Odds n Ends About Fenn’s Treasure Hunt…Part Seventy Five


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649 thoughts on “Odds n Ends About Fenn’s Treasure Hunt…Part Seventy Five

      • had a thought last night the best place to be is where you can hug mother earth and her beauty good hunting to all you treasure hunters with a plan stay safe the snow melt makes for dangerous waters. if it seems dangerous pass

    • I have had a solve for awhile now however life seems to get in the way of playing. If I am able to make a trip it will not happen until late August.

    • Perfect solve for every word of poem and every Forest clue. Need time, money and permission.

      • Finder–

        Are you one who thinks the poem has a religious conclusion? If so..could you throw us a bone and tell which passage(s)?

        Have a great day..


          • Finder,

            I agree as to the religious significance. I also agree as to all bits of the poem contain said significance. Searched my site twice now. No luck. I want the TC to be at this location, but after my 2nd trip I cannot fathom how it can be. Still, I have come to love this place I found because of this Chase. Sigh.

            Best of luck to you this year.

    • I’m still hung up on the West Yellowstone area. In August I went to one of my favorite two places last summer, after the water was too high in June and I REALLTY thought I had found it. I saw the blaze, followed it up to a lone tree with rocks piled below it and just KNEW it was there; what a thrill!!! Because it wasn’t there didn’t diminish the fun, I’ll head back this June and hope the water’s lower and search more thoroughly. I always come away with more than I started with, even empty handed.

      • Heh. Sudden random thought that amuses me:

        So “WY” is it. (West Yellowstone)
        That “I” must go. (Indulgence)

        • The west yellowstone locals refer to it by its nick name, ‘West’. Back when ff was a kid, the brown bears used to come to the city dump to eat, 25 or so at a time, it was at the end of what is now the airstrip. Kids from West would swim at baker hole, bears had to cross that area to get to the dump. Tourist and locals wod drive out there, park and watch the bears. Guess it was near the brown bears Home, lol, what do you think?

          • That explains why they still show up at the campground now and then. That and looking for fish, I guess, and chasing the occasional moose with her young.

      • I have a partial solution in the West Yellowstone area, but I am not confident enough in it to spend the travel money from Missouri to check it out. Still working on it.

      • If you’re treating that lone tree as a significant landmark intended as so
        by FF, please remember that everything in this hunt is supposed to last
        up to about 10,000 years. I don’t know many trees that are so durable.
        As always, in my opinion.

        • Dont think ff ever said that, we all say it, I understand why its said, but I donot recall ff ever saying that.

          • There were two lone trees in the general area, one had a lower case “f” carved in it. I say had because it blew over during the winter of ’17 and it landed on the side with the carving down. The “f” is now face down in the grass (similar to the headstone in Viet Nam). The other one was atop a large scree mound all by it’s lonesome and it had marked trees leading toward it. IMHO, all of the clues as I interpret them make sense there. Until I see the chest recovered I will continue to think that any solve is as good as another. I believe the contents and/or chest could be around in another 10,000 years but everything else, who knows? Good luck to all.

    • I’ve got a couple of new ones ready to go for Summer this year! One in particular has been getting me more and more excited.
      (Why does this always seem to happen right when it is the thick of Winter? lol!)

    • I do. I also know of at least one other person who has the same one as me. It will be a race to the specific location. I hope my car is faster than his…..

    • The general solve progresses forwards from year to year while the trail gets longer and longer from the same wwwh.

      It’s the story that continually requires refinement.

    • I agree. Too dangerous in the mountains during winter. Summer is ideal for me because I don’t have to worry about spring runoff or mud.

    • I have been hearing that the snowpack in the Rockies is especially high this season. Snow levels in January this year are already higher than what they were at the end of Winter last year (at least here in Colorado). It has me thinking that June may still have too much unmelted snow in the forests and the high country and that July may be the better month to start BOTG searching.

      • Blex, I live in Colorado and today I took a long walk wearing a t-shirt and long pants. No polar vortex here. Colorado is the best imo.

        • I was out in a t-shirt today and no jacket in Montana as well. More for the looks then anything else.

          • I was not perky if that’s what your getting at, lol.

            I identify as male but will of course avoid the obvious paradox.

  1. Was watching Jeopardy on tv the other day and it made me think. Can each clue be defined in a “what is ……….”answer? Heavy loads and water high would be canjilon? Ever drawing nigh would be left. Each line reads like a definition. My idea is what happens if you condense it down to 7 words?

    • Yes I am ready for the race I can count at least 5 that are in the ball game so far not counting lurkers that are not saying anything.How do I know this is by there wispers.Its like Fenn said you will know before you go ,anything else is expensive folly, have a nice vacation.There are a lot of smart people here on this site and they are over looking some of the simples little things to get them on Fenn’s wave and ride it to the end.Clint

  2. If I felt super confident about my location I would have no problem hiking thru the snow and going straight to it and digging in the snow to do it. The snow would not stop me from going. Even forrest said someone could. Where people get into trouble is not being sure about where.

    • Fenn didn’t mention it anywhere, but what if the access to the hiding place is closed or blocked during the winter like Yellowstone National Park?
      — MK

      • MK – Isn’t that why he tells us to shut it down when the snow flies? The green gate closes the road IMO

        • Hi Sandy,
          Maybe you’re right, who knows? Even if you want to go and shovel your way to the chest, you can not physically enter into the park. I think a couple roads in the park start to open sometime in May and the remaining roads open sequentially until the end of May.
          — MK

      • Forrest did say this but later after people got into trouble with weather he suggested waiting for spring.
        An experienced outdoors person could indeed go right to it. If you knew where it was. If I knew I would! IF unablle to walk I would crawl.
        You have to understand and know what your doing!
        Also Ive been on the chase for along time. AND I have listened to everything Forrest has said. I still am not confident to go in winter now. But I have hiked searching in snow. Not recommended for the meek!

        • Last year I was over-zealous to get out to my search area that I pushed the edge of winter and spring (there was still snow on the ground). I went to a waterfall near the border of Yellowstone National Park and even walked behind it to the dismay of my mother who was with me. The noise made it so we couldn’t hear each other. From her her perspective I opened an umbrella and walked into the waterfall. I of course was unscathed but later went back to that spot for a second BOTG after the snow had more time to melt. That time I didn’t even try to get close as the noise of the falls alone was at least 10x louder and I didn’t feel like it was safe to even try.

          When I was younger I once got to spend 10 days deep in the mountains of Montana. My favorite activity was jumping into deep snow as it felt like the equivalent of jumping onto a cloud. I of course was dressed appropriately and each time just dug my way back to the path I had jumped from. Sadly I don’t think Montana has had as much snowpack since that winter.

          I also have folfed in the winter but that requires traction aids that can handle hiking up sheets of ice.

    • Lou, you sound exactly like me on my first BOTG trip a couple of years ago when I went searching in March. I learned the hard way that, in spite of my confidence, I should have waited for the snows to melt!

  3. Secret agent Brando….developed leukemia…

    When he’s healthy again (with the help of the Mayo brothers); the Deputy, Brando and I will attempt to move heaven and earth to retrieve it.

    1F Billy

      • Dear JBL and PDenver:

        Secret Agent Brando: is married to my daughter. Together they have a little boy; William. Brando is the nicest guy and the best son-in-law but he actually turned out to be a double agent! You see….

        We laid a trap for a fox. I wanted to observe the reaction of the ole’ fox when he was surprised. I couldn’t do it myself, for the fox had previously been tricked by me and was likely to remember my face.

        …and so I asked secret agent Brando to spring the trap. The plan and trap went down like this.

        The charity drawing for Jdiggins was about to happen. The fox would be there in his den. Secret agent Brando was to buy a book and then ask the fox to sign and dedicate the book. The dedication was to read: To Joe Jr.-
        For your dad Joseph P. Dunn
        We will never forget

        When given his assignment, the fox hesitated a moment and then went to work. (The wheels were turning though) He must have been thinking, “this fella is too young to be Joe Jr.”

        Completing his assignment; the fox asked Brando; “What’s your name?” When secret agent Brando told him he asked; “Is that your real name or your stage name?” Then they both laughed. Then the ole fox told Brando his stage name.

        But secret agent then went rogue. Off script, he then asked the fox for another dedication on another book; it read:

        “To Sherif Billy-
        Forrest Fenn”
        I am not sure if there is a moral in this story, but it may be, don’t go rogue or you will get leukemia. (Get well soon Brando, I love you buddy)

        My new avatar is related to clue #7. I found it outside the pharmacy of the Eisenberg building of Methodist Hospital on the Mayo campus. It is composed of a lot of small colored tiles making a mosaic. It’s quite beautiful.

        Best regards;

        Sherif Billy

        • So Sherif Billy – are you really Forrest Fenn since the dedication reads :

          “To Sherif Billy-
          Forrest Fenn”

          Just askin – JDA

        • Hello Sherif Billy. I believe your son-in-law has a good support system, which will help him. As for trying to outwit the one you spoke of, what did you learn? With the mentioning of Mr. Dunn, I hope he’ll be found and returned home.

    • Hey Easy dont forget about the silver bracelet in the chest! A puzzle alone is fun but its pretty cool there is also a treasure 🙂

      • I think there is a lot more then meets the eye. You may find your own self worth, givin you are the one who solves it.

        I also believe that there is way more to the puzzle then appears on the surface. The real Treasure is what’s behind closed doors. You just have to open them. The message is there.

        I’m not as worried about finding it as what to do after I recover it. That sounds a little like I’m to sure of myself. But spring will tell all. And someone will know for sure.

    • I 100% agree. That’s why once the treasure is discovered and only the puzzle remains….nothing will have changed at all about the chase. Not one thing, except folks aren’t likely to lose their life, home, etc, over a puzzle. The gold has blinding qualities that the puzzle reveals.

        • I plan on allowing folks to just keep on keeping on with the chase forever – less the gold as motivation to have adventures and be in wilderness. The chase is not mine to end. It’s up to each individual to end it for themselves imo. Money is not life or chase.

          • I have been thinking about this. I mostly agree. If I am the finder, I would, at a minimum, ask Mr. Fenn his wishes or recommendations for any post-find reveals/discussions/etc.

    • Turn your engines off til spring was brilliant; evil genius. Treasure or not, this puzzle has been worth every moment.

    • Hello EasyPeasy. I’ve personally found the Chase to be so much more, and it’s all been a treasure.

      • pdenver-
        Agree. I feel like we met before. 🙂 The adventure and the searchers in the Chase … certainly a treasure. A good time will be had by all … whether they are the finders or not. It’s like being on the Super Bowl winning team but only one player gets to be MVP. Still fun. Time of your life. Yea … we’ve met. 😉

        • I do hope searchers are having a good time. If you should think it’s me which you’ve seen, be sure to smile because it just might be. A smile may go a long way in someone’s life.

    • Ken,

      Are you saying that your confident it won,t be found until 2020? Or is it going to take that long for you to get ready to go there. Or to raise the scratch to go?

      Curious why until 2020?

      • Charlie… I was just bored and the comment was made with tongue in cheek. I did not get to search 2018 due to life commitments…I am patient and maybe I can break away this season. 2020 does have a good ring to it though…carry on.

    • Ken,

      I posed some ?’s coming up, it’s in moderation because I messed up with my handle, stay tuned.

    • Hi Ken
      I think you are going to be a year to late. What ever happened to kettle Korn I haven’t seen him here sense last year?

    • Good for you. There’s much to see and enjoy in NM. Mountains, desert, ancient ruins. Sage, cacti, pine, aspen. Elk, deer, lizards, snakes. NO grizzly.

      I’ve done a couple dozen botg in NM. Don’t have the foggiest clue WWWH. Have had a blast each and every time.

      • Yea everything but Grizzer and T.C.
        Ben there done that did that.We did have a good vacation though.Clint

  4. I didn’t have a strong new solve last year until too close to the fall snows to try it, so we’re waiting until late spring; the exact date depends on the snowpack, among other things. We did other travel and outdoor stuff instead; that’s one mild downside of the Chase, it can divert you from other places of scenic interest. This year, we hope to swing by Steamboat Geyser during our trip and, with any luck, see it letting loose.

    As for people finding the chest thinking they can keep the location secret after the fact, it might not be so easy. Whichever state it’s found in will no doubt want their share of tax money from it, and various authorities may insist on knowing the location to at least some degree of specificity to satisfy their red tape. They might demand some kind of evidence that it wasn’t found on private land, in a national park, etc. I know lots of “what do I do if I find it” threads exist, but I don’t recall anyone mentioning just what information the state would require in such a situation. Anybody know, or can direct us to a previous post on this?

  5. I believe I have figured out something important to the chase. I know we all just love the story of FF and the waterfall in My War For Me. But, what if that was not the only tranquil story FF was spared to tell? What if there is another story in My War For Me that says the same thing in a different way? And why the repeated themes; “church is in the mountains”, nickels, jobs from fashioning marbles to fighting in wars, mirrors/reflections, dreams and fantasies, etc. These ideas are not sprinkled accidently, although they may be sprinkled randomly. But, they all tell exactly the same story in different ways. Every story in TTOTC is luring us! And that is why FF’s grand-dau was told she had to tie her own flies. Does anyone else know what it is about these stories that tie them together and what message they really tell? It is so simple that a three year old child could figure it out, and yet it is woven so masterfully into the stories that we cannot see the Forrest for the trees. And, what is it about those trees anyway? I know the answers IMO. I’m writing a book with an analysis of FF’s book TTOTC as it relates to the poem. I hope it is ready to go to print in the next few weeks. There is no guessing involved in this poem. It tells us exactly where to go. The words truly mean exactly what they say. If I can arrange my schedule, I’m heading out shortly to the place on the map that is married to the poem. It really is so simple now. IMO

    • We should talk. I think we both are in Fenn’s mind. I have been to the location and know the place well after a few visits and solving the metaphysical part. I just ran out of time to finish digging the pile and ran into a legal issue at the same time. Perhaps you have the legal issue solved, I think I know who to speak with. My shovel and digging bar are still secreted close by. However, the grizzlies and wolves inhabiting the area do not make the location safe for the duration of the winter or early spring and the snows hide obstacles that make the terrain unsafe. If we share the solve, which I believe we do, you will know what I mean.

      • Hi Finder
        I think you migh be close like Flutterby and Sparrow but if you have to use bar and shovel you better re-evaluate your solve.Fenn said no spicial tools needed.

        • You could just kick with shoes but would ruin shoes and toes, digging bar super effective at clearing piles and has long pointy sharp end in case of grizzly charge, just sayin’

        • Clint
          I’m a little perplexed about Mr Fenn. Stating that no special tools are needed to recover the chest. I have heard this before. Do you know for sure that’s what he said and were this info came from.
          I can’t find that anywhere.

    • Hi Flutterby
      I think you should have T.C.in hand before book release and solve comes out.I also like you have solve done and married it all to a vary special spot.I could go now but way to much snow and I do not want to go all that way to dig trough 70″ plus of snow.when I go I want to be looking at bare ground ,I do not want to miss anything .

    • Hello Flutterby. I do believe the stories may be teaching us different things. I hope your book is successful.

  6. Just wanted to say thanks to Muset and J A Kraven for help cleaning up some Google Translated German. Good work!

    • That journal was a great find. Nice to have some new bits related to the provenance of Indulgence. Interesting that the author speculated the plaster one to be a wedding gift box. It makes sense, given the subject matter of the allegory.

      If Indulgence is indeed from c. 1150, it would be the earliest known example of that allegory, I think.

      Now a little daydream (I’m just pondering; there is no evidence): Eleanor of Aquitaine married Henry Plantagenet in 1152. Imagine Indulgence containing a gift fit for one of history’s best known Queen of France and England…

    • With a little further searching I found this manuscript made by donation from Eleanor of Aquitaine.


      There is a psalter of Eleanor herself in it. Notice the towers and building in the background behind her. Same as on Indulgence. Combine that with Eleanor’s reputation for chivalry and her Court of Love… My guess is that the lid of Indulgence is a stylized picture of Poitiers Palace as it would have looked in the late 12th century.

      I hope I’m not feeding a fed horse here…

  7. Revisiting some favorite nature literature, I came across this one penned by John Muir in his ‘My First Summer in the Sierra’:

    “Wherever we go in the mountains, or indeed in any of God’s wild fields, we find more than we seek.”

    Personally, I think the ‘canasta’ comment was poor guidance. Go be cold, brave and in the wood, regardless of whether you have nailed down the first clue.

      • Yes, EasyPeasy, you learn to meld and work with incomplete sets. Perfect for connecting the hints & clues.

      • I think it was Bill Clinton who said “it depends on what your definition of ‘the treasure’ is”

        Though I may be foggy on this…

    • This is a good quote, aardvarkbark. Thank you for sharing it. When one is silent and uses their senses, the places become most memorable.

      • You’re welcome pd. Frankly, I’ve always been confused by f’s ‘canasta’ comment. To sit at home and agonize over WWWH at the expense of loading up the kiddos in the pick-up and heading out to enjoy nature, wildness and what it teaches, seems to be at odds with his stated noble purpose for the Chase.

        Though he never asked the impertinent Border’s staff for the Shakespeare section, nor threw Hamlet upon Time in his wastepaper basket, I’ve always thought his intended message has been:

        ‘Get thee to a wilderness!’

  8. So I want to go over something that I see within this poem. This is my opinion only and may not be the actual case but its what I am personally gathering from it. I do believe its important to talk about all aspects of this poem whether they are negative or positive. So please just hear me out and let me know your thoughts or your arguments. Again, keep in mind that this is just an opinion.

    Let me start by asking a question. What does a treasure chest and poem have in common with a memoir book? To me there’s only one answer and we’ll get to that but honestly what is the relationship between the two? They are completely seperate identities and subjects. Also, keep in mind that there are hints in the book that were not deliberately placed to aid the seeker. This tells me that there is in fact a relationship between Mr. Fenn’s experiences, where this “secret place” is and the treasure chest. How could this be when all these stories are from so many different places and where most of them do not take place within the search area? There is only one connection between that book, its stories and the chest which is the title of the book, The Thrill of The Chase.

    Forrest has said many times that everything you need is within the poem. He’s also told us you do not need the book. Hmmmmm. That seems a bit funny to me. Then why combine them? Imagine 100 years from now you stumble upon a copy of this poem written by another man’s hand and tucked away in some old library. No mention of the author. No mention of the Rocky Mountains and nothing online. All you have are those words in the poem. Should I be able to locate this chest? Mr. Fenn says yes. All you need to find the chest is within the poem, some imagination and a little research. Okay. So lets look at just the poem itself and pretend we know nothing else but those words.

    The first stanza tells us what he has done, that there’s a secret place and he’s going to hint about this place using new and old riches. The next three stanzas describe a place and/or give you directions, vaguely. Still no starting point. Fifth stanza asks a question and explains what he has done. The last stanza sums it all up in a conclusion of what will happen when you set out to seek this place and its treasure.

    We know he has a secret location. We have vague directions and a vague description of a place, a very vague description that can be interpreted in many, many ways. This was done on purpose. He used specific words to hold your interest and gave you a story that made you believe you could easily crack this and find this chest, you can find it and you also cannot. It depends on how much time and money you have to search. Its difficult to find but not impossible. What Mr. Fenn is really giving you is what he loved the most and the answer he already knows according to the fith stanza which is the title of his book. Its all about the thrill of the chase. He has said it has always been about the thrill of the chase for him. Can you now see the connection between the poem, the chest and a memoir book? Mr. Fenn wants you to go out there and make a memory, to have an experience. He wants you to write your own memoir. He said in his book everyone should. So why is it that he must go and leave his trove for all to seek? He had his turn just as he talked about Shakespeare and how the world is a stage and as one exits a new comes in to play their part and makes room for the next. He told us this by saying I’ve done it tired and now im weak. Mr. Fenn played his part and now has to make room for the next but the next is distracted by technology and many people never get that chance to experience the thrill of the chase as he has done. He wanted to share that. Theres only one way to get people off their couches….entice them with a real treasure filled with gold and more. Mr. Fenn accomplished what he set out to do. Gave the thrill of the chase to over 350K people.

    The last stanza explaines why you can and cannot find this chest but also explaines you wont go home empty handed ever. Your effort will be worth the cold. Each and everytime you set foot out to the Rocky Mountains you gained a memory and an experience. Your effort of failing was worth it. You gained an experience and have a blast engaging in the thrill of the chase. He said his favorite part is about all this is reading those emails thanking him for such a wonderful experience and memory. The only way it can be worth it is by being brave and in the wood which means getting off your couch, throwing a bedroll in the back of a pick-up truck and heading out to the mountains and having your own thrill of the chase. Each and every time you do that you have been given the title to the gold. The golden memory, experience and the thrill of that chase to add to your own memoir.

    Lets face it, the poem can be interpreted in many ways and it has. Even the ones that solved the first 2 clues didnt even know it. Heres a few things that I want to point out.

    1. On the back of his map he wrote, thread a tract through the wiles of nature and circumstance to the treasure. Wiles means devious, cunning stratagems to manipulate or persue someone to do what one wants. Circumstance means and event or fact that causes something to happen. Mr. Fenn manipulated you think you can find his chest through writing with vagueness to get you to get out there and off your couch. The circumstance is he caused this to happen.

    2. He also wrote that the path would not be direct for “those” who had no certainty of the location beforehand but sure for the “one” who did. “Those” meaning the searches, all of them. “One” meaning Mr. Fenn. He told us he was the only one who knew the location of that chest. He worded this again in a cunning way. Manipulating us to think we could know the area beforehand. You cannot. He told me personally It was written vague on purpose. He knew the only way to find this chest was to go out and search your every solve until you found it and giving you the experience of that thrill of the chase.

    I say you cannot find it because he stated you wont even realize you discovered wwwh until you have the chest. That means you will never know you have the correct starting place until you go there and find that chest. Once the chest is in hand you can definitively say you discovered wwwh. Again, the path will not be direct for those who have no certainty of the location beforehand but sure for the who did.

    Is the chest real? Is it really out in the mountains? Absolutely. Can you really find it? Yes, but it will be a process of elimination and could take a few lifetimes and a heavy wallet to do so.

    Like I have said this is just my opinion only. Take it as you wish but I will leave you with one last thing. Over 350K people have tried to solve this poem with no success. Thats a lot of people, smart ones, creative ones, average ones, professional ones… and not one has solved this poem or passed the second clue and the ones who solved the first two clues never even knew it. Forrest Fenn is an average man with some creativity that we all possess. There is only one way he could have accomplished this and that was to be vague so no one could solve it until they had the chest.

