Forrest Gets Mail From a Middle School Class


Thank you Karen,

I will try to answer the questions for your students. I received about 30 emails and was a little overwhelmed. That’s why I didn’t respond to more than I did. My answers follow the student’s questions and are in bold type.

I can see by the first question that your students probably are not asking what they want answered. I will answer the questions as presented and not judge them. I will also leave your students with a poem. It is not a reflection on anyone, or the questions, but something for them to think about.

Today as I went up the stair, I met a man who wasn’t there. He wasn’t there again today, oh how I wish he’d go away.


Can you describe the first and last time you visited your secret fishing spot?
Yes, I went in my car both times and the sun was shining.

Also you said gold. In the canyon we are guessing the sunset make the rock look like gold is this significant to the place where you hid the treasure.
I am sure the rock would think so.

Does the 4 line in each stanza have a significance to when you hid the treasure.

Would you please give us a list of all your friends/superiors in the Vietnam war?
There are several hundred. Would you like the names alphabetical?

Could you also tell was time of year you hid the treasure?
Yes, it was summer.

We have a guess about where the treasure is hidden, and we were wondering if you could give us some feedback on it.
Yes, I think I could.

We believe that the treasure is hidden near agua fria peak, New Mexico.
I think that is very interesting.

Our group also thinks if it is not hidden there, then it might be hidden some where near Cimarron canyon.
The canyon is very long so if you go searching there please be prepared.

Our final guess is that the treasure may be along road 156 in Wyoming. Thank you for taking time out of your day to help us in our class!
You cannot solve the problem by starting in the middle of the poem. You should start with the first clue and then solve the other eight in order.

What is your favorite thing about the place where you hid the treasure?
It is in a place that is dear to me.

When was the first time you went to the place where you hid the treasure?
I don’t want to answer that question. It is more of a clue than I want to give.

What is your favorite outside activity?

When was the last time you went to the place with the treasure was hidden?
A few years ago.

Did you name the poem The Thrill of the Chase?
No. I forgot to name it.

Were you close to your father?
I think I was closer in my memory of him than in practice.

Does Bighorn Canyon,WY ring any bells in your past?
Or does Black Canyon,CO ring any bells?
What do you mean by “ringing bells”

What is the emphasis of “where warm waters halt”?
I don’t understand the question.

What does “warm” mean to you?
It means being comfortable.

Where did you mostly go during your lifetime?
Europe, Asia, South America, and the United States.

When did you find this spot to bury the treasure like year?
I have not said that I buried it, and I don’t want to reveal when I discovered the spot. It is too much of a clue.

Does a blaze mean the treasure?
Not in my dictionary.

Why did you hide the treasure where you hid it?
I love the way you worded that question. I think you are going to be a science fiction writer. The answer is in my book, TTOTC.

What inspired your passion for art?
I have no passion for art. It was only a business to me.

Who was your biggest influence growing up?
My father and my football coach.

Why did you choose the specific riches in the treasure?
Because I needed them to put in the treasure chest.

Have you ever revisited the place you hid it?

How did the Vietnam War affect you?
It made me more forgiving, more considerate, and more aware that we need to leave other people alone.

What time of year did you hid the treasure?

Is there is specific reason that halt and walk are the only words that do not follow the  rhyme scheme?
Yes, I was limited by my ability.

What is your favorite place to be? or river?
In my home in Santa Fe.

Where was your favorite place? Why?
Why don’t you ask me how deep is a hole? I cannot single out one to be my favorite.

Why did you marry?
Because I was able to find a woman who was much better than me, and then spent 63 years hoping she wouldn’t find out.

What is “too far to walk” to you?
It is the name of a book I wrote.

Who were your partners in the Air Force?
I had no partners sir.

When you wrote the poem, were you thinking about fishing
No, I was thinking about the poem.

What was your favorite Hike/Trail Yellowstone.?
Trails are not favorites of mine. I always hiked off trails. Why go where everyone else had gone. The rangers didn’t like that, but I did and I was the one doing it. Do you see my logic?

Did it lead to the top of a waterfall?
Some did but most didn’t.

Where did you catch the Fish that you still have a memory.
In Alaska.

If so, why do you remember that memory?
Because a 900 pound bear also wanted it. Guess who won?

What type of fish did you like fishing for?
Trout, bass, perch and catfish.

What Is Blaze?
Anything that stands out.

How hard was it to write the poem and not give the location away?
It was not hard at all. I just had to stay focused.

In the poem, Thrill of The Chase when you talk about “Not far, but too far to walk” and “Take it in the canyon down,” is it referring to a waterfall.
You guys seem to be hung up on waterfalls. Don’t try to change my poem to fit your ideas.

We were also wondering if you could tell us anything about “The home of the Brown.

“Do you “check” on the treasure every once in awhile to see if it is still in tact.
Do you mean as opposed to being torn apart? I feel sure it is still intact.

And does anyone know for sure where it is, for example, your wife, or closest friend?
No one knows where it is but me.

We are looking into places in New Mexico and we are curious if we are in the right direction.
Go back to the poem and start with the first clue.

When was the last time you have been to where the treasure is hidden?
A few years ago.

522 thoughts on “Forrest Gets Mail From a Middle School Class

    • I agree. A very witty, lighthearted enjoyable post. I see several clarifications and confirmations that overall should be helpful to some folks in the Chase.

      • ty SIR Fenn You can write circles around mind thinkers its funny and i enjoyed it a few years late due to the stroke but hey who would know what last this did if i could ask i t would be something like will we know that when found your clues will we know they came from you? your answer would be of coarse they came from me how do you think you found them

    • The line “You guys seem to be hung up on waterfalls…” caught me off guard there. Sounds like he is ruling it out, just like dams.

      • Not 100% ruled out…but seems likely that is the case. Not a great indicator for all the waterfall folks…
        Also…he clarifies that you can’t start in the middle of the poem…start with first clue and then solve the other eight IN ORDER.
        This is awesome that Fenn has interacted with a group of curious kids involved in his treasure hunt. This is possibly one of the moments that will impact one of these kids in a huge way. Really cool stuff….

      • For me, I would not be so hasty. Here is the quote:
        “In the poem, Thrill of The Chase when you talk about “Not far, but too far to walk” and “Take it in the canyon down,” is it referring to a waterfall?

        Forrest answers: “You guys seem to be hung up on waterfalls. Don’t try to change my poem to fit your ideas.”

        Forrest is indicating that “Not far, but too far to walk” and “Take it in the canyon down” are NOT referring to waterfalls, that the kids are trying to make a waterfall fit their solve, not the poem.

        I would leave open the possibility that a waterfall MAY
        be involved in “Water High” and/or the blaze. Just sayin’ JDA

        • JDA – Logically speaking f said if you’ve got a waterfall in your solution, you are forcing the poem.

          Since you are a sculptor who is familiar with tools, you certainly understand that tools coupled with human hands can force or create many things. IMO you need to put the tools and hands away. Let the poem flow and use your mind. If you do that, you won’t have to force anything to fit that isn’t supposed to be there.

          I realize that you may still disagree and that is fine with me. Only logic and time will tell whether a waterfall will be involved.

        • Jda, I think that is exactly the point. ” Don’t try to change my poem to fit your ideas.” It is his poem and his ideas, NOT our ideas. But you must be right, just saying…

        • I agree with JDA… this may not be informative.

          At first, I thought it was anti-waterfall, then my son asked “why ‘hung up’? that’s the only waterfall question” and I thought even more so.

          Then I “thought Fenn”. These were written responses to written questions, prefaced by “I will answer the questions as presented and not judge them.”

          Now I think Forrest may be reacting to a near-non-sequitor, a poor question from student to author. …

          Not far…. + Canyon down = waterfall??? Maybe water high, but…
          …the jump by the youngun from the beginning to water high, or blaze, or whatever is understandable. I’ve done it. 🙂

        • HMA ~” Logically speaking f said if you’ve got a waterfall in your solution, you are forcing the poem.”

          Umm, errr, I’m not thinking the same here. Fenn answered the question to the way it was asked… “I will answer the questions as presented and not judge them.” The question refers to specific lines in the poem, and not the entire poem.

          There’s still the chance that a waterfall could be involved somewhere. I’m not totally convince, but I can’t rule it out either.

          • Seeker, I see your point but imagine that the question included ‘heavy loads and water high’, how will people react? By the same token, imagine that the question included the line ‘and with my treasures bold’ is that a waterfall mr. fenn? well that does not make sense at all, right?

            I think that you have agreed in the past that he chooses the questions carefully and always finds a way to say what he wants to say in his answers. That is of course if the questions really came from middle school students and not completely made up, which could be possible.

          • Oz10,
            Anything is possibly if all we have are assumptions and thoughts.
            I mean, you used the line, and with my treasures bold to be in the waterfall… Lets take a quick ride through YSP…
            Gone alone in the park~ that we know by stories from the book.
            Scenario ~ WWH source of YS river, Canyon down, elevation north to the lake Not far but too far to walk, area forbidden [reserved for Bison] to travel, must go around [ paths on both side, but a long walk either way]. Below hoB I’ll go with Mr. Bubbles on this one…
            Now, stanza 3 is all about the Grand Canyon of YS [ certainly a marvel gaze ]… no place for the meek [ read Washburn–Langford–Doane Expedition for description], “drawing” of waters from the lake, no paddle up your creek [ falls ].
            Just heavy loads… two story glacier boulder just off the rim at the north end of the lower falls.. water high [ falls again ] upper and lower falls.

            PS. no need to attempt traveling the falls… walk the rim… millions do it every year.

            Hypothetically, why is this theory a risk factor with falls included? Why would the answer to the question not include a waterfall in any part of the poem?… even one as larger as the upper and lower falls of YS?

          • Seeker –

            “Umm, errr, I’m not thinking the same here.”

            To me logic is logic. Don’t complicate things.

            “There’s still the chance that a waterfall could be involved somewhere. I’m not totally convince, but I can’t rule it out either.”

            When I see the poem, I don’t see a waterfall. Short answer is no waterfall. IMO because that is just what I see.

          • HMA;

            What do you see as “Water high” and/or the blaze then? To me, these COULD = a waterfall. JDA

          • JDA –

            “What do you see as “Water high” and/or the blaze then? To me, these COULD = a waterfall. ”

            JDA, if you can solve the poem your questions will be answered. For me there is no waterfall.

            I think you might suffer from what most searcher do. You see the poem one way and to solve the poem you have to see something else. Just my opinion because I don’t have evidence. Consider this though. If f says that following the 9 clues will lead you to the treasure and you will walk to it with confidence, then why would it take 10+ trips to where the clues have led you to in order to find the treasure?

          • I have been reading this poem and studying all information on and off this past year from my arm chair. I sure see some wild, complex, over complicated,odd, intelligent and informative ideas. Lots of head scratch posted ideas. Half are my own lol.

          • HMA;

            I have answered your question re # of trips before, but if you missed it. Here we go again.

            I have had 5 separate solves in 13 months. All started at the same spot.
            Solve #1 ended on private land
            (Moved upstream)
            Solve #2 = no treasure found
            (Moved farther upstream)
            Solve #3 = Spent 4 months looking IN my stream – no treasure (Wasted 4 months)
            Solve #4 – Went to the top of my waterfall – No treasure found
            Solve #5 – Present solve – Searched banks of my stream, but not all bank areas. Solve #5 = same area as Solve #3, but not IN the water.

            Winter is here. Waiting for warmer weather. Each outing I learned a LOT. Time and effort was NOT wasted.

            First five months, was hampered by ice and/or torrential waters, but was able to search anyway. Total of about 9 months wasted, or ill used.

            I am now confident that I KNOW where it is. We shall see. I MAY eat crow, and you can gloat about what a loser I am, but then again, I MAY surprise you and show you and others that confidence and perseverance DO pay off. JDA

          • JDA

            What state are you searching in or is that a do not ask and no tell secret? If so I respect your not saying.

          • JDA,

            I haven’t been around here much, just on and off for past 8 months. Thanks for answering. I did kind of suspected you were focused on Wyoming though.

            I focused briefly on Wyoming. Focused extensively at first on Montana allot. Never was inclined to focus on New mexico.

            I am focused currently on Colorado very strongly.

          • Alset-

            Good luck in Colorado – Fewest # of searchers – less competition for Real Estate.

            I will show my bias and say that I think that you are making a mistake by leaving Wyoming. JDA

          • JDA,

            Yep, very few are searching there in Colorado in comparison but people are searching there and at my area also. The city/town is quite aware of Fenn treasure seekers.

            I think this city/town has been given up on though by many of those that were looking there from what I can read everywhere that I can find searchers comments. Good , I say to that!

            Fewest # of searchers in Colorado just makes me smile and say-“but so few have not found the treasure”. Most are searching in Wyoming and I say to that, ‘ so many more have not found the treasure” HAHA LOLOL.

            Notice FF only ever says Colorado when he is talking inclusive of all 4 states? Secret Where..perhaps?

          • Amp,

            Due to my extreme confidence in the location , I will not say the city/town .
            The only stanza that I cannot conclude confidence is stanza 4 to my location from a distant perspective .That stanza is BOTG required in my conclusion-there is no other way.

            So confident am I that if I divulged the city/town I really believe someone will find it this year. Everyone is looking elsewhere in other states and that is perfect.

            Everyone feels the same as I about theirs. This area is very simple with the poem ,a good map and a little bit of history searched. I just live in Canada unfortunately.

          • I spent 13 out of 15 years attending a Marble Sculpting Workshop in Marble, Colorado. Absolutely beautiful country.

            I am not sure one could find a more beautiful place in which to learn, and help others learn, the art of stone sculpting. How I miss Marble/marble! JDA

        • Indeed, you are right, not waterfalls and the canyon is very long. I almost certain that i revealed the first key word in the first sentence “As i have gone alone in there” , means: FF went SOLO , this took me to solo rider sang by Amilia, to solo fly by Amilia earhart and to AMILIA , N.M
          Amilia. costa. costilla and red river are the 4 points in the big and little constalation of the bear constalation but they also could be the CORVUS constalation. I think that the poem is a navigation map by stars and the blaze may be POLARIS the north star. in old times sea men used to navigate through stars but when you are “in the wood” and must be brave, you navigate by land. so you nust be brave because there are bears around but brave is also “talented” and “knowsable” to navigate in the nigh using the big and little bear depending your location. if you come from the east like from Raton NM you should go down all the way to the west follow Orion and than the big and little bears, than climb up to these 4 points. seach for something to do with the No 13 , a byway, not a trail

          • zvia ben ami,

            I like the term ‘navigation’ much better than ‘trail’ ~ twist of the word trail can make it work… more or less.
            The bear constellation Ursa Major and Minor are also know as “she bear”

            This is not the first time folks have attempted constellation workable with a theory. I have as well. I did like the “alone” meaning as “solo”… that was a nice catch.

          • ZBA –

            I really like this post. I like the idea of using constellations and in particular because Fenn was a pilot. He also uses nautical terms often.


      • Agreed. IMO he went out of the way to make a point. With the intent of keeping searchers safe and away from unnecessary risks.

        • LMN,

          Silly question, why would a waterfall be a risk factor… if I read your comment correctly?
          Is it any higher of a risk than a lake or wandering the wiles of nature in the high mountains, or even crossing an intersection? I have played in and around waterfalls most of my life… Not one like Niagara falls, but others.

          • I can think of a couple of searchers in this blog alone who said they will be getting on top of waterfalls and look down to look for blazes or reflections at the bottom. I’ve read them for sure not too long ago.

    • If I were to Guess about the bear and the fish Id Guess You won because i think you out witted himJeff Burch is still alive and thinking with as much as my brain can muster titan is waving a hello to all of you and as for my wife to be ranee says hello too. thank you again Sir Forrest Fenn fore saving my life by making me think all through my stroke days Im getting through this.Tthe wild erness will always call on me to live. I also believe the man is still there I know this because he borrowed my chair.I also asked him to move his stair so if i didnt see it and triped. no one would care.We all know a mirror is a reflection of time the trick is to close your eyes and not your mind and except and be grateful for our time. Titan is waving a hello to all hope to see yous at the fennboree ye ha. and weeeeee Jb is wishing you all well.

      • Hey Jeff-
        It’s a pleasure to see you here again..
        I hope you can convince Titan and Ranee to come to Fennboree too..
        I can tell by your writing style that you have made vast improvements…
        You are courageous my friend…

  1. An enjoyable read – nothing divulged that I did not already know.

    Good luck to the kids. I hope that they are having fun with the poem. Having fun is one of the most important aspects of youth – In my humble opinion. JDA

    • TTOTC is a brilliant gift. Something that all ages can enjoy, exciting, educational, and healthy.

      I could not thank Forrest enough. Got some good karma comin’ his way.

    • Have you, JDA, ever attended any of the ‘Marble-stock’ music gatherings. Im not sure that they still hold them but i was fortunate to attend one of the earliest. Beautiful place. Great people.

          • JDA,

            Nice! Easier for you to search than it is for me. I live in Alberta, Canada-not too far from the Rockies here.

          • Look under Searcher’s Information for a bio if you are interested. type F3 button, type JD in little box, and voila – JDA

          • Thanks. Just wondered what state you lived in. So, fewer seem to be searching in Colorado by comparison to the other 3 states. Just amazes me really. Now watch , ff will send in a Q&A or something involving Colorado in an ambiguous way ..haha…seems to be a pattern of clues within this blog.

  2. I’m confused a little bit on his questions concerning going back to where the treasure was hid and him revisiting it. One he says, few years ago, and another he says he has not.
    Could there actually be TWO treasures? One that he has not revisited, and one that he has?

    Oh wait… I think I know what he did there 😛

    • Iron –

      “Could there actually be TWO treasures? One that he has not revisited, and one that he has?”

      You are perceptive! Sort of reminds me of f saying, “Sage says don’t try to carry it home in one trip.”

