Looking in Montana and Wyoming…Page Three



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684 thoughts on “Looking in Montana and Wyoming…Page Three

    • Hope this is right place to post.
      I have a room reservation for 6 nights
      September 5th-11th, 2017 in West Yellowstone. Room has 2 queen beds and Continental Breakfast included.
      Would like to share room cost $925.00 each
      and share Forrest Fenn’s when we find it. First time searching.

      • Hey David…another place to post this might work better. ” I Need a Partner” (another search topic) may be more helpful…Good luck in your “search”.

    • I am looking for a partner to “watch my back” for 3-4 days Oct. 10-17….Kalispell, MT area and will give you one pound of GOLD…50% coins, and 50% nuggets if we find it. You must also agree to keep quiet…loose lips sink ships. I am 59 y.o. male and do not want to be the next victim to the rugged Rocky Mountains. Please reply promptly. Thanks,

    • Jake,

      I’ll take that bet , and raise you a nickel.

      I will eat YOUR hat if it’s not found within a 3,000′ radius of my blaze. In NM.

      extra onions, mustard and mayo.

      • Now that’s BOLD Roll.
        3,000′ Radius?
        I should have warned you my hat smells sweaty, dirty & nasty.
        I am in South Florida where the temps get in to 90’s quite often I always wear it outside. The sweat & oils from my forehead have disintegrated parts of the rim.
        Good luck!

        • Yes, you heard me correct. 3,000′.
          We are The Crimson Tide.
          Sweaty, dirty and nasty ?
          That’s what keeps putting those shiny championship trophies in our display cases.
          We show up to kick azz and chew bubble gum.
          And we’re all out of bubble gum.

          3,000 foot radius.

      • One hat coming up with extra onions, must & mayo and where’s my nickel? It’s been over 2 years you know.

    • The treasure chest ~was~ in New Mexico — about 6 years ago. [grin] But anyone who thinks it’s there now should stay home and play canasta until they figure out the correct WWWH.

      • Zap,
        Would it be safe to say the treasure has been in all 4 states if it’s in Montana?
        That would give a whole new meaning to the map.
        We know you cannot take it with you on a commercial flight, so he had to drive or book a private charter flight.

      • Hi Jake — yes, I’m dying to know how he got Indulgence to southwest Montana. A commercial flight is certainly out, I doubt his pilot’s license was active at the time, and having a friend fly him up there is risky. A private charter would work, but it would leave a paper trail. Driving is the least conspicuous route, but that’s quite a poke from Santa Fe.

        • I can’t see him driving his own vehicle there either. Too many people know his vehicles.
          I just looked up the prices for private charter flights & your looking at least $12,000 from the sites I have seen. Yes a paper trail & lots more people see you as opposed to renting a sedan.
          If that’s what he did, he broke some laws on the way every state border he crossed he broke the law considering the chest is worth well over $10,000 which they allow.

          • Since when is there a $10,000 limit across state lines? I think you are confused with how much you can bring into the country without declaring it. Even then you can bring as much as you want as long as you declare it.

          • Lou Lee;

            Please show me where Forrest ever said that he rented a car. You will not find it. People who think it is in Wyoming or Montana ASS – U – ME (assume) that he had to fly in, and then rent a car, but that is only an assumption – Please check your sources before posting something that is probably not true – Thanks – JDA

          • He did say he would land at an airport that he could rent a car but I don’t think he ever said rented a car to hide the treasure. NO

        • Why would it bring attention if he took a private plane to say – Jackson or Cody, Wyoming to attend a meeting, rent a car – go to his meeting, stash the treasure, go fishing, and return to Jackson or Cody?

          Seems simple to me. Why try to complicate it? JDA

          • JD,
            Take a good look at the prices for a private flight, Google it from SF to WY or MT.
            I wonder if his wife looks at the bills?
            Honey, why did you pay $12,760 for a flight to bla bla?
            OK, maybe the price would be half that cause he would probably take a commercial flight back. Either way it raises a flag. But, I know if I was to do what he did, I would not take a chance at my wife or tax guy discovering this huge bill & I don’t think they let you pay with cash. They want to know who you are up in the “friendly” skies.
            I would rent a vehicle in SF, then rent another from a different company miles away & maybe even do that a few times to really cloud the trail.

          • If I had several million, I am not too sure I would worry about the price of a private plane. But what do I know? NADA – I am NOT a millionaire – yet! JDA

          • I know the price is not an issue for him.
            If you read what I said JD, you would know that there is a chance that someone else would know about the bill even if it’s on a CC statement & by the way even though they got millions, they didn’t get that way by spending money foolishly thinking, Oh I got the money……
            If he flew, there would also be more exposure to people as opposed to renting a car.

          • When I suggested this scenario about the Cody connection over a year ago, i was hung out to dry.


            The theory has never left me.

            No further comment.


          • I agree. He could have rented a car (by the way, if in Texas try Ausby’s–good little car rental agency) in Jackson or Cody and driven to the spot pretty easily, done some fishing and gone home.

          • OK don’t rent a plane – Hay George (or who-ever) – I know you have a plane. I have a meeting in Jackson or Cody – How about we fly up there on Wednesday? I pay for the gas, give you few hundred for incidentals, and I put you up in a posh resort for three days. Sound good to you? Oh, and we can spend two days fishing somewhere near-by – You name the spot. Deal? – Good I’ll meet you at the airport Wednesday AM about 0600. OK? Good! JDA

          • Too risky, JD: two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead. Bye bye George! Even if George thought the whole trip was innocuous, months later when he learned of the Chase, he’d put two and two together and have quite the leg-up on the competition.

          • Zap

            Not if this was a yearly thing – But WHO KNOWS? Only Forrest, and he isn’t talking.

            I guess we can ask him once the treasure is found.

            We can throw “stuff” at the wall until the cows come home, and even if it does stick – we don’t know if it is the right “stuff” – JDA

          • From what I’ve heard. Noted, etc.
            In my opinion. Forrest rented a car and drove it far. By himself to hide the chest. No problem, makes sense.

          • I will try to track down this statement. I wrote it down from one of his interviews along time ago. I’ve been on this chase since the beginning.
            I have binders of notes that I thought where important.
            Also why do people think an 79 or 80 year old man could not drive ling distance alone? My 80 year old father was hauling large trailer across several states to go fishing and RVing in Yellowstone! Forrest could do this. Easy…….

          • JD,
            READ what I wrote. Don’t ass u me. Lol
            Forrest has said he rented cars. Thats a fact…jd

          • Lou Lee;

            Am I just seeing things? Twp posts above mine, you say, “From what I’ve heard. Noted, etc.
            In my opinion. Forrest rented a car and drove it far.BY HIMSELF TO HIDE THE TREASURE . No problem, makes sense.

          • A private flight wouldn’t cost $12,000. For someone who was a private pilot, they could fly with an instructor. Maybe $200 an hour plane and pilot.

          • A man with the means to collect and hide a million dollar chest certainly has means to transport items wherever his wandering heart desires. I wouldnt discount any area

        • why would you doubt that arnt pilots licences good forever at least grandfatherd in i believe are

        • I don’t understand why a commercial flight is out.I carried a valuable coin collectio,graded and slabbed from Alaska to West Virginia in a carry on case.At aTSA checkpoints I stepped to the side and my case and contents were inspected behind a curtained screening booth.The only snag I encountered was a TSA agent who leftcone coin off to the side accidently? and almost firgot to put it back in the case..

          • I don’t think it would have been commercial because at some point, someone from TSA would have seen the chest. Once the news stories hit about it being hidden, that agent could have started to piece together information and possible have an idea at least what state it was it.

          • Additional to Mark’s comment: the chest and its contents exceed the carry-on weight limit for commercial air travel.

      • zap ,

        Are we to assume from your above statement, that you have “figured out” that the “correct” WWWH is not in New Mexico?

        If so, are pictures of Indulgence forthcoming ?

        • ROLL TIDE – I get your point: “talk’s cheap, show me the chest.” I haven’t solved the whole poem, so cannot oblige you. But I’ve solved enough of it to be quite confident I’ve got the right WWWH, the right canyon, and the correct interpretation of “not far, but too far to walk”. The answers to the first three clues are self-reinforcing, so I can “move with confidence” at least that far.

    • Jake… you know how those BAMA guys and gals are… Bahahaha just kidding…

      I totally agree with you email me…jtrolinger at me dot com. got a question and a statement for you

      • Hi James (TZP) — you (and I) have a lot of company based on Covert One’s latest survey summary. Most respondents now believe the chest is in Montana. It used to be that New Mexico was the prohibitive favorite of searchers — probably only because of a too-literal/restrictive reading of “in the mountains north of Santa Fe.” I wonder at what point the tide transferred to Montana, even if only by a slim margin?

        • Actually, more accurately I should have said that Montana was the *favored* choice of respondents — not that MOST believed it’s where the chest is. About the only thing you can say for sure about Covert One’s statistics on the states is that at least 70.65% of respondents are wrong, but that at least 19.57% are right. Surprising is that 5.43% of respondents gave an answer of “other” instead of NM, CO, WY or MT. I hope that’s mostly because they didn’t want to say what state they think Indulgence lies, not that they actually believe it’s in a state other than those 4!

  1. i am curious and mean no disrespect but why do you think its in Montana, or Wyoming when Mr. Fenn stated he drove to locale in an afternoon and his wife did not know he was even gone??…

    Was he still flying at age 79 or 80?

    Please give me your feedback… i just got back from my locale and need to go back

    • 1idwillhe,
      Read the 2 books slowly & jot down all the places he mentions in his books.
      Now, jot down the places he thought were special or loved.
      Don’t bother with places that are not on the map.
      He spent his childhood summers in Yellowstone.
      Someone asked him after he stated he could go right straight to it “Would you take a partner along?”
      Forrest answered “Do you have an airplane?”
      That video was taken in Santa Fe.
      Why would you need a plane if it’s in NM or CO?
      There are too many reasons to list here.

      • Jake;

        Almost all of the reasons that you list in support of it being in Montana, I can list as reasons that it is not. If I were to hide a treasure, and write two books about my life. I would mention everyplace BUT where the treasure is secreted – just to keep people guessing, and to keep them distracted from where it actually is.

        Just my thoughts. JDA

        • I’m not saying the treasure is hidden anywhere he has specifically listed, that would not be a subtle hint. Mentioning Montana, Gallatin National Forrest or Yellowstone would be considered a subtle hint for me because all these areas are very huge.
          For instance he mentions West Yellowstone a few times.
          I don’t think the treasure is there, because he mentions it & that town is pretty small.
          If your going to look at what he rarely mentions, then you should be looking in Colorado.

        • JDA— I agree with you. I have been going back and reading many of the articles and comments that Forrest has made in the past.

          In one article about “slicks” (pieces of jade mainly from Wyomimg) Forrest goes into good detail about how the jade becomes worn when sitting in someone’s pocket, etc.

          He then ends the article with a comment about having one in his pocket that he found in an old abandoned cabin by the Gallatin.

          I believe this is done to throw one immediately to the Gallatin. You have just read an entire article about Jade that is found in Wyoming, and then you are directed towards Montana at the end,

          We, as humans, are prone to put closer attention on what we just heard than on a lot that came before it. And if you already have Yellowstone, or close environs in mind “Gallatin” is going to set off the alarm—-and all the hints that were just given beforehand will disappear into thin air.

          Just an opinion. Of course, I believe it may be in Wyoming, so I’m partial. lol

    • 1idwillhe ,

      Can you provide a reference as to where “. . . Mr. Fenn stated he drove to locale in an afternoon and his wife did not know he was even gone . . .” ?

      Not picking on you, serious question.

      I’m fairly certain I read this somewhere when I first took interest in The Chase.

      I just don’t recall if it was an actual quote from f , or if it was simply attributed to him by someone on the blogs.

      Thanks for any info you can provide.

      • RT—- If someone shares where the comment came from, let me know if he mentioins he and his wife being in NM that day.

        What if Forrest and his wife were in Montana for instance, and he left for the afternoon in his rental car without his wife relalizing he was gone?

        Does it say where they WERE when he took off for an afternoon drive? I’d be curious to know.


        • RT—to clarify—-of course Forrest isn’t going to say where they were. But what I meant is does Forrest say anything about where they “weren’t” at the time? When he says he left for an afternoon drive we immediately think of him being in NM and taking off for a drive in the afternoon.

          This may not be what he means at all.

          • Joe and Roll Tide……

            I’m looking for the comment – having a hard time finding it.

            I do know – he said he hid the treasure in one afternoon. He never mentioned leaving from home to do that.

            I’ll continue to try to find it…………….

          • Found it — at Jenny’s

            Question posted 6/19/2014:

            Hi Forrest,
            I’m curious about your time spent in Biloxi, MS, at radar mechanics school, and I was wondering if you received any technical training on electrical/electronic theory and circuitry? Schematics, circuit tracing, troubleshooting components, things like that.

            That is what the school was about mostly and I’ll admit that I don’t feel rewarded for having attend it.

            Also, you’ve mentioned on multiple occasions that it took two “trips” to secret the chest and contents to a very special place. Perhaps someone has already asked this, but I’ve not found an answer yet posted or video recording that contains an answer. Forgive me if this is redundant, but were both trips made on the same day/date? Not to be anal, but that would be one spinaroo of the giant ball we call Earth that constitutes a single 24-hour day to its humble inhabitants.

            Thanks so much.
            Kind Regards,

            Joe, you make this thing so complicated. Reminds me of the reason I don’t like meetings. I hope you don’t belong to a PTA someplace. I made two trips from my car to the hiding place and it was done in one afternoon.f

          • Right, so where is this talk about his wife didn’t even notice him gone talk. I agree that the two trips in one afternoon is important as to how far you need to walk, but no clue as to how far you have to drive. Even then, I’ve driven from Missoula MT, all the way through Yellowstone park, across Wyoming, and 1/2 way across Nebraska In one day and wasn’t tired. Certainly you could drive, sleep, hike, sleep, and drive and do it all in a 3 day period.

    • 1idwillhe
      I am not sure where you received the info that you have stated. Forrest never said that he drove to the locale in one afternoon. He said that he drove to the the spot and parked (Forrest could have rented a car from any airport). Then it took a full afternoon to hide the treasure. In fact Forrest never answered the question that has been asked many of times, “Forrest was the afternoon that it took to hide the treasure chest a full afternoon in 1 day or was it 1/2 of a afternoon 1 day and then you came back a different day and it took another 1/2 of a afternoon to finish hiding the treasure chest?”
      Forrest answer is always the same, ” it took a full afternoon to hide the treasure chest.”
      The reality is left up to us as to how he did it…
      The other thing is, Forrest did not say it took 1 afternoon and his wife (Peggy) she has a name, did not know he was even gone. What Forrest has said is, ” it was a perfect time to go and hide his TC. Peggy went to see their daughter and it was 8 days later before Peggy realized that it was gone. This (when it’s said as it happened) gives time for Forrest to hide the TC in anyone of the states.
      This is why it is so Important to say what truly happened so that others do not get the wrong information. It is so easy for us to imagine it happening our way and not Forrest way so that our solves seemed to be correct to us. That’s how we have all eaten our share of crow pie…

      • Forrest and Peggy seem to have a wonderful relationship. One that allows each the freedom to come and go pretty much as they please, or so I believe.