    Leave me your thoughts and comments. Id like to hear them.

    • Pete –
      Mr. Fenn ain’t average by a long shot, and your assumption that no one has solved the puzzle is a bit presumptuous. The poem is not vague. It’s as precise as it can possibly be. There are two paths to the treasure. One for the genius and another for rednecks. Chose wisely.

      • I agree with you Pete, every year many claim to have solved it and yet it remains to be seen…
        I may be a redneck but I have yet to see a genius come forth with it.

      • “There are two paths to the treasure. One for the genius and another for rednecks. Chose wisely.”

        I disagree. What about the redneck genius?

      • EasyPeasy; Exactamundo! …And the wisdom to know the difference.

        Kinda reminds me of senior Fenn’s little nugget: “Who would you rather have working on your car…”.

      • ie: “bit presumptuous”. I would say it is a bit more like seeing 8 years of people saying they solved the poem, including this year/winter.. it looks more like … a general rule of experience than “presumptuous” 🙂

    • Hi Pete, Some good thoughts. Yeah, Mr. Fenn tells us that searchers have been a few hundred feet from the chest, but apparently never noticed anything that could be related to the poem. Nothing they saw at the spot or on the way to it gave them a clue that they were on the right track. It doesn’t sound like the poem is very descriptive of the location, or the clues leading to it. Unless the poem is saying something other than what it appears to be saying , if taken at face value. Mr. Fenn has said that the poem is straight forward, and that the words mean exactly what they say. It’s a conundrum.

    • Pete,
      Fenn spent 15 years writing and polishing the poem. If he wanted to write something vague and non-specific, like you’re suggesting, it could have been cranked out in a weekend. As I see it Forrest spent 15 years hiding the information in the poem, then spent an afternoon hiding the chest. That doesn’t suggest to me that the BOTG part is going to be the hard part for the finder.

        • Hi Dal
          Did Forrest say no special tools needed like bar or shovel I could not find it but though I read it some where .Clint

      • Like I said, I emailed Fenn years back and told him his poem was impossible as it was written too vague and could be interpreted in many ways. His reply was and I quote, “My poem was written vague on purpose.”

    • Um, that’s a no go in my book Pete. It seems you are basing this post on a comment made by Fenn answering some questions in an email from a journalist in Italy; specifically…’Do expect that people will somehow *know* for sure once they have found the first clue?’ Fenn’s answer to this open ended question is; ” No, many people have found the first clue but they didn’t know it. Until someone finds the treasure they will not know that they have discovered the first clue.”
      Fenn has explained that he answers Q’s as presented…and this one is a good example. In all honesty, I believe he is straightforward in answering the way he did…the folks who found the first clue and didn’t know it, won’t know they did until someone else finds the treasure and reveals the solution. Fenn has said a bazillion times that a searcher has to solve all the clues to find the treasure…to me, this means solving the clues and then acting upon it.
      Here’s a good quote from the Q and A at The Lure to illustrate… ” You’re going to have to figure out the clues. Go to the first clue, and then the clues are consecutive after that. If you can decipher the clues, you’re gonna find that treasure chest.”
      I believe that without deciphering all of the clues, a speculative wwh is worthless to act upon.

      • From your quote – “…clues are consecutive” – which can mean in a straight line, I get one message. From your last line, I get another – HUMMM??? So many interpretations in this game – JDA

      • I would agree completely with Dal and Ken’s comments. Especially the Fenn quote giving its accuracy as stated. I’m quite sure the poem does many things. It is as simple as it reads but is loaded with hidden clues and or hints to Assist you along the way. There is no one way to figure it out. That’s just my opinion and it has been shot down a few times.
        I do know for sure that whatever you figure out is pointless unless you can attach it to the right location and that’s impossible without the correct beginning.

        About those rednecks. Many are or close to being genius and should not be discounted.
        Fenns comment on the redneck family was in response to a question about his audience. And the redneck comment came to play.
        Maybe the clue was don’t underestimate the intelligence of rednecks. This comes full circle to me and thought this should be clarified.
        These are just my opinions
        But I’m sure whoever finds it and then retrieves it will have paid there dues for it.

      • But…. can you decipher the clues correctly? that is the issue. There are many answers to wwwh….many. How do you know which is correct. As a matter of fact there are thousands of solves for all the clues. which one is right and how do you know? you wont have your conformation until you find the chest. Process of elimination. Fenn himself has told me in an email that the poem itself was written vague on purpose. That was not from any interview but a personal interaction with Fenn and myself. I’m seeing the poem for what it is. IMO it seems to be describing just what I have explained. I have looked at this poem for 8 plus years and have come to many different solves. This is the only that makes sense. It’s not forced and answers what he loved, what he wanted and how he had to make it happen the way that it should.

        • You’ve written the author of a riddle telling him his riddle is too hard and vague, what else was he going to say but “Thank you”?

          if you had written him and said his work was too easy, he would apologize instead.

          you are basically telling him, (and us) what we already know, the riddle is hard, and the word “warm” is vague… yes we know the word “warm” is vague, the poem is vague on purpose, are you saying that is a revelation?

          so here it is in a nutshell,
          The possible solutions are not in the millions. the possible solutions that are reasonably based (meaning the answers to nine clues all make sense on a tangible level) are in the billions, literally. The poem/riddle’s answer is difficult, nigh impossible. Yes we know already.

          And that “billions” number, that is not including the solutions where someone would wonder if the person who came up with the solution was smoking something. I am talking real tangible level solutions. If someone doesn’t believe that number, they need to do quick research on the outcome of a 9 level solution to a simple lottery. Yet here we are talking about ‘vague’ possible clues/answer rather than simple numbers 0 thru 9. And even that simple number version stretches into the billions of outcomes.

          it means a serious amount of work. In the future people will scoff at someone spending ’10 years’ or even ’50 years’ only using a pad and pencil, wondering why they only came up with 10 million possible outcomes, asking why is this problem so “hard”… so “vague”.

          It takes SERIOUS amounts of imaginative problem solving, along with work/processing that info to match.

          People are not willing to admit to that yet, that is fine, they will; give it another several years.

          ff has given encouragement with the 200′ and 500′ comments, until you realize the person that was 200′ was “one” person (with possibility of people with him) and he was there because he was a ‘friend/ acquaintance’ of ff’s, who in my opinion many years ago was told by ff of a special spot and it was describe well enough to go there. So he didn’t actually solve any of the clues IMO. There is no other reason why a ‘friend/ etc’ would be the only one to get to within 200′ IMO, which I think is a pretty good guess/opinion 🙂

          then there are the 500′ people. ‘lots of them’ until you realize IMO that most likely there is a human trail that goes by the spot at about 500′, and ‘lots’ of people including searchers routinely go by there normally. none of which IMO solved any of the clues to a level that involves confidence (when they come back empty handed, confidence is usually shaken, at least for people who are thinking clearly).

          If one thinks 500′ is close. They need to go out on their street and mark off 500′, or hit a golf ball with a blind fold on; then go find that golf ball.

          Then there are the people who solved the “first two clues”. Well think about it, how many people get 1 number right in a lottery. And guess what, they won’t know it either, until the lottery outcome is announced. So yes eventually “lots” of people will get the first one or two clues, they just never will know it.

    • Pete,

      You said, “I say you cannot find it because he stated you wont even realize you discovered wwwh until you have the chest.

      Also, you said in part, “… and not one has solved this poem or passed the second clue and the ones who solved the first two clues never even knew it.” I agree that no one has solved the poem, but you seem to contradict yourself.

      F has mentioned things such as all 9 clues need to be solved, there are no shortcuts. He also mentions that folks have been within 200′ & 500′ of the chest. How do you suppose that folks have gotten that close to the chest? This seems to indicated that a majority of the clues have been solved. WWWH is the first clue and you cannot proceed to the next clue without nailing down wwwh as F suggests.

      The quote, “the path will not be direct for those who have no certainty of the location beforehand but sure for the who did.” this also indicates somewhat that F is talking about that all clues not just wwwh. needs to be solved to retrieve the chest.

      Yes the poem is vague, because F wants all to do their homework right from the start all of the way to the end. The poem is difficult but not impossible, the one who is certain of the location, did their homework and learned all of the clues.

      Why didn’t you just come out and say you can’t find wwwh, instead of using excuses to not doing your homework.

      Just Say’n

      • I have been on this over 8 years. I have done my homework and can show you hundreds of solves and are not by any means excuses. It’s logic.

        Also, I don’t understand the contradiction you speak of. Fenn has said no one till this date has gotten past the second clue so I know not all clues have been solved. If someone had got the second clue it must mean they have found the what of wwwh. if they know what it is they must know where it is and that is knowing the location beforehand. I can bet the people who have been 200′ and 500′ have been the ones who have solved the first 2 clues and I also know that they were still completely lost even though they knew the starting place which is the location beforehand. My issue is how do you know you have solved the first clue in order to move on to the second clue? you cannot so you would have to go back to the first clue and reevaluate it and then move to the second clue again. Your only conformation that your first clue is right is getting the chest in hand. so you can never be 100% sure youre right to begin with.

    • Hi Pete,

      I do think the poem is straight forward and the book is not required to solve it, and I agree it is vague as it is written.

      Consider this: Maybe there is another whole puzzle within the poem that will help you along, and the book has some hints that will help you solve that puzzle within the poem. If that is true, we might expect the puzzle in the poem requires rules and constraints to get the correct solution.

      In summary, I think you need to find the puzzle and its associated rules before you even get started on the ground.

      I propose you have not found that puzzle within the poem or any of its associated rules.

    • Pete,
      As we all run in circles on this I just have to put this out there. The end location is a special place to Forrest. He went here often and even wanted to die there. You want to know where the chest is, you need to know the man that hid it. That’s why there is a couple of companion books out there with ramblings from his life. They are not direct solves, just stories from his life. So that you can get to know and understand him. You understand him better and the clues will fit better when you find the right spot. Why does a man wander in the woods? Read the book and it’s in there.

      As winter plows on and the snow remains piled high in the Rockies, take a bit of time to learn about the man and what he has done. Then, go back and reread the poem. See if any of the references make a bit more sense. For me at least some things did. I have a solve template in my notes now that makes sense to me. I look up and read about many places and then try to apply my solve to a location and see if it sticks. If it makes sense to me and my template AND to my idea of the man Forrest is, then I put it on my wish list for places to check out some day. My list is very short. Some places have been picked over already too. That does not deterr me. I have my solve for all the clues. Previous searchers may not have had all nine clues sorted or maybe read them different. Certain someones has been within 500 and 200 ft of the chest. That means if I choose some place nobody has ever mentioned its a bit higher odds it’s not the right place.

      Ground Truth! Nice term to use in the search. Forrest mentioned “Boots on the ground” in his explanation. So many battlefield soldier terms but they match perfect for an operation to find a missing item. You look at a good spot on a map, plan a trip, and you and your posse arrive on the scene. Well, you may not realize by looking at the map that the topo of the place would require you to be a mountain goat incarnate to get up there. Can an 80 year old make it up that!? No? Well that’s ground truth. We learn to just enjoy the trip and move along. Can’t pull a little love out of a road trip the yields little but a few nice photos and a chat with a local? “No, I want to be upset!” That’s personal ground truth, and we don’t invite that guy to go with us next time.
      The blaze is a big unkown to me. I have an idea what I think it might be, but I have to have open eyes for something a bit different. That’s ground truth again.
      The chest is out there, just got to believe it. The clues are vague, but they will make perfect sense when you have a solution that works. Or when that day finally comes that we all dread. News that someone else found it. Will we then learn the solve and hate ourselves for not seeing it? What will we do with ourselves then? Will life go on? Will Forrest be broken hearted if it all ends this year?

    • But a clue is a piece of truthful information with many interpretations. how will you know that clue can even be identifiable enough to help you.

      Here’s a clue. Take 3 left turns.
      What am I talking about? you’ll never know and you’ll never be certain unless I tell you that you’re right or wrong. This is the same as wwwh. Many people have solved all nine clues but dont have the chest. does that mean they were wrong or right? its neither. Maybe they didnt see the chest. maybe they missed one thing. how do they know their first clue was right? If it was wrong the rest of the 8 will be too and youre starting all over again.

      • Pete,
        So you believe a clue can only be a piece of truthful information with many interpretations?

        • How’s this for examples of imagination? It isn’t too far from Alcatraz to San Francisco, but it’s too far to walk. Also, if the Home of Brown was Alcatraz, as long as I put in south of that latitude or lower than that elevation, I put in below the home of Brown.

    • It comes in trying to figure out what the piece of truthful information is meaning or representing. You have to be creative and imaginative to figure out what that clue’s meaning is as it can have so many different interpretations.

      • No. The clues provide only so much of the overall solve. You will need to use your imagination to complete the remainder of the picture. My opinion.

  9. I like this statement very much, “the path will not be direct for those who have no certainty of the location beforehand but sure for the one who did.”f

    Some folks think that botg are needed from the hoB could very well be incorrect by the last words quoted from F, “but sure for the one who did.” Seems to me that “one who did” know the location before hand, knew what all the clues are and then put botg to retrieve the chest at the very end of the clues. It doesn’t make sense at least to me, to put botg to search out the rest of the clues after hoB, because I didn’t know of the location of the tc beforehand. This type of effort would be much like looking for a needle in a haystack and working for a hope and a prayer.

    I for one am not going to put botg if I didn’t know where I was going. I knew where I was going when I did put botg twice last summer, even though I didn’t retrieve the tc. Doesn’t mean I was not in the right area, but does indicate that I didn’t know the location of the tc. Goes back to say, the area is huge, but the location is small.

    I surely can enjoy the mountains and what they have to offer while going to and at the area, prior to retrieving the chest. I look at the “big picture” which is a map, more so with GE while trying to marry the poem to the map. Isn’t that what F said to marry the poem to a map? That in its self doesn’t require botg in trying to do so, but is only needed to retrieve, sure for the one who knew beforehand. As always……

    Just Say’n

    • Charlie M. You finally said something that is correct.
      The master creator of this game said if you know we’re it is you would be on your way to get it.
      Correct me if I’m wrong.

      I don’t think anyone is paying attention anymore
      I know I have been guilty.
      Yes all the clues are in the stories. The man said so.
      He has told everyone what they need to know over and over.

      • Ghopper –

        What do you mean when you say “all the clues are in the stories”.

        Do you mean that Forrest names the places that are referred to in the clues?


    • CharlieM, that’s good stuff you’re pulling out of your hat, just like a court magician.

      • Lori,

        I don’t know if I should take your comment as good or bad. I will say there is no magic being pulled out of a hat. I thought about how to respond to you, so I took my time.

        Thanks anyway!

  10. First comment. I believe many people have solved many of the clues by lucky guessing wwwh. This is why they have walked right past the chest. Only the person who has solved how to get to wwwh will solve the location of the chest.

  11. Bezel;

    What difference does it make whether you “Lucky guess” wwwh, or you solve for it? You are at the same place aren’t you? Once at the correct wwwh (Guess or solve) it is then on to clue #2 then clue #3. JMO – JDA

  12. Nope. If you guessed you will never find the chest. There is a method to the solve. Once done, you will be able to walk to the chest. No wandering or wondering. Same area is not the same as the spot.

  13. Fenn could have written the poem like “Begin it at the location A … then Put in below the location B … then Find the blaze at the location C … then Finally find the chest at the location D.” Easy going and everybody gets the solution to the poem. No thrill at all.

    Or he could have written the poem instead like “Begin it at the location nowhere … then Put in below you-don’t-know-where … then Find the blaze at any place … then Find the chest at my hiding place.” Hard to crack. Nobody will find the chest ever. Infinite thrill before somebody turns up with the chest in the year 3,000 AD, maybe.

    But we have his poem currently on our hands. Fenn said it’s a very straight forward one. There are 9 consecutive clues hidden somewhere among 24 lines. Kids can solve it, and a little girl in India can only solve the first two clues online. Not one of the 350,000 people could be able to solve it. Somebody said it is impossible to solve it. Another said it will take forever to solve it. Fenn said that some searchers were able to come within 200′ or 500′ from the chest without their knowing it.

    He said the searchers to “Look at the big picture.” So I looked at the big picture. It was really big, but I could see everything, all the locations and what I was looking for during the last several months.

    What I’m trying to say here is that it can be solved in our lifetime, and it will be solved in a year or two (according to my little hunch, thank you). I understand the frustration of many searchers not only for their inability to find the chest but also for their incapability to find the solve, I mean, the correct solve, not the general solves.

    Anybody can post their comments, but posting a negative comment saying that there is no solve and/or nobody will be able to solve it in our lifetime is not only undesirable but also not constructive IMO. They will not help the other searchers at all. We are all trying to find the chest hidden somewhere in the Rocky Mountains. It’s there waiting for us to find. Let’s do it.

    — MK

      • Hi Lugnutz,

        Fenn said “There are a few words in the poem that are not useful in finding the treasure Phil, but it is risky to discount any of them. You over simplify the clues. There are many places in the Rocky Mountains where warm waters halt, and nearly all of them are north of Santa Fe. Look at the big picture, there are no short cuts.”

        I’m talking about that BIG picture. You have to figure out which big picture he is talking about. There is only one picture Fenn is talking about, but this picture can be different for every searcher depending upon his solve.

        — MK

        • Hey thanks for the condescending response.
          But seriously, I’m asking you what you think the big picture is.
          Then I can tell you if I think it’s a good idea or a bad idea.

          You can also keep it to yourself as has been the trend of the last coupe of years. And then you will never know, never grow and never show.

  14. It is solvable. Not guessable. May just be the 350001 set of eyes. All the historical knowledge that has been discussed for clues is entertaining, but of no benefit to the solve. Geography is the key. Thinking you have to cross cold water and walk into a scary copse of trees to find the chest is useless. Bezel opined.

    • Bezel;

      When you say that it is solvable, but not guessable – Are you talking about the whole solution or only WWWH. You original post related only to wwwh, and that was what I addressed with my post. WWWH IS guessable, the whole thing certainly is NOT – JMO – JDA

        • No I did not – I solved for it, but someone COULD guess it, and possibly then even wind up within 200 or 500′ of Indulgence, but not know it. JMO – JDA

          • Yeah, you can guess WWWH. I’d give you better odds than those monkeys trying to randomly type Shakespeare’s works, but not by much. Now if a guess meant that someone narrowed the choices down a fair amount and then guessed I’d say that’s possible. But I don’t think a pure dart throw in an area as big as the Rockies would give you any real chance.

    • Bezel,

      I just want to stick my two cents in on your comment about historical knowledge. Maybe it is just me that see’s that most of Forrest life is about history. So why wouldn’t you think that the big picture of his special place and the clues solves that get you there won’t have some history behind them? Yes he said, no knowledge of history is needed, but that doesn’t mean that you won’t learn some on the trail to indulgence. Remember he wanted this as a adventure for kids too and stories of time gone by can surely intrigue any age group.
      Yes, some knowledge of geography will help in following the poem clues to a extent, but not all can be solve from the comfort of your home. BOTG will help in understanding the final ones. Of course what I say is just food for thought, as always.

      Good luck,

      • I concur Bur – I am sure that there is a bit of history that will be told once Indulgence is found. There MUST be stories associated with this “Special Place” that Forrest chose, when deciding where to secret Indulgence. I can not wait to hear those stories – “A bit of history” so to speak – JMO – JDA

        • JDA,

          Yes, I’m sure there are some stories on how Forrest came across this place and with whom he share it with, and I might already know those answers. If this place is the one I have found there are many reasons why he could fall in love with the area, and history is just a part of what it has to offer. I think he grabbed many bananas and went there more then a time or two because it had all he needed at the time he needed it, if I’m understanding it all correctly. Hopefully I’ll fined out in a few months.

          Thanks for your input JDA.
          Good luck,

          • Good Luck to Ya’ Bur. I hope that you have found the right spot. As I said before, I can not wait to hear the tales that Forrest has to offer regarding “His” spot.

            Have a GREAT day Bur – JDA

      • Whether or not history knowledge is needed, I’ve definitely uncovered some great historical stories in my searching that I would not have otherwise learned about. Treasure or no, it has certainly been time well spent!

        • I am way more knowledgeable about history then I was before. Now I research instead watch TV or read junk that’s online. I’m so grateful to him for this opportunity. I just wish I had learned about the chase sooner. I missed a lot of the fun.

    • MK,

      I hope your not serious, if you are:

      Finding the blaze first then backtracking to wwwh, IMO, is folly because starting near the middle of the poem is based on a hope and a guess that you have the right blaze to start with, among the millions upon millions of possibilities out there.

      Starting with the first clue, (wwwh) is the only way, there are no shortcuts.

      Just Say’,

      • Hi CharlieM,
        That’s according to what Fenn has said. He might be thinking that that is the only way, but there is always an alternate other way possible. He once answered to the question about this, “if you know where the home of Brown is, you can go to the chest without bothering the WWWH.” (paraphrasing) I think the other way is definitely possible.
        — MK

        • Now come to think about it, I think I know exactly why Fenn said that “there are no shortcuts” if you understand the word “shortcut” physically not theoretically nor conceptually.

          As Fenn has said many times, we have to read the poem as straight forward instructions, as simple as kids can read and interpret, without adding hardly known histories only to historians or some far fetched associations of actual geographical locations with the words in the poem, or (sometimes very) ridiculous “picked from out of nowhere” kind of ideas and thoughts. The interpretations don’t have to be deep, thorough, complex and out-of-this-world.

          I think the interpretation of the poem and the clues to the chest Fenn asks us searchers to do is a simple one leading to a straight forward instruction how to start from WWWH to home of Brown to the blaze and finally finish at the chest.

          Of course all these are IMO.
          — MK

          • MK,

            Just where did F say, “As Fenn has said many times, we have to read the poem as straight forward instructions,”? Could you tell us where he said that?

            I believed F said the poem is straight forward and in plain English. [paraphrased] I don’t believe he said anything about instructions.

            It may be your opinion, and be careful when quoting F, the quotes of F are needed to be factual as not to misguide folks, I believe this is a hard rule # 2 here on hoD. I would suggest reading the rules.

