Fundamental Guidelines……


UPDATED JUNE 26th 2017

By Forrest


The treasure has been hidden in the mountains for more than 6 years now and I think as many as 250,000 may have gone searching for it. Two have lost their lives in that process, and I can’t help but think those losses could have been prevented.

We know that the chest is not hidden in a dangerous place, nevertheless people are putting themselves at peril by not paying attention to some common sense rules. It is time for everyone to come forward and make suggestions that will keep us safer.

When searching please don’t get target fixation or become obsessed with your solve to the point where you ignore these fundamental guidelines:

  • If you can’t make two trips from your car to your solve in several hours, then don’t go.
  • Don’t search anywhere an 80 year old man could not carry a heavy backpack.
  • The treasure is hidden more than 8.25 miles north of the northern limits of Santa Fe, New Mexico.
  • The treasure is very definitely in the Rocky Mountains.
  • Never search alone or when nighttime temperatures are low or when there is snow on the ground.
  • Carry some kind of device that will make your location known at all times.
  • If you are going into rough country it is probably best to leave your pets at home.
  • A whistle can be handy if you get separated from your partner.
  • It is always a good idea to wear a personal flotation device (PFD) when you enter fast moving water. even if you are a strong swimmer.




264 thoughts on “Fundamental Guidelines……

    • I didn’t even know who Forrest Fenn was until a week ago. I heard about it all on the news about the third death of someone looking for his treasure. No one should even consider trying to place blame on Mr. Fenn. You go hunting treasure in rugged country and you take your chances. After reading about this endeavor on the internet for the past week now I must say there is no way in hell I would go out and look. I am also retired air force and am sitting here with one foot in the grave and the other still takes me places I shouldn’t go. I read where some searchers have apparently been within a few hundred feet of the treasure and didn’t find it. If I was younger and in good health I believe I would be looking along the Rio Vallecitos river in New Mexico.

      • we dont know what they say is true he might of mentioned the treasure but he was playing when this event happened dont be brave to the point of stupidy remember its in a safe place thoughts to their loved ones if i go having fun thats the way i want it to be

    • I am excited to begin my quest for the treasure for the very first time. I appreciate your sensible warnings and guidelines for search. Forrester Fenn wouldn’t intentionally try to harm anyone on purpose and this is an exciting adventure. Be safe all!

    • Dale, thank you for your posting to keep people safe.
      Can I go trekking with you?
      I’m alone in the hunt

    • I’m new to the hunt. Just started the second read on the first book, TTOTC…..this time around, I’m dissecting the entire book. It’s a very time-consuming process too. I’m an avid reader like Forrest. My collection is now over 2,500 books, and I don’t dally with any type fiction. If I can’t learn from it, I don’t want it. I spend many hours lately solving logic puzzles. Those with the grids. A bad back injury which paralyzed me for 4 months last year has left me with ample time to delve into these puzzles deeper than before. Then, this treasure hunt suddenly appeared in a web search one day recently. SO, I’m going to take a very slow and detailed look into it.
      My question for you guys please. Didn’t Forrest say somewhere to “marry the book to the poem?” Please help me find the accurate statement on that please. Many thanks to everyone and good fortune to all. Love, Lynn

      • Welcome aboard Lynn;

        Have FUN!!!

        Here is the quote you wanted:
        1Q) Even today, after more than six years of people searching, and after all the news coverage, articles, and stories written about your secreted treasure, some people are just learning about your Thrill of the Chase treasure hunt and getting involved. It continues to inspire. Do you have any advice for these new people? How should they begin the search six years after so many others? Do you feel they are at any disadvantage?
        No, fresh eyes and new thinking might provoke a winning idea. I would advise new searchers to look for the clues in my poem and try to marry them to a place on a map. It seems like the longer one thinks about the search the more they complicate the problem.

        Marry clues in the poem to a place on a map – NOT “marry the book to the poem?”

        Also look at Q6 here:
        Hope this is what you wanted – JDA

  1. Great information and sensible guidelines, Forrest. Let’s all stay safe and give our loved ones some peace of mind!

    • I live in wild Idaho and can’t tell you how many people get lost out here and nobody knows where they were going other than a vague, general area that encompasses hundreds of square miles. Be smart and follow the basic safety rules. Someone trustworthy should know where you are going, route you plan to take and planned return time. If any of this changes you update your contact person. That way if you get into trouble they know which search and rescue agency to contact and where to send them. Keeping your search area secret and even the treasure itself isn’t worth your life.

  2. Great guidelines, Mr. Fenn! Thank you. I think you’ve been saying this all along…perhaps we will listen well.

    • These guidlines helped my solve immensly it all seems so simple when you consider his guidelines poem and history….I may be wrong as countless others have been but I think outside the box…..if I find the Indulgence I will only keep so many articles and give Fenn back some that he wants and donate a couple to chairty..then I will re hide the box…….but I will write a book about the solve the cipher and the way I was able to think differently and use technology….so hopefully someone else may discover it minus alot of items hahahha….as I have stated this is only my opinion and conjecture but I feel my plan to get to the chest will lead me in the footsteps of Forrest and I thank Dal for this website which has gvin me great resources of information….Bless ups to all Good luck in your chases….youll always find a thrill….

      • Chad,
        Really doesn’t matter for me. I was asking for those who think it’s in NM.
        My solve is way up in the Madison’s.
        Location, location, location.

        • its in NM imo. he was not able to fly at 80 and it was a place he could get to if he lost hope of recovery from cancer.

          • So you’re saying he would not be able to hide the chest any other place but NM because he couldn’t fly.
            The man still had a drivers license….

          • kingoffoxz,

            You are correct, Mr. Fenn sold his airplane around 2003 and to most searchers understanding he did not purchase another one. That doesn’t mean he didn’t fly with someone else.

            But, more importantly and for you own benefit, the better part in me must reveal that Mr. Fenn has stated that at the age of 76 he was still driving himself to Yellowstone about 4 times a year. It was only 3 years later that he hid the treasure. So based on that knowledge I wouldn’t rule out any of the 4 states.

          • Hi king,
            I’m a NM searcher as welll. I’d love to be on the YNP bandwagon but I just can’t get past a couple things. In TFTW preface xiii, Fenn is talking about how he misses the Madison and says “I promised myself Ithat someday I would make the trip again. That day never came for me, and my disappointment still casts a shadow across the Madison River”. There is also his interview last May when he said (paraphrasing) that people look in YNP because he used to visit there as a kid, but he hasn’t been there in about 20 years. Some ignore these statements and try to find reasons why he “didn’t really mean that” because they are dead set on making the poem fit their solve.

          • Kbrock: you claim Forrest hasn’t been to YNP “in about 20 years.” This is refuted by Forrest.

            but he hasn’t been there in about 20 years.

    • Good advice Forrest,

      Your experience as a fighter pilot being shot down as related in TTOTC and on this blog illustrate what a good backup plan can accomplish.

      Plan, prepare, search.

    • this clue would only work if fenn was driving from santa fe
      as a starting point he stated that he did it in one afternoon
      meaning he loaded it in the car or backpack or?then drove
      to the parking spot walked down a canyon went off trail
      deposited the chest took in the breathtaking scenery and walked out all in one afternoon he never said where he started
      from im wondering if he actually said more than 8.25 miles north of santa fe if he did then people looking in colorado or wyoming or montana would not fit at all even if he flew a plane he would not be able to accomplish this if the clue is sound then there must ba an accessible canyon north of santa fe that is near and dear to fenns heart that touches his spirit in a dramatic way enough so that his desire would be to be buried there i know that someone translated his cipher if it is accurate.also after cancer mabey he was searching his soul and that would make a case for montana or wyoming however we do not know where he drove from that day if we did at least it would narrow the search down.

      • jimbo – All the evidence that I’ve found points to MT as being the state where Indulgence is now patiently resting. The evidence even allowed me to see where the sedan was parked when f started walking. I must say this is my opinion but I have confidence.

        • i understand that if it makes sense to you then you need to follow through
          however why would fenn talk about the chest being more than 8.25 miles north of santa fe my question is where does he reside?a man who is getting over cancer would want to be close to home?anyway fenn said if you have the correct starting point then the poem will lead to the chest if the above clue has any meaning than his home base is santa fe it would be able to be done in one afternoon however he quit flying a long time ago so how would he get to montana could be he was already there?rented a car?but the chest would have been kept in a safe place like his home in a safe or?id like to hear more about your conviction on the montana site sounds like a mystery//jimbo

          • jimbo – F was diagnosed with cancer in 1988. He didn’t hide the treasure chest till sometime in 2009 or 2010. He recovered well before he hid the chest. We also know that he continued to take trips to WY and MT at least until about 2-3 years ago. One of his scrapbook’s is about a jar that he wanted to bury near Hebgen Lake. That was about 2-3 years ago without going back to that SB. Also the poem is precise enough that it shows exactly where to start. TTOTC contains some nice hints about the first clue and also about other clues. They won’t make any sense if you haven’t figured out the clues.

            I think f made the statement about 66,000 links north of Santa Fe, for two reasons. The first one I’m not willing to discuss at this time. The second reason is because f needed a reason to nudge people to quit searching near Santa Fe where it is not. I will say that this is IMO because I don’t have solid proof, just confidence.

            If you have TTOTC and TFTW, there is a common theme about his youth. Spending time in WY and MT. F has written about Yellowstone and MT numerous times in his books, his other stories, talked about those areas in videos, and so on. I realize that some searchers don’t think he would dare tell us about the general area where he hid the chest but that is in fact what he has done. I must say IMO so I don’t get bombed by others that have a different viewpoint.

          • HMA;

            You were careful to cover your butt with IMO’s, but don’t you think that you are stretching it a bit when you state as fact,
            ” Also the poem is precise enough that it shows exactly where to start. TTOTC contains some nice hints about the first clue and also about other clues. They won’t make any sense if you haven’t figured out the clues. ”

            I agree with you, IMO, the poem is precise enough that it shows exactly where to start.” I disagree with you as far as the rest of your quote, “TTOTC contains some nice hints about the first clue”. A bit of a stretch for me, and my solve. I am just throwing this out there, so that some poor nubie doesn’t take all that you say as fact – there are those of us with differing views. Just my opinion – JDA

          • JDA –

            “TTOTC contains some nice hints about the first clue”. said by me.

            ” A bit of a stretch for me, and my solve. I am just throwing this out there, so that some poor nubie doesn’t take all that you say as fact – there are those of us with differing views.”

            If you don’t find some very nice hints about “your” first clue, you might want to reconsider. Surely you aren’t going to hold me accountable for what f has done. He’s the one that wrote the book and he’s the one that got D’s and F’s in school. IMO, there are some very nice hints scattered throughout the book as well as other writings to support clue #1 as well as other clues. You have to remember that f learned to tell the truth but he can also s-t-r-e-t-c-h the truth as well. When f said the hints are sprinkled in the book, he didn’t mention that the book is overflowing with hints. This is IMO because you might still disagree.

