) on what one word could be, look at: wood, blaze, listen, cease, gaze to name a few. See any possible letter values? Cold, see old?
        I also like what Forrest has said before,”It is fun to arrange words in such a way that you have to smile at the end of a sentence”. By instuction of course, and not to mess with the poem. If he used every word precisely tells me he used those words gor the multiple meanings, the instructions they carry, and the letters they have. All must be used to solve.IMO.

        • Charlie,
          From the start I was hooked on a journey of three all cleverly written to seem as one. There was a context of birth / life and death / dealing with, as well. There are two more I have not shared with anyone.

          I have a solve that I like very much, but at the moment unable to go. So I decided to open the poem with another set of eyes or read it again, to see if the starting points of the poem lines up.

          If only a few got the first two clues correct [ and may not have known they did ] or They did know but got the rest of the poem off kilter, Then something in the poem lead them to a spot.

          I believe that it is possible that two clues take one to a spot, where now the rest of the remaining clues are used at that spot. But still, one needs to understand those clues and how to use them.

          Just seems a bit strange that most start with WWWH and only a few, out of …30,000 searchers solved it? tells me something doesn’t add up with WWH as a starting point or the very least means ‘just’ water.

          You like letters? AAIA…BANP…and so one, Have a look!.

          • lol, Seek, we need to e-mail. Actually, the start with me was the 6th stanza, but I can see 5. I think everyone is hooked on starting at WWWH. As far as solving the poem, no. Now, with the poem solved, IMO, with my coordinates, I can reverse engineer my path and yes, it starts at WWWH. So, I guess I start at WWWH. But, it wasn’t my first clue.
            As for the letters. I’ll check them out. Really quick, AAIA could be a reference to “x”, and BANP, something to do with three( which may possibly be key). That’s just a quick look though.
            Shoot me an e-mail, I’ll give you some letter values, explanation of how, and template you might find interesting.

  41. Dal – It’s me … Becky. I’m the one who thinks Donnie is dead because on page 63 of TTOTC in Looking for Lewis & Clark, 9th line down, FF wrote about it. Talking about Donnie … “He’s gone now, but I still think about him a lot.” I want to know when he died. Can you help?

    • Becky…
      And Donnie may be dead…but “gone” doesn’t necessarily mean that he is dead..
      He could simply be gone from Forrest’s life..
      It’s back to interpretation again..

  42. Amy, as a matter of fact, I feel the same as you. πŸ™‚ I am ready. Good luck Amy, and all! Happy spring! (Tomorrow) πŸ™‚

  43. Jd

    Just down to 2 months (OMG) before I search again . I’m so ready, if I do not find the chest, at least I have a beautiful solve to share. I hope that it will touch some of the searchers hearts.
    Thank u for the wish of luck and good luck to u.
    Spring what a beautiful word. πŸ™‚

    • Best of luck Amy. Looking forward to reading your solve and seeing photos, maybe as you return Forrest’s bracelet. Wouldn’t that be awesome! The two of you could write a book/movie about searching for his treasure, perhaps plan another totc. Be safe πŸ™‚

      • Thanks Anna,
        A book, a movie that’s thinking big.
        It would be a success. The meaning is what is beautiful of my solve. I’ve been pretty deep for 3 years but it just got deeper πŸ™‚
        Wishing for success for all of u πŸ™‚

        • Amy, you always have great song recommendations, and would that we all find beauty in life and in our solves. Are you able to share with us, without giving away your spot?

          • Lia

            It’s hard to eleborate on my solve cause if I did it may give it away because it’s just that simple πŸ™‚ Remember Forrest saying they would ask themselves what took so long. πŸ™‚

        • Amy, I fully agree with the keep it simple. Good luck with your search in CO, if that’s where you are going.
          If you don’t find it, I look in my spot. If I find it I think I will take the contents and fill the chest with some of my treasures, although it won’t be worth much. That way the search can go on and I will share a few of the hints that lead me to my spot.
          Safe hunting and may the weather be on your side.

  44. Here’s a song for the South
    David Allen Coe “You never called me by my name” . πŸ™‚ Darling πŸ˜‰

    • Spallies

      No I do not recall where but I remember I saw it somewhere or maybe another searcher had mentioned that statement πŸ™‚

      • I remember hearing Forrest say that as well, it wasn’t from another searcher.

  45. Hi Spallies. No we have not yet. It has been “in build” for 20 years! First my husbands friend began the project, and truly created this awesome piece of machinery! Then, about five years ago, we bought it from him, and my husband has been completing the build. He just painted it, and has been lightly “street” testing it, but it is a big fat dangerous beast!!! No streets long enough to hit 88! LOL! (nitrous pop–back to the future…:) ) I call it the bomb!

  46. Attention all…

    We (a few other bloggers and I) thought it would be nice to get a statue of Forrest done by his friend Glenna Goodacre. It would cost 100,000 to 125,000 for a bronze life sized replica. I have been in touch with a manager at Glenna’s business. I am kinda busy right now so I was wondering if anyone could help me set up a kickstarter or other kid of fund to try to get donations for this statue.

    is anyone interested? email me…

    • Hey Philly Did you ever figure out the bank account thing? I will go take a look tonight at Kick starter to see how that works. But I think you are right that people might not want to send money to another searcher πŸ™‚

    • Clues

      Seems like it would be a special gift. Let me know the details
      Thanks πŸ™‚

          • Yeah I asked Dal if he could be the one (or Goofy) to handle the money since the are more trust worthy and reliable…but us regular folks could set it up, advertise it ect….

          • Actually looks like all payments go through Amazon. They say the hardest part is making a video. Know anyone with a good video camera πŸ™‚ Dal you in?

          • Dal would make a kick-butt video! could you imagine how epic it would be seeing a Dal made video, of Forrest Fenn( who lived an epic life) to raise money for a bronze statue made by his famous sculptor friend Glenna Goodacre? Im getting the chills just thinking about it!

          • Might want to wait until someone figures out where indulgence is hidden before you make plans to put the statue there. The statue might not be able to go there.

    • The States of NM, CO, MT, and WY have benefited greatly monetarily from tourist/searchers from Forrest Finns hidden treasure, Likely more than any other single individual act. And will continue to do so until the treasure is found. It would behoove these states to confer official reconnection for stimulating tourist trade in these states. Maybe a email to your States Rep. would do it.

      New Mexico now has a lot of my hard earned money.

    • What? Part 23? Where have we been, we’re still trying to get through the scrapbooks. Didn’t think we could get anymore confused.

  47. I have a feeling the statue, might not be able or even be good tucked away in the forrest somewhere. For this kind of money, it should be at a near by park or in Santa Fe. Up a creek might not be a place that many could get too. If its in Yellowstone or a National Park or Wilderness. It might be a problem. On a better note, I think its a fab. Idea! In the right place for many to Enjoy! Should he be holding a fish or a replica of the Chest?
    Watcha tinkin……?

    • I think Beowulf should be at his feet and him holding Tesuque in the sculpture garden at the now Nedra Matteucci Gardens the old Fenn Gallery. Or we could ask him πŸ™‚

    • Wow, MB, isn’t anonymity great!
      You can say whatever you want and not have to answer for it.

      Did you mean Mr. Fenn?
      When will this take place?
      What makes you think “WE ALL” want this?
      Should this occur, how would that be a “NICE STATUE”?
      When tarring and feathering took place in colonial days people were not turned into statues!

      MB, if you have a grievance, be adult enough to state it, otherwise, you are a candidate for tarring and feathering!

      • Yes, Specialklr, anonymity is great, but he knows who I am, no worries, have a great night fella!

  48. Santa Fe would be the place since he is so well known there. Thats alot of money to raise!

    • Excellent Dal. Thanks for the link to the grizzly discussion.

      Lou lee may be able to out run them, but I’m slow and smell like honey.

    • Will he discuss the 2 legged type that need fead everyday. After the raid even when there is no room for guilt you never get your property back!! Be bear aware!!

  49. I am going to write my bears stories for you someday.
    Lou Lee, Chased by Bears and lived to tell.

    • In the wood:

      I would wager that the last chapter with Forrests dad looking up at the dove and crescent moon has something to do with wood. I think there are 23 stumps…indicating the chest is buried 23 inches down.

      • Ah, Yes Ed, The mystery picture! When I look at this picture I see that the lumber jack, cut down all the tree’s. So the bird had to go to the moon to nest. This I think is one of the messages of this picture, which is in the book twice. Its very very very interesting!

        Lou Lee, Chased by Brown Bears in Jellystone park and beyond.

      • Look close at those stumps Ed….They are not stumps but drawings of buttes or mesa’s or outcrops or saddles or whatever you wanna’ call them. Notice the cliff like edges on some. Ive tried overlaying there positions to a map . The Black boots I believe is a clue. And the story of the N.Y. Times using so much wasted paper on stupid articles. Ya, that ones puzzled me for years.
        Eagle and the Dove. U.S./ Britain=Eagle Russia= Dove. Gin – Vodka …AK DOV. Maybe Russia has a nest on the moon. I am now certifiably INSANE….Thank you Forrest! The EAGLE has landed!….But really Ed,
        “IN THE WOOD”…Check it out, a “WOODS” light is a “UV” light, …(If UV been wise(owl) and found the blaze)- (If you are brave and in the “WOOD”)….Look for the type of rock that “glows” a florescent color under the black light. IMO, “THAT” is the blaze. My theory is these “colored ” rocks, only seen with a UV light could be shaped into a double “Rainbow”, one on top of the other making a “Bulls-eye”. “Bring a FLASHLIGHT and a SANDWICH”… and a “Sand Witch” is a scoop like thing for prospecting. Good Hunting. I hope you “see the light” in your search!

        • Seattle, the only problem I see with that is Forrest said if we figured out the poem we could walk right up to it with confidence.

    • Moby Dickens video.. A metal detector would be helpful if you’re in exactly the right spot.

      • That’s an extremely confusing statement if I were in exactly the right spot wouldn’t I know it from some kind of a marker. Or maybe it’s buried Id need x-ray vision to see it in which case no one would ever find it. It seems to me there has to be some kind of a marker otherwise what’s the point I could bury a chest in my backyard and no one would ever find it.

        • I’m assuming that’s what purpose the blaze serves, but it is confusing I agree. What if the exact spot is a foot underground, if it’s buried..

          • the chest may not be underground but a metal detector might still be helpful. I assume metal detectors work above ground like in a tree or trunk or cleft etc.

          • I don’t think it’s buried. f said it’s hidden… But exactly how it’s hidden is the question.

        • Hi Ed. and all. I sell metal detectors and a Gold Bug which is a low cost one, can detect large objects to 3 feetish. I use a more powerful one called MXT Pro. and it can go a little deeper, but can tell you what your looking at.
          However I dont think you need one, unless you are going out in the snow. I dont think the treasure is buried…NO! I believe it is hidden underwood, or a ROCK. If you see the Blaze, Your there.