            Just Say’n

          • Hi CharlieM,
            I should have written that sentence as “we have to read the poem as straight forward [ instructions ]” meaning that the word “instructions” is added by me. Sorry I missed that and thanks.
            — MK

  15. I think the correct answer to all of the clues could be guessed, but if you did not solve the poem to get to that area, you will never find the chest. The area is too big, even for the last clue. Once solved , each of the clues fall logically in place to an end spot. As been shown, there are many wwwh that lead to Hob’s that lead to whatever a searcher deems is the next and then the next clue ; this method has not led to the chest because they all are guesses. A solve means you have figured it out. Bezel opined.

      • CharlieM – Anyone can guess at ANY of the clues. Will a guess be fruitful? Probably not – JMO – JDA

        • It was fruitful for the ones that were at the first two clues. As far as Fenn’s definition of getting the clues correct. (by just being there). So yes, some clues could be guessed. You just won’t know if you are right or wrong. Somewhere in the poem, there must be a distance. Since we are going from a large area to a small, then to be precise, we would have to know how many steps, how far, how many feet, etc…of at least one of the clues. Something like that cannot be guessed but would need to be solved. It’s hard to be precise if you are just stomping out places. And, since we are in the forest, not very many things that will stand out as markers. Somewhere, somehow, a number will come into play.

          • Hi poisonivey,
            The stanza 3, line 2 says “The end is ever drawing nigh.” Even though it doesn’t say the actual distance, it says that the distance is relatively large, I guess.
            — MK

    • Hi again Bezel;

      You sure are making a lot of assumptions here.

      “I think the correct answer to all of the clues could be guessed, but if you did not solve the poem to get to that area, you will never find the chest. ”

      II know of no searcher that says, “Well, I will guess that the “Canyon down” is “X” and that the “put-in spot is “Y” and the hoB is “Z”…” Every searcher thinks (like you) that they have “Solved” for every element in the poem.

      You then say, “The area is too big, even for the last clue.”

      According to how YOU have solved it, but you do not have the chest, so you can not know for sure how big (or small) the final search area will be.

      Then you say, “Once solved , each of the clues fall logically in place to an end spot.”

      This is nothing new. We all believe this.

      Then, “As been shown, there are many wwwh that lead to Hob’s that lead to whatever a searcher deems is the next and then the next clue ; this method has not led to the chest because they all are guesses.”

      Not guesses, but each searchers best analysis and evaluation and opinion of the given facts and certain assumptions made by every searcher (including you) based on that analysis.

      “A solve means you have figured it out.”

      We have ALL had solves – We have ALL “Figured it out” – The problem is that, so far, no one (Including you) has figured out the CORRECT SOLVE.
      If you, or anyone else had figured out a CORRECT SOLVE, they would have the chest and we would not be discussing your, (or my – or anyone else’s ideas.

      It is good to be confident. It is another thing to be boastful without any proof. You have offered ZERO when it comes to a single clue. You have offered NOTHING that relates to what a clue actually is (or isn’t). All you have offered – so far – are generalities that (to me) say nothing… and nothing that has not been said a thousand times before.

      If you want anyone to listen, you have to offer up something that can be discussed. Even a politician has to offer “Something” – not just – “I will put a chicken in every pot… ” Just the ramblings of an OLD guy – JDA

        • CharlieM,
          Agreed! Though that could change any time now. Because IMO I now know why all the whispers matter so much. And IMO, I know where most of the lines cross and why. If you dont know why the lines cross, you might as well play Canasta. IMO though personally, I prefer marbles.

          • Hi Flutterby
            Yes I think it pays to listen to whispers but you have to know where they are and Forrest does a lot of whispering.Clint

          • Hi Flutterby
            You want wispers how about this feed dead horse with a pitch fork or when the train goes by the banana tree grab all the bananas and how about your name
            Flutterby ,the last two are Forrests .how
            many more do you want?There are a lot of them.when Forrest talks you best be listening .most of the S.B.are wispers, you have to see the Forrest thru the trees.it is simple once you know how to think like Forrest.i think that will just about cover the wispers.how about the home of brown you want that too?

          • You’ve brought up – – or implied – – a rather scary scenario.
            Worth a possible investigation on the way to my preferred
            detailed-search location. Thanks . . . I think. All IMO.

          • Tall Andrew,
            Im not sure why you say that knowing where the lines cross and why is a “scary scenario”. If you are doing something scary, based on my comment, dont do it. Knowing why the lines cross is essential to understanding the chase IMO. All the stories and ATFs teach us about the lines, but they dont tell us directly. IMO

          • Hi Flutter –

            I do not have your email address.
            Do you want me to work through Dal?
            I don’t mind, but I will tell you. In all the years and all the people that have emailed me, I have only once read anything that couldn’t be shared on the forum. And really, even that was shared by someone else too.

            It is rare to be surprised in an email at all. Usually I read the idea and then just refer the chaser to the place where we previously discussed it.
            ii don’t see the need for the cloak and auger.


          • Oh, now I feel like we need to come up with something to surprise Lugnutz! Challenge accepted.

          • Sikeston

            I don’t think I know you unless your one of the people that has changed their moniker.

            Lots of ideas are posed as original or new. Every year Poor Ken has had to read the same Old ideas pop up and hear New chasers swear they will retrieve the TC come spring.

            The odd thing for me is that anyone thinks they need to email someone instead of just commenting here. Thank about it. To date none of those 8 years of email have amounted to anything. Nothing ever needed to be kept secret.

            Why does that matter.

            Because we definitely would have found the TC by now if we just openly shared information with each other instaead of constantly saying things like

            Don’t forget to look at the big picture.
            I finally figured out what the pictures on the cover mean.
            Or whatever.


          • Couldn’t agree more Lug. It may not be found by our generation unless more sharing takes place. So many people very confident that their information is the best out there and it must be kept secret. All of which have amounted to zero results.

          • Lug;

            You say that we would have a better chance at finding the treasure if we shared more, but when someone (me) does share something – like that there MAY be a special meaning to the three pictures on TTOTC (A new thought that I have never seen posted) – you offer up a snide remark. “I finally figured out what the pictures on the cover mean.
            Or whatever.”

            Which side of your mouth should we listen to? JMO – JDA

  16. This all sounds like a bunch of speculation, which is to easy to get caught up in.
    Guessing is not an option if you are dedicated to the solve.
    Backtracking through the home of brown does not seem to me as a confirming solve. If I were to speculate on the searchers that were within 500 or 200 ft I would say they were lost and accidentall got that close.
    My personal opinion on the blaze is that it’s more then one but I can’t confirm that
    Until it’s found as is all in this chase.
    The big picture is more important then you think.
    Just my thoughts.

  17. “Read the clues in my poem over and over and study maps of the Rocky Mountains,” Fenn recently told Business Insider. “Try to marry the two. The treasure is out there waiting for the person who can make all the lines cross in the right spot.” f

    Obviously the pathway to the TC is a process where each clue moves one closer to the goal, the clues are consecutive: “Well in my book there is a poem and there are 9 clues in the poem and the clues are in consecutive order; If you want to find the treasure chest, you have my book there, I’ll tell you how to do it. Read the book just normally, the poem and the rest of the book, then go back and read the poem 6,8,10 times, study every line, every word, then after you do that read the book again slowly with the idea of looking for clues or hints that are in the book that will help you follow the clues. You can find the chest with just the clues, but there are hints in the book that will help you with the clues.” ff — Report From Santa Fe with Lorene Mills(May 13-16th 2011).

    What does closer mean to a searcher, or Forrest? Closer, in a consecutive sense could mean; a faculty by which the body perceives an external stimulus; one of the faculties of sight, smell, hearing, taste, and touch.
    “the bear has a keen sense of smell that enables it to hunt at dusk”
    synonyms: sensory faculty, feeling, sensation, perception; More
    a feeling that something is the case.
    “she had the sense of being a political outsider”
    synonyms: awareness, feeling, sensation, consciousness, perception, recognition
    “she felt a sense of guilt”
    perceive by a sense or senses.
    “with the first frost, they could sense a change in the days”
    synonyms: discern, feel, observe, notice, get the impression of, recognize, pick up, be/become cognizant of, be/become aware of, be/become conscious of, get/come to know, tell, distinguish, make out, find, identify, comprehend, apprehend, see, discover, learn, appreciate, realize, suspect, have a funny feeling, have a hunch, just know, divine, intuit, conceive; All of these definitions are bewildering terms for a shot in the dark that one has a spot picked out based on a hunch.

    But, what if these 9 clues are moving one closer to the TC in a conical, spiral or serpentine pathway? What of these 9 points were places on a map that use longitude and Latitude with elevation and or declination? We might want to solve the hunch we have by creating a line forming borders, like border line biddies at Borders Books, look closely at the borders, starting at 32 degrees and take it in a canyon down, now where is that Home of Brown?

    Just messin wit YA!


    • TT,
      I believe”make all the lines cross in the right spot” are power lines which cross his special spot. Also, FF said something along the lines the he hoped parents would take kids camping, hiking, fishing and to look for fossils and turn over logs and look for the treasure. The map and search area should have all of the above.
      There are several places north of Santa Fe which meet this criteria. The key hint is fossils.
      Also, IMO, his story of Father on the Banco is to me “The Bench”, which is a named map feature north of Santa Fe and close to hiding spot. As he said, have a good map….means not an ordinary map but one with topo and naming features on it. As a pilot he would have had to learn to read aviation sectional maps which are very detailed.
      The Omega’s in the book are signs for Ohms. FF was a radar tech which specialized in electrical as the radar has very powerful electric running to it.
      Have had 5 BOTG trips and have been able to narrow down our solve. Should be out west in May or early June. Could not make it last season. We’ll see what happens.
      Good luck and stay safe.

      • Not likely that any given power lines would still be there thousands of
        years from now. But instead of saying “Jeez, Louise”, I’ll say
        IMO Geena.

        • True. But what if the power lines cross a small river creating an X….X marks the spot. Where the lines cross is a large rock outcropping or rock/boulder. Have been in NM and saw large rocks in a small river the size of trucks, sheds and dump trucks….they roll down from the mountains above. These rocks would most likely be there many thousands of years from now and be a good spot to put the chest, concealed by a log or wood, without being disturbed. These rocks are easily climbed onto by way of the hill side. I know, because I’ve done it. They are also usually high above the waterline. Did not think of the power line theory until we got back from NM or would have searched via the power line easement/route. Power lines in a narrow canyon usually are very close to the roadway….a place where FF can view to see if the chest is still there.

          • Tarheel Searcher,
            IMO, people are looking for concrete lines and not realizing that the lines FF is talking about in almost EVERY (yes, I said almost every) story & ATF are the same kind of lines and they are not visible on a map or in the landscape or anywhere else.

    • I read it just like Fenn said. There is a comfort and excitement when they begin to jump out….when you have the first point of reference….the rest depends on the thaw……lol

  18. Pete….Thank You for sharing in what I myself am growing. to except. Your thoughts have indeed struck a cord. It is the thrill of.the Chase that is the treasure. Our lives are epistles (books, journals, and memoirs) written on the parchment of our experiences and with the ink of our days. The treasure chest is the carrot to get us out into “somewhere in the mountains north of Santa Fe and to fill the pages of our own books of memories..

    This is not the reasoning of many who still hang on to their belief that the treasure chest will appear on display in the not too distant future possibly for public view at the Smithsonian.

    There is no doubt that Forrest Fenn will find some immortality as his legend of the Fenn Treasure is shared around a campfire 100 years from now.

    Well, saddle pals it’s been great riding with you trough the passes and wondering at the scenery but there comes a time to face the music, slow the wagon, and to accept some strong medicine and to swallow these sour grapes.

    Now having said that, tonight I might just have a dream..wake up knowing right where that treasure is hidden. If that is the case look for me at Hyde Park come July.

    My botg introduced me to The Land Of Enchantment and the Southern Rockies and those stories will be in my memoirs and are a bit more pricey than gold nuggets and bronze boxes.

    Now please don’t come chasing me with pitchforks and touches.i am just needing a little rest upon the wind.

  19. I don’t see an “In the wood” discussion area so wanted to post this here.

    I have found gold!
    Yep, liquid gold. The maple sap is running in northern Ohio. I missed the syruping season last year but it feels really good to be in the woods again harvesting mother nature’s bounty. A lot of hiking back and forth from house to woods and hauling heavy buckets of sap – good prep for my summer TC search. Best of luck to you all this spring/summer.

  20. I briefly mentioned about the BIG picture that Fenn said in my previous comment. Has anybody figured out what that big picture is? Sometime ago I mentioned about the letters written by Silence Dogood (aka Benjamin Franklin) appeared as the key to solve the riddle on the back of the Declaration of Independence in the movie “National Treasure (2004)”.

    I think this big picture Fenn mentioned is the key to the home of Brown. In the movie, the word “Silence” was the only word capitalized in the middle of a sentence like “Brown” is the only word in the poem which is capitalized. In the movie the letter was the key. I think the big picture is the key to solve the poem.

    — MK

  21. Hola, mi amigos – long time, no post. I survived the polar vortex from last week, only got down to -40F at my place here in MN. With hunting and football season now officially over (What a dud Super Bowl, eh?) I can turn my attention once again Fenn-ward. And with Dal’s site still up and running, cranking out bazillions of e-mails for me to catch up on, it seems pretty safe to say that the chest of gold and intrigue is still somewhere in the Rocky Mountains. I’ll start chiming in again as I read through the backlog of posts from the end of July up until now. Stay warm!

  22. I have a ” great ” solve but barely know where to begin, starting at Rock Mountains cuttoff to the left over summit down the south boundary pass Garcilla directly below Browns home field National ball Park be careful on the corner you may have to be rescued to your right the end of the nigh to the left “victory” but wait , your on the right path just don’t forget that right turn wise guy because 2.8 miles more the 17th century awaits, oh yeah look down for a quick bath your quest to cease. Right? Or Left?

    • What a lovely tribute by both Forrest and Jenny. I. for one, will miss Forrest’s future input, but at 76, it is easy for me to see how “things” become more difficult – and Forrest is 12 years my senior. I am sure that stepping away must be difficult, but needed. I salute you my friend. You have brought more pleasure into the lives of hundreds of thousands of people – both young and old. Thanks. I hope you can feel the love embodied in that one word – JDA

      • At Forrest’s age, I can understand not having the stamina, so easy to see why. Forrest has given time for all to know his many memories in a short period of time, compared to his life long memories. It is time to slow down, by god he’s earned it.

        He’s gotten much respect from me, and for all his generosity to all. Now let’s find that treasure as he intended.

    • I hate this…… when all I can say is that I cannot say anything. Arrrrrgggh.

      Well, maybe I can say thank you Jenny for doing the six questions over the years.

    • Here’s the link for those who need it: http://mysteriouswritings.com/six-questions-with-forrest-fenn-and-the-thrill-of-the-chase-seven-is-a-perfect-number/

      This quote stands out to me: “The poem was written to assist all searchers. In my mind, studying the clues is tantamount to using a road map to get from one place to another.”

      To me, this indicates that the clues in the poem does not only describe a path to be followed, but also surrounding indicators that point to the correct spot, IMHO.

      • Blex,

        That is the train of thought that will get you to the blaze. At least that is what I have found out.

        Good luck,

      • Blex,
        IMO the clues in the poem are teaching us something. Remember that FF never understood the idea of Miss Ford speaking to him in Spanish so that he could learn Spanish. So he has chosen to teach another way, and that IMO is with clues. Someone asked him if there was only one way to the hidey spot. His response didnt really answer the question. He said, “there is no other way to my knowledge”. He did not say there was no other way to the hidey spot. I believe we must learn what FF is teaching us in the poem, with subtle hints from the book. If we learn the knowlege, we can then use logic to find the hidey spot. But most people arent doing that. They expect a map with designated places for each step. I dont think it works that way. I think we must learn the knowlege and then use our own logic (assuming we have any) to arrive at the correct location. Yes, it is contiguous. But contiguous can mean one step of knowlege leads to another step of knowlege until we have learned and can apply that knowlege to arrive at the correct location. I believe I have learned over half of the steps to FFs knowlege. Only time will tell, but all these years of looking for designated spots on a map, have not produced the TC. The poem tells me that it is the knowlege we must gain one step at a time. And from that perspective, you can see the bigger picture with a tighter focus. Id suggest tossing the map until you learn the knowlege. That is what FF & Donnie did while looking for Lewis & Clark. Remember that FF said his horse, Lighting, barely had the energy to get out of its own way. But once they loosened their grip on the reins, the horses took them home. There is a lesson to be learned there. And it isnt about horses. IMO

          • Blex,
            If you have read any of my early writing, you will already know that the first “hint” I picked up from the first read through TTOTC was that when FF & Donnie were Looking For Lewis & Clark, they followed a little stream until it got so narrow that nothing could get through but water. I felt it was important then, and it still is an important story, but not in the way I thought it was. Three years later, I have discovered that all of FF’s stories in TTOTC and many in other locations are teaching us ONE SINGLE concept. I know it is hard to imagine this, since the stories are varied, with different characters and places and people. But, I firmly believe that in each and every one of those stories, you could lift FF and his family and friends right out of the stories and if you read them again not knowing who the characters in the story are, you would find that they really are the story of something else. And not only that, but the random “sprinkling” of “subtle hints” IMO is more like a rainstorm through the book. I never would have guessed! But, I firmly believe this is true. And, I arrived at this conclusion using FF’s own advice. I learned all the possible definitions of every single word in the poem. I then studied the poem to be sure that every single word meaning fit with every other single word meaning as I read it about a billion times until I could see how alternate meanings of some of the words completely change the meaning of the poem and give you a different perspective. Mind you, I’m using only dictionary definitions of every word, but often not the most common dictionary definition. This helped me see the poem from a different perspective. So, from there, I went back through the book looking for hints that were supposedly sprinkled throughout TTOTC and read the stories again with the perspecitve I had gained from a different understanding of the poem. Sure enough, the stories all made sense from this different perspective. That is when I came to believe that although the stories are stories of FF growing up, they are also the stories of something else. FF taught us this concept in the Important Literature section when he compared his life to JD Salinger. p 13, TTOTC, “Admittedly the places in JD’s book were different from mine and the schools I never heard about were obviously different but other than that it was my very own story line.” So, if FF’s story line could be that of JD Salinger, could it not also be similar to something else? Of course it could! And, what I find now that I’m looking at it from this different perspective, is that the embellishment that FF used in his own stories, makes a whole lot more sense if read from this other perspective. So, some of the little oddities you find in the stories and you wonder what he is saying or why? Those make so much more sense if reading the story from another perspective. Its like the backwards bicycle. You have to understand the perspective before you can apply it. The poem teaches the perspective and the stories, ATFs, scrapbook pages and interviews suppoort that perspetive IMO Good luck, cause it wasn’t easy to get here. But, now that I have arrived, it is so much easier to understand what FF is saying.

          • Flutterby,

            From what I gather, you are saying that, “The poem teaches the perspective”, as well as the stories do.

            F said in the Preface of TTOTC, “My only goal in this endeavor is to talk about a few life experiences and if any readers over the age of twelve don’t see a little of themselves in this mirror, then maybe they deserve another turn.”f

            With that said, the book nor the poem’s intent is not to teach us a different perspective.

            F said also on the same page prior to the quote above, “I tend to use words that aren’t in the dictionary and others that are, I bend a little.”f This does not mean that every word in the poem needs to be looked up or to change the meaning of the words. The only word in the poem that causes confusion is nigh.

            Moving on, “Admittedly the places in JD’s book were different from mine and the schools I never heard about were obviously different but other than that it was my very own story line.”f This quote strongly indicates that parts of his life were the same as JD’s. period.

            IMO your stretching things a little to far and is another large rabbit hole on perspective and knowledge. I’m still scratching my head what your different perspective is. This goes way beyond imagination. By the way it was not F that came up with the quote, “Imagination is more important than knowledge”e, it was Einstein and F was only talking about non-fiction writers. Well his stories and SBs are not fiction.

            F also said in part on the inside of the dust cover of TTOTC, “Unlock the clues that are scattered among these pages…” This does not indicate to look for a different perspective,, the key word here is clues, those clues were not intentional as F indicated.

            I’m sorry I don’t see a different perspective, with what you said about your theory as it completely goes against what F has said. You also said in your first post above, “tossing the map until you learn the knowledge.” Didn’t F say to marry the poem to a map? [paraphrased] Poem + Map doesn’t indicate to gain knowledge with a different perspective.

            If you learn what the first clue is, that’s about it, the rest can be found on a map, look at the big picture = a map. Unintended clues sprinkled in the stories and clues in the poem.

            Just Say’n

  23. I bet Mr. Fenn gets more e-mails this afternoon than ever.
    People will e-mail stuff like…..
    “Mr. Fenn, I know you don’t want to hear from all of those other people, but since (pick one)
    1) I know where the treasure is
    2) I know more than other people
    3) I know you look forward to my daily e-mails to you
    4) we have become best friends online
    5) you look forward to my pet pictures, vacation pictures, children’s picture, search area pictures
    I realize you still want me to e-mail you….and you really want all of those other people to stop.”
    Seriously, he will get tons of mail. People do not know boundaries.

    • 6. Do you know what this rash is?

      Kidding on number 6 and no, I don’t have a rash but I would really hope people don’t send him anything along those lines.

      I would agree with you Clearly Clueless that he will likely get flooded with e-mails today. I will of course stop bugging him as #5 definitely fits me. Thankfully not #3. Anyone thinking in lines with #4 is likely in tune with Chip Douglas which still likely haunts Sherif Billy (sorry Billy for that).

      Otherwise I still can’t get past the hitchhiker reference but Willie definitely looks to be telling Forrest he is ready to go as well.

      Forrest, have a wonderful time passing the seasons with Willie and those you love.


      • LOL Idle,
        I was trying to be funny, but you were funnier. And, I don’t want to hurt feelings, I was just thinking we all think we are the exception.
        Side note, I had found some interesting finds in a field once and I had been wondering if I e-mailed Mr. Fenn some pictures, if he would take a guess at what these items are and what they might have been used for. Native American items, very little stuff not exciting at all, except to me. I would have thought with his background and expertise he might have some ideas. Oh well, should have e-mailed those pictures before today.

        • Hi CC,

          The impression I got from this line:

          “I hope those to whom I cannot respond will blame my stamina, and not my heart.”

          Doesn’t say you can’t e-mail him but simply that it is likely to go unread and that it isn’t anything personal. I definitely think that people might want to take a little more time with their e-mails if they do send them and I don’t think he is saying you can’t e-mail him your question(s) on the artifact. If he doesn’t answer you already know the answer as to why. I wouldn’t be surprised though if this goes for everyone including those he normally communicates with more frequently.