            I also believe that the ending is precise enough that it won’t take 10 or 11 trips to figure it out IMO. IMO I feel like the end is precise enough that you can’t possibly miss the chest because f has been that precise with the ending as well.

          • HMA;

            I wish you well and good fortune when you do go out and search.

            Maybe I am a slow learner, and that is why it has taken me ten trips so far.

            Four months were wasted looking IN my water-way. My bad. Now I think
            that I know EXACTLY where to look – but I could be wrong, just as you can. JDA

          • JDA – I wish you well on your journey. Are you counting down the days? Many parts of the Rockies are covered in deep snow and it might 3-5 months before it melts depending upon the weather. Maybe the area you like to search will prove to be more welcoming weather wise.

          • hi hear me all i understand why you are looking in madison very isolated
            clue in the ttotc book question does his new book have any subtle clues?
            also what do you think about his comment about the chest being wet?
            thanks //jimbo

          • jimbo –

            “hi hear me all i understand why you are looking in madison very isolated
            clue in the ttotc book question does his new book have any subtle clues?
            also what do you think about his comment about the chest being wet?”

            I can see quite a few good hints in TFTW. None of them will make sense unless you can figure out any of the clues in the poem.

            As to the comment about the treasure chest being wet, f has explained that two times. One time he said that physics tells him that it’s wet. Another time he said, “how can anything in the Rocky Mountains not be wet.” That is not the exact quote but pretty close. Seeker or Loco might have that close by.

          • I won’t state what state I believe, but there is no evidence Forrest started from his home in Santa Fe. He could have removed Bronze Beauty, put it in the trunk, drove to a hotel in one of the other states, got up the next morning, drove to the parking lot, following the clues, removed the treasure and spent the afternoon transferring the treasure between the car and the hiding spot. There is no requirement Bronze Beauty was transferred directly from the safe .. it could have been kept in the trunk of the sedan for several days as he drove toward Canada on a mini vacation ..


          • Wow….
            Some people can’t see Forest for the trees.
            Just finished the book and enjoyed it. My friend is obsessed with it to the point of being blind to the simple clues. And not really knowing FF. Funny.
            Gave my friend y option as to the state it’s in. Reading this website confirms it according to FF.
            Don’t I feel fuzzy. But still far from the pot of gold.

      • Remember that we do not know where Forest actually started his afternoon trip from ???? He could have driven to the Yellowstone area and started the day trip from there for example…..

    • Good question, simpler use what your fenn forrest said lines that cross, as I always wonder how he knows that the treasure is still in place, if it is a place you can go with your children and your family, to walk , If a child of 10 or 12 years can solve this, it is a sign that the treasure is easily accessible, some details make it difficult for everyone to see it, for example the bronze mixes with dark stones and wood, of course you will never Will strike at him if he is under wood or one placed in a crevice in a pile of rock, his fenn piece said that no one will stun on her by chance

      • I think when Forest mentioned that it might be easier for a child to search for and find the chest…. that Forest was giving a nod to his own childhood…. that he means a nod to when he was a child spending every summer in the Yellowstone area….. and that Forest most likely discovered this special hiding place when he was a child !!! Remember that Forest also stated that a person could ride a bike to where the chest is at …. how would he know this ??? I think because Forest once rode his bike to this spot …. Remember he rode his bike to his favorite bathing place (Firehole) ….. heavy loads can make reference to the heavy load on a fly fishing rod ….. water high can make reference to deeper water along a river while fly fishing…… the end is drawing nigh can make reference to the left ….. nigh also means left side ….. a river that turns toward the left ….???? Forest also mentions numerous spots he and his dad fished alone ….. one of those spots could easily be his special hiding place …. think like a child would think ….. where his childhood memories are ??? What meant the most to him growing up ….

    • I seriously doubt it’s between Santa Fe and Espanola but there is a slim chance it is, since Tesuque, both the village and the reservation are ..therefore I would use the city limits effective 2010 ..

      B ..

    • Btw – from the corner of Guadalupe/St. Francis – the Hwy 84 north out of SF right next to the National Cemetery – to the turn off into Tesuque Pueblo. Not Tesuque Village, at TP 811 is 8.25 miles .. and since that is south of White Rock, where Randy was too far out of bounds, I would say it is impossible for Bronze Beauty to be anywhere south of Tesuque Pueblo and probably not south of Artery Cafe and Banana Ln. Which is just south of Firefly and Buffalo Thunder ..

      .2 Cents ..

      B ..

    • If you go 8.25 miles from the city center square ZX you land almost directly on the Northern City limit line. But the chest is more like 900 miles North of Santa Fe.

      • 900 miles north of Santa Fe is in Saskatchewan, so I take it you don’t mean due north, and you probably don’t mean as the crow flies either.

        • Zaph, ur right, FORREST, on Dal’s Fundamental
          6/26/17,, stated
          this is clearly defined by the
          E-W lat. line along the top or most norhern city limits of that small narrow extension of land
          running north towards
          Then u need to look no farther south than 8.25 miles north of this defined line of latitude.

      • My guess is the vast majority of searchers do not have any idea where the official city center square is, nor where the official Northern City Limits are, especially since the “populated mass” travels well beyond the official city limits; However, as the Great Thunderbird Flies, 8.25 Miles North of the Plaza Trail Marker in the Park across the street immediately south of the Palace of the Governors puts you at the Northern Border of Tesuque Pueblo – an easily identified marker for people who have never been to Santa Fe .. therefore, logic dictates, (without trying to figure out the exact 8.25 start line) Bronze Beauty is not anywhere South of Tesuque Pueblo, which means Bronze Beauty is not anywhere south of 35 Degrees 48 Minutes 7.2 seconds North Latitude, which, roughly, is at or very near 8.20 Miles north of the Palace .. However, as Forrest mentioned Randy was not far enough North, and at a time when all we knew was the location of his car, my guess is Bronze Beauty is not anywhere South of Cayamungue, which is another 4 or 5 miles north of Tesuque Pueblo ..

        • THE NORTHERN CITY LIMIT LINE, OF THAT SMALL, narrow N. EXTENSION is quite clearly desesminated if
          you have the right map

      • 8.25 miles north of the Northern City Limits also puts you just south of Cayamungue ..

  3. Very good common sense advice Forrest.
    I just hope that people will take it.

    There is an old saying ” People are more apt to follow good advice as long as it doesn’t interfere with their plans”

    Please people…..listen up!
    Be safe out there!


  4. Checked the city limit map of Santa Fe (city, not county). 8.25 miles is roughly at N 35° 52′ 15″
    If I am correct, the chest should be approximately anywhere north of Cuyamungue, NM in the Rockies…

    • Hi guys and gals,
      Good thoughts on safe searching. Not trying to tweak feathers, would like to
      add a carry along item that works for me, but maybe not for everbody. With over 40 yrs tromping /fishing the
      SAN JUAN wilderness in
      CO. and the wildernesses
      in the WINDS in WY.,, I always
      “pack” 22s on up.
      good noise makers, good for emg. food gathering, and of course protection…. not from
      4 legged critters, but in great while, have run across, back deep in. some very very very
      ruffian types. Not had to pull,
      but I am certain the visual
      presence deterred.
      ALSO, being guardian to
      two autistic but capable boys, and wife (d).,,, I have used the
      noise to get the attention of a pair of wild dogs, that shouting at had no effect on
      their advancement.

  5. Thank you Forrest!

    My 3 dogs will definitely be staying at home.

    My 2 Beagles like to chase everything that moves, and the Collie follows right behind them giving all the encouragement he can muster.

  6. Forrest,

    It is unfortunate that you must repeat yourself again and again with these common sense notions.


  7. Thanks Forrest. Good advice for those that need to be reminded. Also, it wouldn’t hurt to wear a life jacket when navigating water, and beware of the dangers of waders.

  8. Thanks Forrest for rehashing those guidelines to the treasure hunt hopefully they’ll keep from what ever happened to Randy from happening again to another one of us treasure hunters. But if something was to happen theres still alot of us that will come to there rescue.

  9. Thanks for saying again, what you have expressed so freely before. PLEASE all, do not be blinded by your quest. STAY SAFE Thanks again Mr. Fenn

  10. maybe it’s time to throw in the towel… heck I’ve been studying every conceivable resource these last 3 years, then I find out little girls in India have no trouble figuring out the 1st two clues.

  11. Dear Mr Fenn i drive hubby nuts with safety sometimes but he goes along with the safety rules and comes up with a few himself. we always tell family where we are, we check in every day with someone, we tell the people where we are staying where we are going and when to call if we are not back, we leave info on our dash in clear view or at least where it can be found. thank you for the careful reminders and will do our part to stay as safe as we can. thanks for challenging us to enjoy the outdoors and your little box

  12. I recommend a spot GPS for anyone searching alone. I’m sorry I could not help in the search for the missing individual but I am deployed for 3 weeks.

  13. Speaking of pets, 🙂 Forrest will u rub the scent of the treasure chest on a handkerchief and send it to me. 🙂 lol. Maybe my dog can help me. 🙂 ha ha ha

    Thanks for the advice some of your main points will not work for my solve. 🙁

  14. Thank you Forrest for the warning once again. I hope you don’t mind if I add a few thoughts from my experience in the wilderness. I believe you should learn your area so you don’t get lost. Buy some trail tape or mark your path so you can return to your transportation. Always go in a little ways and back out again then go in further and back out again until you know your path. Even if your driving off road stay right or stay left until you know the area.

    I also believe we need bright colors of clothing so if your devices fail for some reason you can be spotted from the air find a clearing. Always carry a knife and fire starter of some sorts and a safety blanket. Carry water or liquid and enough trail mix or food for more then three days. Granola bars or compact food supplies serve well for this purpose.

    Carry a candle it can save your life. If your lost stay put sit down collect your thoughts. Panic will set in I know this from my experience of being lost in the Northwest. I can see in Colorado my home state and travel the woods with ease. I thought I could travel in the Northwest the same but it was not so

    I didn’t think I could get lost but I did. By doing exactly what I mentioned here I found my way back to my path and out again by remembering things I noted when I went in to that wilderness. The NW is so fertile with over burden brush and trees its easy to loose your direction. I went in to a panic mode. Its a scary feeling. My heart started beating faster then then a train on steroids.

    But if you sit down and relax and think of where you are and know you can survive with your supplies . You will then need to start thinking about how to be spotted from the air with a fire or SOS made with stones or sticks and finding shelter and water and food. Try to carry a whistle and a compass being prepared for any situation. Carry needle and thread to mend a wound any thing that you can carry to make you at ease if the situation of being lost should arrive.