        Forrest sits, or sat, om several Board of Governors’ or Board of Trustees, etc. He could tell Peggy that he needed to go to a meeting in any one of the four states, and that he would be back in 4 to 5 days – Fly off, attend a meeting, secret the TC, go fishing, and then return to NM. NO PROBLEM!

        I think that you might not serve yourself well by thinking that it MUST be in NM or southern Colorado.

        Just a few thoughts emanating from my one active brain cell. TRY to STAY SAFE ALL JDA

      What is your state? Jake and JDA and I have our state names out there for all to know. Telling someone your state does not reveal your solve. All 4 states are large enough for a 65,000 or more people. Believe me, there has been many people that have crossed over our areas but came up with the same results.
      NO TC HERE
      Good Luck with your searches and be safe

      • Tim …. my state is Iowa… but I am not sure that’s what you meant..lol

        I almost swear I read or watched an interview and he stated exactly what I said… I have been researching this for months… I wish I would a wrote down where I heard this quote … I rarely take any info from what people say in blogs… I try to keep what just Fenn said…

        i know you guys and girls have a lot more time in it than i but i know some interesting clues and just got back from one locale and did some recon.. but unfortunately need to go back and finish

        again.. does anybody know if he was flying at 79 or 80?

        • Forrest’s last medical was August 2001, and at the time, a 71 year old would have to have another after a year.

          Also, regarding paying a friend to fly him; unless that friend had a commercial rating he could lose his certificate. Pilots are very very careful not to break that rule, and if he did have a commercial rating, he would have to log the flight as such.

          I too am perplexed as to how he could carry the chest to MT without driving.

          as an aside: If you took a commercial flight to your spot and found the trove, what would you do? (Jake?)

          • Joseph said, ” If you took a commercial flight to your spot and found the trove, what would you do?” I would mail the contents of my carry on bag home and pack my carry on with the TC and carry it on. Or call one of my pilot friends to come get me and the treasure.

          • Puzzled – Don’t you think it would tip off a BUNCH of alarms if your carry-on contained 42 lbs of chest and treasure? Think it MIGHT cause a bit of an uproar? I do.


          • I assure you JDA, that the combined total of my carry on and my “personal item” on yesterday’s Alaska air flight was 40 lbs. You can easily carry 20 lbs per bag. At least I can. But, either way, the problem is not going to be “carrying” the chest. The problem is finding it.

          • My comment was not directed to weight. I am sure that when the carry-on was scanned that the gold etc would set buzzers a buzzin’ or at least the TSA agents eyes would pop out of his/her head and a supervisor would be called immediately! JDA

          • Joseph, In my estimation Forrest did not use a plane to move the chest at all. I could be wrong but logic says it was probably done with a car in any of the four states in play. I’m on the treasure state bandwagon. I think he could have easily packed it in the trunk and covered it up to head north for a meeting or a vacation. In TFTW, he talks about being in Yellowstone with family a few years earlier. I can envision him packing the chest in the trunk, covering it, packing in the luggage and then being the man that he is he would always unload and reload the baggage so that Peggy or other family would not have to lift a finger. He could have easily slipped away one afternoon for a drive or just said that he wanted to take a walk while others rested. Thinking back to all the questions that searchers have asked Forrest over the years, it would have been wise to ask him when the last time he had been in certain areas. Example, when was the last date you were in Yellowstone or when was the last time you were in the Rio Grande Gorge? While he would probably plead the fifth, it would be interesting to know the answers to those questions because it might narrow down search area pretty quickly. I have driven to my search area so would not have to worry about bringing back a chest in my own vehicle but for those that fly to the Rockies on a commercial flight, I would imagine that the best option of a return trip would be to take a private charter or rent a car. If one did find the chest, spending a few extra dollars to return home in a different manner would be a logical choice.

          • After giving it some thought (enriched by everyone’s comments), I have decided that a road trip would be perfect for delivery of Indulgence. I might even imagine that Forrest took a significant detour in order to begin the trip in Temple, TX, where his decades long love of mountain visits always originated.

    • 1idwillhe : when you been married a long time they do not notice when we have left. If he was at the Cody Black tie Gala and his wife was with him and he took off for an afternoon I am sure she was busy if she was there and did not notice. also she may have noticed he was gone for the afternoon since he was not in the state or checking in by phone knowing he is out fishing having a good time. I agree a lot of people know he is out and about when he hid the treasure and mostly in those three specific states. 08, 09, 10. and when he announced it he said “some years back” I hid it. I get the feeling he rents a lot of cars and hops on a lot of planes from friends or friends of friends. Or at least he did back then in those 3 or 4 years.

  2. My farthest north solve/guess had to do with warm waters halting (historically) on the Missouri River below Great Falls Montana. AFB in the area as well.
    But as Jake points out, that are didn’t get much mention in the books, unless you count the journeys of Lewis and Clark.

  3. You nailed it JDA. To mirror Jake F’ers post let me say I will eat my hat if the solve has anything to do with Hebgen Lake or the Madison River. How many thousands of people has searched west Yellowstone?

    • Ya Lug,
      I don’t think the chest is on/in or near Hebgen, Gallatin or Madison River. Just wouldn’t be subtle.
      But I can see some of the clues may have something to do with these places.

      • Jakers – Think about this.When he was a kid his family drove 1600 miles to and from W Yellowstone each year. There is a lot of landscape in those drives that we have heard nothing about. One story about Shoshoni/Casper but the other 1550 miles are a mystery.

        • Lug: “There is a lot of landscape in those drives that we have heard nothing about.”

          That’s right “nothing” & that’s exactly what I get out of it.
          How could no mention of any place be a subtle hint?

          • I believe the 1550 miles in between are not material because of this quote:

            “My Thrill of the Chase book is enough to lead an average person to the treasure”

            He has a couple solid hints and several other aberrations of hints sprinkled through out the book…

            Somehow what he says, the anecdotes, the places, the numbers, the jokes, the idioms, etc – reveal WWWH!

            He never mentions Colorado or alludes to it in anyway I can find.

            The only clue which may have suggested Colorado is finding his cars final parking spot at the Denver Museum…if he had actually died.


  4. There is one spot in MT that I thought was could be the place for the last year and a half, and I can see a huge white “F” rock “looks like it was carved, as the blaze and I really wanted to go their as my find, as I followed it through the poem, but the problem I have with it, is it seems from everything that FF has indicated is that the TC would almost have to be about 3/4 miles from the side of the road. So we choose NM as our adventure this summer and found a Blaze right off the road that looked like something in his book and less than 3/4 miles in was a real life hidden indian overhang. I we searched it real well all over and around it, and even went past it a little, but I think that this particular road had lots of different caves due to the soft ground/rocks – but it looked like it was heavily used for parties and other things. It looked like we caught a couple people down the road hiding or taking someting out of one cave that looked shady and we didn’t want to investigate any further as it looked like it could be some illegal activity going on. So we checked out about 5 other places, in NM with no luck, but still have a few good ideas in WY, MT and CO that we would still like to investigate. 🙂 Guess we’ll keep chasing.

    • Charlie… from Google Earth you see a White F on a rock that looks carved?? … if i saw that… i would be there tomorrow… it could be more than 3/4 of a mile… winding trails add up quickly

    • Charlie;

      How did you come up with the 3/4 mile from a parking place? Just curious, since my newest site = 3/4 miles from where I have to park.

      Just curious – JDA

  5. All,

    A Rainbow (synonymous with dream and fantasy) has two points of reference, lets call them a beginning and an ending. If we believe that his love of the outdoors began in the north, Montana and Wyoming where do we believe the Rainbow has taken him?


    • LitterateOne,

      That’s a great point. Perhaps the onset of a new search season, after Labor day, has created new challenges for searchers. We’ve had our share of set backs, especially after the Heatwave we felt this summer, maybe Autumn will feel better. My hope is that someone may offer advise as to how to over come the challenges ahead after Labor day. Any advise would be greatly appreciated!

      Gregg Salvia, II

  6. I believe the chest is in the treasure state…but it’s not too far to the north of where most are looking…

    • “My church is in the mountains and along the river bottoms where dreams and fantasies alike go to play.”

      *Or was that….’fairies’ go to play??


      • Fairyland Basin, or Fairy Falls?
        I thought Fairyland Basin looked good until accounting for the two trips in one afternoon, it’s just too far. Fairy Falls is too crowded and popular but possible.

  7. Mensan-Fennsan commented on the previous ‘Looking in Montana and Wyoming’ page. “Since we have been exhorted that knowing WHERE to start is PARAMOUNT, we should NOT assume that others searchers (who may not have known the correct starting place) must have exhausted all the simple solutions to the poem”

    Since the previous page is closed, I wanted to reply that I agree 100% with this comment. However, I have some other info to add to this comment.

    I think searchers are going to the map too quickly. My comments are based upon my own understanding of the poem and what I believe the poem is saying.

    I believe that when Fenn told us to “look at the big picture” he was referring to the picture of the WATER CYCLE. It is basic. Every “kid” and adult has at least a general idea of how the water cycle works here on earth.

    I think that the reason the TC has not been found is that everyone is so busy looking for a spot on a map that they have ignored what the poem is really saying about the water cycle. I say this because I too have considered multiple spots on the map and worked them through to what seemed like a logical conclusion, but never felt sure about any of the conclusions until I put away the map and followed Fenn’s advice. He said, “its not a matter of trying. . . “its a matter of thinking”.

    I think that the “answers I already know” must be thought out before the map is consulted. We must be able to identify WWWH and HOB in our thoughts first. This poem, in my opinion is as “straight forward” as Fenn says it is. But, because we are trying to find WWWH on the map, we miss what the poem is really talking about. If we get the right focus, then it is clear, concise and very straightforward. But, WWWH and HOB must be understand in our thoughts before we ever open the map.

    I do not have the treasure chest yet, but I understand the poem up to “if you’ve been wise”. Doesn’t need a map at all up to that point (imo). It is clear and concise and straightforward as it can be if you can focus on WWWH. Fenn did not say you have to go to where WWWH. He said, “you have to KNOW WWWH”. That is a different thing! And, yes, I am Not ignoring the fact that several searchers have been to the first 2 clues and passed the other 7. I know. But, that (imo) is because they were at the first 2 clues because it is possible to get to the first 2 places without understanding why they are the first 2 places and then to “walk” right past the other 7 because you really didn’t understand the poem. I think I could tell you who has been to the first 2 places. And those folks thought they were at the first 2 places for different reasons.

    So what I’m saying here is PUT AWAY THE MAP UNTIL YOU KNOW WWWH AND HOB. No map needed until you get past that. If you can figure out those “answers I already know” (and you do know) then you are close to needing the map. Start with the “big picture” first. And then just “think”. I was amazed how the poem has clearly and straightforwardly walked me through the “answers” once I figured out WWWH. That is how a searcher can be confident. It is because once your focus is right, the poem guides you straight forward.

    • Agree, to me WWWH screams the warm waters of the Gulf of Mexico and they halt on the west side of the continental divide. So that just gets you started. You don’t have to climb to the top of the mountain to know the Divide is there.
      On a second note of WWWH, what would be better than the lesser known source of it all? The longest waterway on this continent. Lewis and Clark got it wrong BTW. That canyon that comes from the source is little travelled but easy to get to. I think the source itself may not be too bad to get to, I want to try, from the Idaho side. I know it’s not in Idaho, but that doesn’t mean you can’t start there. I just want to go there to see it with my own eyes, not that you need to go there to follow the “trail”.

      • Bryan,

        Love this post and the linked article was very good. It spoke to riches old and riches new that come from exploring the geography of this amazing blue planet – a potentially singular oasis in the infinite desert of space.

        I also believe there is solid meat in this post!


  8. Puzzled, I have to agree. I focussed hard on the maps for years but the fact is that Forrest said all you need is the poem. I doubt that he reserved the right of title for someone with some bizzaar photographic memory of geographical locations. It certainly takes you down a completely different path when you take the maps, history and the such out of the equation. Until you have solved the clues, a map is just a distraction. I certainly hope the answers take me close to home (Montana), but you can be sure that if I find the solution Ill be on the road within days regardless of the miles to be covered!

    • Leza, I respectfully disagree. Forrest has said the clues are in the poem, *but* the answers to those clues are found on maps. You absolutely must have a map (and not just any map — it has to be a sufficiently detailed map of the right area) or you will never be able to make sense of the clues.

      • “All you need is the poem to find my treasure.” – Forrest Fenn. January 23, 2015.

        I agree, once youve solved the poem, the location in question will have to be located on a map, however I do not believe a map is key to the solve.

        • Leza, Are you saying that you have solved WWWH and HOB without the map? Because if someone other than me can do it, then I would certainly be interested in sharing ideas. Would be happy to hear from others who think these “answers I already know” are found by thinking rather than a map. I’ve worked the poem through to “if you’ve been wise and found the blaze”. Leza, message me at lequia at sbcglobal dot net if you want to chat.

          • Well I can’t say that I’ve found “the” solve until Ive found the treasure but yes I certainly have “a solve”

          • More likely, I believe you NEED the poem for the clues. A map and a good researching ability definitely helps link the clues. I believe I have found the general location for the blaze, by finding suitable answers that match every clue given.

      • “I would like to reiterate: Please go back to the poem and look at maps for your answers. Not every noun in TTOTC is a hint. If you can’t solve the first clue you should not spend your money searching. My guess is that the person who is successful will very quietly solve the clues and walk to the treasure with a smile on their face.” — Forrest Fenn in Scrapbook 73, 6/6/2004.

        • I am very aware of the comments that have been made. Ive watched all the interviews, read the blogs and both the books. Even the quote you posted speaks exactly to what I said previously. There are hints to be found and a map will ultimately be needed to find where your solve is located, but I believe 100% that the clues to be deciphered are found soley and independently within the poem. This is not to say that someone could not haphazzardly stumble upon the correct location on a map…..but we are talking about a pretty large search area. No one will really know until we all sit glued to our chairs in front of cbs this morning and watch the interview

          • The clues match, but the area is vast, It is grizzly bear infested. We were stopped by law enforcement we showed them our rifles. you must be armed in this area if the search party is less than 6 persons. and no camping overnight is allowed without a permit.

          • That doesnt sound to me like a place an 80 year old would go or a spot a 3 year old could find with a little help……nevermind a spot you go to twice in an afternoon.

        • Well, Leza, if you can correctly identify the clues in the poem and know their answers without the benefit of a map, my hat’s off to you. In my opinion, “not far, but too far too walk” is impossible to solve without the right map.

  9. I agree that it is in or close to the Treasure State. I will be there next week to try my own solves. Anyone else going to be in upper Yellowstone next week? I will be there 9/15/16 – 9/23/16. I’m staying in Bozeman.

  10. OK—so this is how it all went down. Forrest went to “the Home of Brown” (UPS) or they may have come directly to his house (doubtful though)– and he had the package (it weighed 42 lbs + box and packaging materials) sent to Cody Wyoming, or some other location.

    When he was up for a meeting he went again to “The home of Brown” (UPS) depot and “will called” the 42 lb package. He put it in the trunk of a rental vehicle and went off to bury the treasure. He laughed so hard he cried (WWWH), and got back in his car and drove off.

  11. I believe that Forrest was very intentional in the wording and the clues he choose. Given the amount of time he spent writing the poem, I find it to be no great surprise that solutions to the clues can be found in any number of different locations, many of which were some of his favorite spots.