      • HMA or IW, why don’t you come out and explain that point instead of talking in codes? lol…
        At least 95% will not believe you anyways so what is the harm???

        • OZ10

          But don’t you know that these two guys revel in “Knowing something that the rest of us are too stupid to figure out”? Just sayin’ JDA

        • Oz10,
          Don’t hold your breath… you’ll have to wait for the tell all book to come out. You know…the one in the making before the chest is retrieved.. lol

        • Hey guys…there has to be two…maybe three treasures…because they all are going to get it soon. Cripes maybe Fenn hid one in all 4 states….

        • Oz, I would love to explain that little poem above, and the questions. But I didn’t put all this here. Forrest did. And I imagine he’s having fun watching everyone keep a ghost alive. I’m not going to spoil his entertainment, by letting the cat out of the bag, without people having the chance to learn for themselves.

        • Oz10 and JDA – There isn’t a good way that I can think of right now to explain my statement above without giving things away. I will say that if you want to understand what f has written in his books, answers to questions, things he has said in videos and many of the other questions that searchers come up with, you will have to figure out the clues in the poem. When you can figure out a key word and clues then hints will become evident and your questions will be answered. Things will begin to line up and fall into place. There simply is no shortcut, only that you figure out the clues in the poem.

          I realize that this was probably not the answer you were seeking. If you are serious about solving the poem and/or finding the treasure you have to spend more time on the poem than you do on the blogs.

          The poem really is a work of art that will leave many speechless.

          • Sorry, that came out weird but I think you know what I meant. Did his ideas influenced yours or the other way around?

          • Oz10 –

            “HMA, did you solve the clues independently or were you just taking cues from Zap?”

            I must say independently but encouragement can go a long way. 🙂
            Have you not read Zap’s comments on this blog? Can I be the only one who felt like he might be logical with his thoughts and highly intelligent? I do know of one other searcher who does agree that there is more than meets the eye and has taken on the challenge to solve the poem.

            At some point you have to ask yourself if trying the same thing will produce different results. Maybe you have to radically change the way you see things.

    • “When was the last time you have been to where the treasure is hidden?
      A few years ago.”

      Cool thought, I wouldn’t rule it out, but for accuracy purposes he didn’t say “going back”

      This could also be taken at face value which indicates that Mr. Fenn’s definition of few could include 5 or 6 years… assuming the email is current of course.

      • Remember though when asked directly:

        “Have you ever revisited the place you hid it?”
        Forrest answered –

        Therefore his first quote had to be when he hid it,
        and we have known for some time that that was about 6 years ago – we now know, in the summer – but that makes no difference as far as I can tell.


        • Forrest is now 86 – August he will be 87

          Hid the Treasure when he was 79 or 80.

          When hid? – Summer – July – Sept
          TC hidden 6 , almost 7 years ago. Nothing new.


    • I think in one of them he just visited the state Not went and saw the treasure kinda confused me too now i gotta go look again Must not be in new mexico then lol

      • That’s not what it is. Everything you guys are saying has to do with the poem. Figure it out and you’ll understand the contradicting statements 😛

        • I just reread it sounds to me he went to the state it was in but didnt go to the location where he hid the treasure

          • Ok Diggin, If what you say is true… then New Mexico is ruled out of the Chase.

            Everyone is focusing on what was said, and not looking at what wasn’t said. Sorry so cryptic, but I think Forrest would want everyone to figure it out on their own. 😉

          • Why does it have to be cryptic ? Sounds pretty point blank he was there a few years ago but not to where he hid it Forrest says not to over think And people are making it harder than what it is

  3. Maybe the ghost is just too warm and doesn’t want to leave. He was there first anyhow Lol. Thanks for sharing all these great questions and answers. Some really bright young students with wonderful ideas. Thanks. imo.

  4. The comments regarding warm, when, and waterfall are telling me something, and as soon as I figure it out I’ll know what.

    Seriously, warm=comfortable may help some folks. The waterfall comment does strike me as a near inadvertent strike against waterfalls (sorry JDA). The “when” is less suggestive, but TO ME it leans against NewMex (he could easily say when, if it was after he retired from the USAF, but if he said summer of 1945, well, that narrows it WAY down).

  5. Some great confirmations there!
    WARM = comfortable
    BLAZE = something that stands out
    TIITCD/TFTW= (meaning waterfalls?) “Don’t change my poem to fit your ideas.”…so “no”
    They should have asked about HL/WH!
    F refuses to give an answer to the age of his spot…as a child, people could read WY/MT…as an adult, NM. But, F did travel through ALL 4 states as a kid each summer. He could have a childhood fav spot in each state! So, being secretive about that, Imo, wouldn’t matter, unless he feels if he said “as an adult”, it would point to NM. Who WOULDN’T want to explore a state you just moved into?!
    One last thought…sometimes, NOT answering IS answering!

    • I’m surprised nobody has mentioned “Could you also tell was time of year you hid the treasure?
      Yes, it was summer.”
      June… Sept
      Many have ponder the dates of the hiding… it seems to be narrowed down to age 79 and closing in on age 80… “Well, I’m almost eighty and I think that’s so funny…” { Born in August. } Indecision is the key to flexibility… And Eric Sloane, at age almost-eighty, I’d figure it was time to act. So I wrote a poem…

      • thank you for your concise comment Seeker 🙂

        have I just completely missed that f already specified Summer?

        • Joesph,
          The last I knew was hid the chest at 79 or 80… no dates or specific time.
          Now it seems June, July, August into September … taking it a step further using age 79… June 20th, to birthday in August is a narrowed down time line. Is it important? Maybe it’s the spring or fall equinox time line. and the chest… by using the poem…can only be found on one of two days.
          Tarry scant with marvel gaze… linger a short time and gaze at what is before you. A pointer or line of sight…a shadow cast? Maybe your effort will be worth the cold night if your brave enough for the night time stay…while waiting for the morning light.

          What Is Blaze?
          Anything that stands out.

          If it actually stands out can it be used as an alignment? and the reason to linger a scant amount of time to view the event…

          • Seeker – as far as when f hid the TC, consider this quote…

            I got reacquainted with Forrest a few years ago, and then, when I was down in Santa Fe in July of
            2010… we had lunch together and he said he’d hidden a treasure box, a box full of gold, and was just
            finishing up a book with clues on how to find it.
            (Pg 45, Chasing Words of Forrest Fenn – Chronological Order)

            My estimate for f hiding the TC has been June or early July 2010, when he was 79, for a long time. His mention of ‘summer’, I believe, validates that time period… not that it does anything for me personally for finding the chest.

            I would love to site down with Peggy and have a chat about what they were doing around that time. I wouldn’t be surprised if she would say that she had gone some where for a week or two and that f was home by himself during that time. Just speculating here.

          • JCM,
            I have a slight recollection of that podcast [ unfortunately it’s seems no longer available ].
            Now, if I was to guess… late June or early July would be the perfect time line. [leaning at June].

            What’s your take on the “blaze”… something that stands out? If related to the same time line?

          • Thanks Loco… that worked. The young lady has a soothing voice. Not anything to do with the chase… just note worthy.

          • Thanks for identifying that Loco, I either missed selecting / copying ‘fenn’ or accidentally deleted it after I pasted it.

            I think Dal once mentioned something about some sort of weather or natural phenomena happening around the time or place that f hid the chest… somewhere in comments Dal made in 2012 or 2013… or I just might be lacking in sleep and have no idea what I am remembering (feel free to tell me I am up in the night Dal). Anyway, if I could find that, it would add to some other rabbit hole to go down and chase around in for awhile.

            Seeker – as for the blaze comment about sticking out, I need to go back and look at it in relation to other blaze quotes. But if it is something that sticks out in the area or is drawing attention to itself, I can’t imagine that the chest is right there by it or under it, someone would eventually wander over to it and check it out.

            Some might argue that the chest must be buried or somehow covered right there at the blaze, but I go back to the point that f intended to end his life there with his bones to rot in the sun, yet no one is going to stumble upon the spot where the chest is hidden (nor his bones), which f figured would be there for a few millennia.

            Per our discussions, if there is a specific day that you must be there in the year, June 21st would be an excellent candidate to be that magical day. But there are a few other comments that one could argue this possibility away with. I think ‘But tarry scant with marvel gaze’ is certainly one more thing that needs to be figured out (if it is a clue) by a searcher; and if a searcher doesn’t, I hope they planned to have a nice vacation.

  6. The poem Antigonish” is an 1899 poem by American educator and poet William Hughes Mearns. It is also known as “The Little Man Who Wasn’t There”, and was a hit song under that title.

    “As I was going up the stair
    I met a man who wasn’t there!
    He wasn’t there again today,
    I wish, I wish he’d stay away!”

    When I came home last night at three,
    The man was waiting there for me
    But when I looked around the hall,
    I couldn’t see him there at all!
    Go away, go away, don’t you come back any more!
    Go away, go away, and please don’t slam the door…

    Last night I saw upon the stair,
    A little man who wasn’t there,
    He wasn’t there again today
    Oh, how I wish he’d go away…

    Antigonish is a Mi’kmaq name and, depending upon whom you ask, has two quite distinct meanings: 1. The place where the branches are torn off by bears gathering beechnuts. 2. Meeting place of five forked rivers.

      • I dont understand what you are saying Jeremy, I googled

        “Today as I went up the stair, I met a man who wasn’t there. He wasn’t there again today, oh how I wish he’d go away.”

        the line before the q @ a and found Mearns

    • Squat Cobbler, thank you for all that, it saved me a lot of typing!
      After Means wrote “Antigonish”, meant as a ghost poem, several other small poems came out, imitating his style…

      As I was sitting in my chair,
      I knew the bottom wasn’t there,
      Nor legs nor back but I just sat,
      Ignoring little things like that.
      ***And…by Burgess:
      I never saw a purple cow,
      I never hope to see one;
      But I can tell you, anyhow,
      I’d rather see than be one.

      As in the “Antigonish”, the direct open-end style of poetry allows the reader to have free interpretation. The man could be a ghost, a mirror image, a government man, it is only limited by the readers imagination.
      F’s poem is this style of “open minded direct” poetry. It gives the audience an unlimited canvas to imagine F’s clues. Difficult? Yes! Impossible? No, not as long as ONE person knows the answer, and that is F!
      In this type of poetry, “Imagination is more important than knowlege”,
      has NEVER been more true!
      Good luck all!
      ¥Peace ¥

  7. Interesting read. I am one of those water fall thinkers. How he answered the question to the words in the question ; the referenced lines by them really didn’t make any sense to read water fall into the lines included.

    “In the poem, Thrill of The Chase when you talk about “Not far, but too far to walk” and “Take it in the canyon down,” is it referring to a waterfall.
    You guys seem to be hung up on waterfalls. Don’t try to change my poem to fit your ideas.”

    So, I wouldn’t discount a water fall either but also I wouldn’t put more than one emphasis around a water fall either. My first inclination to my area was not because of a water fall but because of my initial interpretation of Warm Waters Halt was in sync of what he said-comfortable. So, I was happy the way he answered. There was a comfortable relationship that went sour and turned into a competition. One person lost the competition ( to be awarded something) and the other person won . It changed the course of a specific history to our future. So, to me my solve is still strong in play and there is still, to me, a water fall in play-not discounted at all to what is interpreted.

  8. It’s easy for searchers and non-searchers to be drawn into exploring a waterfall or other natural stand out – especially features that lie in places with easy access within a couple of miles from a road or parking spot. Where would you go to hide a treasure or leave your remains? Somewhere easy and likely to be found?
    It’s also easy for searchers to assume specifics when Forrest is speaking in generalities.

  9. I admit that I have an affliction of an over active hyper mind. This has both positive and negative attributes in effect. I meditate moments throughout the day to balance , calm and ground myself in thought process.

    Now that being said:; I am inclined to believe that Forrest is reading this blog, probably last couple days. That is probably why he sent this in to be posted LOL. Water falls, water falls-stop already! Haha.

  10. “Is there a reason why halt and walk do not follow the rhyme scheme?”

    “Yes, I was limited in my ability”.


  11. Have you ever revisited the place you hid it?

    When was the last time you have been to where the treasure is hidden?
    “A few years ago”


    Scott W.

      • Scott,
        I never consider “it” [ assuming in stanza two, begin it where…] had anything to do with the ‘chest/treasure’ In that line I’m more concerned about ‘where’
        As far as; “revisited the the place you hid it” that seems very precise… a 10″ sq spot. [ “place”]

        As for; When was the last time you have been to where the treasure is hidden? “A few years ago” this seems general area. Now all we need to understand is what “a few” means. [ been to ‘where’ the treasure is hidden ].

        I’m being serious. If a mud puddle looks like an ocean to an ant, a few [ normally more than two but not much more ] could mean 5 7 10 or even more, depending on context… If I have 100 apples and gave a few [scant amount] away… lets give it 10%… I gave 10 apples away. That really doesn’t fit the dictionary explanation of a few… but does fit few – scant, as small amount.

        Play on words? or clever use of words?

      • JDA,

        So if I understand you correctly, the last time he was there was actually when he hid it. And that is why he can say that he has not been back since then.


        Scott W.

    • Hey Scott. My interpretation is this. There is a subtle difference between the PLACE he hid it and WHERE the treasure is hidden. That is, the hole he hid it in versus the general area. He may have been back to the PLACE he hid it, but not to where he buried it. Does that make sense?

      • To fit the poem….there is a subtle difference between the WHERE he hid it and the PLACE the treasure is hidden.
        This is subtly different. I imagine.

    • Hey Scott,
      Hope all is well with you and yours.
      Seems now, we have a new definition for “a few”
      Hid the chest… 7 years ago?… at 79 or 80.
      Few; looked up the word, one meaning scant… talking in circles.
      Walked less than a few miles… twice in one afternoon.

      Conclusion; I have no idea what a few means to fenn…lol

      • This is what I mean by specifics vs generalities. Allows for a lot of grey area doesn’t it!

  12. His comments about art being a business rather than a passion seem to conflict with his comments about Nicholai Fechin.

    What inspired your passion for art?
    I have no passion for art. It was only a business to me.

    “Nicolai Fechin is still my idol, and I feel like I knew him, although we never met. Rarely has an artist’s work instantly, and so completely, seized the emotions of a passing observer, who, until that first moment, had been totally oblivious of his work.”

  13. “Also you said gold. In the canyon we are guessing the sunset make the rock look like gold is this significant to the place where you hid the treasure.
    I am sure the rock would think so.”

    There is no reference in the poem or the book TTOTC to the sunset making a rock looking like gold. This question looks out of place. Not a question an elementary student would ask. I think this is significant. I’m guessing this is a question Fenn made up and answered.

    • Hmm. Interesting if true. I wonder if others here can verify this point Squat Cobbler states about in the book? I never read it. If so a fact ,then like I said earlier, he is being creative with assistance to clues.

    • squat cobbler,
      I highly doubt fenn “made up” a question. I’m sure the Teacher and Students reviewed the Q&A and that would send up a red flag, as they would know the question was not asked. { that would seem to obvious }
      As far as the “sun or sunset” it could be the kids imaginations at work… many searchers have ideas of the sun being the blaze or a sun alignment is used for finding the chest or even a shadow affect. Fenn does mention gold in the book and the poem… it would be a reasonable assumption the kids thought about “…guessing’ the sunset make the rock look like gold”

      Just my take on it… it meaning the question and not it in the poem, although “take it in the canyon” in the poem could be the sun down the canyon…

      • Seeker, We don’t know who this teacher Karen is, or what middle school she teaches at, or where this middle school is located. For all we know, every one of the questions was made up by Fenn. If this middle school does exist, are they familiar with “home of dal.”

        “Also you said gold. In the canyon we are guessing the sunset make the rock look like gold is this significant to the place where you hid the treasure.
        I am sure the rock would think so.”

        Seeker I respect your opionion, but I humbly disagree with your interpretation. The word canyon is used once in the poem “And take it in the canyon down”, the word gold is used once in the poem, “I give you title to the gold” Nowhere does it say anything about the sun turning the rocks in the canyon gold”. I think it is a giant leep of faith that the students “guessed the sunset made the “rock” look like gold. What rock? This Q @ A question might be a response to an individual searcher.

        • That’s a lot of IF thinking. My if would be… If fenn would be deliberately misleading us to say these are questions from school know kids…How can you believe anything stated. We have been told the chest is not in a graveyard. Does that mean a cemetery is still in play?

          I recall a guy who was yelling Fenn was being misleading when he said wwwh is not a dam.

          Many in the past have claimed similar comments… Mainly because it made parts of their solve questionable.

          Personally… I’m not seeing it.

          • Ok forget the idea that the middle school is not legitimate. Fenn said he was inundated with questions from students. Would the middle school teacher know every question that was asked? Would you agree that Fenn could have snuck a question of his own in?

            Its not in a graveyard and its not under an outhouse. There is no doubt in my mind these are correct statements.

            “I recall a guy who was yelling Fenn was being misleading when he said wwwh is not a dam.” That guy was correct the statement is misleading.
            Maybe you should reread scrapbook #68 again, about wwwh and what he actually says. The reason no one has found the treasure in 6 years, is because no one actually “listens” to what he is saying. Think in or out of the box, but most importantly dont listen to the crowd, because they are not listening to Fenn either. They hear what they want to hear.

    • I follow you squat cobbler on this thought.

      I have not seen any comments on this post from the teacher or students.
      Surely we would see some activity by at least one.

      The question does stand out.

      There have been a small few here that have commented on “heavy loads” being “heavy lodes” – rock with gold in it that is visible.

      Where does reality & imagination, stop & start with this man?

      • There is no defined border between the two for Forrest….he melded them harmoniously, long ago.


        You’re reality is his imagination….

        His reality is your imagination….