    I take my dog every where with me because he is my mountain dog. We live in the mountains but I have left him home when it is to dangerous.This is good advice. Titan will sit down and not continue with me if its to tough on his pads. He is smart but I worry about snakes bears and cougars but they will run from Titan to a point.

    I can call him off and that’s a good thing. He was chasing a bear is our yard a few months back When I called him of he gave up the chase but that bear kept going full speed ahead. I’m not sure a cougar or snake would do the same.

    Always take notes in your mind as to land markers such a trees power lines boulders that are around you. Anything you can remember or hear such as the water to help aid in the direction or your path.

    Most of all sit down and collect your thoughts and remain calm if your lost. This alone can save your life. Try to stay where you are when your lost. You should never get lost if you have marked your path.

    Or if you listen to Forrest Fenn Your not going to have to travel Forrest words that we should all Listen to.

    If you can’t make two trips from your car to your solve in several hours, then don’t go

    If you should get lost make a shelter and stay put. Try to find something bright to make your shelter spot-able from the ground or air..

    Always let some one know when you are going and coming back as to a time line and area you are traveling in.make it clear that person if you have not contacted them in this time frame that they call for help the sooner the better. Every minute counts.

    I still remain Positive as to Randy being alive. We know he always had a back pack. I assume he has supplies that can keep him alive if he did not get injured or if he is sheltered up it is possible to survive. Many men and women have survived this weather if he has the means to create fire and hunt for food.

    Maybe it might be wise to fly over the area at night to see if a fire can be spotted.His time may have passed but the hope is still alive until we know for sure the out come of where Randy is we must remain positive with our actions.

    Thank you Forrest for creating this page My heart is heavy as to your feelings about all this and to everyone’s feelings involved. Our only intention is to help in any way we can. To all be prepared and safe in your journeys when traveling anywhere you go in life. Some may say this is to much

    I believe one must be prepared. What do you think? Jeff Burch & Ranee. I found my better half She is a god sent angel that has been helping me so much with my healing process. I cant say enough to thank her for her help and love and of coarse my loving boy Titan. He sends you all a bark of love.

    Have a great life light everyone I hope all these words are OK with you Forrest may your mind be lifted and the weight of all of this pass either in spirit or Body the answer will be found. When this time arrives you will know this is not of your fault. We are in control of our paths and actions.

    Please let this weight be lifted off of your spirit mind and body. Forrest You are a jewel and a treasure for sharing this path, opportunity and gift from yourself to humanity.

    The Thrill Of The Chase has brought great joy to many lives with a book of creative stories. I know this from my life experience and the joy of learning and exploring the great beauty of all of this. I love this world and all it has to offer. I chose to follow a few foot steps and this adventure.Its a part of my life now because I am me and anything I do is my choice. I think Randy will or would say the same words. Thank you Forrest Fenn

    • Jeff, Thanks for the great suggestions. I’ll add a candle to my emergency supplies in my day-pack.

  15. My disability makes me a good judge of how far an 80 year old man could have gone with a forty pound pack. Sometimes I bring along my 80 something year old mother. She grew up in north western Montana, and gives me a pretty good idea of what somebody from West Yellowstone would be up for. Hopping boulders and climbing is definately out. Usually it is from the car and then along a trail, or in a field with a slight slope.
    I think Forrest gave us a slight hint in his guidlines:
    “If you can’t make two trips from your car to your solve in several hours, then don’t go.”
    …time: several hours

    • Bringing along an older person is an excellent idea. When a bear shows up you’ll need someone to out run. 😉

  16. Forrest forgot to mention: When searching Colorado, always remember that the reefers / bong hits are for *AFTER* finding the treasure, not before or during.

  17. Definitions… Several hours (meaning two, but not many more than two)
    Do not search a location where Mr. Fenn could not go back to remove the chest at 85… though still pretty spry!
    The treasure is definitely in the Rocky Mountains, not literally!!!
    Above all else, if Mr. Fenn would not take Teseque there, don’t take your pet there. Probably best to stay at home and play Canasta, where it is warm.

    Not making jokes or trying to sound like I know it all, but we all know we don’t, and did not need what is still in continuance with Randy’s disappearance!

    Best Wishes and Good Luck to all, stay safe out there and search wisely!!!


  18. Thank you Forrest and friends. My husband and I have hand held Garmin that are fabulous in the wilderness and we have used them on our trip so we won’t get lost and we would have a couple of times had we not of had them. 1 is a Garmin Rino 660 and the other is a Garmin Rino 655t. They are fabulous! They are a little pricey, but we’ll worth it. Please look into getting one. And learn how to use it before you go out. B safe my friends .

    • Carolyn you touched on a very important point when you said; “And learn how to use it before you go out.”

      I can’t tell you how many times I’ve run into folks that had the equipment they needed but zero experience using or testing it so they couldn’t get it to work. How to use emergency equipment should take no thought at all and be second nature to you before going out in the wilderness. That takes practice……..If Mother Nature gives you the lesson it probably won’t be pleasant. She’s beautiful, but she’s a firm believer in natural selection; survival of the fittest. And she gives no thought at all to being “fair”.

      • Fair comes once a year with rides and corn dogs. You might throw up, but you’ll live.

        Mother Nature is her own wild ride. She will eat you and your pet for lunch if you don’t heed her warnings and follow her rules.

        Glad to see the warnings living large Forrest. Saddens me that legal speak and disclaimers have become necessary due current greedvents.

      • You got that right Goofy; you have to be prepared. You have to show Mother Nature respect in order to be safe.

  19. Forrest, just curious how’s the fishing where the chest is hidden and would I need a Montana fishing license or Colorado? J/k

    • @Cholly, “Forrest, just curious how’s the fishing where the chest is hidden and would I need a Montana fishing license or Colorado? J/k”

      Golly, that’s funny!

    • hello Cholly, hunch here…believe me the fishing is great not far from where the chest mentioned in the poem is. but dont get a fishing license poaching is a much better way to go. as long as you catch and release. you see, the fish are internet savvy and as soon as you buy a license they (the fish) know who you are and what you plan to do. when you get to your fishing spot rabbits read your cars license plate number and relay the information to the fish who, then refuse to bite. i prefer a sneak attack. i have a fake license plate for my truck that the rabbits read as a fish and wildlife department worker doing head counts of the trout population. works every time. dont tell anyone Cholly, keep this under your hat. i dont wade either, prefer to keep my feet warm on solid ground.

  20. In bear country travel in groups of at least three people. While seriously not recommended to go alone, at least carry an emergency locator.

  21. Great guidelines Forrest and everyone. I promise to follow them all. It’s sad that they actually have to be said though. As I recently was trying to figure out how I’m going to get to my search area and back this summer, it occurred to me that I really only have to find a way there. Because when I find the treasure chest, there won’t be a shortage of people wanting to pick me up. Family, friends, strangers, etc. Not trying to make light of the guidelines. Safety is very important. Don’t be so fixated or obsessed with the target that you or I go off with any half baked plans. Be safe out there.

  22. Great words to do chasing by!

    I’ll reiterate what has already been said – let others know where you’ll be and when to expect you to make contact once you are out of the wilderness. Keep your appointment so they do not initiate a search unnecessarily.

    Be prepared.

  23. I know others have commented on this before, but I prefer PLBs (personal locator beacon) over other devices. These devices are only used in the case of emergency. They are small, portable and float in water. They work on the SARSAT satellite network that can reach even the most remote places on the planet. There is no monthly fee as with other devices, only the cost of purchase. They only need to be registered with the NOAA (National Oceanic and Atmosphere Admin.) Satellite and Information Service every 2 years (free to minimal fee). Unused, the batteries generally last 5-7 years and can be replaced by sending the device into a service center.

    At the press of a single button, the network will attempt to contact the 3-4 preexisting emergency contacts, and search and rescue if needed with your location. They have been proven to have saved many lives over the years. Please be safe out there!

  24. Forrest, Thanks for these guidelines. You have given us lots of safety suggestions since this Chase began – thanks for taking good care of us.

  25. sound advice Mr. Fenn, tyvm, i about got in a jam searching last month….wont go searching in winter again

  26. Forrest Fenn has said numerous times that the treasure chest is NOT in a dangerous location.

    A good question to ask yourself would be: is my selected spot a place I would be afraid to take young children? If the answer is yes, then that spot almost certainly is NOT where the treasure chest is at.

  27. Forrest, great advice! As you know there is so much speculative information on the blogs and such that can lead a person into danger. One of those pieces of information is whether WWWH is a dam or not. You’ve been quoted in many blogs as having said, “WWWH is not a dam”, yet I haven’t found a single interview or post from you that confirms it. Question? Could you please confirm this or could anyone else on this blog at least post a link to the actual interview that proves these are Forrest’s actual words.

      • Thanks Goofy! I have read most of them, however when I asked Dal the question he couldn’t tell me either, so I guess we all forget what we read. I do appreciate the information. After a few misguided searches I am taking a step back and looking at all of my information to separate the huge amount of speculation on the internet from what Forrest has actually said himself. This is the last piece of information I needed to confirm.

        • You are welcome Jeff………I wholeheartedly agree with your approach to the chase. Look at what Fenn has actually said in context and as a whole. But if you haven’t read all the scrapbooks you may have left out a critical piece of information that would further confirm or disprove your current line of thinking……Just my opinion.

        • Hey Jeff,

          Yep don’t take anothers’ post as factual. We all attempt to give correct information, however over the years some [ my self guilty at times ] use only parts or slightly different, to get our points across in our post.

          Some folks have been at this from the start, others jumped in when the media picked it up, and even now a lot are still just finding out or getting interested. For those folks… you can be at a disadvantage, as most have read all the information available as it happened. Yet at the same time folks new don’t have to wait years for that information, But there is a heck of a lot of catching up too do.

          My only advice is not to rush through all that information… check and double check… even some of the most senior of searcher still do. So you’re really in the same boat as most of us. No need to rush, is my best advice.

          Oh right! ask a lot of questions, Loco loves that…

          • Thanks Seeker. That is exactly why I’ve taken a step back. I’ve made several trips from Kentucky to go there and it is expensive. I do not want to waist any more time or money looking in areas that are based on speculation. That is why I’m taking that step back to separate speculation from Forrest given information. I will not return for another search unless my search area correlates to Forrest’s , and only Forrest’s, clues and information.

          • I can see an advantage to coming in late in the game seeker. There’s been said by Forrest, and more discussions between searchers, and lots more info available on these sites…it can be said that they were most helpful in my solve which has only taken a little over a week.

          • Debbie send Dal your solution, go get the chest, or quit bragging………You betcha, solved it in a week. You obviously don’t know how many hundreds of times we’ve heard the same thing. It really gets old.

          • Goofy, I just don’t get why this hasn’t been solved sooner. And I won’t be going to get the chest. But I will be telling where I think it is. Just trying to think of the best way to do that. And I figure the best way to decide that it is to maintain a connection with the search here, and it is sort of a normal human thing to comment when you are on a comment board (about whatever you happen to be thinking about.)
            Sorry if that offends you.

