Odds n Ends About Fenn’s Treasure Hunt…Part Ten


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695 thoughts on “Odds n Ends About Fenn’s Treasure Hunt…Part Ten

  1. The last Odd’s n Ends ended.

    I agree JD,
    I was just trying to prove a point from what appears to be a straight forward non-treasure related statement & turn it into a hint related to the poem or books.

    My thoughts of over thinking things he has stated whether treasure related or not may put a searcher in the 10,000 year zone.
    Although you can make a case if you only use the poem you may end up in the same 10,000 year zone.

    If you use the poem, somewhat face value being straightforwards & use the hints in the books as places considering the poem appears to be directions & use the treasure related statements in the video’s & audio’s as well as other statements, I think you can get down to the under 10 year zone.
    Of coarse, you will have to get the hints right.
    That’s my zone….

    • Hey jake
      I personally feel that f has set it up so that it doesn’t matter, books or poem and a good map will get you to
      “indulgence.” One. Checks the other…IMHO

    • Timothy Alkire: “books or poem and a good map will get you to
      Books or poem???
      You personally have me baffled.
      I would love to see the day someone finds the chest with the books & a good map without the poem.
      We know the poem came in TTOTC.

      Are you talking about this quote from Forrest?
      (38:42) “There are clues in my new book that can help a person”
      You just might need help.
      I know I do.

    • I think all the other things outside of the poem should be used as verification of your solve.
      The “two trip from my car in an afternoon” (paraphrased?) along with an 80 year old man is an excellent example.

      Subtle relationships that fit the poem also.

      In my opinion, a person needs an open mind not locked into a narrow zone, and be looking at the “big picture” in these things.
      Hints are just hints, they are not supposed to be a direct clue no matter how they are manipulated into hidden clues. They are just hints. Take them loosely.
      You know, “you are getting warmer” does not give you a “radial” direction or distance.

      And once you can proceed with confidence, you might have the answer. That’s the best we can do.

    • Hi people, this is my first time posting but I have been on the chase almost from the start. Just real quick I wanna say that I love this site and read through some of these blogs almost everyday. On the topic of Odd’s and End’s about the chase I wanted to give a few things “Quotes from FF” or whatever that I wrote down in my notes etc…that somehow or someway stuck in my head or really made me pause for thought or things that just bug me.

      1) “Its Fun to arrange words in a way that you have to smile at the end of a sentence” (I believe that FF said that in a video)

      2)”The missing “d” in Knowledge (on the Bell)

      3)”The picture on the cover of TFTW screams out as an important clue to me. I don’t know exactly why it seems so important to me

      4) “mistakes are not errors”

      Anyway, These are “FEW” of the things that I wrote down while researching and I have more notes, questions etc that I will share in the future. Let me know if you folks have any insight or thoughts on this stuff.

      • Hey Eric,
        I do remember Forrest saying something similar to what you have at #1.
        I did not transcribe that & we should check to see exactly what he said.

        The missing -d- in knowledge, tells me he likes to change the spelling of words where the meaning is the same.

        The picture on the dust cover screams -his bathing spot- where I think the first clue is. The wavy grass.

        Forrest Fenn, Collected Works Bookstore, 10-22-2013
        (6:22) I’ve said some things in my book, I’ve made some deliberate errors, (TTOTC) just to see if anybody would find them, and they don’t, and they haven’t.
        I think the deliberate errors are in the poem. I think I have found one.

        Yes Eric, no mistake about it.

        • Hey Jake, I believe that you are correct about the missing “d” I remember Forrest’s comment now. I tend to forget things more and more as I get older. The bathing spot has always seemed like an important clue to me but also seems so ambiguous. Forrest seems to be such a clever word smith and completely fascinated by words and their spelling and meaning. do you know if anyone has had any insight or thoughts on the “New and Old” from the poem? I am curious to know if anyone has done any research or cross-referencing to the Bible. (besides the MEEK line in the poem.) the Bible does contain the “New Testament” and the” Old” Testament. Just a thought. I know that forrest says that his Church is in the Mountains and Streams etc…

          • His bathing spot(s) and the poem are epic Eric.
            As far as verses in a bible go, I think that’s ruled out when trying to figure out the poem & 9 clues.

            We had a pretty deep boring discussion about “new and old” recently & still came to the same conclusion. We don’t know what it really is, but I think it is what is in the chest.

  2. Dal’s site is turning out to be a fairly large archive of interesting comments and ideas from folks from all walks of life. I remember when one could peruse the few topics and scrapbooks and be done in a flash. Not no mo…There is a heap o’ goodies here and a whole lot of fun tidbits. Forrest gave us searchers a lot of interesting topics to read and maybe there are a few important morsels mixed in there somewhere. There is always room to debate with most of his open ended answers and comments. That’s what keeps things interesting.
    Good luck searchers and keep your powder dry…

  3. Four days ago I branded my map with the authentication key and I will freely give you what I ended up with and explain my notes. Mr. Fenn’s river runs really deep and I think I have caused enough agitation lately. I think very highly of him and you too Dal. Actually, Dal you have been a small part of my motivation too. I saw Mr. Fenn’s poem years ago when this started, but I wasn’t able to join all of you then. When I saw it again about the missing fellow I wanted to take a shot at this. I was going to fly out tonight, but that fell through at the gate. Plus right before getting to the airport someone in the car was getting sick with what I had a few days ago and it’s a pretty nasty virus, hence part of the delay at the gate.

    I honestly don’t know if the chest is there or not, but some of you are close in the neighborhood I think. I don’t know at all because I can’t get out there. It might not be there now and Mr. Fenn will get his bracelet at the Fennboree perhaps that is if the finder(s) haven’t said anything yet. Then again maybe there is a final test that maybe nobody has passed yet if you find this spot. It’s hard to say, I have been really surprised at the continuations in the intertextualities. There’s no telling. My findings may not be an exact science but I am not making any quotes. It is what it is and the branding of the map is obvious when finished.

    Having said all this please know I don’t feel that I am any different than any of you on here. I am no better than anyone else. I already know that I am content and my loved ones are fine too. If you are curious throw a line of the poem and I will reply the best I can. I apologize in advance that I am not a wordsmith or poet. And no the ebay posting wasn’t me and I was curious about that myself. If the post that followed it was directed to me that is fine. We all have to make our entries and exits. I surrender what I have and I hope it might help someone out there or just help with those wanting to gain more info.

    Best Regards,
    p.s.-fire away

      • Hahahaha good one Ken. Who does this person think they are that we will believe that that they know where the chest is and is willing to tell. Nice try X. Save it for April 1st.

        • ACE
          I believe this searcher(X) really feels that they know for sure where Indulgence is. There have been many that have come and gone in the 3 plus years I have been around. Heck, my first couple of search escapades were mainly fueled by that all too familiar OMG knowledge. I am in this for the long haul and my trips are planned as fun times centered around soaking up as much poking around as 7-10 days allows. In the end for me, I may know just as much as I know now…not much.

        • I’m nobody and no better than anyone. I stated I honestly don’t know. One has to be there to find out.

          • X
            I was not poking fun at you…I like to hear what people think. It helps me gauge who the competition is. The best competitors are the ones who say very little and are eager to listen…IMO. Good luck X and have fun with this!

          • To X,
            I am always eager to listen. That is a small reason why I am on this site. But to me it sounds like a ploy to receive attention then masquerade people around scratching their heads to vague ideas. Again if my letters were colors they would be soft pink. I am not trying to disrespect your solve. If you have one and really don’t intend on retrieving chest, by all means… The platform is all yours.
            So my question would be why is it you feel the bracelet has been found.

        • X: ” I don’t know at all because I can’t get out there. It might not be there now and Mr. Fenn will get his bracelet at the Fennboree perhaps that is if the finder(s) haven’t said anything yet.”

          Yes, that’s it, you don’t know.
          Your fire is just smoke coming from the tail pipe.

      • I was there not long ago. In the branding this was an intersection that also split in two directions next. In my mental notes it’s important for me to remember where I come from in hindsight and to follow through beyond the intersection. As an adult over the years I have drug things along with me from my past. The reflection back was cleansing. I didn’t know it at the time, but you could be fined for having a dog with you. She is small and I slipped past the rangers at the end heading back out. My fault for being late in the chase and not knowing.

        I also noticed a terrain feature across the way that looked familiar on a map. I was thinking that was part of it, but the elevation seemed to steep IMO. I didn’t go there.

        If the fellow sitting between the logs on the bank taking a pic of the moon over one of the peaks is on here…it was nice to meet you.

      • Haha come on Jake right state or not? Feeding into this idea your wiser than that.
        Okay X fire away!

        • Why didn’t X state Randy’s name. If he respects us enough as searchers to help us find the chest that should have been a big part of his motivation. He also stated what sounds like he is wealthy so why break down a poem that many have tried to do for years. Possibility that may be counterproductive to me.

          • To my own fault I am a very visual person and can’t remember names well. I was typing as I was thinking and trying to get my thoughts out. Some days I see so many names it becomes a blur. There was no disrespect intended. Wealth like success and excellence are subjective terms depending on the individual defining them. For me I am only humble. The life touching experience from the masterpiece is priceless.

      • Something that would heavy to pick up if it were to fall on your toe while walking to it. That’s only half of that part of the key.

        • Much of the Rocky Mountains were created by heavy loads and water high. This clue does not necessarily suggest actual water.

          My hubby has several very large fish aquariums. Everyone has been too busy to clean them this past month and I don’t usually do it, but I couldn’t take it anymore so I pulled out the supplies and got to work. The water was getting low in one of the 50 gallon aquariums. It was pretty obvious because I could see the calcium deposit on the side of the glass where the regular water level usually is. The water level had been high but wasn’t at that moment.

          We live on a lakefront. Our lake has been kind of low this past year thanks to the drought in our area. It didn’t keep us from getting out on the water. We kayaked anyway. Everywhere around the lake we could see the evidence that the water had been higher. It was clear where the usual water line was supposed to be. Vegetation levels, the appearance of soil and rocks all indicated the normal water level. We are happy this summer that our water level is up again. We know this because it is above that water line we could see all last year.

          Water high can mean a lot of things, but do not assume that it means that the water in the area is high at this time. It could have been high at some other time and it might be apparent that it was.

          When our lake was low, we could see more of the soil and rocks that normally are under water. We learned more about the geography of our area as we kayaked around and observed evidence not covered by vegetation.

          Much can be learned from studying the local topography and geographical features.

    • Hey, X.

      There’s arrows in your avatar pointing to a bunch of compass Xs. If that’s not by accident, that’s very clever. If it is just coincidence, still pretty cool.

      I, for one, appreciate theatrics 🙂

      • It wasn’t intentional and it was a surprising coincidence to me too. Within the final step(s) I feel like it might possibly have symbolic meaning from a higher hand giving guidance.

      • In my notes there were several things that a blaze could be like stacked stones, marked trees, geographical shapes, those made by blazers or survey markers. I also saw a vanishing point as an art reference in the wording for “nigh” meaning it is closing in. Mr. Fenn, is truly a friend of art and a wonderful teacher. Even the lands themselves take shape in his masterpiece.

  4. I have been thinking,The thrill of the chase is indulgence=the practice of allowing enjoyment of what ever is desired.+the excitement of finding something you want,desire,its the same thing,The Thrill of the chase.so mr. forrest writes his memoir,all about his life adventures and family .A memoir is suspose to be about real stuff,but if he wants to put imagination in there,i guess he can if he wants.fiction or non fiction,a flicker with space in between.he likes to embellish just alittle.he can spice things up or turn it around.there are so many words in that poem that mean indulgence.the understanding he got was peace finally,after the war,alot of things didn’t make any since and his trauma didn’t help. there had to be more to life that what he had in his mind.so he had to get the answers,get to the root of the problems that was bothering him.he did finding indulgence.he found his desire for him.lost his family and friends,ca’t go back and be in the middle again,only in memory.yet that you start to lose alittle also as you get older.lost situation.he did hide a real treasure,because he said he did.do I have proof,no,but I believe his word.why? I don’t think he would lie.do you think his proof is in the poem ,yes,where,there,where,in the poem.tell me where in that poem is the answer that tells you where his treasure is hidden.its in clues,what are the clues?alot of the words mean the same or similar.then why can’t you find the clues?you been thinking searching,writing,but yet no one has found the treasure.but he hid it in the mountains,where? somewhere, specisl place to forrest. anyplace in the mountains are special to forrest.hes been all over the place,and found many treasures. so are we, the searcher as we go in the mountains find our own treasures,peace of mind,fun,enjoyment,happiness,heart,mind,thrill all indulgence.does this make any since to you allI feel like i’m suspose to ask forrest for permission to the answer to his treasure,as he said he is the only one who knows where it is and the poem is about indulgence if this makes any since at all .

      • well mark,sorry it makes no sense to you maybe it does to someone else,its like forrest says ,if we all have these ideas ,why hasn’t the treasure been found.what If,its in his mind only,cause it really is ,no one knows but him.so the treasure is lost.thats my hindsight

    • I must exit on a few last notes. I hope that the children are enjoying this and maybe something has helped someone in a small way. Again I can’t be there, but my effort is honest. I have no expectations. My final note is that when you get to where many people are I saw an over arching foresight extended from there. IMO the “tarry” and “marvel” was squint with intent and you will see the light shine through.

      I am thankful and grateful at all this is for the children and all that they can learn from a great teacher. If I was a poor student please forgive me. I hope I don’t have to go to the principals office now. I had to drag my desk all the way to the front of the principals office once and was on display for several days. I hope that doesn’t happen again.

      Good luck everyone and have a great time next weekend. Please take care and travel safe.

  5. In my opinion the poem leads the searcher from place to place in order to discover the place found in the poem . And while searching place to place the searcher is met with an example of where the treasure lies . To be applied after the searcher is tired and weak and has left that place . It is the only way to know where the treasure lies at the actual location as the clues are not all found at the actual location which makes it that much harder .

    • Ya-Sha-Wa, If I understand you correctly, what you are saying: is one of my new theories. I am thinking: we need to learn something at the place of the first clue; to help us later in the search. This might explain why “found the blaze” is past tense – we need to see, (hear, or smell) an example of the “blaze” at the area of the first clue. This is an idea, in my opinion, worth exploring. And this is a fun idea!

    • This was my opinion also. When I look at it from above I see it is shielded with a protective guardian spirit. I also think there is something you need to lift straight up to the sky. There are different levels to this particular object and this one is the highest noble one if I am understanding correctly. I didn’t make it there, but I would try this if I were there today. IMO you will need the guidance from higher and he has thought of everything already. My notes also relate this to the 4 winds or 4 arrows. Also in my notes are fuzzy at this point, but IMO it’s an reference to the branding. My take home so far is that it important to accept the teachings of the wise one and to hand them down through the generations. The younger generations being the most innocent and precious to us. There are so many circles in life that touch us all. I think we all hope for harmony and peace in our lives.

      • Please excuse the typos and grammar…several thoughts mingle together since i can’t physically be there and I have not doubt some of you have experienced the same.

    • Ya-Sha-Wa, I agree with you totally.
      In my opinion,the poem was designed to get people outdoors again and again. It was not designed for us to find Indulgence on the first attempt or the second and the third…etc.
      I also believe that some of the clues have mirror images of things “new and old”.
      “Mirari ” is Latin to wonder at. To “marvel” at.
      If we stop to wonder “why” than maybe,just maybe we are on to something.We just have to find the significance to the poem. Eat a snack,think awhile.
      I believe there’s more to the end than meets the eye. It,s the last 15% of him being correct that worries me. 🙂
      “The whole truth but not all of the truth.”

  6. Hi all, just returned from a search. Would like to write it out to share with everyone. How do I go about doing that? Thanks in advance.

  7. Happy Memorial Day!

    Long time reader, first time poster here. I think I have correctly solved the poem and I will post the solution below. I had been at this for at least 1500 hours before I discovered it in July 2015. The blaze will make your jaw drop, as it is very specific to Mr. Fenn. The reason I am now posting is I have checked it out, and I believe the blaze is no longer there. I have a feeling the solution will draw immediate attention to the area (2 possible creeks with the greater likelihood at the gulch. Everything Fenn has ever said, any clue, any hint cannot be disproved by this location! I have to give up on this one now as I’m in med school and have been out there 4 or 5 times already. The 3rd time I was out I would not commit since there were no trespassing signs posted – I believe the treasure is either on private land or on public land (I am not 100% positive even after I visited the Sublette County office and BLM office). The 4th time I was out there was with one of my classmates in December, however the snow depth became too much at the gulch and we had a flight to catch before we could dig. The 5th time I was out was at the end of April. The snow had melted quickly in west central wyoming. The sun was shining and there was little if any snow on the ground. It was beautiful! I believe it was hidden behind a cattle ranch just south of the Tetons. However, the blaze is no longer there, which I why I am choosing to post this solution :/

    Begin it WWWH – Granite Hot Springs (hot spring swimming pool)
    Take it in the Canyon Down – Hoback Canyon (southwest at first, then southeast, decreasing in elevation as well)

    Not far but too far to walk – (it is about 35 miles and there would be no reason to walk as a major highway takes you to where you put in at this point – 191 Jackson Hole to Pinedale)
    Put in below the home of Brown – This is where the solve starts to get beautiful.

    The Home of Brown is Lamar Ranger Station in NorthEast Yellowstone at 100 deg 14 min. Even though highway 191 is approximately 100 miles south of the Home of Brown, as it runs east it intersects with the longitude of Lamar Ranger Station. Now at this point you are heading directly south (as in traveling by air, or making a solve from above)

    From there it is no place for the meek the end is ever drawing nigh – Not sure of how much import there is here. I believe you head across the south end of the Tetons and then across vast private cattle ranches, and there may be a “drawing” that is associated with the blaze that I’ll explain or show below
    There’ll be no paddle up your creek, just heavy loads and water high – Another beautiful and well-constructed line. As you head south, you will come across 3 waterways about 30 miles from the highway – North Beaver Creek, Cow Gulch, and South Beaver Creek. No paddle up your creek = not Beaver Creek (beavers have paddles), just heavy loads and water high – heavy loads= “cow”, water high = “gulch” (Remember Bessy? 🙂 ) So it is actually at the cow gulch, not up any creek.