        This says it all: “No one ever got rich by overestimating the human imagination. f ”

        crazy??…..maybe…loco 🙂

        • As usual you make a great point Loco.

          I feel like I’m in the Fenn Matrix.
          Most of us here have taken the red pill & guess we will have to ride out all the rabbit holes & see how deep they go until…

          Maybe reality is a figment.

          The lines have been crossed many times & he still keeps shuffling the deck to see who’s buying in.

          I love a good Poker game but this has to be the best.

          I’ve shown my hand & just don’t have a Royal Straight Flush & I’m pretty sure that’s not good enough to beat his.

          If you were him, would you play the game the way he does seeing so many hands?

    • @windy city, hey, always wished Forrest would share with us his great Alaskan fishing trip, curious where he went what he saw besides the bear taking his fish!

  14. Everything I read, further confirms where I believe the treasure to be hidden. This Q & A was no exception to that. Everything I read also further confirms that I believe Mr. Fenn and I would get along very well. How I look forward to meeting him.

  15. What I take from this is, Forrest always says what he means and means what he says.

    From the students questions and the blog comments, most of us don’t. 🙂

    • So one potential takeaway that’s a little funny is an elderly gentleman answering middle schooler’s questions, while opening the conversation by pointing out he was “The Little Man Who Wasn’t There”, meaning he was out the window and down the fire escape during his junior high years. 🙂

      When encountering funny of this sort, it must be true!

      • Jeremy –

        Forrest said something like I’m surprised more searchers don’t consider a possible aspect of the poem.

        For me that’s humor. most people just don’t seem to hear the humor in what Forrest wrote and said.

        I’m glad you see and enjoy it. It’s a grand irony that Forrest would speak to middle school kids.

        Aint life funny?


    • No takers on this song being quoted to the kids? It’s a pretty catchy tune… “Hello there, Texas, whatcha say?”

    • No takers on this song being quoted to the kids? I know it’s also a poem, but this is much catchier… “Hello there Texas, whatcha say?”

    • No takers on this song… It was written based on the poem Forrest quoted here, but the song is a lot more catchier.

      “Hello there Texas! Whatcha say?”

  16. Q: when was the last time you went to the place with the treasure was hidden?
    A: A few years ago

    Q: have you ever revisited the place you hid it?
    A: No

    Q: when was the last time you have been to where the treasure is hidden?
    A: A few years ago.

    It was 3 Q’s about that, the first time has a typo, second time asks “hid it” not treasure. The third time looks good! I think he’s trying to be emphatical about something?

  17. Ok so he went to the state where its at but not to where he hid it makes since to me he was in montana a few years ago fishing his faverite spot Told me he was going below hebgan dam that was 2013 or 2014

  18. Does anyone else think the question might not be in ‘order’ received or asked?
    Question #9 “Our final guess is that the treasure may be…”

    I would really like to hear some of the responses of the kids to fenn’s answers of their questions. And if any of the kids are actively involved in searches…

    • “I will try to answer the questions for your students. I received about 30 emails and was a little overwhelmed. That’s why I didn’t respond to more than I did.”

      Ok, after re-reading carefully… It appears that this was not a single e-mail, but several, from each student. So many of the questions may be repeated from different students in different e-mails. I guess ‘order’ received doesn’t really matter.

  19. What the heck kinda poem is that i went up a stair and met a man who wasnt there i bet all them kids had nightmares after reading that lol And he only went up one stair and met a man that wasnt there so he is imagining a man in his head A man at the top of one stair Ohhhhh my brain

    • LOL Diggin,
      Some of the “fairy tales” I heard as a kid scared the crap out of me… Grimm’s fairy tales? Even Alice in wonderland. Here’s a gal taking pills [ that I’m sure mother never gave her ] and made her big and small… that took her to a very strange underground world…I never took an aspirin again until I was 8.

    • I believe he is refuring to his reflection in a mirror,he is not young anymore,not the person he used to be,now he sees an old man,who he wished to go away.remember he wished he was young again

    • I tried, ken. But to be honest… I’d bet, it’s just a pic that Dal found on the internet, like may of the other pics used in SB’s and such. I could be wrong, but I’ll never admit it.

      • Im sure dal added that pic but first two words looks like michael stout on chalk board

      • The text on the Chalkboard says….

        Michael Stout
        Day 1 http:WW2.**/***
        DD 1944 UZO

        Michael Stout is apparently the teacher posting his day 1 curriculum on the board, which discusses the use of submarine targeting optics to calculate range and targeting solutions (UZO). I couldn’t make out the rest of the website, and the asterisks represent the number of characters. It seems two characters, then a slash then three more.

        The photo’s earliest date, that I can find, is back in 2010. It has been rehashed a lot on many articles in websites as an empty classroom image.

    • The writing on the chalkboard is most likely irrelevant.
      The photo was taken north of Tokyo, in 2010. Just a “stock” photo used as an image of an empty classroom.
      Don’t read too much into this…

      Filename – clroom.jpg
      Make – Apple
      Model – iPhone 3G
      Software – QuickTime 7.6.6
      DateTime – 2010:10:04 05:30:30
      DateTimeOriginal – 2010:09:25 10:06:43
      DateTimeDigitized – 2010:09:25 10:06:43

      GPS information: –
      GPSLatitudeRef – N
      GPSLatitude – 35 57 27.6 (35.957667)
      GPSLongitudeRef – E
      GPSLongitude – 139 38 44.4 (139.645667)
      GPSTimeStamp – 10 6 20
      GPSDateStamp – 2010:09:25

  20. I find these posts from Fenn to be very interesting…the content is often not too deep. And then the searchers tear it apart like a school of piranhas…just hoping for a tid bit that reinforces their solve. Even when it clearly does not help anyone the power of the Chase takes over and the juices squirt out everywhere. The Rocky Mountains north of Santa Fe are in for a brisk influx of Fennatics this spring…

    • Ken –

      You said it! You have seen this over a hundred times right?

      One thing is they always doubt that the item it’s what is is presented as. Can’t possibly just be letters from kids. Must be faked by Forrest.


  21. One thing that I find interesting is that no one, here on the blog, has discussed two questions (Actually the same question asked two ways) that Forrest did not want to answer:

    Q. When was the first time you went to the place where you hid the treasure?
    A. I don’t want to answer that question. It is more of a clue than I want to give.

    Q. When did you find this spot to bury the treasure like year?
    A. I have not said that I buried it, and I don’t want to reveal when I discovered the spot. It is too much of a clue.

    Why would knowing when he first found the “Hidey Spot” be too much of a clue.

    Any discussion?


    • Because if he said, “when I was a boy” then it means its in the Yellowstone area.
      If he said, “after I retired from the Air Force” then it most likely means in New Mexico.

      Those would be VERY big clues.

      • that leaves a lot of real estate out of the equation Ironwill…Fenn has many connections to other very pertinent search areas in between those

      • IW:

        Why would it mean in YNP If he found the site as a boy? There are several ways to drive from Temple, TX to YNP. One way, (the longest way) would include driving through all 4 states wouldn’t it? The shortest way would still include Wyoming and Montana. Probably the best roads include Temple to Denver to Cheyenne to YNP. All that would be skipped is NM.

        So, I just can’t buy your YNP as the only choice.

        Can you please explain?

        I find fault with your “After Air Force” = NM also.

        In TFTW, Forrest mentions Landers and Cody, WY in one of his stories. Forrest is on a number of “Boards of Directors” in Wyoming as well. He mentions Billings, MT and Sheridan, WY a couple of times – doesn’t he have a daughter up that way?

        Probably his love of fishing has taken him to Colorado as well… and yes, NM is in play.

        So, I can not buy your “After AF” = NM either.

        Again, can you explain? JDA

        • I’ll try to explain one aspect of what you’re talking about. Let’s say he discovered it as a boy. This most assuredly is talking about the Yellowstone Park area or that School that they stopped at, which was about an hour out of their way.
          Why? Because they lived in Texas and went to Yellowstone in the summers. The only viable place in that time period is Yellowstone, as it’s in the Rockies.
          However, to suggest that Forrest discovered this special and dear spot, as they perhaps pulled over for a potty break on the side of the road in Colorado or New Mexico, and he thought, “This is such a life changing tree I’m peeing behind! I’ll remember this five decades from now… I’m sure of it!”. And then in his 60s , Forrest recalls back to that time as a boy when he pee’d behind some strange pine tree and thought, “Such a dear and special and private place… I would like to die there… on that fifty-year-old urine-soaked ground!”

          I hope that was explanation enough. 😉

        • Donna;

          Missed your post – sorry. Wanting to explore NM as an adult is fine, but it does not exclude the other three states – in my opinion. JDa

    • If he says when he walked from W. Yellowstone to Bozeman will really narrow it down. Or when he went looking for Lewis and Clarke. Other times like when he went into northeast NM to dig out the mammoth skull or when he flew to Laramie, etc… Many people know those years and it will be easy to match.

      • I agree, HMA. But even without solving the poem, the answers are useful. Just one example: if you really think about why the hiding place is dear to him, you may surprise yourself with the answer.

  22. Such an awesome post! It’s so wonderful to see students learning about how to enjoy life, and not be a slave to it….. Treasure the Adventure! (and kudos to the teacher and Forrest for inspiring them)

    • Yes, but what is the question that Forrest thinks they want to ask but aren’t? My guess is… Why do we have to go to school when we could be out looking for treasure 🙂

  23. What a great teacher Karen appears to be.
    A new word for Websters: Fúle.
    Definition : Having fun while learning!

  24. We have a guess about where the treasure is hidden, and we were wondering if you could give us some feedback on it. -OK-
    1. near agua fria peak, New Mexico -interesting-
    2. near Cimarron canyon -be prepared-
    3. Our final guess is that the treasure may be along road 156 in Wyoming.
    “You cannot solve the problem by starting in the middle of the poem. You should start with the first clue and then solve the other eight in order.”

    How do they jump from good enough guesses to a road that is not even in the search area?
    And why was the answer, you cannot solve the problem by starting in the middle of the poem…?

    • well, it is in the search area. Road 156 is broken up into pieces and there are sections further north in the State, that are around 5350 ft in altitude. As for why that example was used and middle of the poem comment… you got me there! I’m just as confused.

      • I will look it up again. The only one I found is over by Pine Bluffs, east of Cheyenne near the Nebraska border.

        • That is the one I was talking about. It is outside the highlighted search area, as far as I can see anything east of Highway 25 is outside in that area.

          • Oh I see… you were going with the highlighted area of the map. Well that is strange lol.

          • One more thing about that, and I don’t have a solve that I’m working on so not necessarily confirmation bias but I see things that keep crossing in front of me and it is this LINCOLN.

            Road 156 gets cut out by Lincoln Highway, the other night with Angel, they met on Palace Avenue and had coffee at Plaza Cafe, that is on Lincoln Ave Santa Fe. The five dollar bill on another scrapbook and a few others that I can’t remember right now. Does Lincoln means anything to anybody?

          • There’s a Lincoln County Colorado, Lincoln, Montana… Lincoln County Wyoming. He talks about Lincoln Memorial in My War for Me. I have no idea why Lincoln is such a key term in this Chase. It doesn’t fit my solution at all. Just weird.

          • IronWill,

            When speaking of Lincoln, please don’t leave out New Mexico!

            Billy the Kid, born Henry McCarty; also known as William H. Bonney (September 17, 1859 – July 14, 1881) was an American Old West gunfighter who participated in New Mexico’s Lincoln County War.

          • Here’s another one… “In another generation or so most of those names will be but an asterisk in the history of a forgotten war; a curiosity to wonder about, like the Lincoln Memorial.” ff

          • Who said that the clues themselves need to be in the search area?

            The ONLY thing he said is within the search area is the chest itself. For example, canyon down could be the Grand Canyon.

          • I agree and I’ve been on that page for awhile now, as for the Grand Canyon, know this, he once considered hiding the treasure in AZ.

    • Actually its quite simple, after you finish part 1 in Wyoming you leave Wyoming and head to New Mexico for par 2. Remember the map of new Mexico with gold on it? Also the post titled “the great circle route” I’m not taking the biat though.

    • Oz10—-

      I read every post looking for a comment on that exact point.

      Our final guess is that the treasure may be along road 156 in Wyoming. Thank you for taking time out of your day to help us in our class!
      You cannot solve the problem by starting in the middle of the poem. You should start with the first clue and then solve the other eight in order.

      I do have to say I find this question and answer extremely intriguing indeed.

      • I go back to his comment about people looking for the blaze (you can’t start in the middle of the poem). The blaze is telling you where the treasure is, so they are probably in close proximity to each other. The kids are guessing about the location of the treasure, so are basically making the same mistake as the blaze folks are – they’re starting in the middle of the poem. Hope that made sense.

    • More oddities… In a previous occasion ff was asked about the blaze and his answer was you cannot start in the middle of the poem. That made sense.

      In this exchange with the darn middle schoolers it seems that they were pointing at places pulled from the poem. I think it is safe to say that -agua fria peak, NM- was referring to WWWH, it is also safe to say that -cimarron canyon-, even very recently, was been attached to hoB. Actually cimarron canyon could also be -take it in the canyon down- from agua fria peak. It is not far, but maybe too far to walk.

      Now, from there to say ‘the treasure may be along road 156’, to what part of the poem were they referring to? is there something on Stanza 3 that calls for a road or WY?

      The big question is, if they did start with a WWWH why where they still not at the beginning of the poem? Does that confirm that WWWH is not the place to start?

  25. The fact that Forrest is unwilling to divulge even the era in which he discovered his secret hiding spot is a clue in another itself, in my opinion. Let’s consider two possibilities:

    1. He found the spot during his adult years: this really isn’t much of a clue. Forrest traveled the full Rocky Mountain range during his adult years so we don’t gain insight from the statement.
    2. He found the spot during his childhood years: this is quite telling, in my opinion. During his childhood years, he spent the majority of his time i(n the Rocky Mountains) in the Yellowstone area. Now that is considerable insight.

    • Extemp:

      As I noted in a post above, he had to get from Texas to YNP. He certainly passed through Wyoming. Possibly traveled through Colorado (Cheyenne to Denver route) – he could have even traveled into NM (Denver to Albuquerque) then Albuquerque to his home in Texas. Travel was slow back in the 30’s – lots of stops – lots of places that he could have discovered, and that became important to him. JDA

      • I remember stories my dad used to tell me of places he went while working road construction back in the late 30’s and early 40’s. For instance, traveling from Texas to Colorado and going through Raton Pass New Mexico. I would think the Fenn’s would have traveled that route to YNP.

    • He did tell us this…
      “Why did you hide the treasure where you hid it”?
      The answer is in my book, TTOTC.

      • The book contains the poem…
        “All of the information you need to find the treasure is in the poem. The chapters in my book have very subtle hints but are not deliberately placed to aid the seeker. Good luck in the search. f”

        But is there more needed to be know of?
        Does a searcher need to be at each clue… see what fenn refers to as a clue, even if it can be deciphered beforehand. If so, are the clues needed to be used in a way other than just locating them?

        • I remember watching a video of FF speaking in an interview. He said when thinking of words to use in his poem he would look up the definition of a word so to be correct in its usage. Example he used was- what is the definition of “Few”. All we need is the poem he always says and it appears we all are trying to figure out the meaning of his clue words used. So, I would say yes; clue words need to be used in a way other than just locating them..IMO. I think the simplicity of it all has been made complex by so many ideas , thoughts and imaginations. I drive myself mentally crazy when I come back to this poem treasure focus and then forget about it for a couple of months then come back here and read again. Another year goes by and I check to see if there is a Groundhogs shadow once again.

          • Alset –

            Let me preface with the statement that, “I have not yet found the treasure chest.”

            That having been said, All I can say is that I have looked up almost every single word in the poem. This has resulted in hundreds, and hundreds of definitions. Some common usage definitions, some archaic definitions, and some obscure definitions. For me, and me alone, the challenge has been to sift through these hundreds and hundreds of definitions, and to come out with the ones that I feel confident are the definitions that Forrest meant when he used a particular word. Have I made the right choices? I hope so. By choosing the word definitions that I chose, I was able to move from one clue to the next without “force fitting” anything.

            The cake will rise, or it won’t. It will be delicious, or not. Have I used all of the correct ingredients, in the correct order, and in the correct amount? I guess that I will know this spring. JDA

          • JDA,

            Alset –

            Let me preface with the statement that, “I have not yet found the treasure chest.”

            I chuckled at that sentence. There is allot of healthy critique battles here but I don’t engage in that exorcise . I choose honor over judgment of ideas.

            I can interpret Shakespeare and Goethe far better than this poem lol.

            Battles can be won but no one wins a war.

            I hope you achieve the find , JDA.

          • Alset;

            In no way was my preface meant as a challenge. All I was attempting to say was that, Since I have not found the TC, what I was about to say, very well could be wrong…to take it with a grain of salt.

            If you interpreted it as me being adversarial, I apologize. JDa

          • JDA,

            Oh my goodness! I didn’t suggest you were being adversarial..too funny. I was joking about what appeared to me to be a pre-defensive preface:

            Let me preface with the statement that, “I have not yet found the treasure chest.”

            That’s all.

            I said with humorous intentions.

            Cheers! 🙂

          • Glad that it was said with humorous intentions! Y E A

            The English language language is perplexing at times, to be sure. Add to that, the fact that inflections are MOST difficult to insert in text, and where are we? CONFUSED at times. No wonder we can not figure out a “simple” poem. JDA

          • JDA,

            Well said exactly, what you mean per inflections. It is a full moon eclipse tomorrow no less haha. I am going to post in 9 clues something about ” I can keep my secret where. A hint of riches new and old”. , I would be curious of your thoughts.

          • Hi JDA — I suspect we all have little nits with our solutions that we aren’t 100% happy about, but that we’ve accepted because the remaining evidence is sufficiently solid. In your case, I would think that one of the features of your solution that might cause you some nagging doubt is its dependence on an obscure word definition — something that you had to locate in a dictionary.