          • It’s the same old story Debbie. You geniuses can’t understand why us dummies that have been working on this for years haven’t solved the poem like you have. It’s so easy.

            Send it in to Dal and you will have your very own page to talk about it all you want, create your own website to proclaim to the world how smart you are, but don’t bother us telling us how smart you are and how dumb we are. Time to put up or shut up.

          • I didn’t say you were dumb, Goofy, did I? I can’t help how you take it. I’m just still perplexed why some puzzler hasn’t solved this. It is all in the poem.

      • Quick question: Do all reservoirs have a dam, technically? Or only some?

        Warm waters could flow into a reservoir and essentially, halt.

        • Tommy,

          IMO not all reservoirs have a dam, some I believe are natural. The one example I looked up is Lake Superior, which empties into another lake via St Mary’s River and as far as I can tell there’s no dam involved. Hope that helps.

        • There is a Quake Lake (officially Earthquake Lake) on the Madison River near Yellowstone that was created by a landslide in 1959 that occurred during a major earthquake. The “dam” consists of the landslide materials — a spillway was made for water to flow past the obstruction. I have a vague recollection that Forrest’s mother was involved in helping rescue people there after the earthquake, but suggest you double check this — or maybe someone else can chime in. This lake is near Hebgen Lake and Hebgen Dam (manmade).

          • That’s been a popular search area for awhile Dave. Especially so since Fenn said “most of the places” in the poem existed when he was a kid.

          • Question: the lake was formed naturally by a chain of events that was natural so would this still be consider a dam? Levy?

          • Will,

            Just a thought.. a dam is a structure. whether by human hand or even animal such as a beaver. If a tree falls across a stream [ cause by wind or another natural event ] and blocks the flow of water… is it a dam? If a beaver deliberately makes that tree fall into place because of it’s natural instincts to create a blockage… is that a dam?

            If humans place materials to stop the flow of water… is that a dam? If a natural event cause materials to stop the flow of water… Is that a dam?

            For me… a dam has an intentional cause by the building of a blockage for the purpose of stopping the flow.

        • hello Tommy, hunch here. sometime you should make the trip to the Buffalo Bill reservoir west of Cody. there you will find on display a huge wood clad concrete ball that was once used to halt the flow of warmed water just as you describe. it may just be the place to begin. but, usually im wrong.

  28. So Northern city limits huh? Id like to ask exactly where this is. Also, wouldn’t this change over time? In 100 or 1000 years this could grow exponentially.

    I just ask for clarity……..

    • Clint someone posted the coordinates the other day but I don’t remember what they were. There’s a couple ways to look at your question. One is it doesn’t matter; for example, the chest is in Yellowstone and it doesn’t matter where the city limits of Santa Fe are.

      The other is; if looking in 100 years the searcher would have to look back historically to see where the city limits were when he said that.

      • Very true. Now here is the important question……is north due north? Or anything north of (city limit coordinates here) north. Example: I walk 8.25 miles West from the Northern city limits and take one step north…… I north 8.25 miles?

        • No I don’t think so Clint. He said it was 8.25 miles north. He also clarified what he considered north; which is north of that latitude.

          • LOL!! I see how you guys are, stomp on ol’ loco and then you want help!! 🙂

            Goofy, not sure if I have it saved….will have to look.

            But, basically he said North is anything of an due East/West line (90-270 degrees) and, I think, Dal may have posted it, as something he had queried Fenn on.

            That is what I have always looked at… that East/West line. If your 10 miles West of Santa Fe, you still must go 8.25 North……And, if 10 years from now the Northern city limits has moved North 5 miles, you would still have to go North from there 8.25 miles.

            I think ol’ Fenn factored that into hos 8.25 mile comment…, what does that tell you???? 🙂 🙂

          • OK, MISTER Goofy,


            Dal on September 20, 2015 at 5:49 pm said:

            After I wrote that Forrest told me that he considers everything between 271 and 89 degrees to be north…

            That’s the entire top half of the compass…

            I wrote that up somewhere..maybe as a comment on this post..
            Anyway..that shoots my idea of north all to heck..or at least what a pilot would consider north…

            As dal indicates, I seem to remember he posted earlier, somewhere else. But this suffice for me!

            **AND, let me tell you mister, I don’t appreciate being put on the spot by a whippersnapper, such as yourself!!!!! 🙂

            LOL!!! Are havin’ fun yet????? 🙂 🙂 Good Luck to ya Goofy!!

          • Thank you very much Mr. Loco……I knew you would find it. I’m like you, it seems to me it was mentioned some place else also, but I can’t be sure about that.

            Thanks again, you’re a good guy; I don’t care what Seeker says about you. 🙂

          • Loco,

            I don’t know if people don’t understand me or if they think I’m crazy.

            I don’t want ya to think I’m crazy.. I am.. I just don’t want ya to think it.

            I just left a similar post on another thread… I would like your opinion on how crazy it sounds to you… man am i leaving myself wide open.

            How important is “down” in the poem… In attempting to understand why fenn chose poetry as the avenue to present this challenge, A thought comes to mind on how to read this poem as it was intended, as poetry.

            “Begin it where warms water halt And take it in the canyon down”
            Seems simple enough as directions right? lets add the factor of poetry to this, and the challenge to know what a clue actually is and what it means.

            Poetic version; with a touch of Multiple Meanings:
            Begin seems to indicate waters. The IT being the waters. halt meaning: stop, change in direction, and I’ll add a change all together; meaning to change something or stopping something from being what it is, in this case the canyon.

            So the poetic version [ interpretation ] of these lines may say… “Begin where waters are… changing “And” taking… the canyon down.”

            Explanation; We needed to understand what IT is. We needed to understand what Halt means. We needed to hear and listen with a poetic ear to interpret “a poem” We needed to find a connection to read a poem to understand what the clues mean and refer to in the physical places.
            This leaves NFBTFTW in reference to the above as the distance of the waters travels and of time… and the reason for past tense to present tense changes in poem.

            Leaving now, ” Put in below the home of Brown ” which could be stating All the previous lines in stanza 2 are already below = put in, hoB. Now this could give the impression from a poetic reading, to understand how the clues work a contiguous fashion without changing the intended order or taking what could be a clue out of order. Which in this poetic reading of the clues could be understood as “home” of Brown being clue # 1. The ignored first clue. The clue not “dwelled” on enough. The most important clue to have or might as well stay “home”. The important possibility. Or could the important possibility be we don’t read with a poetic ear?

            Well, there ya go… I thrown in the kitchen sink for ya… have at that crazy mess.

            Oh right, IMO, just food for thought… yada yada yada

      • LOL!! Seeker, I KNOW you and I are crazy……question is, have we driven Dal & Goofy crazy yet??? 🙂 🙂

        I see your post and am pondering it…..I’ll try to give reply tonight or tomorrow, maybe.


        • nope, made the post above to Seeker & it showed in mod. Then I made the post to you guys and double checked everything before hit enter. The query to ya’ll also went to mod…….who knows?? GREMLINS!!!! 🙂

        • Seeker & loco, nurse Ratchett checking in here…I thought i heard goofy toss dal the Tylenol. You two aren’t crazy, just wayyyyy toooo smart for me.

    • correction: about 5:30 into for the difFennition of North….also, keep in mind the only reason ff ever said any distance at all was so folks would not be digging up his back yard….there’s been other clues like 50 miles out his way, 90 miles north, came out 50 miles from where we started, and others….I don’t pay much attention to 8.25 equation….IMO

      • Cholly-
        Forrest actually told us the chest is at least 8.25 miles north of Santa Fe…
        That is a clue written to us in a comment on Richard Saunier’s Mountain Walk Blog.

        Forrest Fenn: Land Surveyor

        His exact comment is below:


        “Since Richard mentioned the olden days lets harken to 1620 when universal land measures first became law in England and America. As you rode your horse into town you had to pass 80 telephone poles in order to reach a mile because they were 1 chain apart, or 66 feet. And each chain had 100 links, if
        you wanted to break it down further. Road rights-of-way also were 1 chain wide. And 80 square chains made a square mile, or 640 acres – and that was 1 section of land.

        But if you’d rather count fence posts you had to pass 320 in order to reach a mile because they were a rod apart, or 16.5 feet. And since everyone knew that an acre was 10 square chains (43,560 square feet) it was easy to tell how many acres were in your neighbor’s farm.

        Some aspects of those measures are still in use today in the horse racing business because a furlong is 10 chains in length, or 660 feet. You should feel smarter now because that’s so easy.

        If you want to apply those important figures into the thrill of the chase I will give you an additional clue. The Treasure chest full of gold and precious jewels is more than 66,000 links north of Santa Fe.”

        To get from 66,00 links to 8.25 miles is just a bit of math..Try it for yourself..

        • Thanks Dal, I know this, have seen the conversion in your other post, but, I’ve heard or read where he stated why he said that, “the only reason he said that was, so people wouldn’t be digging or looking in his yard’ (paraphrase)….My point is, I don’t put any stock in the distance of 8.25 north of Santa Fe… to be a little bit further than that! IMO

          • The distance may not be important as much as the method Cholly. The thing about this comment is, is wasn’t provoke by an interview, a Q&A etc. I don’t know if there is anything here… but I wouldn’t dismiss it all together.
            Just a suggestion.

        • The comment by ff on Sanier’s blog is an interesting lesson in surveying terms but also funny (to me).

          If we harken to the year 1620, there were no telephone poles. Telephones were not invented until 1876.

          • Hey Anna,

            This is a perfect example of misreading or understanding something fenn says. IMO.
            He starts out by telling of a universal usage of measurement of land [1620]. Then jumps to a time were he explains different mode of calculating, in reference to the law set in 1620. However he simply didn’t tell the readers of this jump… we were expected to understand or expected to figure it out.

            Also what is not explain, even though the calculations of measuring an acre is correct, doesn’t explain shape of the land. Is this important to know to the conversation of measurement, No. But it is something we should either know or figure out. This is the way the poem reads as well ~ imo. Just enough information required for the reader to understand IF read correctly.

            Which brings me back to a theory that, when reading stanza 2 and keeping the clues in order that Fenn wanted them to be [ not the way we read them ] The first three in line or first sentence explains something… while the last line or sentence may refer to the previous sentence to be, All below hoB or all put in, enter in, placed below, south of, down from, over yonder, a country mile away…

            Are we reading the poem / clues correctly? Is it possible the First clue is HOB?
            and we begin below that, to located WWWH. Is this the reason why some have indicated the first clue but didn’t understand the significance of where they were. Or even the ‘important possibility’, ‘ignore’ the first clue, without the ‘first clue’ you might as well stay ‘home’, don’t ‘dwell’ on the first clue, Some are in tight focus of a word that is key ~ ‘below’

            Just Rambling n Rumbling……….