    If you’ve been wise and found the blaze – 190 feet up the creek and 8 feet north of the cow gulch is some sort of 6′ by 2′ either wooden of stone object with a giant “F>” facing up! It is completely visible on Google Earth at 43 deg 2 min 20s N, 110 deg 14 min 11s W! When I got there however, all that remained was a conspicuous hole.

    Look quickly down your quest to cease – Thinking it means 1 of 2 things, the chest is directly under the blaze, or the blaze is a path that heads northwest about 70 feet to what looks like the drawing/painting/outline of a man in a cowboy hat (not sure about this one).

    Effort worth the cold – Not sure if this is a reference to the fact that the area between Bondurant, Pinedale, and Big Piney is 1 of the coldest in the continental United States, or the fact that you have to cross the gulch in order to get to the area in which it is hidden.

    Brave and in the wood – Have to pass through “private” land, sagebrush

    alone in there – you park your vehicle at the entrance to the gulch, it is moderately steep on both sides, you walk .75 miles to the location, it is approximately 5-6 miles off the main highway.

    The area is difficult to access and snow covers it for much of the year. Tetons to the north. Fencing to the South and West. The only entrance is to the east, there is a “no trespassing sign” – don’t go during summer months when the cattle ranchers are here. You drive down the beautiful North Beaver Creek then turn south towards the BLM wells 🙂

    I may have missed something and didnt have time to search the whole gulch, or either of the beaver creeks. Could be no paddle up creek just heavy loads water high refer to it being up one of the beaver creeks and the cows are a reference to heavy loads! Not sure. Also there are several “draws” south of this location and towards the Southernmost part of Wyoming which could probably be analyzed as well.

    A couple of notes:
    If you are able to get out there and find it, please think of me 🙂

    Since Fenborree is coming up, I would like to see if someone could run this by the man in charge.

    Never had so much fun putting so much effort into something in my life. Thank you Mr. Fenn!

    Would be happy to work with you guys toward this line of thinking. Would feel even better if I positively knew this was not close to the solution 🙂

  8. Happy Memorial Day Everyone…… FF makes a statement at Moby Dickens Book Shop on 11/02/13 @ 16 minutes into the interview…. Not buried, not behind a tree or a rock, or a waterfall, but out in an open area….. That’s YouTube, Forrest Fenn Moby Dickens Book Shop…… Happy listening

  9. in a canyon
    not for trout
    found a distressed
    damsel on way out
    Abercombie & Fitch folks
    had passed her by
    to this day
    I know not why
    gave her a tow
    but not in slo-mo
    at the highway
    to my surprise
    she gave me her number
    which opened my eyes
    she lives up in
    a mountain home
    been there 6 times
    and will end this poem

    all gold not in boxes
    thanks a Forrest

    • If smart folk done passed her by,
      you best be inspecting with a suspicious eye.
      Often times barnacles, quagga, and Zebra Mussels take hold;
      there may be a valid reason she was left in the cold.
      While there is nothing I can say for sure,
      avoidance is sometimes the best doggone cure.

      • Assigning Crotch and Wetherbee sort,
        As folk bright and clever.
        They left lassie he’s began to court,
        His bonus of the whole endeavor.
        It’s she that might become his dear,
        No sea creatures are needed here.
        Congratulate him for his find,
        for something sweet may bloom in time.

  10. Song lyric I heard that seems eerily appropriate to the Chase:

    “Our ideas held no water, but we used them like a dam.”

  11. Gah!!

    Everytime I look at the mountains, see or hear a plane, look at my fishing pole, or think of getting out of town….

    I’m thinking of my solve!!

    It’s like that song you can’t get out of your head at night and you don’t know all the words…

    “The Girl from Ipanema” comes to mind…

  12. ok , here comes the question that pops up every so often and hope Dal adds the anser to theCHEAT LIST * Does Forrest ever state that no tools are necessary to retrieve the chest?

    • I was wondering the same thing this past weekend.

      I found a cave type thing with some old black fire scars on the walls and a bunch of sticks and debris on the floor. would have forrest put the chest under those sticks? Is that what he meant by being brave and in the wood was to dive in there with my hands and claw that dirt and wood away?

      I am thinking about bringing a small garden pick on my next adventure. seems like it could be a reasonable tool for an archeologist-treasure hunter-adventurer…

      • In my mind, the chest could get covered up over time by debris. Even in a cave, possibly, with wind and snow melt. Maybe high waters.
        So having a small tool seems reasonable to me.
        And yeah, get in there and dig that spot out. Unless an 80 year old man couldn’t get in there.

        • Oh yeah, take a walking stick to stir things up first. In case of snakes or whatever.

    • Arnold – here are some statements on the subject, both are claims that f said them, not directly from him to the public…

      Just so all you seekers know, me and the lads did not dig beneath that thar tree of ours. A mysterious fellow named “f” once sent us a curious poem, part of which said somethin’ like: “…while fools argue about the quest, he won’t even need a tool, as he carries out the chest.”

      Reporter: He did say (referring to Forrest) you won’t have to… If you think you know where it is, you don’t have to dig around, you don’t need to disturb anything.

      Take it for what it’s worth to you; I personally leave the “tools” at home in the shed.

  13. Question…

    Can you solve the poem with only a map that contains land/water features only… no names, roads, airports, Molly Browns house, no man made objects, no human presence at all?

    • clarify; add poem and book of course, for a complete set of tools.
      But the question refers to a map.

    • Yes, I think you could put together a solution like that if you wanted to. I can’t recall any in particular, but there’s been some examples floating around publicly. I’ve come to draw a distinction between a “solution” and the “correct solution”. I don’t know if any of them would be correct, but you could certainly treat the poem as a problem and require a solution to have only those criteria, and end up with something that “works”.

    • It is my opinion that “NO, you can not solve it with a map that contains no words.” I do not think that you could “knowingly” find wwwh w/o words, nor could you find hoB w/o words.

      This is just my opinion though, and what do I know? NADA

      Good luck with your search – words or NO


      • This might not go here but BE CAREFUL….The BIGGEST baddest RAT I have ever seen with ball bearings in his tail looked at me like he was hungry. This guy was a serious character indeed. Up high on a remote Mesa that he owned and didn’t appear to like trespassers. Stretched out he was soaking up lots of sun energy and when he coiled his strike span appeared to be probably about nine feet.

    • No, you could not. This question seems similar to little indy. You just added the book, which I didn’t find to be much help in solving the clues in the poem. It’s a good idea and this is why, how would you know where you are on the map? Without being there, unless you were there before? You would have to follow the physical geography features that’s how. How a river bends or the shape of a lake, could things like these be answers to some of the clues? It would be like driving across the country and getting to your destination without any signs on the road, at lest I could drive as fast as I wanted LOL.

      • Actually I wasn’t considering the book or the poem… those are given, I added them later so others wouldn’t say… what about the book and the poem?

        The question relates to a map with nothing more than natural features… Think GE and zoom capability without any man made titles or objects.

        You said; ” It would be like driving across the country and getting to your destination without any signs on the road,”

        That is similar to what I mean… can you travel across the country with no road sign? the North West passage didn’t have them… At one time fenn said he wished he was born 100 earlier… 1830’s in the mid-west and RM’s were very different. Do we need these “signs and names” to figure out the clues?
        I wonder what the area would look like in a 1000 years.

        • So, could this puzzle truly be that difficult like the analogy I stated above except, on top of it your looking for a small box thats hidden as your destination?

          Ideas like this make me think how valuable intimate knowledge of the correct search area is.

          All of this does make me think that’s what it would of been like for Lewis and Clark but with no roads or signs.

          I truly enjoy your questions, they get the wheels a turning.

    • I don’t think so. IMO it is more important to have the correct time period map. Names change over the years.

  14. I don’t have a book – but I think that the poem and a map will get you there imo

    • Poem and map is all you need. I do think that most people are using the books wrong. I believe we must study the poem & map intensely and then the hints in the book can give confirmation. Most people are going about it backwards.

  15. Seeker,
    Great question!
    (“…I’ve been through the mountains with a map with no names…”)
    IMO, a searcher using such a map, together with the poem, the hints in the book, and a knowledge of geography (and of course a flashlight, a sandwich, and gloves) would miss several of the clues, and would not be able to find the blaze.
    “Have flashlight, will travel”

    • Hello Jeremy P. Thank you for the link. I just listened to it and enjoyed it very much. Mr. Fenn is so funny with his “clue.” Do I hear the thunder of reservations being made to Rocky Mountain National Park??? Better hurry! Just heard on the news how the national parks are considering limiting the daily entrances, but Rocky Mountain National Park will not consider this. They’re thinking of something different, but “different” wasn’t explained. This is so much fun. Thank you, Mr. Fenn. 🙂

    • Two interesting point… have been stated before yet worth repeating;
      Approx 11 min. ” …I looked up words and definition of words and changed them, went back and rebooted…”
      Approx. 11:40 min. ” …sure, I mean, people figured the first couple clues and personally walked past the chest…”

      The definitions comment doesn’t surprise me… Multiple Meanings.

      But the more I think about the first clue[s] … these comments, Little Indy, and all the other comments pertaining to the first clue[s] and how those searcher went / walked pass where the chest lays in wait…
      Seems to me the area is to start and finish is one in the same. A small area with no mileage between clues.
      Getting to the first clue may be a different story…

        • I’m familiar with that Q&A… he walk less than a few miles to the hide. Fenn as also stated, if a searcher can’t walk several miles in their solve the shouldn’t go. Fenn stated, he made two trips from his car to the hide in one afternoon.

          What I was wondering about is the clues themselves, all being very close…
          Getting to the first clue may take some hiking, but once there, it seems that the clues are very close to the chest itself…
          ” …sure, I mean, people figured the first couple clues and personally walked past the chest…”

          Fenn as also stated those searchers didn’t know the had the first clue[s]… Yet they all seem to go by/ went pass/ walked pass the other seven clue.

          The comment in this interview places those searcher that figured out the first clues were near the chest as well.

          • Hello Seeker. You’ve stated, ‘Getting to the first clue may take some hiking, but once there, it seems that the clues are very close to the chest itself…’ Wouldn’t the first clue be where you start and perhaps the second clue is “may take some hiking”?

          • I would of agree at one time Pdenver, but with all the comments about the first two and searcher walking past the other seven clue… and apparently pass the chest… It seems all the clues are very close and not miles apart.

            The one question I would like answered is did fenn travel the “exact” path as the poem? It was asked at one time, and I believe fenn stated [ not a quote ] the poem is the only way. But is that the true way he went?

            Fenn walked less than a few miles twice… @ 3 miles round trip, twice, that would be a single trip of approx, 3/4 of a mile, or approx 3900′ If he followed the poem… that puts all the clues in that 3900′ area [ close enough for horseshoes]

          • Seeker – you probably already know this quote, but if not, I think it comes closest to answering your question about the path f took to get to the final spot.

            Q. When you hid your treasures, did you take the same path that is described in the poem, or were you able to skip some of the steps because of your familiarity with the area?
            Thank you Curtis
            A. The clues should be followed in order Curtis. There is no other way to my knowlege.f

          • Hello Seeker. It does seem interesting. I keep asking myself, if the first clue(s) are so close to each other, how are the people walking by the treasure chest? Could the possibility be they’re not that close? Let me give an example of figuring out the first clue(s) and walking past the other seven and the treasure chest. Let’s say someone ended up at Old Faithful and took the loop and in that loop were the first couple clues. Let’s say there’s a path or area off of the loop that one is suppose to go up and finish the other clues, but it wasn’t taken, hence, walking past the other seven clues and the treasure chest. In reality, the statement would be true, but it doesn’t say how close the first clue(s) is to the next one and the treasure chest. I’m not saying this is accurate. I’m offering a different perspective of understanding the answer given.

            As far as the distance he walked, I also ask myself when he answered the question, did he mean it as total distance traveled or one way?

            You asked if Mr. Fenn traveled the exact path as the poem. I’m not sure if the following two links will help, but I’ll post them. It’s possible there’s something else I’ve read that he may have, but I may be mistaken. Perhaps others will have more information.




          • Hello JCM. Thank you for posting. The link you’ve provided is the one I was looking for to help Seeker. 🙂

          • PD & JCM… thanks for the Q&A’s

            I just posted to frank about the “order” or “consecutive order” fenn has used as well.
            But to make my point on my thoughts let me add fenn’s other word about the clue… Contiguous: sharing a common border; touching. next or together in sequence.
            synonyms; adjacent, neighboring, adjoining, bordering, next-door.

            So with with this new comment and all the others as well… does it seem that we need to travel miles between clues, use vehicle or any other transportation between clues?

            Every comment that I can recall about the first two clues, the other seven clues, the closeness to the chest [ and those comment are splatter all over this blog ]
            all indicated they walked pass the remainder of the clues and now apparently the chest itself.

            I just don’t see miles… nevertheless, 10 or 90 miles from one clue to another. Especially if “Contiguous” is accurate. I understand folks have worked on their theories, put hours of research in, many trips to their locations, swear by their solve… it’s tough to look at the poem different. But none of our brilliant solve add up. The one thing that has been consistent to the first two clue is; by fenns own words… no one knew that had them correct… they didn’t understand the significance of where they were.

            I’m just looking at this thing from every perspective.

          • Hello Seeker. I believe you’re doing a great job asking questions and trying to look at things from different angles.

          • PD,

            I’m just hoping someone with a few more working brain cells will tell me the answers…lol

          • Seeker – I have long had the opinion that all the clues are close to one another and I believe that people have walked by and continue to walk by those last seven clues not realizing what they are, and also right past the chest. This may now only be the last five clues people are walking by if f was correct in saying that someone may have figured out three or four of the clues.

            In my personal solution to the poem, the only things which requires a car is first getting to the area and then “not far, but too far to walk”. With that, my personal search area still meets the definition you are considering with the word “contiguous”. I could go into detail with the poem about why this makes logical, rational sense, but I am smug enough not to provide this thinking for others. Besides, most don’t care much except about how they interpret the whole thing based upon their own research, regardless of what f may have said at various times.

            I believe you are correct on the part that people don’t know for sure that they have had they first two clues correct, but I would add that I think a few have some level of confidence in that they may be correct, otherwise f wouldn’t be saying some people might have figured out the 3rd and 4th clues.

            I do, however, believe that those who arrived and didn’t understand the significance of where they were were people who just happened to be out searching and stopped off somewhere along the way. That place happened to be the correct area, but it was not part of their search, and then they continued on their merry-of-a-vacation way completely clueless of what they had just passed by. Why? Because they haven’t thought the right things that would have clued them into understanding just where they were at.

            Keep looking at it from the many various perspectives, I also try to do so as a means to challenge my own thinking; I consider your public process of doing so to be of high value and one of the very few reasons I even participate on this blog.

          • JCM
            Just for fun, the comment about the 3 or 4 clues… I have wonder if those folks haven’t even gone searching. I’m not going to look up that comment as this is just a thought… but the way fenn indicated “he” didn’t know if they knew, gives me the impression he learned about that information possibly from the blog[s] or one on one conversation.

            Anyways, I can see a distance involved if I look at it from a point by point view. start at wwh, “take it in” the canyon means to “look down the view”, see the next clue, and the reason for the vague line of not far but to far to walk… meaning having to travel around said canyon.

            That would indicate hoB is viewable from the rim/other end of the canyon or lookout area. I Say that because, there is no distance of measurement in the poem unless force fit by change words such as far to four… I don’t buy into that. Any true distance from the book ..imo.. is not true as fenn stated “you don’t need to read my book”

            My last thought or one of my last thoughts… the number of clues [9] don’t match the number of answers.
            example; stanza 1 2 3 could hold 6 clues with one or two answers or references.
            This is not popular theory, but if you think about it… 3 or 4 clues may have been indicated, but no one knows that those four clues lead to, a single answer, reference/place.
            leaving searcher at the first two clues, but never putting the other needed clue in with them [ together] to know exactly what and why they were there.

            or all the clues must be known of in one spot, to understand what it is that is needed to be known. This is a thinking game, and not so much a tour…imo.

            The first clue is more than just a place to start… it’s the answer to the poem.


          • Seeker – “The first clue is more than just a place to start… it’s the answer to the poem.” You and I are of one mind on this, and for very similar reasons. This has been my line of thinking for a couple years. Everything ff has said during that time corroborates this – IMO. In fact, looking back, I believe everything he’d said before I came to this notion supported it…I just didn’t catch it earlier.

            I also think the solve will be “layered”, like a 3-D chess game. And, that the “word that is key” will identify the correct wwwh. All just my opinion.

          • Seeker – with regard to the 3 or 4 clues, I had initially included your thought that someone may not have even been there or just not back to the area who had figured out these additional two clues, but I deleted it because my posts always end up too long. Of course that opens a challenge to only the first two clues being solved from home, which I am not going to get into here.

            I hope Loco doesn’t go loco over the number of our responses back and forth on this string. 🙂

          • It seemed that way to me as well. The stones had lichen so it was easier to tell which ones had been moved. I was there a week ago. Did you happen to see the spot where someone had looked deep?

      • At 11:45, I heard “….first (uh) couple of clues and unfortunately walked right past the treasure chest”.

    • One useful thing some can take away from this interview is that he did actually say it’s “not in a cave”. He says he’s said that before, but in every interview I’ve listened to he said “not in a mine” and “not in a tunnel”, which left the question of a small, shallow cave somewhat still plausible.

      In fact, I was even wondering if he was avoiding saying the word “cave” because some might consider the place it’s actually at to be a cave. Seemed like a short, not tunnel, cave might still be in play.

      I think that can safely be ruled out now.

      • However, it does not rule out a “cavette” – similar to a cave dwelling, etched into the vertical side of a cliff….

        • Hello Melanie. This is an interesting thought. Yet, I can’t help to think that it may still be considered a cave. I keep thinking of Mr. Fenn speaking to someone about the topic of a dam not being where warm waters halt. A beaver’s dam was brought up and he said it’s still a dam. Your thoughts may be correct.

          This is an opinion, offered as a thought.

          • Hi pdenver. I noticed that sometime ago you suggested to someone that if their solve didn’t work out that they could go get some ice cream as a condolence. Maybe I had read too much into that statement but may I ask if you were at that place on your last search and if you were if had considered the ‘cave’ close by? Forgive me if I am on a tangent and misinterpreted your words.

          • pdenver,

            The correct photo still isn’t being displayed!

            It shows FF sitting in front of a stone wall of sorts; drinking a beverage from a can.