          Oddly, I am reminded of another Jim Carrey movie on the topic of getting too many e-mails.

  24. Honestly, Forrest would probably be delighted if he could ration people to a couple of emails per year. I fear he gets bombarded by those that write him emails like they post on Instagram.

  25. The way I see it IMO there are 2 X’s on the map. 1 at WWWH and the other at HoB. Between the Xs is a word that tells you that you are on the correct path to HoB. The poem gets you to the (next step) place where the historical map needed to get you to tc location. Last part is using words and numbers written in the book to understand what to do with the lawyer you possibly need to keep the tc. The link below will help your lawyer. A chapter in the book tells you the chapters, paragraphs, sections and subsections that will help you at link below. There are 4 chapters I have found with hidden messages that only makes since once you know what to look for. The postmark dates, pictures and their footnotes has significant meanings. Digging into these helped me getting to the hidden messages. Don’t get me wrong here, ff is correct when he says you don’t need the book to find the tc. It helps to confirm your solve. No need to say it…OK smart guy, why don’t you have the chest now? The answer I already know and that is waiting on my son to go on Spring Break.


    • Armchair Hunter,

      You are some what right about a word between wwwh and hoB, but it helps confirm you are in the right area and trail. But in the TTOTC book there’s one chapter that gives in it a clue (word that is key) and two chapters have hints (one each) that helps with that clue. Then there are a couple of really out there hints that help with the big picture area. Of course you won’t understand those until you get the first couple of clues solved.

      You won’t need a historical map, a detailed satellite map will do for most clue solves, but you will learn a little history along the way.
      I’ve checked into postmarks, drawings and pictures and I can say……..ok I cannot say anything other then don’t discount them all. There may be a trigger that sets off once you have most of the clues solved then recheck the book.

      Again, always just food for thought.
      Good luck,

      • I will have to do some research Bur. I suspect that – “n the TTOTC book there’s one chapter that gives in it a clue ” – I suspect that this chapter is “My War for Me” – at least it is for me.

        You then say, “and two chapters have hints (one each) that helps with that clue. ” I will have to do some research here.

        I totally agree with your statement “.ok I cannot say anything other then don’t discount them all”

        “There may be a trigger that sets off once you have most of the clues solved then recheck the book.” – I will

        Thanks for your input Bur – Always a pleasure reading your posts – JDA

        • JDA,

          When Armchair said there a word between wwwh and hoB it gave me concern, but read other info posted and lost that concern. There is a physical word/(name) right in between those to places and it’s in the TTOTC book one of the high points in one of Fenn’s stories. It is one of those really out there hints you don’t see until you solve both those clues.

          JDA, thanks for even considering any of my info I whisper out there. If you understood my indirect hints through out the blog it would take you to my search area not that I don’t think others have been close because it is a place that when told about you might say I should have thought about that. (Smile)
          JDA on a side note I seen in one of your pictures you posted that you had long gray hair. Well no picture of me posted anywhere, but I too have long gray hair pasted the middle of my back. Kind of going back to my long hair days. I wasn’t a hippie, I was a keep on trucking dude LOL.
          Enjoy life and always good luck.

          • I will have to look for that word that is between wwwh and hoB. I thiMk (Close to thiNking – but not quite) I know what it is, but will have to find it in a story.

            I believe that I have understood your hints about your location – Who knows how close I am – Time will tell.

            Can’t imagine you with long gray hair, but since I like my long silver locks – YEA for you. – “Keep on truckin'” – Thanks for the post – JDA

        • JDA,
          I agree on that opinion about “My War for Me.” That story really stand out as a deeply personal story and I think there may be more than one clue teased in it. At least in my notes it does. As with everything in the chase, your mileage may vary.

          • Thanks – Wishin-I-was-Fishin. Have a warm winter and good luck a searchin’ in the spring or summer – JDA

  26. So as ease drips unto this earthly meadow. Timber wolf howls from hearken shadow. Mountain magnificence shall forever bellow. Farewell to you our friend, lone golden fellow.

  27. No more Six Questions. Well, it’s not like all the previous ones have resulted in a successful solve.

    Nor has all the puke spewed on multiple utoob vids.

    Poem, TTOTC, botg. Enjoy and appreciate the wilderness.

  28. “I have zoomed into the hiding place several times but I wasn’t looking for the treasure.”

    “I am almost umbilically attached to the spot, and as I approach 89 years my desire to be there is still strong.”

    “The immediate landscape will probably remain about the same for as long as time has to go.”

    “My favorite flights were those when I headed alone, and at 200 feet, into the teeth of the Rockies, not knowing, or caring, where I would land.”

    sooo…..the 200 footers have been 200 vertical feet from TC?

    • Hi aardvarkbark,

      I once thought too that 200′ is the vertical distance, but I think it is the horizontal distance (or nearly horizontal) according to my current solve.

      Since I think my current solve seems to be the correct solve (I know, of course, I don’t have the chest in my hand yet, so it can be wrong anyway) which I was able to solve with clues in the poem and other hints from Fenn (either said or published in the last 8 years) BUT WITHOUT the help of other subtle hints contained in the TTOTC, I am not going to purchase the book. But for a historical and/or record keeping reason (to complete the chase) I may purchase a copy after I retrieve the chest myself IF I’m the first one to do that.

      — MK

      • MajinKing,

        To me and I have stated in the past, the 200′ mark is a elavation up from the 500′ spot but not a strick vertical rise, If you can draw a 500’circle (500′ being at the center point) right below npuyc (trailhead npftm) and then draw a 200′ circle at heavy loads and a 200′ circle at water high. Now if you are in the right area all those circles should meet at one point. Now this intersection should be where Forrest secreted the chest. Your trail should look like a backwards question mark ???? The period at the bottom of the mark is the 500′ point- a off beaten trail – being “no place for the meek”, now the point at bottom of the up part of the mark would be – npuyc, and then the middle of the radis on the mark is – “heavy loads”, and the end of the radis is -“water high”. All the circles should meet right in the middle of the open area of the radis of that backwards question mark. Is this where your quest to cease is? I believe so.

        If you have a solve maybe this means nothing maybe, if you don’t then this might be food for thought.

        Good luck,

        • Hi Bur,

          Definitely your idea is one of the method to locate the hiding place. But as I pointed out sometime ago, the right way to do it is,

          1) Draw a X where you think the treasure chest is.
          2) Draw a circle of 200′ radius with this X as a center.
          3) Draw another circle of 500′ radius with this X as a center again.

          Then you should be able to see a certain geological feature, one at 200′ circle line and another at 500′ circle line. I think that’s the only method IMO.

          — MK

          • Hi Bur,

            Definitely your idea is one of the method to locate the hiding place. But as I pointed out sometime ago, the right way to do it is,

            1) Draw a X where you think the treasure chest is.
            2) Draw a circle of 200′ radius with this X as a center.
            3) Draw another circle of 500′ radius with this X as a center again.

            Then you should be able to see a certain geological feature, one at 200′ circle line and another at 500′ circle line. I think that’s the only method IMO.

            — MK

            another way to look at the above would be;

            1) mark the treasure with an “X”
            2) to the left of the “X” mark a “+” for 200′ radius
            3) to the right of the “X” mark a “+” for the 500′ radius

            this will give a little 800′ distance compared to the 500′ to look for your certain geological features.

            This most likely will not make any difference in finding the chest. It’s just a thought, a little different way to look at things.

          • jim rice,

            That was what I had a problem with, in a way was “guessing” where the chest might be.
            I originally followed the npuyc creek past heavy loads and between there and water high up that mountin creek to a cluster formation of rocks (because they look like the gold nugget layout- with the frog and coin in TTOTC book), and searched that area. I should have went to my water high and searched a 200′ radis, but didn’t have time after wasting my time 200′ radis around that cluster of rocks. That’s what’s sattilite images will do to you, they sometimes make you believe in the wrong areas. Follow the clue solves until they end don’t vary. So now I will be looking in that area I discribed above below water high.

            Don’t guess, is all I can say.
            Good luck,

        • Bur;

          With a little bit of work, I think that I have been able to implement your theory at my search location. I sure hope that it works this spring. Thanks for the input – JDA

  29. Less chatter on the 6 questions than I would have expected, but I suppose it has only been a day or so.

    I’m curious what everyone makes of his use of the word “site”. To me, that implies some kind of delineated area (i.e. a small field or a bend in a stream rather than a random spot in the trees that might be harder to identify accurately on GE). I also have connotations of “archaeological” from “site”, but that’s probably too much of a gray area/stretch to be useful.

    Does his use of “site” change what you’re looking for on GE when looking at your end “search area” (i.e. if the clues led you to a creek that was hard to see on GE, how likely are you to re-evaluate your solve)?

    • Hi FMC, Many places can be referred to as sites. Any place where any activity of interest has occurred. To me what’s more striking, is Mr. Fenn referring to the place as being almost “umbilical”. More than just the word, I don’t think I could refer to any place that I found as an adult “umbilical” no mater how special it was. It would have to be an older deeper child hood place.

        • Hi Sherif, Experiencing rebirth is a possibility, but most are reborn into the present not the past, which umbilical suggests to me. It reminds me of a post Mr. Fenn made about a searcher that was a relative of all the kids and adults, that he grew up with in West Yellow Stone, and Mr. Fenn being so over come with nostalgia, said he’d need another hankie. To me it’s umbilical in that sense.

    • Site probably refers to the mental boundaries of what Forrest considers his special place – probably everything he could see in the immediate vicinity from the chest.

  30. “Why didn’t I think of that?”

    I just had one of those “AH – HA” moments.

    I have LOOKED at the cover of TTOTC for over three years now, but never before have I SEEN it. I may well be wrong, but I honestly believe that Forrest shows us the PATH to solving the riddle, right there on the cover of TTOTC. If you can figure out the meaning of the gold, and the three Pictures, you will have figured out the riddle.

    As I said, I may be wrong, but I do not think so. Solve these three PIC’s and you will have solved the riddles contained in the poem – JMO – JDA

    • JDA,

      I guess you do listen, but do you really understand what it is that you see and how things relate? Imagination might help.

      Good luck,

      • Hi Bur
        Yea there is a lot of imagination in between here and there or is it there and hear.will gotta go wife is ringing
        dinner bell,I wish I had a nickel every time she rang that
        thang.Aahh burgers.Clint

        • Clint, there is something in your comment that relates to understanding one of the clue solves. Maybe you already know.

          Good luck,

      • JDA,

        You can also throw in a scrapbook or two to add to my comment above. (Relate to).

        Good luck JDA,

    • Ok JDA, you have me intrigued, so I’ll bite and take a looksee right now.

      We’ve got the 3 pictures on the cover:
      1. The picture in the middle left is a photo of Forrest as a child holding a couple of fish in front of an place labeled as “water hole” in Yellowstone National Park. This photo reappears on page 122 under the chapter “Flywater” in which it is one of a 7-photo spread showing various members of Forrest’s family holding up their catches (3 of Marvin Feen, 1 of Forrest, 1 of June, and 1 Lillie Fenn; a 7th photo contains no people but two columns of fish laid along the shore of Hebgen Lake).
      2. The picture in the upper right shows Forrest as a teenager in his coonskin cap looking away from the camera towards the view beyond as he stands between 2 horses (presumably his and Donnie’s). This photo reappears on page 62 under the chapter “Looking for Lewis and Clark” and does not have a caption, but does overlap a second photo of Donnie riding his horse through a creek.
      3. The picture in the lower right shows Forrest as a young man in the Air Force in his flight suit posing against the wing of an airplane (is that a pontoon on the wing?). This photo is different from the other two in that it is arranged at a tilted angle (the other two are squared away at right angles to the cover), and it does reappear elsewhere inside the book. It may be a bit of a stretch, but perhaps this photo was used as a model for the illustrator to use in the sketch of Forrest discovering the tombstone of the French solider on page 95 in the chapter “My War for Me”. The author caption “by Forrest Fenn” appears immediately below this photo as well.

      Aside from the photos, we have the pile of gold coins in the lower left of the cover. These reappear on page 131 under the chapter “Gold and More” and we can see that the image on the cover has been photoshopped to copy the right portion of the coin pile over to the right, creating an image of a bigger pile of coins than what appears on the cover. Only the photo of Forrest in his flightsuit overlaps the image of the gold coins (that photo-mounting-corner in the lower left doesn’t seem to be doing too much!).

      Lines in the poem evoked by these images for me:
      “title to the gold”, “treasures bold”, “riches new and old” – all tie to the gold coins.
      “WWWH”, “No paddle up your creek”, “Waters high” – could all tie to the picture of little Forrest with the fish.
      “marvel gaze”, “canyon down”, “brave and in the wood” – could tie to Forrest in the coonskin

      Not sure about anything from the poem being evoked by the photo of Forrest in the flightsuit. Perhaps “alone in there”? “Worth the cold?” Maybe “heavy loads” with respect to an airplane’s payload? Not sure.

      Anyways, that’s what I’m seeing this morning taking a fresh look. Am I tracking along the same path as what you are seeing, JDA? It’s fun to take a fresh look at this. I need to give this book another read cover-to-cover sometime soon.

      • Hi Blex;

        Nice post.

        I think that “Water Hole” is important, and as you say, it is in “Flywater”, and this may be important.

        The two horses, to me play a role, and yes, it appears in the chapter about the Louis and Clark excursion – which may be important.

        The photo of Forrest, although not replicated in the book, reminds me of “My War for Me” – which I think is VERY important.

        Can’t say more than this – Thanks for the post – JDA

          • Blex and JDA,
            Yes. Water hole is important IMO. It fits beautifully with my belief that if you figure out the perspective the poem should be read from, and apply that same perspective to the stories in TTOTC, then you can see why water hole matters. But, I’m not referring to the Firehold River or Bakers Hole or anything like that. It is a concept IMO!

    • JD –

      Quick question if you don’t mind sir.
      Does the new revelation form the cover of TToTC point you at Wyoming?


    • Hi JDA,
      I’m sorry to say this, but IMO there is no riddle in the poem, just simple, straight forward instructions from start to finish. That’s all.
      — MK

      • MK;

        What is a riddle?

        Answer: a question or statement intentionally phrased so as to require ingenuity in ascertaining its answer or meaning, typically presented as a game.

        Isn’t this a description of the chase? To me it is. JMO – JDA

  31. There is less than a week left to enter the “Name Forrest’s Kitty Contest”. One winner will be selected by our panel of anonymous judges after the contest closes next Monday. Winner gets a Forrest Fenn signed/personalized TFTW book….as well as a contract to co-star in a new Netflix miniseries…

    OK…just kidding about the Netflix contract…

    But there are some ingenious entries and many that make me laugh…

    Read about the contest and submit your entry here:

  32. Here’s a couple thoughts on a discussion way back up this thread about the clues or TC site having some special ‘history’……
    FF tells us that Gen. Nappy said ‘history is lies agreed to’ …. and later he tells us that ‘history will always be contradictory when told by one person at a time.’ So if history is lies or unreliable, what is truth? I’m thinking FF is telling us to trust Geography.
    When FF was flying his plane 200’ above the ground, what was he searching for first … history or geography? Not theiy’re mutually excllusive…. they overlap of course. Aerial viiews, land forms, contours may speak more than history on your search paths. Just sayin’

    • OS2,
      I think everyone is looking incorrectly at the “big picture”. We have been told to use a “tighter focus”. FF’s stories all have something in common. They all share the same message in different ways, but people get lost because they cant see the forrest for the trees. IMO, if you can see the underlying message in all of his stories, you will see that the reason the “site” is important to FF is because of what it represents and not because of anything that happened there. Im sure he is truthful in saying he has spent time there. But, IMO, that is not why it is special. In three years, I have yet to find a FF story or ATF that does not support a single theme that connects all of his stories and comments together. Im baffled that nobody else seems to see it. But then Forrest Fenn has asked whether we need to see in order to “confirm its existence” The grass sees, but it wont tell. I see, but will join the grass and trees and rippling brooks in keeping it a secret.

      • Flutterby, I assume you are referring to Fenn’s ‘spirituality’ that shows up in so many stories & SBs….. Yes, it is apparent, but it is not the only thread (or tied-on string). Accommodation to the realities of existence is likewise strong. Don’t drowned in the butterscotch.

        • No OS2,
          I’m not talking about Fenn’s spirituality. I’m talking about something he actually has never commented directly on at all anywhere. Remember his quote about it not mattering who you are, but only who they think you are? That is what I’m referring to. I thought for 3 years that “I” was water. I now believe that is wrong. I cannot find a single story, quote, ATF, or scrapbook that doesn’t support my current theory about another perspective in both the poem and TTOTC. If you know the right perspective, then the whole string story makes so much more sense. And you also will know what happened to the ball of string. Remember that sometimes “it is wise for the fox to dress like a hound”.

          • Thats interesting Flutterby, I pretty much associated FF’s comment on “it’s who they think you are” to his gutsy business acumen… Fenn’s a matured risk taker that grew out of the impulsive risk-taking child that ran across desks, and slid down fire-slides. I’ll think about it more and see if I can pull another warn coal from the ashes.

          • Ha! … and risk-taking goes hand-in-hand with bluffing….. whether its in playing poker or replacing a meadowlark with a sissortail.

  33. Something to chew on, IMO.

    “My favorite flights were those when I headed alone, and at 200 feet, into the teeth of the Rockies, not knowing, or caring, where I would land.” f

    Perhaps he was hinting that the person or persons that were within 200′ of the treasure were flying above the treasure.

    The one answer that caught my eye was, “I am almost umbilically attached to the spot, and as I approach 89 years my desire to be there is still strong.” f

    To me it means that this spot is like a new beginning to him, a rebirth if you will, one that may have taken place when flew over that blaze and it reminded him of the waterfalls he flew over during the war. He maybe went to this area after landing and found something special in his spot. “Memories and serenity”, a place to give him a new outlook on life, a place where it all came together for him, such as, when he realized the things that he wrote on page 102 & 103 in his Memoir. This, I take it to mean that this spot was found later in his life and not likely to be from his childhood as many think.

    When he got cancer and decided to hide a treasure chest full of gold and things I can see him thinking, yes, yes, this is the spot where I’ll hide my treasure chest, and write poem with clues for all to find.

    After all, “The fun side is that it really doesn’t matter who we are if we are someone to ourselves. No one else can think my thoughts, so I am myself only to me. Does that make sense? So, to be important I only need to impress myself. And I can do that if others are positively affected by what they see in me or see me do.” f

    • ManOwar,

      You said, “To me it means that this spot is like a new beginning to him, a rebirth if you will”…..”this spot was found later in his life and not likely to be from his childhood as many think”.
      I believe you are on the right track with these two comments.

      Good luck,

    • MoW, in an interview Fenn did for/with the Wild Bill museum, he said (I paraphrase) that when he came home from the war he didn’t like to remember the things he saw or did in the war. He also said he went to Yellowstone & the museum every year, or whenever he could, during his war years. That makes me think his healing-place was in that area, but I don’t think it is a pretty little glen with a babbling brook… I think from that site he was able to contemplate the ancient violence of nature, and perhaps the struggles of many waves of people that traversed it, and how in time it healed, became covered over with grass and life and thrive in peace…. always waiting to heal the next abuse.

      • OS2 –

        I agree. Not some little secret fishing hole.
        A place with a powerful view. A place where Indian Chiefs went alone to contemplate history and the inevitable history yet written.

        • Have you always thought that Lugnutz? Or did it evolve as it did with me as I tried to understand the mind that hid treasure & wrote the stories. (I do think there is a lot more story in them than mere memoir.)

          • OS2

            I have not always thought that. I have had all kinds of thoughts and ideas over the years.

        • I’m kind of thinking that the spot is just going to be some ordinary spot to us. Nothing exciting or awe inspiring, just a humble spot in the forest, where f had something done or has done something at. It seems with f, it’s always something on the “flip-side”. That’s why the “marvel gaze”. We may be thinking extravagant, and get ho-hum. A place with no visitors, and not in any History books. Just a place and a bet…

          • Poisonivey,

            From what I have found in my search “spot” that it’s fun hiking the clues, but not a spot I would have chose (but he say something like he didn’t want someone to just stumble apond it). It’s a off beatin trail that takes to a out away place. It’s the beauty that surrounds this “spot” I think Forrest wants you to see and many of the references he has talked about throughout can also seen in “the big picture”. At “water high” you can see for miles up the “canyon down” and beyond. Yes there water about 600′ – 700′ he could fish but not in the npuyc creek (to small).

            Ok just gave you the description of my search area, how about anyone else?

            Good luck,

          • Bur says…

            ” It’s the beauty that surrounds this “spot”

            This is the way I have looked at it also.
            It must have one heck of a view if it was going to be Mr f`s final resting place.

          • Poison, I can understand your point of view here. A place with absolutely no visitors might be a stretch, but an out of the way place not mentioned in History books with infrequent visitors seems plausible.

          • Bur, my spot is right under a mountain. Two lakes near by, elevation 8000 ft, formed from snow melt of the mountain. Looks pretty cool, but just like all spots that have a mountain with snow and lakes. Looks great, picture worthy, but not UTTERLY STUPENDOUS!!! No what I mean. It’s just Midwest landscape really.
            My search area, just below Mount Haggin in Montana, is nice, but I think it’s like going to a pawn shop and trying to sell something that has sentimental value. To you, it’s worth 100,000 dollars, to the pawn guy, 5-10 bucks. I don’t doubt it’s a nice place, but it just might not be what searchers are looking for when they think ‘marvel gaze”. Beauty in the eye of the beholder, right? I’ll say this, here in So. Cal., we have Mount Baldy. A 10,000 foot mountain that in Summer, looks like a mountain surrounded by smog. Big deal, but right now, in Winter, after all the snow fall, the whole mountain range looks awesome. Any So. Cal. would back me up on this one. Maybe f’s spot is the opposite. In Winter, just another snow covered place, but in the Summer, the whole place springs to life. Whatever it is, I think “ho-hum” could be used to also describe it. You know f, always a twist on something..

  34. Well the change has come.

    Now, the wait for a new north is over. The World Magnetic Model update was officially released on Monday, and magnetic north can again be precisely located for people around the world.

    So I wonder where the new degree lines would be on the TTOTC map? Has anyone come across them for that section of the Rocky Mountains? Did the old map help in playing a roll in location of Indulgence, other then that big general area showing? To me there is something there if you look into it deep enough.