          • Thanks for rambling Seeker – that made sense on several layers. Tel lines were buried in some areas quite early. My tummy is rumbling; time for a cup of joe and a bit of Madison River/Cameron map work. Hope you njoy your day;-)

    • Is there video of FF talking about the blaze possibly being white, on horse…, etc? First time I’ve heard those comments.

    • getting wrapped around the “north” axle again eh?

      Perhaps a pilot’s perspective. A “notherly bearing” is what f described to the interviewer that seemed to be getting on f’s nerves a bit (“is that a wrap?”)…..271° to 89° magnetic north. This is ~261° to 79° “true” north due to magnetic north “appearing” 10° east of “true” near Santa Fe (it’s different in different places). And magnetic north is moving; some very old runways no longer “point” the compass direction that is painted on the ends of the runway. Note the Santa Fe runway is oriented ~30° true, but has a “2” painted on the south end (the 0 is omitted by convention).

      “north of”, geographically rather than navigationally, means restricted to latitude, or “due true north”

      please do not let this discourage any NM devotees 😉

      • hmmm, I suppose the

        “north of” geographically

        comment warrants an IMO. All maps I’ve seen, including aeronautical charts use geographic north. The “restricted to latitude” is my common sense interpretation, thus IMO.

        over. out.

  29. I’m not sure where to post this, so I’m hoping this is a good place.

    Does anyone know what type of plane Forrest owned while in Santa Fe?

    I have a sneeky suspicion he may have flown his plane to hide the treasure, if he in fact still owned/flew that plane during that time period (2010ish).

    I found a site to search historical flight records, but it apparently does not include smaller aircraft such as a Cessna 172, 182, etc….

    • Tommy-
      This point has been raised before on the blog. Yes, we know what kind of plane Forrest had. There is even a scrapbook on this blog that shows it and him flying it. He sold the plane long before he hid the chest and he gave up piloting before he hid the chest.

      • Thanks, Dal! I’m glad I didn’t spin my wheels trying to find that one out. 🙂

        Dal and/or JD, I wonder if the airport(s) would have a record of him having rented a plane during that period….

      • Since the topic of flight came up I think there’s an interesting reference to it on page 15 of TTOTC. Definitely disputable as to what Forrest is talking about but interesting at least. I’m using it in my overall realm of possibilities. Thought some might enjoy.

        • Interesting. Almost sounds like the “arrive at same place and know it for the 1st time” quote/reference…

  30. I believe that Forrest flies (or six years ago flew) to many locations in the Rocky Mountains on business, and for fishing excursions or vacations as well. Just because he no longer flew himself does not mean that he could not have flown into a place like Jackson Hole, WY, rented a car and drove to wherever he chose.
    Drove back to Jackson, went to a business meeting, and then flew back to SF.
    all my opinion of course…Pure conjecture on my part.

  31. My apologies if this is common knowledge or previously posted: In the latest news article regarding the treasure, IMO, Forrest has given a large clue. It might not seem like much, but this really solidifies for me the physical effort and/or distance required or lack of to reach the hiding location from your car/vehicle…

    “Have you been back to the site since hiding the chest?
    No, but I could go if I wanted to, even at 85.”

    • Whut-
      1. Forrest said numerous times in interviews and elsewhere that the chest is hidden at least 8.2 miles north of Santa Fe.
      2. There is nothing south of Santa Fe that is considered by the USGS to be in the Rocky Mountains. The southern most point of the Rocky Mountains is defined by the USGS as the Jemez Mountains, which are to the west of Santa Fe.
      3. Forrest published a map and told us that the chest is located somewhere on the map. The map does not include areas south of Santa Fe.

      So…I think it’s clear that Forrest has indicated over and over that the chest is north of Santa Fe.

  32. just to explain–the poem itself doesn’t say anything about it being north of SF. I saw the Forrest interview and this hint somehow seemed designed to throw us off the scent.

    • Forrest gave out the clue that it was in the Rocky Mountains after the book and poem were published as an “additional clue”. There have been many “additional clues”. You should do some serious research before you spend any money looking for the treasure. Start by reading Goofy’s “Cheat Sheet”. The link to the cheat sheet can be found at the top of this page.

  33. Dal, I may be mistaken, but I thought somewhere it was stated that Forrest made two trips from his car to the hiding spot, but I can’t find it in my notes. I’m questioning this because Tommy V posted a link to an interview with Forrest by People .com on Feb 10, 2016. I copied and pasted this question and Forrest’s answer. I’ll paste it here : “Who else knows where the treasure is buried?
    I never said it was buried. I’ve avoided that word. I hid it. I don’t mean to imply that it isn’t buried. I just didn’t want to give that as a clue. It took me two trips in my car to hide the treasure. And I can tell you an 80-year-old man is not going to make a trip into a canyon, then come up and go down again. As for who else knows, I’m the only one. My wife doesn’t know.” My question is in his answer Forrest states “It took me two trips in my car to hide the treasure.” NOT two trips from my car. If the latter is the case, I’m puzzled by why it took two trips in a car. Can you help clear up my muddy thinking on this please.


    • “And I can tell you an 80-year-old man is not going to make a trip into a canyon, then come up and go down again.”
      I think this following sentence clarifies it satisfactorally. I don’t think he’s concerned about a drive

  34. Here is a failed solve to save everyone the trouble of repeating it. South of Ouray, CO is an area known as the Ironton Flats along US Hwy. 550 between Silverton and Ouray just north and down from the summit of Red Mtn. Pass. There is a large mine tailings pond there built by the Idarado Mining Co. It’s almost like a dam, but isn’t really a dam, just a lot of big boulders backing up mine tailings, but of course there is some water in it and it is all mildly radioactive, thus warm waters halt. Immediately north of the tailings pond one is at the base of Brown Mtn., a long mountain ridge terminating at the north end in Abrams Peak. Needless to say it’s all in a wide canyon of sorts and at the end (north) of the Ironton Flats the canyon drops almost precipitously into a narrow canyon with the highway high above. The typical tourist driving this could easily characterize it as a ‘white knuckle’ drive on the steering wheel. Anyway back at the Ironton Flats which is named after a mining ghost town located just south of the tailings pond you will find it to be a large flat swampy area rimmed with abandoned mine entrances on both sides, west and east. I have searched every mine entrance I could find, both visually and on topo maps, but no treasure chest in any of them. At the north end of the flats was at one time a mine smelter from the Saratoga Mine, but it or a subsequent structure located there burned down in I think the 1940’s. One could imagine a blaze in the mind’s eye, but no chest hiding place below the former structure. One of the canyon/ravines to the east coming down the side of Brown Mtn. is called Avarado Gulch which is a derivation on the name Alvarado. The coat of arms for Alvarado has a gold blazoned shield, but again this is a blaze only in the mind’s eye and no mine entrance below with a chest. The opposite side, west, of the Ironton Flats is a mountain side which in the autumn can be an enormous blaze of Aspen gold, but the mine entrances below are without a chest.
    Something about this solve that hooked my imagination is that the Ironton Flats is actually a huge iron fenn surrounded by mountain forests. Mr. Fenn, to the best of my knowledge has never said exactly what all the 9 clues are. It occurred to me that with this particular solve the author’s name could easily have been one of the 9 clues. I live in Durango about 60 miles south so this area is practically my backyard, metaphorically speaking, and something I have come to appreciate is that even with 9 clues there are, to use a math term, many permutations possible all over the West. It’s possible I missed a mine entrance so this solve cannot be 100% dismissed, but it’s probably not the solution.
    Another idea I kicked around in my mind is that the Ouray hot springs municipal swimming pool could easily be a warm waters halt and going north down the canyon out of town I found a reference to a Brown’s B&B, a house up on the east mountainside, but as I explored the area with Google Earth I just couldn’t find anything that could pass for a blaze or a mine entrance–this area is lower in altitude and the canyon is starting to open up into ranch land. The upper branches of the Uncompahgre River run through this canyon and in the Ute Indian language Uncompahgre roughly means warm waters. They were known to camp at the hot springs way back in the day. While the treasure may well be worth a lot of money there is no way that it compares to the treasure of living in the San Juan Mountains of this part of Colorado, arguably Colorado’s most beautiful mountain range. In your searches don’t lose sight of what the real treasure is all about.
    There is a beautiful little poem by Li Po, reputed by many to be China’s greatest poet back in the 8th century called the Ching Ting Mountain:
    Flocks of birds have flown high and away.
    A solitary drift of cloud too, has gone, wandering on.
    And I sit alone with the Ching Ting Peak, towering beyond.
    We never grow tired of each other, the mountain and I.

    • To save you some time in the future…I forget where, but Forrest has said that he did not hide/bury the treasure in a mine. He also has said that he had not been to Silverton before hiding Indulgence (someone had been looking at the Shrine of the Miner I believe). I do like your idea of Ironton none the less! The iron fenn idea is brilliant also – way to think outside the box. Rust stains on his pants is a major theme in TTOTC. I live in DGO as well… am looking in NM but I should never discount my back yard. Thanks for your solve.

      • And yes, the San Juan Mtns/Weminuche Wilderness are a treasure indeed. Big love for our amazing back yard here in SW Colorado. If FF didn’t hide the treasure in CO, he should have.

  35. Hello.
    I’m new to this hunt, but more importantly I’ve never hiked in a wilderness mountain range. I’m seeking advice from you experienced hikers.
    Do you use a walking stick of any kind?
    Do you wear clothing that’s water repellent?
    Should I have a concern with snakes?
    And also, what about predatory critters (bears and mountain lions), do you carry noise makers of any kind and use them as you walk or enter an area that they might be concealed? Guns?

    While I don’t expect to go more than 2-4 miles away from a car (as Forest has said he made 2 trips in an afternoon), any and all advice for a rookie mountaineer is greatly appreciated.

    • I wish someone would have responded to you. All great questions, that I myself would like the answers to as well.

      It seems like all the posts just came to a complete Dead End.

      I enjoyed reading everyone’s experience and their interpretations on the Poem and its clues.

      I would love to hike in the Ojo Caliente area, after seeing how beautiful the environment is, from my work desk.

      But with my first newborn on the way, I’ll wait for her to get here, and than plan a trip next Summer. But I would need to know the same answers you are seeking lol

      • I will answer yours and Buckeye Bob’s question the best that I can based on my own experiences.

        Yes, there are snakes, bears, wild cats and all sorts of other critters including the small critters like ticks, chiggers, mosquitos, biting ants etc. There are other non living hazards like the sun and snow in the higher elevations so here is a list of items that I have learned are essential. I carry these in a back pack.