    A man who understands human nature will have no problem manipulating man’s desire to find order and pattern in chaos.

  12. Does it take a while for the old MONT WY Archive page to update after a new page is started? Please advise.

  13. I forgot to mention. If Forrest was in a hurry and shipped UPS-RED, this would explain “Heavy loads and water high”—as the plane (he would have to ship air freight) would probably go through clouds before it setting down in Cody or the location he chose.

    • Woah woah woah!! Dal your actually searching up here! Let me know of you end up over in the cody/red lodge area!

    • Not there yet. Taking the scenic route and eating my way through huckleberry season above the Clark Fork. In Trout Creek tonight. Maybe Missoula tomorrow. If I pass a Mystery Hill or anyplace Lewis and Clark camped I may be slowed down again…lol…

          • Dal,

            You going to post any MT trip pics this time? Must be quiet there this time of year…since kids are back to school.


          • 23-
            I will. It will be a couple weeks before I am back at home and can organize. I am doing some vacationing as well as searching…and then there is the doll show that “guess who” wants to go to in Colorado before we head toward home…lol…

          • Dal – Have fun at the doll show with guess who.

            I just bought 2 Ashanti dolls (Akua’ba) at a sidewalk sale in Santa Monica for $5 a piece.

            I prefer the pure streams and rivers of my hometown that no one knows about to stocked ponds.


      • Thanks Dal you are definitely an inspiration to all with your history of exploration. Not to mention the way you just love life in general. Enjoy your trip sir.

      • Out of Gallatin NF today..
        No chest in hand…but I’ll be back…
        Snow, cold and rain Spent the day in Cody at the Buffalo Bill Museum…vast and incredibly intoxicating museum. It was a cold/rainy/snowy day so the museum was popular. In spite of crowds I had a great time there. I noted that they had Forrest’s Fetchin book for sale in the gift store and a couple of donations from Forrest and Peggy on the walls of the Western Artist’s exhibit.
        My favorite item there was the 1910 silent reel of film taken at a New York City appearance of Buffalo Bill’s Wild West show…
        In Thermopolis now.. headed to the Dinosaur Museum tomorrow…cold here…
        Good dinner at a restaurant called A Stones Throw up by the Thermopolis airport…way off the beaten tourist path..
        Unless you fly in…

        • Sorry to hear you didn’t find the chest. Would have loved to have seen what you saw at the museum. Tonight’s news just showed the snow in Yellowstone. Season is changing. Stay warm.

        • Dal – if it’s not to cold to walk the bridge you could check out my blaze/TC. I can’t get there till next chase season.

        • Dal – maybe you’ve already been but I have a nice solve that runs from Warm Water Creek down to Gold Creek.

        • Seems like my comment won’t post. I have a nice Thermopolis solve. Maybe you’ve already been. Warmwater Creek to Gold Creek. I don’t have a solid HOB

        • Hi Dal — another notch for you in the Fenn bedpost. Disheartened to hear that “Winter’s Coming” (cue the Game of Thrones theme music) is making an early appearance in the Treasure and Cowboy States. Perhaps a warm spell will accompany the long journey home after Dal’s Journey to the Valley of Dolls is complete.

      • In Laramie tonight…Worst internet connection on the trip, although all else in Laramie is above average. Great eats and good brews…

        Laramie seems to be doing well economy-wise…unlike many other cities we passed through on our way.

        Resource extraction such as mining and oil removal are in decline and so are the family jobs built upon those endeavors. Many people here are in serious economic trouble…

        Whole communities seem to have locked their doors and left.

        I saw a fine three bedroom home for sale in Casper for under $90K…and no buyers…no jobs…

        I’m not rooting for the comeback of oil and coal but I certainly have empathy for the folks who built families and homes out of those crashing resources…
        and the rest of the folks it once took to support them in retail, manufacturing and services..

        All gone…poof!!!

        • Dal, “Laramie seems to be doing well economy-wise”
          Laramie is awesome, it’s a college town, had a great time there a few years back.
          They must put something in the drinking water, because the folks there are way too pleasant. Can’t understand how they tolerate the long winters, with the wind blowing like crazy. We learned that April- May isn’t what you would call prime Wyoming camping season. I/ we ended up spending way more time indoors than out in the woods.

          Spent a good deal of time in several public libraries on that trip: Ft Collins, Laramie, Cheyenne, the staff at a small Library off I-70 in Colorado surprised me when they let me load GE & Mozilla on a computer there. (the PCs reboot after every session)

          Goofy, before you say searchers spend too much time online, I’ll have you know I also eased up to a herd of Elk in Wyo, a herd of Bison in Colo, neither were impressed with my smartphone’s pathetic zoom lens. Also had a lengthy, albeit one-sided conversation with a sage grouse while I sat on a log, recuperating from an exhausting trudge, in and around snow drifts.

          • NineClues glad you got out from behind the screen out into the wilds. Wyoming summers are spectacular and I enjoyed them very much when I lived there. Sadly there was a couple years I missed the summer completely from being out of state that weekend.

  14. “I too am perplexed as to how he could carry the chest to MT without driving”.

    I was kidding above—but seriously—-Forrest REALLY could ship the chest to himself buy UPS, FEDERAL EXPRESS or truck for that matter. He wouldn’t have to take it on a flight. No one is going to know there is a million dollar chest in the box he drops off at UPS. The only give-away would be if he insured it.

    But I think maybe that IS how he got the chest up to the area where he buried it. He had it shipped to a depot, or possibly to an address he owns up in that area—who knows?

    All he would have to do then is drive it a few miles to the hiding spot. He probably uses UPS or Fedex from time to time anyway at the Santa Fe shop he owns. No one (not even his wife) would suspect anything odd about shipping a package to NM, COLO, MONT. or Wyoming.

    I actually think it might be quite easy for him to “ship” the chest. “Hey, David, can you do me a little favor? I shipped some stuff from the store up there via UPS–could you pick it up for me? It’s a little heavy—full of fossils and stuff—-I’ll come and get it after my meeting today”.

    Chances are “David” does not even remember doing that “little favor” back in 2010 or so.

    • He’s a pilot and he flies himself. There is a story in TFTF about flying to Cody and stoppling in Meetese and renting a car. He also makes the point that Cody to YP is 54 miles (and not far). I don’t have the exact reference but it is there.

  15. I found the Blaze…. and will tell all
    becareful or you may fall
    Bridges over ……. ….ty
    45.367448, -111.412767
    this is a clue from 1idwillhe !!!

    • 1idwillhe,
      That blaze has been floating around the minds of many searchers for years.
      Just way to obvious & too easy to find the blaze before any of the other clues.
      I will add that you can see the blaze from many vantage points from the north side & there is only one very crowded road & parking spot to get to Blaze Mountain.
      Way to many hikers, bikers & horse back riders.
      Take a look at GE & count the vehicles parked to the NE of the mtn.
      No, an 80 yr old is not going to get to it from the ridge to the West.

  16. Arrhhgh… I am a poet
    and did not know it …
    Even tho Montana is not my state
    it could actually be a clue up for debate…

  17. Just before 10pm mountain time:
    I am in the Yellowstone area now. Smoke in the valley but it’s not bad. I can see stars in the wide open sky except around that glaring half moon…
    Will check out areas tonight and tomorrow..
    Saw herds of Magpies on the way down along the Clark Fork…also saw Swans and Pelicans, Osprey and their nests, Two owls were out sitting on a fence post…

    In Montana the speed limit signs are simply a suggestion so when you are flying down the two lane at legal but crazy speeds it’s only the large birds I have time to identify.

    I had the BEST pork ribs of my entire eating career in Trout Creek last night.

    • Spallies-
      Not just owls… I saw a rainbow over Hebgen Lake…might have been anchored into the ground near the Rainbow Point Campground…

    • Dal, where in Trout Creek did you eat the best ribs of your life? Is this a name of a tavern? Near or in Yellowstorne?

      • Arnie-
        I don’t remember the name…but it’s a place right on the river with a great lawn and tables out overlooking Clarks Fork…Is there more than one place to eat in Trout Creek??
        North of Yellowstone on the Madison last night. Probably somewhere different tonight..

        • I’d say just one place in Trout Creek to eat. DId you actually find fresh huckleberries still? Last time we were up a few weeks ago they were about done. This was outside of Missoula though, and I know Trout Creek is better.
          Glad to know you passed through and still have MT/WY on the possibilities. I have stayed close to Missoula all summer so didn’t get to try any of my new wish lists in the Centennial Valley, the Gravelly Mountains, or the Ruby River valley. Glad to see nobody found it during my lack of effort as well LOL! I had great adventures where I did go, I just wasn’t looking for Forrest’s treasure.

    • Morning now…headed out…Thanks for all the good luck..
      Meeting a searcher on Hebgen Lake for a gab fest about Forrest today at noon..
      Checking out new flies at a couple fly shops…
      My gosh…the day is loaded with fun stuff to do…

  18. Our predawn search of a location in yellowstone was one of the best days of my life!!! This is by far the best time to visit yellowstone. Having lived here in Montana nearly my whole life, it has always been a favorite spot but I wont go near the place in the summer months anymore. Make sure to take a dip at the 45th parallel for me Dal!

    • Before they close everything, but after school starts. The Elk bugle all night, it’s easier to stay warm in the cold, then stay cool in the heat. The crowds start to die down. Last fall we must have seen 13 grizzlys in 3 days time.

      • Yeah I wont set foot in the place in the summer months anymore. We usually go up to the hotsprings in November-January so we have the place to ourselves

  19. Me and my brother spent 7 wonderful days site seeing and searching the beautiful Woodbine Falls area of Nye Montana a couple weeks ago. Went from Still Water River all the way to top of falls area and above which I wouldn’t recommend. We keyed off river and creek points of 200 and 500 feet (plus 400 which we heard in another site as in which people have been in proximity of treasure) and acres of areas near still water river. We also searched both sides off Woodbine Creek as well as 5 islands in WOOD bine creek. We even tried at all locations Falls were visible looking down to areas that may of keyed something but no luck. All in all we probably spent 30 hours a piece in area searching thoroughly metal detecting and searching every crevice. Forrest mentioned that he use to fly 600-700 miles and not knowing where he may end up in interviews as well as showing Sitting Bulls peace pipe off a time or 2 which this area is in Custard National Forrest. Custard has many areas around so maybe not an X on searching spot but Still Water would be a wonderful answer for where warm waters halt. Plain and simple. Woodbine is a honey suckle plant so combining the Falls and lush green and yellow foliage throughout most of year was another key we went off as he mentioned his military adventure to falls area which was lush and beautiful area where he found grave markers of fallen soldiers
    We’re planning another trip next year with more family members and maybe looking at areas to spend during retirement out of the SE USA high humidity times of year. Forrest has done a great service to many a people. Thanks!

    • I know what you mean, by taking a break from the humidity. As much as I like being close to the ocean, I could find plenty to keep me busy in the great outdoors of Colorado & Wyoming.
      Funny how the financially well-off ride around on bicycles that are worth more than the SUV I drive.

  20. Our trip may have been delayed again.

    Can I get a weather reality check on the Gallatin NF area? I see reports of light snow higher, and great temps otherwise. This Week.

    I would like to reset for arrival next Monday.

  21. Joseph,
    I hope you all get enjoyment while you are also searching. Please be aware of your surroundings at this time of the year animals are on the move as well as the weather can get on top of you before you know it.
    Be safe first but enjoy the time you are out their…
    Best of luck to you and the family, May find all that you are searching for!!!

  22. Thanks folks. We are over prepared I think, and mom and dad are well versed in outback. We won’t get more than a few hundred meters from the truck anyhoo. Weather looks good.

  23. Forrest had a lot of flat tires on his way home from Yellowstone with Skippy. Maybe that’s a good omen for you.

  24. Strike number 1. An encouraging recon geology wise though. Exceeded the 80 year old range, according to everything my body says.

    • I believe someone as active as I believe Finn has a bit longer range than most of you are thinking… Finn is a treasure hunter and avid fisherman… at least he was. Afternoon treks for a person in decent shape should have no problem traveling up to 5 miles from a parked vehicle and make the trek in an afternoon.

    • “The country up there……man, you just want to stay forever. The water is crystal clear and there’s always plenty of it..Its a fishermen s paradise.”

      Father Fenn when talking about Yellowstone and Fenn Haven in a 1954 newspaper section article: “Field and Stream.”

      Just appreciate the quote and thought.


    • I know of one area, SL. It’s used by the Park Service for emergencies in Colorado. I’m sure there are many more that I am not aware of.

          • pdenver,

            It’s those people that are gentle and ever so kind; that bring us those sweet marsh mellow smiles..

            You always seem to get…IT, my friend..

            You are appreciated,


  25. Well, I suppose this will sound trite, but my family and I just returned from a vacation search and we found treasure in the Fenn manner. We explored the outdoors and discovered many wonders, new acquaintances, and each other.

    Having read over and over how Forrest intended to get folks to do just that, I never really got it until now.

    Thank you Forrest. I get it now.

    I am writing a travel log, but unfortunately, my solution is not invalidated, so I will have to redact portions for public consumption. 😉

  26. That’s great Joseph. We should invent a new word for a vacation that involves searching for the treasure while on vacation. You know like how staycation means a vacation where you stay rather than travel. I vote for Fenncation. Of course it will become obsolete once the treasure is found but maybe it could stick if we said it enough an emphasized that it really means discovering all the riches and glory of the mountains. I look forward to your travel long.

  27. Really enjoyed reading everyone’s comments. I have been here before but the last year was strictly work for the Mrs. and I. would love to get out in the woods but not going to happen before winter. Better plan my trip for May back where I suspect a lot of you have been searching. Not sure that it is a good thing that you have not found it or a bad thing that you have not found it as I would think it is there in Montana. Been there once but I believe I headed straight past it.

    Anyway, my take is Montana along with those who believe he hid it in 2009 from the Cody Black Tie event. As far as how he got the treasure up there who knows. not impossible though. Maybe they all drove up there and enjoyed themselves maybe he mailed it to himself but I doubt that and maybe he hopped on a charter or took a ride with a friend up there. Love the thrill 😉

  28. I’ve been MIA for the past 3 and a half months because I broke my left leg, both the big and small bones right where they connect at the ankle. I am finally back to working and will resume my armchair search for the TC. I still think it’s in Montana but with my leg healing, work to catch up on, money issues, and winter coming I do not think I will make it back to Montana till next spring at the earliest to look again.

    • Thanks pdenver. I think this is a good reminder that f says the treasure is not in a dangerous spot. If he invites families to go out looking for the treasure, then I’m pretty sure one of the things he considered about his hiding spot was that it would be okay for young and old alike without fear of being attacked by the wildlife.

      • You’re welcome, Hear me all. I’m not sure if there is ever an area that is totally safe. Even the calmest of areas could pose dangers. We just need to be aware of our surroundings and be prepared for the unexpected.

        • Last week out on a walk in Wyoming my sister found a deer partially buried… They put a game camera on it and a cougar came back ate some then reburied it again! So beware of anything buried except the chest of course 🙂

          • Yeah, I can’t wait to see it my stepdad filmed it for a week while it ate the deer… Said its a really cool video where he cleans himself after eating, sleeps and even tried to jump up in a tree and missed 🙂

  29. not trying to scare anyone here, just saying be careful out there. Lots of bear attacks lately. Sure, partly because there are lots of hunters out , but also the griz population has increased and the bears need to expand their territory.