          Lou Lee, Chased by Brown Bears in Wyoming and Montana and lived to tell.

          • and Oh! I have been wondering about that Blaze, Could it be a tree, that was burned by a lightening strike? Do you? Could it be that! Whatcha tinkin?

          • lou lee
            the mxt pro is a great machine… I have an explorer se…and a few others, mainly for under water use. I have witnessed some spectacular finds w/ the most basic models that cost peanuts in comparison…I believe forrest has said that a metal detector would only be useful if a person was in the right spot…ambiguous at best…so who knows.

        • Ed, maybe a scenario like…
          Inside of a large hollow of a tree with a marking on the exterior; or hidden among rocks and brush that you don’t want to clear without confirming metal within. A detector would confirm the presence of metal. My luck would be finding a rusty nail. Lol! I may purchase a metal detector and woods/uv light.

        • X-ray vision….”From there it is no place for the meek” mild mannered reporter CLARK KENT.
          Many of the old mines in my search area were used to mine KYANITE, “Kryptonite”.
          The marker?= Florescent rocks seen with a UV flashlight (if UV been wise”owl” and found the blaze”….Brave and in the wood ?….A Ultra Violet light is also called a “Woods” light…..”Deep Purple” , like the 1985 album “Perfect Strangers” with songs like “Thrill of the Chase” and ‘Gypsy Kiss”. …Hmmmm. Bring a FLASHLIGHT and a SAND WITCH.

    • All depends on what your searching for. Hard to get by without a working gold bug but then again if your in the right spot eyeballing will get the job done.

      • What’s a gold bug… a metal detector?
        Talking about metal detectors reminds me of my first search. Didn’t bring one on 1st search and after getting to the spot which was covered in brush / debris, I wished we had it. It’s easier to pass a detector over the area instead of digging through weedy brush… Then after getting back home, a 20+ hr drive, I booked two airlines tickets to fly back out the next day with the metal detector to check the spot again! Crazy huh? It’s amazing how certain we can feel of our solves… That was one expensive trip… or I guess I should say two… πŸ™‚

        • Like I said above, the Gold Bug will detect, like other detectors 2 or 3 feet down for larger anomolies. Such as the chest. But I think you dont need it, unless your looking in the snow. If you see the Blaze, sounds like your there. I do believe from everything forrest has said, the chest is hidden UNDERWOOD. or under a flat Rock. Not Buried! IMO.

          Happy Spring everyone.
          Lou Lee Belle, Chased by Brown Bears while camping in Montana and wyoming.

        • I guess it could be a metal detector but could also just be a crazy guy hooked on gold? Just depends on how you look at it I guess.

  50. Anyone – On page 16 of TTOTC, the title of the chapter is First Grade. Then on pages 18 & 19 is FF’s Lanier School picture. The caption on the right states 1936. FF was 6 yrs old in first grade … with his b’day being 22 Aug. Then on page 22 is a picture of him at age 13 with a caption stating seventh grade.

    Something doesn’t jive. If FF was 6 in the 1st, 7 in the 2nd, 8 in the 3rd, 9 in the 4th, 10 in the 5th, & 11 in the 6th, he would have been 12 years old starting in the 7th grade … not 13 . I remember FF saying to look for inconsistencies in the book. Well, there’s one, but what does it mean?

    • It may have something to do with the 13th line in the poem ” If you’ve been wise and found the blaze “..Keep researching,you might be on to something .
      He has said to read the poem then read the book then the poem again,looking for hints… πŸ™‚

    • I dont remember Forrest saying look for inconsistencies. When did he say that? Anyone?

      • I don’t remember him saying look for inconsistencies either. He may have used the word aberrations, but I don’t recall where.

    • Something else that’s weird is page 123 of the thrill of the chase. There are seven pictures on that page. I’ve done it tired now I’m (week=7)

    • Becky, The HUGE clue is on the inside “COVER” or as I say, the”UNDERCOVER”..The photo”overlayed” on the ID card showing a young boy, not a 150 pound teen ager. And the sliver of a purple stamp, the ONLY color on the sleeve…..remember, “Its not who you are, it’s who they think you are”. Don’t remember him saying look for inconsistencies either…..Just something we all do anyway.

  51. Does anyone have video making experience?
    To use kickstarter you have to make a video showing what you want to do with the funds…this if for the bronze statue that Forrest’s friend Glenna Goodacre will make…

    email me at

  52. I think the common ordinary average man or woman who loves and provides for his/her family, who may not be considered the brightest, who lives a humdrum, pay your tax’s and slug it out everyday at a monotonous, routine type of job. These are the real hero’s of life that should have a ‘Golden Statue’ made for them. and this… I would give money for a statue.

  53. Sometimes I go and have breakfast when the wife and kids are at school. I enjoy some alone time, but then I have a silly joke, an insane idea that needs another like minded person to appreciate it, and a dreamer to bring the kid in me alive once more. I get excited and laugh at my self, it would be nice to share a smile every now and then.

    This is the Chase, 90% of work, and 10% of absolute thrill and excitement that makes you forget about the 90% πŸ™‚

  54. So I don’t know if any non-local has a snowballs chance of finding it. But hey, hope springs eternal and we’re having fun……
    Well way to bust my bubble!

    Non Local just check n’ in.
    Mark H.

    • If your over 18, check out Deep Purples “Knocking At Your Backdoor” (THRILL OF THE CHASE) and “Gypsy Kiss”…both off the “Perfect Strangers” album. WHAT ARE THE ODDS ? “It’s not who you are, it’s who they think you are”.

  55. Spring has sprung! Waste the youth on the young! Let’s get out and have some fun!
    I’m just excited to GO!

    • You always have such a way with words. Keep your eye on the Spring. It’s still too far to fall. Soon we will all be feeling the heat. Just throw me a stick near my feet.

      • I miss my spot
        It’s just so grand!
        I’ll toss you a stick
        Or maybe a bone,
        I’ll be looking quick
        And I won’t be alone.
        It’s just so grand
        Such beautiful land
        You’ll see bajaau
        When you retrieve
        It’s just so “wow”
        So hard to leave.

  56. After trying to heard cats for several days asking everyone to send me some info on their belief/location of the first two clues, Tom Terrific have officially thrown in the towel.

    The majority of searchers are just not willing to share much or anything, so little or nothing to statistically calculate, even the private emails to did not net much, but the ones who answered me all seem to have one thing in common, the belief in the word that is “Key” some think it is in a line in the poem, while others felt it is derived from meanings of the metaphors and similes ff designed intricately into the fabric of his expressions, either way I promised not to reveal name and the various take on this Anonymous Group of contributors.

    I am expressing only my take of the “Key Word” here which is in the poem, it is the only word of all the nouns in the poem that has only one meaning.

    If you will write to me I will send you this word because it is unique.

    Tom Terrific

    • just too many ways a word can be key. From the poem, a certain line will give you some hints. Still, that line gives a couple answers. Could be “Skippy”, could be 33 or 6, could be kees or seek.(I know I’ve referenced Seeker’s posts lately, this is just coincidence). could even be six or xisix. These examples are from the poem. Not saying they mean anything, just not something that will give you some OMG moment in solving the poem.

  57. For me, the word that is “key”, NOT a “key word”, is not in the poem, but does relate to a word or even possibly word(s) in the poem.

  58. Although he has dodged the question several times now, …..I would just like to know if Sir Forrest Fenn of Nottingham, himself, traveled the EXACT same route that is outlined in the poem or NOT. But he doesn’t seem to ever want to answer that with a yes or no. It’s kinda like the question of whether the chest is buried or not. He just won’t give us anything much more to go on. He does respond of course, but never definitively. And like so many other statements from him, it only turns out to be ambiguous.

    • Susie, IMO, he could not have taken the route in the poem when he hid the treasure. He said he made two trips from his CAR to the hiding place. You do not “PUT IN” in a car, you put in a boat or canoe. I believe that the poem is to get US out on adventures, he has been doing that all his life, imo that’s why he’s “tired”. I think that once we have the correct solve figured out, we too can just drive to the area of the blaze and find the chest without traveling the route of the poem, although I would like to.

      • Let me “Drop the Bomb on you” I think it’s important to start at the very beginning of the directions of the poem. Forrest would hate for us to miss the scenery of where u begin.
        πŸ™‚ it’s well worth it

      • Not Obsessed,

        Yeah, I used to think somewhat the same. πŸ™‚

        “he could not have taken the route in the poem when he hid the treasure”?? Hmmm…..

        “Two trips”? “PUT IN”? Okkkkkkkkk. πŸ™‚

        “Tired”? Sounds good to me.

        • As regards to this subject, I think it simply comes down to this:

          Could he, himself, have skipped all of the steps and went straight to the chest? — Absolutely!! Why wouldn’t he. πŸ™‚

          Will he ever disclose that? — Probably not.

          Do we need to take the exact same route outlined in the poem? — Yes. Because, like he said, “There is no other way.” …..for US. πŸ™‚

          But it would be helpful, at least for me to know, maybe? …..if HE ‘traveled’ the exact same route the poem takes us on?? Because if he did, then from everything else he said, then for me, that will eliminate an important element.

  59. Ed, can you tell me where to find Forrest’s statement about the weak spot in the poem. I don’t recall reading that, and your idea could fit my solve. Thanks.

    • πŸ™‚ he didn’t exactly say that, that’s my interpretation of what I think he was trying to say…a keyword…somewhere we don’t even know if it’s in the poem. Apparently that one word will make so the treasure is found sooner than he’d anticipated.

      • Ed
        I believe the word is in the poem…it is right there in plain view…and the word is definitely key…imo

  60. Dal, on March 18th at 9:48 pm you wrote

    What are you talking about?
    There could never have been a suicide pact. Forrest’s dad took his life years ago Forrest is still here…what kind of pact would that be…???

    Answer, A suicide pact does not always include we both kill ourselves immediately, just when the time comes and conditions are right, that is when the plan is executed, because we all know that ff stated on page 143 of “Thrill” these words, “I recover after having planned my future up to ONE detail short of the final bier. I had even plotted to have my bones rest forever in silent repose, beside the treasure chest.” “If I go I want to do it on my own terms as my father had done two years earlier” ” For sure ff knew exactly where his bones and the chest would rest forever in that special place, what I am calling a pact between Forrest and his father might not have been a formal agreement per say, but it was for sure that the night of William Marvin Fenn’s passing they spoke of this way as a permanent solution for a permanent problem, unlike some people who commit suicide as a permanent solution to temporary problem.

    I know after Skippy passed away there was obviously only one male family member for Forrest to relate to, and my bet is that William Marvin Fenn already knew his special place for the act and Forrest Special Spot. I can visualize that conversation this way..