        – First Aid kit with antibiotic ointment, bandages, tape and gauze, along with a good pain medicine like Aleve or Tylenol.
        – Sunscreen if you are prone to burning and a wide brimmed hat.
        – Insect repellent.
        – Bear spray
        – Flare gun with flares (Walmart carries them in sporting goods)
        – A air horn like used on a boat (Walmart also carries them in sporting goods)
        – A walking stick (good for pushing snakes aside as well as poking into holes before sticking your hand in them)
        – Water boots
        – Hand warmer and 2 pairs of gloves (regular and dish washing gloves for putting hands into water)
        – Bottled Water
        – Snack granola bars
        – 20 ft of nylon rope
        – A good sharp knife. A machete is good as well but please don’t use it to cut trails. Be respectful of the environment and don’t tear it up.
        – Any required medicines like inhaler(s), epi pen for allergic reactions, etc. Please keep in mind that the air gets thin in higher elevations and makes it harder to breath.
        – It’s also a good idea to wear a good hiking/work boot with slip resistant sole and steel toe. The streams in the mountain contain large rocks that can roll onto your toes.
        – I also carry a hand gun. I have a concealed carry permit from Kentucky which is recognized by the 4 states of interest.

        Also, keep in mind that my pack weighs a little over 20 lbs. if you find the treasure, that will add 40 + lbs. to your load. Be prepared to make two trips back to your car like FF had to do.

      • Also, I carry 3 other items that I feel are of great importance. A cell phone with a spare battery, a flashlight, and a portable radio with spare batteries to get weather reports. A butane lighter can come in handy as well when spending the night in the wilderness.

        • Check in on renting satellite phones, and tracking monitors as well… no need to buy… the rental is relative inexpensive. About the cost of lunch and calls are extra. One thing I always bring is a 9v battery and steel wool… store separately.
          And need it be said; give someone your plans…where you’ll be,for how long, and keep in contact w/information when possible.

          • 9clues.
            The 9. Volt battery will last. A small amount of steel wool is all that is needed for each time you start a fire.
            Note: it flames up quickly, so have dry grass and twigs at the ready with larger wood to add as the fire builds.

            The steel wool is very light to carry… a zip lock bag or small box full can make a few firer starters. All you need is a loosely amount the size of the palm of you hand for each time you want a fire.

            Note, do not store together. I suggest you try it at home in the yard… before doing it camping… so you know what to expect.

      • Actually, Brandon, a few people did in another blog post.
        I meant to copy their answers here for others, but I got sidetracked and now I’m not sure where to look. The comments under these blogs get pretty long.

        Congrats on the new little one coming. Kids are trying, and you get worn completely out sometimes, but you won’t find anything better in life than that.

    • IMO: If you are hiking for an afternoon, and plan to be no more than a few miles from your car, I would take a hiking pole (good for poking in dark corners and getting snakes out of the way) a flashlight, your cell phone if there is service in the area, a quart of water, a sandwich, a compass, a map, a rain jacket, and another layer in case the weather changes. Maybe a few bandaids and a bit of duct tape (I wrap duct tape around my lighter). If the weather looks like it is changing, turn around and go back to your car. Keep your pack light (remember, you plan to have it full of treasure on your return trip). You aren’t going to be climbing a mountain or descending into a steep canyon or going anywhere an 80 year old man wouldn’t be going. You are strolling, looking closely at your surroundings – not mountaineering. And last but not least, don’t forget to pack your common sense. Good luck!

    • oh yeah, and also;
      if it possesses sharper teeth, longer claws, a more venomous bite or wider gauge barrel than you ..then RUN!!


  36. Oh, one other item that I carry but forgot to mention is toilet paper. Depending on how long you’ll be out there, this comes in handy. Leaves start to scratch after a few trip to the air latrine.

    • For something like that the best option is to upload the image to an image hosting site like Photobucket, and then post the link here under a related topic or the Odds and Ends topic.

  37. The treasure is hidden more than 8.25 miles north of the northern limits of Santa Fe, New Mexico. Hmmm… surprised this was not “TORN” apart. Lets look at this (new), description of “Indulgence” location for a second. We all know the 66.000 links deal blah blah blah,,,8.25 miles math works that is cool, we get it. For the uninitiated and (sorry vets you know this), Santa Fe County and Santa Fe City is the same deal, you have both city limits and county limits both named Santa Fe… Did FF indicate which? I do not think so…also look at a map, “In My Opinion” (That was fun my first IMO, such a virgin), IMO and looking at any map, both Santa Fe County “limits” and Santa Fe city “limits” can BOTH be considered “IMO” (Northern)…

    So, for those searchers who were initially “Crushed” as I was “Temporarily” by this new description, Think about it again, I believe this is “FF” attempt at basically saying Hey folks, I am tired of wack-a-do’s showing up at my house thinking its buried (sorry, hide-in), near the ammo stage-coach deal in my front yard, or in my pond, or in a duck’s butt etc. etc..Do you blame him? Peggy is probably over it, 6 plus years by now. They probably can not even back out the new bullet without running into one of us.

    As we all know look up words, hint – Northern, draw a line dead center east to west 270-090 degrees, center post of : (IMO dead center Santa Fe is the plaza square/Palace of the Governors area, which IMO is the ground zero for this anything 8.25 miles north deal),,,Please someone correct me if I am wrong. IMO ANYTHING NORTH of this location is considered Northern limits, both in the city and county jurisdiction….Now if “FF” had said Northernmost limits key word “most” now that would have changed everything now wouldn’t it ?

    Please feel free to rip this theory apart…..I double dog dare you….. Wyoming, Colorado, Montana your safe…keep checking those class VI rapids and areas you will get arrested for picking up a 5 year old set of antlers…..and a pinecone..


    • C’mon Joad, I mean really………

      It sounds like you’ve made up your mind and nothing we say will change it……So good hunting to you.

    • plural noun: limits

      1. a point or level beyond which something does not or may not extend or pass.

      ?? Does the County of Santa Fe and City of Santa Fe both not extend North beyond your “line drawn dead center east to west 270-090 degrees, center post of : the plaza square/Palace of the Governors area” ??

      I don’t think the City or County would appreciate you redrawing their boundaries?

      • Goofy and locolobo, I think I can answer to both your replies and thank you both for the response….locolobo you looked up the definition of limits got it brother….but what about Northern which per definition one meaning is – “situated in the north” key word “situated”….You are reading into his prose…. he never said Northernmost city or county limits, ,,,, he said Northern and there is a DISTINCT difference,

        Both the city and the county jurisdiction “boundaries” are considered/within geographical Northern space…look at it yourself the vast geographical majority of the “boundaries” limits are southern both city and county,,,,,but he said “north of the northern limits of Santa Fe”

        • The hairs you are splitting over where the 66,000 links begin and end are of little consequence if the chest isn’t even hidden in New Mexico. (And supposing thatall areas in the four states above 5,000′ and below 10,200′ are equal, the odds of the chest being in New Mexico are less than 6%.) Perhaps you should spend less time trying to read the tea leaves (be they black, red or green) of everything that Forrest has ever written or said since he released TTOTC, and focus instead on the poem.

          • Zaphod,

            Ok, i got read/focus on the poem from that…I did.. Was there a question there? Brother, I am not trying to split anything, I think what I have said is in IMO and i stipulated this. I never claimed anything and would not dare to do so. I have been on this site for close to 2-3 years now I am not stupid and my intent is not ingeniousness. Just a new guy, but not really new cut me some slack brother…and I have been out there not some arm chair Jbrone…

            So for argument sake if we go by this 6% theory what was your point anyway? Elevation via public/state.federal land mass? where ya going brother?


          • Hi Joad,

            My only point was that you seemed to be getting wrapped around the axle about the 8.25-mile minutiae. Forrest could just as easily have said 5 miles, or 10 miles, and in my opinion it wouldn’t have made any difference in searcher’s behavior or their probability of success. Give ’em an inch (or a link) and they’ll take a mile. I think he was just trying to get people out of his backyard … and his neighbors’ yards.

            > So for argument sake if we go by this
            > 6% theory what was your point
            > anyway?

            The point was that a disproportionate number of searchers favor New Mexico relative to the tiny area that state represents in the overall 4-state search area. I suspect that many NM searchers favor that state for reasons that have nothing to do with the poem.

        • Joad505,

          You been on the site for 2-3 years now… so I wonder what it is that intrigues you about the northern limits?
          The comment was about adapting surveying laws of 1620, methods of surveying etc. The example of the links was part of that… Is the thought here more about measurement in general, or as some think 8.25 miles a hint/clue?

          To be honest I would have to go back and read the conversation again to get the gist of what lead to the comment… however, I look at the distance of 66,000 links more about the action and type of measuring, than a hint to a location.

          Not unlike the No outhouse, no graveyard clues etc. wen folks were doing crazy stuff… i think fenn simple gave out the more than 66,000 link comment in the hope of keeping the crazies more than arms length from his home.

          The question I have… do we need to do measurement of any kind to ‘precisely’ retrieve the chest?

          • Seeker,

            Intrigued is a good word, I am that. I guess what my Aim in the post is just trying to define or re-define the Area in Play. I am sure I am not the only one who has examined this possibility (Northern Limits).. It means nothing to those searching in areas way up north in the Rockies, but should be examined closely for those playing a different hand.

            As far as 8.25 miles being a clue or hint of some kind, I don’t see anything tangible there, but when you look at Santa Fe, its at least that or more to even say your in the southernmost portion of the Rockies, IMO, (I have not completed any actual measurements, that is just what it looks like via G-Earth).

            I do not see the need for any specific measurement for the winning solve. My opinion, the only thing required is the right WWWH, which “should” lead us “contiguously” thru the remaining 8 clues to the right geographical area,, which IMO will be more than 8.25 miles north of the northern limits of Santa Fe.


          • Seeker, I don’t think so. In fact, my solve,
            in which I believe strongly enough to make a third trip to the SAME SEARCH
            AREA, doesn’t involve any math at all.
            And it doesn’t involve anagrams, foreign
            language translations or names, or any
            other “exotic or esoteric” ideas. But it
            did require imagination, as FF has
            suggested we use.

            The above is just my opinion.

            Good luck. Please stay safe.

  38. This bothers me, carry some sort of tracking device and then on MWs site he posted a “be Safe” weekly words and a picture of a strange woman …with a smart phone. I have learned recently to not trust these things. He also hates those smart phone texting devices. His granddaughter leaves hers at home when she visits. And also the leave your pets at home comment? My pet is my protection from things in the outdoors, my extra set of eyes and ears. Both of these guidelines are confusing to me. IMOO

    • Rethinking what I just posted I now realize for many a phone is a protection necessity and for some not necessary. Some of these guidelines are meant for the general public. For me all this modern technology, although convenient, is also an invasion of privacy and interferes with the natural element. And I’ll take my pet except in places where she’s not welcome, those places we just won’t go.