    If you recall when Lewis and Clark got near to present day Glendive,MT they encountered their first griz. You see, that was their territory, a long ways from the mountains.

  30. Spent a cold and rainy day out in the Madisons today. Steady rain with temps in the upper 30s at the elevation I was searching. Winter weather advisories/winter storm watches throughout the region tonight through tomorrow. Feels like the season here is starting to draw to a close. Looking towards spring of 2017.

  31. “If you have a searching partner, best to have them wait in the car. f” & “as I have gone alone in there…” Solitary Geyser in Yellowstone?

  32. It’s been awhile now that nobody has posted to the Montana/Wyoming section as of late. Just want to make sure everyone is in Montana…:). Saltpeter, anyone know how “Deer Valley” got it’s name? I need a nice Epsom bath… Maybe there is a hardware store near by, in case I need to nail something, that would be a good place to start…

    • I think most are north of Lander although WyIMustGo was buzzing all around Lander.
      You may have to search back a month or few on this blog to see the who, what & where.

    • Shoshone? Why Shoshone? Who would even think of searching in Shoshone? That’s ridiculous. Hey, stay out of my forest, man! 🙂

    • Warlock –

      I don’t know you but I will mention some things I find interesting in the area. I think everybody knows this stuff. Lander is interesting as the location of Fort Brown. If you are north of it on the Reservation you are in what the Shoshone call Warm Water Valley. We named their reservation with our dumb name. They still say Warm Water etc.

      South you pick up the usual hot springs and tufa stuff. I would say go check out Burnt Ranch.

      But what might FF be interested in? What might draw him nigh? Handcart Rescue

    • I think they’re great, SL. When I grew up in the countryside of New York, the bus would drive by such buildings and they were always a joy to see. The traditional brick red siding. There’s also another in Colorado that we occasionally drive pass that always makes me imagine schoolkids inside and the slate chalkboard. Thank you for the link.

    • Yes they do SL. Thanks for sharing that pic.
      Someone brought up the question of the schoolhouse that f’s dad always drove out of the way for. I too often wonder about that………

  33. Thank you for sharing your special memory, my friend. We also have one in my hometown that is now a little chapel.


  34. If searching in the Paradise Valley area, north of Yellowstone, be sure and rest your bones in the Hot Springs.
    Chico Hot Springs has a free outdoor natural hot spring pool you may use if you stay there, or you get a free pass if you eat the Sunday morning brunch. No reservations needed if less than 6 people.
    The Boiling River is free – 1/4 mile walk from the parking lot, just 2 miles inside the north park border. Many call it the best natural hot spring in North America.

    • From the many years my family and I traveled to Yellowstone, last year was the first time we soaked in The Boiling River. Oh, was it nice!

      • Oh, hot springs sounds so nice right now. We are having a real Winter this year. Lots of snow and many cold days. Big snow is headed for the mountains like three feet or more. Be careful of avalanche danger.

  35. Gotta say I am pretty excited about Montana. I had a solve about a week ago… it just seemed “right”. I started planning my first trip since 2015… thinking .. this is perfect!. Then, I said to myself lets list the reasons why this isn’t the place…I came up with a lot (but I will still visit, because its a cool place). I then stumbled upon a recent convo on here, and a couple of searchers stories that started putting the pieces together… I’ve got through every clue (well the clues IMO I have solved). It is an area I know at least two searchers have been to, but I dont think they went there on purpose….

    Hopefully a great story to follow in 4 months 🙂

    • This is “old news” but a couple days ago I read the first bears have been sighted out of their dens. Stories talk about bears hearing wolf sounds and emerging from their den to steal the recent kill.

  36. Hi all,
    I’ve been trying to apply the clues in the poem to the area around YNP as it would be nice to search close to home and many others think the TC is in this region. So in yet another view and review of all the information I might be able glean from FF interviews I found one statement as very telling. In one interview he stated that if he was standing at the TC he would see, water and animals, mountains, and he would be able to smell pine needles and pinyon pine nuts.

    The northern most range of Pinyon Pine is along the southern boundary of Wyoming. Do you think this is just a misspoken phrase or was it a clue, either intentional or unintentional?

    Additionally, is there a list out there somewhere of all of FF videos and or interviews.

    • Hippie, here’s what Fenn said about the New Mexico Tourism video:

      Halogetter, I just watched that New Mexico Tourism video again and must say that I didn’t say what I was thinking. You cannot smell a pinon nut, but those who pick them know that in doing so you get pine pitch all over your hands, and pine pitch smells about the same no matter what kind of pine tree you are talking about. Looking back I think I wanted to say I could smell pine needles, not pinon nuts. Sorry I kicked a hornet’s nest with that comment. There is no clue there. Incidentally, when I get pine pitch on my hands I rub butter on the spots and that solves the problem. Of course then I have trouble getting the butter off. f


    • Hippielogger


      Funny thing here is, fenn never stated he would see [ or even heard ] water. He just knows the chest is wet… Take in consideration he also has alluded to, how can anything in the mountains not be wet even buried 6′ deep
      In another comment he stated “probably wet”

      Add that to Goofy’s post on Halo’s inquiry, and what we have is… my last brain cell smokin.

      • Thanks for the quick replies, the response to Halogetters query is what I was looking for. So much has been said by FF and about what he’s said it difficult to sort through it all. And thanks for the correction, seeker.

        • and besides, the “mapped range” I suspect is just where pinyon pines are very common. They are symbiotic with pinyon jays, which cover a much larger area. Also, “pinyon flats” (maybe prarie) is just west of boiling river in YNP

    • Hippielogger – In my Chasing Words of Forrest Fenn documents, there is a section that I put together on f’s NM Tourist ad. There are a number of things f said regarding that statement he made in the ad.

      And if you are looking for more of what f has specifically said about finding his treasure chest in the various videos, news articles, and Q&A’s posted on various blogs over the years, then you are going to find it in these documents.

      You can read more about the documents here: https://dalneitzel.com/books-by-searchers/chasing-words/

      and Dal’s thoughts here:

      And the website to purchase them is here:

  37. I’m just going to say this again. Fenn is the word that is key because it is his title and he gives it to us in the poem.

    Fenn Mountain is the starting point I’m not going to tell you how to apply it to the poem or the poem to it but think about it some.

    Also to all the folks going anywhere but Fenn Mtn this year, have a nice vacation. I don’t usually post words to argue by but someone’s gotta light a fire under all your butts. This is the year.

    Maybe I’ll show my hand if you promise to just think about it or are you too busy chasing your tail over warm waters? Haha.

    • Good luck convincing Cynthia, for all we know that may be where JDA has run off too

    • Guys and gals, wasn’t there a time when a man’s name “title” was all he had. And making a name for himself was what he worked hard for? Forrest’s dad did that as a principal. Skippy did that by his reputation. And Forrest did that by working hard and building himself from the ground up. He made a business of dealing with names. Selling to the rich and famous. He learned early on that names are important. It’s all about names and geography. Maybe we need to go back 100 years to realize how important a man’s name is. When he says I give you title to the gold, is he really saying here’s my name use it? He is.

      • I dunno, He has already indicated that he knows he has made a name for himself with the treasure, because hundreds of years from now when someone finds his name on something (perhaps a bell) that they will be able to look him up on the internet.

        • Yes if, in a hundred years, someone finds one of those bells or jars the excitement will last about 15 minutes. But the treasure chest is what legends are made of. Gold and items of historical value.

          • My point exactly. He doesn’t need to use a mountain (not even named after him) for his legacy to live on.

      • A little background I found on Fenn Mountain:

        “Fenn Mountain is named for Frank Fenn who was appointed Captain of Company H, First Idaho Volunteer Infantry and was the acting Major from April 1899 to September 1899 when he was promoted to full Major. The company saw active duty in the Philippines during the Spanish American War. He also was at the first battle of the Nez Perce Indian War at Whitebird in 1877. Later Fenn lived in nearby Kooskia after retiring from the U.S. Forest Service in 1920. A picnic area, Ranger Station and a small town are also named after him.”

        (source link here: http://www.summitpost.org/mountain/442211 )

        Forrest doesn’t seem like the type who would want to piggyback his own mark on the namesake mountain of another famous Fenn, even if Frank is actually a distant relative of his. Just my opinion, though.

        • I agree and I’m not saying that the treasure chest is located on Fenn Mtn. Just that using the name Fenn gets us the starting location. And isn’t Fenn Mtn right next to Omar Mtn? Omar is one of the first names mentioned in TTOTC.

        • Ramona—-

          I find fenn Mountain to be very interesting. Also, the fact that Frank Fenn was a Major is also quite intriguing. Kooksia also anagrams to “is a kook”–that is also quite intriguing. 🙂

          • Look, a crazy or eccentric person. Forrest said it best, “It’s not who you are. It’s who they think you are. “. Besides that Major Frank Fenn doesn’t need 2 mountains named after him. He can keep the one in Idaho since that’s where he was mostly and Forrest can use the one in Montana to write his poem and hide his chest.

      • I too was looking for a solve starting in Idaho and ending in Montana. I still think WWWH is the divide but many of the places just on the Montana side are easier reached from some road on the Idaho side. I plan a trip to Brower’s Spring, the real source of what should be called the Mississippi, this summer but the easiest trail is off of Sawtell Peak road coming out of Island Park, ID. It’s just the last 1/4 mile of a 2 mile hike you would be in Montana. For me there is treasure there just to see it, but gold would be nice as well! With the winter we just had that spot is BURIED in snow long into summer. My trip is in August.

        I want to make Henry’s Lake the HOB and Island Park is just below that. I thought Henry’s was full of Brown trout but that turned out to be wrong so I’m lost.

        No place for the meek, Hellroaring Canyon and creek is what becomes of the water from Brower’s spring. But it doesn’t fit right.

        So now I just want to go there because how many have stood straddling the mighty Mississippi (although wrongly named Hellroaring, Red Rock, Jefferson, Missouri, and then finally Mississippi.) Even Louis and Clark got it wrong in their desire to go west.

        • Wow… I think you guys are close, but still miles away from where it actually is. It helps to solve the riddle from the beginning so you know where to go!

    • I believe you are right Ramona. It’s Forrest Fenn though. A little of him is inside the box… Key…Plus line 9 read from right to left will help. Just need to break it down.

    • No tail chasing here… I found a place that fits all the clues including warm waters.

      • Is it a special place? So many times I find a spot that fits everything to a tee then I look at it on google and say wow that really is not a very special looking spot who would want to be buried there! Unless it is special to him in a way we cannot see… Somehow I think when you find the right spot you will know it is special and why… imo

  38. I saw some roads in Yellowstone Park are open for bicycle travel. You’d have to look on the Park website for Spring Bicycling. They said West Yellowstone to Mammoth is 49 miles. Better be prepared to survive winter storm conditions.

    • I think you are a little off course with it being in Yellowstone. Close, but I am 99% sure it is not there.

    • Oh crap!
      More competition.
      Is there anyway I can talk you out of S. Montana Amanda?
      It’s getting crowded there.

      • Going to get even more crowded as the ‘smoke screen’ leading to NM begins to dissipate. So many of the clues could fit so many places…

      • LOL not a chance, especially now that I believe I have deciphered the remaining clues today. 🙂

        • How do you know what f considers a clue? Oh wait, not that subject again. Nevermind. Yes, you are in the right area.
          So where? (Just the area). Is it a place dear to him, to rest his bones? Is your blaze deceptive?

        • Amanda – Did you solve the clues with BOTG or at home? I’m in the camp that believes that if you try to figure out the clues with BOTG it will take 100 years to solve the clues.

  39. I’ve been attempting to correctly interpret, “As I have gone alone in there.”

    After eliminating several other possibilities; the following is my final determination:

    The Wilderness


  40. The Treasure State.
    My treasures bold.
    If it’s not in this state, I will…..

  41. If there is no consolation prize for an armchair solve I personally feel like going atomic myself. Anybody around Yellowstone want to partner on this thing right now.

  42. If you aren’t around Yellowstone RIGHT NOW you are going to miss your chance because I am stuck.

      • Don, bears love Huckleberry, and that’s how we’ll catch one and use it to get us unstuck! I heard some kids tried that a while back with a buffalo and got all kinds of unstuck!

        Ever present state of readiness here, no worries.

    • Because we just had the worst winter in 30 years, or because we just got 2 more feet a few days ago? It’s certainly wet in the high country. When it warms up it’s almost the worst. That layer that might just support a car or at least a person won’t anymore and you get stuck.

      • I has been an unusual amount of snow and late snow fall this winter at high elevations. It just might be a short search season. IMO. I got turnaround on my first search because of snow.

      • Past snowstorms, thaw, then the recent snowfall creates a hidden danger for avalanche in some areas.

          • I think many are getting frustrated having to wait for that kind of “heavy loads and water high” to pass. I’ve seen some beautiful waterfalls in the past couple weeks because of the runoff. While waiting, one could still drag out the sleds or snowshoes and enjoy the fresh air and sunshine.

          • I live close to the mountains here and drive lots to the West Coast through the mountains, always beautiful and days lost to good fun and scenery . I was just in Montana, like here in the Rockies roads, lots of falling rocks close to roads everywhere.

          • Yes, the falling rocks are a big concern while traveling, especially in canyons. Seen plenty already.

  43. Use caution near rivers and streams. The runoff has started. This year has 300% snowpack in some areas. A life jacket might not save you

    • I enjoyed reading this link about Melville C. Brown. Quite an interesting story about him and his family. Thank you for the link, my friend.

  44. Glad you enjoyed it, my kind friend! I’ve researched so many things this past month. Can’t seem to get enough of this brain food! BTW…Were you able to read about the total solar sun event occurring on August 21st

    Wyoming would be a super place to see it.

    • I took a brief glimpse into it, and saw the path. I think it’s wonderful. Unfortunately, I’ll be passing by the area four days too late.

    • SL: I’ll be logging my Great American Eclipse umbra time in Jackson. Centerline goes right through the Jackson Hole airport, though downtown Jackson’s totality will only be 3 seconds shorter.

      • zaphod,

        Looks as if you’re going to have one, fantastic experience to savor, my friend! Wyoming should be a prime place to be for this phenomenally once in a lifetime* gift.

        It can’t happen soon enough!!

        Life’s Good,


  45. A couple of weeks away from making a trip up the Madison to Yellowstone, over to Cody, up to the Pryor Mountains, over to Red Lodge, then back to the Missoula area. Anybody want me to look anywhere particular? I never hear the Pryor Mountains mentioned, or the Bighorn Mountains. I also was thinking about making a loop north of Livingston to the Crazy Mountains. There is a peak there named for one of my pioneer relatives, Iddings. I have never been to any of those 3 ranges so I don’t know what to expect.

    • I just sold a futon to an Idding couple here in Minnesota. I even delivered it 40 miles. When I unloaded I noticed two guitar cases in the living room of this old barn that was made into a house years ago primitively but solid. They offered to play a song if I had the time and in no hurry to get back to the yard sale I agreed. This couple was in thier late seventies. Ma wore her hair straight and a denim dress. She played the squeeze box and had one whipped out in a jiffy. Pa was wearing a western shirt tucked nicely into his Levi’s and sported a 12string guitar. I manned the the other 12string for a few songs and two hours had passed before I headed off back to the yard sale thinking had I know they played like that I’d of given them the futon for the lesson. You just never know when your gonna run into good folks.