    Now I’m tired. I need to come home. I am nearly ready to begin my journey although leaving isn’t easy.

    “Many things I love must remain behind: Friends, dreams, memories, many songs I never got to sing.

    “But there will be other dreams and perhaps I’ll write a new song

    “But I must return to you,

    “Gain your strength, feel your arms around me, make my home among you once more.

    “So, look out your window some morning when dawn is breaking,

    “An afternoon when autumn leaves are falling, or perhaps in the red-gold haze of a twilight sunset,

    “You’ll see me running, arms outstretched, tears of joy in my eyes, and my heart overflowing with happiness and love.

    “I’ll be home soon, and this time, I’ll be home to stay.”

    If anyone wants to reproduce this its OK it was written by a distant relative of mine Linda Evelyn Brannan

    If Forrest Fire checks in and sees this could he answer this question: Did your father know the special place? Two can keep a secret if one of them is dead?

    Tom Terrific

    • Tom-
      Good luck with that!
      I think you missed your calling. You should have been a writer of novels. πŸ™‚

      • Dal I am flattered but you are not only a talented writer, you are obviously a gifted Videographer, and I believe you will eventually create a documentary for National Geographic or History Channel.

        No one has your experience and talent, and I ain’t just blowin smoke…

        • Tom..
          I have created many stories for natgeo, disco, cbs, abc, nbc, pbs, tvbarcelona, tvmadrid, cbc, bbc…I had a 40 year career creating stories for everybody that would have me.Some were pretty good, some stunk. I almost always knew when I wore out my welcome.

          • I am incredibly insightful at reading between the lines. Dal you do an awesome job here and there is never a dull moment all because you post the right message at the correct time!

            Kudos and keep up this good work you have a gift.

            Tom Terrif

        • Dal, your stories are well crafted, your photo compositions sublime, and you’ve an elegance with words. I’m not surprised you’ve written and filmed for the best.

          True. And yes I’m brown nosing for Carl part III πŸ˜‰

    • Tom your commentary is filling in lots of gaps for us thanks. You seem like a thinker. About your statistical analysis on where warm water halts. My method was simple. Select the state you like and Google geothermal activity.

      • Great comment ED..Now if only I believed that WWWHalt was actually that.

        Unfortunately I still think it is either Tears or cold water or where rivers come from mountains onto the plains and warm water spices begin to thrive, check with your local Game and Fish proclamation in your state it will say “where warm waters halt and cold water regulations begin.”

        Tom Terrific

        • Tom

          What I’d be more interested in is a poll of how many people believe it’s in Yellowstone. I think the vast majority believe it’s in Yellowstone. Someone I think it was Tony said that he would put it in the Grand Canyon of Yellowstone.

          • According to NPS Yellowstone website:
            “Canoes, kayaks and other non-motorized
            boats are permitted on all park lakes except
            Sylvan Lake, Eleanor Lake, Twin Lakes, and
            Beach Springs Lagoon. All park rivers are
            closed to boating except for
            the section of the Lewis River
            between Lewis Lake and
            Shoshone Lake, where
            non-motorized boating
            is permitted. Float tubes
            are considered
            non-motorized boats and
            subject to the same regulations.”

            This would eliminate anyone from “putting in” a canoe or kayak in Yellowstone River, and most of the others, to follow the poem in YNP.
            I remember Forrest saying that he “didn’t know that he couldn’t do that” when he talked about fishing and camping for three days and using use his inflatable boat in the Madison River. Maybe he did follow the poem, assuming it is on the Madison.

    • Tom, my Uncle Johnny likes to get straight to the point. So, when folks go over to his place and he is ready for them to leave he’ll throw an arm around your shoulder and say, “If I were at your house, I’d be leaving right about now.”

      Makes me laugh every time. He simply won’t allow someone to overstay their welcome. You know where you stand with Uncle Johnny. I love such abrupt honesty.

      This is Dal’s house and he isn’t as abrupt as Uncle Johnny, but he has his subtle way of letting you know when you have crossed a line. Are you picking up what I am throwing down here, Tom?

      • That was how I understood it also, lol.

        My opinion is that it does not matter what Forrest’s relationship was with his father or whether or not his father knew the secret spot. And I don’t think trying to call Forrest out to get a confirmation of a solve will work.

        But that is just my opinion.

    • Skippy,Skippy,Skippy. I think he went on alot of adventures with Skippy. Family outings, fishing trips, etc. could be seen as adventures, but, with a brother you idolize, and has a sence of adventure more than your own,Skippy. They should have buried him standing up.
      As far as a suicide pact, your talking about a guy that is larger than life, so many adventures, I just don’t see someone like that committing suicide. Let alone a father hearing his son talk about suicide or form a pact. I would thing a father in that situation would knock him on his azzzz.

  61. Friends, good luck in the Chase. If someone does find it they are either incredibly smart or incredibly lucky. The hints seem extremely subtle. I imagine it could take years to decode.

        • Hi anna,……it’s an acronym that I made up from some words that mean something to me. Is anna your real name? Like πŸ™‚

          • I guess you’re anna and lia… that makes you lianna or annalia. Am I right? lol, Nice names by the way. I guessed, so what are you going to tell me?

          • Nice guesses Ritt, however don’t you think if I were Lea that I would know how to get a pretty avatar? Anna is my grandmothers name. You didn’t give up anything about your anagram. Does it have anything to do with totc?

            Back on topic so we don’t get moderately moderated for being out of solve mode. After reading a few older scrapbooks I’d place my bet on NM for the gold, but DG and Dal must know something to continue in West Yellowstone, Montana.

          • Lia is my other name I’m Bi-polar with multiple personality disorder some days I have no idea who I am. just kidding Lia is Lia.

            Back to the poem, tired and now I’m weak. The tire is round like a circle the gypsies are in a circle.

          • Hi anna, your avatar is pretty. So what does lia know about you? Lia, time to tell.

            You must have come across samsmith’s post while looking back at older SB’s…he thinks it’s in Wyoming. I think he has something going there…look to Cody!

            Yeah, Dal and DG like Montana…can’t blame them, it’s a good possibility, but so is Colorado and NM. To each his own.

            This is a game…have fun playing, and thanks for liking my screen name.

            Good luck to you! πŸ™‚

    • Ed, no worries, I talk out loud to myself to think thru poem structure and Fenn reasoning so my family doesn’t have to hear it “one more time” and roll their eyes. So in your solution is the tire a sandbox or a tire swing? I’m trying to decide if I need a metal detector. Yikes those Gold Bug detectors are way out of my price range! Would sure make searching brush and rock piles and underwood easier. What do you think?

      • Actually Anna I’m out here now in the dark trying to secure the mother load with a flashlight. joking πŸ™‚ But I’ll be in there tomorrow. I’m thinking something along the lines of a sandbox. My Metal detector is just a cheapie.

      • This is how my husband thinks, he has a Whites XLT metal detector that we did use on our search for the chest, he said get a picture of me with this so that if we do find Fenn’s chest then that company will put it in there magazine for advertising.
        Well we didn’t find it. But we have one more chance πŸ™‚ lol

  62. People laugh and people cry, sticks and stones etc. we will see who is laughing this summer if you think you got this figured out.

    Good luck and keep those cards and letters coming I need all the help I can get because I do not have it figured out, just using the best means to locate the prize which is, a lot of people exchanging ideas, some great and some not so good. Good luck on your searches out there and if you have the time drop me a line and let me know where you spent your vacation.

    Also as we veterans like to say “All gave some and some gave all”. So if you are looking for brave and in the wood go the first US Vietnam Veterans memorial in Angel Fire NM and on the east side is a stand of trees called “the woods” and a sign that says “decorations for bravery” planted in their honor with names of soldiers, sailors, and airmen in bricks about 50 in all for those who gave all.

    And if you, like me are a Vet “thanks for your service” and be thankful that you did not give all, someone else has done that for us.

    Tom Terrific

  63. Tom’s just thinking out loud. My thinking is to keep it to myself when folks say things that maybe they shouldn’t… We’ve all done it! Anyhow that’s dal’s job, ask the German Guy. (I miss him.)
    And also, and fortunately for all of us, f can take it, he thought of everything including death packs, which are an everyday occurrence… right? Okay maybe not so much πŸ™

    Personally, I don’t think f is trying to tell us about some of the more uncomfortable things that happen in life, but of those awesome things of beauty and joy… that which has thrilled him and made for a wonderful life. Things that if he had not shared might be forgot… after all he was worried about our future and how he could contribute to it… okay enough said!

    Let’s talk foundations.
    How do you pick an area to Search. Okay wow.
    I am on the NM band wagon, and of course I have doubts, and of course it could be in Cody or anywhere else. …but… to have a place one should have a reason. A foundation if you will. In this case I hunt NM, and I’l tell you why. My foundation begins in our book, TTOTC… where I’m told by f in a poem that his house is in the sand and that’s where he’s comfortable. This is followed by so many clues and hints that if added up precisely… might equal NM. Just say n’. (Foundation)
    Now he also tells us that the BLM might/may tend to the land… where he has planned to bury his bells and Jars… so why not the box as well??? All guessing like anyone else but a little less morbid.
    Using his “being comfortable” with his home and the BLM I now need to support both… Okay… for me I have tons of examples, but will only give a few as to not give away too much or to say that this is right… only how I built my foundation.
    I began with the distance he could travel and with him being at home when he started… without flying he probably didn’t drive to Alaska. NM sounds do-able and even into southern Colorado. Now, that I have a possible time frame I have a fairly good foundation to begin searching. ONE: He loves his home, TWO: it could be on BLM, and THREE: a time line.
    Now I start building f hints. He writes about NM artist and friends…like Okeeffe, he sold a lot of Native American art and perhaps enjoys Native American/Pueblo History… more than anyone! He signs books in Turquoise mines… not in Thermopolis? In Taos, but not at Hebgen Lake. How about the frogs, the bracelet… and it’s history that most appealed to him? How about where he got it… Fred Harvey (we call him the pimp) the hotel magnate… the Brown Hotels??? I dont think there is one of those in Montana? Can’t ya see her coming round the track it the AT&SF…… Judy garland you know who also did the Wizard of OZ. Okay we got frogs and land grants and the Spanish And Coronado, the Santa Fe Trail for heavens sake…tons of clues including perhaps spices to make some good wine. While I could go on and on this is my example of why to pick an area.
    Now… how about that poem, some walls, and a roof, and we’ll get this virtual structure built!
    Mark H.

