Odds n Ends About Fenn’s Treasure Hunt…Part Seventy Eight

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693 thoughts on “Odds n Ends About Fenn’s Treasure Hunt…Part Seventy Eight

  1. Use the appropriate discussion page…there are dozens of them for discussions about Where Warm Waters Halt and the Poem and the Nine Clues and looking in Colorado…for instance…This page is for discussions of topics that do not have any other discussion page…

  2. After seeing a post that JDA has stepped away for a few months I can see why this chase makes some do this. It does take a big part of your time if your really trying to find the chest. I myself have stepped away a few times but curiosity drives you back, wondering if it’s been found, or what newbies are thinking as far as new ideas. Most all discussions have been talked about over the years a few times, but every once in awhile there is something that pops up that generates new thoughts. I’ve seen searchers come and go for many reasons, whether it’s because lack of money to travel, health issues, thought they had the perfect solve and can see no other, or maybe promises made to life partners – because they believe it’s not worth it anymore. Are these past searchers still active? Maybe not all but every once in awhile you see a name pop on the blog that you think wow I haven’t seen that name in a while. Look at the names the kitty contest, a lot of old names there. I know some went to other blogs, why? It just might be they over posted this one, or found it was the same repetitive comments always, or just couldn’t get their ideas across to other searchers. For what ever reasons the old searchers are gone. I hope and wish them luck in finding what ever treasure they’re looking for and if they still monitor this blog ( as a lurker) just know you are not forgotten and some of your old posts will always stand out in those who search for answers in “The Thrill Of The Chase”.

    Good luck to all the old searchers and all the ones who have come after them.

    • Well stated Bur.
      Even if you don’t get involved in conversations, you have to keep checking to see what is happening.
      I’ll engage occasionally, but had to back off several times over the years.
      Never giving up! (although all the new ads help me sign off quicker, but I understand business)
      Good luck and all the best,

      • Luckydog,

        Yes, I see you pop in every once in awhile. Do you still go out or have you taken a break? I have been on a break for a couple years I think ( searching that is), but will head back out come May.

        Well good luck if your searching and even if your not.

        • Good luck Bur,
          It has been several years since my last trip. I feel comfortable with my decision not to head back out West for a while.
          Fall of 2021 or Spring 2022 will probably be the next trip.
          I feel pretty confident that it will still be there. But I still wish you luck! Hope you can prove me wrong!

    • Yep, check in now and again to see/hear how everyone is doing and to see if anything new has popped up, who is debating whose ideas, etc. My own solve process has evolved a lot since my “A-Ha” moment back when I began “The Poem as Nine Sentences” blog, but that “A-Ha” is still very much a part of it. Still no chest, or even BOTG, or plans for BOTG as the poem is still whispering its secrets to me.

      Nothing but best wishes for all searchers as the next season is drawing nigh. 🙂

    • Hi Bur
      Are you walking a way to ? I look forward to the add venture of
      it all the chase.I am a truck driver in and out of it about 12 to 14 hrs a day hauling 70 ton loads of wood chips from the woods to the paper mill or board mills. Whole new meaning to in the WOOD
      don’t ch think.But i love the out doors and worked in the woods
      most of my life.

      • Not walking away yet Clint. Yes, we all need a adventure in our lives and why not this one.

        Good luck,

    • Bur said: “… the old searchers are gone …”
      Well, they may or may not be gone from the treasure hunt; but yes, they do seem to be gone from the blogs.

      After all these years, blog topics have been talked to death. I’m so tired of hearing about the 200 foot searcher, I skim right past any mention of it.

      I have been in this chase for almost four years. I do NOT see that searchers have made any progress at all toward solving the poem or finding the chest. And claims to the contrary are a dime-a-dozen.

      Given the extreme repetitiveness of the topics talked about on FF blogs, I can see why people leave. Maybe the blogs are meant only for newbies who need to catch up on all the failed theories, as part of their indoctrination period. Truly unique ideas and theories, those that could actually lead to the chest, probably will be kept out of the blogs; I know mine will.

      Ken (in Texas)

    • I truly hope JDA is ok and will return. His out-of-the-box thinking has stirred me quite a few times, especially when his general descriptions sounded like my search area. Maybe just the winter break.