    • B. H.
      Throw a few cases of bottled water in you vehicle, staying hydrated in the mtns makes a big difference. And don’t be a litter bug, some of the thinner bottles squash pretty easily, pack them out—that way you won’t come back empty handed

      • Oh I won’t be able to climb anything big around here yet. There is still a bunch of snow around 7000 feet. A buddy posted some pics from the Beartooth highway where the snow was still 10 feet deep on each side of the road at 10,000 feet. At least it’s open for travel already.

    • Byran Hersman,

      If your schedule permits, the Songwriters Festival runs through tonight at Red Lodge. If you have an opportunity, head on over! ( The son of an old flying partner is scheduled to appear and perform there later.)

      It’s one venue I’d really enjoy and love to be a part of. So much is going on in that area anyway, with so very much to discover. ( Lots of great history to explore in such a special and unique place).

      Here’s some info about the Festival:



    • Perhaps the forecast will improve over the next few days? Trying to stay optimistic here.

    • That’s amazing! The few times I camped in Yellowstone in June, we mostly had rainy days. Camped in September, and a few hours after leaving, the park had received 6″ of snow.

      • June 9th 2017, we were driving through the south half of grand loop from west to east and ran into a blizzard!! Snow still everywhere and the ponds along side the road were still thawing out. Mostly in the south east section of the grand loop.

          • No problem, they were catching fish one after another by the bridge at Ojo Caliente to. Was in the 50s there and no snow. I threw a pebble in Ojo, didn’t know I wasn’t supposed to:) if it was a lil warmer out I’d of jumped in and joined the club lol.

          • I was just in Montana through Helena yesterday and it was clear , sunny and green everywhere I was. I guess the storm was further east.

          • Wed- fri we were in that area of Montana also, it was nice out the whole time just that one storm in YS and very strong winds Sat. Night in Cody Wy. But warm

  46. Powderchaser Steve is one of the best forecasters in the business. He channels ULLR, son of Thor, like no other. Bundle up folks.

    • Heard it was his 4/5 trip to that area within a few months. Sounds like he might of been a ff searcher?

        • It is so very dangerous to search alone anywhere in the bush in all 4 states. I just did my first full search and alone. I didn’t even get to my spot because the direction I went was too dangerous being alone. My first attempt was hindered by snow. This time was the terrain that inhibited me and I turned around after awhile knowing that physically it was the safest decision for me to make. Now I know there is only one way to actually get to the spot and it is safer. I learnt this by being there botg but I had to return home the next day for a sudden job interview. It is so dangerous going alone , not just because of wildlife animals. I will not ever go searching alone again; there is just too many dangerous scenarios . The chest is valuable enough to spit with someone, no less value to continue to share our lives.

          Think safety first and foremost.

          • Just curious how far you got before turning back? I’ve done the same thing. I didn’t reach my first solve until the 6th attempt lol

            If we search and are turned back by common sense then we’ve lived to search another day.

          • How far did I get? Well, I didn’t know how far until after I returned to my hotel and studied my map and pictures lol. This is the thing about being in the thick bush where ones sight and sense perspective is naturally different. Not a straightforward answer lol. Post review comparing to land marks, rock formations , potential yards traveled and points to guide while in the bush; I have determined that I over walked south of my spot by about 300 feet sw . I had hiked through rough terrain of ups and down for about 45 minutes in total and realized this was not the right 1 of the only 2 routes to get there. An 80 year old man would not have taking this route. I was already exhausted.

            I don’y know the area at all because I live in Canada so time, distance and exploration amounts are a factor. There is only 2 routes to the spot once I park. I did not know what the terrain was like until I would enter the bush itself. Pictures and other research do not give those details clearly. So, I first chose the determined shortest route. Adrenaline and will to succeed can push one to greater stamina. I knew I would need at least 2 attempts ; I chose the shortest first- big mistake. My legs are so sore I would have taken me 3 days to recover to proceed another search. I did a partial walk through of the other starting point just to get an idea of terrain and directions. Well it will be so much easier. though longer and still a bit rough , but much more doable and an 80 year old fit man could do it. One thing to mention is after 7 years the terrain would change some just by natural growth of trees, other vegetation and all forms of earthen debris. Just something to think about; every year some forms of difficulty may change over the years. When I got back to my hotel I had an email for a job interview so I had to leave the next morning back to Canada, unable to finish. My legs are still sore lol.

            I have an exact spot to get to, not just an area. There is only one path to see and get to it. You can’t see the formation until you are a few feet away from it. It is exposed open air but covered. It is rather obvious that a human created it. Next time I will get to it. But I will try to partner with someone to go with next time. It is much to easy to suddenly be incapacitated and stranded alone in the woods. Forrest knew exactly where he was going, the path and area- we don’t.

          • Jeeze Alsetenash,
            Don’t stretch yourself to thin.
            Definitely get a partner next time & maybe this area to hike is too grueling for an 80 yr old in good shape to make 2 trips done in the afternoon.

            I give you credit for following your dreams & backing off when you need to.

          • I have a hyper adrenaline hereditary in my family that only 1 in 10 of my family have it lol. Its both good and bad in resultings haha. It takes me allot longer to experience fatigue.

            Jake , this is the thing. An 80 year old fit man could make it in this area. But there is only one easy way to it. I went the hardest way first, expecting perhaps the difficulty was short and would get easier. It wasn’t that difficult in perception but got progressively worse. So. i changed direction to get too the easier area but it was not accessible from where I made that decision. This was my error. I should have went back whence I came from then continued my journey but this is hindsight talking now. One thing to be aware of ,as we learn through experience, is that at higher elevations less common for people, we don’t think as clearly. There is a mental fatigue that happens by this effect. For me it is 6000 plus feet higher than I am acclimated to. I noticed a variance in metal processing. My learning advice to myself, is to take 2-3 days to acclimate before searching.

          • Alsetenash,
            As long as you learned something from going the hardest way 1st, you are on the right track.
            Where you been searching anyway?

          • Jake. Ya, if I would have taken the longer route I would have probably completed my search area. It is a deceptive area that requires trial and error no matter what. There is only one way to get to it and it is by that process, can the way be determined. I am searching Colorado/Wyoming area.

          • Alsetenash,
            I love the idea of one way in & out that is doable by F at that shape & age.
            No ones gonna stumble or happen upon the chest in that situation.
            The poem has to guide you there.

            I’m not crazy about Colorado seeing it’s not mentioned in his books although he may had to drive through it to get to WY.

            I can see Wyoming being part of the solve but not where the chest is.

            Trial & error is all we can do to eliminate possible splattering’s flung on the wall & I know most smell bad.

          • Jake. Speaking specifically to my solve and area ,yes I fully agree there is only one way in and out, that is easy. Once my feet were in the bush the view becomes very limited compared to being out of it. Outside the bush, what I can see is just the same either way. From a distant clear view of the area it looks accessible from all directions ( the visual deception) . When I was finally able to be at location and walk in the bush; it became aware that there is really only 2 ways from the same starting point. There is no other logical starting point based on what we all know about FF and this Chase . I chose the one direction of the 2 for shorter length as I said.

            Knowing this and studying the terrain, distance and location- I just shook my head thinking 50/50 chance of making the initial wrong decision and I made the wrong one lol. Upon further study, FF could make it there easily. He knows exactly from where to start, every step and direction. It is not dangerous to the one who knows the area and where to go. Simple, if it gets dangerous and hard then perhaps a change in degrees to the left or right was slightly off while walking. There is an obvious visual guide easily seen to keep you on proper path if you go slightly off direction. This is why it is safe for families and an 80 year old fit person could do it. You have to know the proper starting point and maintain proper path and direction.

            In my area there is only one way and it is the safest. You cannot even see the spot from anywhere until you are there .Perfect to hide in the open and camouflaged to those that would be a rare to be there and to stumble upon it. If it was a non searcher they wouldn’t even consider to be there by purpose.

            It may appear as an area/spot where FF would not go nor an 80 year old person; but that is the deception to my area. IMO . In my solve, the poem walks right to it IMO. Same as what everyone else thinks of theirs. lol

          • Edit correction..’mental processing’ not ‘Metal’ lol go figure. Metal health will drive you crazy haha.

          • Wow, Alsetenash! I did not expect you to do a second search trip so soon after your first. I’m glad to hear that you let wisdom get the best of you and turn back when you did. A big part of hiking in the mountains safely is periodically pausing to reassess your situation. You absolutely did the right thing by not pushing yourself into a worse situation.

            Glad that you got home safely, and good luck on the job interview!

          • I went when I did because of Job prospects are coming and I wouldn’t be able to search potentially. Happened faster so, I had to return sooner and not complete my search. I do 2 week rotations away from home in my career. But I will go again in my 1 week off following 2 weeks on. Just have to go with someone to search. The bush is just too risky alone.

          • Alsetenash – I am in Denver (as others), am only a lurker, am in my own potential career transition (so could have some time off), am very familiar with southern WY (but I expect you’re not being totally honest about your spot…understandable). If you need a body and are willing to share your solve (after we get there of course!), I’m interested. My own solve is not developed enough to warrant botg, but you’re there maybe. I’m simply offering my company on your journey, if you can propose how you want this team to function that might help…without giving your solve up of course. I’m a mechanical engineer, 41 yo, plenty of hiking/wilderness experience, and fenn enthusiast. If you’re north of Lander I would not be interested (too far to drive haha), I expect you would not have a hard time finding someone, so good luck if I’m not that person!

          • Tbug. Thanks for the offer and I will keep that in mind. I can say I am not being dishonest about my area lol. I am looking at options about searching next. No matter what the experience of a person in the wilderness Rockies, it is dangerous. I just did my first actual bushwhacking search and so easily can your situation become dire . So, I won’t do it alone again. I still now think I could do it alone and be safe about it. But I also drive safely every day and just look at those stats too lol. The chest is worth enough to share say 50/50 no matter who’s solve it originates to. If it is valued at 1 million at a minimum, $ 500,000 is a pretty good penny for a days work.

        • Road Hawk wrote: “I believe both of those gentlemen were searchers.”

          Why do you think that, Road Hawk?


          • I live in West Yellowstone and people regularly come here and divulge information about why they are here. Those guys were searchers. Sadly given time there will be more befalling the same fate.

          • Are you sure what you have said is true Road Hawk?
            They were searchers?

            The search area above Quake lake is not doable by a 79 year old man making 2 trips done in the afternoon.

            I wish folks would use more uncommon sense when going on a search.
            If you don’t, it could cost you tour life.

        • Oh I see now, I wasn’t aware of the other in YS. My hats off to both those gentlemen and also to their determination that lead them to that point. I think we all have a deep rooted desire to accomplish something great in life. Some more than others. These gentlemen had they only been injured would of certainly returned again until they reach there goal at any cost. Some of us are simply built that way. These two were brave men and absolutely deserve recognition as such.

        • The one in Beaver creek was searching for the treasure. My other email server has been down for 2 weeks & just got this email from the 8th today from her.

          “Hi Dave, A friend of mine on search and recue pulled a man out of the water the other day. He was searching for the treasure. Beavercreek…… He had his fishing gear on and I think the waiters filled up … Sad. We have to be careful out there!! ”
          Mike Petersen, 42, of Bismarck, North Dakota

          That was from the owner of Cinnamon Lodge on the Gallatin, – Morgen.
          She is very credible & she has gone on a hike with me searching for the treasure.

          Not a good start to the searching season….

          • Yes it is sad Road Hawk.
            Randy Bilyeu
            Mike Petersen
            Jeff Murphy
            Paris Wallace (not yet found)

          • Jake,
            I got some local intel also this last weekend that his waders filled up with water while ‘fishing’ and drowned. While Beaver creek is easily wade-able there is a lot of logs and debris that you would not be able to get out of if all of a sudden your lower half instantly weighed many pounds more. I believe he is an unfortunate and sad addition to the thrill death toll.

  47. Hey there Jake,

    Jeff Murphy was a searcher. Look at the comments. He has been trying since 2013. He used his photo for posting and if you look up the details of the Yellowstone missing Batavia man’s body found you should find it was the same Jeff Murphy.

    As for Mike Petersen I am still waiting for the internet to catch up with what the locals here in West have been saying from conversations with authorities in Gallatin County. There may have been more going on than a drowning. Maybe bear related. Time will tell.

    Be safe out there Jake! I camped up by Waipiti Cabin last week just for relaxation. I am not looking near Taylor’s Fork….have bear spray will travel. https://dalneitzel.com/2013/01/27/rumors-abound-2/

    • Thanks for your input & info about those unfortunate ones.

      I always find a way to go searching with others even though most are strangers from the area that don’t know the area as well as I.

      There’s always the chance that Mother Nature calls for your extreme attention & sometimes you have no choice but to succumb to her.

      • Jake and all who search Wyoming. I am unable to go there anytime soon but think you might find this particular map of interest. Let me know if it helps.

        It’s an 1883 map by Holt and is the 1st Map to show Brown’s Spring named for Lt. John Brown.

        Good luck all and study the map carefully as there are Brown nuggets and names no longer on modern maps.

        • Try looking at the 1888 map from the same place, I found it last year and it is even more revealing (for WWWH).

          Having said that, I do not think any of them will help you. Google Earth is a good enough map for everything we need IMO.

          I’ve made some SERIOUS progress since I now have someone on my team who lives there. IMO of course, but I feel I will have the chest within a few weeks. Poem is just about complete, just some details need to be worked out regarding retrieval.

          Without a team mate who lives there, this would not have been possible because a LOT of trips were required to finalyze the solve.

          • How are we supposed to look at that map when you don’t provide a link?

          • Jake, too bad you’re not closer to my spot, you could go to mine too! If you completed your search area.

          • I’m stuck in Montana & maybe on the border of WY.
            The Gallatin National Forrest is where it’s at for me.

          • Ya, you have said previously. No other way for me but with myself lol..frustrating . Maybe in a month I can .

          • I believe the map you need is stated in his book & the one that was sacrificed to help them get warm with a blaze.

            Gallatin National Forrest West map to be precise.

          • Actually ,I never read his books but thanks for the recommendation. I did get enough of what’s in them that I needed from them though.

          • I would invest in his books Alsetenash.
            I know, all you need is the poem but i think you’re helping yourself more with the books than without.

            It’s a tricky subject & could find yourself seeing way too many hints in his books.

          • Ya, they would be helpful and FF advises that also. But I currently think I have read enough points written of things in his books and excerpts supplied by many posters here( thanks for that) . There are just sprinkled hints plus there is many stories on here from him, interviews, SB’s. I did get a couple hints that I have isolated that I feel are important from TTOTC and the unintended clue in TFTW. Is it a clue about where it is not or where it is? Is it like a clue in the poem? Or is the unintended clue that just narrows down to 4 states and not in Canada clue? Opinions vary. IMO .

          • Al;

            Forrest has said that there are hints in the “text” of TTotC, and an unintentional hint in TFTW. I will go against the grain and say that I found one picture and one illustration in TTotC – also – a couple of hints in “Text form” in both books. JDA

          • Is it an unintentional hint in TFTW or was it said as an unintentional clue? 🙂

          • Alsetenash, which is most informative, word of mouth or knowing for oneself? Although information may have been given by others, I believe it may be beneficial to read the stories in “The Thrill of The Chase.” The stories are great, but to say these words might be okay, but to know for oneself is even better.