    Good luck all,

      • J A Kraven,

        This is the article I read:

        Magnetic north just changed. Here’s what that means. – National Geographic

        Couldn’t find the change in degree line #’s over the Rockies like shown on the TTOTC map. Like where is the 10* at now?

        Thanks, guess I will keep looking.

        • Magnetic north is always changing, Bur.

          Usually gradually enough that it’s officially updated every 5 years. There was a rapid flux recently, which meant they had to do an unscheduled update.

          You can find the lines here:


          Change the BASEMAP to “National Geographic” (so cities show up for guidance), zoom in on the Chase area, and move the timeline (at the bottom) to the year you want.

          You’ll find that the TTotC map lines correspond pretty closely to the 2010 setting, and that the 10 degree line is now right about where the 11 degree line is on the TTotC map.

          (According to ff in Scrapbook 62 (which I linked in my earlier post), *magnetic variation* is one of the things that “will not assist anyone to the treasure location.”)

          Hope that’s what you’re looking for.


          • J A Kraven,

            Thanks for the info, and yes I know magnetic north is always changing and that’s the map I was looking for the newest change, I already had the 2015 map. I was wanting to see just how much difference there was in the two. There something Forrest said in ATF comments that relates to his map.
            I already have my search area and have had it it for quite some time, I’m just looking fo more confirmation pieces to add to my pieces that I have already found. If I even tell my story it will be quite detailed.

            Thanks again,

  35. Hey Dal, where’s your entries for the contest? Been looking forward to them, better hurry! And come to think of it, where’s Forrest’s entries, if there’s a panel of non bias judges shouldn’t he enter too?

  36. If Forrest wins, instead of TFTW book, I’ll get him his bracelet back for the prize this coming spring……………..maybe:)

  37. I’ve probably looked up every word in poem, in the dictionary. I was surprised by the number of words, where after the definition, it would say “more at cemetery”. Yes, we know it’s not in a cemetery, so why does Mr. Fenn, the wordcrafter, wordsmith, word architect, keep leading us toward one? It might be worth a look.

    • James, it’s possible that one passes a cemetery while traversing through the clues. Do you mind sharing what words you looked up that resulted in “more at cemetery”? Same dictionary used for all that you looked up, or just googled them? Thanks

  38. Reading the final 6 questions provided needed closure. They were that bitter-sweet, ying-yang of happy-tears that permeate the chase experience for me. They once again showed that Forrest is the master of speaking to everyone while also speaking directly to one. He makes us all feel part of something larger than ourselves, and that is needed in our world these days. Forrest is a gem. I hope the chase lives on in the hearts and minds of many, forever. Forrest too.

    The time has come for me to hang up my TTOTC boots. Like my Dad, I have some hitchhiking around the world to do to get back to simplicity. However, before I could head out, I had a book that I needed to publish to honor a promise made to my Dad 21 years ago. And the time to deliver on my promise has come!

    My book, Dear Dad…Thank You, will be available soon – just in time for Spring. It is a tribute to my Dad and his book, Future Shift, a book on leadership and love. My Dad was of Forrest’s generation and from Texas, and my guess is the book will shed light on many things and ways of thinking that intersect with the chase. Things that may help searchers on their journey to find the treasure offered by Forrest.

    Maybe Dal will share a sneak peek of the book with the community as I depart (Dal, please let me know if you are willing). If you are interested in the book, you can email robinchancepublishing@gmail.com for information on how to order a copy.

    Good luck to all of you! May you find what you seek, and even some things you didn’t know you were looking for. Namaste.

    • Awesome Twingem, definitely will have to get a copy. What do we need to include in the e-mail so they know what we want (or is it your e-mail?).

      Also, do you have a link to your Dad’s book?

      • I am the publisher and the book is only available through me at this time. I’ve sent Dal a pdf preview of the book to share with the community if he so choses. Email robinchancepublishing@gmail.com and ordering info will be sent in reply.

        Peace out folks! Love each other.

    • Twingem,
      I wish you wouldn’t hang up your TTOTC boots, but in the same breath, I also understand that there are more trails than one to walk upon… it’s been a thrill having you around with your outgoing positive attitude and many kind words…
      A persons word means everything, you made a promise to your dad and you are fulfilling that promise… I respect you greatly for that and I know he does too..
      Enjoy your many trails my friend as you enjoy your chase……
      Until next time…. see ya twingem

  39. Here’s part of my take away from Mr. Fenn’s answers to Jenny’s 6 questions. One knows the Correct Hiding Place, but Mr. Fenn Cannot respond to that individual via email. Time Has To Go, while the TC Patiently Listens for the singular Boot, to Zoom in after the Season Passes. Then Mr. Fenn would Personally Like To Meet the finder and Share A Bottle Of Grapette, or say champagne. Caps for emphasis. JMO, and that’s all I have to say about that.

  40. Dal, I understand. Hopefully when the contest is over you and Forrest can tell us what names for kitty you thought of, think we’d all like to know, I definitely would. Creativity and Imagination should not waste. Now, on another topic, I’d personally just like to take this time to say to you Thank You! I first learned of the chase in summer of 2017 and it’s been a whirlwind of adventure. I have filled my being with the most wonderful knowledge of the Rocky Mountain territory. The learning of history, geology, ecosystems, animal habits, adventures, legends, nature, science and on and on have enriched my life and saved it as well. This all came to me at THE lowest point of my life. I was injured and sick and my mind was taking me places no one should ever delve into. The chase was exactly what my mind needed to transform it to a better place. It saved me. What Forrest has done is an extraordinary thing. But iit is of the foundation that all is built. Forrest is on the ladder and you are footing it. The process and development you have gone through to establish this website is astonishing. Everyone in this community should indeed give you a round of applause and say Thank You. I know I am. So Thank You and the people you may work with also. Thank You for letting me wander through all of this. Paul Thomas

  41. I want to clarify a couple of things about the solve, guess, and luck. I think you can SOLVE a line in the poem. But once you do, you have to GUESS the location that fits to your solve, and then you got to have a LUCK to have your selected location to be the right one.

    Let me explain further with the stanza 2, line 1, which is the first clue, “Begin it where warm waters halt.” In order to SOLVE that clue, first you have to analyze and figure out
    1) what “warm waters” refer to
    2) the reason why the plural word “waters” is used instead of just “water”
    3) the reason why the word “halt” is used even though it doesn’t rhyme with “walk”

    Once you figure those out, you have to GUESS the specific location that fits to your particular solve. Fenn said “There are many places in the Rocky Mountains where warm waters halt, and nearly all of them are north of Santa Fe.” The problem at this point is that you only can guess the specific location out of many locations that fit to your solve. You haven’t looked at the second clue yet. It’s only the beginning. How do you know the location you choose is the right one? There is no way. But anyway you have at least the particular starting point in your search.

    Then you continue this process, analysis, solve, selection and so on, and one by one you build the search order. As I pointed out there are only three definite locations in the poem to identify; WWWH, HOB, and BLAZE. Let’s say you have 1A-1B1-1C1 as the first set of your three locations.

    Now you search or explore around your 1C1 Blaze (using Google map or BotG) to see if you can find or do something to get the chest. If you can you are really LUCKY, and you can go there in confidence to retrieve the chest. The end of the story !!!. But that has never happened up until now.

    Then you guess another candidate (1C2) for the Blaze and repeat the same process (with 1A-1B1-1C2) until you find the chest, which is a very tedious and long process. As Fenn said “Playing a hunch is not worth much in the search.” When you exhaust all possible C’s and you can’t find the chest, then you guess another candidate (1B2) for the home of Brown, and continue the same process with all the possible C’s for 1B2. Now you exhaust all the 1Bn’s and 1Cm’s.

    Now you have to guess another candidate (2A) for the WWWH and continue on with the next set of HoB’s and Blazes. 2A-2B1-2C1, 2A-2B1-2C2, …… 2A-2B2-2C3 …… Now you get the idea. The combination is endless and the process takes forever. That’s why Fenn expects that it may take 100, 200 or even 1,000 years for someone to solve the poem and find the chest. I’m sure you will NOT find the chest if you follow on this route. Anyway we are very glad that we only have 3 locations to match.

    So now what are you going to do? Then comes the LUCK. When you guess the locations, specifically the first location, you need a luck to guess at the right one, a LUCKY GUESS. Then you are on the right track to the chest. That’s why Fenn said that you have to focus. Try to use all the hints and other searchers’ comments available on the web and nail the first clue down. That’s the only way. In my humble opinion.

    — MK

    • MK,

      Right from the poem, “If you have been *wise*”.. pretty much says it all. A person that is wise would never guess.

      • The poem cannot be solved, even by the wisest among us, without SOME guessing. As always, in my opinion (I guess.)

      • Hi CharlieM,
        That clue “If you have been wise” is used only to find the blaze, not for anything else, IMO.
        — MK

    • MK;

      I very much disagree regarding the GUESSING part of WWWH. Not to beat a dead horse, but I have repeatedly said that the ANSWER is knowing what “In the wood” means. Knowing this, it will tell you where in Wyoming to find wwwh – NO GUESSING NEEDED!!!

      Again I totally disagree with your statement that “here are only three definite locations in the poem to identify WWWH, HOB, and BLAZE” EVERY thing mentioned MUST be identified – WWWH, canyon down, put-in place – hoB, the meek place, the END place, the no paddle creek, the heavy loads place. the water high place, the blaze the Tarry Scant, the Marvel Gaze location, why go in peace, the go/tired and leave/weak connection, why you must listen good, why cold is important and finally what in the wood means. ALL MUST be figured out – In MY opinion – Good luck with only finding WWWH, hoB and the blaze. JMO –

      Just my GUE$SS, you are on the wrong path – again JMO – JDA

      • Hi JDA and Ken (in Texas),

        That’s why IMO the searchers could not come up with the winning solution because they wanted to identify all those locations until now. I totally agree that you don’t agree with me, but if you narrow down all those search locations to just three (or maybe four, depending upon how you look at the poem and interpret it) it is now manageable to guide me and you in the right direction. I’m sorry to say this, but if you try to identify and find all those locations you will NEVER find the chest IMO.

        And I keep seeing your comments about “in the wood” phrase in the poem, but as you know that phrase appears in the 23rd line, one before the last line. And you’ll also remember that Fenn said that the clues are arranged in the consecutive order. How can the one before the last clue is needed to nail down the beginning point in your search? That I really don’t understand even if I stretch farther than I usually apply.

        Also as I posted sometime ago, IMO, about half of the lines in the poem give you the additional descriptions about the locations (you already found or identified). And I think some of the lines refer to the paths between these locations, not the locations themselves.

        As you have confidence in your solve as the 100% correct one (according to your latest post), I do have my confidence that my solve will be the winning solve. And I did it in ONE WEEK without the help from the TTOTC book or any other books, whether you believe or not.

        Please don’t misunderstand me. I don’t want to discourage other searchers nor to boast that I think I have the correct solve (again I don’t know whether my solve is the correct one until I actually retrieve the chest), but I merely want to point out that since for the last 8 years nobody was able to find the chest, a fresh new look and a different way of seeing and interpreting the same things exists and sometimes that is the only and viable solution technique there is.

        — MK

        • MK;

          Forrest also said to read the poem over and over – even memorize it. So, “in the wood” will be implanted in your brain BEFORE you even begin to solve WWWH. Because it is already in your memory, once you start the solve process, you will recognize what those words mean – JMO – JDA

          P.S. I HAVE been able to locate each and every place I mentioned – both on a map, and with BotG. Step-by-step. If you start at the correct WWWH, finding each and every location I mentioned is not all that difficult. JMO again – JDA

          • JDA,

            What part of consecutive order you don’t understand. I’ll put it this way, clue 1, clue 2, clue 3, clue 4, clue 5, clue 6, clue7, clue 8, clue 9, that is consecutive order. The 9th clue is in the wood, this is way after clue 1. As one reads the poem as it is written is in consecutive order.

            If you or anyone else says there are hints in the poem for wwwh, IMO, I wish you a whole bunch of luck, because you really are going to need it. Also if you are looking for answers for wwwh in the TTOTC, this also applies.

            29 botg (around that number) to the same area should tell you something. You’ve also said in the past that there is more than one blaze, whether or not you still see it that way, there is only one blaze. The poem says in part, “…found the blaze,” does sound as if there is one blaze, not blazes.

            If I sound harsh, it wasn’t intended, my friend, I’m just pointing out inconsistencies in what you say, IMO

            Just Say’n

          • CharlieM;

            I respect your opinion. I do understand consecutive.

            When you solve ANY of the clues, you use information that you have acquired throughout your life. When you read “Canyon down” prior knowledge lets you know that “Down” usually means either lower in elevation or south. Do you disregard this information when you read the poem? Certainly not, you USE that information.

            All I am saying is that “In the wood” has meaning. Use that knowledge when you begin to solve WWWH. It matters not, at least to me, that this information happens to come from another line in the poem – it is just information – information that can be used.

            29 nine, or however many BotG have been fruitful. I have learned a LOT!!! These trips are not a reason to start over, they are the reason that I KNOW that I am getting closer.

            Thanks for your advice. I wish you luck. I will keep on keepin’ on – Thanks for your input – JDA

          • Hi JDA,
            I’m not sure whether you have read my previous post about the nine clues, but I think “in the wood” refers to describe the final hiding place after you’ve found the blaze. Order wise, it’s the one before the last line, and it’s the last sentence if you consider the last two lines as a single sentence. You have to solve that phrase together with “If you are brave” to refer to the last action you have to perform to find the chest, not as a single separate clue associated with WWWH, again IMO.
            — MK

          • Hi JDA,

            I’m sorry to say this, but I think one can read the poem several times, or over and over until he/she can almost memorize it as Fenn said, but to a certain person, a couple times is all it takes.

            What I’m trying to say is that you don’t have to read the poem over and over until you get it because Fenn said so. The reason why you read it over and over is because you don’t get the true meaning behind each and every clue. Fenn may have said it to encourage the searchers because he thought the reason why the chest has not been found is because some searchers read it a couple of times and immediately jump to go out on their boots without knowing where the chest really is, i.e., with no confidence at all.

            Person’s ability to grasp the idea or get the main point or solve the clues is all different according to the person’s perception capability. IMO.

            — MK

          • MK;

            No reason to say you are sorry about any post – Just not necessary. We all have ideas. Time will tell if your ideas hold water or not – or if mine do.

            Forrest does not say how we are to read and/or interpret anything that he posts or publishes. That is left up to us – the searchers.

            Forrest has been saying to read the poem over and over , almost from day one. There MUST be a reason. You have your idea, I have mine, and so does everyone else.

            You seem like a bright guy. Good luck. You seem to believe that what Forrest says can (and should) be taken with a grain of salt… Here is what the writer of the poem has said –
            “There are nine clues in the poem, and the clues are in consecutive order. If you want to find the treasure chest – you have my book there – I’ll tell you how to do it. Read the book just normally … the poem and the rest of the book, and then go back and read the poem 6, 8, 10 times – study every line, every word. Then after you do that, read the book again, slowly, with the idea of looking for clues or hints, that are in the book that will help you follow the clues. You can find the chest with just the clues, but there are hints in the book that will help you with the clues.” f If you choose to ignore this advice – go for it. Hope you have a nice vacation – JMO – JDA

        • CharlieM,

          When Forrest say’s read the poem over and over what makes you think that when you are in the process of solving the first clue that it can’t relate to something said towards the end of the poem. We do not know the correct 9 clues, we can only assume what they all are. So if “in the wood” is used maybe it is not a clue (not saying it is not) but a helpful hint to something else like wwwh. I personally believe in the wood has a meaning for the end of the solve, but could be wrong in all I have found over the years. My clue solves that I have are in consecutive order and I didn’t get the place wwwh from the poem. But with help from the TTOTC book, and no it does not tell you the place but with research of the “word that is key”, that I found, it finally lead me to what it really means and that location. I only have 7 BOTG trips to the Rockies, because of being so far from the Rockies, and have learn something with each trip. It’s only when I got back “in the box” that I was able to put the clues solves together by reading the poem over and over and the path of those clues put me in a very comfortable position for my journey to indulgence. Am I right or wrong only time will tell, but I’m confident in the eight clue solves I have come to find. By the way I have two possible blazes to consider when I get to my eight clue solve, that’s why I only have eight clue solves you need BOTG to solve the ninth. IMO- I don’t like saying this because all I do say is just food for thought, always.

          Good luck CharlieM,

          Good luck

        • MK-
          A searcher who guesses through life is destined to carry a thin wallet.f

          Playing a hunch is not worth much in the search and those who start out by looking for the blaze, are wasting their time.f

          Do you really think that f would say that first ATF and then involve “guessing”?

          With the spot so precise, I don’t think there is room for guessing. The problem with the last few years is that searchers are reading the poem incorrectly. Now the comment about doing this in a week, lol, come on, really. That’s a comment I think you want back. If it took f 15 years just to write it all up, then you are in for a lot of time needed to address all the possibilities and weed out the “no-gos”. Fenn knew only one way, we have to address all possible ways if we can, and you say that should take a week of intelligent guessing? The problem I see is that it only took a week because of the guessing. Back to the drawing board MK, you are better then that. No guessing.

          • Hi poisonivey,

            Thanks for your comment. But that’s exactly why I added “whether you believe it or not.” The fact that it took 15 years for Fenn to write the poem doesn’t mean it will take the same amount of time to solve it. That’s why I said that the possible solve together with a timely LUCK did the job.

            You said “With the spot so precise, I don’t think there is room for guessing.” I think it doesn’t matter whether the spot is so precise or vague, you need all the right guessing to find the correct spot.

            There are so many WWWHs in the Rocky Mountain as Fenn said, how are you going to nail down a SINGLE one, a CORRECT one out of many if you can’t solve for it? Until you continue to solve for the next several clues and find the chest, there is no way you can do that IMO.

            Good LUCK with your search because you’re going to need it, whether you like it or not.

            — MK

          • MK;

            Hate keep pickin at ya, but you just (in my opinion) keep making foolish open-ended statements like: “if you can’t solve for it?” referring to wwwh. Who says it can not be solved? Forrest certainly has said that they can ALL be solved – and HE wrote it.

            You may believe that it can not be solved, but that does not make it so.

            If you believe that the clues can not be solved, that they just need to be GUESSED at – why are you in the chase?

            Again – Good luck guy (or gal) – JDA

          • Hi JDA,

            Don’t feel sorry for picking on me. I like to discuss things. I think you’ve got me wrong in some sense. Initially I couldn’t solve for WWWH, but since I back traced to the WWWH and got the solve, now I have effectively solved it, haven’t I?

            What I have said is that you cannot solve the clue as is, you have to solve the next or the previous one and connect them in a consecutive order to see if it makes sense. And if it does, then you nailed it down. That’s what I was trying to convey. But combining the last clue “in the wood” with the first clue WWWH doesn’t seem to make sense to me, IMO.

            — MK

          • Oh, I forgot to mention one thing, JDA.

            I’m an old man, not over 80 years like Fenn, but old. That’s why I have “King” in my web name.

            — MK

          • MK;

            I may be wrong, but didn’t you say something like you stumbled onto either the blaze or hoB, and then backtracked to WWWH? How is that “Solving” anything? Anyone can throw a dart at a map and say that where it hit is a Blaze or an hoB. Follow a stream or road or trail back towards “Something”, and again stumble on an hoB or a “Canyon down”, and finally to a spot you GUESS is WWWH. How have you “Solved” anything? – You proved you can read a map and that with a bit of imagination made a couple of places match things mentioned in the poem.

            But what do I know? Maybe your approach is what has been missing. JDA

          • Hi JDA,
            As any researchers have done it, I left out some details how I think I’ve solved it. I can elaborate the details if it’s necessary some time later, but if I do it now, it will expose too much about my solve. I think you’ll understand. But if you allow me to say it again, the LUCK played more than half. And the remaining quarter was my good guess and the rest was my solve.
            — MK

          • Okay MK, I actually do see what you are saying. I totally disagree, to an extent, but there are things you are saying that could garnish some backing. I just think you are putting “guess” out there, which is the wrong thing, IMO.
            I’m taking for granted that you think the chest is at the blaze? If so, then it is the solve of the poem that would put you there. If you just picked a spot, with things that are similar to F’s poem, that is coincidence. That is not a solve. But, if you happen to find this spot by just some guess, THEN, worked out in the poem how it is correct, and the poem told you it was, then that is different. That is not guessing. If you are BotG, find something not expected, go home and figure out that it is part of the poem, and can incorporate that into a solve, you are not guessing or depending on luck, you’ve worked the poem, and have solved by poem.
            The way you come across is that you just threw a dart at a dart board, found some similarities, and oh joy, a solve.
            So, with what you posted, you do have back up from some of the things f has said. Reverse engineering to find wwwh is, IMO, the only way to solve for wwwh. The thought of, you will know the end spot before you know wwwh. F’s words in an ATF support that very thought. There is no answer given by Fenn for wwwh.
            You asked me this question: “There are so many WWWHs in the Rocky Mountain as Fenn said, how are you going to nail down a SINGLE one, a CORRECT one out of many if you can’t solve for it?”
            That is very simple, with the poem. With the poem giving me an “X” on a map, I could reverse engineer to a spot of where to start, that is wwwh. Not much different then what you are saying, but no guessing. The solve, and only the solve of the poem can do that.
            Even if you guess correctly, the fact that you don’t know what you are doing will come into play. If you find something by pure luck, in your mind, and cannot tie it to the actual “solving” of the poem, then that is a guess. If you find something out of pure luck, in your mind, work out in the poem how you come to solve for that spot, that is solving the poem, whether you found it by chance, you still solved the poem and found it. You just weren’t far enough in your initial solve. Big difference.
            I still see you using a map instead of using the poem, maybe that is why I disagree with your method, but you have to see, there will be no guessing. If you feel you have guessed at all, then rethink and start a new. But I do “kind of” see what you are saying, and yes, there are ATF’s that could support some of the things you are saying. As long as your guess can turn around and be shown how to solve with the poem. Maybe a change of wording on your post topic will be better suited, but bury this in your “chase” head, “No Guessing”.

    • MK … I disagree with almost everything you say here.

      There is no need to “guess” anything. And “luck” has nothing to do with it.

      And your claim that “there are only three definite locations in the poem to identify; WWWH, HOB, and BLAZE” is astoundingly misguided, in my opinion.