      Smoky 🙂

    • I’ve found that with the rate at which OnE posts gain comments, I’m better off letting them build up and then going through a full thread or half a thread all at once (as opposed to piecemeal via multiple emails per day). When you’re not a frequent commenter (and I’m not), it’s just easier.

      And if something does catch your eye, it’s not all that hard to do a callback to it for further discussion.

      Just my two cents.


    • ill agree with you its in or out its here or there its warm or cold and lets not forget its up or down we all know its confusing at best. have a good day all

  3. Since we all look forward to the chase I wonder what happens when the tc is finally found? Going to be a bummer for many people. My feelings are mixed about the chase ending but I want Forrest to be able to explain why he put the treasure where he did and to be able to go back to that place if he wants to.

    • I agree about the bummer, morecowbell. I hope people do not hate on the finder.

      I think it will be obvious why he put it where he did, once it is found.

    • Hi more cowbell
      Forrest will not have to explain why he put it where he did because when you have all the clues solved you will know
      that is the only place he could have put it .Does that make
      any sense.Clint

      • Clint – You may be right but I think there is a distinct reason and story for why he chose this spot and it probably has everything to do with those who he idolized (his father and Skippy).

    • I have often thought about this and worry a little. There are so many people out looking and have been for years. Obsessing for so long. If you go and find it, will these other people fade away or will they come after you? Will someone sue you for a share because they feel they have so much invested that they deserve a piece? Let’s say too that you find it and you want to share your story with a Discovery or Travel Channel special. Get a small payday that would help offload the huge tax burden you are going to have to deal with. You call up Josh Gates and he comes out with a truckload of hats and you film a happy Expedition Unknown “Finding The Fenn” special something. Does this paint a huge target on you?
      I am not a full time hunter but I have what I think is a well thought out solve I hope to test this year on vacation. If I find it, will I be hated as an outsider? Myself, I wouldn’t really be put out by someone else finding it. I barely have anything more than a passing interest. I do like to read the tales on here, and I like the puzzle solve aspect, the gold is a bonus. I came up with a solve way back in 2013 when the story first went viral and reached me. I figured I lived so far away, I would just compare my answer with the final find to see how I did. Kind of surprised I will get a chance to go and have a try myself.
      A lot of people would say that all the attention(positive and negative) and tax is a good problem to have but I wouldn’t agree. Wish people would be happy for a winner.

      • Wishin-I-was-fishin, for this exact reason I would prefer to stay anonymous. I have absolutely no interest in being known or famous which helps in this kind of scenario if it would occur.

        I do believe also that there are individuals who view this as their ‘holy mission’ and think that the treasure ‘belongs’ to them, because they have been obsessing about it for so long and used huge amounts of time BOTG and online, reading everything possible ever said about the subject.

        These people are such who would very likely try to find ways to obtain the treasure if they knew who has it and where.

        In my case, the best way to protect myself and my family members is to just remain anonymous.

        I would ofcourse make a YouTube video about the treasure, show each item, show the actual location where it was found, a step-by-step guide about how the poem was solved – however all without name and face, and made in a burner account and a burner email contact for further inquiries.

        Only after a safe amount of time, let’s say after ten years when the issue is no longer relevant and the money is well spent, I would consider publicising my name.
        This gives the most volatile individuals time to forget and get interested in something else.

        If however it still looks like there is risk in that, then I would forever remain anonymous. In my view, anonymity is a blessing and a kind of freedom, as once you lose it, you’ll never get back.

        • Good advice to follow Q but difficult to execute without keeping the secret from everybody you know imo. Something to think about for sure.

        • But could a person remain anonymous? You could find it and hide it in a safe place and say nothing but the IRS and the law will want to know your name. We didn’t even mention those guys again. I like the cool down period but it seems a tough prospect. Plus you got to liquidate it back to cash to pay the tax maybe you could do that on the quiet but I think it would come out.

          • Ofcourse the relevant authorities know who I am and the tax man can tax. I was not implying that one should make a tax fraud.

            However they are not going to go to the media and advertise who found it paid taxes for it, so they can know without likely risks.

            Morecowbell, you are correct that people you know are more difficult to control and trust. Your best friend can one day leak the information to the media and then your family can be at risk.

            I would go as far as not tell anyone who knows me. If someone asks where I got money, I could akways say I won some at the lottery/casino and that’s it.