          • Pdenver. Good points. I am referring to direct quotes not interpretations though. Some I have read actually pages of the book posted online and excerpts on blogs. Only 2 stories I needed that helped me to realize ( well at least I think so anyways) I was on the right path in thinking. I was already of the poem to this area and the book hints I read just helped to ” check mate” my thoughts. 🙂

          • Yes, I do know that. I used it pertaining to my solve. My solve was completed. From there I just have to find it in the area of the solve. To me there is 2 ‘ games’ at play in this chase. Solve the clues. Find the chest in your area of your solve. That’s my theory and I am sticking with it lololol.

          • Alsetenash: I think that at least TTOTC is a fun book to read just on face value and also recommend picking up a copy. I think that you are in the correct mindset that neither book is mandatory for finding the treasure, and that neither book should be used as a starting point for determining a solve, IMHO. But still, it’s a fun and interesting read and I like having it on my bookshelf.

          • Blex, from what I have read and gather, the books are interesting. From the onset of my delving into this chase, I thought I would approach this in a certain way and angle. I didn’t think ” sprinkled hints” was strong enough to use the books for information. Very early I was able to use what I saw in the books already determined in my mind, right or wrong, at then and this moment. There is a plethora of FF info available that I find more in direct relation to my way and angle I chose . I do plan to read the books at some point, but after this chase is over.

          • Alsetenash, one with “checkmate” is ready to pick up the treasure chest. I wish you the best.

          • Alsetenash and Jake, “check mate” and “checkmate” are a little different. 🙂

          • If that’s the case pdenver then there is a difference between “under water” & “underwater”.

          • It doesn’t matter what you think you know, it only matters what he knows.
            I know some of what he knows & he knows it.

          • Jake, just got back from a week all over the Gallatins. Caught a 18″ Brown and a 17″ Rainbow camping at the Palisades. Then 2 nights at Canyon in Yellowstone. Both kinds of bears, and every other animal but wolves and moose. Then a night at Big Game campground out side of Cody, then a night in Lovell’s free city campground (a very nice thing for a town to do). We went up into the Pryor mountains from the Wyoming side. Amazing trip. 20 miles up a TERRIBLE road (Crooked Creek) we figured the 10 mile shortcut down couldn’t be much worse but we were wrong. Jeeps or ATVs only should be on that road (Burnt Timber Ridge Road), not long bed crew cab pickups. Totally worth the drive, 8200′ meadows filled with wild flowers and we saw a good 40 wild horses living the good life. Then back over to Red Lodge for 2 nights at Cooney reservoir and a drive over the Beartooth including a hike to 11,002 feet, my record. Not hard even in sandals when you start at 10,947! Not really looking for a chest except looking for new possibilities. That Prior Mountain is an amazing place, and Oasis hidden high above the badlands. Petroglyphs, caves, 100’s of teepee rings, wild horses, solitude, views for days, just nothing I could come up with for HOB or WWWH..

          • Jake, in part, ‘I know some of what he knows & he knows it.’

            ‘It doesn’t matter what you think you know, it only matters what he knows.’ 🙂

            Is the treasure chest under water in Montana?

          • The clouds have water in them & the treasure is under them & maybe over them at times.

            So, tell me how the treasure is not under water?
            Not “underwater”, this has a different meaning.

          • Jake dude

            Underwater is the new spelling. Lots and maybe most editors prefer under water. Not to mention the spell check software.

            The treasure is not under water. He wrote that because of you. And others, but yeah you.


          • Jake, common sense says a storm cloud may be dangerous, but they’re not constantly around. How might a regular cloud be dangerous to give warning that the treasure chest is not under water? I hope this makes sense.

  48. There are cognitive changes to expect for flatlanders who ascend to altitude. Those changes have been researched at 5250 ft. and mostly dissipate after 2 days. They are: sleepiness (biggest effect), unclear thinking, irritability, aggressiveness, and unhappiness (which follows initial euphoria). At 9,800 feet, these effects are quite marked. At 5,250 they are relatively mild, except for sleepiness and unclear thinking.

    I believe searchers would be wise to expect and plan for being fuzzy-headed, maybe not making the best decisions, being stumbling/sleepy the first couple of days they are up in the Rockies if coming from close to sea level. And if searching above 9K feet…ascend slowly!

    These stories of lost and missing searchers are heartbreaking. I saw the man who died in the Mammoth area in the visitors’ center a few days before. :'( Weather is so wild, dramatically changeable, up there. Fingers crossed for Paris.

  49. Calling all Montana searchers.
    Please click searcher’s discussions and then click I Need someone to Look for Me. Then read my brief request for partnership proposal. Thank you for your consideration.

  50. Magnitude 5.8 earthquake near Lincoln, MT, last night. Since then there have been 15 aftershocks of magnitude 2.5 or greater.

  51. My (somewhat) Solve,

    A few clues from the poem (all my opinion please nobody get cranked). I’m sure many have thought or written these on this forum. Maybe somebody can use a few of my ideas to form more.
    1. Begin it where warm waters halt: This to me is the Stillwater river. The river comes to a halt (slows) after the WARM season melt has run down.
    2. And take it in the canyon down: Stillwater flows north and into the Yellowstone river. So follow it south down the canyon (Up river).
    3. Not far, but too far to walk: This to me means he drove from the Columbus airport, which is where the Stillwater meets the Yellowstone.
    4. Put in below the home of Brown: Well…bear IMO.
    5. No place for the meek: kind of goes with #4, if Brown = Bear.
    6. The end is drawing nigh: Double edged sword for me. Key word that brought me to the Stillwater and the other edge is for my solve  (yes silly and secretive).
    7. There’ll be no paddle up your creek; just heavy loads and water high: This ties into my #8, in the cold there will be no water to paddle up. So I am listening good. The topo map shows 10,200 ft by a small pool of water.
    8. So hear me all and listen good, your effort will be worth the cold: I went in July (90 degrees and the water was not halted, more like bat outa hell), when I got home and started understanding what #1 actually means IMO.
    9. If you are brave and in the wood: This ties into #4, if anyone has been there (Sioux charley trail), it gets real when you hit the wooded area and see all the signs of bear activity. Funny story, sweet girl at the store in Fishtail sold me some bear spray. She had two kinds and asked me which I wanted. The one you think is best I said. She was like, “don’t ask me I carry a gun”. Felt like a wus after that smack down. I had both with me at least lol. Always have more guns and bullets than the bear wants to eat. I like bears, so please nobody freak on me. Tweakers stealing anhydrous in Kansas get the same treatment, minus bear spray.

    My take away from the book are, The mountains are my church, always feeling like he is thirteen and the waterfall was significant.
    So, Cathedral point happens to be on the Stillwater river. The trail nearby also has a waterfall. If people haven’t googled images of Sioux charley trail, do, it’s an amazing place. IMO 

    Hope this helps someone, I have to deploy soon so won’t be back for the next cold snap 

    • Sisson09 –

      When you are deployed you should be able to have internet access, maybe not at an FOB. So I hope you read this and continue on your quest to find the Fenn Treasure.

      I have read a lot of solves and yours is quite good. It doesn’t fall apart at the blaze ( end?) like the vast vast vast majority.

      More importantly you mention something really cool, the idea that Fenn meant a real place when he said (paraphrasing) my church is in the mountains and streams. I have looked at a lot of churches but never considered Cathedral Point. That would be a VERY FENN thing to do.

      Really this is a great solid solve!

      Thank you for sharing it!


    • sisson09, I enjoyed what you posted and I believe it may hold merit. In one of the scrapbooks, one of Mr. Fenn’s ducks is named Tail-end Charlie (spelling?). Also, the neighboring town, Beehive, seems to have been a possible hint on a post/story over at Jenny’s blog.

    • Its amazing when isolated from what my real world is how clarity and logic can bite. My above solve is washed up. Like all others I will be on to the next, when I return home.

      After reading Forrest’s statements over and over, I will be staying warm where its warm till I know exactly.
      Hope someone gets lucky.

      • Regarding being lucky, Forrest said the following: ““I said in my book that the solution will be difficult but not impossible. If it was easy anyone could do it. Whoever finds the treasure will mostly earn it with their imagination. I have done only a few things in my life that were truly planned. Hiding the treasure chest is one of them.
        And at the end, the one who finds the gold will not feel lucky, but instead, will ask himself, “What took me so long?”

  52. So…. how would you feel if you were on a trail searching and turn around and see Mr. Fenn walking towards you with a big smile on his face?

    • Gosh, I tried twice to respond and neither have shown. 🙁
      Fingers crossed this one will. Thank you for the link, SL. Would this stretch be considered being in the desert?

  53. Imagine having observed the Total Eclipse of 2017 from Wyoming’s historic Casper, and its majestic Grand Tetons!

    Magnificent memories made for so many!

    Am also very thankful for what we were able to witness here in California!


    • I’m glad you had clear skies to view it, my friend. News here have stated there would be approximately 400,000+ people in Casper. Would have loved to have been among those to experience such a sight of totality.

      • We had a great view in Fenton, MO. Clear skies around 2 minutes of the total eclipse. We just walked out in the driveway and leaned up agin the mini van.

        • So happy you got to see it in it’s totality, Windy City. Must have been quite a sight.

  54. pdenver,

    I hope you’ll enjoy this, my friend. Castle Gardens photo gallery and Casper’s S E news! (All on the same page, to boot!)


  55. Have fun near Castle Gardens, it’s a cool place, especially down by Sarcophagus Butte. My team was there back in June, it was a sad day when Forrest let me know that the area is considered a desert (the day before he posted the Desert comment on Jenny’s). It blew my solve, the area fit like a glove and to top it off it was exactly 242 miles from my old WWWH until the walking part in Gas Hills.

    My solve is now once again further west into the mountains. I only considered south of the Sweetwater “desert” until I found this out. I even debated Forrest (until he posted the get a new solve if your solve is in a desert comment) because technically it is not more than arrid plains. Then I realized it was silly to argue with “the man” hehe

      • Is there an online map where one can see what would be considered desert areas in Wyoming? I’ve tried looking and I’m not having much luck.

          • PD-
            I think one of the issues we face when trying to find a map that shows desert areas in WY is that geographers (scientists) tend to make up the maps of geographic regions and “desert” is a rather subjective and non-scientific term that we treasure hunter types tend to use to describe a variety of regions that scientists would agree fall into several different of their classifications…
            Some folks think desert means a rock and sand area with little to no water..
            others would include the sage steppe in their consideration of a desert…and so on…
            As always…it seems we are left with trying to understand what Forrest means when he says “desert”…and that is probably not the same as what a geographer right classify as “desert”.

    • Thank you for the link, my friend. It almost seems as though Wyoming is mostly made of desert, right up to the mountains. I’ll look into it deeper and compare these maps to my spot in Google Earth. I greatly appreciate your help.

  56. pdenver,

    One of the better places of interest in Wyoming. Would enjoy checking this one out myself!


  57. i had the funniest dream last night that i found the treasure and every one was chasing me to get it with any luck i should be around yellow stone for a few days and on into montanas butterfly field the big m or visa a versa you should of seen the big wood the treasure was in in that dream there was fire weed all around it what beauty i think two rivers dump into wwwh the m and the g got to poke around the gnf ANd THE LNC NF if i get time i had my hands on that bad boy last night that was a fun dream

    • has any one else ever dreampt about finding the treasure i know Forrest kinda did but did not know if he found it or not living the dreamoff and looking for a good thing

    • Sounded like you had a great dream, Jeff. Good luck and be prepared for changing weather and temperatures. The last few days, we had rain and thunderstorms while in Yellowstone. Some of the aspen trees have begun to change. One area was at peak. A buffalo near our campsite had steam coming off of itself one morning. Reminded me of one of Mr. Fenn’s stories. Have a great time.

      • Didn’t know the altitude was quite that high in any
        part of Yellowstone, to have steam at the temperature of a living buffalo. Did the buffalo fall into a geyser or hot spring?

        I’ve been advising people to use a dictionary to look up the word “halt”. Maybe the word “steam” should also be researched. (Hint: steam is
        not visible, but a cloud — of droplets — can be.)

        Good luck in your solving and searching.

        The above is my opinion. Yours may differ.

  58. If anyone is in the West Yellowstone area now (09/01/17 through 09/05/17) and would like to meet up and talk shop/search together let me know via ttotc@yahoo.com -Stephen

  59. ABC Nightline is interested in interviewing/following a family with kids who might be searching in the Yellowstone area on September 17 or 18 or 19….
    If this is you and you wouldn’t mind being on TV please let me know and I’ll get you in contact with the Nightline folks.

  60. No, I have a ton of bear spray and fire arm protection. Also, you wouldn’t believe this but it wasn’t far from my home. At the end of it all I ended up in a nice bear free fishing creek close to my driveway where I park my car.

  61. Heading back to Montana in 21 days to finish up a search area. Hope there isn’t too much snow.

        • Safe back in New England. I have never smelled so much sage or seen so many skeletal remains. Great time though. Every search yields results of some kind. This one (#2) certainly did for us.

  62. In TTOTC book 50 miles, comes up a noticeable number of times. 50 miles South of West Yellowstone, doesn’t look interesting, 50 miles North of West Yellowstone, looks very interesting.

  63. I got a super cool book for Christmas!!! Atlantic City, Wyoming – Voices from a Powerful Place… There is a forward by Alan K Simpson and although I think this has been pointed out before I thought it might be worth mentioning again… Mr. Simpson says that Lander Wyoming used to be known as Brown’s Camp. Merry Christmas everyone!

    • Spallies—-

      Fort Brown was in Landers. Then it’s name was changed to Fort Washakie. Then Fort Washakie was moved north a few miles. This is what I read in the past at least. Merry Christmas.

      • Forrest talked about Lander. I went there 4 years ago. Nice place. Wonderful trip. Found out about Brown Town etc. It was a structure.
        Worth the trip. See my entry for contest Shawdow. My story……Sinks canyon.

      • Rabbit hole alert!
        Rabbit hole alert!

        If you guys want to hear it all, there is a while bunch of stuff that sounds Chasey in the Landers slash Wind Res area.


          • Spallies –

            This is not a solve just a discussion of some things in the area that fit.

            So first it sounds like you understand that Fort Brown has been renamed and moved. Today “Fort Washakie” is on the Wind River Reservation. The TC is probably not because Fenn wouldn’t want us violating sacred land so best to stay off res. The original Fort Brown would be off Res near Lander.

            We have Fenn talking about his trip to Lander which he calls the best 3 days of his life or something to that effect. It’s the story about flying to Lander, renting a car, driving out to somewhere and finding arrowheads or points. He meets a kid and they hunt together for artifacts. He mentions the Little Popo Agie River. When chasers talk about The Sinks, they are on the wrong river. That’s on the Middle Popo Agie. The Lil Popo is a different river.

            There are a couple of businesses what have the word Wise or a variant in their name. You have Weiser Knoll and Weiser Creek also.

            How about the junction of the Lil Popo and Wise creek?

            I read that Wind River is what we call it, but the Indians call it Warm Water Creek. Or they used to before we named it. I guess if that’s true it would actually mean they live on Warm Water Reservation. You see? If you don’t, that’s cool. I think a lot of ideas are nuts, and maybe I can’t see that this is nuts.