          • Hello SL. Thank you for the link. I am aware of the photo for which you speak. It is interesting. I do believe the photo is a hint. Right now, my tired mind hears “stone wall” and thinks Stonewall Jackson. Then I think of Jackson Hole, WY. I think I’m going in the wrong direction. Hope I can find my way to my pillow. 🙂

          • Hello alopes. I believe I commented to JD about getting ice cream for the kids to top off a nice search. He felt ice cream as a condolence. If I’m not mistaken, JD searches in Montana. I do not. Within the past three weeks, I went out for another search. In my area, I had checked a rock overhang and other features. On our return, I saw what looked like a cave, and knowing we’ve been told it’s not in a cave, I still asked my husband to climb the rocks and check for me. Empty as expected. I’ll be leaving tomorrow to do some camping and fishing in Leadville for the weekend. If the fish aren’t biting, I’ll pick up a good book and do more studying, while the fellas continue to coax the fish to their bait/lure. 🙂

          • Hi, pdenver. Thanks for replying. I let my thoughts wander and had an inkling that you were at a place that holds interest to me. The ‘cave’ I mentioned is at ground level though. It was the ice cream comment that peaked my interest as ice cream is an Indulgence. I hope that you have a delightful camping trip. Be safe and ttfn. (ta ta for now)

          • Hello alopes. I understand the connection you’ve made with my previous comment. Did you get to check your cave? As for ice cream being an indulgence, some may see it as a necessity. 😉

            Thank you for the well wishes. I greatly appreciate it. There’s nothing like camping in the woods and putting in a fishing line in the water and catching hungry fish. At least I hope they’re hungry. If not, the fellas will have to be stuck eating my home-cooked meals. 🙂

            P.S. “Put in”…I guess I have the chase on my mind. 🙂

          • Hello pdenver,
            I read your post on your camping trip. I am from Indiana and have never been to the Rockies. I have what I consider a pretty good friend. He was telling me of a place that he fished at one time. For the life of me I cannot think of the name of it. I believe it is near where you are heading. I am planning on visiting him soon and I will ask him all about it. We are all getting older and from what I remember I do not think he will ever return but sounded like he did enjoy his time there. Be safe and enjoy your time with your loved ones. Oh I forgot to point something out. With temps warming up should make the fish ready to feast. If your lucky you will not have to cook.

          • Hello ACE. Looks like the fishing and camping trip has ended up to be a “Father and 2 Sons” weekend in Leadville. I feel confident the fellas will catch plenty of fish. We usually go at about this time, because the ice will have recently cleared and the fish are hungry. Left them with plenty of food should their stringer come up empty. They’ll have a good time “shooting the bull” without a woman being in earshot. 🙂 Where they’re heading, has been a family favorite when my husband was a boy. His father was an air traffic controller from the previous Stapleton Airport. Pilots would flyover their spot to let him know when the waters were ice free. 🙂

          • Hi, pdenver. I bypassed the ‘cave’ for something a little more interesting in that area. Take it in the canyon down. Do you hear what I’m saying? 🙂

          • Hello alopes. I’m not sure. Although, your words seem to be a little similar to my area, yet my “cave” sat higher in the rock(s). Hmmm, now you’re making me think. I think my “cave” sat higher, but yet, it may have been considered ground level, with an inclination. Would that be considered “ground level”? Up in elevation, yet ground level? Continue to take it in the canyon down, alopes. 🙂

          • Hi, Pdenver, yes, at an inclination but at ground level. Up from the place that gives me the chills. About 200 feet from the water where one could eat a sandwich. I went south from there into the canyon.

          • Pdenver, sorry that was kinda rushed. I am talking about that place but I did not go there. South at that canyon. Look on google earth and when you find la place qui est weak then go south from there and see what you can see.

          • Hello alopes. How far did you walk? Please don’t answer if you feel it gives too much of your solve away. I walked a few miles, then my body started to let me know it wasn’t pleased, so I had to go back knowing I still had the same distance from where I came. I was able to get to my area and when I did, I was in awe. Pleased that I made it and pleased to see my blaze. Not sure how long it will be before I get to go back and check it again. Many factors stand in the way.

          • Hello alopes. Please excuse my sleepy concentration. It seems I’m not sure where you’re guiding me. I know you can’t explain further because it may compromise your solve.

          • I don’t mind at all. I sent Dal an email and I figure he may post my BOTG when he isn’t busy on the road for Fennboree. I am throwing my solve out there and if it can help someone here then that’s great. I hope they throw me some coins 😉 . I didn’t take the trail that goes around, because it was really far for me. I went straight into the canyon( over the fence) so the arrival time was minimal, maybe thirty minutes. Did you make it to spot and see the stones?

          • Hello alopes. I was looking, but I couldn’t find them. I found my blaze, but then I seemed to have got lost from there. I looked down, but I saw others have turned over stones/rocks, too. I can only giggle about the fun I’m having trying to figure this out. 🙂

          • Pdenver. Shoot! I replied in the wrong spot. The reply is above. I might take this conversation in the comment section down.

  16. ok seeker imo – I don’t think that ff went the same way as the poem and nether are we – from wwwh its not far but to far to walk – and the end is farther away and to the left – so he could not say – from wwwh drive your car and pass hob and keep going north till you get on road so and so and turn left and park- so he wrote the poem as if you had to put botg starting from hob – so from there you could go north on the map and find the road he couldn’t tell you to turn left on and park – its like a cross – from hob go north – cross the road go north in the wood – this is just my opinion hope it helps – frank

    • Frank, you could be correct.
      I don’t see the need for a vehicle when is pertains to any clue… other than to get you from home to site. I don’t know… it just doesn’t make sense to the comment… “…sure, I mean, people figured the first couple clues and personally walked past the chest…”

      That doesn’t sound like they got back in their vehicle and drove miles from one clue to another… It also doesn’t make sense with the other comments, folks indicated the first two clues and walked pass the other seven. [ I’ll add; fenn used terms in different comments about the first two clues, as,” walked”, “went pass/by” the remainder of the clues ]

      Honestly though, I don’t care anymore about the later clues.

      Knowing why and where we need to start seems to be the only way to understand how to finish the poem… There seems to be a reason he has us starting where he wants us to be. A significance of why we need to be there.

      Folks like to use the word “consecutive”, because fenn stated the clues are in consecutive order. I’m leaning toward another word fenn used about the clues as well, “contiguous” meaning; close to, touching, neighboring.

      • imo – every clue from where he parked are close togather the only ones that are far apart from each other is wwwh to hob from hob to where he parked – and that’s a few miles from wwwh to where he parked- from where he parked to where he hid the chest imo its about as far as a foot ball field in length all this is just my opinion

        • imo – there are 3 stanzas that only talk about one place – the other 3 tells you how to get there and imo you only make one stop

  17. Seeker;

    I am sorry, I just do not agree, nor do I follow your logic.

    In my solve, I start my trip (NOT first clue though) at wwwh. I could go downstream 11.3 miles, or drive almost exactly 10 miles. I change direction (put in) and drive another 9.2 miles – past meek place – to the “END” – the
    end is ever drawing nigh. I park, get out and hike 1/2 mile to “No paddle”, Water High, the blaze and the treasure (Hopefully) I have traveled (by road) almost 20 miles, and walked a total of two miles,,,all following the poem.

    Why do you feel that there is no driving (or other means of travel) past hoB?

    Am I reading your post correctly?

    And YES, I believe that the poem follows the EXACT path that ff took, and YES, there is no other way of getting from wwwh to the TC other than the one described in the poem.

    Just a question to spur thought.

    Good luck to all searchers and STAY SAFE


    • JD,
      “YES, there is no other way of getting from wwwh to the TC other than the one described in the poem.”
      That’s a given… But I’m not to sure if fenn took the same exact way we are being told… although it is possible IF it is a one way in and one way out, then it would be reasonable that fenn would have to travel the same route.

      You tell of your distance of 11 -10 miles and change direction and drive another 9…ok… but if know where your “no paddle” is, and that is where you put botg… why drive the other clues? why drive the 20 miles if you know where you park to start hiking? See, that doesn’t make sense to me at all.

      In the latest interview that JeremyP posted… fenn stated that the searcher [people] figured the first couple clues and personally walked past the chest…”

      Add the comment that searcher indicated the first two clues and walked pass the other seven… how can a vehicle be involved?

      Jeremy p. loco, myself and a couple others went back and forth on the first two clues comments a while back… plastered quotes, comments, Q&A’s etc. and all those comments had two thing that were consistent… walked past the other seven clues, walked past the chest.

      I just don’t get 20 miles of needed driving between clues.

      So here is a question for you and your solve, if you don’t mind sharing… what is the reason for you needing to be at the first clue? if you know of it and know where your going next… why bother being there? Is it the only vantage point to see the next clue? I’m curious.

      • seeker if I may – I don’t think that walk really means walk like botg – I think he means – they figured 2 clues right and the other 7 they got wrong -imo

        • Frank, I don’t see any other way to take walk to mean anything else but walk.

          ” …people figured the first couple clues and personally walked past the chest…”

          That comment must include the other seven clues. in an earlier comment fenn stated almost the same as; searcher indicated the first two clues and walked pass the other seven.

          This time he added “personally walked past the chest” if the clues are consecutive and contiguous… Unless I have gone off the deep end, walking pass everything is what is being told.

          • seeker you could be right – in my solve, I don’t see any one walking , from hob to where he parked – but I guess it can be done

          • Seeker. I think you have a very valid view of things. The statements about ‘personally walking past’ are leaving me scratching my head. In my solve the first clue is As I have gone alone in there and the second clue is Begin it wwwh- those aren’t the clues but what I have used to find the 1st and 2nd clues ( if that makes sense). Those two clues are in the Rockies and the next few aren’t so it made sense to me then the next few are. Now, as I understand it, he has said that one is able to figure out the first few clues but personally walk right past the others. Shoot! That sure sounds like one can solve the poem staying in one area? As always, IMO.

          • Just giving you something else to consider Seeker.

            I got a new cell phone a couple of weeks ago. I really had a lot of trouble learning to use it because I wasn’t used to a windows phone and the phone wasn’t working right. I couldn’t fix the settings on my own, so I called tech support. They WALKED me right through it and got the problem resolved.

            My daughter is working on some math homework today. It is tough stuff; Algebra 2. My husband showed her how to do it and then said, “now WALK through it and show me how you get the right answer”.

            Not that this version of walk is the correct one. But, it is something to think about.

            It is possible for someone to WALK through a solve on paper, without ever having left the house. In fact, I’ve walked several of my solutions through on Google Earth. I was amazed that I could “virtually walk” a trail and see it in great detail! But, then it is possible that I “walked” right past some clues and didn’t know it.

      • Seeker;

        You make no sense at all…in my opinion.

        If I am in Pocatello, ID, and I have to go to Idaho Falls.

        Just because I KNOW where Idaho Falls is, does not mean that I do not have to drive in order to get there.

        Just because I KNOW where my END is does not magically transport me to that spot.

        And YES, if there is only one road IN and the same road OUT from hob to END – That is the road that I must travel.

        I do not have to STOP at wwwh, on the way to below hoB, and I do not have to stop at hoB on my way to END, I just have to know where they are, and where to “Put in”…If that makes sense.

        Hope that this answers your questions. If not, rephrase, and I will try to do better.

        Good luck to all – and STAY SAFE


        • I think Seeker has presented a very logical case. To say he has not is to ignore all the statements by Fenn (which Seeker and otheres just referenced) that work together in a very straightforward fashion. IMO these statements tell a story about how the chest was placed and the nature of the path…you just have to listen.

          IMO the one thing that cinches this is his stated purpose….to get people/kids out into the woods. He never said he wanted to get people out for a long Sunday drive…..No wilderness experience there.

          “Dad how far is it to the treasure….are we there yet?”

        • IMO, Hi, JD. I see what you are saying, although isn’t it true that if you were giving someone directions from Pocatello to Idaho Falls it might be different story? Of course, you would give them easy directions and Fenn’s directions are anything but that. 🙂

  18. I wonder if Forrest would answer this question for us….

    “Dear Forrest, how far (feet, miles, etc.) was the walk from your car to the final resting place of the trove? One way from car to trove location?”

    The answer cannot give anything ways, but could help searchers evaluate the reality of their own solves. Could also help searchers determine if their health would permit the trek.

    Fingers crossed he will answer!

    • Didn’t he already answer that question by saying something to the effect of “Less than a few”?

        • I see it differently. My question hasn’t been answered. The one way from car to trove location distance hasn’t been answered directly.

          I’d like my question as written answered if Forrest happens to read it and be inclined to answer. No harm in asking.

          • “how far you walked to hide the treasure after leaving your car”

            “how far (feet, miles, etc.) was the walk from your car to the final resting place of the trove”

            Sorry Twingem, I think it is the same question, though some semantics could be argued, but you would be twisting words to make them not be the same.

            Knowing f, even if he reads your question, his answer to your question will be silence. He doesn’t answer q’s in the comments section of the blogs, though many before you have solicited him to do so.

          • Appreciate your input. The question shouldn’t be a concern for anyone. Hopefully he will answer; if not, no worries for me. I march to the beat of my own drum for sure. I have no regrets and huge rewards from doing so.

            Have a great day! May you each hear the beat of your own drum in the chase. Peace.

          • JCM, he has answered questions several times over the years in the comments. Just do a little research to read them.

        • Q. I was wondering if you would be so bold as to give an estimate of how far you walked to hide the treasure after leaving your car: was it >10 miles, between 5 and 10 miles, between 1 and 5 miles, or less than 1 mile? ~Thanks, Ron

          Based on this question, I agree with Twingem.

          Based on Forrest’s two trips comment, the act of “hiding the treasure” after leaving his car required Forrest to walk the distance 4 times (…”how far you walked…”).

          If you believe his answer referred to the total distance walked, it’s less that 3/4 of a mile from where he parked. If you believe his answer referred to one leg, the total distance could be up to 12 miles (based on your definition of a few).

          As Twingem suggested, the extra 2 1/4 miles each way could prevent some people from searching and a clarification would be helpful.

          • One thing I’ve been thinking about the parking spot is how he says, “As I walked back to my car there was no one else around…” To me there could have been others around but there wasn’t at that time, so this spot could be a place where others do stop occasionally, just a thought to keep in mind when a searcher thinks they are at his parking spot.

          • Pair the “less than a few miles” comment with this other comment from f:

            “If you can’t make two trips from your car to your solve in several hours, then don’t go.”

            Make a mathematical story problem out of the two and you can come up with a realistic approximation of the distance from the car to the treasure chest.

            I believe that this conversation has been had at least once before somewhere around here if you want to go looking for it.

            Now, at what point in the nine clues did he park and start walking…

            “If a person will think, they can find the chest; but the secret is to think and analyze… they can find the chest.”

    • And here was his answer as the others have alluded to…

      Q. I was wondering if you would be so bold as to give an estimate of how far you walked to hide the treasure after leaving your car: was it >10 miles, between 5 and 10 miles, between 1 and 5 miles, or less than 1 mile? ~Thanks, Ron
      A. Ron, your question sounds like a travelogue, but I’ll answer it. No, I don’t want to be that bold. But I will say that I walked less than a few miles if that will help. I just looked “few” up and one definition is “scant.” Why do I sound like I’m talking in circles? f

      • Full Definition of few

        : consisting of or amounting to only a small number

        : at least some but indeterminately small in number —used with a

      • Did you ever notice “few” definition is scant; a synonym?

        Tarry synonym; dwell
        scant; wanting
        Marvel; phenomenon
        Gaze; study

        Just thought floating in my empty storage space.

          • See Jake, your too fixated on straightforwards you can’t see the light.

            Some searcher, self included, have thought that the chest could be found by a shadow affect of a natural fixture. or maybe a slot/hole in a natural stone structure that would shine sun light on a certain spot once/twice a year. So maybe tarry scant with marvel gaze is indicating to look down dwell at this phenomenon that will only last a short time, study where it lead to what you want. your guest to cease.

            I’ll take it one step further… “take it in’ the canyon down” A physical trek or a visual observation? and the rest of the poem describes what is seen from that vantage point… have ya “found” the blaze yet?

            Just linger on that thought a bit, try and picture it in your mind.

            So why can’t little Indy or anyone else get pass the first two clues with just the poem and a map of the Rockies?
            Why did those searcher walk pass the other clues, and the chest? why is the first clue critical that if you don’t have than nailed down just stay home?
            What is the one important possibility no one has mentioned?

            Have you ever wondered why fenn kicks off Spring searches, and warns us after fall to sit by the fire, shut of the engines, relax… don’t go in the mountains in winter?

            Good luck on your straightforwards stomping out 9 of different locations.

          • That’s right Seeker, I’m sticking to straightforward.
            Do you know why?
            Because some man said the poem is & wasn’t playing games as most of us are.
            Maybe you have been blinded by the light.

          • ” …I looked up words and definition of words and changed them, went back and rebooted…”

            ” I tend to use words that aren’t in the dictionary, and others that are, I bend a little.”

            “Would you want the person that finds your treasure to admire the place where it rests? Andrew
            Well Andrew, I’m not sure “admire” is the right word but if we twist it a little maybe we can make it work. The word means approval or high regard. So it works. I sure feel that way or I would not have hidden it there. I like the way you think Andrew. f”

            Just wondering what your straightforwards line of thinking is about just these few statements?

          • Seeker,
            The exact quote is:
            “I tend to use some words that aren’t in the dictionary, and others that are, I bend a little. My only goal in this endeavor is to talk about a few of my life experiences…”

            He is talking about his book in the preface.
            Yes the poem is in the book & which words in the poem that are not in the dictionary?
            Just because he uses some words that aren’t in the dictionary doesn’t mean it’s not straightforward.
            I guess it depends on which dictionary your using.

            In one definition of admire is regard.
            Forrest changes it to: “approval or high regard”.
            That’s twisting a little. It’s still straightforward.

            I could not find this quote you stated:
            ” …I looked up words and definition of words and changed them, went back and rebooted…”


          • Jake look on this page… Jeremy p posted a link to a radio interview a couple days ago.

            When it comes to the perface of the book, you don’t consider that fenn is stating that is his normal usage ofwords or at the very least…one of those thousands of subtle hints?

            This is all fine if you believe the words in the poem are to mean exactly as it appears… But have listen to the interview anyways.

          • Thanks Seeker,
            That’s what happens when work picks up.
            I miss things here & there.