      Ken (in Texas)

        • Thanks CharlieM and Ken (in Texas),

          I appreciate that you disagree with me. Now we have something to talk about. Constructive discussions can continue with the agreement or without. As I said in my previous post (not the immediate post, but several posts back), I traced back from the Blaze to WWWH through hoB. In doing that I needed to identify only those three. “No place for the meek” creek was considered as a path, not the location.

          I know that Fenn said “Playing a hunch is not worth much in the search and those who start out by looking for the blaze, are wasting their time.” But I think I haven’t waste any of my time to exactly do that. You know what? I think Fenn has never thought about that, I mean, tracking the path backward. I think I’ve found the blaze by luck, because I didn’t solve for it. This is the lucky guess I talked about.

          How did I know the blaze I guessed was the right one? (Again I don’t know whether it is the right blaze or not until I have the chest in my hand, and I don’t have to tell you about that anymore, I guess.) But to me at that time the blaze was THE BLAZE I was looking for. As I was back tracking the path from there to WWWH, my confidence grew that I was hitting it home.

          So when I found the WWWH, I followed the clues in the poem in the correct way, I mean, going forward consecutively to the end. And my solve fit kinda perfectly to every hints given by Fenn. Especially this one, “Look at the big picture, there are no short cuts.” Does anybody have the correct explanation to his mention of short cuts? I haven’t see that anywhere.

          How about “And I can tell you an 80-year-old man is not going to make a trip INTO a canyon, then come UP and go DOWN again”? I posted my comments about this a couple times before.

          You can go ahead and try to find any number of locations you can think of, but I’ll tell you that finding three locations is a lot easier than many, IMO.

          — MK

          • MK- IF my solve works out, and IF I read Forrest correctly, your approach is good. The immediate connection of wise and blaze is almost too easy. Has no one else heard the adage of what makes a man (or woman) wise? It’s early to bed and early to rise makes a man healthy, wealthy and wise. I’m with you MK.

          • MK- that’s all fine, but,

            A searcher who guesses through life is destined to carry a thin wallet.f

            That does not sound like Fenn involved any type of guessing to be part of the chase. He even says “guessing”, IMO, you are on the wrong path…

          • Hi Saun Moony,
            Thanks for your encouragement.

            I think I’ve posted a comment on the “wise” sometime ago. I think it refers to the line “The end is ever drawing nigh” three lines before. As I also pointed out, that this third stanza refers to the path from the HOB to the BLAZE and back. Since the 3rd and 4th lines is written in the future tense, I think it refers to the same creek after you find the chest.

            And the next line (the first line in the fourth stanza) says about “wise”. So if you combine “the end is ever drawing nigh” with “If you’ve been wise and found the blaze”, I think the “wise” means that you have to continue your path until you reach the end since the end is much farther than you initially thought when you start on this path.

            Notice also that this line is written in present perfect tense, not the present tense, which, in my thought, tells me that it should precedes the previous two lines written in future tense, confirming further that the those two lines should be skipped when you’re going to the blaze.

            — MK

          • So Saun, this is just an observation/curious question. Did f hide the chest on different days or do you feel he did it within one afternoon? (Feel free to guess if you like).

            The point of MK’s post is the topic of guessing. Of course “wise” and “blaze” will be connected. That’s not what MK is getting at. It’s the part about guessing. I ask because I would be surprised if there was anybody else that believes that f put guessing at the forefront of solving the poem. If you are with MK, then guessing is at the forefront of your solve? That is a very tough pill to swallow, and makes it hard to see if you two are really serious or not. Believe me, through the years, even though most write ups start with guessing, the topic of having to guess your way through the poem is not a serious one.
            IMO, if you have to guess anywhere in the poem, if you arrive at a place on a map from a guess, or if your BotG is just a shot in the dark guess, or any part of the solve revolves around a guess, you will not find the chest. There is no reason to look for the chest, unless you just want a reason to have a nice, expensive vacation, your wallet will remain forever ‘thin”. I would encourage anybody to look at their solve and see deep down if they are guessing. If so, think about it, do you really think f spent 15 years forming something to make us “guess” at a solve? IMO, if you start at some random place and then need to explain through a History lesson why it is wwwh, without showing how the poem solved for such a place, then you are just flat wrong. Every “ah-ha” moment is just coincidence, no matter how “ah-ha” it is. Until the chest is found, everything should be considered coincidence void of guessing.

          • poison, I understand why you say there SHOULDN’T be any guessing but if over 300,000 searches have not located the right spot, then weren’t those 300k wrong guesses?

            The way I understand what MK is suggesting is that instead of forcing the last 8 clues to match a possibly incorrect wwh, a better way will be to use the process of elimination to weed out wrong guesses by using the first 3 clues. It’s an efficient brain exercise.

      • Hi oz10,

        You’re talking about #2 and #3 clues, right?
        #2, Take it in the canyon down.
        #3, Not far, but too far to walk.

        Some searchers think they have to drive some distance down (or south, or to lower elevation) following the canyon, while some other searchers believe “take it in” means “to view”.

        How far? Not far. 100′? Half mile? A couple miles? 20 miles? You decide. Nobody can SOLVE it. How can you make sure you’ve traveled the correct distance? Until you find the home of Brown? Is there any house related to Mr. Brown anywhere? Or the place where brown trouts hangout?

        Not far, but too far to walk? How many steps are too far to walk? Is a mile too far to walk? Again there is no definite, exact number of steps or a certain distance that Fenn has specified. You have to find that out yourself. The only way for you to find out is, here it goes again, you have to GUESS IT first. Then you find out whether your guess yields any identifiable geographical locations at that distance away. If you can’t find anything at that distance, you guess again and repeat that process until you get it.

        Or you can look at the scene (clue #2) and pick a spot and go there (clue #3). Did I help you in any way?

        — MK

        • Thanks MK and sorry I should’ve been more specific. I was referring to these:

          2) the reason why the plural word “waters” is used instead of just “water”
          3) the reason why the word “halt” is used even though it doesn’t rhyme with “walk”

          I don’t want you to reveal your solutions, but since you pointed it out I thought it will be good to hear your perspective on why waters (plural) or the used of halt. If that will also reveal too much then it is okay not to answer. Or maybe use an analogy. Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

          • Hi oz.
            I’ll throw my 2 cents in on this if it may help. Water and waters are completely interchangeable. ie “The murky waters of the Amazon”. “The icy waters of the Yukon River” etc. I see 2 reasons why he chose waters and not water. The first is, if he had used water singular, then grammar dictates that “waters halt” would have to become “water halts”. This would make an already fragile rhyme with walk non-existent. Secondly, if “halt” becomes “halts” then on the next line, he would have to remove the ambiguity that exists and use “take” or “takes” to specify whether it is the water that TAKES it in the canyon down or whether it is you (or something else) that TAKE it in the canyon down. Just my thoughts on the plurality. He did craft the poem over a long time until he got it just right.

        • MK, you said “the only way for you to find out is, here it goes again, you have to GUESS IT first.” Imo no guessing involved. If one has a Sound Theory, then one will go with confidence, and with ALL distances in mind prior to botg. If you’re relying on ANY guess, you’re not ready for botg. IMO

          • Hi everybody,

            I think all of you got me wrong about my saying that I have to guess the locations. I’m talking about the process of solving; guess first, search next, and fix (or nail down) the solve. With every solve first you have to guess what the clues refer to (names, places, locations what have you), and search for it until you get the correct solve.

            If you haven’t done that, I’m afraid that you’re one of the 350,000 searchers with no chest IMO. I said that initially I had to guess (with a luck it was a better guess) to come up with something to search for, and selected one out of many (or sometimes it may be the only one) which best fit to the poem, and that finally became my solve. Guessing is finished, and I have a solve, THE solve. I think I can go in confidence to the hiding place without hesitation. I’m pretty sure that I will be within several steps from the chest.

            IMO most searchers have tried to fit the locations to the poem, not to fit the poem to the locations. If you try to fit the location to the poem (not the other way around), that’s what is called “stretching.”

            But still I have to be there on my boots to do the last action required to find the chest, which I don’t know exactly, but only GUESSing (here we go again) what I have to do. If you tell me you know exactly how to retrieve the chest, I think you’re not telling the truth, in my humble opinion.

            — MK

          • MK;

            I can only describe how I have SOLVED the poem – without guessing.

            I followed Forrest’s advice and read the poem over and over and over – then read the book looking for hints that might help with the clues. I looked up almost every word to fully “understand” the many possible interpretations of the poem.

            I have had two or three different theories regarding what is a clue or what is a hint.

            Once Forrest stated that wwwh was the first clue, it was obvious that this was where to begin.

            Using my “In the wood” theory, I wound up at a particular place in Wyoming. No guessing – I feel that the poem sent me to this spot. Once here, I scoured a map of the surrounding area, looking for a WWWH. Spotted one almost immediately – on the map. No guessing. It was the ONLY possibility in the surrounding area.

            Looked on the map for a canyon – only one found – NO GUESSING – I took it in a southerly direction that was also lower in elevation.

            New challenge – Find a place to “put-in” below something that could be considered a hoB. Took a bit of research, but found a logical place. Was this a guess? I say no, because there was no other place in this general area that met the criteria.

            I could continue through the rest of the poem, but the process is identical to my thought process.

            Read the poem, decide what the words mean (Look up almost every word to make sure I understand all possible meanings.) Find a spot on the map that matches the criteria laid out in the poem. Analyze all available information – Find a spot on the map that matches the poem’s description – based on analysis – NOT GUESSING. Be LOGICAL in my choices. That is just how I have approached the solve. Read, absorb, study, analyze and apply logic – Jmo – JDA

          • Thanks JDA,

            With the help from the book you probably did not have to guess anything. But for me without the book I think I had to guess everything. Does that make sense?

            One other thing to mention. In my solve “down” in “canyon down” is not southerly direction but rather an easterly direction.

            — MK

  42. Seeker, come out, come out where ever you are. Imo, you’re one of the stars here on hoD. Are you ok? I truly miss your input.

  43. Dal, Thank you, you’re the best when it comes to Mr. Fenn and the thrill of the chase. I’ll conduct myself according to your rules here on hoD. Everyone here should refresh yourselves on Dal’s rules. The point being, ” IMO”

  44. Well it looks like a new coat of fresh snow in my search area. Nice to be able to see my general area on a webcam. I like to check periodically to see if more snow or if it melts some with higher temps. From what I see so far it’s been about the same as last year. It’s got three months to clear, hope it does. Is anyone else monitoring their area?

    Good luck all,

    • Hi Bur;

      Yes, I monitor my GENERAL area, and yes, my area also has a new coating of snow – as does Pocatello. I wish that I could monitor my small search area – but alas, no cameras that I can monitor – but their probably is one that I can not view. I have heard about one, but can not confirm it.

      Next week both Pocatello, and my general search area are supposed to get snow for 6 straight days – Y U C K ! ! !

      Stay warm, and TRY to STAY SAFE Bur, and all other searchers – JDA

      • Hi JDA
        Pocatello is this where you are from?I looked on Google earth to find,man you got a lot of search area just out your back door or front.
        That sounds like a good name for Forrests cat.

        • YUP – YUP – Not TOO far to West Yellowstone area – Cody area, Jackson Hole area – Landers or Thermopolis area. Lots to choose from 🙂

          Chief Pocatello might not like being named for a “Kitty” 🙂 JDA

  45. Is there ANYBODY on this blog that lives near or in Boise Idaho that would like to meet in person to discuss the Chase? I am in dire need of another searcher to talk to, but I don’t want to share my Ideas with the whole world. Please E mail me at dproudscot@gmail.com. I promise you won’t be disappointed!!

  46. Well, I go skiing in the mornings and catch 9 holes in the Afternoon, sometimes in shorts, my skiing is usually free, over 70, one of the best thing about New Mexico is it is Where Warm Waters halt and 32 degrees does worth the cold does not overpower the sun….See ya on the slopes, TT

  47. Tom Terrific….clinching my fist and making a pulling down motion as the powder flies and you go whizzing by. Just like we did as kids to get semi drivers to honk their
    So refreshing being an non-offical, non-governor appointed goodwill ambassador for The Land Of Enchantment WWWH.
    Shouting at the top of my lungs at the summit of MT. Wheeler….”God Bless This Land….God Bless The U.S.A. !!!!!

    as always IMO

  48. “I am almost umbilically attached to the spot…”

    Slow afternoon, so parsing f’s recent six replies. This may have been discussed, here or on another board, so apologies if redundant, or if simply painfully obvious to searchers.

    I can’t claim to ever having been umbilically attached to anything but a placenta (so I’m told; I have no clear recollection of it), so today I’ve been trying to understand f’s use of the term. He chose six questions out of many, and crafted replies over a period of days, as I understand it, so I don’t think any word choice or phrase is inconsequential.

    FWIW, he used the term in SB 149 three years ago.


    I don’t know if it’s relevant to a particular place or not, but it might shed light on the context in which he uses the term. Or not.

    • There is nothing that connects one human closer than the umbilical cord that connects a baby to its mother.

      I think that it is this kind of connection that Forrest was referring to.

      The umbilical cord brings life to the baby, and sustains it.

      I think that Forrest’s connection to this special spot is much the same. At one point in Forrest’s life, this spot nourished Forrest’s soul and gave it life.

      THAT is a strong bond. JMO – JDA

      • What would we do without our mother.
        Life blood.
        Umbilical- serving as or containing a conduit through which power is transferred, especially to a unit that will be or is designed to be ultimately self-sufficient or independent:
        an umbilical cable for launching a rocket; an umbilical plug for starting jet engines.

          • Not too many men walk around with poetic licenses. It’s his mom whom he imagines there, I think.

          • Also I just want to say that the woman on the lid of the chest front centre right is Eleanor of Aquitaine. Richard the Lionheart’s mom. I think.

          • If you can find it. Watch “Lion In Winter” with Patrick Stewart and Glenn Close. Glenn plays Eleanor. Sorry if I’m boring.

          • Sean
            Why would you be tied to a spot umbilically?
            We would say ‘’cheepta” or belly button but I won’t get into that.
            There are special places we are tied to they are sacred sites.
            You might not even know why but it lifts your spirit.
            Spiritual places like the Big Horn Medicine Wheel.
            The Alpine Visitors Centre in Rocky Mountain National Park is a pure location.
            Some people prefer the beach at the ocean.
            You might go there to purify your soul and balance out you ions. (+ -)
            You most likely didn’t realize your mother was helping you out.
            There is much to learn from Mother Nature.
            She might whisper in your ear if you listen hard enough.
            This is what I was thinking when I heard the word umbilical.
            There is more to the story but I don’t want to be a wet blanket and bore you much.

      • you got it backwards JDA. imo
        Forrest feeds the spot, the spot doesnt feed him. Forrest is the mother of the spot, nourishing the spot, seeing to its growth and well being.
        this makes sense when you understand that the spot is the Buffalo Bill Center of the West.
        the spot is not Forrest’s favorite fishing hole. nor anywhere else outdoors.

        i think.

    • As someone already pointed out, he uses the term on pg. 76 in My war For me. With a very different twist. It’s worth reading.

  49. Wonder how much heartache, fuel and expenses this year by those adamant
    bout pre mid May forays into the Rockies?

  50. Hey poisonivy. How deep is a hole? I have “reason to believe”. It’s more than a guess, and with partial confirmation. As always, we must prove it one way or another. The prima donna isn’t singing yet.

    • If the hole is a sipapu, it goes all the way down to the world from which we came. According to Hopi legend anyway.

  51. Has anyone noticed the similarities between the second and fourth stanzas?

    just occurred to me that “found” can mean “begin”
    then “down” in the second sentences and “but” in the third?

    Just something I noticed. Not sure of the significance, if any. Does this trigger thoughts in anyone else?

    • Corresponds to one way I’ve parsed the poem.

      Those are also the two stanzas in the poem that are 2nd person. In other words, the subject of all the verbs in those two stanzas is “you.”

      1st stanza – 1st person

      2nd stanza – 2nd person

      3rd stanza – 3rd person

      4th stanza – 2nd person

      5th stanza – 1st person

      6th stanza – 1st 2nd and 3rd mixture (effort will be; YOU are brave; I give you. . .)


      • Interesting observation, Jake.

        I guess to add more, those two stanzas also each have three “command” forms of verbs:

        Begin, take, put in
        Look, tarry (or maybe but instead) , take

        The only other command form is “hear”in the amalgamated final stanza.

        • The 1st – 2nd – 3rd – 2nd – 1st – all 3 sequencing of the six stanzas struck me as very . . . architectural.

          You’re right about the imperative “commands” Clint(“instructions that can be followed precisely” is another way to think about them).

          I’d add that:

          in stanza 4 the final one is “(you) take AND (you) go”
          in stanza 6 the initial one is “(you all) hear me AND (you all) listen good”.

          Also of note are the two conditionals (if-then) in the poem.

          Stanza 4 has a tactical one:

          *IF* you’ve been wise and (you’ve) found the blaze
          *THEN* (you) look down to cease your quest.

          Stanza 6 has one that seems to encapsulate the “problem” as a whole; it’s the terms of the puzzle’s contract:

          *IF* you are brave and you are in the wood
          *THEN* I give you the gold


  52. Today, I’ve been trying to reconcile comments f has made about how nature might affect the hidey spot.

    “The only changes to that site today are those that nature has made.” -f -MW 2.2019

    “The immediate landscape will probably remain about the same for as long as time has to go.” -f -MW 2.2019

    “I don’t think earth can hurt it, under the right conditions wind might affect it, it’s probably already wet, and look at what fire did to the twin towers. Nature makes her own rules, James, so I try to not be absolute when talking about her.” -f -MW 10.2014

    “I considered mudslides, forest fires, earthquakes, and floods.” -f -DailyBeast 2.2013

    Nature is sum kinda powerful force for change, even more so where human activity occurs in it. So the ‘immediate landscape will probably remain about the same’ comment strikes me as odd, and therefore worthy of attention.

    Drought, insect damage and fire have created significant changes in the landscape where they have occurred throughout the Rockies, even just in the short period since f hid TC. Millions of pinons have been lost in northern NM, mountainsides once thick with lodgepole pine in RMNP have been dramatically changed by the beetle and changing climate, burn scars over 100s of thousands of acres have made a huge difference in what one now sees and what now grows in those areas.

    So I wonder, for the immediate landscape to remain the same, is it necessarily rock and not vegetative? Ruling out another ice age and associated glacial activity prior to TC being found, I still must consider how Yosemite’s El Capitan (and the valley floor immediately below it) was changed in late 2017 with two consecutive days of rock slides. The well known Old Man in the Mountain I much enjoyed viewing when hiking the White Mountains of NH in the 90s literally fell off and changed that rocky area’s profile in 2003. So rock is not impervious to change by forces of nature.

    And yet f tells us that ‘the immediate landscape will probably remain about the same for as long as time has to go.’ It just doesn’t (yet) make sense to me. And to complicate things, it seems totally contradictory to his ‘Nature makes her own rules, James, so I try to not be absolute when talking about her’ comment four years ago.

    • Aard:

      Don’t forget to add to you quotes the following:

      Forrest also said, “If I was standing where the treasure chest is, I’d see trees, I’d see mountains, I’d see animals. I’d smell wonderful smells of pine needles, or pinyon nuts, sagebrush—and I know the treasure chest is wet. Well you’ve asked me a lot of questions and some of them—most of them I answered, a few I haven’t, but I’ve got to tell you—there’s one thing I told you I wish I had not.” f

      Add this quote to yours, and what kind of picture do you conger up? – JDA

          • My solve (I believe) hits all of the clues and many anecdotal statements by ff except 2 things. His 200ft/500ft statements make me doubt my location and his insistence that the tc can be found with only the poem. I rely on info in TToTC for my solve.

      • Hello JDA, “IF” I was standing where the treasure chest is.
        That to me is the one thing he wished he ‘d not said.

      • @JDA — f’s ‘what I’d see and smell’ comment tells me that it is in nature/wilderness, but that just means to me that it is highly subject to natural forces and change. There are many places in northern New Mexico where one could smell pine needles/pinon nuts one year, but not the next due to their die-out or fire. I don’t know how he can be so sure that change will not occur in his immediate area.

  53. aardvarkbark, on 2-6-19 I gave my partial take on Mr. Fenn’s answers to Jenny’s 6 questions. Now, my interpretation is probably colored by personal bias. The one difference in his comment about “for as long as time has to GO” was used instead of COME. So imo, “the immediate landscape will probably remain about the same”, due to not much time has to GO before the TC is found. JMO

  54. Aardvark, JDA…….and all Searchers

    Two items to chew on:

    One :
    “I don’t think earth can hurt it, under the right conditions wind might affect it, it’s probably already wet, and look at what fire did to the twin towers. Nature makes her own rules, James, so I try to not be absolute when talking about her.” -f -MW 10.2014.
    When he states that under the right conditions wind might affect it what does that suggest to you? It tells me that the treasure chest is not buried, for how can wind, no matter how strong, effect something that is buried. So, IMO the question if it is buried or not has been answered, not buried.

    “I considered mudslides, forest fires, earthquakes, and floods.” -f -DailyBeast 2.2013.
    If he had already found this place before he even thought about hiding a TC how could he have considered the things he mentioned above? So, if he did actually considered them in deciding where to hide the TC then did he really know exactly where to hide it beforehand as he said he did? Or, was it just a coincidence that this place already had everything that he had considered? Chew on these for a while. What are your thoughts?

    • ManOwar;

      Just a thought or two. You say that if your #1 is true, that it can not be buried. I disagree. Let’s say that it IS below ground, but that Forrest erected or made a marker of some kind at the site. Let’s now say that a strong wind topples a tree that falls on this marker.

      Can the treasure now be found? Maybe, but with a lot more difficulty since the “Marker” has been destroyed or obscured. The same with fire. Fire can topple a tree and obliterate the marker that designated where Indulgence is interred.

      Regarding paragraph #2 – Forrest said that he knew where he wanted to secret Indulgence, and that he was going to make it work regardless… “Make it work…” This implies, at least to me, that once the site was chosen, that Forrest MAY of had to do some “Prep work” in order to make the “Spot” WORK. Does this mean digging a hole, erecting a small stone bunker or some such in order to “protect” the site from natures ravages? Forrest says that he has thought of everything – part of “everything” just might include site preparations don’t you think? Makes sense to me – JMO – JDA

      • “I tried to think of everything” is not the same as “I thought of everything”,
        in my opinion.