      • Strawshadow –

        To be safe in the wilderness takes some planning. I think you can leave your cell phone in the car – as it won’t work where you are going anyway. Indeed, one searcher, narrowed down his search area by eliminating areas where cell phones worked.

        Forrest knows people are doing wild and crazy things. One person was going over an ice lake. Look at what happened to Randy and Leo. I’m sure Randy would have never jeopardized Leo – but he did.

        When Forrest planned this hunt – he said he thought of everything – and I believe him. He did not place anyone in a boat. IMO He did not place anyone in a raft. It’s not something that everyone knows how to do – and this chase is for families. I mean would you put a three yr old in a raft – I sure wouldn’t.

        I took my dog – but I knew he would be safe – but some idiots are crossing rivers and then your dog would not be safe. So a blanket statement like don’t take your dog works.

    • strawshadow,
      I’m not getting ~ “I have learned recently to not trust these things”
      Are you talking about the devises or the comments… just wondering.
      I dislike the idiot phones as well, but not for the fact that they can be very useful in an emergency, but that folks feel the need to be on them constantly. So it more of a beef with me than anything… Maybe I just feel I’m not that important I need to answer phone just because it rings or chimes I receive a text.
      And it gets in the way while I’m munching a Mr. Subs, sipping of a DD coffee, watching my GPS and vehicle TV while driving of my favorite show… I mean, I have to be careful not to make a sudden steering wheel moves or may lap top will fly off the passenger seat.

      Fundamental is the word that is key here. long before the smarter than i phones, we simple told someone where we were going. Folks seem to forget… a mile or two into the mountains is not the same as a block or two from our homes. This all about precaution, not likes or dislike… sometime technology is good.

    • Hi strawshadow
      just a humble hypothetical (re: the pet comment) but what if..

      large bear approaches
      (owner takes ‘selfie’)
      dog chases bear
      owner chases dog
      bear eats both
      Ranger shoots bear
      three avoidable tragedies later..

      I could be wrong though, but hopefully not
      Happy hunting 🙂

  39. Many reasons for my nature. If you have ever used any of the map programs such as Glympse you know what I mean. With every new technology comes a price. I recently heard of a bar that insulated its building with metal materials so no cell phones would work. They have had no complaints, in fact every body loves the place. I’ve been into places in the wilderness where no one knew where I was with no phone for months. I never saw a soul for weeks, that was the most peaceful place I’ve ever been, the company was great. And for the religious crowd that is where you discover your shadow and he never leaves your side. The beauty about life is that we all have choices and sometimes they are difficult at best. It’s sad to me that everyone has to be so judgmental and by saying that it brings out the hypocrite in me. My flaws are many and I understand that I don’t always recognize them all. Fortunately for me they’re are many perfect people who can step up and remind me those that I was unaware of. Thank you all and I mean that sincerely.

    • “It’s sad to me that everyone has to be so judgmental and by saying that it brings out the hypocrite in me.”

      Strawshadow, who was being judgemental?

      We were talking about fundamental guidelines… devises that could help in case of emergency. Personally a cell phone might as well go in the trash, it most likely won’t work in many locations. But a tracking device like fenn suggested could locate you if help is needed. If you took my response as judgemental… you’d be wrong.

      You sound like a person who has experience in nature and away from society… most do not. Hence the “Fundamental Guidelines” suggestions.

      • Couldn’t agree more with your ‘safety guidelines’ comment Seeker, as wise advice is often worth more than a sturdy pair of boots ..and infinitely less expensive.

        happy hunting mate

  40. That response had nothing to do with you, sorry for the misunderstanding. Rather than post in multiple places I just responded here to a few different comments. Perhaps I will separate more clearly my intentions in the future.
    So to be perfectly clear you have always been respectful as well as respected with all of your posts.
    Mine on the other hand have been confusing at best. And in case of an emergency, break glass. That was from TFTW to be clear.

    • there is a pleasure in the pathless woods
      there is a rapture on the lonely shore
      there is society, where none intrudes
      by the deep sea, and music in its roar
      I love not man the less, but Nature more..

      – Lord Byron

  41. Re: boost book sales & credibility. set a time limit to reveal location to news media with treasure going to cancer treatment program. Then treasure hunt 2 with new clues from already published books and new poem.

  42. Perhaps leave six bonus clues separately hidden away that each help to point to the main treasure. Those that find each clue get a leg up & that helps your cerdibility as those specifics overcome present ambiguities…

    • I meant credibility…. if you do, include a specific id code numbers & letters so that you & finder can confirm without revealing the clue.

      PS great idea to get people outdoors & appreciate nature . Also a bit concerned someone will get hurt or damage environment in pursuit of buried treasure…

  43. When searching for this treasure always be safe it can easily get out of control a lot of these places have no one in sight to help you if you are in trouble … don’t let this adventure eliminate your common sense… try to bring a buddy with you, and always have plenty of water !!! you will be amazed by searching in the mountains and desert how it drains you of H20 especially being at high elevations… Even if you think you solved it and SEE the BLAZE … You can’t spend your Bounty and become Famous…. if your Dead 1idwillhe

  44. Sorry, for my ignorance–I don’t have a pet to take with me (my cat would never handle a trip anywhere… lol) But I don’t understand the reasoning of not taking pets. I had always imagined that having a good dog with you would be a good guard/deterrent against bears, etc.

    Is it that the opposite is true, or that you might lose your pet? Just curious.

    • @Ryan: “But I don’t understand the reasoning of not taking pets. I had always imagined that having a good dog with you would be a good guard/deterrent against bears, etc. Is it that the opposite is true, or that you might lose your pet? Just curious.”

      Bears are overwhelmingly not a threat to humans unless the humans actively, aggressively, deliberately harass and threaten bears. That includes the people who just want to see how closely they can get to a bear to take its picture— those people don’t out-right deserve to die, but they perhaps do deserve to be slapped around until they learn some common sense. Wild animals do not “magically sense I’m just being friendly” and act friendly in return: they assume humans will kill and eat them whenever and where ever possible.

      That means a dog can make a bear encounter much worse. Humans and dogs have forward-facing eyes, and that tells bears that we both are predators; but dogs have protruding jaws fitted with teeth, unlike humans, that are “designed” to rend and tear flesh even at a dead run. A bear that will cheerfully ignore a human will be much less included to do so when the human is with a dog,


    Been on here a couple of months, went on an expedition or 2, and made a few comments, and saw a lot of smart individuals making sense of their own interpretation of their poem.

    Whether its the right location or not, of course we will never know who is right until someone actually solves the poem correctly and grabs the Roman Chest.

    or stumbles on it while hiking or camping and never knew nothing of ” The Thrill of the Chase” or Mr. Fenn

    This is why I want to act fast and start a team and go one last time to my locale in New Mexico before winter— Who is with me??

    I will hand pick a few people so go to my website/blog and put in your resume even if you cant look for it physically or think your too old, or handicap or too busy at this stage of your life… please apply I have other options

    Thank you for your time, and Happy Hunting !!!

  46. 1idwillhe ,

    umm, that link says you don’t exist . . .

    are ya fer reallyreal, er arya the phantom ?

  47. Dal, I recall you mentioning somewhere when you considered it to be “spring” in Yellowstone (only a few weeks or so), but couldn’t find it. I’m not too familiar with Yellowstone. I was thinking of planning a trip in Mid May in an RV with my family. Should I still expect a lot of snow or really cold temperatures? Would my “delicate” wife and small kids enjoy it, or would I be taking them on an arctic vacation–worried more about the cold and mud, than any treasure?

    (The reasoning is: the RV is for my wife, and mid-May is for my budget–as the prices drastically increase for renting the RV around Labor Day and beyond.)

  48. Hi All,

    Have stumbled on this exciting treasure hunt today.

    As much incentive as the treasure box is, I feel more excitement to see how beautiful this off track place must be for Fenn to share with us in such a memorable way.

    From reading the poem and comments, my imagination wonders to a shallow lake with waterfall & rainbow, fishing for trout peacefully and possibly Brown bears in the far distance – having never travelled to the area (reside in Australia) this is probably the product of a movie I have watched.

    Not personally being in a financial position to search for the treasure, it will be so great to read when someone finally finds it 🙂

    Good luck hunters!

  49. I know that this may come off as rude since this is my first post, but I think there should be an addition made to these guidelines. For safety reasons, it is probably best to go with a partner and not alone, especially if you’re not accustumed to trying to rough it in the wilderness. I’ve personally been in a situation where having someone with me made the difference between a minor set back and me being stuck with no way of getting help.

    My husband and I went geode hunting with some friends in an area that had a steep incline we had to get to the bottom of. During the climg back up, my knee dislocated on me. The sudden shock of pain caused me to lose my footing and I fell/slid a good distance before catching myself on a fallen, but not very stable tree. Had I been on my own, I would have been stuck there with the risk of things getting worse if the tree gave. Thankfully, the others were there to assist me in getting somewhere safe long enough to relocate my knee and in getting back to the camp area. I recovered quickly once I was able to rest my leg, and the night went on as if nothing had happened.

    I hope that this humble advice helps you guys have a safer hunt.

    • welcome to the Home of Dal (& Goofy too) Tabi Leigh

      -yes, that’s really great advice
      -no, you haven’t come across as being rude
      -yes, i agree a minor injury can be potentially life-theatening on solo hikes
      -no, Zap hasn’t found the treasure chest yet, so there’s still a chance 🙂

      (& yes, a dislocated knee is horridly painful 🙁 glad to hear you recovered well )

  50. Dear Forrest Sir,

    I wanted to ask you about the very special area where you hid the TC and where you decided to be laid to rest at one time.

    Is it possible that a small population of black bears have migrated into that area since the year you were there last?

    My last time in the area, I led myself astray by misinterpreting clues with the reality on the ground. I had limited time and one day to look. Had to come home before I figured out my mistakes.

    So I must return, but while there I found a lot of bear scat, tracks in certain areas and bear rolls in the low vegetation between certain kinds of trees.

    What say you? Possible that things have changed since your last visit?


  51. Dal,
    Can anyone lend credit where he said he would see trees, mountains, animals… and smell pine needles, pinyon nuts and sagebrush? Also, I read somewhere he said in an interview “I know the chest is wet (whet?)”. Anyone familiar? He also said something about giving a clue he wished he hadn’t. I’m very green to this exploration, and still currently just a couch surfer… Would love to explore the great outdoors of NM one of these days. 😉
    Thanks and good luck to all!

  52. Hi all .

    f has stated this a lot on this blog. And still some of you all feel the need to go in places I cannot.

    I have searched all the States with in the search area. All of them

    have vast amounts of land that separates them . Here is a small list I learned

    from other whom gave me advice and these folks are servers for sure. I know

    because they are also searchers and great mountain folk.