            If I didn’t make that obvious enough to pass the sniff test for Zaphod, Halt and Reservation have similar connotations.

          • Hey Lug… I don’t think your ideas are nuts at all… In fact I love the Wind River area and all the places that seem to marry up to the poem… I also agree its not on a reservation. But maybe we start there… I’m planning to go to Wyoming in July so everyone please don’t search in Wyoming until then. Thanks 🙂

          • Spallies –

            I do not know whether this will amount to anything at this time.
            My plan is to fly into Bozeman.

            From there I have yet to decide if I will follow my solve or Zap’s.

            Speaking of Bozeman, I always think of this song. I literally cry when I hear it.


            Raising sheep out in the snow

          • Yes Lug, Forrest would not want us hunting on Reservation land. And anyone who visits Lander would have to go to Sinks! It’s a must see great place! I forgot to take a picture of FF carved into the tree on the trail up. Camp Brown was actually located where the reservation town is today. It’s a interesting place to visit too. I found my trip to be magical. I am going back. Lots to see.

          • Lou Lee –

            Where the town is today is the second location of Fort Brown.
            There was Fort Brown original location
            Fort Brown moved
            Fort Brown renamed Fort Washakie.

            If you need to remember how to pronounce it, think Was A Key


        • I really enjoyed hiking to the top of the falls! You can see the picture of the canyon below in my “shadow contest” entry here on dals blog! Also…..There is a lot more to this area. Not far but too far to walk.

  64. I had the pleasure to talk to Forrest’s old friend Dick in Lander several years ago on the phone. We talked about some crazy stuff. He lives on the reservation, but does not text or email. My plans are to visit him in 2018 and search his study. He told me he finds things from time to time.

    An Indian Scout and A Saint


  65. Don’t forget to visit Sacagawea’s grave site, pretty close by. Lug, I like your WWH = reservation idea, that has some interesting implications…what about the ATF (paraphrasing) you won’t know you have the first clue until you have the box? makes my head hurt.

    I am not done with the area, recently looking at wedding of the waters…the official sign mentions ‘warm waters’ leaving boysen reservoir…which is strange to me because reservoir outlets are usually deep enough that the water is colder than any natural river ever would be…kind of strange…then the sign mentions the warm waters from the hot springs park…hard to figure out where the ‘warm’ aspect would halt there…somewhere downstream of thermopolis…my best guess would be where the Greybull river joins…wondering if this is JDA’s…but I know he won’t say. My most recent wyo ideas have been multiplying and so hard to not go down rabbit holes…I really like an archaeology theme, so many connections to George Frison…the fenn cache…U of Wyo (colors are Brown and Gold!)…anyway, good luck if you do your trip, take photos! Next summer/fall I think we are going to see many busted solves…I am still contemplating a database that shows where people didn’t find it…start eliminating things kind of idea…not sure that works given the 500/200′ comments…so many things to consider…gaaaaaahh. FYI I have quite a few 7″ topos from 50’s-60s for wind river range if you’re interested, not that I think old maps help that much (IMO).

  66. We need to get people chatting up this board. Sounds like this summer is the one! I need help in Wyoming. My search area is the Thermopolis/Wind River/Camp Brown area and I live in Alaska. I would love to search more, but I really can’t. I have several Google Earth images to share and would really love a partner. It’s lonely doing research and having few to share with. I’m a nice gal, Mom of three, and extremely loyal and honest…….I’ve made this sound like a dating add. Sorry. If you want to team up I’ll share what I’ve got, I promise you’ll be pleased.


  67. Hi all. I was wondering if anyone has used Newton Lakes as their WWWH? It’s a newer architectural theory of mine… that I had not looked into yet. Anyone?

    • while the answer appears that, no, no one is using it, the question is what led you there…just the ‘warm water’ species aspect of fish hatchery? Pretty weak IMO, but maybe you had more? Remember, lots of searchers have been and used Cody/various spots near there as a starting point (not saying Cody is their wwwh, just that the area has been well utilized)

      • no, it was another architectural way of looking and reading the poem- I had come up with New it in for this particular try, then googled Newton… found Newton Lakes there right near Cody- thought it was interesting.

  68. Dear Mr. Fenn,

    You are probably aware of the recent earthquake swarm just east of Hebgen Lake. This could herald a millennial scale change in the landforms of the area.

    I know you are ambivalent about Indulgence being found while you are extant, however I presume you DO want it found. Eventually.

    If you would like to release additional information regarding finding Indulgence, but are not sure how to proceed, I will be more than happy to assist you.


    p.s. my 60th birthday is Sunday, just fyi…. March Forth!

  69. First Grizzly bear spotted in YNP. Typically when they first leave their den they find Winter-killed animals to eat.

    More snow headed this way. Be very careful what clothes you wear . The wet snow this time of year can cause hypothermia especially if you are wearing cotton. 38F degrees is the most deadly temperature for hypothermia. You get wet from rain or melting snow then the heat drains out of you. Then you can’t think right and start to make mistakes and bad decisions. Wait a minute, I think i am confusing this with beer temperature. LOL

    • Hi Dal: if they did (I haven’t checked), then it would likely be for the purpose of reducing the chance of invasive species transfer (e.g. didymo).

    • The fun part will be to see how many people break ankles/other bones and then sue the parks…I refuse to fish without my felts…rubber soles no matter what the mfrs say do not match a good pair of felts, IMO…also, how many of you pay for a state license price + the YNP price (comes out over $30/day I believe for out of state, and you cannot keep anything in the park, I believe?) Sorry, my fishing legs are getting antsy…been telling myself I would get up soon here in CO but too much going on. At any rate, stay safe out there, there will be lots of Weebles in the river this year! Also, yeah, wash your felts every time when you get home, they will last a lot longer and retain traction better than leaving all that caked in mud/silt.

  70. Yes, invasive species prevention. So what other footwear is there? I don’t know but it is wise to wear something that prevents slipping. Lewis and Clark expedition went barefoot because it was too slippery pulling their boat upstream.

    • Hi M. Healey: simple solution is to use wading boot cleats/studs. They’re simple aluminum or tungsten carbide studs that screw into the bottom of your boots. One example: check out the promotional video at this link: https://www.rocktreads.com/

  71. Stay out of the water in those conditions- period. I am an expert in this area, and I promise you, and I know I speak for Forrest as well on this one, THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO NEED TO CROSS ANY MOVING WATER THAT POSES ANY THREAT ANY TIME OF YEAR TO THE POSSIBILITY OF DROWNING, ON FOOT OR BY WATERCRAFT, IN ORDER TO REACH THE TREASURE!!! Don’t do it!!

    • and counterintuitively, a nice hot day melts spring snow, creating ice cold floods. Respect the wild waters.

      • Yeah, cross a small stream in the morning hours but later in the day it could be too deep/fast to cross. And it might stay high for weeks. Fast water is more dangerous than Grizzly bears.

        • If you cross water, be prepared to stay there for days. LOL Probably don’t need to remind, but cellphone service is not too good in the mountains. Worst thing you can do is to try to cross anyway.

          • Forgot to mention water temperature. Melting snow is not warm. LOL I’ve fallen in ice water when kayaking and not fun. Was looking at the streamflow website, one stream water temp was below freezing! Probably have about ten seconds to get out on your own.

  72. Is Yellowstone ready to blow?

    If Fenn treasure is buried there and it blows ..covers the treasure ..will he tell us then?

    Underwater ‘fountain’ of magma found beneath Yellowstone http://dailym.ai/2G2vwag

      • Yellowstone is not dormant. It should warn us, however. Is the recent activity a “warning”? Probably not, but stay tuned.

        If Yellowstone did erupt, I expect finding treasure would come second to finding food.

          • If this “global warming” lasts any longer, all that magna will be frozen solid. LOL

          • just a quick geology google on Yellowstone caldera: average eruption is approximately every 600,000 years, the last one was 640,000 years ago…ever heard of statistics/odds? The nice part for those of us living in the search states…we won’t be around to enjoy the aftermath…the planet will have a rough go for some time though.

  73. Snow, snow, more snow. We just hit the number two spot for most snowfall here in Billings. A few more inches to hit the top spot. Pretty sure that will happen as it is still snowing and more to come later next week. This could be the start of the next Ice Age. LOL I think the YNP area is expecting a bunch, too. Sorry to sound pessimistic, but this time of year is supposed to be warm. It’s 13F right now. Wind chill -3F. Be careful out there. No cell service in the mountains and not fun walking miles through wet snow if you get stuck.

  74. I found a point of interest:
    Near Lone Mountain Ranch Resort in Big Sky, Montana.
    (As I went alone in there)
    >There is an Omega symbol.<
    45.274979, -111.312322

    It is also along road 64. I have always taken an interest in that number because the poem has 6 stanzas with 4 lines. That is all so far.

    • Road 64 becomes a jeep road called Big Sky Roadway. It goes directly beneath Blaze Mountain. Quickly down from there are the Spanish Lakes. One of which is shaped like an arrowhead. DO NOT go up to those lakes unless you have a death wish. The road then goes down to Ennis Lake. So far, taking a road that goes from Big Sky to Ennis sounds like a fun SUMMERTIME day trip.

      • If that is the road I am thinking of, it is private and gated. Some employees of the Big Sky resorts are given permission to use it if they live over around Ennis. A shorter commute but much more scenic.

        • The lakes are very high up a steep climb.
          I don’t want people to put themselves into a risky spot. An 80 year old man would not go up there.
          I am not recommending this place as a solve. It is just an interesting detour with a couple of things that are near other solves and detours.
          But if there are gates, forget it.

          • Good advice MH,
            Google Earth is very useful in eliminating areas where an 80 year old man can’t go.
            That area was one of them and they keep piling up.

          • I may have to make a correction. On another map the road from Big Sky to Ennis is called Jacks Creek Road. From Ennis it is called Jacks Creek Bench Road.
            If either end is closed then take a detour to Ousel Falls trail off of Lone Mountain road in Big Sky. It is beautiful.

    • I opened the coordinates in Google Earth and immediately noticed the Omega but also the phallic symbol directly above and a little to the left. I suppose the real question is: Can you find a second Omega symbol nearby? Just because that Omega symbols spot is fenced in doesn’t mean it couldn’t be a hint (Fenn could have definitely noticed that from a plane).

  75. Just looking at the river streamflow. The Yellowstone is very near record highs for this day. Was reading a few days at 80 degrees and some rain storm there will be major runoff because the snowpack is so deep. Stay away from the river banks because they erode and even get undercut (which you can’t see from above). The Missouri already claimed one life the other day. Somebody jumped in to save another and didn’t survive. Same with your pets–if they fall in, don’t try to save them. Kids, sure. Right now the weather is in a cooling cycle so the worst could be weeks away or next week, just keep an eye on things. Don’t take any risks if you get stranded.

    • Just to reiterate to all you antsy searchers…now is not the time to be fooling with river crossings (national AP report today):

      “Rivers and streams across western and parts of central Montana are swollen and overflowing due to the rush of melting snow from a very snowy winter. The western Montana snowpack was 150 to 175 percent of normal this year, which is one of the top five years for snowpack over the past three decades.”

      • Tbug,

        Can you recommend a good source of research to keep up with the upcoming runoffs please? Thanks

        • Butch – go to waterdata.usgs.gov, and here is a fishing website that has some really good active maps that can show property ownership info…very valuable IMO:

          whackingfatties.com – weird name but useful

  76. I meant 80 degrees here in Billings so it stays above freezing in the mountains at night. That’s when the big water will hit.

    • And sorry for all the doom and gloom. I read in the jungle more people are killed by falling trees than by all the wild animals. During the high water flows, many trees have all the soil eroded around them and they fall. Add a little wind and it makes things worse.

  77. I find it interesting that of the 7 airworthy F-100 Super Sabres in the US, 4 of them are located at a place called Big Sky Warbirds in Three Forks, Gallatin County Montana.
    Another tidbit, how many knew that “Super Sabre” is a character from Marvel Comics?
    (Although a WWII veteran he appears in the 1980s so I doubt he is a Fenn inspiration).

      • RD,
        At least two F-100 (2-seaters) at Belgrade as of June 2016. I’ll check for you this summer when I swing past (if you know what I mean). I sent an email inquiry about these two jets to a retired Major that used to fly the SuperSabre. He never responded. Imagine that.

    • Randawg, that is interesting… At one point I I looked into the static displays… Had a lot of fun at the spotting mode site searching their maps…

      Never knew there were so many “planes on sticks” 🙂

  78. I know i sound like a broken record. Many of the streams around YNP are running at well above record high levels right now (for this time of year) and the big run-off is not even here yet. Of course I expect MANY people will not heed the warning to stay away from the water. No different than the tourists who get too close to the bison in the Park.

  79. Any interest in a Sheridan, WY (Bighorn Mtns) search? I will be in Sheridan 5/25-5/28 and I25 corridor on the way there/back…if you have a spot you want searched feel free to reach out to me. I have one or two spots but nothing complete, so this is just a scouting mission for me.

    • Hi Lady V: Steamboat was very active when I was there just a few days ago — continuous spewing of water to a height of 8 feet or more, and a tremendous amount of steam. Exciting that it is becoming more active!

  80. While there has been a lull in the rivers and streams, I just noticed some have doubled in size just since yesterday. Use extreme caution.

  81. Hi. I’m looking for someone to partner up with me to look in an exact spot. I crosschecked the nine clues and about 25 other clues and they all match up a specific spot. I live in Europe and would need a partner. You would have to prove you could be trusted before I would give any information. Email: martinarff@hotmail.com

    • My Dad was a special agent for the FBI. Of course most people know how they gain trust–they get a mole to go in and tell them what they want to hear. That can take a few years. They have trained agents that know what to say.

      • Now me, I just say what I think most of the time. Sometimes it’s not pretty and almost always someone doesn’t want to hear it. Guess I’d never make a good mole. LOL

  82. “The Thrill of the Chase,” page 137:

    ‘On many occasions at night, while my wife was watching “Dancing With the Stars,…”

    “Dancing With the Stars”…Big Sky, Montana?

    • pdenver- see footnote

      *dancing with the stars

      asterisk=blazing star

      I think.

  83. Just a quick question for all who are looking in this area…Have you guys been keeping up with the activity surrounding the Yellowstone Caldera? And if so, what are your thoughts? I’ve been reading about the activity at Steamboat geyser this year, and the recent fissure that opened up near the Grand Teton area. I’m planning a 10-day trip to YNP soon, and was just wanting to make sure there isn’t too much cause for concern. Any thoughts are appreciated!

    • I just returned from an extended stay in Yellowstone. The thousands of people there didn’t seem to concern. I went by Steamboat but it had not erupted in two weeks prior to my visit. I did get to see Grand Geyser go off 🙂

      No concern for the volcano at this time from what I have read and experienced.

  84. For those not following Cynthia’s explorations of YNP as a possible hidey spot, you may be interested in her latest (maybe last this year?) two part post over on her blog…


    I like Cynthia’s posts because she explains her interpretation of what she believes the clues to be and provides pictures to help a reader share her experience of each search.

    As with all searchers’ posts, I find strengths and weaknesses with various interpretations, but acknowledge that I’m sure not at a point where I can ‘go with confidence’ and am still in the ‘hoping to stumble upon it’ group, which f tells us is a fool’s errand. But it’s fun, so…hey….