            In my country there is a saying:”if you have happiness – keep it to yourself.”
            This works well in these kinds of events. When you don’t make a number out of yourself, you’ll stay out of all kind of problems.

            It needs nerves of steel to shut up and not start to boast about it, but at that point I would remind myself of my family’s safety.

            Making sure the information is not leaked by your own family is a tough one. I am still considering what would be the best way to prevent family members who know to not blurt the information to possibly wrong people. Maybe there’s a way for that too.

          • Q – would you give up the winning solve to avoid the headache?

            I’ve joked around about finding the treasure with so many people (family and friends) that it would be nearly impossible to keep it contained. But I can’t walk away and not try so what to do?

          • ** ** ** **
            Q said – “In my country there is a saying: ”if you have happiness – keep it to yourself.””
            ** ** ** **

            There’s a similar saying hereabouts –

            “Just take the chest and go in peace.”

          • Other options for “go in peace” could include Fremont’s etymology, and a county in WY that used to be named “Pease”.

          • Given TTOTC’s words of “John Charles whatever” and him carrying around an olive jar, my bet is Fremont.

          • Then again, he clearly calls out Johnson “maneuvering for peace”, which is what Pease County ended up as, so… I guess go with your gut.

        • Mr. Q–
          I don’t think anyone is “safe”. When I worked in Kansas City, it was not unusual to have people murdered for $25 or less. One poor soul, got off I-70 and stopped to ask directions because he was lost (this was before cell phones) The fellows he asked for directions decided it was in their best interest to shoot him and take his car. This took place in the middle of the day. When the law asked where this had occurred, he couldn’t give a precise location because he was lost at the time and then had to walk several blocks with several turns until he was able to find help…he recovered.

          Once a husband and wife were driving along when the husband decided he would have a heart attack. The wife called 911 as her husband lost consciousness. The EMTs couldn’t resuscitate him on site so they decided to keep coding him while they transported him to the nearest E.D. a few blocks away. The first responders asked the wife to meet them at the Emergency room.

          But when they left she was worried that when they got him in the E.D. they would find his gun he liked to keep tucked in his belt. You see this would be a problem, for you see he was a convicted felon. Now to get around the law, she had become a licensed gun dealer so they could have the armory in his house he liked to store.

          She searched the glove box and under the seats to no avail. Wondering where he might have stode it, she popped the trunk….
          Surprize! Dead woman in the trunk! Now that’s a dilemma, what to do? I guess she decided she would have to think it over and so she decided to drive home.

          Once home, the E.D. called and informed her that they couldn’t resuscitate him and he was DOA. Only then did it occur to her what the right thing to do was… and she then called 911 to report a dead woman in her trunk. Thankfully he didn’t have a flat tire…that would have been embarrassing and awkward!

          My point is that there are evil and desperate people all around us all the time. You are more likely to cross paths with them in the hood than in a neighborhood with million dollar houses. (ten million for Calif.)

          Oh, the woman in the trunk…hadn’t even yet been reported missing..


      • Difficult subject w-i-w-f,
        At first I thought I would want to do the talk-show circuit and book tour but now I’m not so sure.
        There are so many ‘fanatic’ searchers out there. Many of whom I would not want visiting my house some dark evening.
        What bothers me most is that if you don’t go public some imposter is sure to step forward and try to convince the world that they are the finder.
        (Ever see the Dustin Hoffman movie “Hero”?)
        The thing is I think that any attempt for the finder to remain anonymous will be difficult and only temporary.

    • I think his legacy is well established at this point, so I’d certainly like to hear more about the whole process, etc. from FF himself if Indulgence is found in his lifetime. I think the finder could still remain anonymous if such were the case.

      • Bowmarc said, “…I’d certainly like to hear more about the whole process, etc. from FF himself if Indulgence is found in his lifetime…”

        Get ready! The whole world is in for a shocker this summer. I think there is a lot more to Forrest Fenn than we know. IMO.

  4. I’m sure the place where he wanted to rest for eternity is beautiful but the backstory is what will really tie together the why’s of this place, and it has everything to do with his family imo.

  5. Ads?
    When did this start?
    So, clicks generate revenue?
    Is this to maintain the blog?

  6. Do not worry about claims by the owner(s) of property where the TC is found, or IRS issues. Finding a wallet containing 1 or a million dollars, then returning it to the known owner, eliminates any claims. The owner giving it to you (title) is a gift. Look up IRS rules on that. As for anonimity, use your own discretion. Five minutes of fame can come with a price.