            I did not listen to the interview completely & probably will not before my trip.
            That is a good find by JP & one of the comments he made about not in a cave I’ll buy that.

            When it comes to the preface, I think it’s about the book & very little if any of the poem. The quote about straightforward is about the poem only as far as I heard the Q&A.

            I never said LOL, “words in the poem are to mean exactly as it appears”.
            Exactly is not the same as straightforward.
            Maybe you need to be more precise.

  19. begin it where warm water halt and take it in the canyon down not far but to far to walk put in below the home of brown – if its put in below the home of brown – and its to far to walk to where he parked – I don’t see much walking being done – only from where he parked to where he hid the treasure chest – so to me – imo he walked north of in the wood which is not far to where he hid the chest – all this is imo

  20. Has anybody else used the (3) from “there” in the first line, with the 2, 4, 2 in the “to walk” line to get where forrest “begins” from?

  21. jd your efforts will be worth the cold – cold to me means north – if you are brave and in the wood- in my solve the chest is south of the creek (no paddle ) and north of in the wood imo

  22. IMO, I believe that when you get to the home of Brown that you yourself are not ‘putting in’ below it but that you are looking for what was’ put in’ below the home of Brown. This sentence to me does not read as an imperative but rather as a declarative.

  23. Seeker, and others,
    IMO, it is not necessary to drive from the first clue to the parking spot; however, it is IMO necessary to know precisely the location of the first clue (and the others, of course), in order to choose an appropriate parking spot before walking to the hiding place. “Precisely” is the bugaboo that I’ve been working on for months. Safe searching, everyone!
    “Have flashlight, will travel”

    • What if the first clue is a large area and all the other clues are within that area? Then once you got to clue two you would still be within clue one. Maybe an idea like all the clues are circles and the next clue is a circle within the last making all of the clues part of one, the first one.

      T. S. Eliot said:

      We shall not cease from our exploration
      And at the end of all our exploring
      Will be to arrive where we started
      And know the place for the first time.

      • And why do we know it for the first time? I figure the first time we didn’t know it because we were exploring, when we came back around then we knew. What do you say?

        • And why do we know it for the first time? Discovery! How often does our exploring lead to what we are looking for? Look at Columbus or Lewis and Clark how far did they explore before there discovery? It was right in front of them and all along the way. At the end of there exploration did they realize that? Or did they know there discovery for the first time?

    • Geoff in Idaho, I agree with you. Park the car one time. Get out and walk to the precise location of the TC. I think the area from the first clue to the last is not a large distance.

    • I put my take on it over there.
      Basically, it might remove most of northern Montana from the search zone.

    • JD,

      I have my crazy thoughts on this like usual. Reading between the lines, he is wondering if anyone has figured out the last stanza in my opinion. I do have my position on this because I am only 67% correct. What color is a daffodil again?

  24. It would be fun to see FF flying his F-100C in the Battle of the Little Bighorn. Not sure the US government would take too kindly to him fighting on the right side of history.

  25. I would like to ask fenn a question. Would you go – where from hob, where from you put in below the home of brown or where from where you would park after putting in below the home of brown?

  26. I am not sure what it means, but I find it interesting that the last word of the post is “in-between”. I looked it up, and it can be either inbetween or in-between.

    Either way, I wonder if this compound word has a specific meaning?

    Just food for thought.

    Good luck to all searchers and STAY SAFE.


    • If I had to guess and that’s what I am doing then I would say, IMO, hinting at something that is in between other things, the thing that comes to mind is a line in the poem that was placed for a specific purpose. IMO.

      • “in between” is an interesting word that definitely fits the solve I’m working on.

  27. Here is something to think about and all IMO. Fenn’s rainbow. The goal is to get to the end of Fenn’s rainbow, IMO only. So the places that you travel to while on your adventure ( imagine you are filling in the lines on a dot to dot drawing) begin at one end of the rainbow and end at the other. A rainbow is not a circle, obviously, and if you are trying to arrive where you started and know the place for the first time then how can you be following Fenn’s rainbow? The circle undertone and the rainbow undertone seem to be in conflict with each other. IMO

      • Wow! That is pretty cool. I did not know that was a possibility. Well, now I have to rethink this, again. 🙂

      • Checked off my bucket list… Vernal Falls, Yosemite NP.

        Thanks Forrest! Your dare to enjoy the majestic beauty of our National Parks was the catalyst for hiking Vernal Falls yesterday. We were rewarded with a rainbow and very sore thighs. Heads held high, a very difficult steep climb for me. (I don’t know how to post my own photo.)


        • Hey 42- Wish I had known you were in Yosemite. We have a vacation home abt 25 min from the North entrance of Yosemite. We spend half of our time there and half of our time in our other home in Central California. I just now got back from our Yosemite house where I’ve been for several days. We hiked the mist trail along Vernal Falls a couple of weeks ago. It was the only time I’ve ever seen a full circle rainbow. The mist reflects the light and we always see such beautiful rainbows there but this last time, we saw a full circle one. Got great pictures. Enjoy Yosemite. It is where we spend much of our time hiking back country trails and enjoying nature.

        • Puzzled, many thanks for your kind offer. We could have initiated
          Fennboree Cal style! Since I can’t find Fenn’s treasure I’m enjoying other treasured landscapes. Would have enjoyed meeting you.
          We stayed at the south entrance and enjoyed every beautiful vista we could climb, hike, swim or drive to. The mist trail to Vernal/Nevada falls was the steepest hike I’ve done and my all time favorite. what a rewarding view and feeling of accomplishment. Hard to keep pace with my 21 yr old son, but surprised us both I did it.
          Last time I was in Yosemite was 27 yrs ago…the magnificence of creation here leaves me breathless! You are fortunate to play here on a regular basis. Best wishes.

    • As you stand at one end of the rainbow, and look up towards the center, will it be any different when you stand at the other end and look up at the center…I think not, so you have arrived “where you started”…in a way.

      Just a thought.


    • Hello alopes. It’s wonderful to chase the end of rainbows. Several years ago while camping in Rocky Mountain National Park, a rainbow formed in the field we were camping in one morning. Other people stood near us taking photos, just as I was. I told my kids to run towards the end, because it was a once-in-a-lifetime experience to stand at the end of one. They ran, as did the people that took photos near me, realizing the rarity and opportunity that was offered. 🙂

      • Great story pdenver. Hope this finds you well. Have a great summer. I went out treasure hunting with my friend the other day and came back with a 1957 painting. : )

        • Hello Kedar’s Mom. Thank you for the compliment and well wishes. I greatly appreciate them. So pleased to hear you found a 1957 painting while treasure hunting. Having a friend with you is even better. 🙂

      • That is a once in a life time event. It is a nice memory to be able to share. Thanks, pdenver.

    • How close to where you begin does anyone think they have to arrive where they started…?


      A person goes into a lumber yard and buys some lumber…the cashier says to drive around back to pick up the order. You get into your vehicle and drive out of the parking lot and down the street one half of a block and turn into the back area where the actual lumber is stored.

      You started at the “front” of the lumber yard but had to leave it and drive a ways and then “back” into the lumber yard.

      Is this where you begin or not…?

  28. @JD Bering land bridge comes to my mind with this weekly word answer, his desire to have been with the first human to step into North America.

    • You may well be right. The question is…what does a bridge, of any kind, have to do with the poem or the solution? How does “in-between” relate to the supposed bridge?

      Lots to ponder.


      • The painting Forrest bought of a dead dog bleeding over a bridge? Forrest had a scrapbook about jumping off of a bridge?

      • I wonder why Forrest said that he would have liked to be with the Indians at the Custer fight? What significance could this have. Of course he would have liked to be on the winning side, and he has a strong affection for Native Americans. It is just intriguing.

        Any thoughts?


        • There’s the Sitting Bull tie in, considering that he has Sitting Bull’s pipe and all.

        • JD IMO I think he was referring to the entirety of the period where the first man stepped foot on this continent to the war that was essentially to preserve the American Indian way of life. It would encompass much of the entire evolution of the American Indian culture on this continent until the beginning of the end at Custer’s battle.

  29. So… now that the all the adults are away at Fennboree this weekend, let’s solve this thing!

      • The poem says to begin it where warm waters halt, but that may be a red herring. I think if someone told Fenn to begin it some place in particular, he’d just begin it wherever he pleased. You pick!

      • In fact, he’s said that you can’t start in the middle of the poem and find the treasure, that it’d be a miracle if you do. Let’s do that!

        • That’s interesting about the middle, you know miracles happen all the time. : )

        • Hi Jeremy, I like the people on the blog and don’t mind sharing what I have figured out IMO, I do not necessarily ,however, want to share with all the people that just check the blog for information. I don’t want to say something here meant for someone here and then have a random occasional person get to use that info. I know, I know that probably makes me a jerk and it is not very nice of me at all. Not that my ideas are all that great anyways. I dunno. Anyways, my idea about WWWH is that it halts outside of New Mexico. warm water regulations halt at the border. That’s why most places that WWWH are N. of Santa Fe. Because most states are N. of Santa Fe. That’s also why it reads where warm waters halt not where warm water halts. IMO.

          • Alright, so Colorado on up. That’s fortunate because all those Fennboree folks are distracted down in NM. I like it, we may have a shot!

          • 🙂 that’s true. Maybe we can get to the bottom of it before they are all done with Fennboree. Warm waters halt exactly at border. No need go further than that,IMO. My solve is in NM.

          • Hi Puzzled. Warm Waters include all streams, lakes and ponds except those designated as trout waters. In NM.

      • Ha, this is actually funny… so I looked at the poem just now and tried to figure what the middle is.

        One one hand you can say that the middle is the space between stanzas three and four.

        Another way to look at it would be that there’s nine sentences, so the middle of the poem would be at sentence 4.5.

        .5 of sentence 4 is “cease”.

        Solved it!

        • Better yet, count 12 line up from the bottom and 12 lines from the top you land on HLAW.

        • Seeker, if we’re going with heavy loads and water high, I’ve always liked the idea some have put out there that this might refer to stream loads, or the amount of solid material in the water. That probably varies with most waters, seasonally, but there’s some rivers that are consistently muddied all the time.

          I remember that when I lived near Rome, Georgia, the Oostanaula River was a lot muddier than the Etowah River. Where they meet to form the Coosa River, it looks like the vanilla and chocolate in Neapolitan ice cream. You can see this in Google satellite images.

          I’m just pointing to this one because it’s one I can recall off-hand, but I know you were interested in all-natural solutions to the poem. Maybe a place like that might fit for you.

          • 166 words in poem = word 83 = wise.
            Theme = wise? 83?
            alpha/numeric values say- THE 33 MI 24
            Also, William Fenn = 25 8 = 33.
            Died at age 83.
            Doesn’t help, back to bed…

          • I think we’re on to something with this starting from the middle business…

          • I think you may be right. I mean cmon what does Forrest know anyway right!! Haha
            However it is good to see you participating again.
            Forrest did not want to piece this all together to create hardache when solves go wrong. He wanted people to create ideas and imagination then see where it takes them. Plus of course be one with nature. For me that is just the surface. The poem has much deeper roots. You said you did it all because you were chasing poetry. I truly admire that in you.

          • Hello Jeremy P. Let’s continue with “middle” and Charlie’s and my find with the word “wise” and Charlie’s find with “TH EM E MIDDLE”. I hear “EM E” as Emmy. I can follow different strings with this. Emmy, a nickname for Amelia, perhaps for Amelia Earhart. Then I do a little creative thinking and think of the Emmy Awards. The Emmy is a winged woman, holding on to an atom. One string could lead to Isis and Nike/Athena. Then we have atom. Could think of nuclear. Might also think of creation or beginning of time. One other. Atom sounds like “Adam”. First man in some beliefs. Gosh, now I have all these strings and I’m getting tangled. Mind helping me out?

            P.S. I have other thoughts with the above, but I’ll keep those a little hidden and let others do a little digging. 🙂

          • @ACE, thanks! It’s a busy summer for me in real life, but I’ll make an effort to check in when I can.

            @pdenver, we can do this!

          • Could Heavy Loads = the 10″ X 10″ X 5″ 42# TC? 42 lbs = a heavy load for me at 74. How about for Forrest at 79 or 80?

            Just a thought.


          • JD,
            The only way I would think heavy loads would be the chest is if Forrest made 3 or more trips instead of 2.
            On second thought, the plural load”s” does indicate 2 or more of something.
            But with 3 trips, I’m not sure it would be heavy anymore.
            Then again, 2 trips may not be heavy.
            It may also indicate a waste of a clue if the chest itself is a clue & be out of order.
            How would you find heavy loads (the chest) before – water high – would mean nothing.

          • I Here ya all,
            Very specific places & things IMO.
            I twist loads into lodes in my solve.
            Water high. Now that gets me, there’s water high everywhere on this planet.

          • John edo- I’m just curious how you arrived at the idea of heavy loads and water high being eastward. I personally believe it was once heavy loads of sediment carried by high water, but now its only the evidence left behind in the geography.

          • Puzzled-you get eastward from letters in loads and water. Any place there’s “and” take words before and after to make word. Example new and old makes downland.

          • @ john edo,
            new and old also makes “land owned”, following the word ‘hint’ or “h” in “t”, riches land owned would be “tree”. Adding the “h” to the “t” gives you “three”;)

          • The first stream gauge in the nation is on the rio grande at embudo. It measures “heavy loads and water high”. (Smiles).

            Hydrographic Station.

            Fenn Enterprises is recognized as a leader in hydrography, kinda interesting.

  30. this is how I see the poem – that not all stanzas show you the way to the chest

    stanza 1 – as I have gone alone in there
    stanza 5- so why is it that I must go
    stanza 4- if you’ve been wise
    these stanzas imo have nothing to do with directions to the chest

    the only stanzas that gives directions imo are

    stanza-2 – begin it where warm waters halt
    stanza 3- from there its no place for the meek
    stanza 6 – so hear me all and listen good

    these is just my opinion – you take it from here

    • JD couldn’t find a reply button so have to comment here
      it very well could be that heavy loads is the treasure chest

  31. At this juncture, it would be nice if Forrest would answer another question about distance. It has been some time since he said that he knew of searchers being within 200′ of the chest. Now that the 2016 search season is running full throttle it would be nice to know if anyone has come within 100′ or less to his knowledge. It wouldn’t be a hint to anyone in particular because we all think we have been close but would at least let us know that some searcher/s are making progress in the chase. Thoughts.

    • I think he’s giving hints all the time. He’s not going to give that one killer hint that really helps in isolation. His hints are putting together a 50,000 piece bubble gum puzzle. The individual pieces only start to make sense when the pieces start fitting together but one piece into and of itself is very difficult to place into context.

    • Thoughts,
      It’s just the beginning of the search season it’s not likely to run full throttle until July. Then you must give searchers adequate time to email Fenn about there adventures(some may take well into the winter or like me not at all). Maybe this is why he hasn’t answered questions like this until the search season is over. So hear me all if you would do adequate research your questions might be answered and wonder about how meny clues have been solved and not distance. If four clues have been solved at 200 feet how meny are within that 200 feet? Could it be 5? Thats a lot of clues within a short distance but if it could be true and if it is, will there be any armchairs to solve the last 5 or is it truly BOTG from here on out? Just thoughts….

  32. Hi pdenver. I had suspected that we were in the same area and wondered if you seen what I had seen there? Forgive me all the questions. If you ever have a question about the place or how I arrived at the spot then please feel free to ask. If you don’t feel comfortable on the blog then Dal has my email and I will ask him to pass it to you if you’d like. If not, that is perfectly okay as well, just an offer.

    • Hello alopes. I look forward to seeing your story on the blog. Should I have any questions, I’ll be sure to ask. As for questions, feel free to ask away! 🙂

  33. I wonder why Forrest left the key inside the chest unlocked?
    He could have locked it & kept the key so he could unlock it to get the bracelet & give us the key.

    The only thing I get from this right now, is the chest will not topple over where it is or he doesn’t care if it does.

    • Hello Jake Faulker. When dealing with antiques, which would hold more value? A chest with a lock and no key? Or, a chest with a lock that has a key?

      Where it’s hidden? He thought of everything.

      • I wasn’t thinking of value pdenver.
        Could be though, considering the key may boost it some.
        Now I am thinking he left the key in there knowing he may not be around when found.

        • Hello Jake Faulker. I believe the thought may be that he would not be here to enjoy the knowledge that someone had found his treasure. It may be a long time or today before it is found. It’s unknown. There are a lot of smart people out searching and it may be possible he may enjoy the finale. I do hope so. Yet, he wishes to influence the future, too. I can understand how he feels about both.

          • Hello pdenver is your family catching any fish. Is your place a secret. I am hoping to go see my friend in a few weeks I will see if he fished there as well.

          • Hello ACE. The family have called this weekend and said they have caught their limit each day. I was also told two are approximately 30″ long. I sure would have loved to have known the fight to reel one in.

    • Why would Mr. Fenn tell us that fact? have you figured that out as well? I have! Follow the line!!!

        • Jake, the fact that he left the key inside…. why say it? there’s a reason it was “said” !

          • he says he left a little of himself also in the box. That would be the key. He’s trying to tell us that “HE” is the key.

            write this down for future reference, 5 degrees, 8/22. It’s the sun’s elevation in the sky on 8/22. That is the key…

            knowledge= know lege= lege is short for “legend”, which he considers “Skippy” to be. instruction = Skip, “p” is what you skip to leave you with “Y”. “Y”= 7.

            legend or leg end = foot. So, Y=7′

            A Y stick 7′ tall, with the sun’s elevation at 5 degrees, would cast an 80′ shadow.

            Two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead, = Y (Skippy) standing up, and the shadow(laying on the ground”dead”). 80′ shadow.

            Where, the coordinates or “X”, of course.

          • theme middle = the=223=7 , me , mi ,ddle=1113 = 24 = 7 me my 24.

            24th letter = “X” so, 7 me my “X”.

    • He left the key inside so that the finder would not have to destroy the chest to get inside.

  34. I am wondering, what could have changed that made forest want that bracelet back?
    Seems to me when you make a decision like that there would be no going back.

    • If I remember correctly, he told a searcher that “claimed” to have found the chest that he wanted the bracelet back. Their response was, what bracelet? That told him that they had not found the chest.