  64. When you read TTOTC it’s like a game of Pick One. …..So, it’s either in Yellowstone or New Mexico?, …..but it screams Yellowstone, so it must be there right?, …..with only little fragments of NM mentioned here and there, …..basically background noise. It’s almost like he doesn’t want to say anything about, but he does, because he loves it so much. πŸ™‚ But that’s it………. The sleeping giant right behind us, …..while the elephant is on stage attracting everyone’s attention

    It’s here, …..somewhere.

  65. Thanks Tom, 90 miles is similar to Skippy and f’s story about what might be too far to walk. I like 8.25 but that is just from maybe one point to the next. and the first is 90? Chamber door and Canyon or Canon? IDK Here I have a problem as a non local knowing what is up and down… take the Canyon down. Well if one reads all the post many locals will explain… ex: Cynthia in her High Road to Taos story explains the canyon down in her trip! Not on purpose or even correct, but there it is, an example. Her stories IMO are some of the best and most informative with better pictures each time.

    Suzie, some like Colorado and Montana… just say n’. Boy, I hope that elephant gets an Oscar?
    I would love to hear about the poem screaming Yellowstone besides suggesting yellowstone and I don’t mean YNP.

    Since, I’ve talked much too much already tonight, I’d like to share another angle I’ve been working on…smiling from ear to ear… it’s just another angle, and then I’ll try to be quiet. Geology… what ya think goofy?

  66. Soo many posts…Is it the the thrill of the chat that some are after? Just saying…Got to love how the weather is shaping up for a early spring in the Rockies….The early bird gets the worm they say but all I can think of is robins eating worms in the yard and yuck who would want to eat a worm eating Robin πŸ™‚

    • This is what the junkyard of broken and defeated solves looks like. Sit around and chat all day because well all gassed out.

      • How precise is precise and that line in the poem that leads you precisely is it open for other ways to interpret πŸ™‚

        • Hi Ed. Absolutely, it is precise, but only as precise as you’ll allow it to be. Interpretation is the ambiguity.
          Too easy to force one way or another. Have to be sure, otherwise you’ll run in circles! Oh yeah, IMO!:-)

  67. Ha! I’ve been watching “Rocky Mountain Bounty Hunters”on TV for some good secencery , and keeping an eye out for that 10X10 box.

  68. Dal, you told the story of filming the bear as it walked towards and then by you. Can you post that video on the blog, or is it owned by someone else that you were filming for?

    • I think I can…but not tonight. Let me say that I am pretty certain I still have that footage. I think it’s in my archive at the studio…but I won’t know for certain until I get back there on Monday…
      I’ll post it if I can…probably next week..
      Wait!…if I post t will someone come by and arrest me for being illegally close to a protected species?

      • Not if you edit out the part where you were feeding it a Baby Ruth!!!! πŸ™‚ πŸ™‚

        • loco-
          We were at least smart enough not to be carrying any food in our pockets..probably not planned…just lucky…

      • If they try to arrest you, you have proof the you weren’t approaching the bear, it was approaching you, so they should arrest the bear for getting too close to YOU.

        • NO-
          I don’t think they care about that. You are supposed to be smart enough not to stand around while a grizzly walks up to you… πŸ™‚
          On the video you can hear this person screaming at us to get out of there. He was sitting in his truck up on the side of the road watching. He was the one agitating the situation. His yelling just made the whole event uncomfortable.

  69. Do any of u remember Crystal Gale? What a beautiful lady she was. She is 64 years old. I love her song “Don’t it make my Brown eyes Blue”, She had to have been known for her beautiful long Brown hair. πŸ™‚

  70. May 2014, scrapbook 73
    Almost one year ago
    Forrest I believe I’m full thanks for the food . πŸ™‚

  71. Using failed solves from the JUNKYARD to narrow down where the chest isn’t, ain’t so bad! It might lead to some success.

    And 68U, DEFEATED is a word never used in my vocabulary. It sounds like can’t… Not a Harper thing!

    Goofy, I was thinking about f saying that “a comprehensive knowlege of it might help” statement in regards to Geology (And U misspelled Knowledge!) Ha!
    But when you look the word Geology up, we are again left with the ambiguity of f. It means virtually everything??? So again, we are left to interpret what f means.
    Geology: the study of the earth’s history… esp as recorded in rocks. So rocks, artifacts, what about glyphs, bones, or traces of such that trace time???
    I was, and still am, confused as to how to narrow this down but I went with mining districts and the geology of ore deposits as I was chasing gold. Interesting though, came to learn about so much more than gold… Stephanite, Hematite, and Iron or about gypsum and asphault which again was very interesting… as we know it is in the TTOTC. f ask if one day in the future, NM will be covered in houses and asphalt. (Foundation)
    Then there was the extensive habitation of peoples based on cultural remains… architecture, tools and remains.
    We find the Cody Complex, and the Pecos Classification, etc, where we find Richard Wetherill. How do we know which angle to take or how to collate them?
    And Lastly, rock and types of… such as magma v sedimentary. altitude, or those that rust and those that don’t.
    All Creating many living breathing works of art to get out and see..such as Lamb’s Spring or the Rio Chama. (Fennboree plug)
    Goofy, to find the box f said, an extensive knowlege of geology, the Poem that’s in the book, and a good map???
    I wish I knew what any of that meant?

    Mark H. πŸ™‚
    all too much

      • Lou Lee, I’m completely nuts, and apologize for my blunder.
        Could geology encompass a bit of geography though.
        Maybe you can give me the benefit of the doubt on this one.
        Sure was a good bit of information there.
        Mark H.

        • No worries, geology must encompass geography too! Just pointing out what forrest said. All in Kindness. Lots of great info out there. Thanks so muchy.
          Lou Lee, Chased by Brown Bears and am still afraid.

        • Not wasted time, just misquoted. However, consider this, that without the geology of our physical earth, you don’t have geography in general that could basically be broken down to human physical interaction within the environment, IMO.


      • At one time…just one of several dozen times…I thought Forrest said GEOMETRY…not Geography…so I came up with a great solve involving angles and degrees. Too bad it didn’t pan out.

  72. Hes always said, the poem, and about a year or 2 ago he added a good map. I don’t remember the geology requirement….

  73. Now that my new solve has me at ‘water high’ I am very interested in this that f said. …”those who start out by looking for the blaze, are wasting their time.”

    That leads me to think that the blaze is somewhat common, maybe not a rare thing to be found. Could be many in one area (100 sq miles) and none in another.
    f is talking about hats in the scrapbook, maybe HE Wants Us TO Put On Our THINKING Hats

    • Musstag, thinking cap on regarding water high:
      I recall some of the wise ones here discussing the line No paddle up your creek, just heavy loads and water high. Someone mentioned no paddle being taken to June since she was the family pet. My take is that there will be no June paddle or the creek runs dry from June forward. Early spring run off in the creek then dry gulch. Heavy loads and water high may be reference to Skippy drowning but also to geological info: boulders, high mountain lakes, Lodes/lightening prone place or reference to ore, boulders containing glacial ice, water falls.

    • Muss-
      He’s said the same thing about HOB. I’ve assumed this meant that HOB was just not likely to be figured out unless you had followed the clues properly and could see it. In other words, it can’t be figured out from GE or a map..
      I feel the same way about the blaze..
      This is just my opinion and likely to change in the next minute or two..

      I had not considered the idea that there might be many in some areas and less in others…
      I am considering it now..

      • Hi Dal,

        For the arm chair seekers who would love to be able to get boots on the ground I offer this: In my opinion, if HOB cannot be figured out until the prior clues are figured out and so goes with Blaze it very well might be accomplished further than this on a GE or map.

        A not of encouragement nothing more.

      • Dal

        F said that we are wasting our time trying to start off with the blaze

        he implied the opposite on the HOB saying in essence sure you could figure out the HOB then reverse engineer that to figure out WWH

        • Chris-
          That’s interesting. I remember his remarks about HOB from more than a year ago when people were talking about the HOB and were trying to figure out what it was without even having a place to begin. He said at that time that we must start at the beginning and that starting in the middle will get us nowhere.

          So I’ll try looking up my reference. Can you look yours up as well?

          • Question posted 7/2/2014:

            Do you think that someone who is sure about the location of the home of Brown could reverse-engineer where warm waters halt? ~Ben Raylor

            Thanks for the question Ben.
            If you are sure about the location of home of Brown why are you concerned about where warm waters halt? But to answer your question, sure you could and a few searchers might throw in some gas money for a percentage of the take. Good luck.f
            From jenny kile’s questions.

            Ultimately I think that entire interpretation is still required and a reoccurring theme that you still must determine wwwh as well as all other “clues” to have your own undeniable confidence for yourself. This is the ongoing mental struggle that I have and am sure others find those same conflicting thoughts of “absolute” strength in their solve. To me it is that little voice in my head saying, “are you certain and why are you certain, what backs up your claim? Why would you have full confidence in any type of partial solve? Have you stretched your interpretation of the poem even slightly askew to fit the area you are working?”

            I think the chase is an amazing challenge and an awesome way to spur people to get out and into the wilds, no matter what the confidence level is.

            GOG mentions in below post about our imaginations and thinking. Our minds can certainly send us up and down many paths, lol.


          • -steve
            your quote from ff.. “If you are sure about the location of Home of Brown why are you concerned about Where Warm Waters halt?”

            Imho … he is saying if you know the location of the Home of Brown you probably already found warm waters halt.

            Did you find Where Warm Waters halt -steve?


            Dal, i concur that F has said we should start at the beginning.

            when he says “If you are sure about the location of home of Brown why are you concerned about where warm waters halt?” that could be read as a contradiction, but im not going to try and reconcile the two cuz your guess is as good as mine

            when he says start at the beginning, and we need to know where to start, i think that has to do with constructing the poem path

            and to do so we need to have the starting point which is WWH, and that we should try to construct it by starting there

            before we start constructing it, the most difficult clue (per another f comment) is figuring out where you start. you can’t start where you start to figure out where you start if you dont know where you start lol, you know what i mean

            so i think there are some clues and hints in and around WWH that you can figure out and eventually you can know what and where WWH is. HOB i believe is near the beginning and may be one of those things that can be figured out so then you know where to start.

            it seems to me that Fs comment about reverse engineering HOB is revealing something like that is possible and maybe with other hints about other things right there at the start, in or next to WWH

          • Certainly possible Chris. But it might also be that you will only know what is meant by HOB if you have the correct WWWH because HOB is not any of the expected or predictable possibilities. HOB could be so unique that it will only be recognized as HOB once you have the correct WWWH and the correct interpretation of canyon down and NFBTFTW.
            Or not…
            I am hoping you will remember to tell us what interpretation you used when you find the chest πŸ™‚

          • I think that start at the beginning refers to start at the first chapter in the book. IMO there are hints in that chapter that tell you what WWWH could be. And that seriously reduces the number of choices of where to start.

          • The preface has several numbers too. Have to admit I toyed with the numbers even though I usually wouldn’t consider the numbers aspect in locating the chest.