  7. Saun.
    You are almost 100% correct on your evaluation. On the issue of ownership, it has been my believe all along that the TC and its contents do and shall belong to it’s owner Mr. Fenn. If and when it is recovered does not insure ownership to that person unless Mr. Fenn agrees differently. There will be a price for that finder to pay after that day comes. That should almost be self explanatory.
    I would think that most avid searchers have experience a little of that over time and some the Ultimate price at there own
    Free will.
    I have a feeling that the finder will not be able to keep there secret in secret for very long and that it will reveal itself when the right time comes.

  8. Interesting discussion, but I assure you if I find a treasure, I will tell all, and I will show video.

  9. Scrapbook 198 was an invitation for someone. to bring the documents and bracelet (if you find anything else) and come see Forrest. Forrest has thought of almost everything and has a plan.
    I have no problem believing there is a Chris L…but Forrest could have received those letters years ago for all we know.

  10. I forgot. I might change my mind like I have a 100 plus times this year.
    If you haven’t done that your a slow searcher.

  11. I agree that Mr. Fenns intentions Were and most likely are that who finds its is entitled to it. I am only speaking from my perception of how I feel about it if it were in my trust. But I do not know for sure of anything becouse I do not have the TC that was hidden my Mr. Fenn.
    Maybe we will all get to find out this summer and pull our hair out in Astonishment.
    I know I will be one.

  12. Discussions of what to do if you find the chest have become trite; these kinds of discussions have been going on for as long as I have been around, which is almost four years.

    I think posters are getting a little ahead of themselves. Someone first has to find the chest. And I, for one, see no progress (none whatsoever) in solving the poem or finding the chest. Claims to the contrary have become super annoying.

    The idea that the chest will be found in calendar year 2019 is popular now. But there is no objective evidence that 2019 will be any different from previous years.

    Staying grounded in the reality of trying to solve the poem’s puzzle doesn’t seem to interest posters these days. Which might explain the conundrum posed by poster Bur at the top of this Odds-n-Ends page.

    Ken (in Texas)

    • Ken,
      There have been claims? I have not seen these…….
      Can you point out some? thanks.

      • joe …there are indeed claims made, especially on YouTube, that some person (P1) has discovered the spot where FF hid the chest but the chest wasn’t there; the person (P1) then rationalizes his superior skill in “finding” FF’s secret spot by saying either that Forrest removed the chest or someone else found the spot and deprived P1 of the chest. Of course none of those claims are believable.

        But what I really had in mind is the more common practice of posters on message boards “claiming” they know where the chest is hidden, or alternately, they’ve solved 8 of the 9 clues, or alternately, they’re waiting for the snow to melt to retrieve the chest, thereby quickly putting an end to this hunt. After all these years, none of those arrogant pronouncements are believable.

        Talk is cheap. And the real motive in posting such garbage is a solicitation for cheers and admiration from readers. I wish message board monitors would disallow such “claims” on threat of being banned.

        Unless the searcher has a photo of the chest in its hiding spot or a photo of the chest on newspaper showing current date, such meaningless claims of “knowing where the chest is hidden” not only are vacuous but also reek of grandiosity and ego-centric wishful thinking.

        Further … while there may be some isolated searcher who has indeed solved most of the clues, the general trend of message board conversation through the years, along with YouTube presentations, convince me that most searchers are still stuck at the most basic level of the puzzle. The searcher community has not discovered the location of WWWH; nor have they figured out how to interpret correctly the overall message of the poem; I’m not sure they ever will.

        Ken (in Texas)

        • Ken, (in texas) thanks for responding. I do not look at things on youtube (except watch ABBA music videos) so don’t know what goes on there.

          As for what you explain in the 2nd ¶ I, personally, do not let that bother me. It is a basic human need (somehwere in Maslow’s hierarchy) for ‘acceptance.’ Such activity on boards/blogs is just an avenue for that. I think if one were to meet those ‘claimers’ in person they would be just regular guys like most of us; they just need to release their enthusiasm to the crowd. I doubt they are bad people.