    1. Gas – always bring a gas can
    2. Proper clothing and boots- spear sets- hat glasses
    3. A lot of water ,vitamin C Ibuprofen. This is for altitude as well as environment .
    4. A lighter and matches , flares, medical kit – snake bite kit
    5. A compas not your phone . Real compass .
    6. Flash light
    7. Bear spray , deterrents
    8. Car in proper working order, I helped two different folks in the Back wood area of Yellow Stone get their cars started . One was because they didn’t know to put their foot on the break to start the rental car they had.
    9. Tell your family where you are going no matter what .
    10. Never put your self in a situation that could even be dangerous.
    No way he was in a dangerous place when he hid it.
    You are important please do not put your selves at risk for any reason.
    I am disabled to a degree and teaching in the mountains where
    folks don’t go and put myself or my children in danger , No way Fenn would
    ever place you or your families in danger.
    So do not go if it requires a degree of difficulty on the ground.
    If f placed it where anyone could find it , then he took into the account folks like me who can only go to limited places.

    As far as the rest of the advice . Where you can make two trips..?
    From your car, not his? To your solve ? Boy I have questions for sure .
    But think about it. A to B . Then two trips to c with in a few hours.
    Hey thats 9 total steps anti it . Well if you don’t go back to A it is .
    Think about it …….
    A+B=C .
    I mentioned this at Fennboree .
    Any ways Please Please stay safe . Each of you are very special .
    You have proved that by stepping up to the plate to even get involved in this.

    Take care every one .
    Mike and Heather

  53. Howdy, thanks for building this page so a new fanatic can join the search.
    Question: has anyone ever asked or has Forrest disclosed if it is on private property, public land, or, Tribal land?

    Richard Payton

    • Well, Richard, none directly that I can find, But other posters/searchers are far more astute than I. On the TARRYSCANT site, put in
      “private property” and you will find
      ovassional FF comments relating to some of his other collectible finds.

    • Hi Richard – this may help answer your question…

      Fenn has said the Rio Grande is not part of the Rocky Mountains, so searchers should not be taking risks to look there. He also has said that the chest is not hidden in a dangerous place. And Fenn has cautioned searchers against trespassing on private or tribal land and cemeteries, saying the treasure is not hidden there.

      Answers to many things are easy to find if you have a good resource…

      • I would like if FF had ruled out specific types of land (other than the Rio Grande) but that part of the article seems to be an interpretation of something he may have said. I don’t think he would narrow anything down that much, IMO. Go to Tarryscant and type in Indian land. This is the straight from FF. I am hesitant to believe anything other than that.

      • JCM-
        I am not aware of where Forrest has been quoted as saying that the chest is not on Tribal land…
        In the Santa Fe New Mexican story that you reference above…It is not a quote from Forrest where he states that the chest is not hidden on Tribal land…rather it is a simple statement made by the writer:
        “And Fenn has cautioned searchers against trespassing on private or tribal land and cemeteries, saying the treasure is not hidden there.”

        So those are not Forrest’s words…those are the words of the writer…and we have no guarantee that they are accurate because we have not heard Forrest say those words…
        However, I agree that those words are likely an accurate interpretation of what Forrest told the writer. I trust the writer…but still…it is an implication rather than known fact to say that Forrest said that the chest is not hidden on Tribal land…
        It would be more accurate to say that “in the following article the author wrote that Forrest told him the chest was not on Tribal land…”

        I am always cautious about second hand statements about things Forrest supposedly has said…

        On the other hand there are a couple places where Forrest actually said that the chest was not in a graveyard..The primary source is the May 3rd, 2013 Today Show appearance where that was the clue he handed out.”The treasure is not in a graveyard.”

        • Dal,
          I very cautious of second hand info as well, no matter how much I ‘think’ it can be trusted…

          But, in the Torge n Elliot podcast [ posted on your media thread ] fenn was ask;
          Q~ Reservations or what nots, do you ever worry about Indian spirits or removing some of this stuff, it might bring bad juju on you?
          A~ Well, I’m not worried about that. But, you should never take things off Indian Reservations.

          LOL.. who knows if fenn meant this as an eliminator to a possible solve or not… but in my mind, it seems to imply he might not have hid the chest on Native American land of any sorts, if he respects the idea of not removing anything from them, line of thinking.

          Does this help anyone get closer? nope, could it help to keep us from getting into trouble we don’t want to be in…?

          • Thanks for pointing that out Seeker.
            There are a couple quotes like that which I can never get past…
            By that I mean…no logic I apply gives me an answer one way or the other about how to interpret them..
            I call them “exasperating quotes”..
            One of my least favs is the one about eruptions in Yellowstone from Jenny’s site:
            “I doubt that a volcanic eruption under Yellowstone Lake would blow the treasure chest to bits, no matter the odds, but it might spread a lot of beautiful cutthroat and lake trout around the country side. f”

            I hate that quote…
            It seems to rule out the YNP area as a logical location for the chest…
            Sometimes logic is not on my side..
            Sometimes I ignore logic 🙂

          • Logic always finds a way to kick me in the head, the wrong way.
            I have almost ruled out YSNP for the location of the chest [logically?], but not the greater YS area… However, and this is just me dissecting the question in this Q&A… “blow the treasure to bits” killed the question.
            If that was to happen, the last thing I would worry about is this treasure

          • Hi Dal – My logic for dealing with that comment with the bronze chest being “blown to bits” is found in this line by f in TTOTC:

            ‘Bronze is a non-ferrous metal, meaning it won’t rust or deteriorate in any way. One must pound it with a sledgehammer, or melt it down in order to change its shape.’

            A volcanic eruption may throw that chest a great distance if it is in proximity of a volcano, but an eruption is not going to blow the chest itself into ‘bits’ or small pieces (per the Q put to f). I think that is why f says in his comment “no matter the odds”. f is keenly aware of the durability of bronze.

            So feel free to borrow my logic if it works better for you. 🙂

  54. It says by Forrest and in the first paragraph it says “I can’t”, but then the second paragraph begins with “We know”…

    I’d like to know who We are.

    • I would think that the answer to you question is this: – I (Forrest Fenn) and those that have been searching for a while… know that the chest is not hidden in a dangerous place, (because this has been stated by me [Forrest Fenn] preciously) nevertheless people are putting themselves at peril by not paying attention to some common sense rules. It is time for everyone to come forward and make suggestions that will keep us safer.”

      I could be wrong, but this seems like a logical explanation to the Forrest Fenn/”we” problem – Just my guess – JDA

        USING THE Built in Ladder ON

    • When any individual uses the word “we”, it should be very
      carefully evaluated, as people tend to generalize,
      mis-speak, and (attempt to) represent others, even if not authorized to do so. Here’s a hypothetical example:

      “Nobody believes the treasure is in Los Alamos, NM.”

      To me, invalid generalization indicates lack of clear thinking. As a result of that indication, I tend to believe
      that the person lacks ability to think clearly. Thus I tend
      to believe that the person is not a significant “competitor” in solving the poem and finding the TC. But I still wish
      for every person involved in this treasure hunt happiness,
      good health, and fond memories of the experience.

      The above is my opinion.

  55. ” If you can’t make two trips from your car to your solve in several hours, then don’t go. ”

    This is still not clear to me what FF means here. Two trips like to different spots of ending location (one being the chest, one being the starting location?) or what?? Any ideas?

    • Brandon-
      You need to do more basic research. In Forrest’s description of the afternoon that he hid the chest he writes of making two trips to the hidey spot from his car in one afternoon.. Therefore, it is expected that the correct solution to finding the chest will also allow the finder to travel from their vehicle to the hidey spot twice in one afternoon. This gives us a hint to the distance between where Forrest parked his car and the hidey spot.

      Forrest made this remark more than once but the most often quoted statement is at Jenny Kile’s site from June of 2014-
      “I made two trips from my car to the hiding place and it was done in one afternoon. f”

    • Brandon,
      I’m going to add to Dal’s advice to read more…. fenn also stated;
      “If you are walking long distances in search of the treasure, you’re walking too far. f.”
      Add this to other comments, such as “one afternoon” and fenn “walked less than a few miles” and he “followed the clue when he hid the chest” [ using those key words you should be able to find those comments to read in full ]
      You might be able to understand your dilemma.

      Also remember, the quote you refer to was to help with the idea of safety in mind…
      Personally, i think most of fenn’s comment seem to imply the clues references are closer than many think they might be, or that we need to travel into places that an 80 years [ yet healthy ] man carrying a heavy backpack can’t go.. such as; up and down a canyon twice. But read through all the comments, and make up your own mind.

  56. 35.87409 ° N lat. should be the APPROX.
    farthest South delineating search
    parameter latitude. Imo.

  57. you know, if one cannot figure out where to start, how you gonna find the gold…? How is that even possible..?

  58. Hello Everyone:
    I just learned of this “The Thrill of the Chase” this evening and I’ve been working on the poem and hints and clues that are posted all over the web for the last three hours. What can I say, I like puzzles. I live in Canada and I’m not physically able to travel where the treasure is hidden. So for some of the cyphers that are part of my solve are as follows for you treasure hunters. Good Luck to all.
    1st hint I found – Pinyon trees are originally part of the Great Basin in the rocky mountains and said basin only touches the bottom western corner of “Wyoming”.
    2nd hint – 8.25 miles from Santa Fe…LOL (I really loved this clue, actually first clue I solved after reading the article, that is what caught my attention to try and solve it )… during my research I read that Mr. Finn likes to play with words. Well this time he played with numbers while trying to point you in the right direction. Example: $ 1, 100, 000.00 would be expressed as $1.1 million. Soooo, 8.25 miles is actually 825 miles north of Santa Fe which again according to google would place you in the bottom western corner of “Wyoming” but exactly where not sure because I don’t know where his starting point would be.
    3rd hint – loves fishing, some great fishing lodges in the “Great Basin” areas and a boating reference in poem, I think that I’ve narrowed it down to which state it is.
    Now on to the poem my cyphers are not in order I’ll leave that to you:
    Warm Waters halt: I think some where below Wind River.
    Put in below the home of Brown. Based on my theory we know we are looking at the geographical great basin – Brown Basin and Brown Mountain area, a lower canyon area?
    So at the end of a water way as “put in below” is the nautical term I’m using for my solve.
    No Paddle up your creek: it is either a flat river/creek (can walk across) or dry/seasonal river bed, ravine. In the last stanza: we are given the one word in the name of the river…”in the wood”, my conclusion “The Great Wood River”.
    “your effort will be worth the cold” anyone who lives below 2500 ft. in altitude will find the air feels quite chilly even in mid-summer.
    Next clue I think heavy load refers to a small area near there called “Dumbell” , some more research and “water high” could mean an upper water reservoir in that area too.
    As to the rest ….LOL…it is a treasure hunt after all and its well past mid-night and I’m off to my bed.
    So, please take these assumptions and compare to your facts, I really hope a deserving person finds this treasure. Good Night, Cheers and Best of Luck to All.

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