        • I think Forrest has been very clear about this, based upon a number of comments that fit together fairly well.

          You need to start at the beginning. Trying to figure out the third clue first is a waste of time because you do not have the preceding, contiguous solutions to arrive there in the first place and verify if that clue solution is correct.

          If someone handed you a bona fide clue solution (only Forrest could do this) somewhere in the middle of the sequence, you wouldn’t need the preceding clues, for the same logic as above. You would likely recognize the solutions to the preceding clues (reverse engineered, but why be concerned, as Forrest said), and you would be able to continue forward with the remaining clues with great confidence. But that’s theoretical, because we assume no one will be handed an intermediate clue solution.

          You cannot begin at hoB, but if you were given the hoB solution, as Forrest implied, you could likely find your way to the treasure. I agree with this.

          These are interesting considerations, but they will not help you solve the entire poem.

          Regarding the commonality of the clues, that remains to be seen. The solutions could follow the dictum of the Marine’s rifle, as someone else has pointed out before:

          “This is Forrest’s home of Brown. There are many others like it, but this one is his.”

          I believe each clue solution is unique and singular but only recognized as such by association within the contiguous sequence that Forrest has so often referenced. Knots are very common, yet Forrest provides very particular knots on one very particular rope.

          And the first knot is a doozy; it’s a prerequisite.


          • Well said Halogetter. I always appreciate your input. I think too many people walk right past the most important information in the poem. I’ve been at it over a year and am still trying to correctly interpret the layers. IMO you have to solve the poem a minimum of 3 times to the same location, but using 3 different methods. I’m still learning and always open to ideas. Love reading some of the older posts, especially when Forrest weighs in.

          • Halogetter, since you’ve mentioned knots and they play out in totc pgs 109 – 111. I wonder if you have any thoughts on knots?
            Why “under penalty of death” Why do you think such strong emphasis is placed in red letters “DO NOT TOUCH?”

          • I think Lia is right, but I think we already know there are different levels to the poem. Technically, wouldn’t the starting place for everyone be at there own home?
            if you’re taking the beginning to be the first clue, with a poem with multiple levels, you would have different “first” clues.
            Lines 5-14 is obviously the path. If one level of the poem gave you numbers, and those numbers give you the coordinates, then that spot could be reversed engineered. You have to get to those coordinates somehow, Working back from your spotcould begin at some kind of warm water something. And that’s where you begin.
            The clues might start in the first stanza as well as the sixth stanza. A hint on one level of the poem may be a clue on another level of the poem, or, a hint or clue used on one level is totally worthless on another level. Because it was already used. Example, my first clue is in stanza 1, but can also be in stanza 5 or 6, I think of clues being the coordinates. With those coordinates giving me a spot, I see how to get there. And it starts at WWWH. Face value would then be the beginning at WWWH, but that was not my first clue. Clue can mean so many different things, and so can hint In fact hint can be clue. I wouldn’t worry to much on who’s on first and what’s on second. Just solve the poem how you see it, it will all reveal itself in the end.

    • Mustagg, from the solutions I’ve seen and come up with myself; I would say all of the clues are common; at least in our imaginations. There aren’t many places the clues don’t fit. This would especially apply to the blaze, in my opinion, since it can be anything we dream it to be.

      I think it’s an absolute necessity we put on our thinking caps; it not a choice. Fenn said he didn’t give away the chest; he said the person that finds it will have earned it.

      The problem, at least to me, is how we know when we’ve fallen off the event horizon into a never ending rabbit hole of our imagination.

      Are all of the clues confined to the search area? How far out do we go? Take home of Brown for example; the search area references could be, a canyon, trout, a ranger’s cabin or fort, a mountain man, Molly Brown, etc.

      Thinking out of the box (search area); Jerry Brown the current governor of California was a prominent political figure back in Fenn’s day when he was also Governor of California. Governor Moonbeam was famous/infamous from his antics and dating Linda Ronstadt.

      He is from California having been born in San Francisco. Oddly enough San Francisco Street is one of the streets that border the square in Santa Fe. So is home of Brown San Francisco Peak, creek, or California something?

      No need to stop now…….the Franciscan Monks founded the missions and churches in New Mexico who happen to wear brown robes. San Francisco de Asis Mission Church built between 1772 and 1816 and is located in the historic district of Ranchos de Taos.

      Oh what a tangled web our imaginations can weave. When does our β€œthinking” turn into lunacy?

      • Goof-
        I love the Monks idea. That could tell a person where to “put in” on the Chama as well…
        I hear the sound of keyboard typing as we all start searching for Monk habitats in the mountains north of Santa Fe..

        • Pineapple and coconut pie my oh my fits right into my wicker basket. It’s the cold off the windy point that’s had me from the start.

          • Thought it was banana and cocoNut cream, if my memory serves me right, catch me if you can, bunny will be hopping soon, Paris is delightful in springtime πŸ™‚

        • The Fennboree will be below the Monestary of Christ in the Desert. Which is also below the place where the biggest brown trout was caught in NM. We could sit and drink Monks Ale and imagine the possibilities. Or not.

          • Michael hard to argue with your expertise but my gut is saying farther southafter swinging a little through the northwest. Just saying.

          • Michael are you thinking of attending this year? It would be great to meet you.
            And in addition to places such as El Vado…Ojo Caliente…and the Rio Chama
            how exciting are the stories of Warrior Monks…
            Too, and not far from the Monastery is a structure that looks like the inside of an ear? Hear me all?

            Note: the road to the monastery is a trip and I mean a hallucinogenic trip. It’s 13-14 miles of the show “Off Rd. Truckers.” Expect an hour, to an hour and a half to get there once you have left the highway, and a Honda Civic might not have the clearance needed between the ground the car and the boulders.
            I can’t wait to get back.
            Do you think Bob Haworth would show up and play a few tunes around the old campfire?
            I hope to see you folks there at this years FennBoree!
            Learning geography and not geology
            Mark H.
            Oh ya, I thought how cool would it be to own the Brown Hotel in Springer??? It’s for sale for $159,000.00. If I sold our house the kids, dog and just about everything else. I’d only be about $158,999.00 short!
            f where the heck’s that box?

        • Not to suggest your going back the San Francisco but… Detective Monk lived in the city. I like you all’s take on Monk much better.

      • GOG, It could be that our thinking turns to lunacy at the point when we find it acceptable to start our search anywhere other than at the first clue, and when someone omits any of the clues or forces them to fit in any way other than what Forrest intended.

        • Hi Stan,
          I think the craziness begins when one decides to become a Fenner/hunter.
          As far as starting anywhere other than where the first clue is… is kinda funny if ya think about it. It’s all just conjecture. This is why I was suggesting stringing clues and or hints together to form an area that IMO the first clue/wwwh might be…
          Here, I’ll go ahead and throw this out there and then you can destroy it if you want… fair enough?
          In the TTOTC, when f is taking Olga’s ashes to their resting place, he describes smelling the juniper and sage… this sounds familiar? Well for me… it’s foundation. Foundation enough to assume I can put this one hint on my stringer with my other hints and clues thus helping me to choose an area to begin? And IMO the stringer is full enough to look for wwwh in this area… I’m not saying I’m right… it’s just one way in which I’m comfortable.
          Also, deciding where to hunt is IMO only one layer to this thing. We still have a sub-floor/concrete, walls and a roof to put on!
          Mark H.

  74. Musstag, I think (opinion) the blaze will prob be found once you’re there on the ground with boots on. And I’m not sure what it is. I hope that once I see it I’ll know? Many in one area and none in another sounds reasonable. Thanks
    Mark H.

    • Couldn’t disagree more Mark, Mr. Fenn always does things in grand style. Look up and it will be right there. As red as the sky on a stormy morning. Just a sailors warning.

      • bajaau, hi. I have no clue, but musstag’s reasoning is as good as anyone else. I guess I won’t know until it’s found? Someone said, Flexibility is the key to success. So I’ve become somewhat of a contortionist. And bajaau, I think it’s look quickly down, but then maybe your right and I’d miss that red! Thanks for the input mate!
        Mark H.

  75. Setting here looking at the poem,
    I am wondering the possible intent of the clues.
    For example, clues 1-5 are location oriented. Clues 6 & 7 are actions and 8 & 9 are results? IMO disclaimer applied πŸ˜‰

  76. ILia, good thought. GOG, imagination, I struggle with that as you say and also with the fact that I Have trouble thinking up things, I tend to try and reason them out, and thats not what ff sez to do….
    Yes I guess you will know the blaze when you see it, But I am not convinced of that yet. When you are looking for the blaze, the other clues possibily solved, look for one more clue of somesort AT the last several clue places. Thats just a hunch….

    • I am guessing you aren’t off the hook. The hook that you, me, and many others are caught on, and tied to the end of FF’s fishing pole by a string strong enough to pull in thousands++. Gotta love it.


  77. The Rockies are wide open for searching. I spent the day in my spot and I’ll be searching tommorow as well. Seems like a warm year. Some snow at really high elevations.

  78. Hi everyone. Maybe this isn’t the right place for this but this is my first post on this blog. I’ve been following the posts for nearly 2 years now while doing armchair searches for the treasure. It’s weird but it almost feels like I know many of you…

    So, why am I posting now? Well, I think I finally have a solve to the poem and I’m making plans to get boots on the ground soon. Every line in the poem seems to fit my spot. I’m not saying that the chest is there but it’s the best that I can come up with.

    My wife and I were talking last night and she asked me what I would do if I found the chest. I’ve thought about it a lot and I think I know exactly what I’d do. 25 years ago, we were married at the ripe old age of 20. We didn’t have very much money so we took our honeymoon in Southern Ohio (our home state) at a place called Hocking Hills. It’s certainly not the Rocky Mountains but it’s beautiful, nonetheless. The waterfalls and rock formations… and the smell of hemlock just seems like a perfect place to me.

    So, if I found the chest I would start my own cabin rental business in the Hocking Hills so that others could enjoy the same place that means so much to us. Here is a video that shows some of Hocking Hills… (I hope this works)

    Hocking Hills State Park Waterfalls (Hocking County, Ohio):

    So, I’m curious as to what all of you would do if you found the treasure.

    Thanks for reading… happy hunting!

    • Best of luck to you TimM! There has been talk of blazes recently. You have an armchair solution, so I am curious to hear if you have identified a blaze for your search?

      • Yes, I’ve identified the blaze in my solve… I’m not sure if it’s right but I know it’s there and it falls in order with the poem.

        • Interesting! It seems most people, myself included, believe the blaze can only be discovered once you have “boots on the ground”. After two years of pondering the poem, it sounds as though you may have discovered something missed by others. When are you headed out to search? Planning to share your “search story” afterwards? I am curious to hear the details.