            As you know, Forrest has never mentioned a dictionary as one of his “good research materials,” just the poem, TTOTC, maps and Google Earth. I’m sure you know by heart Fenn’s lengthy quote about head pressures and foot pounds, etc., so in light of that don’t you think having to extract an archaic word meaning from a dictionary would fall into that category? Please know that my intent is not to disparage your solution, but rather to get a better understanding of your decision processes and justifications.

          • I remembered the example word wrong when ff mention about what words mean and sometimes we have to look up meanings of words and that we use words in the english language erroneously. The example word he metioned was “several .Sometimes he looks words up for their meaning. This is in Moby Dickens Book Shop video of Q&A at 47:50 he says this.


            So, to look up the meaning of a word (dictionary) is not a form of research for solving the poem but it is way to help understand a words use and meaning by the correct definition of the word used.

          • Zap;

            You sure seem concerned about my solve – How about yours?

            Forrest once said: ”There are nine clues in the poem, and the clues are in consecutive order. If you want to find the treasure chest – you have my book there – I’ll tell you how to do it. Read the book just normally … the poem and the rest of the book, and then go back and read the poem 6, 8, 10 times – study every line, every word. Then after you do that, read the book again, slowly, with the idea of looking for clues or hints, that are in the book that will help you follow the clues. You can find the chest with just the clues, but there are hints in the book that will help you with the clues.” f

            Take special not of this part – – study every line, every word. Why would he say that, if we were not supposed to pay attention to EVERY word?

            If Forrest thought enough to look up the meaning of words then maybe so should we. If you are not paying attention to EVERY word, and its EVERY meaning, in my opinion you will NEVER figure it out.

            Because I have found the meanings of almost every word in the poem, some common, some archaic and some obscure, I PROBABLY stand a FAR better chance of solving it than you. Just my humble opinion. JDA

          • Well, JDA, despite my best efforts to assuage your concerns about the purpose of my post, you went on the defensive. Again. But you did actually answer my question, even if it was accompanied with a wee bit of venom. You could have just said, “I’m okay with depending on a dictionary or even a thesaurus, because although he didn’t explicitly single out these sources as good research materials, he did say about the poem ‘study every line, every word…’ I took that literally: how do you study a word? You look it up!”

            That’s a perfectly reasonable interpretation of Fenn’s words. I don’t happen to agree that a dictionary will play any role in solving Forrest’s puzzle, but at least I now understand and appreciate the reason that you do. Good luck!

          • Zap;

            You said, “Well, JDA, despite my best efforts to assuage your concerns about the purpose of my post, you went on the defensive.”

            Zap, to me, you made no effort to assuage my concerns.

            What I read was a straight-forward attempt – by you – to put doubts in my head regarding my solve. Guess what? It ain’t happening guy. As I said, How about YOUR solve? How goes it? Got it ALL figured out? If you have, and are confident in it, you wouldn’t be spending time worrying about me and my solve…But Thanks anyway. JDA

          • Zap;

            Since you proposed a better response than the one I gave, let me propose a “Kinder” way of you asking me about why I chose to use a dictionary as a tool.

            “JD I am curious, why have you chosen to rely so much on Dictionaries, when Forrest never mentioned them as a tool? – Just curious. Good luck Zap ”

            Wouldn’t that have been a bit softer and kinder?

            We all know the story about the guy that comes up and pats you on the back- – – looking for a place to put the knife. That is how I felt with your question Just sayin’ JDAA

          • Wow JDA,
            Can I pull the knife out & stick it in the other side?

            I think a dictionary use is elementary considering these are words in the poem.

            Except for “the wood”.
            It’s 2 words……

          • Maybe I should have been clearer,
            Do those 2 words mean one word? “the wood”.

            If that’s the case then I see your reverse thinking.

          • JDA — for your sake I hope you’re not as bad at reading Fenn as you are at reading me.

            “What I read was a straight-forward attempt – by you – to put doubts in my head regarding my solve.”

            No, that was not my intent at all. I was simply curious to know how you justified dependence on a dictionary, and you actually provided a decent argument. That’s all there was to it. I don’t care about your solution or whether you have doubts about it or not. That’s your own cross to bear.

            Why did I single you out? Because I’ve lost track of how many times you’ve told us all how important it was to discover the right, obscure definition of a word (I believe it was “quickly”), and it seemed clear that your entire solution depended heavily upon it. I’m curious about ~why~ people think the things they do, not specifically what those things are.

            “As I said, How about YOUR solve? How goes it? Got it ALL figured out?”

            My solution is just fine, thanks.

          • Ah JDA,
            I now see the reverse engineering you use to devise the word that is key.

            He never said it was one word in the poem.
            He just stated “a word that is key”.
            But that could be any word like “focus”.

          • JDA –

            Are you having doubts about your solution? I seem to remember that you will be searching as soon as the weather clears. So are you still on the right path or just taking a vacation?

          • HMA

            At my age – I do not care much for vacations. What ever gave you the idea I have doubts about my solution? JDA

          • JDA –

            “At my age – I do not care much for vacations.”

            I know plenty of folks in their 70’s and 80’s that still enjoy getting away and taking a vacation. Don’t let your age be a factor.

            “What ever gave you the idea I have doubts about my solution?”

            You’ve taken 10+ trips to the area you believe the treasure chest resides without finding it. You don’t think it could be in a place that f has written or talked about. Maybe I’m wrong, but I do remember him saying things like, the finder of the chest will go with confidence. The path will be direct for the person that is certain. No subterfuge. No red herrings. The clues are contiguous. The person that figures out the clues will walk right to it..

            I know you have “reasons” why the chest is not in your hands after many searches and just wonder if possibly it might be because the clues in the poem are different than the clues in your mind.

          • Zaphod ~ “As you know, Forrest has never mentioned a dictionary as one of his “good research materials,” just the poem, TTOTC, maps and Google Earth.”

            Ok- that is correct for ‘that’ one comment fenn stated.

            Zaphod ~ “I don’t happen to agree that a dictionary will play any role in solving Forrest’s puzzle,…” {In a second post}

            ANY? really?

            Here’s another comment;
            SF podcast approx.11 mins.
            “I looked up words and definitions of words and changed them, went back and rebooted… it turned out exactly like I wanted…” {Talking about the poem}

            Fenn also stated in a Q&A, {in part}
            “Dear Mr. Fenn,
            The definitions of words seem to interest you. What dictionary, and year of dictionary, do you use for looking up words? ~ wordsmith
            Interesting that you would ask that Mr./Mz Wordsmith.
            I don’t use dictionaries anymore. I just type the word in Google for a faster response. It’s fun to make up words and play with different spellings…”
            “The poem in my book is something that I changed over and over again. When you read the poem it looks like just simple words there. But I guarantee you that I worked on that. I felt like an architect drawing that poem.”

            You may not agree Zap… but for me, that is more than a tap on the forehead… that’s a 2×4 clunk on the noggin.

          • Hi Seeker: if you want to depend on a dictionary to help solve the poem, you’re welcome to it. It played zero part in my solution. Poem plus map was all I needed. Occam’s Razor.

          • Hi Colokid;

            How goes it? All is good on my end –
            Just waiting for warmer weather – Hope to be out in time to win my bet. If not, You will enjoy the beer I am sure.

            183 days from Oct 5 = ????

            That figures out to be April 5. I think I am OK. JDA

          • Hi Colokid — perhaps JDA will have an epiphany (oooh, where’s that darn dictionary?) and change states in the next 6 weeks. If not, then you can’t lose. Which case did you ask for if you win the bet?

          • Zap;

            As a matter of fact, I had an epiphany this very morning. Thanks to your nudging, I went back to my trusty dictionary, and spent several hours re-looking up several words. WOW, I found a number of things that I had overlooked. I am even more excited now than befor. And no, I will NEVER leave Wyoming. JDA

          • Hi JDA — well, I guess I’m glad to have, er, “helped”? Though I think your time would be more productively spent looking at maps and cross-referencing with the poem. But I think you’re probably locked into Wyoming, and even Fenn telling you the treasure wasn’t in Wyoming would probably not deter you. It *is* a beautiful state, so there are certainly worse places you could spent your free time. I’ll be there myself in four days hitting the slopes. JH has really gotten dumped on this winter.

          • @Zap…

            you said…
            ” But I think you’re probably locked into Wyoming, and even Fenn telling you the treasure wasn’t in Wyoming would probably not deter you.”

            When did Mr F take Wy. out of play…?

          • Rickinflorida: you misapprehend me. All four states are in play. I was just suggesting that even *if* Forrest told everyone that Indulgence wasn’t hidden in Wyoming, it probably wouldn’t deter JDA (and many others) from still searching there.

            I predict that even if the treasure chest is found and Forrest announces that it has been, many people won’t believe it or will think it’s some trick and will keep on searching. It has happened in past treasure hunts, and this one probably will be no different.

          • Zap ~”Hi Seeker: if you want to depend on a dictionary to help solve the poem, you’re welcome to it. It played zero part in my solution. Poem plus map was all I needed. Occam’s Razor.”

            I think that’s hilarious!
            Occam’s Razor 101.

            Early on in the chase we had a book of memoirs that contained a poem… Then over the years the Author makes comments such as, read the poem read the book.
            Another comment being, GE and / or a good map… funny how many skip right over the And/Or part… looking for that magical “map”

            Yet another comment, a comprehensive knowledge of geography might help… hmm, might as well toss that one aside as it wasn’t mentioned with GE ~ map ~ or the book, right?
            And still more comments that tells us; he looked up words and definitions changing the poem over and over { a process of 15 yrs on and off }. But heck, he didn’t mention that with book or the map or that electronic GE thingy, sooo, in the waste can with that too.

            LOL… Forget about us knowing anything. That poor Occam kitty used up all 9 lives trying to figure why folks pick and choice some comments that make their brilliant solve glow gold, and dismiss all the others. Oh right… it must be that 85% – 15% truth serum at work again.

            Too funny…
            The only “depends” I see, is holding a lot of______. Dang, it’s gonna be one very disappointing spring for some.

          • I like that question… made me think. lol be afraid…

            Why in a poem that seemingly explains how to get to a spot, has a question with an answer[s]?
            My thoughts have been drifting to different theories on this over the years… one reason I read the poem in a different manner than most…

            Example; could “I” in stanza one be a different “I” in stanza five.

            Look at it this way… AS “I” have gone alone in there “and” with “my” treasures bold…
            Why is treasures plural? there’s only one treasure [ even if it contains many pieces ] In line 2 of stanza five “trove” is not plural. As well as answer[s] is plural… are the answer[s] of another before fenn? Are the treasures told about in stanza one of another that was collected later ?

            In one of my theories “I” represents knowledge of self, or in this case, simply humans to the new word. Things fenn collected throughout his life { arrow heads, Clovis points etc. } Those treasure[s] were brought to the “new word” from the “old world” and that would definitely have been a bold journey. So is “I” another who ‘keeps his/their secret where’? { in this case when an ancient died and to be found thousands of years later… treasure meaning; possessions }
            The hint of riches would be of knowledge new and old, as in dual meanings New world from Old world journey and past and present. Knowledge of self… Us.

            So, maybe to answer your question “Why” he hid the chest? Could it be the same as why we look for knowle*ge of When, Where, Why, and How we got where we are [ missing piece of information]?
            If this thought is remotely true… can “In there” and “secret where” in stanza one be read as…In there in time and where in time?
            So “begin it where…” might mean, where in time, making the poem in past tense for all of stanzas 1 2 3…

            LOL, you asked…

          • But Seeker, the question wasn’t “why” he hid it, it was why he hid it where it is.
            And treasures could be his memories.

          • Opps, Just kick me eagle, eventually I’ll get it right…lol
            Why he hid it ‘where’ he hid it? Heck if I know. Maybe the Bio in the chest will explain that.

            The again… maybe “tired and weak” gives the reason…

          • Eagles-

            You say, ” the question wasn’t “why” he hid it, it was why he hid it where it is.”

            I think that the answer to your question is found at the waterfall in “My War for Me”.


          • I believe that Forrest has already answered why he hid the treasure where he did, and has done so many times. He hid it where he did because the place was dear to him.

            It’s a place that is loved by him, a place that is treasured and respected. I think that place is out of the ordinary and can only be found by following the clues in his poem. It is not the everyday run of the mill vacationing site (State and National Parks), it may be close by one of these places but not in them.
            The question is not why he hid it there but why is this spot is so dear to him. What happened there or what made this spot so special for him?

            Is this a place where he found his sprit or was born again. A place where it all made sense to him. What would make a place dear to you? Answer that question (what makes it dear to him) and you’re on the way to finding the treasure.

          • Manowar, I believe the answer f gave was “the answer is in the TTOTC book.
            Can you tell me where in the book he tells us that the place was dear to him.

          • eaglesabound,

            Yes I could, but that would be giving it away. It’s up to you and others to find it. Sorry.

          • This thread has been on my mind for a while…The mystery behind why Fenn hid the treasure “where” he did has nagged at me since I first started this Chase.
            Folks have generalized and said…”…because the place was dear to him.” And the litany of other ideas could stretch the NS length of the 4 search states and still keep going.
            My point is not to knock any ideas…but to bring the topic back up as a valid measuring stick while deciphering what the poem is trying to say. On the surface…this Q seems just average, with great wording. Fenn’s answer is what makes it more than that. Fenn comes right out and says “The answer is in my book, TTOTC.” It seems singular in nature and invokes an idea other than a generalization, especially given his answer about “what” was his favorite thing about the hidey.

        • I have reason to believe that the latter is correct. The first clue is a map….of sorts.
          One must wonder why ‘it’ goes away/disappears when and where it does. Poetically speaking that is….i imagine.

  26. Can you describe the first and last time you visited your secret fishing spot?
    Yes, I went in my car both times and the sun was shining.

    both times in his car,so not as a child.

    is the secret fishing spot , his special place though ?

    • I thought that too–that he recognized the kid meant “hiding” but wrote “fishing”. Then I read his preamble over–that he answered the questions as offered–and decided he answered the “fishing” version, with a delighted chuckle. “That’ll keep’em busy.”

  27. I don,t think that the state of New Mexico can be ruled out. Place that he has been to could just referring to the Rocky Mountains .What do you all think?

  28. “are the clues needed to be used in a way other than just locating them?”

    IMO, locating all the clues is sufficient, but using them together with imagination and FF’s markers makes pinning down the final few easier, if that makes any sense.

    I’m a little surprised that no one has yet married this Q&A…:
    “What inspired your passion for art?”
    “I have no passion for art. It was only a business to me.”
    …with the recent eBay tease. IMO this was FF re-leveling the playing field after some $*it for brains disturbed something important. 😉 To check this theory, you might want to read SB105 VERY carefully.

    • Sorry, meant to post the above in answer to Seeker’s question in another thread, but it’ll do here since it references the Q&A from FF.

    • Ron, it’s mea culpa, I’m afraid. No one else to blame but yours truly. Sounds like you’ve also got a similar solution…?

      • Ive got nothing more than a self-confirming hunch. You have any eyedeer what those duck looking things are that keep appearing?
        Or the lincoln thing?
        Lincoln logs?
        And are the answers he already knows the A word which is key?
        So many questions and even more snow.

        • Good questions, Ron. I’m afraid I don’t really have any answers for you, but I don’t think the word “answers” is key, although it’s interesting that it contains the cardinal points – hadn’t noticed that before.

  29. Original Q: Does the 4 line in each stanza have a significance to when you hid the treasure.

    Trying to figure out how f read this question and how f he gave an answer to it –

    Option 1: Does the 4(th) line in each stanza have a significance to when you hid the treasure.

    Option 2: Does the 4 line(s) in each stanza have a significance to when you hid the treasure.

    I don’t think it ultimately makes a difference, I suspect f zeroed in on the word “when”; to bad the question didn’t use the word “where”.

    • JCM,
      That was a difficult question to understand what was in the mind of the kid who asked.
      I wonder if the question might have related to; ‘the’ 4 line[s] in each stanza… as, all 24 lines… to mean [when] a date? 24th day of a given month?
      lol, the possibilities of what was meant could go on and on… But I feel for the kid… I wish I could change / reworded some of my questions as well.

  30. mr. forrest says,I can keep my secret where,and hint of riches new and old. If he’s keeping secret where(place,location,wherever).he”s got a secret place,so he’s not telling,how we gonna find that place,he’s keeping.then the poem goes on to say begin,you wise,found blaze,take chest,go in peace.then a Question,why must I go?he alone knows the answer,he’s not telling,he done it ,tired and weak .hear/listen,effort/worth,cold,brave/wood .I give,title to gold,title to title,gold to gold. a game of the minds,guess who wins.the dice is not rolling my way,I get snake eyes many times I think i’m on to something,then get shot down again .In There,where,here,somewhere,anywhere,someplace.he went somewhere with his treasure to keep his treasures a secret,where you can’t find it,cause we can’t figure out the poem,A Tale of mysteries,A dream,fantasy,says he didn’t name the got me ,i’m lost like forrest got lost.when you need something ,and can’t find it ,isn’t it frustrating.

  31. Why did you hid that treasure forrest?,so kids can get off the games and out in nature with their family and have fun . experience the great outdoors,its beautiful.stop and smell the roses ,time is so short.breath,live,not work,work work and a person can enjoy some of the pleasures I’ve had in life,pay bills,go on vacationetc.just paying back,what god has given,say hello,at least you know you did your part of the unto others as you would have them do unto you.the golden rule.I do this golden rule.Darn,mr. forrest why do you have to make this so hard. I don”t see anyone getting the answer.and its probably right there in front of my eyes in the poem,look,I still love ya ,even tho this is hard.