    • Timw- I don’t think FF changed his mind about the bracelet. He said he wanted to put it in the chest because of it’s history. I think the bracelet itself is a subtle hint. He knew he would want it back, but put it in anyway. Some have suggested it may be a way to authenticate that someone really has found the chest because he offered to buy the bracelet. This would prove the chest has been found. I believe it’s a hint.

    • During the radio interview it just sounded like his granddaughter was adamant about wanting it back. She may just really want a part of something from someone she really loves and looks up to. See when he hid it no one knew but him which gave no one and opportunity to voice an opinion.
      That is life on the surface. However, we all know with Forrest there can be much deeper meaning. I kinda think the latter equates but only time will tell. Just hope whoever finds it gives all searchers some closure.

    • The bracelet is the only way the family can identify the authenticity of the chest if he and Peggy are no longer around when it,s found.
      In my opinion,he may have been unsure about the jar being secure enough for his autobiography and by putting the bracelet in the chest it would most definitely be the same in 100,1000 or even 10,000 years.
      He did say he has thought of everything . A backup plan perhaps.

  35. Nucimienta means birth is Spanish.
    There is nucimienta by Cuba nam
    Adding onto pdenvers thought earlier.

    • Tim , yes there are the Nacimiento mountains by Cuba. They are not part of the Rocky Mountains though.

  36. Puzzled. Thanks
    I choose to look at it as a positive. Unfortunately it can also be a ruse to give it authenticity.

    Question. What do you folks think of the chest sinking below ground and needing a detector to find it? maybe why bronze was a good choice for the box.

    • I believe the TC is firmly secure on a rock surface. I think it would take a strong act of nature to have it sink.

  37. Hear me all. thank you too. That does put my mind at ease. I appreciate your help.

  38. Let’s change course a bit.
    What do you folks believe the reason for two trips?
    I propose.
    One trip to retrieve a prototype left years earlier.
    If the proto was not there, then he knew he couldn’t leave his trove.

    A second trip because he forgot something.

    I don’t go for the half load two trip theory.

    I believe there was an absolute reason for two trips.
    Your thoughts?

    • 42 pounds of gold and bronze, water for a round trip, most likely a sandwich( probably pastrami), gloves, flashlight maybe, and what ever else he would’ve needed. That’s a lot to carry, if anyone thinks a 79 – 80 year old man could carry all that most likely into the wilderness who knows what else you think about Fenn, superman maybe?

        • Never underestimate the fortitude or adaptability of a “Forrest” friend.
          I visited a 3000 yr old Sequoia grove today. Talk about mega flora treasures.

        • I don’t underestimate him but rather believe him if he said 2 trips I believe 2 trips. To question anything he says is to question all of what he says.

          • Is that what he said, exactly? Why do I feel like I’m repeating myself.

    • I am with you on the prototype or something like that. Remember he has worked on his poem for 15 years but chest was hidden much later hmm or was it. Anyone else up to par on that one.

    • Maybe he “tripped” twice hiding it and that is why he laughed to himself on the way back to the car IMO.

    • IMO. I believe that he made two trips on the same to day to ‘secret’ the chest in its final resting place. If he was at a high altitude then two trips(with 20+ pounds) would probably be necessary for most people. IMO.

      • It amazes me how some very smart wordsmiths still tend to paraphrase. And since I’m not a smart wordsmith that might not make sense.

        • I guess so. I was only stating my opinion. I am not a smart word smith by all means.

  39. If you are talking about me. I have never changed my screen name. This is the only name I have ever used.

    • Sorry Tim,
      I may have mistaken you as someone else.
      You said: “I believe there was an absolute reason for two trips.”
      Rewriting the poem in 15 years would give him plenty of time to scheme & prepare the spot.

  40. It is only a theory until proven otherwise. same as any other comment by anyone.

  41. Thank you. Faulkner
    I am who I say.
    I am recently new on the hunt. I have solve that fits what I believe are
    Two of the very most most important clues.
    WWH and HOB
    I have about 75-80 hours of research
    So I am probably a little giddy.

    • Well, Tim, Sometimes I don’t know what I’m saying.
      What I’m trying to say is to know the architect who sent us on this journey.
      BTW, my last name is Faulker.
      I hope you pay more attention to what he says.

    • Hi, Timw. I’d like to hear about your theories if you are so inclined to share. If not then that’s okay too.

  42. The most recent of FF’s Weekly Questions/Words” over at Mysterious Writings, (Jenny Kile’s Site}.

    The ‘Batter at the Plate’ drawing could, IMO… easily pass for Skippy.


  43. this is my take on the poem

    begin it where warm waters halt and take it in the canyon down
    not far but to far to walk , but in below the home of brown

    from there its no place for the meek , the end is ever drawing nigh
    there’ll be no paddle up you creek just heavy loads and waters high

    as have gone alone in there and with my treasures bold
    I can keep my secrets where and hint of riches new and old

    so why is it that I must go and leave my trove for all to seek
    the answers I already know ive done it tired and now im weak

    so hear me all and listen good , your effort will be worth the cold
    if you are brave and in the wood I give you title to the gold

    if you’ve been wise and found the blaze, look quickly down your quest to cease
    but tarry scant with marvel gaze , just take the chest and go in pease

    all this is just my opinion — frank

    • jd – you say that im messin with the poem – to me the meaning is the same – I have not added any words or taking any of words from the poem they are all there – I changed some stanzas around but to me the same steps from the beginning to the end are still the same – all of my comments are in my opinion – nothing that I write are facts – that doesn’t mean that in my mind my way of thinking means im wrong – all this is just my opinion

      • frank: “I changed some stanzas around”
        Changed, mixed up, mess with.
        All sounds & looks the same to me.
        Keep up the good work.

      • Frank,
        Is there another way to read the poem? There has to be, when you hear all the interpretations floating about. Take my WWWH for example, I can put 6 or more different WWH’s at my starting place. The list keeps growing. Another example, I look over at a tree and see a tree, you look over at the tree and see wood, someone else sees an aspen, someone else may see a family. My point being aren’t we all looking at the same thing. The same goes for my solution, I can make it historical, geological, imaginary, sexual, family oriented, aviation oriented, fishing oriented, liberal, conservative, therapeutic, I even had marriage in there at one point, and the list goes on. There are so many different ways to understand the poem. For me, the chase, has been the highlight of my life and then again one of the lowest points of my life. I’ve gained trust in people I’ve never met and lost trust in people I thought I knew, and I am probably wrong about that, time will tell.
        I’ve always preferd the outdoors, that’s where we clean out our souls of all the confusion that is a natural part of life. I believe that Mr. Fenn needed these outdoors for the same reasons. When life throws you a curve ball there’s only one place to go and recover, that’s the place where we can be alone with everything we love, including ourselves. If there is one thing that I’ve discovered along my path it has been the beauty of a Rocky Mountain sunset. Does that fit into the poem? I know it fits into mine. There will be many books written about how “The Thrill of the Chase” has changed lives. Some might not be all positive, most will, mine will. And more importantly many young children today will be Parents tomorrow and take they’re young children to the same places we visit today and share with them the “Thrill of the Chase”. The treasure will always be here for those who understand and love life. After you add nine, the real treasure is peace. And after all our searching it won’t be the disappointments and frustrations that we remember but those special moments that make us who we are. Mr. Fenns poem is perfect the way it is written, yet the meaning changes daily, just like my poem changes daily, my poem being me. And obviously my opinion only:)

        • Sorry got carried away, I believe the poem as written will guide you directly to what you seek. Mr. Fenns flies do catch fish, and there is a pot of gold at the end. IMO

          • Hello strawshadow,
            This is my first time responding to you. That was well written and understood. Your view is real close to how I feel the purpose of the poem is written. There is obviously only one correct solve, but Forrest anticipated this challenge to last for generations. Peoples solve for the poem may not necessarily immediately set them on a path of personal triumphs and tribulations, but once the BOTG are involved they will be able to see and reflect their purpose, meaning, and place in life. It will also give them time to appreciate all that have paved their way and to value the others that will follow behind them. IMO Forrest takes an artifact and although he respects it. It is more important to him the person behind the artifact. He tries to imagine the person and why the artifact exists in the first place. Aside from the value if you took 2 arrowheads one perfect and one damaged he would prefer the damaged one because it tells more of a story. To me that is how I feel Forrest is wired.
            Yes there are many more layers to it as well. Much of it is why it is important why I video my journey. Big IF but if my solve is correct hopefully it will bring closure for so many that have dedicated their time to THIS chase and at the same time will show the world how to be selfishless and enjoy our time and the futures of others. I wrote to Forrest one time and gave him this as an idea for one of his bells. It is his for as long as he wants it.
            In Life There Are No Impossibilities
            Only Undiscovered Solutions!

        • I liked it, Strawshadow.
          When I watch a movie about treasures, the most appealing thing in it is the nature of the world around said treasure.
          What would Indiana Jones have been without the boulder, the ruins, the history?
          And all this includes the history and stories of people and life.
          The real treasure isn’t the gold, the gems, the place. It’s the world. It’s living.

          Now see whatcha done?

          • Thanks BB, And you are so right. I have found more than my share of gold nuggets. I could have made more money selling Yachts but for me there is nothing like the outdoors, digging up a big gold nugget that has been in place for millions of years.Of all the thousands of gold nuggets that I have found, many I’ve forgotten, The bigger joy is looking up in the sky and thanking the good Lord for his blessing. It’s a beautiful feeling knowing your never truly alone.

          • In mind only Jake, and to expand on that thought , I live in a treasured world. And to answer your question another way, I have lived in the treasure state. Bozeman, Mt., Mammoth Hot Springs in Yellowstone, Boulder, Colorado and Lovington, New Mexico. And many places in between.

          • I know what you are saying. Ever since I took that trip through the Gallatin, my mind is still there & the treasure is there as well in nature. You have traveled quite a lot seeing all sorts of treasures in the Rockies.
            Is your focus on MT now?
            For the chase that is.

          • If I have my way Jake, I would love to search the Gallatin. But I will wait until the Salmon Fly hatch. Until then my focus is south of the Divide. Good luck to you.

          • so Jake Faulker….. you’re a believer of the Gallatin is treasure home theory?

          • Yes TZP,
            Am I wrong in this theory of obviousness?
            I could be, but I may be right.
            There’s only one way to find out.
            I may not survive that one way or another.

        • You’re welcome, strawshadow. I’m finding it a little difficult to concentrate as of lately. Maybe a nice walk in the woods may help. Hope to do that next weekend for my 35th wedding anniversary.

          • pd, your a very lucky person indeed. 35 years is a blessing, any treasure beyond those memories will only be a small part of your beautiful picture. I fell in love once and it was worth all the disappointments that quickly followed. You have brought a big smile to my face sharing a small part of your path, thank you.

        • strawshadow – thanks for your comment – like the poem there are a lot of ways to cook an egg you might not like the way I like mine cooked – but there are a lot of opinions on this blog and from the tine the chase started there is not one opinion the same – how many hob is there how many wwwh – some people fly – some walk some drive in looks for the chest – some people can go out and enjoy the out side and some cant – its all the matter of each persons lives – you like the way the poem is written and so do I – the way I wrote the poem helps meunderstand it batter – for some it will help and some it wont – some people will like and others wont – to me that’s what this chase is all about – imo

          • Your right Frank, What ever floats your boat, so to speak. It’s just amazing how many options there are on the menu, and all seem delectable.

        • Hello strawshadow. Yes, I have been blessed many times throughout my life. Your kind and beautiful words have made me a bit misty-eyed. Thank you. It makes me very happy to know I’ve put a smile on your face. Keep smiling, strawshadow. It will make others smile back at you and you’ll have made a difference.

          • Thanks Again pd and everybody, I needed you guys today, I’m sharing your misty eyes from afar. It’s time for me to go on a search now. I have been waiting because there was a very cute couple kissing below me and I didn’t want to interrupt. Which reminds me…have you kissed your loved ones today? Just checking, I know you guys have:) Peace all.

          • No one said life as we know it was going to be easy.
            Something tells me we signed up for this beforehand.
            Keep your spirit in mountains high.
            Good luck on your nature quest.

          • Congrats pd,
            I have said it once and will say it again, you are one of the many reasons I am on this site and why I feel it is important to film my solve. Hope you have many more wonderful years.

          • Hello ACE. Thank you for your kind words and well wishes. I greatly appreciate them. I’m glad to see you participate on the blog and be part of the conversations. You have great thoughts and I hope you’ll continue to share them. May your journeys be memorable and that you’ll continue to film them. Look around and really enjoy what is around you.

      • To do it the way you have written it out is exactly what ff has told everyone “not to do”. FF has said that and you have to find the first clue to get started so many times I don’t think that he will even address the statement. Frank, Stop messing with the poem and deal with the poem as FF has written it. He didn’t take 15 years to put this poem together so that people could arrange it to fit what they would like. FF has this poem written out exactly as he wants it to be. Forrest hid a million dollars worth of his life in this chest and he has it so the “only way” to find it is to follow his poem exactly as it is written by him.
        This is not a poem for the fate of heart. All though yours sounds ok it is going against Forrest and I will be following the author of the poem first and for most.
        Best of Luck which ever way you decide to go and be safe when out in the woods
        Timothy A.

  44. Not far, but too far to walk. Suggests you are walking before & at this line.
    Why would he state this if you were in a some sort of vehicle?
    What gets me though is all the people that walked by the other 7 clues.
    Maybe I have my clues mixed up.

    • jake imo – not far but to far to walk to means that when you arrive to where wwwh is – its still a ways off from there to where he parked – as far as the people walking past the 7 clues I think that they wrote to him about there trip that they were taking or took imo

          • I was watching it on the news & saw a blaze-r floating down the creek without paddles.
            Mother Nature makes the rules, but sometimes we just ignore them.

          • So funny, I think that couple down below are going to kiss forever. Jake and James, tough to keep that redneck with all the cloud cover. You would have a better chance here in sunny buena vista. Time for this girls “nature hike”.

          • That would be nice straw, but I guess Mother Nature has her faults as well.
            I will see Cali some day. James has lived there for a few & experienced & shared the beauty.
            The redneck turned into wetback.
            Just kidding James.

            Have a great adventure in your nature hike & know where we came from & where we are going.

          • James,
            Why would you hide a treasure worth millions & write a poem about where it is with 9 clues & have all the clues within walking distance even though in the poem he writes Not far, but too far to walk?

          • Why it’s a hint it would help full to have some form of transportation getting from point A to point B

          • Yes James,
            The poem trumps all.
            The interviews, statements, emails & books, you name it.
            There may be some helpful info in them but when you have a question about something, you should go back to the poem.

          • Thanks Jake and James, yes I’ve known all about that dark side of the woods. After all we all have our twins. In the end we all now that an honest keel guides a straight path. Say hello to my other half, always a sunny disposition:)

          • We all have the mirror image inside, it’s what keeps most on an even keel.
            Honesty is the best policy even when it hurts.
            I would rather be honest than not tell how I feel & regret it later.
            The regret for being honest will be replaced by truth in knowing you said it.

          • Regret for being honest replaced by truth. No regrets, just the truth. The truth hurts much more if the honesty has been delayed. In which case silence can sometimes be golden.

          • Truth, honesty trumps all straw,
            When it’s delayed, it does hurt more for all involved.
            I guess it depends who delayed as well.
            You would like to think relationships would be more transparent & I’m talking about all relationships.
            I would take a walk right now in the wood if I could.

          • “James,
            Why would you hide a treasure worth millions & write a poem about where it is with 9 clues & have all the clues within walking distance even though in the poem he writes Not far, but too far to walk?”

            Most searcher are closer to space than they are each other Jake. Why does a non existent distance need to be a distance at all? the Kármán line, at an altitude of 100 km (62 mi) above sea level, is conventionally used as the start of outer space.

            For an observer standing on a hill or tower 100 feet (30 m) in height, the horizon is at a distance of 12.2 miles (19.6 km). For an observer on the summit of Aconcagua (22,841 feet (6,962 m) in height), the sea-level horizon to the west is at a distance of 184 miles (296 km).

            A distance in time [ in there? keep my secret where? ] can not be measure in feet, yards, miles but in years, decades, centuries, millenniums etc.

            “I’m not flippant about this. It’s not something somebody is going to be able to do on spring break or a Sunday afternoon picnic. I’m looking a hundred years down the road, maybe a thousand years down the road. People don’t understand that.”

            Could this comment refer to a time for distance when fenn wrote the poem?
            Is the “hint” of riches new and old”, referring to time? or is the poem only written for present day searchers.

          • Seeker,
            If your going to get time & distance from: Not far, but too far to walk. Then get your wegee board out.
            You may actually get an answer from the dark side.

            I prefer to see this line as straightforward.
            Considering he states that many years down the road, I would presume the treasure is buried under water.
            Not really buried but not on the surface either.
            Old & new describes what’s in the chest & are riches.
            There’s your timeline in a box.

          • Think about it.
            100 or 1,000 years down the road.
            We have to change our way of thinking on how it was hidden instead of how the poem was written.
            I can see y’all getting ready to type up a storm.
            The poem when taken in a straightforward way is just as difficult if it were not. Compare it to pi squared.

          • Thank You Melanie,
            If you don’t know how to read someone from what they said, then you don’t have a chance.
            Trust what he has said as long as there are no if’s, and’s, maybe’s, might, or buts involved.
            When your watching his videos, his poker face reveals all.

          • The contents of the box has no reference to the location of the chest…

            Do how could hint of riches new and old refer to the chest or contents?

          • Seeker,
            I would have to say the new is the autobiography, I would consider that fairly new opposed to the other contents.
            But I guess new could mean recent.

          • Jake,

            “Are there any objects placed in the Bronze Chest that are connected, or have meaning to the place the chest is hidden? ~ Mike

            No Mike, everything in the chest is straight forward and visual, except my autobiography, which some might find dull. Oops, I forgot, there is one thing in the chest that I have not talked about except to say I don’t want to talk about it. It is something saved especially for the person who solves the clues. I think that person will be pleased when she sees it. f”
            Jake you said…
            I would have to say the new is the autobiography, I would consider that fairly new opposed to the other contents.
            But I guess new could mean recent.”


            “…Old & new describes what’s in the chest & are riches.
            There’s your timeline in a box.”

            If none of the contents have meaning to the place the chest lays in wait… why would the poem’s line new and old refer to anything in the chest? Apparently nothing in the chest relates to the poem, the hide a hint or a clue.