          • I’m not sure it’s even right but I’m at the point to where I have to get out there and check. I’ll have to wait until the weather cooperates. I’ll share my solution eventually … and of course Forrest would get the bracelet back, and anything else he wanted. Lol

          • Austin,

            I hope you and the others are wrong and the blaze can be found without boots on the ground.

            I found a blaze and it screams blaze as in horse markings. It can be seen from a distance on google earth, bright white and shaped appropriately. I have yet to duplicate how I got to the peak where I saw this (memory issues) but I hope I will find it yet again.

            Long and short of it, armchair folks there is a chance. Boots on the ground folks, there is a chance. A chance is all we all have.

          • Sorry Amy, I’d rather not say at this point. I’ve been sitting on my idea for a while and I’m afraid that someone will figure it out too because it’s really not complicated at all… makes me nervous. Lol

          • If I were to find the chest I have quite a bit to give πŸ™‚

            I have plenty of ideas and thoughts πŸ™‚

    • To answer your question…I’d probably stay real quiet about it and carry on with life as usual. Maybe get a pilot license and take more vacations! Also, I would return the bracelet to Forrest anonymously.

      • Hmmm… I would become like Carl πŸ™‚ well a lighter version of Carl I would want to go to town now and then and I would have to have my internet of course πŸ™‚ Maybe a few field trips to some museums as well. I would also definately give Forrest his bracelet back…

        Dal how can I ever aspire to be like Carl if we never get to hear the rest of the story!!!!!

        • Spall-
          It’s coming. I spent some time on it today. I don’t think we can aspire to be like Carl. We have to be born into it. It’s not who we are……..

      • Tim

        Well πŸ™

        I have Colorado covered πŸ™‚

        I don’t want to make u nervous. πŸ™‚

        May the wisest one find it πŸ™‚

        Good luck

          • Tim
            Why sure I have it narrowed down πŸ™‚
            Been thinking 3 years now. Last trip in June. My solve has been solved πŸ™‚

            We Welcome u to the Thrill of a Chase. πŸ™‚

            You might be making me nervous about your blaze but if u don’t search Colorado then I’m all good πŸ™‚

          • Tim

            I’m one with lots of confidence on this blog , in fact it’s been that way since I started lol πŸ™‚

            Don’t worry to much I still haven’t found it, but I will in June πŸ™‚ lol

            See how confident I am.
            Just ignore me πŸ™‚

    • TimM, The Hocking Hills area is nice. I took a girlfriend to Ravenswood Castle in Hocking Hills for a Renaissance Festival once. Unfortunately the castle was booked, but we were able to stay in a nice cabin and enjoy our meals at the castle, if full costume of course.

    • TimM, I too have found a blaze before I put boots on the ground, which will happen in late June if all works out. I think I would take the contents and leave the chest filled with some of my treasures for other to find. Unfortunately they are not worth much monetarily, but still special to me. I’m not sure if I will let anybody know when I find it, just sit back and hint in the blog of where to look,

    • Make a list of 10 people from the blogs that I feel have contributed alot or have helped, send them all a copy of the 20000 word biography, a couple coins( share the wealth), and my thanks. Because nobody here solves this thing all by themselves. A little respect and acknowledgement is a good thing.

  79. I post some clues to Philadelphia every one and a while on this blog… here it goes again…

    1)The catcher and the rye was mentioned in the 1st chapter in the book…The school in the book is based off Valley Forge military academy in Wayne Pa where the author attended
    2)When the chest is opened, the symbol surrounding the key hole is the shape of a keystone.. the is PA’s state symbol.. “the keystone state”
    3)Benjamin Franklin is mentioned in the book… he is a Philadelphia fixture…
    4)there is references in the book to bells through out it… Philadelphia is home to the most famous bell.. The Liberty Bell..
    5)Forrest mentions flying over Philadelphia is one of 2 of the biggest or life changing moments in his life..
    6)the chest is located in the rocky mountains…Maybe mountains near Philadelphia, home to Rocky Balboa? he he thats for laughs…
    7)George Washington played and important role in and around Philadelphia…
    8)Albert Einstien is mentioned in the book..he lived close to Philadelphia in Princeton NJ..
    9)Forrest is a cowboys fan and their arch nemesis are the Philadelphia Eagles..ha again with the jokes…

    I think number 1 and 2 and 5 are the really important ones that drew it to Philadelphia…Maybe the key to the poem has to be unlocked by going to Philadelphia and then you can find it in the search states???

  80. Lia-

    There are a number of curiosities in that chapter, many of which have been discussed. Despite the fact that I think we need to be careful about seeing what we want or need to see in the book, there are many things to consider here.

    First we have the string of kids on a rope, each with their own knot (and that first girl even has a dress with the same dress pattern as one of the Biddies- how efficient, and the teacher Halts an old car, and the Rockwell thang, etc.). This reminds one first to “learn the ropes”, which is appropriate for the chase. I don’t know exactly how frequently kids were taken on a class trip utilizing this method back then, but the system survives and has been updated today:

    I was taken aback by Forrest’s statement of “under penalty of death” in reference to children. This would generally be something to be avoided, and reserved for bone-headed adults who don’t listen, not innocent children. But the statement is one part of the many references to death strung throughout the book. It may also “tie in” to the huge ball of string with countless knots which was unravelled out the window because it was too big to roll out the door, while his mother gazed out upon the scene of the crime…

    As I mentioned above, the way Forrest has described the contiguous nature of the clues is directly analogous to the knots on a continuous rope- they are united and sequential, not independent and random. The word “knot” is often used to represent a challenging or intractable problem. So is the poem an intractable knot; is it a Gordian knot? Is it a great mystery that is actually very simple, yet concealed within apparent complexity πŸ˜‰ ?:

    I was surprised as well by the fact that Forrest decided that DO NOT TOUCH needed to appear twice in bold red caps. The printer would have needed specific instructions to do so, and it’s a real pain to have to deal with the red ink. At the very least it reminds one to touch on everything involved with the chase, and use all of your senses together “sight, smell, touch, taste and hearing”, to use “another dimension, one that is not available to the eyes alone”, and at the very least, to listen good. But I know it means other, specific things to certain searchers, and by IT I mean DO NOT TOUCH…

    At the very least this chapter reminds one to use “imagination, hard work and a logical mind”, and each of these qualities has since been specifically mentioned by Forrest.

    I believe that there is a lesson in this chapter pertaining to the bronze sculpture, and Forrest only partially explained why it’s cold to the touch.

    The best part of this chapter is Forrest casually speaking with tongue-in-cheek about the “nice note” he received from a parent calling him a fraud. Reflect upon that, given the fact that he stresses that it only matters what they think you are…


  81. @ Halogetter – thank you for your thoughts and kindness to respond in detail. I’m trying to reason through some of the tougher puzzling statements in TTOTC and came to the same conclusion about the ball of string and proper sequence necessary. The jury is still out for me on ‘do not touch/penalty of death.’ Both are extreme. Can’t decide if they are overstated to call attention to facts or red herrings. Enjoy the weekend.

  82. It seems I remember when FF had his art business, he wanted people to touch and hold his articles, in fact he had signs that said something like please touch, but yet he says about the poem, “Don’t touch my Poem”. Somehow that just don’t sound like FF. Ya think in fact, he wants us to rearrange or change the poem.?

    • Your sharp sharps burg. I like your simple straight forward interpretation. I’m going with it and moving on to the next knot. Thx

    • IMO…The reason he said that is to extract coordinates. Evey letter/ word has to “add” up….that’s why after you find,”BEGIN”, the next line you “add”just heavy loads…..for a reason…..IMO of course. Not rearrange or change, just “ad just”.

  83. Just a thought…
    When forrest said he got the email where folks got the first two clues but went right past the other seven; it’s a pretty general statement just like the original 500 ft note. Maybe it’s something we are ALL READY doing?

    • Yes!! I have been waiting anxiously to redeem myself for that debacle of an ornament i made that looked like christmas time in mordor..Thanks for the oppurtunity Jenny and Forrest!….jc117, its on!!!! πŸ˜€

      • Hello, Fins Up. Is that a triple dog dare? πŸ™‚ Your comment about “its on” reminds me of the Alicia Keys video “It’s On Again” (Oooh! La La!) that somebody posted over on…where I’m currently banned/blocked from posting for some reason. I guess it must have been something I said…or my Chromebook is screwy. I’m sure it’s one or the other. I wouldn’t be surprised if I was banned. There seems to be a lot of that going around. I think Mike might have been mad that I wished him a happy birthday a day or two late.

        • Triple dog daring going on? Now I would hate to miss seeing a triple dog dare!

          JC, I suspect whatever thread you were replying to at Mikes was too large to function anymore. Sorry Dal and everyone….

    • Amy, You still got a arrowhead from Forrest, Yes? I did, I Love it so much, its a very sweet one!

  84. LouLee

    Why sure it’s a very nice one. It’s in safe keeping πŸ™‚ I consider it a treasure.

    My egg will be …. Not sure lol
    I will try to put something together because it’s fun πŸ™‚

  85. Can’t get this song outta my head!

    Willie Nelson – On The Road Again – YouTube

    • I just went to see Willie’s son, Luca in concert. He was so good! I could hear Willy in him. I heard him do the “Tea Pot Party Anthem”. That was the only song that I heard Willy also do. Luca had his own great songs. I Love Willy too! Forrest likes him too!

  86. Amy – my treasure song is the 70’s song FRee Ride… The lyrics just seem to fit πŸ˜‰


    The mountain is high, the valley is low
    And you’re confused ’bout which way to go
    So I flew here to give you a hand
    And lead you into the promised land
    So, come on and take a free ride (free ride)
    Come on and take it by my side
    Come on and take a free ride
    All over the country, I’m seeing the same
    Nobody’s winning, at this kind of game
    We gotta do better, it’s time to begin
    You know all the answers
    Must come from within
    So, come on and take a free ride (free ride)
    Come on and take it by my side
    Come on and take a free ride
    Yeah, yeah, yeah
    [Instrumental Interlude]

    • That’s a great song, Sherri. Did you know that Edgar Winter, who wrote that song, was born with albinism. His brother, Johnny Winter, who is also a musician, was also born albino. They had to go to special education classes as children back in the late 40s and 50s. Apparently, they were TOO white to be with the other white kids. They took segregation very seriously back then. (LOL! That’s a joke, people…and sort of a sad critique on the way things “used to be”…?)

      I think Edgar Winter would have made a great Gandalf the White…aka Gandalf Winter. πŸ™‚

      • Interesting my coworker just went to see Ed last Friday in Boston she was very excited since with all the snow there is not much else to do… She was is also a big fan……

        • I have a picture of me with Johnny. And a signed picture and poster. I was sad, when he passed away last year. RIP Johnny Winters.