  32. Forrest has always maintained that the poem is all you need to find the treasure and there are subtle hints in the book. After 4 years of research and searching, I have limited my solve to an area close to YNP. The reason why I have settled into this search area is because of one line in the poem: “I can keep my secret where”. In the book he says that two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead. All the people that shared his Yellowstone summers are gone to include his father, mother, brother, sister, and good friend Donny all of which most likely visited the special place that Forrest hid the treasure. So he can keep the secret because all of these people are dead. I am sharing this because someone needs to find the treasure. I have run into people in the Yellowstone area that were also searching for the treasure. Why they were searching right next to a well travelled pathway, I don’t know but they were in an area I like, they just needed to get off the beaten path. He has recommended that we look at the BIG picture so another reason why I am only going to search in the YNP area is because where else in the 4 state search area is there a bigger “where warm waters halt” than Yellostone that has a huge caldera with countless geysers that are spitting up millions of gallons of boiling water that turns warm while floating in the air? There are also hundreds of hot springs where hot water turns warm all over Yellowstone. Guess what, all of this hot water that turns warm ends up halting somewhere? Let’s find this treasure and make history!

    • We are seriously on the same page. I have one search under my belt in the Lewis&Clark vicinity. Perhaps we could compare notes and help avoid dead ends. (omit the dashes in the name)

  33. You know, spring is around the corner. I am hoping some good hard facts to nail the poem down. Forrest gets mail has some useful info, I just have to sort it all out.

    • Belle
      There is a bunch to to sort out! It’s great fun wishing and wondering maybe we’ll catch a whopper? A couple of us are going fishing this weekend for some white bass below Guntersville Dam in Alabama this weekend. Spring isn’t far away and summer will be here before we know it.


  34. Why did you marry?

    I’m not saying Fenn worte this but that’s a really famous and significant line in literature.

    It comes from A Christmas Carol. While talking with his nephew about whether or not Christmas provides value Scrooge blurts out that question.

    A Christmas Carol and this scene in particular is Dickens weighing in on the philosophical debate of the time. When society grows and population expands do we suffer for it? Are we better of holding back or bursting forth?

    And the workhouses? The treadmill? Best do it and decrease the surplus population.

    Scrooge is wealthy right? Hardly.
    Fezziwig had 15 employees and Scrooge only one. He lives in 2 chambers in his former partners mansion.

    Why did you marry?
    Because I fell in love.

    • Lug—-

      That is so interesting that you shared that. I won’t go into detail, but I have suspected for a while that “A Christmas Carol” has something to do with the poem.

      I have been trying to fit all of this together. But I appreciate your sharing what you did. Thanks.

      • Hey Sparrow –

        I’m glad you like that. I don’t believe Fenn outs clues in these letters but I cannot ignore that line.

        Why did you marry?
        That’s an odd phrasing in 2017 right?
        A kid would ask why did you get married.

        I will look forward to hearing more about your Christmas Carol ideas!


  35. Two thoughts to reconcile:
    1. Catfish – in the past, at least up to now, I understood Mr. Fenn to be a fly fisherman. Makes me wonder if he noodled catfish or tickled trout.
    2. Hid in the summer versus “your effort will be worth the cold”. Wondering if higher elevation is more important than first I thought.

  36. I can’t believe how much Canyon of the Ancients in sw Colorado match with the poem! Discovered in 2000 so fits old and new to a T. Many ruins are a short walk and haven’t been excavated. Please touch I am responsible! 6,000 plus ruins discovered since 2000. Forrest would of been very interested in this place around the time he hid the T. Just my humble opinion.

    • AMP,

      Canyon of the Ancients is an interesting place. It is not my area that I am focused on there in Colorado, though I can see many possibilities there. Colorado is very tangible to the poem in many areas. You and I seem to be the rare ones on this blog interested in Colorado.

      • Seems to me that area is far but not too far from his home and hasn’t got much interest. It was discovered in 2000 and probably peaked his interest as it was 10yrs old at the time of his hide.

        • AMP,

          Everywhere is possible and no place can be dismissed by anyone in any of the 4 states. The Canyon of the Ancients( COTA) was discovered a bit late for when he picked his spot for the chest. Unless perhaps ff knew of the COTA before officially discovered and it is possible it is his special place. If the poem flows for you there then it is possible. My area is not all that far from there really. In Colorado there is a 60 km radius of many strong potentials. More than any state IMO.

        • Amp,

          About what you said about it maybe too far from where he lives; I don’t think that really applies nor is it that far. He fly’s planes and it is closer than the other states less New Mexico only. He flew, rented a car and walked to his spot. COTA is not really far in those terms. He said he didn’t have to worry about gas for his plane to think where he would land until about 600-700 miles in the air. He did allot of takeoffs and not plan where to land until in the air adventures. Then he would just look at his map if he saw a town he was interested in going to; look at his map and find out if the airport had car rentals there. Even in that scenario he could also drive there in 6 hours from his house. SW,W,NW Colorado is just a plausible as anywhere.

          • I can’t help but notice now stunning that area looks. Really is a special place for everyone. Those mountains ne’er Ironton Co. are something else too. I never knew all that was there till now. Ty FF

    • aMp … congrats on having enough imagination to spotlight an area almost never mentioned by posters here, many of whom still cling to some stale solution involving Yellowstone.

      Although Canyon of the Ancients isn’t where I’m focused now, I have considered it in the past. And it does indeed have a lot going for it as a resting place for the treasure chest, with its abundant archeology and relative proximity to Santa Fe.

      Canyon of the Ancients is one of several hundred locations in the Rocky’s that rarely if ever get mentioned by posters.

      Ken (in Texas)

    • Canyons of the Ancients appears to be “out of bounds” according to the map from TFTW.

      It seems to be outside of the “highlighted region of the map”. Perhaps only partially outside.

      As I was typing this… I noticed that the word “highlihted” is spelled incorrectly on the map.

      Perhaps I should get zaphod’s permission to look up the word in the dictionary [God forbid]. 😉

          • It’s amazing how you and others are able to pull up that kind of information. Those types of things are unknown to me. It was interesting to see the file. Thank you.

      • fennatical,
        I have also noticed that if you search for ” The Wall Map ” here on Dals blog you will notice that the spelling of “highlighted” is corrected on the wall map version… humm… good eye Fennatical …. have a great day … see ya

        • Also Fennatical, searching ” Map” here on Dals blog. If you look at ” The Map” the word answers in the poem is spelled “answer” and on the wall map version it is spelled “answer(s)”… a lot of typos for a company like benchmark… see ya

    • aMp: I have been to Canyons of the Ancients many times for hiking, exploring, and mountain biking and am very familiar with the area. It was not “discovered” in 2000 but was designated as a National Monument in 2000. The general area of the current Canyons of the Ancients NM has been well known to locals for generations; looting/grave digging/running cattle have been common practice since the white man arrived. The NM was an effort to save what was left. Local ranchers have run their cattle up and down those canyons for decades, and when the cattle sought shelter in the ruins they destroyed them. Much of the archeological significance of the area has been lost due to local indifference and difficulty in enforcing antiquities laws. Although this area is special in many ways, I personally don’t believe FF would have wanted to rest here in eternity. It was picked clean by looters long ago.

  37. I received this E-mail today:
    “Sparrow— why isn’t Forrest answering questions from rich kids or poor kids? Why is he only answering these students questions?” –Billy

    My response: “Billy, please pay more attention in English class. Forrest is answering questions from a Middle School Class, not questions from a Middle Class School. Thanks, Sparrow”.

  38. A place that is dear to him. We’ve heard it over and over, but “what if” he is spelling that wrong? Dear being ‘deer”? A place that is “deer to him.

    Sense he says it is in just a place, maybe “deer” has something to do with it. A deer lake, landscape, street name, valley, city, whatever. I’m sure the spot is “dear” to him, but maybe in Fenn fashion, there is more to it. And I know, then why isn’t it capitalized? It’s up to the writer, and f doesn’t walk the norm. He says get back in the box, but his “box” is so far out there as to be way outside the proverbial “box”, so getting back into his box is still outside.

    Either way, it’s noteworthy to think “deer”.

  39. Hi Seeker — moving the thread lower to make it easier to post replies. You seem to think that I’m picking and choosing which of Forrest’s comments to pay attention to and which ones to ignore. I don’t ignore or dismiss ANYTHING the man writes or says, which is not something a lot of searchers can say truthfully. Here are some features of my solution. I challenge you to find something below that is contradicted by Forrest’s words. (Just to emphasize: this list applies ONLY to my solution. The chest’s actual location may have its own ideas.)

    1. it *requires* only the poem and a couple maps
    2. all nine clues are somewhere between 5000′ and 10,200′
    3. no structures are involved with any clue
    4. no mines, graveyards, caves or dams are involved
    5. the blaze is a single object
    6. the proper WWWH cannot be identified without a “word that is key”
    7. the chest is not in a dangerous place
    8. the chest is not underwater
    9. searchers have been within 500′ of the location, but did not know it
    10. no specialized knowledge required (i.e. no head pressures, foot pounds, acre feet, bible verses, Latin, cubic inches, icons, fonts, graphs, formulas, curved lines, etc.) To Fenn’s long list I will add: no knowledge of history, famous people, foreign languages, or obscure dictionary definitions.
    11. hints can be found all over TTOTC, but they aren’t helpful to a searcher who hasn’t already solved the clues they’re associated with
    12. there are many hints in TFTW, but same caveat as in #11
    13. there are hints in dozens of the Scrapbooks, but same caveat as #11
    14. the poem is more than the simple words that make it up (“When you read the poem it looks like just, just simple words there. But I guarantee you that I worked on that. I felt like an architect drawing that poem.”)
    15. a comprehensive knowledge of geography is helpful in identifying WWWH
    16. if you alter the poem in any way, you will very likely destroy one or more clues

    • Zap, I only have a problem with four of those. But, I’m not Seeker, so who cares, right. The other 12 I feel your right on with.

      Is that 500′ actual distance or elevation? 6000′ to 6500′ could be a lot more than 500′ as far as distance is concerned.

      • FF had said 200′ and 500′ I think. Either distance, it has always intrigued me how he knew the distance from the treasure they were. Sure, it was by description and said locations in emails to him. I just wonder what they said to him. What was it that gave him such a distinction of distance? I think he said they solved the first 2 clues then walked right past it. That being said, I could mean all clues in the poem are withing 200′-500′ of chest. Interesting piece of comments from FF. Could be in height. Sometimes 200′ to 500′ in height away may take a bit time to get there by the way it takes to get there in height.

      • Hi Charlie: hey, 12/16 ain’t bad. 😉 Regarding the 500′, it’s ground distance for me. But I think it’s wise to consider the 3rd dimension as being just as valid. And as with anything Fenn, “within 500 feet” (or 200) can mean many things. I take you’re meaning: searchers could be within 500′ of the correct *altitude* of the treasure, but even a 5% grade could put you almost half a mile off the right spot. But this may fall into the category of being deliberately deceptive, which Forrest has claimed he wouldn’t do.

    • Zap,

      Just a note of encouragement to you and my fellow searchers – being cognizant of and keeping the “additional information” in front of one’s self as one ponders the puzzle, helps keep one’s mind from wandering down rabbit holes – usually. 🙂

      Good luck with your search!

    • Those kids…asking better questions than us, almost like they have inside knowledge. What subject would that teacher have this under? I think all are covered one way or another. “Bighorn ring a bell”, lol, nice…Just drawing a tangent…

      • Charlie you said… “What subject would that teacher have this under?”. I’m guessing the “Comprehensive knowledge of Geography” subject… They teach that in Middle school don’t they?

      • Charlie-
        I’ve visited a few classrooms that were using the poem..and I’ve Skyped to a couple others. In the classes I visited the poem was used for several different studies…
        For instance in one class it was being used by the English teacher as the students studied poetry, it was also being used by the geography teacher and also by the GIS instructor…In another school there was a treasure hunting club that was trying to figure it out…
        In Michigan one of the stories the Michigan Department of Education uses to test students in English Comprehension is a story about Forrest and the Treasure Hunt…

        Educators are finding many ways to use the poem and the story because it interest’s kids…

        • Wow, that is very interesting. I’m sure these educators wouldn’t use info from something that is fake or just not true. Puts a muzzle on all those “non-believers”. And, is good to hear. Just hate to admit these middle school students ask better questions than I’ve asked myself. This would be a good History subject once you get into all the different aspects of f’s life. I guess sometimes he gets things right…

  40. Does Bighorn Canyon,WY ring any bells in your past?
    Or does Black Canyon,CO ring any bells?

    Those 2 places are exactly on a vertical line on the map, ring any bells?

    • IMO, anywhere around there in Colorado is the likeliest chest location. Anywhere from the Black Canyon , south ,south west or west from there is likely. I think it is the area my search would be if and when I search . But mostly in the main people are thinking and searching elsewhere in other sates. I think this is why it hasn’t been found;less concentration of searchers in Colorado.

  41. “What Is Blaze?
    Anything that stands out.”

    Stands out of what?

    Doesn’t belong?
    Out of place?

    Where are you curious hobbit?
    One of these things is not like the others.

    Is it standing & not sitting or laying down?
    It’s obviously not “sitting in”.


        • Do you guys know Osborn blazed the trail through fountain flats with wood posts all the way up to queens laundry and just below firehole flats. He “blazed” the trail but never completed it before he retired/left that office. I’d bet there is still one or two of them around there somewhere? And did anyone notice the walking stick leaning against the outside corner of QL? Maybe someone found the end of there trail? That corner could be an arrow pointing in the direction of his swimming hole. There is a hill in between.

    • sorry Jake, been a bit distracted designing race replicas of classic muscle cars on Forza Horizon 3 lately (Richard Petty, Dick Landy and my personal fav, Smokey Yunick’s ’57 Chevy)
      – ’tis great fun 🙂

      i took the ‘stands out’ remark to be a geographical reference (small mountain, cliff-face, rocky overhang, limestone strike, poss even an unusual patch of forestry?)

      ..even if it ‘stands out’ in ones mind or imagination, surely that image can only be bourne from a natural phenomenon of some type that stands out from its environment or literally stands out of the Earth.

      but DEF not a river though – hope this helps 😛

  42. What is your favorite thing about the place where you hid the treasure?
    It is in a place that is dear to me.

    Not ‘ it’s a place that’ but he sez ‘ it’s IN a place that’

    So, the spot isn’t the dear place, the dear spot is the locale…?

    • The statement usually used is NEAR and dear to me. Forrest doesn’t use Near in this context , but is used many times in the Poem.

      Examples of Near in poem, not far, nigh, with, keep, warm, take, put in, drawing nigh, blaze(hearth), all, and title( tight).

      Interesting to me

      And then there is the stanza that talks about to go, leave. Like he is saying to abandon, or desert something. Desert as in sand and barren wasteland or desert as in leave.

      • Another thought of Near is this. What is the two Omegas are just that. Two ends that butt up against each other. The end is ever drawing near. Or drawing close together. To be near and dear.

        If you have two ends drawn together you have mirror images on both sides and the space where the two ends meet is in the middle! That tight and narrow place in between.

  43. Obviously, this is all only my opinion. A year or so ago I was rather adamant concerning what Forrest meant about hiding the treasure in his favorite spot. I was convinced (and still am) that he is referring to his favorite spot as an entire state, not a very small area. To further solidify my belief I only need to read a couple of the questions and the answers he gave.

    Q: What is your favorite thing about the place where you hid the treasure?
    A: It is in a place that is dear to me.

    Q: When was the last time you went to the place with the treasure was hidden?
    A: A few years ago.

    Q: When was the last time you have been to where the treasure is hidden?
    A: A few years ago.

    Q: Have you ever revisited the place you hid it?
    A: No

    • Interesting. While I don’t think these statements necessarily mean he is specifically talking about a state, I’ll definitely agree that there is some flexibility in considering the scale of “the place”. The place could be a fishing hole, a canyon, a park, a state, or even this wacky blue ball we call the Earth.

    • KP, you’ve fallen into the same trap that everyone else did concerning this post. Just remember, ghosts cannot hurt you unless you let them. 😉

  44. How hard was it to write the poem and not give the location away?
    F: “It was not hard at all. I just had to stay focused.”

    If you’re looking for the location in the poem, I think you should look elsewhere like his books & other writings.

    Found the appropriate location to comment.

    • I said to myself,
      Self, These students are us searchers and the same things mentioned by us.
      None of these students have chimed in over a year later and appears to me that all of us are the students.

      When you wrote the poem, were you thinking about fishing
      No, I was thinking about the poem.

  45. ” Why did you hide the treasure where you hid it?”
    “I love the way you worded that question. I think you are going to be a science fiction writer. The answer is in my book, TTOTC.”
    Is the wording in this question and how it is written a specific “tell” that sparks Fenn’s answer?

    • This one intrigued me as well. I think this is a typical Fenn “non-answer” answer. He only addressed the “why did he hide it” part of the question but makes you think he answered “why did he pick that spot” which he did not.

      • Randawg…If this is just another “non-answer” answer…why is it “intriguing” to you.

    • Ken, the tell is the fact that the question contains the word treasure and not chest. thats why FF loves it. and the answer to both parts of the question…the why and the where are indeed in TTOTC. well, once one understands that treasure and chest are two different things. TTOTC is loaded with why and where for treasure but not chest.

      i think.

      Ken, do you drive a model T?

      • dodo…Fenn has intermingled his answers and comments over the years with both words. Treasure and chest… The poem mentions trove as well. There have been many discussions about these words with all kinds of theories about how they are used. Would you care to share your idea about “chest”?

    • The question could have been stated; Why did you choose the hide spot – or – why did you want the treasure where you hid it?
      These type of questions [wording] imply a personal reasoning for a single 10″ sq spot… maybe even an emotional reason.

      IF you look at the question carefully… then the answer… it kinda makes sense that the TTOTC holds the answer, because the poem is in the book. The poem is the answer.