            You also said; “Think about it.
            100 or 1,000 years down the road.
            We have to change our way of thinking on how it was hidden instead of how the poem was written.”

            Well… Yeah!

          • Seeker- Thanks for the Question/Answer about whether the contents of the chest related to the place it was hidden. I’m surprised by the answer. I had not seen that before.

          • Hello Seeker. “I think that person will be pleased when she sees it.” AHA!! I like the “she” part! But I had not heard of this quote before. Can you direct me to the Q&A it’s from?

          • Seeker, you said:
            “If none of the contents have meaning to the place the chest lays in wait… why would the poem’s line new and old refer to anything in the chest? Apparently nothing in the chest relates to the poem, the hide a hint or a clue.”

            There’s a problem here.
            Let me explain with a proverb from an Ohio State Buckeye.
            If you were to ask a Buckeye fan how to get from Columbus, Ohio to Ann Arbor, Michigan (home of the Michigan Wolverines), the Buckeye fan will tell you this:
            “Head north ’till you smell it, then west ’till you step in it.”

            So, now, when asking the question “does a compass have any relationship to Ann Arbor?”
            The answer is surely “no.”
            Because any direction will do.

          • Had to go up a mile to find a reply button, mile high lol.
            Sounds like some are coming around to riches new and old having to do with other things in the poem and the chest and it’s contents. Could this help with determining what clue 1 is if it’s in the first stanza?

          • Hi Seeker — I’m perplexed how you came to this conclusion:

            “If none of the contents have meaning to the place the chest lays in wait… why would the poem’s line new and old refer to anything in the chest? Apparently nothing in the chest relates to the poem, the hide a hint or a clue.”

            I don’t see what’s wrong with Fenn using the introductory stanza of the poem to make a reference to the contents of the chest (if only in vague terms)? There are certainly “old” things in there (to say nothing of the chest itself), and comparatively new things like his autobiography or even gold nuggets that could have been found in the 20th century for all we know. There is every indication that one of the themes he wants to convey with the poem is polar opposites (bold/weak, begin/halt, warm/cold, meek/brave, tarry/go, down/up, take/give, far/nigh, etc.) So why not new and old?

            And as long as we’re on the subject of the first stanza, I’m sure many people have considered that he could have been using “I” to personify the chest itself, after all Fenn’s nickname for it is (I)ndulgence. Being sneaky about the subject of that first sentence certainly seems rather Fenn-like, although it doesn’t appear to offer any obvious insights into the chest’s location.

        • Zap,

          My comment is based on the the Q&A.
          For a line/words in the poem to be used as a clue to find the location of the chest [ which is what we’re attempting ~ to use clues to find the chest ]. New and Old or any other “clue” [ I repeat, if you use the line/word/sentence as a “clue” ] to the contents of the chest… you’re looking at it wrong.

          Fenn stated, NO to “Are there any objects placed in the Bronze Chest that are connected, or have meaning to the place the chest is hidden?”

          With that said… I’m a multiple meanings guy… so, can new and old be saying “something” about the contents, Sure. But as a “clue” to solve the poem? Well, no. There are no objects in the chest that are connected or have meaning to where the chest is hidden… imo that would be a clue. Again, aren’t the “clues” supposed to lead us to the chest? and if something in the chest was to help/lead, that would be a clue, right?

          Conclusion; and I’ll say imo, to be politically correct, the line new and old shouldn’t be considered anything within the chest as a clue.

          If the line is used as a “clue” , it should not pertain to the items in the chest. As some want to say they are.

          We [ searchers ] can buck-heads all day long on this… as this seems to be similar to many discussions about, searcher having the first two clues were not the same ones who walked passed the chest… now it seems they were just that.
          or the discussions on If those searcher “knew” they had the first two clues correct… which they didn’t.
          As well as, the great possibility that anyone and everyone [searchers] who were at the first two clues went/walked pass the other seven clues. were as well, on their way as they walked pass the chest.

          If you think about it… in the last year, we have seemed to learn a lot about the clues [facts].
          For me personally… there is more to… “knowing where to start” and “knowing the first clue / having that one nailed down” …than just simply being there.

          • 10-4, I get your meaning now, Seeker. Except for a brief time over a year ago, I’ve never believed that the “new and old” phrase was at all useful to finding the chest. I suppose those who lean toward “New” Mexico might think it’s a clue, but I’m not in that camp.

            As for the “first two clues” controversy, and how someone could have those and walk right past the chest and the other 7 clues, there is a Sherlock Holmesian solution to that conundrum. It is the same solution to why TLGFI can’t get closer than the first two clues. It all depends on your (or more importantly, Fenn’s) definition of “first”.

          • Seeker and Everyone Else
            I tend to go along and agree with a lot of what is being thrown back and forth to each other (not at). The new to me is definitely F’s autobiography but I feel that the old is the gold trinkets, bracelets and necklaces probably even more items. But it is all items that have some type of time related to them. So with that in mind, why would FF be hiding his chest in a area that also is related to time. Also, in my opinion only, if FF wants to be remembered in the future why not hide the TC by some type of monument or some area that is and will be remembered in time. By doing it this way f gets to be remembered in the future and the contents would be connected to the location by time along with the autobiography to wrap the whole Chase into a common theme…..IMHO
            Timothy A.

    • But frank, not far, but tooo far to walk is after WWWH.
      You may be putting the cart before the horse.
      Yes frank, it’s fair to say people have let him know every detail of the trips & maybe even sent a link to him to there website.

      • lol ok jake lets see if if we can get you in a car with out you having to walk – begin it where warm waters halt and take it in the canyon down – its not far but to far to walk – whats but in below the home of brown- the chest – and its to far to walk – im sure forrest didn’t walk from wwwh to hob and got in his car and drove to the location- jake imo im sure that you can get in your car from your home and drive all the way with out stopping till you get to the location imo hope it helps – I still type with one finger that’s why it takes a little longer for me to answer and when im finished typing a word I forget what im trying and say what I mean

          • Thanks frank,
            Same to you even though we are probably worlds apart.
            That’s the beauty of this site & all the different op’s.
            I wonder if this site & others will still be around after it is found?
            I would like to think so.

      • Jake, you stated, “Trust what he(ff) has said AS LONG AS there are no if’s, and’s, maybe’s, mights, or buts involved.”

        I guarantee there are “ifs, ands, & butts involved in ff’s poem and the solution to it. One doesn’t have to look very closely to see their presence and importance, IMO.

        So, in your opinion, are you stating that FF is not trustworthy? I’m not suggesting you don’t trust ff, just truly interested in your opinion regarding trustworthiness by your definition. Thanks in advance.

  45. If you read nothing else, read the last line of this excerpt from “Give Your Heart to the Hawks: A Tribute to the Mountain Men” by Wilfred Blevins. A lament of the high cost of Rendezvous.

    ” It was God’s county. Except that God stayed on the other side of the Missouri River. No churches here to cramp a man, nor look at him mean when he did what was natural. Nary a policeman to clap him in jail. Nary a law to push him around. Nary a lawyer to fool him fancy, nor a revenuer to steal his money for the government. Not a man to answer to. And God’s finest sculpturin’s to roam in. And if God has made the livin’ a mite dangerous, wasn’t that part of the fun?

    “So, if the things of civilization had got a bit expensive, what did that count? If a child could trap for half his life and go back to the settlements broke, what did that count? They might have told their families that they were heading west to get their share of a fortune that would make the mines of Peru seem puny. They might even get Jed Smith to write a letter home for them declaring that they would come back rich. But most of them didn’t have a mind to go back, rich or otherwise. Money was something for the settlements, and they didn’t want the settlements.

    “They were learning that whatever they had come to the Stony Mountains for, it wasn’t beaver. ”

    The Thrill of the Chase. this child thanks you ff, fer helpin me reckon which way the stick floats

    • @Joseph…sounds like a good read. I used to trap when i was in high school, (would never consider it these days) but one of my favorite books was ‘Two Logs Crossing’ and another was ‘Trap Lines North’.

      Anybody stumble across ‘The Big Sky’ by A.B. Guthrie, Jr? This a Mountain Man book published in the early 40’s when FF would have been about 17 y.o. The author uses the word Nigh dozens of times throughout the book and not once as a reference to ‘left’.

  46. And hint of riches new and old.
    IMHO, it means I will give hints by way of my memories, from the past and the way I think of them now. I’ve come full circle and see my youth again in a new way thru my memories.
    These backup for this, one place is the saltwater chapter.

  47. Silence can be golden, but the patina becomes tarnished, got my jewelry cloth out today :), for the misty eyes

  48. This may not sound important but, imo, it is very important. I share these thoughts in case anyone is interested and with the hope they can help others.

    Forrest is a self professed maverick. He is not shy about admitting it, stating it, owning it, and being one. He is a maverick through and through. Imo, believe him when he expresses this. Believe that he didn’t lose his maverick-ness when creating this poem and chase. Look up every definition you can find for maverick. imo, be that and do that when trying to understand the poem and the man.

    Imo, one must be a maverick to solve this poem. Be different. Think different. See different. Embrace different. Bend the rules. Heck, play by your own rules when understanding the poem (e.g., I don’t break rules….I make rules that don’t harm anyone). Look up every single word in the poem – the number of meanings for each word is breathtaking! I didn’t know what I didn’t know before all this. I have my own “chase” dictionary at this stage, for the poem, TTOTC, and TFTW books!

    I leave in a week for my final BOTG adventure. I’ve gone full maverick in my approach and understanding of the poem and where the treasure lies. I am excited for the adventure that awaits. I am forever grateful for the adventure that has already been getting to this juncture.

    Cheers to possibilities and the chase.

    • Hello Twingem. I am happy for you. Wishing you the best in your journey. Have fun and make beautiful memories. Thank you for the advice.

    • Twigem,
      I like the way you think. This is how I have been doing the poem and things are connecting. I just returned from BOTG and I have to say that I can’t find a restaurant that serves crow. Not that I didn’t find it , but My wife got very very dizzy and faint so I had to get her back down to a safer elevation. Another day another time.
      Good luck on your up coming search and remember to be as Safe as you can
      Timothy A.

  49. its my opinion – that new and old is (where) I can keep my secrets where – and – hint of riches new and old (is a hole) if he went alone (in there)and if you have to look quickly (down) and take the chest and go in peace – to me it only means one thing – sorry but that’s my opinion

  50. Lots of talk. Any consensus yet? How about what State? Since there are many places where Warm Waters Halt, and most of them are North of Santa Fe…any idea?

    • Hello oziboy. I believe you’ll get a wide variety of answers. I have searched 3 of the 4 states. Which state do you believe the treasure lies?

      • pd, his answer will be the one you haven’t searched, sorry couldn’t resist. In my stupid opinion

      • You are correct. I am also bored. Trying to get over my altitude sickness from Fennboree. Still feeling a little ill. Yellow? How about a stone? 😉 We better keep on topic or else… :/

        • Wiseone, follow me…
          to the poetry page…
          where the wild run free.

          We’re all a bit bored. I’ll liven things up.

          • No worries Wiseone. I can’t stay to play, but left you some laughs on the corner of happily and horsey. Aka the poetry page.

            Take care. I’m not able to search this summer so extra bored. So much so that I’m electing surgery and trips to doctors for fun! Just kidding.

            Looks like Fenboree was a huge success. So happy Forrest is healthy and was able to shoot the breeze with his fan club. Fun for all. Wish I could have joined in.

        • Can I change my guess to a cute little baby chicken or is that against the rules?

        • Hello WiseOne. Heading there next month for vacation, but also going to check out something I saw a couple years ago. Is it the blaze? I feel that it’s in another state, yet, this particular spot has always been on the back of my mind since then. I guess if I keep looking over my shoulder, it’s best to check it out.

  51. Alrighty then, If Mr. Fenn now states that its “not in a cave”, can Dal pin Forrest down and add this statement to the CHEAT Sheet list? He did say this in the imbedded video link on this page. This could be a BIG help, for I thought surely it must be in a cave.

  52. @Zeldasings, nice find Zelda. Stream Gage’s are also one of my heavy load/water high definitions. You can find them marked on some topo maps. I think Caltopo or mytopo denote stream Gage’s.

  53. imo – this is my take on new and old – stanza one – he went in there feeling bold to hide his treasure in a hole (new and old) stanza 5 – so why is it that I must go (die) and leave my trove for all to seek- so he went and hid his treasure – for us to seek and remember him by – cause he had cancer and he was going to die imo

    • Frank,
      Where did FF go? Didn’t he say it’s not in a cave on a video? If he did, then where did he go and find a hole? Forrest has said he didn’t bury it but he never said that he did either.
      Timothy A. IMHO

      • Jason D – lets see if I can explain – why I say that new and old is a hole to me the word bold stands for bold omega
        if you look quickly down – the center of the omega is the hole (old) – where you go down – the bottom part of the omega where the opening is – is where he dug the hole (new) to (put in) the chest – so you go down the hole and look – (in there) and take the chest and go in peace
        I tried to explain the best way I could – to give the answer to your question – hope you can under stand what I meant to say – all this is just imo

        • Don’t quote me on this… as I only recall conversations and not a quote from fenn, to my recollection… wasn’t something stated that the omega[s] will not assist in finding the chest? or something similar.

          I could be completely wrong but it may be worth checking it out before ya hop the next flight out to see how deep a hole gets.

  54. I also think that stanza -1 and 5 – have 2 meanings – 1- he went and hid the treasure chest – 2 – he left it there for us to seek – he hid it hes tired and now hes weak this is another way to look at it – this is just my opinion – you decide from here

  55. As I have gone alone in there
    I can keep my secret where,

    And with my treasure bold,
    And hints of riches new and old.

    I am not messing with the poem.
    As you can see, the poem starts with – As
    This baffles me some.

    What I do get is the rhyming lines also start with the same word.
    This every other line rhyming scheme poem seems to join the lines that rhyme.
    But what about: Not far, but too far to walk.
    Doesn’t rhyme with halt.
    Why don’t they change the spelling to rime?

  56. Sourdough – This is Jeff from Fennboree. My wife, Andi, and I talked to you at length at Fennboree. We were wearing the tie dyed Fennboree shirts. As soon as you get this message could you give me a call at 618-713-3076.

      • I will never beg,
        Unless it’s for a pony!
        But yes, a fennian SB is always fun.

    • Ditto!!!!! I need something to entertain/challenge me this week… Seems like minutes are ticking as hours. Maybe if we all ask Dal to ask Forrest, Mr. Fenn will treat us (especially those that couldn’t make Fennboree) to a new scrapbook post to cheer us up and challenge us a bit before Friday!

      Dal, can you ask Forrest for a new scrapbook post on behalf of the HOD community? Please and thank you very much.

      • I feel confident that he will have one up this week, but then, I don’t have the chest.

  57. I think that I am going to stop commenting for a while – I am having trouble saying what I mean – with my one finger typing and its getting to me so I think ill back off for a while and see what happens – good luck to all and be safe—-frank

  58. I think it’s time to address an elephant in the room… why was Fenn’s high school coach hanging out with him during summer vacations?

    • Pandora you apparently don’t do any research at all before coming up with your weird conspiracy theories. Fenn’s dad was principle at the school. The coach was good friends with his dad.

      I’m still waiting on your answer about the evil algorithm here on Dal’s blog that turns you into a guinea pig……. Please enlighten me.

      • @Goofy, the wisdom of crowds are proven to be smarter than any individual, no matter how brilliant he or she is. A group of people — say members of a forum – are better at solving problems, fostering innovation, coming to wise decisions, even predicting the future. A smart person could put thousands of thoughts into an algorithm to create a solution based on the wisdom of a crowd… it has been done numerous times to solve complex problems like how many jelly beans are in a jar. But given the extensive research you’ve done, you already know this… you’re obviously just toying with me. I never used the term “evil” so this is your word, not mine. Personally, I think it’s genius.

        • Well Pandora I’m going to disagree with you about crowd sourcing. I can give you many examples where millions and millions of people were just flat out wrong. I will go so far to say that committees and crowds yield nothing but gray mush and nothingness. Of course if you want to copy all 134,666 comments that are here at this moment and put them into a magic algorithm go for it.

          In my humble opinion the innovative person that finds the chest will probably ignore all the comments, study the poem and what Fenn has said, and go get the chest.

          • Hey Goof, will you kindly let me know when the number of comments reaches 166,666?

          • Lia that will happen in 31,993 comments from this one. You can count them if you want.

          • I agree 100%. This is a great place to bounce off ideas but in the end we should all trust only our own decisions. When to many people get involved it usually ends up making us question our own decisions. IMHO

            Back to square one….

          • If you send me the raw data [ all 135k comments] I will analyze it and even share my findings with everyone.

            Google has a $505 B market value for a reason.

        • @Pandora, crowd sourcing isn’t going to help in a treasure hunt.

          In a jelly bean count you have actual aggregate data, actual numbers like individual’s guesses of the count. You also have the benefit of hindsight. You know that the jar has 100 jelly beans and, maybe, that the average guess was 100. None of that allows you to predict the 100 in advance.

          In a treasure hunt, you don’t know everyone’s guesses, and much of the public data is intentionally misleading. The only one who knows the correct location is Forrest Fenn. There’s missing data, intentionally erroneous data, and no correct answer to compare whatever aggregate information you come up with to.

          • Intentionally erroneous so true, at first read I thought I saw a g. Imo

        • @Pandora “the wisdom of crowds are proven to be smarter than any individual, no matter how brilliant he or she is. A group of people — say members of a forum – are better at solving problems, fostering innovation, coming to wise decisions, even predicting the future.”

          If that were true our elected officials would be worth a #$%^.

          So I’m going to say big disagree on that one. Just know half of people are below average. The bottom half think they are above average and the top half think they are average.

          Its called the Dunning–Kruger effect. Realize that a group think causes the clever folk to doubt themselves and the not so clever to get louder and bolder. None of us are quite as stupid as all of us.

          “The problem with the world is that the intelligent people are full of doubts, while the stupid ones are full of confidence.”

          ― Charles Bukowski

          • @ Jake Faulker. I doubt that you doubt you are intelligent and we have now come to a philosophical paradox.

            I think the safest and likely most amusing course of action is to doubt we are stupid right or wrong and just see where that goes. The overwhelmingly dumb seem to be much happier than anyone else… so who is stupid now?

            Just thought for food.