          But I do concede that it could get old after a while. I had built a barn between my house and my neighbor’s house (on my land.) I chose the location so it would block my view of his house. The neighbor did not like where I put the barn as it ended up closer to him than he wanted. I thought he should mind his own business since it was my land and I followed all the zoning rules. But then he did say something profound to me, “If you don’t like your neighbor, you don’t have to look at him.”

          regards brother

    • Mr. Ken–

      Is it possible that someone could have produced or shown evidence that indeed they were advancing on the correct solution…but you either refused to believe it or dismissed it? If that were the case, I could see how you wouldn’t think any progress had been made.

      Just wondering….

      Where’s my Deputy?


    • I’ve never liked the idea that Forrest is secretly communicating to a particular person through his scrapbooks and whatnot. I can’t prove that he’s not doing something like that either though, so folks can believe what they wish.

      As to whether or not Forrest is sprinkling additional subtle hints for the general population, that seems like a bit more of a reasonable possibility, however there’s no way to know this for certain until after the treasure is found, so again folks can believe what they wish.

      • Blex, To your notion, I can share this. I e-mailed FF my theory and had a few exchanges with him before he went radio silent. Somewhere along the way I had boldly asked him to send a message via the scrapbooks and to date there has been none. I still believe in my theory and time will tell, but if he’s sending coded messages, they’re not to me!
        Just the facts as I know them. SJM

        • Don’t feel too bad, SJM! I’m not getting any coded messages from Forrest either. If I did, I would be very concerned since I have never emailed the man, and it would imply that he is able to read my mind! 😉

      • Blex,
        I am pretty (this is like saying 90-99%, or at least above 75%) sure Forrest is not communicating to any one person in the SBs. I think he is an honest, fair, generous guy. But I also think we will find him to be much more of a comedian than we realize. But who knows…. those are just my beliefs.

        • I think those who have met Mr. Fenn may agree he has a certain twinkle in his eyes. On the Media Page, there are links that seem to support this, as well as, some of his posts on Dal’s blog.

        • I agree, Joe. Why create something like the Chase if you are just going to tip the scales in someone’s favor? Why not just hand the chest over to someone who he particularly likes?

          I believe that above all, Forrest wants the finder of the chest to have earned it. He has done his part in presenting the opportunity, and it is up to one of us to meet him halfway through our own efforts.

          And I also agree with Pdenver that he seems to have a good sense of humor…. However, there better not just be a rubber chicken inside the chest!

          • I agree. I believe him to go out of his way not to favor any one searcher over another. I believe any hints ATF are given broadly and posted publicly so all can see. IMO the only way to get him to admit something would be to trick the ole fox in person when he wasn’t prepared. IMO


          • Maybe that’s the one thing in the chest he doesn’t want to talk about! (Giggle.)

          • Blex,
            “….just be a rubber chicken inside the chest!”
            LOL!! That would be even more funny than I suspect!

  13. Well just in case someone does find it this spring and they want to just sell the gold. Gold prices have changed since Forrest hid the treasure. So let’s say he did hide the chest around August 20, 2010 (think that was a estimate posted here), then the gold alone has increased in value about $ 18,155.00 at market price right now FYI. But to me it has more historical value then the price of just it’s weight. I think the whole chest together is worth more if kept together then sold in pieces, but it’s future will all depend on the finder.
    Don’t hold me to prices stated. All just a estimate and food for thought, good luck.

    • If someone finds a treasure, it is most advantageous to sell at auction. But if it is me, I would like to save part of the found.

    • BUR,
      Intrinsically, yes.
      I suppose the whole, minus the
      bracelet is “worth” more than the sum of it ‘s parts.
      However, intrinsic does not
      buy chow.
      An aution is going to take 25-30% of the sale price, then you still have state & Fed. taxes. +
      a million relates you never knew you had before? That’s all providing some bureaucracy just doesn’t take the TC.
      UH, I guess I would have to go a different route.

      a knuckle dragger by some
      accounts. lol

  14. I am far more interested in the back-story, history, of everything. Appraisers call it ‘provenance’. I want to know where those boots walked, and how something came to be. The real value of the bracelet is in the story. Monetary value of a thing changes with demand and desire, but a price cannot be put on the history and its lessons.

    • Wow! That one looks really difficult.
      I’m Polish and it looks like a combination of Polish, Russian, German and some Arabic writing to me.
      Doubt I’ll ever figure that one out.