      Look at this possibility: He created clues that: created a spot.
      The spot may not be as special as the location itself.
      “why did you hide the treasure WHERE you hid it”? Because the “answers” to the clues put it there,.. a 10″ spot.

      Science fiction is, imagination of the future. Doesn’t fenn tell us imagination is needed? So now read the question with a little imagination and the fact that fenn knows why he hid the chest where he hid it… ** it worked out that way.** {where the “treasure” is hidden}

      Food for thought.

      • Seeker;

        I can not quote the entirety of “Flywater” – a chapter in TTOTC, but I invite every reader to read this chapter. For me, I think that this chapter provides a lot of insight into why Forrest chose his location, where he secreted Indulgence.

        Additionally, If I can, I would like to repost something that Bur posted on November 8, 2017 at 7:32 am:
        “I’m wondering when we think about the poem and finding “indulgence” do we really think about Forrest and the time he got cancer? How this terrible disease made him change, and all he did to fight this invasion in his body of something he had no control of. His mind thought the worst, but his body fought for life.
        Forrest wrote this for a wonderful lady “Renelle Jacobson ” after her passing – “As the days of autumn approach each of us must know that our hour glass is slowly getting bottom heavy. Hopefully, as each crystal of sand drops, it takes with it the story of a fruitful life, full of grateful memories and dreams fulfilled.”

        I think that “Flywater” and Bur’s post are very insightful – JMO – JDA

      • Seeker;

        Regarding the “special Location” vs “Special spot” – Last month I posted the following on MW. I wish I could express it better, but this is as good as I can do –
        April 29, 2018 at 5:19 pm
        Reading through the past 250+ entries, I am amazed at the depth of thought presented here. Many have given a lot of thought as to why Forrest’s “Special Place” is special to him. I have long felt that this “Special Place” was visited by Forrest and his family on the way to, or on the way from Yellowstone each summer. I think that Forrest fell in love with this place as a boy and continued to visit it as an adult in later life.
        I think that this place inspired Forrest to become an amateur archeologist and piqued his interest in geology. – Geology in its fullest sense. Not just the study of “Places”, but a study of those places, the people that lived there, and the lives they lived.
        Not just a study of the world as we see it today, but the world of the past – – Yesterday, a thousand yesterdays, and yes, even millions and millions of yesterdays. A Yesterday when the earth was in the midst of an ice age, and glaciers were carving out valleys, shearing off cliff faces, and depositing rubble in morains as the glaciers retreated back up the mountains.
        Memories of finding arrowheads, and buffalo skulls, and maybe even remnants of ancient villages, memories of he and Skippy building “Forts” like all young boys do. Memories of seeing everything from chipmunks to Grizzlies. Hummingbirds to eagles. Clear blue skies to almost earth-shaking thunderstorms. Memories of “family”, as only a “family” can be. The closeness, the inseparability, the love.
        And there was the fishing, and the hiking, and the “Just doin’ nothin’ – together, and alone.
        And there was the healing of the body and the soul after the cancer diagnosis, and remission.
        Why is this place so “Special” – we may never know for sure, but I think that it must involve at least a little of what I have offered as possibilities. Memories, precious Memories – everlasting Memories –
        “As I have gone alone in there, And with my Treasures bold, I can keep my secret where, And hint of riches new and old.”

        • JDA,
          I agree with you, time with his family makes it special. It possesses everything that the Fenn family enjoyed. It is a place that his mind & heart takes him to when he thinks of those days long ago. I believe people will be surprised at the simplicity of the location but will see the beauty also. IMO

          • Thanks Birdie. I agree with your last sentence: ” I believe people will be surprised at the simplicity of the location but will see the beauty also.” It truely IS a beautiful place, IMO – JDA

        • JDA,
          You have to wonder, could this place be known by his family [ prior to marriage, only ] Sure, I can see the place as an importance to fenn and his memoirs.

          What I find hard to believe is, many of the places [ from what we can read into the memoirs ] happened up to the age of 20. If this place was so special, would he not have taken his kids, wife, grandkids, nieces and nephews at some point [family]? I mean, we know that some in his family are out searching as well, right?

          Your thoughts about the grandeur of the place is great… an emotional attachment even. But, if you only think of this place with that idea in mind, doesn’t it limit many possibilities?
          One thought I have would be; a place that would never change or not able to change… but there would be a reason for that to have to stay ‘relatively’ the same as it has for thousands of years [ no real possibility of development line of thinking ] So.. what are our options to this type of place?
          ~Not private land…
          ~Possibly and more likely.. public land.. but even that can change in, let say 200 yrs. YSP is a good example of mans involvement [ even with environment in mind ] that has many changes in a 200 year period.
          ~Reservations? A no, no in my mind.

          fenn “special” might not be anything special to many of us because we speculate it must be, should be, has to be a beautiful location… well it might be, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder [ no place for the meek? ]
          WhatIF the “location” is about or near and area that couldn’t possibly be developed because of geographical and geological reasoning?

          YS seemed to work nicely, only we are limited to the rules and regulations at a location as such, and who know what a place, that is government run, will look like ‘down the road’.
          Would it surprise you if the hide was in a location of a tar pit, or maybe a large quicksand local, or anything of that nature? [ not exactly on top of the place, but close enough to ensure longevity ]. fenn, at one time mentioned “10,000” down the road… I think many simply dismiss that as BS or embellishment on fenn’s part. However, if we’re supposed to think the same way, a lot of those beautiful places are going to be some of the first place man moves into [ for whatever reasons ] in the future.
          That may sound odd to many because, many have only understood the lands for a few generations. look at the changes in the last 300 years to this country alone… when I was a kid the population [world wide] was about 2.5 billion, today it’s creeping to 8 billion. When fenn was born the population in the US was about 100 million… today it’s over 325 million. The population in another 88 years could be close to 1 billion.

          How do you think ‘down the road’ affected fenn’s thoughts?
          “I’m not flippant about this…. I’m looking a hundred years down the road, maybe a thousand years down the road. People don’t understand that.”

          It will be very interesting when the trove is discovered and why it’s where it is.
          Hide location vs. Location;
          In my mind; fenn created the clues that ended up creating the hidey spot… all is within his special location.
          The hide itself [imo] is a creation of the clues, and not so much his “special place”

          More rambling and Rumbling… BSing the WhatIF’s

          • Seeker,

            Knowing what I know IMO FF is absolutely right in what he is saying and when the chest is found within the next couple of months all will be clear I assure you, technically it may never of been found for a thousand years, however the poem has been solved and FF has been completely honest and straight down the line with his comments, crafty but honest.

          • Hi Seeker,
            I hope you don’t mind me jumping in..
            I brought this up once before but without much feedback.
            Pg 4, TTOTC, “Please overlook my slight penchant for provocation and realize that all of us are environmentalists to some degree, and me more than most.”
            Maybe the hidey place has more to do with an environmental issue then where he spent his childhood.
            Just MO

          • Seeker;

            You pose some interesting questions. What will Forrest’s “Special Place” look like once found and disclosed to the world? Will it be “Beautiful” or look more like a “Tar Pit”? I hope that it is beautiful – but beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

            I am from New Mexico, and love the “High Desert” type of terrain. I also spent lots of time in the Jamez mountains of New Mexico, so am attracted to the Ponderosa Pine Forests. So, for me, beauty is a combination of the two. Will the “Special Place” look anything like I have just described? Who knows?

            Is there something about this place, like you said Seeker, that will limit development in the future? I can only hope so – but man has found ways of developing some pretty rough terrain, so I hope that there is another reason why it would be difficult to develop… or maybe, like Yellowstone, there is a reason to set this land aside as a National Park or preserve? Who knows.

            Interesting thoughts Seeker. Thanks for sharing.


          • Why does FF embellish upon his youth and military in the TOTC? OH, those were the times! Don’t we all take time to seek out memories? Fenn is 88 and had many more chapters in his life; one which includes N.M. Why have we not considered a more inclusive flash back in time? The place of the TC, IMO, could not possibly be “one” special place from his memoir because there are many. FF has cleverly chosen nature to exhibit a visual painting of his special place. IMO, once you are at the blaze you will understand that FF is looking out over past centuries to fix his stamp for futures to come. His life, dreams, accomplishments will live on. Maybe a trail post will be fixed there with TTOTC written on it. JMO

          • Butch,
            There seems to be more ‘confidence’ floating around the blog this year. I can only imagine fenn’s mailbox is overflowing with e-mails. I’m not going to say we have heard it all before… All of the; I know where the treasure is and this will be the year.

            But I gonna ask folks who truly believe the have solved this challenge to answer a two part question.
            ** Where is your solution located -?- and when will you retrieve the trove?
            Examples 1 mile from Earth Quake lake, Never Summer Mountain east side below 7000f, etc. and the month ya’ll plan on going.

            I’m curious to the span/range of all those who are confident they are in the correct location with the correct solution. I think it would be a hoot to pin a map and see where the ‘I know’ folks all end up at…. Should, this be the year.
            I get a gut feeling this would be a fun little activity to gander at. Who’s first to show their “I know” before it happens?
            {no solve required, not comments to why there, Just answer the two part question}

          • Seeker;

            I will be the first to “NOT” answer

            I will not disclose my search area, other than it is in Wyoming and I plan to search Memorial Day Week-end. Sorry for the Non-answer to question #1 – JDA

          • Seeker,

            I know only what the poem says, that’s all.

            MT / WY / CO / NM – everyone has WWWH that fits in perfectly with the poem.

            Only one so far has caught my eye.

          • Ken,
            I said no need to specific locations… Ha! … your wwwh is bitter and balmy, even in July.

          • Seeker,

            lol, By asking those that truly feel they know where it is, the pins on a map is utterly ridiculous. Your map thing reminds me of scammers calling asking questions that should not be replied to to get access to personal info. REALLY? It also sounds of desperation for someone that does not have a solve.

            Having fun lol

          • Why does FF embellish upon his youth and military in the TOTC? OH, those were the times! Don’t we all take time to seek out memories? Fenn is 88 and had many more chapters in his life; one which includes N.M. Why have we not considered a more inclusive flash back in time? The place of the TC, IMO, could not possibly be “one” special place from his memoir because there are many. FF has cleverly chosen nature to exhibit a visual painting of his special place. IMO, once you are at the blaze you will understand that FF is looking out over past centuries to fix his stamp for futures to come. His life, dreams, accomplishments will live on. Maybe a trail post will be fixed there with TTOTC written on it. JMHO

          • CharlieM,
            I’d figure someone would use the excuse, what did you call it-?- ‘scamming… for personal info’?

            I find if fruitless to read post from those who say they ‘know’ over and over and over again… yet when asked a couple simple questions of; when they plan on retrieving their winnings [ a month was the example] and a location [that is rather large, to say the least, but a little smaller than an entire stated ] many turn tail. I guess deniability is better than factuality, when it is all said and done.

      • Good points Seeker. Again, it is risky to assume what Fenn was really thinking when he answered the way he did. That aside…he did throw the science fiction idea in there. Maybe just to mess with us…maybe not…or both. There are as many definitions for “science fiction” as there are fans of it. The definitions have evolved with the genres and times as technology advances. It is interesting that science fiction seems to parallel the ideology of geography as a “cause and effect” based on the advancement of human technology. That fits well with your “imagination of the future”.

        • Seeker,

          I cannot answer those questions, all I will say is my solve has lead me straight to the treasure IMO and it is as FF said ‘In the wood’…… quote from the bible….’We covert what we see everyday’………’Or every summer’ in this case……..IMO…..the only way that I will not claim the chest this summer is if somebody gets there first……FF knows im right, he has my email with an image enclosed.

          Sorry I can’t be more precise, but IMO be it me or someone else all this ends this summer.

          • Butch;

            Here we go again: “the only way that I will not claim the chest this summer is if somebody gets there first” The time honored ready-made excuse. How sad! – JMO – JDA

          • JDA

            Your right, here we go again, however with a different outcome IMO! if I am wrong (Im not) I will show my solve and you will see I was right but too late!….I will even publish my email I sent to FF with my solve in it.

            P.s I have never made excuses for anything in my life, you are however entitled to your opinion! 🙂

          • McB,

            Looks like its down to who’s the faster runner then……what state is your solve in? 🙂

          • Butch,

            So your positive that you have a correct solve as well as JDA and myself. Two are going home with nothing in hand, or is it three?

            I’ll aggravate you just a little bit, I do believe you don’t have the solve. So what you sent F an image or your solve, does make it right? Heck I sent my solve the day before F came out with his “gut feeling”, which I did not jump up and down on thinking I was the one he was referring to.

            I’m not questioning my solve, but, I understand my solution could be wrong. So……….here we go again, proof will be in the pudding or in the hands lol.

            Happy hunting there will be no luck.

          • CharlieM

            Im gonna be honest and say my solve isn’t in WY but MT and IMO my solve it spot on from start to finish, lets see, if you get there before me then you was obviously meant to have it and I wasn’t, good luck and stay safe……..what state is your solve?

            P.s Dont forget your waders! 🙂

          • Butch and CharlieM;

            Sure glad I’m searchin’ in Wyoming. Sounds like Montana is a bit crowded 🙂 JDA

          • Butch: MT is the right state IMO, but it’ll be no foot race. I’m actually going to reverse myself and say that the chest won’t be found in 2018.

          • OohH Man, Zap…….

            You’re kidding right? Please say it ain’t so! It has to be found in 2018. lol… I’m not sure I can take another season of all the ‘I know where it is’.

            Did you change your plans of going? Hope all is well, if you had to.

          • Hi Seeker: no, I didn’t change my plans to search. While everyone has been jibberjabbing the last week, I was driving 2400 miles and putting a wooden stake through my best solution. 4000+ manhours and 5 BOTG trips over three years to investigate incrementally better solutions has been educational, humbling, and unfortunately … irritating. The Chase has long since ceased being fun — other than perhaps the chuckle I get from first-time BOTG searchers boasting that they’re going to find the chest. (New flash: not gonna happen, but you gotta start somewhere I guess.) When Forrest said Sunday afternoon picnic, I don’t think he was being literal. It was his way of saying nobody is going to find it on their first trip out. Or their second, or third. Thus, non-U.S. searchers are at a tremendous cost disadvantage.

          • Zap;

            I am sorry that your last trip did not turn out as you had hoped. You are a very intelligent and dedicated searcher. I personally thank you for all of your hours of research and accrued knowledge. You have contributed greatly to the Blog. I hope that this disappointment will not cause you to leave the chase.

            I am sure that this last trip was a disappointment to you, and for that I am sorry.

            Maybe Forrest’s “gut feeling” will come to fruition, and we can all take off our pack and find something new to “Chase”.

            Take care of yourself my friend – JDA

          • Zap,
            I hope you mean the blogs and chats can be irritating. If the ‘chase’ is no longer fun, I think ya missed the whole point of fenn creating it in the first place… to influence other generations.

            The lure was only a sale pitch… the idea, was a life style adventure. Not only for this challenge but for any time the urge pops up to get your feet wet in a mountain river, stroll through wild flowers, roll a log, flip a rock just to see what you will see, stand on a high point and see where you have been… lay a bedroll down and sleep under the stars.

            Don’t get me wrong… I’m in this for this challenge to match wits with not only the creator of the chase, but ya’ll as well.
            There are very few here that needed any excuse to wonder nature… the thrill of the chase wasn’t designed for them, as much as, the guy or gal who hasn’t done the above.

            I have said it before and will say it again, if this was a box on marbles, well… this blog and all the others would be very quite. fenn sold the adventure, not a chest. It’s truly sad many don’t see that.

            For me, the thrill of the chase is an itch. An itch that can only be scratched against the highest tree standing on a mountain. The challenge is only a reminder… the little itch needs scratching.

          • Hello Seeker. I truly enjoyed reading your post, and I concur with your thoughts.

          • ZapHood,

            Im sorry you didn’t find the `TC I really am, sounds like you had a promising solve to go all that way!
            I hope you at least enjoyed the scenery which although it wasn’t what your journey was about, but it was the reason FF wanted us to go to the Rockies!
            I didn’t realise you was from the UK, What part?
            If it is any consolation to you a brit will be claiming the TC IMO, dont give up, stick it out, take it on the chin and start again fresh, your last journey could only of helped you for future BOTG.

          • Thanks for your very kind words, JDA. I’m not yet ready to leave the Chase, but I will admit that the intellectual grind is taking its toll. If another searcher should surprise me and find Indulgence this year, it’ll probably come as a relief. I have other hobby interests that have been neglected for several years because I felt that the only hope of solving Forrest’s puzzle was total immersion over an extended period. My latest solution was excellent — in fact, I *still* love it. But unless Forrest actually did bury the chest and leave no marker, it’s simply the wrong spot.

            I wish you luck and safe journeys when you return to your location in a couple weekends. I envy your much shorter drive! Btw, I drove right through your fine town (twice) during my journey. There was quite the thunderstorm going on when I stopped there for gas on Mother’s Day!

          • Hi Seeker,

            “Zap, I hope you mean the blogs and chats can be irritating. If the ‘chase’ is no longer fun, I think ya missed the whole point of fenn creating it in the first place… to influence other generations.”

            It’s partly the blogs, Seeker, but that’s not it entirely. I “enjoy” the challenge of a good puzzle — or more specifically, I enjoy the thrill of solving a hard puzzle. The trouble with the Chase is that you can *think* you’ve solved the puzzle, but the only way to confirm you have is to produce the chest. After a while, this can get quite expensive, to say nothing of the expended hours “arm-chairing the thing to death.”