  87. Sherri love it πŸ™‚
    Our graduation song was Free Bird by lynard skynard πŸ™‚

    I think my Thrill of a chase song is “Thriller by The one and only Michael Jackson. πŸ™‚ lol ha ha

  88. Ha! Awesome Amy πŸ™‚ … u prob thought that was from left field… i thought you posted the willie nelson song… but it was gdiggins… I’m a dork πŸ™‚ But I bet you now have my song stuck in your head… πŸ™‚

  89. Sherri, now THAT is a great song! Gonna stick:)
    Amy, we went c shopping at the c stores on the road searching for some CA DC, but we ended up with Cheryl Crow so “Every Day is A Winding Road”! πŸ™‚

    • Jd
      Yes everyday it is a winding road. But my road is looking pretty straight πŸ™‚

  90. Jd
    Lol I was wondering ha
    AC/DC aren’t they on some highway going somewhere. ? πŸ™‚

  91. The friend and coworker I wrote about in the Deadwood Incident died Monday, March 16th 2015, three months shy of his retirement. He was an old school trapper, and a true mountain man through and through. I learned a great deal from him, and his death reminds me of Forrest’s words of wisdom, and The Thrill of The Chase. I will miss him greatly…and although the world knows not of his passing, we are all a little worse off because of it. Rest in Peace Bruce Connolly. Thank you for the wisdom you shared with me, and the memories that live on.

    • Sorry Michael, I’m sure he’s resting peacefully knowing that your still here sharing those memories. Thank you for that.

    • Michael D. So sorry for the loss of your friend. The loss of a friend carries a deep sadness within the soul that is different from loosing a relative. Most of us know your pain and share in your sorrow.

  92. Hey Forrest, I am watching Suzan Summers! I have never watched dancing with the star’s. Wow this is OK. I could never move like that in heels!

    • Lou Lee, I am watching it tonight with my wife. We love to dance with low heels.

  93. Sorry for your loss Michael…
    My daughter who is 18 and lives with her mother came by for a visit today to tell me the high school’s last day was moved forward to the 27th of May… her Graduation is now the 23d of May, and I will have to skip the Fennboree… No necklace πŸ™ internal tears… and perhaps scars?
    Even worse… following her visit, several in-laws and relatives showed up for some sort of intervention… Worth the cold wasn’t the word for it. I was told there was not a snowballs chance in … … that I would ever find a box that prob didn’t exist??? Fighting words!
    Needless to say however, I shook my head up and down to re-assure them that they were correct… but inside… I was wondering how to get back to NM?
    I guess the only thing that matters is my wife supports me and the Chase!

    On another note: Mrs. Summers was awesome!
    Mark H.

    • Unfortunately, I missed the first part of Dancing with the Stars… got preoccupied discussibg weekend plans with my daughter and did not change the channel. But I did place all my votes and yeah!!! Suzanne and Tony made it!!!

  94. Here’s one of my FAVORITE artists and a very special song with special meaning to me, I dedicate it to my late older brother who passed one year ago:

    Joe Walsh – Rocky Mountain Way – YouTube

      • Thank you, Dave. My condolences to you, as well. I’m not sure which is worse; sudden and unexpected, or enduring and inevitable. I’ve lost close family members in both ways, and neither is easy. The best thing to do is be happy for them for they are now at peace. We need not sorrow ourselves with regret, rather joy in the memories. πŸ™‚

    • Jd

      Sorry to hear that about your brother.:(

      Good song I like Joe Walsh also πŸ™‚

  95. I like to hear the locust in the summer:)

    Don’t u hate it when a June Bug lands on you πŸ™‚

  96. I hear frogs as well… lol.
    My kids explained to me today how frogs have been around longer than the dinosaurs, and that the word frog comes from the Greek word that means two lives. Perhaps it’s because they live on both land and water? Frogs are wonderful Jumpers… up to ten times their body size. Too, some bigger frogs have been said to eat mice and rats… even bats… I hope none of those cute Brown bats? In Northern NM, some frogs were observed as becoming extinct… Prob due things like the Moly folks turning the Red River Blue… Not my favorite peoples!
    Somewhere, I had written about passing thru and leaving SF NM headed towards Espanola, (285 N I think) and saw on the highway underpasses depicted in mosaic tiles, some of NM’s State critters… they are awesome… One looked just like the frog on f’s jars.
    Mark H.

  97. Ms. Wiles is cooperative, I only hope Mr. Circum and his buddy Stance haven’t changed the locks on me! Otherwise, back to plan A..

      • Mr, Circum said Ms. Wiles is busy with the youngins, so we can only walk through right now and that’s too far to walk. But meeting Stance today for further recon. Looks like it’s just not time yet. πŸ™‚

  98. For those of you who read my blog, please know that I am NOT trying to cast doubt on Forrest or the treasure, but simply encouraging us to weigh words carefully with our eyes open πŸ™‚

    • Wow….it must be tiring for FF to constantly see every little phrase / colloquialism put on trial by searchers.

      Once upon a time, I worked under a chain of command. When we wanted to say something off-color or flat out disrespectful then we would just precede the statement with a the disclaimer “With all due respect…” When the boss started to turn red with anger we would quickly remind him that our insults were protected speech under the “Geneva Convention” or some such nonsense. It was all a big joke because we were close friends and relied on each other at the end of the day.

      After reading your post, Mindy, I can say that “With all due respect…” does not play well on a blog. IMO, of course.

        • I don’t think you said anything that hasn’t already crossed the minds of many other searchers… In the end you still believe that’s what is important imho:)

        • Great! Then no need to write two disclaimers or the statement: “I hope he (FF) isn’t offended when and if he reads this.”

          • Austin, I don’t think he would be offended at a searcher exploring all the possibilities. He did say to use our imagination and logic.. that is all Mindy is doing… again imho…

          • Thank you, Amy and Spallies. However, it is my belief that if I can avoid even appearing disrespectful even though no disrespect was intended, I should take down the post, which I have.
            The title was “Causing controversy and I don’t care,” but I guess I do care.
            The post may have not portrayed what I was thinking in the best way. I think I can do it in a way that won’t be misunderstood.

      • Mindy
        There is nothing to change it was a good write up

        I never stopped believing πŸ™‚

    • Mindy I can make a good circumstantial case either way; for the chest really existing or for it not existing. That’s decisions each person has to make; is the chest really there and is it worth the time, effort, and money it will take to find it.

      You seem to be going thru the doubting stage most searchers experience after the chest is not where you thought it should be. This is where many give up saying the chest doesn’t exist because after much research and ingenious insights they had the perfect solution. It’s easier to doubt the existence of the chest than our abilities to find it after our beautiful solution is shattered on the rocks of reality. I think it happens to most searchers.

      If one is looking for the chest as a business investment it’s probably a bad idea. Dal is going to have to find the chest pretty soon to break even. πŸ™‚ The day I quit having fun is the day I quit the chase.

      For me the chase is an extension of what I would be doing anyway; looking for the perfect landscape picture. I can’t tell you the number of times I’ve waded through miles of stagnant, stinking water in a slot canyon chasing the light or nearly froze to death camping overnight to catch the shot of a mountain reflection in a lake with the glow of morning light and a fresh blanket of pristine snow in the foreground. I’ve made a few bucks from my pictures, but I’m going to have to sell a lot of pictures just to break even on the camera equipment I’ve purchased over the years. It really isn’t about the picture; it’s about being where I love to be. If the chest was anywhere but the Rockies I would care less about finding it. It’s certainly not worth enough to get me on the east coast for example.

  99. Is anyone else, totally up to their ears in maps and books etc? I am! I get frustrated too when I get so close to having that one spot. Than I spend another 10 hours on it, to find, it just wont work!
    Still this hunt takes me away from other problems in life. Not all of us had or have a great life like Forrest has!
    Still I have learned so much for this and from him.
    Many of us have lost loved one’s. Personally I am still damaged from the loss of my child years ago. My 9 year old son. The Loss of my parents, and the challenges I have taken on taking care of my Handicapped twin sister.
    I had big plans for the rest of my life, but that all changed. Now I don’t mess around dreaming of endless days camping and looking for the Pirate booty. I have to be all so responsible all the time again.
    I have to stay focused, so when I do get out. And I plan too! I will go right to it!
    Be kind to one another. We are in this together! Many of us are Broken. In one way or another.

    Best Wishes, Lou Lee, Chased by Bears and it was kinda fun.

    • Lou Lee,
      I can’t even begin to imagine the loss of a child, so my heart goes out to you. And I’m definitely in agreement with you about plans and life being put on hold or changed due to caretaking responsibilities. It is a very heavy load. I’m a single mom with three kids, and am taking care of my mom who is terminally ill.

      Sometimes it feels like the load is too heavy, but at the same time, you don’t dare try to lighten the load for fear of regretting that you didn’t do enough.

      I’m praying for you…and those are not empty words…:)

      • Wow three kids. I took care of my terminal mom too, till she passed. She was 86. just a couple years ago. Thank you so much, Mindy.
        Taking care of your family is so important. At home if at all possible. I know so many chasers that want to go hunting, but can’t because they are care giving. I am trying to make arrangements so I can go…
        Love the Thrill.

    • Lou about those maps. I have friends that use paper fold up topos. I’ve found one online map particularly useful, Caltopo, Google it. I think maps figure heavily in the chase. Any shortcut a map helps you find is worth it. Save time driving instead of walking. Good luck to ya!

  100. Lou Lee, Thanks for sharing! I know we all have things in our lives that we wish we could change. I wish you well in your search and may God Bless you for taking care of you sister. I too find a certain pleasure out of reading the blogs and forgetting about my problems. I try not to complain because I see so many people around me that have it worse. Yes Forrest seems to have had a good life but I bet that there are things that he wishes he had not have to go though as well. Being shot down, his early years starting the business probably took a toll on him and his family, and the problems with the Feds about illegal collection of artifacts.
    I have been blessed with 4 healthy children and I can’t help but to feel sorry for anyone that would have deal with a loss of a child. My prayers are with you.

  101. Lou Lee,

    I am sorry for your loss. I move in scattered directions as well with my loss. Staying focused is key until the end. Peace

    Indian Scout and a Saint.

    • I believe, when I am feeling good, that if you want something enough…its yours. Only one Chest…..I do believe. Lots of other treasures out there along the way.

  102. Hmmm,
    Alicia keys.
    Being banned from another site.
    Willie Nelson.
    Some smiling faces.
    Willie’s son in concert.
    Freeride…with lyrics.
    Edger Winters.
    Johnny Winters.
    More Ac/Dc.
    led Zepplin.
    Joe Walsh.
    A Cricket Chirping.
    The Oak Ridge boys.

    Could someone be kind enough to point me to the 9 clues thread?! Apparently I’m lost.