        • How can anyone know that they have thought of everything. None of us can see into the future. Saying that you have tried to think of everything says that you have done your best to think of everything, but without being able to foretell the future, you have done the best that you can – JMO JDA

      • JDA, Just a comment to let you know I’m still out here. Haven’t been shadowing the Forums, not enough time.

        Regarding your thoughts on Forrest Fenn’s comment “making it work, no matter what.” I don’t believe the context of his remarks have to do with site preparation as much as his method, difficulty, and outcomes he desired the challenge to entail!

        Here’s why.

        This is Forrest special spot which he has described as umbilical, imprinted, his alone, etc. etc. He likes to “steal away” to it in his “reverie”… I’m going to suggest that he can see his special spot very clearly in his minds-eye.

        Next he is a master at finding things, no one else can find. He understands concealment intimately; therefore I’m going to suggest that both the spot and a method of concealment came first and foremost easily to his mind.

        But he realized very quickly and intuitively, that the spot and the 10″ x10′” x 5 or 6″ treasure chest’s concealment, are only the first part of the whole challenge and when thinking this whole thing out in a “serious way,” he knew there were going to be “what-ifs” that might present challenges to his objective of using this spot and in realizing this – he committed himself to figuring out a way to make that specific location work no matter the difficulties that the what-ifs might entail!

        Some of the what-if’s we know based on what Forrest has told us about his “trying to think of everything:”
        1) Legal Ownership to the finder
        2) The Enduring Nature of the Treasure location over time
        3) Difficult but not Impossible to find
        4) How he could go about hiding it with out with out people knowing
        5) How he could get back to it, at his dying (with out further clues)
        6) How he might know for sure when or if the chest were found
        7) How safe the hunt would be (perhaps not fully foreseen)
        8) What “avenue” or what form the puzzle would be presented

        In the end, that challenge was designed into a poem we all know and love, Apparently his imagination was up to the task!


        • GCG’

          I can see that you have given this a lot of thought – Brave to you. I can not disagree with anything that you have presented. I think that our two posts pretty well summarizes how difficult it must have been to “Make it work” – Including the “What If’s”.

          Thanks for your input. Stay warm and TRY and STAY SAFE – JDA

        • Hi, GCG. I like the ideas you shared above, and I can’t say I disagree with anything you wrote.

          It made me wonder if it is possible for someone not actively looking for the Chest to coincidentally find it. If the general hiding area has some element of special natural beauty that may cause someone to decide to visit it on their own, and the blaze is a noticeable aberration once in that area, it seems like this could be another of Forrest’s “what if” situations that you describe.

          This makes me think that there might be more importance to the line “look quickly down” as a means of providing some amount of separated distance between the blaze and the Chest, to prevent a coincidental visitor from noticing the blaze and accidentally finding the treasure in their closer investigation of it.

          • Hi Blex,

            I think even if some non-searchers came to see the blaze and were close to the chest (only several steps from the chest actually) they wouldn’t dare to go any further to do or see anything more. Why? Because they thought they were already at the final place they wanted to come and see.

            The searchers who come to that specific place on purpose according to their solve in confidence will definitely and knowingly go an extra step to find the chest. The poem clearly says that “if you are brave and in the wood” you are given the title to the gold.

            You have to be brave, and dare to go an extra step, and venture out in the wood, then and only then, you will find the Indulgence, IMO.

            — MK

          • Blex;

            Please note one of GCG’s comments that you said that you agree with – Concealment. I agree that Forrest would conceal Indulgence. Forrest has repeatedly told us that it will not be stumbled upon.

            The Blaze may attract your attention, but I am confident that if you then do not know EXACTLY what you are looking for, you will walk right past it, and never give it a second thought… because it is concealed so well – JMO – JDA

          • MK;

            I agree, and disagree. A searcher must be willing to take that extra step – I agree.

            You then say: “and venture out in the wood, ” – I disagree. I think that these words have an entirely different meaning – It does say “wood” (Singular) not “Woods” (Plural) – for a reason – JMO – JDA

          • MK – although you say “wood” – you imply “woods” – I may be wrong in my interpretation of your usage of “wood” – JDA

          • Hi JDA,
            I know exactly what you’re going to say next, that “in the wood” refers to the WWWH not to the last step needed before finding the chest. Good luck to that.

          • Hi JDA,
            What then are the difference between “wood” and “woods” according to your line of thinking?
            — MK

          • MK;

            To me, “woods” = the forest – Go into the woods = go into the forest.

            Wood, on the other hand – to me refers to processed lumber – like a “Wood-lined” cedar chest. I know, hard to envision a :”Wood-lined” anything out in nature, but maybe Forrest took the time to create something like what we see in Charmey and Me – that is wood-lined. JMO – JDA

          • JDA
            May not be relevant but the chest appears to be lined with wood.
            It’s an old idea I had about wood in the chest. I figured if you’re in the wood you’re looking inside the chest.

          • Thanks for your responses, MajinKing & JDA. Hiding and concealment I think are certain to some degree… but to what degree?

            “In the wood” could be a clue speaking of the nature of the Chest’s concealment. I will admit to having excitedly looked inside a few conspicuous tree stumps and logs.

            JDA, what is “Charmey and Me”? Is that a chapter in a book that I’ve forgotten about?

          • Thanks, JDA. I just gave it another read this morning and that was the story that I was guessing you were talking about. Certainly a good idea of hiding to keep in mind on future searching!

        • GCG –

          It’s great to hear from you.

          Were your ears burning? I was talking to Zap about you yesterday.

          I think most have misinterpreted the following Friday quote.

          “The chapters in my book have very subtle hints but are not deliberately placed to aid the seeker.”

          If I was looking for hints in order to find the Fenn treasure I would rewrite that as follows..

          The chapters in my book have very subtle hints that are deliberately placed to confuse the seeker.


    • Here are my thoughts:
      The TC is not on a steep hillside where a mudslide or landslide would be a
      threat. The TC is not in a large, densely-forested area near a mountain top,
      because lightning could start a forest fire there, which could threaten the TC.
      The TC is not in a creek, stream, or river subject to much fluctuation in flow
      rate, because rapidly flowing water can move rocks or other heavy objects such as a treasure chest. That water can also erode the ground that defines the path of the flowing water, which could then (if the TC is in it) allow the TC to move/tumble.

      I think the TC is on a relatively level part of the ground, and not covered with anything that would look, to a casual passerby, like the result of purposeful
      placement. In other words, no “monument”, “cairn”, totem, etc. is there.

      Fenn’s comment about the treasure being wet is not important, as he said
      this in winter.

      The above is all part of my opinion.

      • Tall Andrew,…..I agree with your thoughts……and maybe he hid it in some large clearing with sagebrush surrounded by pine trees that would be far enough away that fire wouldn’t effect the TC. Some rocky plateau that’s hidden in the mountains would be a good place.

        • @MOw — I like the rocky plateau idea. Forces of nature do change rock, but mostly vertical rock working in partnership with gravity. Horizontal rock would better stand the test of time. The trees around it may no longer be seen following a fire or severe drought, but then those may not be in the ‘immediate landscape’ he now references (and just how many feet is considered ‘immediate’ anyway? I’m still trying to get a measurement for ‘proximate’, too.)

          Plus, my boot tends to emit a much more definite ‘clomp’ when traveling across rock rather than across a soft forest floor.

      • @TA — bear in mind that mudslides/landslides don’t just affect steep hillsides; they also significantly alter the level areas below where all the debris eventually comes to rest. And fires aren’t only started by lightening in densely forested mountaintops. They are also started by unattended campfires, carelessly discarded cigarettes and downed power lines. At all elevations. And once going, are indiscriminate in their consumption of mountainsides and valleys, forests and meadows.

  55. One thing he wished he did not say. Yep…..bet he wished he was eat’in Pinyon Nuts and not talking about the smell of Pinyon. The range of Pinyon Trees and their distribution in the Rockies and the American West could be quite telling. Sometime way back in the Chase while doing a trek to New Mexico via Southern Colorado for BOTG we came across an amazing lady up at Zapota Falls. She taught us about Pinyon Nuts and their early use as a food staple by the Ancestral Pueblen. She also shared harvesting technics and insight concerning the fruiting cycle of Pinyon along with letting us harvest some with her. Boy….don’t ya just love it? The Chase has opened up so many insightful adventures. This all happened before f made the statement about the smell of Pinyon if he was STANDING near the chest so when the statement was made….bingo….lights went off…..the search area had been narrowed. The U.S. Forest Service (Dept. Of Interior) has Pinyon Distribution Maps. Boy HOWDY….just can’t have enough “good” maps in your arsenal if you want to be a spit-shined Junior Woodchuck. I slip of the tongue can sure change the course of history on the planet. “Hear me all and listen good” sure rings true in those Pinyon forests. That statement sure ruffled the feathers of some of those die-hard residents that would swear out loud that the treasure was in their state because they were either borned or lived there. Ain’t (used to not be in the dictionary) life funny that way. I mean ain’t life funny that ain’t was at one time not in the dictionary.

    • Guy;

      I think that the reason that he wished he had not said it was that it was NOT correct. He was NOT limiting the search to only NM, Colorado and a very small piece of Wyoming. It is obvious you disagree – I am just offering the other side of the argument – JDA

      • JDA,
        There are so many ways to interpret that interview. The thing he wished he never said could be something that got left on the cutting room floor, so to speak – I wish we had the whole thing. You can’t smell pinyon nuts (at least most people can’t). Anyway, I’m firmly in the no pinyon nut area, so confirmation bias requires me to agree with you. But the sage, pine and mountain views are still important, imo.

      • JDA
        I agree with you I don’t think nuts have anything to do with it.
        Lot of nutrition but too costly.
        If its nuts you’re after check out the maps.
        Yeah it’s funny but it “Ain’t” there.
        Just my opinion.

      • Jda- I agree with your line of thinking too… Does anyone know how flutterby made out? Sounded very confident and peaked my interest.

  56. What is it about Aspen Wood that makes it unique? It does live longer than any other air breathing plant or creature, it does blaze once a year and in the Rockies it grows in all the range.

    IF you are brave and in the wood, are you wise as well? A blaze in the Aspen Forest, meaning forest fire threat is simply a minimal risk to an almost perfectly designed plants, often the grove will withstand better than anything else, except rocks, and Aspen thrive very well in rocks, see the rocks in my video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-GD4vhA3No
    if timing is what makes one wise then August 22, is a wise guess, since the Aspens begin to turn golden around ff’s birthday.


  57. I’m content with knowing the Chase has rooted itself in hearts that will help it grow far beyond what I first imagined it could. I’ll be enjoying much of my time playing with my little dog Willie and watching the seasons pass.

    Good luck and safe passage to all of you. f

    LISTEN CLOSELY, my friends, to these final words of the ORACLE:“Ah, make the most of what we yet may spend,
    Before we too into the Dust descend;
    Dust into Dust, and under Dust to lie
    Sans Wine, sans Song, sans Singer, and–sans End!

    Alike for those who for To-day prepare,
    And those that after some To-morrow stare,
    A Muezzin from the Tower of Darkness cries
    “Fools! your Reward is neither Here nor There.”

    Omar Khayyám

    Rooted? Safe passage? Put in? THANK YOU MR FENN…..FROM A VIDEO CREATOR.

    tt TO ff and out!

      • That quote, was the very last line (ever) by Forrest Fenn, to answer 6 questions on Mysterious Writings, completed each February since 2012, Mr Thunder…..Understand that Many Searchers, including me, believe that ff has been giving hints in his interviews and writings, for years, some of the answers and comments by Forrest seem to suggest he enjoys a good tease at our quandary, like 66,000 links north of city limits of Santa Fe, NM? That converts to 8.25 miles distance, yet in another thread ff had said this video might help us with the poem (I paraphrase what ff actually said) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFzDaBzBlL0 …now apply that analogy to 8.25 and reverse you get 285, which is the most northerly highway into the Rockies, it is only 90 miles as crow flies to the Colorado Border.

        Forrest has explained that children may have an advantage in understanding the poem, so watch and learn Forrest’s lesson.

        What in the structure of this poem is a backward bike?

        The answer belongs to the correct solution, if we had a more pliable brain, ie neuroplasticity to understnad what he has done then we be styilin…in RIches ENw and lod…


    • How do WE in New Mexico watch the changing seasons? Let us not forget to grab every banana!
      Winter Thoughts by Tom Terrific. google it.

      Canasta is a little wicker basket, 8.25 miles north of SF; is on the right road map, backward bicycle eh …285.
      You can thank me later. TT

  58. Kitty contest deadline today. 2/11. Two eleven is 22. Mountain time. I’m going to review chapter 21 in TFTW…

    • Sorry, you can’t. If you click on “Searchers Discussions” you will find a list of all available threads. Best of luck – JDA

      • “Searchers Discussions” scroll up to the top of this thread – Look on the right side – scroll down a bit and you will find “Searcher’s Discussions”. You might also look at the “Rules” tab and- the “Cheat Sheet” – Lots to explore – JDA

      • Shucks! Thanks JDA! I just have a question for everyone. Do you think Forrest hid Indulgence so it can be found with the correct solve? I’m not talking about the “treasure” or the “chest”.. which are different IMO. I’m about ready to give Forrest the boot.. I think the old coot is sitting on it!!

        • Laddyaddy;

          I am a bit confused. You ask : “. Do you think Forrest hid Indulgence so it can be found with the correct solve? – My answer is absolutely, one can find Indulgence with the correct solve.

          Then you say: ” I’m not talking about the “treasure” or the “chest”.. which are different IMO” OK, how are the “treasure” and the “Chest” different than Indulgence.

          True, in stanza #1 Forrest days that “As I have gone alone in there and with my treasures bold…” which COULD be different than Indulgence, and later says “Just take the chest and go in peace…” Most think that he is talking about Indulgence, but a few think it has another meaning. What do you consider the chest to be if not Indulgence? Just curious.

          Treasures bold might be memories or any number of other things. A chest could even mean ones own chest – or self.

          What are your thoughts? – JDA

          • You then say: “. I’m about ready to give Forrest the boot.. I think the old coot is sitting on it!!” Why give Forrest the boot so soon in the game? Why would you think that Forrest is “sitting on it”? Again, your assesment seems a bit premature to me. JMO – JDA

          • Laddyaddy;

            For someone who wanted to open up a thread about your inquiries, your answer to one question seems a bit terse, and NO answer to the other two at all. What are we to think? Just someone who wants to stir the pot, but offer nothing??? JDA

          • JDA,
            Just my opinion. But, I also think the words “treasures” and “chest” do not refer to the treasure chest. Though I disagree with Laddyaddy as far as her attitude goes. Just for the sake of discussion, I believe “treasues” refers to natural resources. I believe “chest” has a meaning other than treasure chest.

          • Flutterby;

            I agree both Treasures and Chest have meanings not directly related to Indulgence.

            Is it spring yet Fletterby? I want to see you flitting on warm wafts of spring-time air – JDA

        • Laddyaddy,
          Im confused. Why are you spending any time on the chase if you think it isnt solvable? If you would rather spend time with family and friends, then go do it!

      • Hi Forrest! I am hot on your trail! I spent my whole Sunday on a heartwarming story and all for nothing. Guess i’ll throw it in the trash like that time magazine! That time could have been spent with my family and pets. You love to preach about that while you sit on your electronics and read your emails. I would like for everyone on here
        to please send Forrest an email and demand a reply. Fill his inbasket!!!

        • Mr. Laddyaddy–

          I’m guessing that patience and persistence are two words not in your vocabulary. IMO The Thrill of the Chase, is to have fun and explore places you might have never experienced.

          Forrest made the rules, because it’s his game. Please don’t come across like a spoiled child, because he won’t answer or respond to your emails. I am sure after you find the strong box, he will respond to you and ……your inbox will be flooded .

          • Actually I am glad when he doesn’t reply. When he replies its probably not a good sign or to misdirect. He is very tricky!! that’s an understatement.. The blueprint is challenging and requires almost instant adjustment.. that is all I am going to say. Having fun, exploring, and creating memories is a huge part of it. He left a huge area to explore and not all of it is done out in nature. But what do I know.. only the phantom knows

        • Laddyaddy The number you have dialed is not in service at this time, please check that you have dialed the number correctly, this is a recording…………

          The number you have dialed is not in service at this time, please check that you have dialed the number correctly, this is a recording………….

          And by the way, A Good Fisherman Needs To Have A Lotta Patience, The Fish Just Don’t Jump Into The Skillet!!!

          • Haha I guess you are right:) makes sense when you put it that way. Maybe one day I will catch that trophy 30” walleye.. er trout. I tend to go all in or all out. Not so seasoned at finding the middle.

          • Laddyaddy

            I just read back through this and realized you might not know Forrest signed off last Monday. He and Willie jumped ship, got into a dinghy and rowed to a deserted island to watch the sun set over the Chalupa Trees.

            Guess everybody is a little saddened and upset. I know I am. He did his last on camera interview January 2018 and on Monday February 4th 2019 he did his last 6 questions with Jenny.

            Check out “ mysterious writings, 6 questions with Forrest.” A lotta interesting stuff.

  59. In The Wood…..could have many interpretations. The Wood lining the box is one. Maybe in the timber. Possibly in the wood has references to being hidden under some wood. Often Archaeologists would find ancient artifacts in the American Southwest hidden in the stick nests of Packrats, hence “brave and in the wood”.

    How bout this twist…maybe it is hidden below the roots of a Pinyon Tree (laughing to beat the band). There are eight species of Pinyon Pine, bit ONLY one thai IS within the search área. The one that is in the search área is not in all of the search. área. One name for this Pinyon….is The Colorado Pinyon.
    You can find a range map here.
    When f said he wished he would not of said what he said when asked what he would experience if he was at the treasure, I feel he was telling the truth that he would smell PINYON. I personally think he had a slip of the tongue and gave away more than he wanted to and he said so.

    If he was telling the truth about smelling Pinyon, then the search área has been reduced substancelly and warrants critical investigation.

      • Saun,……and all, IMO, He wished he didn’t say something because of one of three reasons:
        1. that the treasure is wet. (and he clarified that)
        2. Pinyon Pine, because it’s not in Colorado or New Mexico.
        3. Pinyon Pine, because it is in Colorado or New Mexico.

        Forrest knows darn well what Pinyon Pine smells like, he lives amongst them, and when he said it in the video it just came out so easy without even thinking. You can bet that there is Pinyon Pine somewhere near the TC. IMO.

        • ManOWar,
          Surely you must realize that everything is wet. I am sitting on the sofa relaxing right now. Clearly its not raining in my house. Yet, you could say Im wet because the human body contains water. Plants, rocks, grass, everything visible in nature contains some percentage of water. So yes, if the TC is touching rock or soil or plants, it is touching water even if it doesnt feel wet to the touch. Just something to think about.

          • Flutterby,…..Yes, that’s what I was implying that Forrest had cleared his statement about it being wet up. So that eliminates that statement from being the one that he wished he hadn’t said leaving the other two. So which one do you believe, #2, or #3, or none?

  60. Has anyone heard from Seeker? Its not like him not to comment regularly. Im hoping he is ok.

      • Three or four weeks ago, he said he was signing off because there was nothing new on the blog or something like that.

        Maybe he is incarcerated and doesn’t have internet privileges.

        Just thinking like a law man…IMO


  61. My apologies….twice I tried to supply a link to a range map of The Colorado Pinyon Pine. Not working. There is a wealth of maps if one googles NORTH AMERICAN RANGE AND DISTRIBUTION / PINYON PINE.

    Again my apologies and may you move with confidence. Canasta Players need not apply.

  62. Dal, I wanted to ask you (and anyone else who feels like commenting) about the statement on the home page of the blog that Forrest is the “master of the double entendre”. I would not be surprised if there are some double entendres within the poem, but I was curious if you could point out some examples of Forrest using double entendres in past instances outside of the poem, such as in his books or in past interviews. I can recall Forrest being playful with his words and using colorful & sometimes exaggerating descriptions, but I can’t think of any specific double entendres that Forrest has used off the top of my head.

    • Blex

      One thing I can’t get off my mind is, Forrest is adamant about KNOWING the treasure is still where he left it, BUT, on old Santa Fe trading co site in thrill resource page it says, there is a chance someone has found it.

      Why can’t they be ABSOLUTELY CERTAIN about this?

      Forrest said in Koat interview “ I don’t wanna give that as a clue but I KNOW the treasure is still there.”

      In old Santa Fe trading co it seems they will not KNOW until someone goes public.

      Why the 2 Orders?

      It’s kinda like that scene from “ A Few Good Men” when Tom Cruise asks jack Nicholson why there was 2 different orders.


      We can be sitting here for years until someone’s great great grandkid finds the treasure chest in an attic someplace in Connecticut or somewhere.

      What say all of you?

      • Pauley;

        There is always a chance that an asteroid will hit the earth and end civilization as we know it.

        There is always a chance that some idiot will push the wrong button and blow the world to smithereens.

        There is always the chance that the treasure has been found.

        I put all three statements in the same bucket. Just because there is a chance does NOT mean that it has really happened – ANYTHING is possible.

        Forrest says it has NOT been found – I take him at his word. Why become frightened by what MIGHT be under the bed. Probability is that it is only dust bunnies – JMO – JDA

        • JDA

          Hahahah, the thing is THERE is something living under my bed! Mice! Got 3 this winter already! Woke up this morning to the sound of scratching in the ceiling! Persistent little fellas they are. Got glue traps all over the house but hate when they get stuck. I try pulling them outta the glue but…….

          Anyways, I hear ya,. I believe the treasure is still where Forrest left it for many reasons but for one particular reason above all!

          Once again, this is a treasure hunt, and there can not be a treasure hunt without an X on a map someplace.

          And if anybody finds the treasure where I believe the X is they’ll never be able to contain themselves and have to tell the world what a genius Forrest really is. True

          • Pauly

            Only word is what is stated in the contest rules: On February 11th this contest will end and all the submitted names will be reviewed by our crack panel of anonymous judges. The winner will be selected by the judges and announced on this page soon after the contest closes.” As you know, there are LOTS and LOTS of entries – Am sure it will take a day or two to sift through them – JDA

          • JDA

            I had Snarley Marley and Furoshee Furoshia.

            Some of my favorites are nibbles, snuggles, mittens, cuddles, funny stuff.