            The Chase’s lure for me has never been to get out in nature. I’ve backpacked thousands of miles, climbed every 14,000 foot peak in California, visited at least two dozen national parks, uncounted state parks. I’ve been to every state in the U.S., and nearly every Canadian province. While Fenn’s challenge has achieved its primary goal of getting hundreds of thousands of people out enjoying all that the Rocky Mountains have to offer, in my case (and from what I can tell, most people who post here) I needed no bronze box of baubles to entice me off my couch. You captured this sentiment well when you wrote, “There are very few here that needed any excuse to wonder nature… the thrill of the chase wasn’t designed for them, as much as, the guy or gal who hasn’t done the above.”

            I do love Montana (and Wyoming and Colorado), but I also love Hawaii, the Pacific Northwest, the UK, New Zealand, France, Italy, Switzerland, French Polynesia, and on and on. I will not live long enough to see all the wonderful places this planet has to offer, and so each trip spent looking for Forrest’s treasure actually robs me of time that could be spent visiting places I haven’t been yet like the Galapagos, Machu Picchu, Patagonia, Costa Rica, Kenya, Tanzania, Iceland, Australia or even Antarctica. So in my case, the Chase has costs beyond the time and money devoted to it.

            You likened it to an itch, which I think is fitting. But I’d say that itch has evolved into a bit of an intellectual thorn.

          • Zap, and others,

            Sorry, late to the party – very busy weekend. The previous statement sums up my life at the moment. For me, there is more going on around me and in my life that I could not possibly dedicate the amount of time you, and others that meet up here on the hoD, have and do put forth in the chase. I am sorry you didn’t pick up Indulgence. Bummer. But you gotta get back up on the horse and ride, maybe somewhat slower, but making progress nonetheless.

            I won’t bore you all with the minutiae of my life, but suffice it to say, I’ll be checking in less frequently again for a while. Spring time for me is my “book worm” time for catching up on things to read, including this blog. Now that summer is upon us in full swing, I have to make hay while the sun shines, as they say.

            Good luck to all!

      • IMO … the question restated above would have brought the exact same answer. It is not the way the question is worded, it is the question itself in its entirety.

        • Seeker…your post to Zap is the most eloquent and succinct comment you have ever made IMO! You even spell checked!! Way to sum up all the ups and downs of the thrill of the chase, Seeker.

    • I think the tell is “you” is said twice. Imagine if Forrest were standing next to someone and a third person asked that question. Who is the first “you?” Who is the second? We assume F for both, like we assume “I” in the poem is also him, but these are assumptions that need to be questioned.

    • HI Ken,

      You keep coming back to this point and I am in full agreement. My solve takes this question into account. I think most serious hunters have it in their minds — what makes this spot special to FF? And when you think about what would be a place that is special to FF you can come up with dozens of ideas about why, having to do with great memories, places where he had a life epiphany, places he spent time with his loved ones, places where something significant in his life happened, or like any of us places that just become “ours” because we claim them (The Art Institute of Chicago is one of my special places.)

      I believe when the chest is found we will all understand the why of the place.

    • The reason I don’t think so is because of the playful evasiveness in his other answers. Like: “Yes, I think I could.” or, “Not in my dictionary.”
      He knew he was responding to kids and he had a little fun with it.

      • Randawg…answered as posed is Fenn’s game for sure. In this one, I guess a person could just think that there is two actual q’s. Then again, a person could look at it as someone asking Fenn the reason behind his choice of location. Either way…Fenn’s mention of science fiction gives me reason to look at the situation more closely. Just more thinking about the whole.

        • Is there a specific reason that you think science fiction may be relevant?

          • Well…not actually. Fenn had time to think and answer at his leisure…this made me look at “what” science fiction is. In those terms, I believe Fenn’s answer takes on a different approach in what he thinks, and maybe why he does/did the things he has.

          • The short answer to your question is “Yes”.
            Here’s why: Science fiction typically involves a scenario
            that requires future development of technology or society
            in order to become a reality. In some instances, soon
            after the “fiction” was written/published, it became “reality”. All IMO.

    • C’mon CharlieM, Those in the confidence category would like to know the where and when? are Biggest competitor stands.

  46. I believe another that makes me wonder is the following from above:

    What was your favorite Hike/Trail Yellowstone.?
    Trails are not favorites of mine. I always hiked off trails. Why go where everyone else had gone. The rangers didn’t like that, but I did and I was the one doing it. Do you see my logic?

    Mr. Fenn states, ‘The rangers didn’t like that, but I did and I was the one doing it.’ I believe he’s mentioned before one should stay on the trails in Yellowstone, yet he’s stated this.

    • My take is that officially he tells searchers that they should obey the rules but that Fenn himself does not.

      • I’m with you on this randawg. We should go the speed limit, we should sleep eight hours a night, we should tell the truth, ad nauseam. But we don’t have to. And there may be justifiable reasons for not doing what we should do.

        So, how does that help us find Indulgence? That’s the question at hand.

        All in my opinion…

        • “Doing what we should do” is the attitude/philosophy of “sheeple”. If one is to succeed beyond the level of the “sheeple”, one must do extraordinary things, such as “working” more than 8 hours per day. And one who will succeed beyond the level of the “sheeple” must also think “out of the box”, as thinking “inside the box” tends to keep one as constrained as an average “sheeple”.

          This is not rocket science. None of us, including FF, are immune to the limitations of biology/chemistry/physics. Please remember that he got cancer, fer gawd’s sake. And mortality is one of the “great equalizers”.

          What I find (a little) interesting is anyone’s interest in any kind
          of “legacy”. After one dies, one can hardly be concerned or
          affected by it. But maybe the idea is to “provide for” or “be
          concerned with” one’s descendants/family . . . which may be a
          reasonable concern.

      • “There isn’t a human trail in very close proximity.” Meaning if you stick to the trails like your supposed to, you can count on Not finding the chest.

    • PD,
      I think fenn is simply saying; this is supposed to be our public land… why do I need to do as you only want me to-?- see what only you want me to see? Be herded like cattle and miss the really good stuff that is out if view. Not unlike “don’t touch” …Whats the fun in that?

      • Different ffolks ffind ffun in different things. Is there a lot of ffun in “lowering the bar”? Would it be ffun to just tell everyone where the TC
        speciffically is (within a “ffertile” area, say)? Even after I ffind the TC, I
        won’t tell anyone where it was, as I won’t want “souvenir hunters” to
        tear up the place any more. I already ffound pieces of broken glass
        bottles in the area; I don’t think whoever owns the property would want to see it littered more than it is. And yes, trespassing is considered a crime. But many searchers would commit a minor crime in order to receive a substantial payoff. All IMO.

        • AJ…don’t send the message that it is OK to do wrong while out in nature searching for Fenn’s loot.

    • Yes, pdenver! It is a contradiction, not unlike all those found in TTOTC, and the pairs of opposites found in the poem.

      Agree with randawg, ff’s saying, IMO, don’t stay on a trail. I believe you start on a trail, and then head off of it, onto a horse trail/animal trail, or by a lake or stream edge or meadow or other reasonably safe, open space. I don’t believe there is serious (read: dangerous) bushwhacking to do.

      Yellowstone is a place many, many backpackers go every year, and some of the “trails” they travel on are not really trails.

      • For example: Fairyland Basin. I would LOVE to go there. Here’s a tip for searchers in YNP this summer… if you can swing it, book a kayak tour on Yellowstone Lake. Vendors are tightly regulated, and tours start very early because that lake is so cold and windy in the afternoons. My husband and I (it was just the two of us and our very responsible guide) did this 2 years ago, and I think of it almost every day. What a thrill, seeing (and touching) the warm outflows from the springs into the lake, picnicking on the deserted shoreline, and going right up to Fishing Cone! Magic!

    • i believe that these two answers ((science fiction (writer) and do you see my logic (hiking off trails))) are connected.

      to BOLDly go where noone has gone before, and
      spock always spoke logically and of logic

      unrelated: (spock spoke and fun with punctuation)

      seems logical to me that a deep thinking (deep space NINE) treasure seeker could use logic to determine…

      i never said that the treasure was buried, i didnt want to give that as a clue…

      hint: things that forrest doesnt want to give as a clue…are clues

      so is the treasure gene roddenberried or ray bradburried?

      see the strong ray bradbury connection to weekly words.

      imo if you are taking the poem clues litterally, well, whats more boring than canasta?

  47. Do your own thing.but always remember safety first.if you don’t know.don’t go.your blazing your own trail,but you better know the area first,or you could get yourself in a pickle.know your way in and out.people in yellowstone go off the trail and fall into abyss.i don’t know how the rangers know whats solid to build on and whats not.thats scary.guess thats where knowing, learning,studing,teaching comes in.

  48. Butch,
    When you get back from your search, please indicate whether “crow” tastes like “chicken”. 🙂

    • Ha!……….For the time being I will take that one on the chin Fennatical……..ive never been afraid to put myself out there to be aimed at!…….Let me have your address after this is over, I will send you a page slice of ‘Humble Pie’ 🙂

    • Just in case I am winning this lottery I have a page in my book… full of pillories with names in it… it‘s a collection of all those smart people claiming the title to the gold before their search… I just want to be able to give them a shoutout…
      In the end the big winner should be happy enough not to call names but who knows…

  49. With all the replies suddenly in this topic… I’m curious about something. Did anyone EVER see the distinction of a “few years ago” comment of visiting the treasure site, and understand the initial poem in the article about the man on the stairs?

    • Hello Iron Will. The “few years ago” may be of a broader area rather than the exact spot where the treasure chest is at rest.

  50. Iron Will, To your 1st question, his answer is definitely interesting. As for the man on the stairs, I’ve always interpreted that to mean ” don’t stand in your own way.”

    • It HAD to be Afana lol
      He said he was at the treasure spot a few years ago, and he hid it in 2010 (ish). He then said he’s never been back since he hid it.
      HOW CAN THAT BE!??

      I’ll tell you how.
      If this Middle School class sent him the Q & A in 2013 and he responded…yet did not tell us. Then NOW…in 2017…he decides to show us that email.

      Today as I went up the stair, I met a man who wasn’t there. He wasn’t there again today, oh how I wish he’d go away.

      As for the poem…it was put there to show you that the concept of TIME is a factor. He reformatted the original poem by Harvard…by adding another TODAY in it. This makes you wonder how it can have TWO Todays? You can’t. So it means there are two separate times that the person meets the man on the stairs… today…and another day. Forrest put the poem there (modified) to show you that he put the class email answers there ….FROM ANOTHER TIME. 😛

      • Iron Will, Whatcha mean! “It HAD to be Afana lol” ? Insert smile. The obvious question to be answered is, when where the questions and answers exchanged? Maybe Dal knows. Interesting take on the poem, It could very well be from another time. I refer back to my question. Only then will know for sure.

        • I just told you… 2013. These were not exchanged in 2017. Those facts from his answers are obvious.

          And I jokingly said it HAD to be you, because of the MW Featured Q&A in which I mentioned that you were a legit person and not Forrest. Then the next day you’re the first person to respond lol

          • Speaking of TIME, why does everyone on this blog have on the same clothes they had on the day after yesterday?

      • I’m not sure that time plays a big part in solving the poem, other than
        the fact that it takes a lot of time to do it. IMO.

  51. I thought this was interesting…
    “What does “warm” mean to you?
    It means being comfortable.”

    WWWH – nothing to do with temperature?

    • Thanks, Aaron! Maybe learning to ride a backwards bicycle isn’t enough. Backwards unicycle maybe… 😉

      • I think a regular tricycle is likely more appropriate, though I would love to see you ride a backwards unicycle!

  52. Can you describe the first and last time you visited your secret fishing spot?
    Yes, I went in my car both times and the sun was shining.

    The New Mexico state emblem is the sun with four rays. Also, historical references called NM “The Sunshine State”.

    It seems odd that FF would add this last part to the statement when he answered other questions with a “yes” or “no”.

    I’m still in this with NM as my state for the solution.

    • It does seem strange that he would add that at the end of his comment about the sun Tarheel…..

      • Butch/Tarheel—-

        If I might chime in here. You will notice if you read SB145 about “The Bullet” that Forrest tells us that the person who located a another copy of the old car he once had was Richard Blake–who Forrest says is the foremost authority on the SUN alive today.

        I will not hide the fact that I have wondered whether the sun had anything to with “the blaze”, and wondered whether “But tarry scant with marvel gaze” may be telling us we can look at the Blaze (The Sun) but only for a moment, because looking at the sun is very dangerous for the eyes.

        I just wanted to add that because I found the fact that Forrest mentions this physicist and his knowledge of the Sun in a story about an old car very interesting.

    • So is the secret fishing spot the same as the “secret place”, treasure place?
      Is this the assumption?

      I recall he commented that he and his father had several secret fishing places that they kept to themselves?

      • Meadowlark, it could be, sounds like a river given that he loves fly fishing and many people think that there is a water crossing in the solve somewhere too! But the n with FF its never what hes telling you, its what hes not, so who knows 🙂 JMO

      • Meadowlark, I believe Mr. Fenn has many trophy waters marked from memory.

  53. I know what you mean Zap. This year will be our second family vacation to the Rocky Mountains, though we did consider a tropical place and Europe. My wife has warned me that next year we will be going somewhere else on vacation. I am good with that as I’d love to see new places too. I will still go to the Rockies on my own if I need to, if nothing else to fly fish 🙂

  54. From the Q/A above:
    Q:When was the first time you went to the place where you hid the treasure?
    A: I don’t want to answer that question. It is more of a clue than I want to give.

    When I think about Forrest’s answer I can’t help but wonder, what period of his life would be a clue to a spot that is both dear to Forrest AND was likely to be the first time he visited that place AND was likely to be in the search area?

    Lets say he was 50 when he first visited that place…would anyone here know where Forrest hung out when he was 50? How about 27? How about 60? How about 15?…yes…we should know that…

    We know where he hung out from about age 3 to age 20…Temple,TX, Some place in Georgia and Yellowstone. So if he had answered that question by saying about 13 years old…we would all be running toward Yellowstone because neither GA nor TX are in the search area. But the rest of his life is a big blur…What if he had said “I was 31 years old. Would that help anyone???

    I mean, we know he traveled all over from California to Russia to Germany to Santa Fe to Mexico Beach…and lived on a lot of Air Force bases but few of the places I can recall that he named are in the search area…

    The only period of his life that we really know where he hung out, explored, and was in a search area was when he was a kid up to about age 20.

    Just thinking out loud….

    • Hello Dal. What you’ve posted makes sense. I would like to add that we know he’s been in the Cody area with one reference to Mummy Joe. Could the family have stopped off along the way from Temple to Yellowstone/West Yellowstone? We may not know this. I do agree what you’ve posted makes more sense than mine.

        • Thank you for explaining, Dal. I’m curious. For you, where would you place the limit/boundary of Yellowstone heading East from the East entrance?

        • Hi Pendever, I never saw any ads for a P52 in Good Housekeeping Magazine. Google – vintage can openers – to see all those pointy-jagged kind that were used before the wheel was invented. If you stare at the right YS map, you may even see the faces of the two biddies as well. Still having fun like a kid.

          I really liked your link to the Colorado Encyclopedia. Thanks.

          • Hi OS2,

            The only can opener add I could find in Good Housekeeping around the time period of Forrest’s story was the Edlund Jr.
            I could never figure out if that was what I was supposed to find or not.
            Right above that add was an add about Crown jarring lids. Somewhere else in the magazine was an add that mentioned “stretching a point” (war time rationing) which always made me think of a gravitational singularity. I would have glossed right over that if there wasn’t the comment about stretching tangents.
            Bottom line is I could never really relate the Can Opener comment to anything that I could really use. It seems like something definitely mentioned to “catch up” in your brain. Does anyone have anything they are willing to share on this one?

          • OMG Argillite, you are an amazing researcher…. I often wonder how you guys learned to do that. I am so envious of your search skills, & speed-reading skills. I share Fenn’s lament… “especially now that it’s too late to get any.” I never dreamed there would be on-line all all those old magazines. Thanks. OS2

          • Pen, I never thought FF was referring to a real magazine ad. But the comment was so unusual… face like a can opener… that it stuck in my craw and looking at the map later, I related the two. But if its easy & fun to research it, go for it. I’d like to see if I guessed right. I enjoyed thumbing thru some of the 1947 issues, and especially the hand drawn graphics instead of computer generated ones in todays magazines, and the era when a mans income could afford a stay-at-home wife. OS2

          • Hello OS2. Mr. Fenn’s statement about the “face of a can opener” is unusual. Tried to look at the can opener with the pointed end and compared it to the eastern entrance of Yellowstone, and I must say, I must not have too much of an imagination. With Good Housekeeping, I see a brand name with a slogan. There may be other things associated with this, too. Remembering my Mom, she kept a home that could pass the white glove test. The advertisements of the year you suggested were fun to see. The sketches are great. I’d like to see things go back to what they were.

          • Hello J A Kraven. Thank you for the link. I do see a moody face in the can opener photos you’ve provided, as I did with the other links. I’m trying to imagine a profile of one with eastern Yellowstone, just like the profile of George Washington.

          • I have to admit I don’t know the suggested connection to the east border of Yellowstone and/or the profile of George Washington, pdenver.

            I’m sure I’ve missed some theory/speculation or other along those lines over the years. No matter.


          • Hello J A Kraven. In regards to the “face of a can opener,” I was thinking of a profile. While thinking of “face,” I thought of the story about the children touching the face of George Washington; the profile of him. Perhaps in some sense, a thought about profiles to borders, or an edge(s). I’m not sure if I can explain further because it was a thought that came to me and I’m exploring the idea.

    • Good point[s].
      The only other time frame we would know about, that seems to relate, is the time he moved to NM when retired from the service, had a business, an archeology dig site, spread the ashes of a friend -keeping a promise to her, gave the book given to only one store to sell which is in SF. NM. [although, that wasn’t really known of right away, I don’t think]. So if he answer [ lets say ] 1975 or age 45ish, would that change things?