          • We are all stupid at sometime or another.
            We are all brilliant at times as well.
            Everyone has there own wave they ride.
            You also must understand Dys, that there are people we think are stupid, but yet they know more about some other things we don’t.
            That’s why I say, never underestimate your fellow man or woman.
            Just when you think you got someone figured out.
            Think again.

      • Maybe it involves fabricating a tree into a cube? Is there an algorithm for that? Is it even possible? Must consult ouiji, only forgot to buy one. Can I use yours goof? If not I guess a couple balls are fine.

    • Pandora, coach Concy may not have had a family and loved to fish – not uncommon for families like the Fenn’s to welcome others to Fenn Haven.

      What are you suggesting?

      • I’m not suggesting anything! It was a question, not a suggestion. Maybe it was a different time. I found it odd and I know others who do as well.

  59. Anybody know??? I found a wood post with a very small sign and on that sign a (black) horizontal dash. There were no other marks or reasons for the small sign. Does that dash have any known meaning that I have been unable to find out about?

    • Just a guess. But, could it be a snow level marker? In our area the markers are metal posts but I don’t know how they do it in other states. Did the wooden post look like it had been in water? A water level indicator?

      • Definately not a “water” level mark. Snow, I would not know. Thanks for the opinion! Anyone else???

  60. Not sure where to post this Question….Does anyone know how often Fenn reads his email? How often does he respond to people?

    • Hello HviteUlf. I believe I’ve heard he reads them daily; he receives approximately one hundred a day. How often he responds is unknown.

      • Thanks pdenver – just to confirm …his email is still info@oldsantafetradingco.com correct?

        I assume you are in Denver due to your title…was there this last weekend searching…try to stay cool this week..heard it was going to be HOOOOT end of the week.

        • Hello HviteUlf. You may try that email address and see what happens.

          Hope you enjoyed your weekend in Colorado. It is suppose to be in the low 90’s by the end of the week. Definitely toasty and will do my best to stay cool. Nice glass of iced tea and a swamp cooler ought to do the trick.

  61. Goofy, Dont count on me to count comments. I can’t even count sheep effectively. Please pull the wool over my tired eyes.

  62. For those of you following along about the status of my Gyrl, I’ll be waiting close by the phone today for the outcome. I will let you know as soon as I hear the opinion.

    • Straw – what’s the status of your Gyrl? I hope it’s nothing serious. I’m sorry, I don’t know the background.

      • She’s a lab/Aussie mix and last Friday I took her to the vet. He kept her over night and took a bone sample to check for cancer. The ex rays didn’t look good. Nothing back from the lab today, hopefully tomorrow. Thanks for asking, a few people at Fennboree knew.

        • I thought maybe you had a daughter with a medical condition, but I understand how people’s pets are family (though I’ve never had one myself). I’m not that in touch with the search community, but I always read your posts because I respect you as perhaps the most clever one here. Hope it all turns out well. How old is she?

          • She’s 8 Spoon and thank you for that compliment. I’m camped on top of a mountain so apologize for my slow timing. I believe there are some Indian graves here possibly? Could be my overextended imagination though. Good luck in your search.

          • Thanks JL and Keder’s Mom, she’s a good Gyrl, and enjoyed here NY steak tonight smoked over a juniper fire.

  63. I don’t know how many of you like maps, but here is a fun interactive map to check the size of your search area… sorta


    It’s based on the typical mercator projection of our global maps and lets you visualize that size is relative.

    Or rather the projection perception deception.

  64. I’m sure most have noticed that the last weekly words shows a pic of a batter, but not just a batter, but a left handed batter.
    Does anyone else find that interesting?

    • The original (found on the web) showed the letter “A” on the batter’s hat and the number 8 on his jersey. I’m left handed and always chose #8 (my favourite number) for the sports I participated in – but consider it completely meaningless and coincidental in the context of “Weekly Words”. Unless Jenny has spies.

      • She might have been kind enough to spare us from considering those as clues 🙂

  65. Periodically the “CE5” marking that is on the chest comes up. Forrest has stated that this mark relates to his personal inventory system and that it won’t help searchers, which, of course, is occasionally met with skepticism (it’s a treasure hunt after all!). I wanted to report that I found a listing for a mounted Arctic Grizzly bear that he had for sale that was marked “YE5”. Hopefully this helps anyone who was wondering.

    • Just out of curiosity, how was the YE5 tagged? I don’t see the CE5 being helpful, but I do find it curious that he engraved it to the locking latch. Then again, he did say he bought it for the chase… to use if to hide the contents. Still a 1150AD chest and one marks an inventory letter number system on it is odd in my book. I wonder how he tagged other items… like paintings, did he scratch letters and numbers on the backside of frames? What about gold artifacts, such as the frog? or the larger pieces of gold nuggets? Is there an inventory mark on the bracelet? Probably not… that would have been been a personal item. Hmm, I wonder what’s printed inside those hush puppies?

      Wait! fenn bought the chest for the chase, payed 25,000 for it… he sold the art gallery when??

      • @Seeker, It was just in the listing next to the price ($15,000) like a SKU. It might be fun to try and decipher his pricing system from the two examples we know, CE5 and YE5. I’m guessing the -E5 part might represent the -5,000. I’m not sure how C becomes 2 and Y becomes 1.

        • I was just having some fun… It is an interesting inventory code though. Maybe someone can sneak the question on how his system work on weekly words or something.

          • Hello Seeker. Wouldn’t that might be like asking a bank teller for the code to open the vault in the bank? Some things should remain unknown. 🙂

          • PD, sure if he wasn’t retired or sold the business almost 20 years ago… I doubt very much if he would start up another business at this point in life. Anyways, it’s seems to be only for inventory and original purchase price, a fast recall on the showroom floor, if you will, to recall what he paid for the item.

            Or it could be the code that breaks open the poem… lol.
            C for Colorado E for east side of the RM’s/CD. 5 miles due north of boulder.

            There ya go folks… poem solved… you’re welcome!

          • Hello Seeker. Here’s one for you. “C5” sounds like a call when playing the game Battleship. ‘You sank my battleship!’ (Sure hope I haven’t sunk mine now. If I have, I don’t want to know.) 😉

            P.S. Time to search the books and maps!

          • Me & my friends would play barf battleship.
            Take a drink every time one of your ships were hit.
            Anyway, some maps are set up with a coordinate system with numbers running north to south & letters running west to east or visa versa.

          • Hmmm. Battleship Rock, NM. Battleship Rock, CO. Now we have E (east). Battleship Rock, NM because the other is the west side of the divide. What do you think Seeker?

            Actually, I don’t put any meanings to the markings on the articles, but for Mr. Fenn’s personal use. It’s fun to think about. 🙂 I can only imagine what his gallery looked like with the amazing art pieces. I believe someone asked about markings on paintings. I have a painting above me that is penciled on the back of the canvas from the artist. Would Mr. Fenn have done something like this to keep inventory? I don’t know. I would love to see the sketched drawings on the napkins he has of Mr. Sloane. I have the book, “Seventeen Dollars a Square Inch,” but to actually see it would be amazing. I saw one of Mr. Sloane’s paintings and I stood close to see the strokes on the canvas. It was almost as if I stood behind him, watching him paint it.

          • Hello Jake Faulker. I’ll bet you guys were feeling like you were on rough seas playing the game that way. Up and down, up and down, looking green in the gills. 🙂

      • I’ll describe. It’s a picture of a news camera and instead of CBS, is says CB5.
        in the story f says he is being interviewed by CBS. I have to say I’m somewhat supicious of his answer regarding the CE5 on the chest. IMO of course.

        • No idea, sorry. All I know is that he said it refers to a price and there appears to be at least two examples of that, so (at least to me) his statement holds up.

        • That makes a couple of us eaglesabound. It (CE5) is an important indicator IMO; but differently than I’ve seen discussed. Because it’s relevant to my solution, I won’t say more.

          • It’s no secret that the number of times he uses, 5, a nickel,etc, is so many I lost count. It has a great deal to do with my solve as well.

  66. Eagle, discussion about the CE5 mark has been on the blogs since the first year. TFTW was written after discussion was already active. I’m not
    gonna dig out my copy to verify, but if your right, it was probably FF stirring the pot. How did your trip go? Did it resolve anything for you?

    • Thanks for asking OS2, my trip was riddled with mishaps that can only happen to me!
      We didn’t even leave my state when we scraped the entire side of the motor home with those stupid concrete barriers in the construction zone, then there was the tornadoes in the mid west, geez, what else. After 4 long days of travel I go to pull out the sofa bed and Whammmm, it came down on my toe! So after waiting all winter and traveling 4 days, I can’t hike because I have a broken toe!!
      As persistent as I am I squeezed my swollen toe into my boots and at least went to my site. It was like hiking on crutches. We stayed only 2 days and had to go home.
      To answer your question, I discovered 2 things. 1,Google Earth does not represent the earth as it really is, and secondly what is seen through the windows is not the search area but rather the beginning. IMO of course

      • eaglesabound- I’m so sorry to hear about all of your mishaps. That is terrible about your toe. I hope you can search again soon.

        • Thanks Puzzled!
          The real trick will be convincing the other half to make the trip again.

          • Hey Eagles abound,
            I know what your going through. Sorry to hear about your foot. The worst part is you did it before you searched, if it was afterwards at least then you could of marked of your place and start on a new one while you are laid up.
            Two months ago my wife passed out while we were signing in and split the back of her head open and we ended up in the hospital for the night and the headed back home the next day… I’m still trying to get her to go back. Man has that become my new solve…
            Rest up, take meds, and hope for the best with the wife…
            Good Luck
            Timothy A.
            from Illinois

          • Thanks Timothy!
            It makes it especially hard when you feel you have a really good solve.
            I hope your wife is better now and you’ll soon be on the trail again.
            We are still taking on air so everything else is just a minor setback.

  67. For all of those who were not at Fennboree and those who were there and did not take notice… Just for discussion sake… Cynthia’s quote that f alluded to attendees to should add two “clunks” of watermelon to his tea, was actually written at Fennboree as (paraphrasing) that attendees should add two “plunks” of watermelon to the tea. Throw in the Weekly Words on Jenny’s site and… Well, you do the definition research and do the math. Let the discussion begin… I’m surprised no one caught this (to my knowledge).

    • Curious.

      Is anyone else getting double solves for some of their clues?

      • Err, what I mean is the same solve in 2 ways on some of your clue solutions.

          • I already considered them “primary” and “secondary”.
            Your suggestion not only works, I’m wondering if there’s actually something to that.
            Are there any clues or hints related to “alpha”?

          • Which leads me to wonder, what about “beta”?
            In a wolf pack, you have the alpha, the beta, and the omega is the lowest ranking member I believe.
            Maybe there are three ways to solve this puzzle.

            Or maybe it’s a common thing to read into it all numerous “solutions”?

            But mine are direct without making something out of nothing. That still doesn’t mean I’m right. I’ll know before the summer is over, unless I have bad luck getting there.

          • BB,
            I wouldn’t want to mislead anyone so I don’t know. I am just a bystander to the chase anymore and have more important things to do, but I like chickin in every now and then to see if someone may have found the TC.

      • buckeye bob – if you but one omega at one end of a rainbow that would be the beginning and the other one at the other end – that would be the end – where you would find the pot of gold – to me that would also mean – 1- wwwh- 2 if you been wise – imo – that means the beginning and the end – I think that’s what forrest means by the double omegas – all this is imo

          • bob also from wwwh- which is the first omega – from there the bow of the rainbow sense it doesn’t touch the ground means – no botg – so to me itmeans drive form the beginning to the end imo

        • LOL, Straw….
          If ye ain’t cross eyed by now, ye ain’t lookin’ hard enough!

        • I tried to post this earlier with bad service so might be a repeat. BE CAREFUL…this morning we ran into the biggest, baddest rattlesnake I have ever seen. This guy was hungry, horney and ready for action, no lie. Huge he was, his black and white ringtail and rattles were no less than 9 inches long. When he rattled it sounded like ball bearings in a beer can. This guy was king of the hill, strike range maybe 9 feet and his bite would have broken a leg. Got some good pictures from afar…..BE CAREFUL.

          • Holly crap!
            I hope to go with a group, and long walking sticks in tow exactly for snakes.
            If we look in any enclosed areas or whatnot, stir the pot to be sure.

          • Hello strawshadow. Thank you for the warning. So glad you caught sight of it when you did! Just gives me the chills just thinking about it.

          • Thanks for the heads-up, strawshadow.
            Our local new here in Texas ran a story last night on the population increase of rattlesnakes and how plentiful food sources have made them grow seemingly bigger than in years past.
            I hope you post the pictures.
            …And as strawshadow says above, Be Careful everybody.

          • @strawshadow – I am going BOTG this weekend. What state are you in seeing the rattlers?

          • Didn’t mean to get everyone in an uproar, I’m out all the time and this is the first one I’ve seen. I was high up on a flat remote Mesa and today was extremely hot. We slept just a short distance away. He was a prize winner though, no BS about it. Very few people ever go there so he was able to grow BIG. I think he might have been eating rabbits. I’ll post a picture when I get around a WIFI. Maybe he was guarding the treasure?

      • Buckeye Bob, I don’t believe he said “his cup of tea.” IMO, it was general like, two plunks per cup and mint if desired. I’ll check my pics. I may have snapped a pic because I loved the tea. That tea can excuse anyone of any misunderstood behaviors if presented as was. It’s no wonder Peggy keeps f around. He thinks of everything!

    • Hi Slurbs. I have come up with my own interpretation for the clunks that fits into my solution. Sorry I can’t say what it is, but there’s not really much math involved. Well, maybe a little.
      So what’s it supposed to be? plunks or clunks?

      • IMO:
        Definitely PLUNKS, WiseOne. Maybe someone took a pic of the cooler, watermelon sticks, watermelon, and mint leaves. That tea was the bomb! I missed Spallies pineapple pie by a few seconds. I went off to take something to counteract the gluten and when I got back, I was told that some old baldy from out by the West took the last one! Could you believe the nerve of that guy. He must be protected by some big guns on mounts or something because when I asked if he was going to eat all of that (last piece of Spallies pineapple pie) he growled emphatically, “YES!” It looks like I am going to have to find Spallies and grow her a pineapple. Then, maybe I can have a pineapple pie all to myself.
        I had to vent, my apologies fenners!
        Could someone please send me Spallies via Postal Express?

        f, thanks for showing up to the gathering. Your presence was much enjoyed! What was your favorite part of the whole event? That is my question.

    • Slurbs –

      It’s not unusual for FF to add a “plunky” word in a sentence – to avoid the real word.

      Is the real word hint -” watermelon” – which would, of course, be served on the 4th of July? IMO it’s a very important date. Remember all the 4th of July stamps?

        • Yes, I have – and the “X” was there…….but no treasure – so far.

          This year I am many miles away from my spot in Texas (do you see the X in that word – and it’s in the middle) – that was part of my solve – but, of course the TC is not in Texas. Don’t know if I’ll get a chance this year to go back and work my spot again.

          • OK – I’ll even give out another hint (imo)

            Tea relates to Judy Garland – she used to put vodka in her tea —– sound awful to me – but that’s what she did. If you don’t think rainbows and Judy are in the chase – you might want to rethink that.

          • Remember the scrapbooks with the parrots? Those are totally related to Judy Garland. Clark Gable gave Judy two parrots………when she was young.
            She named them Clark and Carol.

          • Texas is my spot also. fort worth is a clue imo. the blaze may be in texas.

          • pdenver – I didn’t think you knew…..and you don’t.

            I’ll give you a hint – if you start with a rainbow – it has to do with all the colors.

          • I was asking you for a “who”. And it’s not a her.

            Good Luck figuring this out…….I could tell you and it wouldn’t make any difference because of the genius way Forrest set this up.

            I will tell you that by doing this – it is going to end up giving you coordinates. Then the ground game starts – with another game of explicit directions.

          • I’m sure this is quite interesting as long as I keep giving out hints. Well, it’s been along time for me to keep things to myself – and I am a woman so it is harder for us to do that……I think.

            It took me a good two years to put together – and that was after I knew what he did. He made this a puzzle and included games.

            Why do you think there are 039’s on some of the stamps? I know exactly why.

            If you don’t use those as they are supposed to be used – you missed a game and you will be wrong.

          • pdenver –

            You make it sound like a joke. no, not one game – but two games – after you complete a certain thing. He tells you to do this.

          • I don’t know if any of you remember Mr Magica………but I thought he was pretty close. Come to find out – he started in the wrong place – but people laughed at him too…… It’s OK ……but it is the way this will be solved.

            Forrest planned this as he wanted this to go on for a least a few years…….

          • I did not know Mr. Magica please enlighten me. I am all about wanting to understand what most view as illogical. I once took a cruise on a ship called Magica.

          • Hello inthechaseto. By no means do I think this is a joke. I truly am taking our discussion seriously. I’m not sure what the 039 means, although I have seen it in the book. Are the two games mentioned in the poem or in the stories in the book? I know one game he mentions and it matches my area and the second thing to do is to call.

          • Hello inthechaseto. I do not play poker, nor know how to play. If I found the treasure, I would call to let him know I did. Hopefully, that makes better sense.

          • pdenver –

            Calling Forrest or anyone else – has not come up in my solve – although if I did find the TC – I would be on the phone to him.

            Are you saying – that a phone call will find you the treasure? I have heard that one before and don’t believe it to be the case…

            but who knows ……..I’m done for tonight and going to bed. Sleep well……..

          • Hello inthechaseto. For me, a phone call to Mr. Fenn would be the proper thing to do. For me, there are no other phone calls, nor are there games. Perhaps someday I’ll learn what “039” stands for and better understand what you were trying to convey.

            Have a good night’s sleep, inthechaseto. It was a pleasure discussing things with you.

          • Hello inthechaseto. I’d like to add that Mr. Fenn, and each of you have been added treasures in my life, which I am truly grateful for. A big hug to each and every one of you for putting a smile on my face. 🙂

    • The only thing I’ve found is something along the lines of “the great turtle”. That’s based on one culture’s creation myth. But I know there were other cultures, for example the “ant people” and their people coming out of caves, but I don’t know of anything about the actual land on that one.

      One thing about ff’s hunt, it’s an education. I’m getting an overload in the short time I’ve been looking. And more drive to learn more. Not living in the western states, the native cultures just aren’t in front of me much, until now.
      Even though I have an ancestor who was a Flathead Indian. But other than that fact and the name, the story of her was lost in time along with much else.