            That CAT used the forest to ambush its prey, imagine walkin to gather some nuts and berries and that THING jumped out at you with those 2 BIG TEETH!
            Instant Heart Attack!
            Sometimes when I bring the garbage out at night a neighbors cat will run through the yard and I’ll HIT the ceiling! LOL

          • Pauley-

            If you really want to get something off your glue trap….pour some vegetable oil on it and wait 10 minutes.
            I have a problem with Brown recluse spiders, and I think I hold the world’s record for the number I’ll killed on my glue traps.

            It’s like when I get my bubble gum stuck in my hair…..you rub peanut butter into the mess and you don’t have to cut out your hair! Then you can shower, wash your hair and it all goes down the drain.

            It’s not healthy living with vermin. Get a cat if you don’t like killing them…

            1F Billy

        • Good luck on getting a safe deposit box big enough to hold the chest. I’ve been needing a safe deposit box for a long time now, but had to put things in a friends safe. I would have bought a safe, but didn’t have room in the garage and most of the safes worth their salt are too heavy to get it in the basement.

          Just Say’n

    • Blex-

      1. F telling people to “think” or “get back inside the box”

      2. When F talks about intersections or boarders

      3. When F talks about his pet donkeys (boroughs)

      just a few examples…

      Your welcome;


      • Sherif Billy, that first one is more of a metaphor and the other two examples sound like assumptions you are making about words that Forrest has used.

        I was looking for something more concrete that could be attributed to Forrest as a double entendre. Like, has he ever written something that is obvious he is using double entendre? I just haven’t seen much evidence that Forrest likes using double entendres in other pieces that he has written or said in interviews.

        • I agree it would be nice to have an example of a double entendre used by FF to go by. The problem is that other than the poem he hasn’t had much need to use one. If he has used one in his writings as a hint it likely won’t jump off of the page unless you know the solution to the poem. It is better for him if he doesn’t use one because giving an example of using one would give us an idea about the poem, if in fact he is using it in the poem. Follow me? It is like not talking about Colorado if the chest is in Colorado.

        • Blex-

          IMO Mr. F doesn’t use any double entendre in the clues within the poem. Rather he uses words that were derived(etymology) from other words that we do not appreciate (the connection) in our language today.

          i.e. “tired”

          Etymology 4
          tire (plural tires)

          A tier, row, or rank.
          (as copied from Wiktionary.com)

          By the way, the translation of that line in the poem is …(paraphrasing) .. “end of the rainbow”. IMO

          The following line tells you what to look for and how he hid it…IMO

          Now where is my deputy?


    • Blex… I believe that Dal’s use of the *double entendre* while sharing his description of interacting with Forrest Fenn is/was meant in a more general context and less exact or inclusive of solving the poem. The way I have always taken it is to… listen carefully to what Fenn says and not go running off willy nilly thinking something that clearly may not mean anything. Dal can speak for himself… but I believe it was an intuitive comment based on his own experiences interviewing and speaking with Fenn. Without knowing what exactly someone is thinking at the time, or their motives… it is near impossible to make an absolute statement about exactly their meaning when they utter a sentence. This is where Fenn’s other statements about word definitions etc. etc. may come into play?

      • Ken, I think you make a subtle good point, look for the patterns, not the events. …. harks back to what a ‘run’ is.

        • Yes…there are certainly enough *events* to trip over after all this time. I have to remind myself…”…why didn’t I think of that.” may be one of the more subtle directives Fenn ever uttered.

      • Ken, OS2, Blex. The following isnt a double entendre but perhaps a fun example of either “redirection” or a subtle “diectional” hint (for lack of better term)
        Lewis & Clark–>
        Lewis Carroll.

      • Ken, I think what you described is the main idea of what Dal’s cautionary note on the blog’s homepage is what he is trying to get across. Forrest chooses his words very deliberately and that there is a good potential for possible misinterpretation or misdirection.

        I guess I was more specifically wondering about the statement that Forrest is “a master of the double entendre”. I haven’t seen much evidence of this myself, and I’m wondering if that statement may be sending more Chasers into the weeds than keeping them out.

        • Could be Blex. Fenn has succeeded in keeping his secret even with all of his interaction over the years. I suspect that is not an accident.
          Sandy… Another little snippet that I discovered while in one of the rabbit warrens a couple of years back was that Lewis Carroll’s poem *How doth…* is a parody of another earlier poem by Isaac Watt’s. One focus is deception and predation… the other is hard work and moralistic.

        • It would be safe to assume that the statement that FF is “a master of the double entendre” is an opinion, IMO. Nobody knows for sure yet if there is a double entendre in the poem with the exception of FF.

          • The title of the book, TTOTC, could be a double entendre & could be the name of the poem….. anticipating is the ‘thrill’ of the searchers chase, but when Forrest slid down that fire-slide, he was enjoying the the thrill of the ‘chase’.

          • That’s true OS2. “title to the gold” could also be a poem naming double entendre that giving the poem the name “To the Gold”.

          • OS2,
            Speaking of the fire escape, Im enormously entertained that apparently nobody else see the deeper hint. Yes, I know everyone is aware of the brown on Forrest’s britches and they all knew where he had been. That is obvious. Forrest spelled it out for us. But there is a greater lesson Forrest learned there and nobody seems to question why none of the other kids “knew that trick”. Ive raised six kids and I can tell you that if one of them gets away with something, more will follow. Except that didnt happen. Hmmm!

          • Flutter;

            I am sure that others “Knew that trick” they were just not brave enough to implement it… or their father was not the principle – Just a thought – JDA

          • Flutterby, I think there is some ’embellishment’ going on in this story. I go along with JDA’s comments, but my first thought was, it didn’t happen during class time. I suspect that IF it did happen, Forrest managed to do it when that room was empty, maybe he was out of Ms. Ford’s classroom on a bathroom break or something. Some kids are bolder when alone…. like when he jumped off that bridge during the night, or visited the graveyard at night. And of course… “As I have gone alone in there…” starts the poem’s journey. I think there is more than 15% of “not deliberately placed for the searcher'” embellishment in the book. Cheers to you fellow parent… there is a lot we don’t see. I know, I had parents too.

          • Os2 & PDenver,
            Regarding the fire escape. If you only look at the surface of the story, you will only see the obvious. Look deeper!

          • As far as the other kids “knowing that trick”, I would argue that from *some* perspectives the difference between being aware of something and actually knowing it is experience. They were aware of the trick, but they didn’t “know” the trick because they hadn’t done it for themselves.

            And there certainly does seem to be a motif in TTOTC of FF getting his butt browned in a variety of ways. Rust, cowpies, spankings. And although not actually mentioned that I can recall, I feel certain that bailing out of a plane and descending via ‘chute in hostile territory would be enough to make anyone brown their pants, or at least feel like they might.

            And, dare I say it, young FF certainly seemed to fly by the seat of his pants through life.

        • Blex, I think of it like f’s story of when he was saying that Eric Sloane only marries housekeepers. The point that he gives the punch line, (because they keep the house), shows he knows exactly what he is saying and how it can be interpreted. It’s the saying that he gives, that do have a possible double meanings, but he does not give the punch line that is important to look at. He knows there are possible double meanings, and I think that is what Dal was pointing to. If f wants us to know what he means, he will give the punch line, so to speak. If he wants us to consider other avenues, we don’t get a punch line. So, to answer your question, there are many.
          – when he says I wrote a poem containing 9 clues that if followed precisely. Is he saying to follow the clues precisely or the poem?
          – When we look at what we have to walk he says, it’s not far, but too far to walk. So is it too far to walk or is it ‘too far” that we have to walk? He comes out with an ATF, saying if you are walking long distances you are walking too far. Is that what we need to do, walk a long distance, or is he saying long distances are too far?
          – Even the took two trips from his car and it was done in one afternoon. Is he saying he was done in one trip or one afternoon?

          There are many examples as you know, it’s when f says something, that can be interpreted in different ways, and f doesn’t tell us which way is correct that makes him the “master of the ‘double entendre'”. Actually, I think he likes to hear the discussions searchers have as they argue the different possible sides of a topic.

          • Lug, Another cleverly worded paragraph by the word architect … a past, a repast, maybe even a wake? A bank, a table? I never know what 95% of the posted innuendos mean. Did I miss the DE you implied?

          • Os2 –

            I wouldn’t want to be on get on your bad side,so I will explain what I was saying.

            I was joking about the “double omegas”. These have been discussed ad infinitum. So, I was just making a joke with Old Ken Cowboy.

            I think 1F Billy responded in the affirmative because he believes the Omegas are actually horseshoes, making the image a sort of visual double entendre.

            That’s all I got

          • Oh my…ha ha . The old double omega joke. That’s what it is. I find it entertaining though…someone writes an intro for folks to get some background info and get started with their very own treasure search. Next thing you know… oh well. Funny ha ha.

          • Yikes Lug, — You ”wouldn’t want to get on my bad side” ? … I didn’t know i was so fearsome. I do apologize if I’ve frightened the children.

        • I’ve checked the end of the book and see some possibilities, but which particular double entendre are you referring to, Lugnutz & Sherif Billy? Nothing is overtly jumping out at me.

          If I had to make a guess, maybe “history” & “his story”?

      • Hi, pdenver. Are you talking about this line from the scrapbook:

        “In the mirror that’s me again, also early Spanish. The mirror I mean, not me.”

        I do remember seeing at least a couple of instances of this in TTOTC book too. That is definitely a play on words that Forrest enjoys using, but is it a double entendre? I wasn’t thinking so, but maybe I’m getting too caught up in splitting hairs. Could Forrest be using adjectives in the poem that may be ambiguous as to what particular noun they are modifying?

        • The only thing like this that jumps out at me in the poem is that the word “bold” could be referring either to “I” or “treasures”.

        • Hello Blex. The part of the quote you posted is the one for which I spoke. I do not see it as a double entendre, but a play on words, which I believe a double entendre may be considered as such.

        • I have been thinking along these lines myself. In particular, in stanza 2, who is doing the “taking”? Is it the reader who “begins it where warm waters halt” and then “takes it in the canyon down….”? Or is it the warm waters that “halt and take it in the canyon down….”?

          By the former reading, each line of the stanza refers to something distinct in a step-by-step fashion. A place to start, a direction to travel, a distance to travel, and a place to pause (below HoB). Very straight-forward.

          By the latter reading, the first three lines of the stanza all refer to the same thing: a point of beginning where warm waters do all these things in one area. Then you proceed to the next point, which is below HoB. Potentially, depending on how you parse It, the entire stanza could be taking place within the confines of “the canyon”.

          There are actually a number of spots in the poem where the most common reading is not the only legitimate way to read it. In fact, I would suggest that the most common interpretation may not always be the correct one when it comes to FF’s writing. He is not exactly a common thinker.

  63. The travel channel is re-running the episode of Expedition Unknown “ Finding Fenn’s Fortune” today at 6pm eastern time. If you haven’t seen it you need to treat yourself. I’ve seen it several times. It’s a Wonderful way to spend an hour. I haven’t pursued my solve into the wilds yet, but when I do, my first stop is gonna be the Jackson Hole Hat Company to Enrich my Noggin with some Flavor, even if it’s a LITTLE outta my way.

    • Pauley T – I enjoyed watching that episode too. In case anyone misses it, you can buy the episode for $1.99 off of Amazon video too.

      I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but when I visited Jackson Hole last summer I discovered that the Jackson Hole Hat Company store was closed down (I had been looking forward to checking it out after watching the EU episode too). They are apparently still operating out of Alpine, Wyoming and have an online store, but the Jackson Hole retail location is no more. 🙁

      • Blex

        I’m Devastated!

        Oh well, guess I’ll pick myself up, dust myself off and to ALPINE I go! I can’t wait!

        • When you‘re there you should AVOID the Bull Moose! We had a reservation, arrived and the totally drunk ladies operating the bar and reception sent us away, because they had cancelled our reservation (without letting us know). Later they tried to keep our money because they did have a room but we didn‘t „want it“…

          • What is it with people that run lodgings. We stayed in Rhode Island few years back in a motel that had bed bugs, the next morning they didn’t wanna reimburse the 190 bucks for the room cause they said we stay the night, where were we to go at 2 in the morning when we realized place was infested and they weren’t answering front desk phone or me pounding on lobby door?!

            Anyways, they refunded in full after I threatened them with legal beginnings. Idiots!

          • I can at least recommend some good food places in the central area of Jackson: Snake River Brewing, Pinky G’s Pizzeria, Liberty Burger, The Merry Piglets, and the Bunnery were all fantastically delicious and all reasonably priced.

  64. in the wood. Webster’s says “wood” refers to a group of trees, that’s larger than a grove, and smaller than a forest. Mr. Fenn told someone that the chest was in the trees. With so many trees around, maybe it’s a unique group of trees. Not unique because the chest is there, but that the trees them selves are some how unique?

    • If you can figure out what “whispers” are, you will know what the trees are. You will also know where the edges are. I know Im supposed to say IMO, but actually I know this is a fact. To be politically correct, I will say IMO.

      • Flutter –

        May I ask what you are referring to?
        I only know that Fenn quote that includes the word “Whisper”.
        Is there a later statement using “whispers”?

        Original quote:
        “It’s not what they say on the blogs that may be significant, it’s what they whisper”


          • Flut –

            I am not asking you what you think whispers means.

            I am asking you for an instance when Fenn used the word “whispers”.

            I am not aware of any. without that then you are answering a question that hasn’t been asked of you.


          • Lug,
            I am only aware of the one quote where the word whispers was used by FF. Its the one about, not what they say. . . what they whisper. However; there are IMO, over one hundred places where a synonym for whispers is used. If you look deeper, you will see. If this answers a question that was not asked, its my gift to you. Enjoy!

          • Flutter and Lug…hope this falls in the right place. If you go to Tarryscant and search “whisper” ….

          • Good call, Sandy! Quite a few quotes with “whisper” in them actually.

            Flutterby, I assume that you are referring to aspens with respect to “in the wood” above? Though according to tarryscant.com, “whisper” appears without the S at the end:
            “No longer will I be lulled by the throaty whisper of the quaking aspen that one time populated our landscape….”

            Aspens certainly stand out in the Rockies where they show up.

        • I’m just going to leave this right here… Norman Rockwell/ Skippy peanut butter /whisperers.
          Looks kind of familiar, right? Coincidence or rabbit hole?

          • Maybe a whisper is just a discrete message from a searcher to Fenn directly, without posting it on the internet where everyone can hear in their own mind what was said to everyone instead of the intended recipient.

            As far as I’m concerned it is a secret and if you can read it on the internet or other media then it is NOT a whisper.

    • James P,

      Can you point us to where F said the chest was in the trees? Careful of saying something about what F said, otherwise if there is no quote it would be considered miss information. As you will, *fake news* now days.

    • James P. said “…chest was in the trees.”

      This makes me chuckle. Not because of the context here but because it sounds like the line in the movie Madagascar where King Julian says, “The people, are in the trees!” That guy’s voice and that movie were hilarious.

    • It has always, even before I discovered the Chase, been my take that a “wood” is smaller than a “woods”, and that a “wood” is generally composed of only one or two species, while a “woods” may contain many.

      Hmmm … this reminds me of the “water” vs “waters” debates.

      It’s all about that diabolical “s”.

  65. The world smile, grin, etc has been mentioned a few times by Forrest
    Smile possibilities:
    Lips =Taos mountain top shape?
    Verde river smiling girl=Made her the “seasoned navigator”
    Horse teeth

    • Another smile thought:
      “I’ve got something in my pocket, it belongs across my face.
      I keep it very close at hand, in a most convienient place.
      I’m sure you couldn’t guess it if you guessed a long, long while.
      So I’ll take it out and put it on, it’s a Great Big Brownie Smile!”

      Girl Scout/Brownie easy trail Hyde State Park NM?

  66. Hey DAL

    Now that the kitty contest is over can you tell us what names you thought of for that Magnificent Creature?

    • Thanks you sir.

      There were so many clever, and entertaining entries…I’m honored to have won.

      me·owth·ful /mēˈouTHˌfo͝ol/

      Definition: A quantity of disagreeables or malcontents that fills or can be put in the mouth.


      Thank you Dal and Forrest!

      • At first utterance, it doesn’t exactly roll trippingly on the tongue, but I got to thinking neither did the cat’s prey, so it actually fits, dare I say it, purrfectly. Congrats to a swell fella, Mr. K !

      • Congratulations Allen K.!
        I’m surprised nobody suggested “Frosty”.
        My third entry would have been “Ginger-vitis”

      • I know the perfect resting spot for Meowthful:

        The Cat Chair in the Rye.

        Hyuk, hyuk, hyuk!

        Seriously though, congrats Allen K!

  67. I have noticed a trend of folks stepping away from the chase recently. Some are tired of the drama on the blogs, some are tired of coming home empty handed with empty pockets and some are just plain ol’ tired. I can understand their frustration and absolutely respect everyones choices. I feel like the clock is ticking now and I’m over here praying for a mild winter and willing the snow to melt faster.

    • @ronnie …and some are still just lurking! lol! There has been some burn out for sure but spring is on the way!

      • TA…I pray ULLR, son of Thor. In SW Colorado and elsewhere in the mountain west we have been in a prolonged drought – and I hope I never live thru another fire season like we had last year. It was devastating. Snow is essential to the environment and ecosystems depend on snow pack. Not to mention that I’m as passionate about skiing as I am about treasure hunting. Be grateful for the opportunity to research, think and plan. You can’t hunt for treasure if the forest is on fire. Bring the snow! It’s beautiful and essential to life in the mountain states and general health of the planet. All things, including treasure hunting, in it’s time. Bring it ULLR!!! Jackson Hole is calling.

        • I’m with you, Sandy. Colorado is a rather arid state to begin with, but our droughts get truly terrible. I will never complain about the gift that is a Colorado snowstorm, especially in the mountains.

          But I do reserve the right to whinge about our occasional high winds. They put me in a foul mood, and the noises my house makes in them make me worry I might wake up with a rafter through my chest.

      • Hello Tall Andrew. I do not pray to Thor. I do believe Thor is something to be considered in the Chase.

    • I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but it looks like the entire length of the Rockies from Montana to New Mexico are getting slammed with a fresh coat of snow this weekend.

      Think like a profitable hospital and have plenty of patience.

      • Hello Blex. The snow is good news. I hope when the thaw begins, it’s a slow one. The waterways may prove challenging come Spring if it doesn’t.

        • I agree, pdenver! We’ve got a much better snowpack this season than last, and hopefully keeping a healthy distance away from droughts this summer. (On the other hand, I’m still itching to get back out there for another treasure-hunting expedition ASAP!)

        • Veronica S – The benchmark that I’m using is to not plan on a BOTG trip until after Father’s Day at least (June 16th this year). 2 years ago when I attempted a BOTG trip on Father’s Day the forests were still choked with snowdrifts and all of the creeks were furiously gushing from snowmelt in a manner that made attempting a crossing dangerous. A week or two later, conditions were perfect.

          This year may be different, but that’s what I’m still tentatively planning on at this point.

          • I joke about the snow melting just because I’m so anxious to get back at it. I’m with you on The end of June. When I was up there last year @that time , run off made a lot of searching difficult. I wouldn’t waste a trip going before then because it’s too dangerous. I’ll wait until the end of June so I can get around better.

    • How about this? I think Mr. Fenn is stepping away from The Chase because someone has sent him a good solve.

      • ChickenOne;

        You just might have something there, but we will all have to wait for the snows to melt I guess – – – Is it spring yet??? JDA

      • I can think of many possibles reasons for FF to be stepping back, some Chase related and some not.

        Until he announces that the Chest has been claimed, or someone provides clear proof that they have it, I’m going to keep on Chasing. If nothing else, I crave closure. 🙂

    • I find I go through cycles where real life pulls me away from the forums and the Chase, and I generally lurk more than I post. But I am constantly mulling over the poem when my attention isn’t needed elsewhere. Frankly, my grandfather seemed very much like FF, and I think they would have understood each other quite well had they ever met, so the Chase helps me feel closer to him. My grandfather, that is.

      I do think the Chase can become a drain on some people though. It’s easy to reach the point where you think you’ve looked everywhere. Of course, the Rocky Mountains cover a *lot* of ground, so there is always one more place to check if you can just think of it.

      In the end, the Chase needs to be fun. If it stops being fun, you need to set the Chase up on the shelf, go recharge your batteries, and maybe come back to it later with a fresh perspective. I totally understand about people who feel the need to absent themselves on occasion.

      • I agree with you on that. When it stops being fun then it’s time to take a break.
        It hasn’t for me because I don’t get to get my boots on the ground too often because of distance and that pesky job/life thing. Each time has to count and I have a process of elimination going; like a wheel where i am eliminating spokes as I go. I have a really good feeling about this year and I can’t wait!

    • The size of the hole just couldn’t have been done in one afternoon! An 80 year old didn’t do that on state land!

      • Hay Charlie
        Out of the night that covers me
        Black is the pit from pole to pole
        I thank what every Gods maybe for my unconquerable soul.
        I think Forrests hole is a lot bigger than the one you are
        talking about.

    • Old news.

      These days it seems that the best way to celebrity status is to make loud noises about NOT finding the chest.

      Ken (in Texas)

      • Ken (in Texas)

        I think it is only you, that created the celebrity list. The ones that you think are celebrities are sharing their thoughts pertaining the topic, nothing wrong with that!

        Just Say’n

        • CharlieM … I never created any “celebrity list”; you must be thinking of someone else.

          And I disagree with you about their motivations. Yes, they “share” their OPINIONS … which all searchers have. The subtext is that celebrity searchers are more important than non-celebrity searchers as a result of their contact with Forrest Fenn or their blog or their YouTube channel.

          But they have no claim to intellectual superiority, owing to the fact that, like non-celebrities, they haven’t found the chest. In a few cases, I find their “opinions” laughable, as with this guy in the article who continues to get unwarranted media attention for his abject failures.

          Yet, there are non-celebrities who put these celebrities on a pedestal, as if they had special powers or knowledge. They absolutely do not. Moral of story … don’t let these self-appointed experts do your thinking for you.

  68. Hi JDA
    Are you going back to your old spot or did you find some place new to search come break up? Clint

  69. We are all better people for knowing Mr. Fenn. In a sense, he is now a part of each one of us.

    T.S. “We” shall not cease from our exploration
    And at the end of all our exploring
    Will be to arrive where “We” started
    And know the place for the first time.
    Pronouns matter
    Happy Valentine’s Day***

  70. I seem to remember Mr. Fenn saying , that there was one good hint in TTOTC, and a couple lesser hints. So maybe 3 or 4 ?

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