      The reason I bring this up… the words spoken just before the; pinion nut comment in the interview. However, would we even have know of those/that word[s] without ever hear that ATF interview? That he seem to not to regret saying something…

      Dal, your reasoning is sound, and I agree the most logical idea is the northern section or more than likely the ‘greater Yellowstone’ area [for lack of a better term]… But that dang reason for moving to NM – in that interview- always has me wondering.

      • “…SF. was the only place that I know where I could recover…”

        This comment was stated in the NM tourism video. The video seems to have few pieces of interviews with fenn, over time, rolled up into a short ad. Yet, It gives me pause to think about all the places fenn could have chosen to live, and the word ‘recover’ is the itch I can’t reach [ understand ]. Does it have anything to do with the chest/challenge? IDK. In this section of the video he states he was asked a lot of questions and answered most of them, and said something he didn’t want to… but we don’t have those questions mentioned in this video.

        This is the only video I can recall that has the comment above. Does anyone recall, a possible full interview, where those question occurred?

        • Seeker;

          Here is the only one I can come up with: “”If I was standing where the treasure chest is, I’d see trees, I’d see mountains, I’d see animals. I’d smell wonderful smells of pine needles, or pinyon nuts, sagebrush—and I know the treasure chest is wet. Well you’ve asked me a lot of questions and some of them—most of them I answered, a few I haven’t, but I’ve got to tell you—there’s one thing I told you I wish I had not.” f

          It is from this video: JDA

          • Yep, that’s the NM tourism video.

            I was hoping for any video or audio of that interview where the questions were asked, prior to, that little segment in the ad.
            ~Well you’ve asked me a lot of questions and some of them—most of them I answered…

            The ‘questions’ and answers to them were not presented in this 2 plus minute ad. But prior to the ad… I have never seen that interview or heard about it. LOL I think it should be somewhere floating around the matrix, I just haven’t found it.

            Thanks anyways.

          • Hello Seeker. I believe searchers may have tried contacting the interviewer of said ad, and I’m not sure if they were able to get any information.

          • PD,
            I’m sure others have thought the same as i have when they heard the ad… looked into it.. I was only curious of others actually found anything. I was never able to locate that full interview.
            It’s more a curiosity than anything else… ATF’s have help me from wandering too far in thoughts, but not produced much in the way of answering anything.

          • Hello Seeker. It would be interesting to have heard the entire interview, but after listening to the ad as it stands, would it not lure one to wanting to know more about the Chase? I’m not sure if you’ve seen many tourists commercials, but I believe this one may have raised a few curious eyebrows for the state of New Mexico and the Chase as a whole. Searchers still talk about this ad and what Mr. Fenn would see if he was standing where the treasure chest is. I like the ad. They did a good job. 🙂

    • Dal, on the other hand, maybe he didn’t want to answer that question because if he said anything over 45 yrs old that could possibly eliminate Montana and Yellowstone area, especially after the pinion pine statement. It could go either way…but, he’s right it would be too much of a clue.

    • Dal…good insight. I’ve been hung on that one for a long while. The way he said “mine alone” in reference to his special spot makes me think differently. Thanks for the topic…

    • Good sound thinking dal!
      You tore that Q&A apart to the basics and I think that’s what we need to do to most Q&A’s.

    • Dal, I always thought that by saying when he found that place will be more of a clue not for us, but to his family and close friends.

      • Oz-
        I considered that thought as well…but I decided it offers me little to no value..based on my own life experience…

        If someone were to ask me where my wife’s fav place was, where she might return to hide a treasure because it was so important to her…
        when she was in her twenties…I’d have no idea and it doesn’t get much better if we talk about her thirties or forties…We’ve traveled all over the place and for the most part, every new place has been her favorite. I believe the same is true of Forrest’s family. Only Peggy knew him as a kid…his kids didn’t know him til he was in his thirties…his grandkids until his fifties at the earliest…

        My wife is my closest companion, yet I don’t think I’ve ever mentioned my favorite place to her…
        I suspect it would be a surprise to her.

        An accurate guess might be more likely among his collecting and hunting buddies who travelled with him from time to time…

        Maybe even Donnie Joe…but you can’t ask him..

        And I am constantly reminded of the thought:
        “As I have gone alone in there”
        Which may indicate that he never took anyone else there…never shared the place…never even talked about it…kept it to himself..

        I turn over a lot of rocks when I’m looking for the location of the chest…and I find fascinating things…but no chest so far…

        • And I am constantly reminded of the thought:
          “As I have gone alone in there”
          Which may indicate that he never took anyone else there…never shared the place…never even talked about it…kept it to himself..

          Yes, a secret. Until he possibly hints of it in the very next line of the poem…And hint of riches new and old.

        • Dal, maybe something important happen that year where family and/or close friends will easily remember where he was traveling to.

          It takes me back to the time of his illness. What happened in that time from the day he was diagnosed with cancer in 1988 until he recovered?

          We don’t know the whole story, but I’m pretty sure it was a tumultuous time in their lives. I can imagine Forrest, facing his mortality, going away and taking time alone at his favorite place. I can also imagine that for a second time in his life (the first being that night in the jungle in Vietnam) he had to struggle with the decision of going out his way (like Marvin did) or doing was most fair to his wife and daughters and submitting to the treatments. The parallels are incredibly similar. So if he went out at that time, they were keeping a close watch on him.

          Did he find this specific spot during this years or was it before? I don’t know the answer, but we know it wasn’t after he recovered cause he already was working on the chase.

          Was it before he was 18 years old? how many of us find a spot and say ‘this is where I want to die’ at an age where we think of ourselves as immortals? Maybe some people.

          But we ‘the public’ don’t know where Forrest was at any time between 1972 and 1990. We can put together a list of places he’d mentioned in posts or interviews, but it will be a very short one.

    • From the Q/A above:
      Q:When was the first time you went to the place where you hid the treasure?
      A: I don’t want to answer that question. It is more of a clue than I want to give.


      Welcome to the Old Santa Fe Trading Co.
      Sixty years ago, a young boy walked along a mesa ancient in history. A passing summer thunderstorm had drenched him and painted a rainbow in the west. The pounding of the raindrops had uncovered the shaft of a projectile. The boy reached down to pick it up an, as he brushed off the mud, he saw a beautiful and perfect arrowhead. On that day long ago, a dream was born, that led to a remarkable life of discovering and collecting. The Old Santa Fe Trading Company grew as a result of these fantastic years……

      So, did a young boy find an arrowhead in a plowed field? Or, upon a mesa in perhaps New Mexico???

      ??Marketing hype?? Or…………..?

      —-something to ponder this winter 🙂

  55. Holy crap this is the biggest new trove of info I have come across in a while. Yeah yeah, I’m late to the party I see…but wow. He really divulges a lot here!

  56. “I don’t want to reveal when I discovered the spot. It is too much of a clue.”

    The way I see it, there are the NM years and the “traveling to WY/MT” years.

    For the NM years, he is an adult, and free to travel anywhere he pleases. In fact he does, and this may include NM, CO, WY, MT.

    For the childhood years, he is limited to where he can travel, and from the sounds of it, it was an annual route. This knocks out more of an area than if it was hidden in the NM years, therefore, I am leaning toward WY/MT based on this comment.

    Also, regarding his special spot, he has said “It’s a place I have visited a few times”.

    If it’s such a great spot, and close by (say in NM), since he is a free adult, why wouldn’t he have visited it MANY times? Instead, he has visited it a “few” times, as in, possibly…his teen years or thereabouts.

    And if it WAS a place in his later adult life, and only visited it “few” times, well, driving all the way to WY or MT would be a good reason for that! Not to mention, he said he had “fond memories” of this place. So all these things point me to WY/MT.

    • CP, you can look at it that way, but let me interject this. If he discovered the spot when he was younger it may point more to MT or WY yes. Older, it might point to NM or what about CO? Because he doesn’t mention it in his memoir we can assume that if he visited this state much it would be more when he is older and that would be a clue. I don’t think we can count driving through it on the way to Yellowstone unless it’s a gas station.

      • I agree. It’s a tenuous interpretation at best, but in this day and age in the chase, were looking for even subtle reasons! Maybe something to just skew probabilities in one direction or another.

  57. Q: “Why did you hide the treasure where you hid it?”
    “I love the way you worded that question. I think you are going to be a science fiction writer. The answer is in my book, TTOTC.”

    Let’s reword that question:
    ‘Why did you hide the treasure THERE (as opposed to some other spot)

    IF Forrest is answering the “why” regarding why he chose that exact spot, and he is telling us the answer is in TTOTC, since we know the spot is dear to him, is he then telling us that the answer as to why the spot is dear to him is in TTOTC?

    I think some people might read it as him answering the question “why did you hide the treasure”, but the kids question is asking why he hid it IN THAT SPOT so assuming Forrest answered what the kid actually asked, I think the reason why the spot is dear/special is in TTOTC.

    • if forrest loves the way the student worded his question why are you rewording the question?
      if you reword it would forrest still love the way it is worded?
      the kids question is not asking why he hid it IN THAT SPOT.
      the kid is asking why he hid it WHERE HE HID IT.
      forrest loves the wording because of the play on the word it.
      the first it is referring to the treasure or the box. the second it is referring to the word it. not just the word it, more specifically the word it in the poem.
      the word it is of great importance. especially when converting the poem into a map. which btw, happens to overlay almost perfectly into the real geography, as does oldrich farskys painting, both at the home of brown


      • oh yeah. the reference to the science fiction writer happens to be ray bradbury.
        or gene roddenbury.
        i think.
        remember that forrest said, i never said that it was buried, i never said that it wasnt buried.
        there IT is again.
        is it or is it not ray bradburied?
        or something

      • Well, luckily I didnt reword it for Forrest. I reworded it to simplify the interpretation for others because looking at the same thing from different angles can be helpful.

        “where you hid it” is a place. So the kid was asking why did you hide it in that place. So the answer as to why he hid it in that particular place is in TTOTC.

        • Corepuncher,

          There is alternative to “where” other-than “a spot” or the spot being of a 10″ square “particular place.”
          It could be considered as to what the poem’s depiction is ‘of the place’ where the chest lays in wait… which would include all the clue’s references.
          Example; does the question and/or answer refer to a tree within a forest -or- a forest itself, line of thinking.

          “Where you hid it” was not defined to a size of a place. In your attempt to reword ‘where’ to ‘there’ ~ while both words are similar ~ ‘there’ gives more attention to something or some place. ‘where’ is more generic and broader in meaning.
          fenn made an attempt to relay, he would answer the question as presented and not assume what is intended by the question;
          “I can see by the first question that your students probably are not asking what they want answered. I will answer the questions as presented and not judge them.”

          Changing the way the question was received could possibly have a different answer / response, only that answer might not be what we think it should be. {your idea; the reason why the spot is dear/special is in TTOTC}
          However, the answer does say; “… is in my book, TTOTC”
          LOL that includes the poem and the clues.
          Should this be the case.. is the “answer” told of in stanza 5 -?- rather than somewhere else within the pages of the book?

          This reminds me of another Q&A; *Are there clues in your book?* This question ‘seems’ to want to know; are there clues in the stories, pictures, stamps, illustration etc. And fenn again, answered the question as presented; “Yes, because the poem is in the book.”

          Your post was a good exercise to keep in mind; fenn seemingly does not judge /assume a question or questioner desire, but answers them as presented.

    • Hi Corepuncher;

      I agree with some who say – “Why reword it if Forrest liked it as it was phrased.”

      “Why did you hide the treasure where you hid it?” “Where you hid it” COULD be a very large geographical area – Let’s say YNP. Forrest likes YNP. YNP is vast. Forrest is giving away nothing – All he has said is that he likes WHERE it is hidden (In YNP) – not necessarily the exact spot where it is hidden.

      Let’s continue our pretend game. What if it is hidden near a sulfur geyser that smells of rotten eggs. This spot may have been ideal, since the sulfur (rotten egg) smell would cover the smell of his decaying body when he cast his body on the chest.

      I know, this destroys the “Ideal” picture we have in mind as to where it might be secreted, but remember, this is just a what-if.

      Again, “WHERE” can be a BIG area, not necessarily THE spot where Indulgence is secreted, and that is why Forrest MAY have liked the phrasing of the question – Just a thought – JDA

      • jda,
        i think that it behooves to think of IT as “the IT” or the word IT, instead of thinking of IT as the prior mentioned whatever. not only in this case but in the poem and beyond.
        in this case what im suggesting is that IT does not refer back to treasure, IT is an entity of and within itself.
        it is my belief that forrest also likes the way this question is worded for the following:
        “WHY did you hide the treasure where you hid IT?”
        because (from the poem):
        WHY is IT (that i must go)
        interesting is that this statement is not symmetrically equal:
        “why is it” is far different than “it is why”

        but i cant be serious according to some

        • BadgeR;

          How could the question have been asked without IT? I do not see a way. If there were, then your argument that IT is so important, but since I see no other way to state the question without using IT, To me, your argument lacks validity.

          In the poem. IT is used in several places – Begin IT… and take IT… From there IT’s…So why is IT…

          What is referred to by the use of IT or IT’s? Begin IT – Begin the journey or begin the quest. Take IT – again probably quest or journey. From there IT’s no place for the meek – defining a space or place and So why is IT – Thre IT could have been left out – Forrest could have just said – “So why must I go… but he added “is it” probably just for poem count and format.

          There is a whole thread about “What is IT” – maybe you should take a look – JMO – JDA

          How do any of these “IT’s” have anything to do with the question asked? Forrest did not tell the kid HOW to ask his question (or so we are told) so how can the kid’s “IT” have any connection to any if the “IT” or “IT’s” in the poem?

          Sorry, makes NO sense to me. JMO – JDA

          • i reckon ill continue this discussion on the what is IT page. or perhaps not.
            i pose a different perspective on something and before trying to make sense of what i said the criticism rolls in hard and fast that what i said makes no sense. thats no way to learn how to ride a backwards bicycle.
            a good exercise that may help make sense of what im trying to explain would be to try to write without using the word it. instead of using the word it, write what the word it is referring to. likewise when you read the word it try to consider all the things that the word it can be referring to. youll find that is sometimes many things.
            i believe that your observation of how the word it can be omitted (in many places) is significant and gives the word it more significance.
            if the poem can be read with or without the word it in several places and where the word it does appear yet refers back to nothing or something unknown, then it obviously is there for a reason. that reason is for the architecture of the poem.
            what if i said that parts of what the poem tells us means absolutely nothing to the solve, and that it is just a coherent series of words whose only purpose is to arrange the words in such a way that allows certain words to be connected graphically into a map or diagram.?
            i know…. i must be totally backwards bicycle…

          • BadgeR… I agree to some extent with what you are presenting… just so you know that there are some that give these things a hard look. Nothing should be taken too lightly….

          • BadreR;

            You say: “i pose a different perspective on something and before trying to make sense of what i said the criticism rolls in hard and fast that what i said makes no sense.”

            Badge, when you post something you are asking for criticism. I know, I have had my share, and that is all good.

            I DID try to make sense of what you had to say, and “I” was not successful at that.

            You pose trying to write something without an “IT” in it, and to substitute a different word for “IT” – Isn’t that what I did? I said that “Begin IT = Begin your journey or quest etc.

            You then say: “i believe that your observation of how the word it can be omitted (in many places) is significant and gives the word it more significance.”
            I mentioned only one case IN THE POEM where an “IT” COULD be eliminated. We are talking about the poem aren’t we? You chose to take an “IT” in a question and try to equate “IT” with other “IT’s” in the poem. My point was you can’t, logically in my mind, equate an “IT” in a not associated question with the few ITS in the poem.

            If this criticism is “Too hard and fast” sorry. I am just commenting on what I read. JMO at that’s IT – JDA

          • BadgeR;

            If I hurt your feelings or pride, I apologize. We each see the poem in a different way. I will take the blame and say that maybe I should have asked more questions about what your thoughts on “IT” were, and how you, in your mind, correlated an “IT” in a question with the various “IT’s” in the poem. Again, I apologize – JDA

        • BadgeR,

          The answer to, “WHY did you hide the treasure where you hid IT?” is in TTOTC on page 131 last paragraph, first two sentences. “I knew exactly where to hide the chest so it would be difficult to find but not impossible. It’s in the mountains somewhere north of Santa Fe.”f

          Why worry about IT when its clear that the chest is IT for the question. Also the chest is the same as IT in the quote above. IT = chest.

          Just Say’n

          • i thank all for any constructive criticism and no hard or hurt feelers here.
            im just doing a little fishing, trying to provoke some lurkers…not lunkers.
            i know not which are the right buttons but i just may push the one.
            i cant express how relieved i am that my approach is not widely accepted, and a conscious clear of selfishness the bonus. someone is very close that is abundantly clear and it could very well be me

    • You are welcome. I will try to not be so quick on the draw when replying to your posts – JDA

  58. Begin IT WWWH and take IT in the canyon down.

    Must “IT” refer to the same thing? I’ve always assumed as such but curious how many people think they are two different things? Grammatically I think it’s the same thing but I don’t think he’s too big on grammar.

    Second, if they are the same thing, does it refer to the “search” or something like a river or road? I’m leaning toward a combination of “search” and “road/river”.

  59. I am new to the blog but not to the Chase. In reading his response about Trails, which I’ve read and heard before I had a new take on HoB.

    What was your favorite Hike/Trail Yellowstone.?
    Trails are not favorites of mine. I always hiked off trails. Why go where everyone else had gone. The rangers didn’t like that, but I did and I was the one doing it. Do you see my logic?

    Maybe HoB is a generic Trail as the YNP Rangers are alluding to living on the trails and wear brown and the capital B makes it a Pronoun of Ranger collectively vs an individual ranger?

    Reason I love the blogs.. new ideas generated all the time.

    • DM, that was a stree-etch. Are you related to Hayley? I’m in search of the
      “cast aways” . . . kinda. All IMO.

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