    On this one, I like (and considered) Cynthia’s HoB. If TToTC includes ‘hints’, many wonder if the school’s iron fire escape slide is one for ‘Brown’. Iron Spring allows one to marry a brown with the capitalization of brown rather than just a generic form, and also without a structure.

    From a practical ‘how did he make two trips and go undetected by possible hikers nearby’ perspective, I like the availability of the little two-vehicle parking spot she used (similar to a couple other ‘put in’ spots I’ve looked at elsewhere).

    Weaknesses in this solve IMO are that she actually walked (twice!) the ‘too far to walk’ piece (which she, with some license, interprets as ‘you’d be a fool to walk this when there’s a road right there’). And she never got cold.

    But what I find most compelling about this solve, is that f posted a comment — “Good story and photos Cynthia. They bring back good memories. f”

    uhh — ‘good memories’ from what year(s) exactly, mr forrest?

    • I’ve searched that area (as have many others) several times. My approach is slightly different which makes it even more fun; we all get to the same place a different way. AND, there is a relatively nearby and even more compelling ” iron fire escape” that warrants more thorough exploration – which is not on any maps. You must be BOTG to find it. That section of the Gibbon fishes well after high water ; July and August….good memories, indeed.

  85. This has been mentioned before but I want to provide a little more info..
    NatGeo is producing four evenings of Live TV coverage from Yellowstone National Park. The coverage started Sunday and will continue through Wednesday evening.

    The technology alone is fantastic. 34 cameras all signals converging in a converted barn in Montana with a control center on the first floor and studio in the loft. Signals sent via bonded cellular technology…which means they must have installed cell towers in the park because ordinarily it’s a pretty dead area for cell phones.

    The production company claims they aren’t really sure what they will cover during each hour because no one knows what will happen…live animals and geologic events…

    These are the same folks who created Live Earth…last year…

    Read about it here…and if you have NatGeo on cable or device…turn it on at 6pm tonight…Maybe they will uncover Forrest’s chest…

  86. My first solve, which was in CO (which I’ll be submitting to Dal to put on this blog if he wants very soon) didn’t turn up the TC, but it changed the way I was thinking about all of this. My new idea involves WY. I haven’t seen too many people sniffing around the area I have in mind. Hopefully I will be able to physically go there next year. Without giving too much away, I will say that I will be headed to see the devil’s tower belly button first and then to hear some really bad Neil Diamond covers. I’d be pretty shocked if anyone knew what it is I’m referring to!

  87. Tomorrow I leave with my son-in-law on my first “search” of the year. We will start looking somewhere around the Varney bridge over the Madison and work out way upstream. Mainly looking for trout at these points but I’ll take a chest if I trip over one. We will camp Friday night somewhere on the banks of the Madison or Quake lake. Then the real adventure begins. We go over to Island Park Idaho. Idaho? It can’t be there. Ahh yes, but the warm waters halt on the Idaho/Montana border. The warm waters of the Gulf Of Mexico over 4000 miles downstream. That divide is easier to get to from the Idaho side, it’s not too far on the Montana side, but it’s too far to walk. So we will put in below the house of brown trout of Henry’s Lake (or maybe this is some reference to the FFA radar station) on Sawtell peak road, and then follow the canyon down from that point. Once we drop off that saddle into Hell Roaring canyon it will be no place for the meek, and at 2″ deep not much use in bringing a paddle. All I need then is a blaze.
    What I describe is Brower’s spring. The start of the 4th longest river on Earth, the longest in North America, and nobody seems to go there for any reason. It sounds like an almost magical spot where on August 29th 1895 Brower and Culver stepped into a hole in the mountains, where a rivlet 2 feet wide and scarcely 2″ deep forms forms form the inner walls of the mighty and towering uplifts that surround it. They carved their initials on a fractured flat rock and deposited a copper plate nearby with the date and the name of the river on it which (the carvings or the plate) has never been found to this day.
    Will we find a chest? Will we find a copper plate from 1895? Will we even find the volcanic rock and the spring? I don’t know but I’m sure we will find laughs and a memory we will never forget. Just typing this I realized we will be there on August 25th so almost the 123rd anniversary of Brower’s expedition to the source. I have one more clue from Brower’s book on the matter I’m saving for now but it involves I think everybody who returns to the spring to look for Brower’s initials and plate is looking in the wrong spot. It’s not at the spring.

    • After about a 2 mile hike on a fair trial we dropped off the trial. About another 1/2 mile down ancient volcanic caldera landscape following a dry streambed we spot a small meadow with grass that seemed to have more moisture. We named it No Elk Meadow. No spring there, still dry. Then at the far end we spot a rockpile cairn. about 3′ high. What is sitting in the top but a square metal box! My heart about leapt out of my chest, but I immediately recognised it as an ammo can. A geocache I figured. Opening it up I see all kinds of notes and a journal for Brower’s Spring. But I think this isn’t the spring! Looking down between a few trees over a drop off we realized we were standing right above it, the polished black volcanic rock with a clear pool sprouting about 1/2 way down and continuing down more of the same black rock like a staircase. It was so amazing. We searched about a 100 yard radius for any other signs or blazes. Looked in every crack and behind every bolder. At one point right on the top there is a nice perfectly flat and level 6′ slab of a rock table next to a twisted snag of a dead tree that grew at a sharp angle. At the base of the tree a 12″ deep and 12″ wide pocket to hold a chest. What a nice place to lay down for the final time next to the chest 10″ above the spring. Your body would slowly return to nature and slowly take a 4100 mile journey across the country to New Orleans. The problem I realized by the journal is, at least 10-12 people make that spot every year. If the chest was there it is long gone.

      Like I said before, that isn’t the spot I was thinking of, not the spot where the copper plate was placed by the original Brower’s expedition. We couldn’t have made that spot in a reasonable time, it was another 2 mile downstream with no trail. It would have been much to far to make 2 trips in one day, and it’s a good thing we didn’t try because my son-in-law rolled his foot (which he had broken 6 months prior) on the way back and could barely make the last mile
      to the car as it was.

      What I do have is a great memory with my son, a liter of water from the source, and a priceless polished black volcanic rock.

      The way home we took a few dirt roads. I mean probably 120 miles of dirt roads. From 5 mph loose sandy crawls , to 68 mph blasts down arrow straight rally worthy, graded gravel. Spent a night in a forest service cabin centered where we were the probably only people in a complete 36 square mile township.

      Awesome time, and thanks Forest because I would have never even heard of Brower’s spring if I hadn’t been searching old books and the web looking for clues.

  88. More global warming (in the form of snow) headed to Montana. Be prepared. No fun walking in wet snow without proper footwear. And if it’s tall grass you’ll be wet up to your…

  89. Hello all,
    I am planning on the final BOTG search and recovery trip this coming weekend. It’s just me and the mrs. so far, but I would really like 3-4 people to avoid wildlife encounters. It’s her first time out west. If anyone is interested and around the Cody, WY area (just south of) and is honest and able to hike about a mile in and a mile out, I would enjoy meeting up for a hike. It’s going to be once in a lifetime stuff. Please, no greedy people need respond. The recovering of it requires the finder be humble as well. Thank you all for years of enjoyable reading and ideas and God bless.

    • Beautiful area out there so good luck! Don’t forget your Bear Spray (For those searching near/around Cody they sell it in the Cody Walmart).

    • I like the looks of that area Jake. If I could make it I would. Two of you should be okay though as long as you have bear spray and do not do anything risky. Good luck.

  90. I’m still rifling along in Montana and stopped at the Fir Ridge Cemetery and paid respects to all there.

    I was wondering if Forrest ever told anyone of his plans where he is going to be buried.
    New mexico, Colorado, Wyoming or Montana.

    If anyone here lives in West Yellowstone or will visit here, I would like for you to go to the Town Hall and look at the public records to see if he has a plot laid at Fir Ridge.

    The State in which he planes to rest his ashes or bones may be the state where the treasure was hidden IMO.

    I find it very interesting this cemetery has lots of veterans if not all.

        • Hey Morecowbell! Ys, I am still in it and I am doing well! Thanks for asking! We should definitely repeat and meet up when I am heading back over the pond!
          Counting the days already… 🙂

          • Let me know when you are coming back through this way TLo. The snow in MT/WY may be around for a while lol.

  91. TTOTC p.60 “So on the fourth, fifth, or sixth day, I forget which, we were pretty sure we’d used up most of the fun.”

    I believe this is when 16yo Forrest found a place so special that I would be blessed to find even if the box was already removed. 🙂

    about 3 days by teenage rookie “mountain man” from red?

    Jake I get it, but I’ll still go with Trail Creek–the ancient connection between the Gallatin and Yellowstone

    but the special place…. there are so many there….I must go investigate further…

    thanks again fen

  92. I’m kinda new to this site. You guys are funny.
    What does IMO mean? Anybody think a newbie has a chance?

      • If I agree to follow the Loonie Toon rules, all I would say is “Beep! Beep!” So you see my dilemma,
        “To beep or not to beep, that is the question”. -r

          • Roady–

            Mr. F has said we don’t know the meaning of the words we use……hope that helps

            I’m doing time….


          • ….and just that that…I’m out again. Whoever posted my bail…..Thanks

            I’m not going to mention religion, salvation, born again, crosses, angels, demons, or the meaning of the names of Mr. F’s friends.
            Nope not a word…nada…
            Just reading green eggs and ham (Dr. Suess) instead.
            Straight and narrow for me..
            Now where is that dang deputy of mine…guess I’ll have to uber home.
            1F Billy

    • Roady…

      IMO means “In My Opinion” IMO which according to the rules of engagement here at HOD (House of Dal) everything must be stated as an opinion until you have the strong box.

      If you don’t follow the rules, you will in the least be put into “moderation” which means Dal will look over what you intended to post and decide if he’ll let it go. You see the first amendment has been suspended here in the land of Dal. Watch your Ps and Qs or you’ll end up as my cell mate.

      Do you have a chance solving the puzzle? Absolutely, especially if you follow your own thoughts, and don’t follow the paths well worn. IMO it also might help if you went to bible school as a child, or have studied the bible, IMO IMO

      No Dal don’t do it….I won’t ever mention religion ever again. It’s not right locking a law man up.
      I want to see the judge….

      Best regards to you Roady;


      • p and q – aren’t those mirror images of each other?
        p & g & q & b & d’s – all are very similar depending on which way you look at them.
        Gee – now you got me thinking again. Prob not a good thing.
        As for your time in the pen – the judges around here make you sit it out and think about what you did – no bond!

      • Van Halen couldn’t have sung it better. That there poem was the longest poem I ever did see. Thanks SB. And double thanks for taking the time and effort to learn me. I feel way smarter than I was yesterdy I’m guessin.

        • … but that post about the guy with stage 4 liver cancer lookin in Colorado … went right over my head. Maybe if you corrected the punctuation, us rednecks might have a chance at interpreting the story.

    • roadrunner- every newbie will find the treasure. it takes a while to realize that it is the chest of the poem that needs to be found though. and remember to take the photo.

      i think.

      IMO means infer multiple options.

  93. IMO= in my opinion… if you‘re not able to prove what you‘re saying you should add IMO to make sure no poor soul takes it as a fact! Add an H (IMHO) and nobody will believe you… your „solve“ will be safe so to say 🙂

  94. My Case for Montana:
    IMO there are four subtleties that lead to the treasure state IMO

    FF’s oft mispronunciation of the Popo Agie ( Po-po-Ag-ee instead of “Puh – Po Shuh” )
    FF describing agate marbles – Aggies
    FF’s short lived time at Texas A&M – the Aggies
    FF’s description of ice on the agate fishing pole guide

    State Gemstone ? Montana Agate

    • Hi Morecowbell! I will probably come in mid june… I’ll try to attend the function in the junction, at least for a day… I will write you a mail as soon as I have the Dates fixed! Promised!

      • Sounds good TLo. Still a lot of snow in around so hopefully by then it will be gone.

    • Forrest was either 79 or 80 when he secreted Indulgence – Says he does not want to give that out as a clue – JDA

      • If I recall correctly, one reason FF did not want to disclose the exact year was because he did not want people scouring rental car records. That seemed like a big hint to me, but I cannot find that reference, so take my failing memory into account.

  95. Found myself in SW Montana again.
    Got a day or 2 to check out some spots near and in the the Gallatin.
    Drove thru Pocatello today, sorry JDA, didn’t have time to BS.

        • That’s what I was thinking and didn’t want to disturb it but I will go back tomorrow and the elephant will stomp on the ants to see whats under.

          The liken was on top of the stones but I believe they were carried from the base of the old tree that is about 6 ft in diameter and placed carefully.

          The 4 flat base stones had no liken and were placed there years ago without disturbance. I would say at least more than 5 years ago and possibly more than 10 years but maybe not more considering they were not covered in dirt or sediment. The soil and weeds around those base stones had no visual appearance of movement in years.

          Here’s a better video of the finding.

          • Thank you for sharing the video, Jake. The cairn is interesting with an amazing view. Is it located on top of a mountain, or near the top? I wish you good luck in your search.

          • Thanks PD,
            Not on the top of a mountain but close to the top of a plateau or ridge, only about 7700′ in elevation.

        • I’m thinking it may be the same, ace 340. The flat stones seem to suggest to keep animals from digging since they have a keen smell, and the cairn as a marker. I may be wrong.

        • Shortly after I discovered this cairn it started raining with bolts and thunder. I had to take shelter by that old tree hoping it wasn’t going to get struck again like the old scars had shown.

          It’s still storming out here at Taylor Fork and hope it clears tomorrow for another recon with a shovel. Hope I don’t find bones….

          • Jake, if the clues brought you to that spot then I dont think you have much choice but to dig. You can put everything back the way you found it
            Although I certainly hope it isnt a grave but perhaps a corner market or memorial of some sort. Good luck to you!!

          • I did go back and dig down over a foot and quit. It didn’t feel right. I put it back but changed it a little to more my liking. No bones, just super hard dirt.

      • Hi Jake: if it’s feasible to try to remove (and from your picture I would say it’s trivial to do so), then that doesn’t sound like Forrest’s blaze to me.

        • Agreed,
          It was feasible to remove. I was hoping for a rock outcropping that stood out and was not man made although you could say the rocks were natural but were placed by a human.

          The other blazes (rock outcroppings) were very difficult to get to and probably too dangerous.
          Oh well. Better luck next time.

  96. Jake, I hope you found “The” BLAZE and would love it if you are the one to bring the treasure home. And give Forrest back his bracelet for a late bday present. Good luck!!! Sandy

  97. Last year I went to my search area, a place with a lake and cemetery on Forest Service land accessed by road thru private property.
    This was my second trip. First trip the year before the property owners
    had no problems with driving in. The gates weren’t locked, close them behind
    you kind of thing, enjoy the area. This trip big surprise. Gates locked.
    No access by road. Couldn’t even walk thru on their road. Had to be
    backtrack to the F.S. boundary and bush whack over a couple of miles
    and some steep terrain on a sort of game/human trail. The reason as
    I was told was that “Forrest Fenn treasure hunters” had dug a big hole
    next to the lake. Sure enough, 3 or4 feet wide and down to the water level.
    I would have jumped in but didn’t think I could get out that easily.
    Thankfully there was no damage done to the cemetery and the Forest
    Service property is still open to the hiking public. The road on the other
    hand is up to the two different private property owners. Guess I’ll
    find out next week. BOTG in Montana

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