  103. Thank You so much! No Obsessed. Its hard to watch people we Love grow old. I feel bad for forrest too. I know it was not easy for him. He suffered too! Seems like his life came all together for him. He is so strong. Forrest is a big inspiration to me and so many, to survive cancer, like he has. Wow he is so amazing!
    I think we are all Unique to eachother here on the Chase. Its so powerful!
    Live forever!

  104. I am trying to find where f said something like: If he forgot the location he wrote it in such and such a way, or he was concerned he might forget? I have search dal’s site and google but must be phrasing it incorrectly.

    • Check in the Forrest gets crazy mail scrapbooks… He alludes to losing his memory in his response.

      • Thank you all for suggestions where I might find f talking about the possibility that he might forget where he hid it. Maybe my memory is playing tricks. SB 124 might be what I am recalling.

        • Uken I recall it as well but can’t remember where it was either… It was something like “I put it on a scrap of paper but I can’t remember where I put the scrap of paper at”???

          • Thanks Spallies.
            I have searched a good while now and will stop. The reason I am looking for it is because, as I recall…, he mentioned/discussed he wrote the poem or such.

        • I think this is what you are looking for…


          I hid the treasure chest at the first onset of dementia. I knew I had a disease so I made myself a note that revealed the exact location because I wanted later on to give some additional clues. Now I don’t remember where I put the note. Maybe if I search my fishing box I can find what it is that I was looking for. But why would I want to fish in this weather? I’ll go ask my wife Phyllis where my tool kit is.

          • Thanks JCM. I believe this is the one I was looking for. While I was searching a came across this one:

            “All that I could remember was that I was not supposed to forget something.”

  105. Everyday…..UKEN, I say…..What is he going to say next? Or in 10 years from now? LOL

    • Yeah he has been pretty quiet lately… Wonder what he has been up to working on his book? I am sure it will be just as amazing and as well written as his other books… only even better πŸ™‚

      • I think after the pinyon nut debacle f decided to sit quietly on the sidelines and watch for a while.

        Or less likely: someone is sending him info and nailing the spot so he is just going to bide his time until it is picked up this spring.

        • Thanks JCM for locating that for us. It was driving me crazy trying to remember where I saw it. If someone is close and sent him the details then I guess he would know if they nailed it… So maybe that is why he is keeping quiet until they actually go out out and find it. Imho

        • Mmmmm, not SO less likely, wood eye have to say. I told him April I would return, as it was frozen in 2 feet of Fish tails. Rainbows ,I believe.
          And I’m not talking $#;+ !!!!

    • At least seeing Suzanne is a sure bet if you buy tickets! Can’t say the the same for searching for the chest! Good Luck Romona

  106. Lou lee, I agree with you that some of us are broken, that’s how we ended up here! Truth is… it has been a place of rejuvenation for me, and I’m grateful! Sorry for your loss!

    I will say too, that I’m here for the treasures. The education, the comradely, and the landscapes are bonus! I will never surrender, and I will put every extra minute of every day into TTOTC, that until the box is found…it’s a race of tenacity and longevity. Also, I agree about staying focused so I’ll throw out an idea.
    Flexible means having flexibility in creating solves??? There are so many good ideas here, that we should listen to others ideas… if those ideas somehow fit our scattered thoughts we should somehow categorize them…. ex. I have named my solves or gave them a title… Here’s one of them for your amusement. “Put that Cross Back !” Every time someone talks about this solve I give their ideas the once over… if I like it I add it to the solves structure. That’s it… flexibility.

    • Have something similar Fenn, titled “other peoples ideas”. Could probibly write a book on just that. Little section in my notes. Ive incorporated a few ideas that seemed to workout. I think that is a smart thing to do. Alot of smart people on this blog, and it’s not hard to understand that no one person solves this thing on there own. Maybe put it together, but not solve.

  107. This might not be the right place for this post, but, in regards to some of the pictures and photoshopping, I believe anything he has done on purpose needs to be at least looked at. The pictures I believe are just fun, but some do hold “HINTS”. Example, the boys playing marbles. That can be photoshopped to show many things: A boxer with his hands up knocking someone out, “blaze”, A person on the ground lifting a big rock with something underneath, etc… Was thinking about the one with the guy lifting a rock and looking underneath. Alot of people, I’m sure, believe Forrest rode a horse to thee spot. It could be possible that the chest could be in a shallow hole underneath a very big rock. A rock he tied to his horse and lifted, then inserted chest underneath. Could be.
    The thing is, a person would not be able to move the rock, thus, nobody will happen upon the chest. Now, this may be a stretch but possible. You may have the spot and not know it because of a huge rock, or tree, or something is too heavy for a person. Something to remember when out looking:)

  108. Charlie

    Thanks πŸ™‚ I will remember hope nobody sees me throwing my back out πŸ™‚ lol ha

    • @Amy, hope it’s not right, because if so, you may need your hubby and a friend. Possibly big rock that two men would have trouble with. Good Luck…

    • Here is something I had worked on in the past… I never looked into it that much, though. Maybe of interest.

      Just south of Elizabethtown, NM there is a creek called Willow creek. I found that one of the first placer gold mines on the creek was a group of people and one of them was named Brown. When they found gold, it was too close to the winter to stay there so they marked a tree and headed back to the fort. They named that tree the Discovery Tree.

      I don’t remember where I found all this information… it was a long time ago. I think I stopped looking there because I couldn’t determine if this area was private property or not.

      Maybe it’ll help someone.

          • Glad to help. Like I said, I don’t know if it’s private property or not so you’ll have to look into it some more.
            I think my line of thinking was Agua Fria Peak(cold water) and Angel Fire at the southern end of the Moreno Valley could be where warm waters halt. Then the canyon down was down Moreno Valley…

            Happy hunting… and if you find the chest, flip a coin this way. Lol. Happy hunting

        • Tim, I call this solve “Gold, Gold and more gold.” the problem is the next move… Please post more as you go… I’m right there with ya… If I find you post something new, I’ll let you know. And If you get to my spot… well then I’ll have already been! Smiling
          I have another solve here that I call “My Grail Quest,” my, mine, it’s my quest. Ha!

          And hey Charlie, I agree there are some very smart people here. But IMO listening is advantageous to TTOTC. And Charlie my solves are original solves… they are mine,,, my solves! πŸ™‚
          Mark H.

          • I know that they did hydraulic mining here… particularly in humbug gulch, which is just north of willow creek. Hydraulic mining used high pressure water nozzles to wash down the dirt and rock into sluce boxes. Is this “heavy loads and water high”?

            Just throwing it out there. I’ve not gone out to search the area because I can’t nail it down but there’s a lot of things that could line up with the poem.

          • That’s good Fenn,(urrr, Mark) I only have one solve, the right one:). Kidding of course. (Dang, now I sound like Robert Durst). This chase is turning me insane.

  109. left and a right,
    new and old in tight,
    Trips times two,
    Horse shoes too,
    Peace and brave,
    I’ve been up to late,
    I’m seeing double,
    Oh I’m so in trouble.

  110. Heard a song this morning
    Anyone remember the ” outlaw”
    Johnny Paycheck the song I heard was “Outlaw Prayer”, Some outlaws just say exactly what they feel.
    It will make you think how some are. πŸ™‚

  111. Musstag<
    A few of my ideas…Water High=Watter(electricity) High.
    High transmission towers….or Enemy (N.M.E.) Lines.
    "No Paddle Up Your Creek" ? = No Oar (Ore) Up Your Creek.
    Meaning… After you find the home of Brown (adobe), you will turn off the Rio since there is no gold any further upstream.

  112. I agree that there is a good foundation to work with here, but No, I don’t think that’s it there, but (and IDK) the lynches did make the Big Ditch work! I’m think n a bit east but can’t say? I think your warm, but who knows.

    • This was part of my first solve. I have moved on to another spot but I never ruled this one out. Just wanted to throw this out there in case it helps someone out. I’ve not considered anywhere east of the Moreno Valley…. but I might now. Lol

  113. Today I am having a great day. I am sure everyone has one too. Anyway, has anyone solved the poem?

  114. When I emailed Mr Fenn with info regarding the poem, I received no response. A personal email gets a direct response. “Good Luck”. I could use it, in more ways than one. My dear wife surviving her cancer and medical complications means more to me than anything else. I may concede that circumstances beyond my control will negate my efforts to find the solution. That is all I want at this point. The solution to the poem. Treasure is where you find it. I will always love the man and the poem. Good luck to you all.

      • Thank you Amy. Thank you JD. At this point, if I happened upon the treasure by coincidence (unlikely) I would stare at the dull gold and say, “Yes, but what is the solution?”. You may not get what you think you want, but I believe you will get what you need. I can say without reservation that this is the strangest life I have ever lived. Again, I love the man for what he has done, leaving the world in a better condition than he found it. I hope to do the same in my own way. I will “Put in below the home of Brown”.

    • Thank God we all have the Poem to keep us hoping, wishing and thinking about fun things to do. Love to you and your family. May forrest bless you with a special clue. Forrest? God bless.

  115. This chase is no place for the meek, Forrest likes daring searchers, so I’m going with bold:

    Dear Forrest, has anyone mailed you a map showing the land where the treasure resides because they have solved enough of the poem to draw an accurate map?

    At one time you stated you would retrieve the treasure if someone knew its location but could not retrieve it. Will you still honor that?

    • Let me rephrase: a map where the treasure chest resides, the one photographed in your memoirs.

  116. “Springs some of which have precisely the taste of soda water when taken up and drank immediately others have a sour, sulperous taste: none of them have any outlet but boil and bubble in small holes a few inches from the surface of the ground” from Journal of a trapper

    Collecting soda caps ….. subtle hints…..

    Whatca think?

    • bold
      (of a person, action, or idea) showing an ability to take risks; confident and courageous.
      “a bold attempt to solve the crisis”
      synonyms: daring, intrepid, brave, courageous, valiant, valorous, fearless, dauntless, audacious, daredevil; More
      antonyms: timid, unadventurous
      (of a person or manner) so confident as to suggest a lack of shame or modesty.
      “she tossed him a bold look”
      synonyms: impudent, insolent, impertinent, brazen, brash, disrespectful, presumptuous, forward; More
      (of a color or design) having a strong or vivid appearance.
      “a coat with bold polka dots”
      synonyms: striking, vivid, bright, strong, eye-catching, prominent, impactful; More

      I think the second the definition is more fitting.

  117. OFF TOPIC
    Back on October 14th we reached 3 million hits on this blog…
    Today (March 26th) we have over 4,300,000. Wowie Zowie…That was quick!!!

    21,000 hits yesterday …where did all those viewers come from?

  118. This post is now closed to new comments but you can still read all the old comments from this NINE CLUES page and all the others…

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