    • Hammertime et all……………

      Caves and Ice Age People ARE part of the hunt……imo.

      Once you find the connection – it will take you to many caves around the world. It’s a truly fascinating journey and enlightening to boot.

      This does not mean that the TC is hidden in a cave.

      Happy Hunting !

      • IMO to simply study the ancients – will get you no where.

        Without a very precise clue back to the spot and the poem – it will do you no good.

        First one must have the area right. If not – there is no way, ever and no how to find what I am speaking about.

        S0 – how do you find the right spot – I have said many times, LOOK TO THE RAINBOW. Read what Forrest wrote about the rainbow…..start in the right place. You can do it.

      • Hammer, SL – great info re naming America. I was raised attending Sons of Norway meetings and eating Lefsa… no doubt in my mind that Vikings named prior to Vespucci . I only hope my ancestors treated the Native Americans better than they did the Anglicans.

        • SL, thank you for your kindness! I enjoyed your link to Scandinavian “tortillas” more than you know. LOL=lots of lingonberry memories.

          I would have loved sharing a watermelon ice tea with Forrest at Fennboree. Really sorry I couldn’t join in the festivities and meet Forrest.

  68. Can anyone please point me to FF answer to the little Indian girl’s post. I would like to read it again.

  69. Just heard a 23yr old man was burned to death after falling into a Yellowstone hot springs when he wandered off the path. Please don’t let it be a searcher.

    • Every year there are many that perish in the scolding waters.
      Whut difference does it make if it’s a searcher or not?
      Maybe the new cry should be “Searchers lives matter” instead of “All lives matter”.

    • Very sad to here about that young man…… I did hope it was not a searcher also.

      I do want to say this to all…….IMO, Forrest did not place the TC in a dangerous place. Not near a death trap of a hot spring – not near a raging river – not in a cave that could cave in – not near an ice lake you have to walk across – not near buffalo that could charge you. He really did think of everything – and he took into consideration – your kids. IMO it’s in relatively safe place – no grizzlies – but there are black bears – but if you make noise they leave.

          • Hello inthechaseto. With you understanding the poem, which appears you know where “X” marks the spot, I was wondering why you haven’t picked up the chest?

          • Hi back to you pdenver……….

            While at my spot – my husband was not feeling well………..we never got to complete what I was looking for.

            Since that time, last year – my husband died. It really took the wind out of my sails – and I am now. just beginning to get back into the swing of things.

          • Inthechaseto- I’m so sorry to hear that you lost your husband. Best wishes to you in your search.

          • Hello inthechaseto. Gosh, I’m sorry to hear you’ve lost your husband. I couldn’t imagine how you felt. I’m glad to hear you’ve found the sunshine once more. You can do it. I returned to my spot nearly three weeks ago and I couldn’t finish searching my area either. By the time I got to my spot, my body was already letting me know it wasn’t pleased, and I knew I had to walk the same distance to get back. I’m hoping to return again this year, but many things are to be considered. I’d like to walk through a different area just because it seems like it would be a beautiful place just to take a walk through the woods. My daughter and I were there last year, but she ended up getting too tired from the previous walks the family took days before. I look forward to hearing your adventures and wish you the best of luck and many fun memories.

          • pdenver –

            It’s one thing to get it right on paper – and quite another to execute the finding of the TC on the ground.

            While on the ground – there is a lot involved …………

            Thanks for your encouragement – it all helps.

            I wish you the very best in your hunt and travels.

          • Hello inthechaseto. Not really. I use to buy plenty of sets for my sons and they played. I know there’s one larger marble than the other, and I think it’s called the shooter, and you have to hit the others out of the ring. That’s about the extent of my knowledge. Do I need to look online and see how to play that, too??? 😉

          • Well, IMO your going to have to find the proper marble game to play. I did not find this by myself – rather a friend in the chase told me about it – and he was 100% correct. He does not post here any longer -but does post at chasechat.
            So, when I find the TC – he is going to deserve a gift.

          • Thank you Puzzled –

            Can you tell me how you are posting directly under the question you want to address – without going back up to the reply button?

          • inthechaseto- I get a Email notification that there is a new message on the page. Instead of clicking the title of the notification, I click on the reply button. It takes a bit for the page to load all the comments. But if I don’t click on the page while it’s loading, it will eventually stop loading and I will be on the reply box. Hope that helps.

          • Hello inthechaseto. I believe I know which one you’re talking about and it fits my area and what I’ve found. It also fits another area of mine, too.

            Are you from Colorado or search it?

          • Hello inthechaseto. I have three different search areas, from three different states. Things I’ve read during my search has brought me to my area. Am I in the correct one? It’s nice to think that I am, but I won’t know for sure.

          • pdenver –

            If you have three spots in three different states – two of them are wrong – imo.

            Of course the TC has to be in one of them. I believe it is in Colorado. There are very specific reasons FF placed it there. First of all – he knew not many would look there…. but once you start in the right place it will all fall into place.

            Remember – first and foremost FF is a people person. Friends of his ARE involved. Just take a look at the scrapbooks – they are mostly about his friends – and very meaningful. Do you really think he wanted to play the cello – or is that a hint. Do you think pineapple pies are a hint…….I do..but they are not pies. I think his extreme love of flying is involved along with WW2 – it’s an amazing tale. Do you think cars are involved — yes, indeed. Do you think chickens are involved – the ones that eat out of gold spoons….I do.

          • Hello inthechaseto. I believe there are hints to what he has said in the book. I believe I understood things, which for me, confirms I may be in the correct area. Since others feel they have understood, they feel they’re in the correct spot, too. Right now my head is spinning with so much thought.

      • Ok, enough of this. If you are so confident that yours is the solve then why is the TC still out there?
        Where did ff say anything about a rainbow? You sound intelligent and I want to truly believe you but I need solid proof not the little tid bits. I see you are having lots of fun with certain people but you should clarify what it is you are teasing everyone about…IMHO

        • I’m sorry to read that you lost your husband last year. You have my condolences. That explains a lot of what I asked earlier. I didn’t read about your husband until now. Sorry inthechaseto…

          PS Marbles is really a good game from the past. Pdenver you sound like you know how toplay and I’m sure that it plays into the final solve, some how….all IMHO

          • Timothy –

            Thank you. Actually Forrest placed a huge hint in the book – as to what game to play with the marbles. I cannot tell you as it would not be fair to my friend who told me in confidence.

        • Timothy –

          Certainly don’t mean to be teasing anyone – I would only hope to be sharing to be helpful.

          The rainbow that FF wrote about is BEFORE the poem – both in the book and on his website. If you compare – the website to the book – there is a difference. It’s a huge hint. So there you have it. Just remember – any time you find something wrong – it may be important. FF does not make mistakes.

          • Hello inthechaseto. Are you talking about the very first page when you click onto Mr. Fenn’s website? The poem? If it is, I see it as someone else speaking, not Mr. Fenn, and that they helped him build his website. Using his words that were written in his book, but applying it differently. It’s possible I’m not looking at the correct page on his website.

  70. @Jeremy,

    I was reading some older post and I stumbled up this one you had posted. I really like the way you are working it out. I recall reading your post and didn’t really think much of it. Now that I am in position to read the Poem and then read the book again has much to say, IMO. Back to thinkin’

    Jeremy P. on January 15, 2016 at 5:51 pm said:

    OK, following the crazy (arguably original) idea out:

    Preface to TTOTC: “This book is my ninth in twenty-six years of casually recounting the things I enjoy most.”

    Dust jacket to TTOTC: “This is his eighth book…”

    Other books listed on the dust jacket:

    1980, The African Animals of W.R. Leigh
    1983, The Beat of the Drum and The Whoop of the Dance
    2001, The Genius of Nicolai Fechin
    2004, The Secrets of San Lazaro Pueblo
    2007, Teepee Smoke
    2007, Historic American Indian Dolls
    2007, Seventeen Dollars a Square Inch

    (Dates added by myself)

    The book count anomaly calls attention to the books. The year anomaly (it’s actually 27 years of books) calls attention to the years.

    There are 27 chapters or sections of TTOTC. 27 chapters of stories from his life.

    The chapter “Important Literature” heavily talks about the influence of JD Salinger. JD Salinger wrote the book Nine Stories.

    Nine clues.

    If we go by the hint to follow the book publish years, we need to look for clues/hints in stories 1, 3, 21, 24, and three in 27.

    • I had forgotten about that post, Geydelkon. At the time, I was just thinking out loud, and I never really got anything out of that train of thought. I will say that when I first read about JD Salinger in the book, I immediately associated nine clues with Salinger’s Nine Stories and considered that as a possibility, thinking maybe there’s nine stories in the book that matter in some way. I’m not sure if I got any further than that. I think that if there are nine stories that matter, they probably are not organized in the way I described above. It would be kind of cool, though. If anything I said helps, best of luck and let me know when you’ve picked up the chest!

      • @Jermemy…. I am at a different level in the Poem. I see numbers to the nth. Yet, I still don’t know why I am looking at the Poem this way. Perhaps, I will find the answer in a Cosmopolitan magazine I bought.

  71. Can I get a history of someones posts on this site by just typing their name somewhere? Dal, Goofy, or anyone?

  72. @inthechase – my deepest condolences. Im very sorry that you lost your husband.

    Once JC1117 mentioned a Portuguese word related to grieving: “Saudade” which translates to “the presence of absence”

    While it doesn’t ease grief, it helps one understand its presence. Do you have family or close friends near by?

    • Thank you my dear friend 42,

      Yes, my daughter is here in Texas – and lots of friends. I go to the beach quite often – but miss the mountains of Colorado.

      • @inthechase, I’m glad your daughter is with you. Grief arrives at inconvenient times and is difficult to process alone. I may have already asked, but don’t recall what part of TX?

  73. Knuckle down..clear out 7…gives you playground bragging rights.

    How to play marbles:


    I’ve always believed the proverbial X is inside a circle or arc of sorts.

    So in Fenn’s case “W” or double omegas inside the winners circle.

    It’s the 7 marbles which troubles me as I tend to believe one must solve the poem to multiple locations. I’ve played with post marks as possible addresses and extracting phone numbers, land deeds in the past. let’s be honest 7 correct would be near impossible.

    • 42 –

      I don’t understand about the 7……. if you take the stamps and are looking for coordinates …..there are too many. So you eliminate some by playing games. This is done in groups. Whew I can’t believe I said that. The palindrome is in the numbers.

      First you have to know “how” he used the stamps. Nothing will work until this is completed – and you know who each stamp represents and which chapter…..

      • The only thing I found interesting about the post marks are the they are all wrong.

      • Corpus Christy is beautiful. Glad Mike & Deb live there too. If you are ever thru dfw please give me a shout. Would enjoy meeting you. Warm regards ITC.

  74. Howdy fellow searchers….

    I have a complete solution that makes a great deal of sense but I won’t be going into the details. I found something so significant on my last trip that it pretty much guarantees the chest is there but I can’t say. Anyway I feel certain that no one will happen on to this spot and I know also that the trail is cold 🙂 I made sure…

    My plan is to run the clock out, I have no worries at all. I can’t imagine someone ever finding this local especially now that the trail is dead.

    Has anyone else noticed the word odd appears twice in the poem? IF you include the d descending on the right side of the poem. Something unusual buried that would be out of place @ some point in the future I intend on return to the spot and collecting my loot. I won’t be letting anyone else know for obvious reasons not even Fenn of course, such a good feeling knowing you quite possibly own the chase and you didn’t even half to spend 15 years writing that poem.

    • Good grief, yet another one that knows where it’s at that can’t/won’t go get it for some unknown reason. Just come on here to share with us dummies how brilliant they are.

      How many does this make, I’ve lost count.

    • I seriously doubt it…but who knows. And not very nice to not at least prove to Fenn so that others will know to stop searching…rather shallow IMO. Good luck just the same.

    • I’m a bit bored here Ax…
      Ya got it all solved, and take your precious time to tell us, what?! ya screwed up your brilliant solve the first time? And now you’ll just sit back and wait to go get a million plus in treasure?
      And tell us…. “I know also that the trail is cold I made sure…”
      So, you sabotage the path so the rest of the world can’t go looking for the trove… is that what you are implying?
      That the best you can come up with ~Yeah! I’m bored.

      Suggestion… new contest… who can come up with the lamest excuse to leave a million plus in gold out in the RMs, when they have the one and only solved for the poem…

      • Seeker I wasn’t sure how to break it to you all, sorry to bore ya. The top is lonely, I know Forrest is perplexed but he knows which switch to throw.

        • Ax Man –

          I think what everyone wants to know – is how you arrived at your solve. You give us no hint. You won’t even say “what state you are looking in”. That’s boring for sure. If you are just here to brag – what the heck are we listening to you for? We’ve heard it before.

          • Every person that posts
            has a reason and a theory! Lets see his rational for his post: Let him explain.

          • I say let him preach! He hasn’t made anything up? He hasn’t said any misinformation about anything? He’s just a confindence searcher going to get the chest! Ain’t that what Forrest is wanting?

            He has my vote to stay ( my vote doesn’t count lmao )

          • William –

            I think your opinion matters…. you see he said he had the solve and never said IMO, I think or I believe.

            To come in here and tell everyone how brilliant you are is bunk. When I said I think I know where it is ……..I gave some substance to the equation and even gave some good hints, and told what state I’m looking in ……. I could be so wrong….but at least I say so.

          • I agree with you but unless we have the chest or Forrest confirms we are right that it should be unwritten rule
            It’s all opinionated? But maybe he should tone it to IMO or just get the chest and this would all be irrelevant 😉
            Thank you but I really haven’t been helpful other than being the joker in that hand of poker! Lol it rhymes;)

        • Call it as you see it Goofy… I’m so dang bored that all the failed searches come up with the same exact excuse… I learned something on may way home and now I know I got it… I mean, can’t anyone do a three point turn anymore?

          I kinda miss JayA, at least he a wildly fantastic, great story that most SiFi writer would be jealous of, to go along with is crazy.

          Yep AX, ya bore me.

        • I’m more curious of what he means by “run the clock out” than the location. I can see maybe a clock ticking against you finding it before someone else, but if you’ve already “found” it, what clock could you be letting run out?

        • I couldn’t care less wether you all nuke me. If you do you won’t have any chase left. If I disengage you lose everything. Inthechaseto chest is in Wyoming.

          (W)h(y) is it that (I) (m)ust (g)(o) a(n)d

          • Maybe New York?

            I can (k)eep m(y) secret where,
            And hint of (r)iches (new) and (o)ld.

          • OK AX, you’re nuked.

            Since we don’t have a chase left what do ya’ll want to look for now? No one tell Dal the chest can no longer be found; he’s having fun.

            So what should we for look for now? Bigfoot, extraterrestrials, or ???. Hurry up and decide so I can have the site revamped before Dal gets back.

          • Kinda like taking a cat toy away from the cat. I was just about to have some fun playing! (devilish grin – just jesting)

          • **yawn** I had high hopes for you AX, I really did. I believe you have a great solve. We, well most of us, have a great solve (heck, some even two or three (that’s odd))! Which side of your boat am I on? The answer… The outside, because your ship is sinking fast… Right down a rabbit hole… IMO.

            Goofy, some mountains wear a winter’s coat in summer. Though it sounds wrong, it’s true. Let’s give AX a little rope and see if he/she can pull h**self out of a grave. You never know, give someone enough rope and they are likely going to hang themself. I vote to let AX have some rope and watch what happens. Will it sink AX or will AX swim with it?

            Can you impress us AX? Take care in answering… You are already leaving a lasting impression and it is not good. Peace.

          • Ax Man –

            Remember Forrest said he thought of everything………

            Do you really think he would set this up so it could be destroyed by someone like you? I don’t think so.

            Don’t tell me where it is as I have been long before you even new about it.

          • I was actually hoping he might answer. I’m genuinely interested in why people believe the things they do.

          • AX Man, I’m with you, wait till after 5, the drinks are cheaper. As far as your solve, I’ve had some crazier than yours, and they solved my curiosity. Since your running the clock out just write another poem with different reflections, that’s what I would do if I were you. Tick tock….

          • Personally, I think it’s absolutely amazing that you have single handedly managed to rearrange the geography to prevent other researchers from finding the TC. Fenn has said that he believes the poem will guide a searcher to the TC in a 100 or a 1000 years. Clearly the clues need to be things that could only be altered by a major act of nature such as an earthquake. It’s amazing that you have managed to alter mountains, valleys, creeks and other geographical features that only an act of nature could do. I will await the news coverage of you finding the TC.

          • yup, you have no idea. And have is spelled h-a-v-e, not half. Bummer, I always show up late to the “bashing” party. GOOF, can’t we just have (or half) a hat contest again?

    • Dear AX Man,

      Not that you ax’d, but to avoid being ax’d, I’d recommend being humble and kind.

      Best to you in your search. May you receive all that is coming to you based upon what you sow.

      • The way you guys are acting its like you are actually looking for treasure or something.

        I thought we all knew exactly where it was and just didn’t feel like going and getting it so instead we just hang out here and complement each other on how clever we all are.

        /end sarcasm/

    • Lets all be kind to all posters; irregardless. Ax man: please elaborate on your post to soothe the disgruntled.

      • Yes, imo, you are right.

        And freedom of speech is fundamental. If we start to censor those that rub us the wrong way, we are off track imo.

        • Many of us felt the same way years ago – but here’s the deal. Most people who are avid searchers and have a solve will say they think they have a solution. Not brag about it. This person was simply trying to get attention and we have always found this to be very disruptive and unproductive to the blog as a hole……. it always ends that way – especially when the person was told and did not change.

          • IMO: you should show the reason why you are “deleting him,” most of us cannot read the previous posts and what issues you are denying him access to post. JMHO

          • Deb read the rules at the top of the page. You do not come on here and pronounce you’ve solved the poem and found the chest without proving you have the chest. But this guy carried it one step further; he fixed it so no one else can find the treasure….According to him.

            I don’t know why these narcissistic drama queens do this. It’s happened again and again over the years. If he wants he can start his own blog or write a book as others have that claim to have solved the poem.

  75. I enjoy reading all the comments; but they are just rhymes, riddles and theories. Nothing but distractions from the Poem. All you need is the poem. I too have my search destination in an area that is huge, but the location is small. It is a significant place that FF has reminded people that some have been close to the putt putt course. It’s the what “if’s” that attracted me to this specific location.

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