      I’m curious, are any of those medallions hidden in or around Connecticut? As for it is difficult for me to travel far with my injuries and illnesses.

          • Pineapple in Arabic means exploding dynamite, probably from the older shapes of a hand grenade. Umm in Arabic is mother. What is he saying about the pineapple upside down cake?

            Forrest mentions Kismet and borrows from Omar Khayyam. Ali ibn Abi Talib (Taliban) is who Forrest loosely quotes his father teaching him about the greater part of knowledge. What other Arabic references do you see?

    • It is interesting how quickly these medallion rocks are getting found. Are the riddles being written with the motivation to not be too hard to solve?

      • Blex-
        Jenny is the mind behind the hiding places and the clues so I can only provide an opinion…my opinion is that Jenny wants the clues to not be so difficult they will go unfound before the next medallion is hidden. A challenge…but not an overtaxing challenge…
        After all…the prize is not a million $…
        Jenny is also a big believer in the fun of puzzles and hunts…and I believe she is of the opinion that a puzzle/treasure hunt is more democratic when not made so difficult that only those with “special” powers have any chance of solving it.

        • That makes sense, dal. I’m glad that the folks out east are having fun with solving Jenny’s puzzles. It’s seems much more of a “chase” to the medallion stones than it is on Forrest’s main Chase.

          Now what’s this about special powers being required to find the Treasure? If that’s the case, I’ve been playing at quite a disadvantage all this time! 😉

          • Hello Blex. Did you know the special powers are the same as the super heroes from Mr. Fenn’s youth? I prefer to try and read his mind, but we’ve read others have tried this. 🙂

          • Yes Pdenver, some mind-reading powers would be quite a bit helpful if I can ever get them to work! 😉

  15. Today may be my lucky day. lol. I went to my Yahoo e-mail and it asked to have me create a new e-mail address. Before you can do that they send a code to your phone. Mine was:


    Queue the Twilight zone music. 🙂

  16. Spring Song by R.L.S.

    THE air was full of sun and birds,
    The fresh air sparkled clearly.
    Remembrance wakened in my heart
    And I knew I loved her dearly.

    The fallows and the leafless trees
    And all my spirit tingled.
    My earliest thought of love, and Spring’s
    First puff of perfume mingled.

    In my still heart the thoughts awoke,
    Came lone by lone together-
    Say, birds and Sun and Spring, is Love
    A mere affair of weather?

    • This is nice, Soulstice. Thank you for posting this. I’m so happy Spring has finally arrived. Spring’s palette will soon wash away the colors of gray.

  17. Does anyone here know if Forrest has ever mentioned being in Canada? Does he mention Canada in any of his books?

    The only time that I know of him ever mentioning Canada ,was about his map ending at the USA/Canada in TFTW.

    Muchly appreciated .

    • Hi Tesla – If I remember correctly Forrest went on a fishing trip to Alaska but I’ve never read any mention of Canada except that the map steps there.

    • Hello Alsetenash. I just did a quick scan in TTOTC and TFTW, and to the best of my knowledge, I didn’t see Canada mentioned in either book. I don’t know if Mr. Fenn traveled to Canada while in his art business or for any other reason.

    • Hi, Alsetenash. Searching “Canada” on tarryscant.com yields a few mentions of Canada, but nothing indicating that Forrest ever spent time there himself.

      It’s interesting on some of the older interview transcripts that pop up. It looks like towards the very beginning of the Chase, it seems like Forrest was trying to be a bit coy when asked whether or not the treasure could be in Canada. Later on, he changed his tune and freely stated that the treasure is not in Canada (in addition to Idaho & Utah). It seems like the impetus for this may have been the release of “Too Far to Walk”, which included the map that did not extend into Canada.

    • Alse-
      IMO You are barking up the wrong Canada. Personally I would look for Santa Cruz de la Cañada…

      Dang it…There’s that theme again I continue to trip over.

      Note to the Warden…If no one can mention the topic of that theme…the viewers here at HOD will never know the solution. It would be against the rules to publish the solution…..IMO

      .Maybe the Governor will intercede..

      Señor 1F

    • You’re welcome, Alsetenash. Are you reconsidering the book in regards to the clues in the poem?

  18. @Pdenver. No, I have not really changed my feeling/thinking as for wanting to read the books. I mean as for thinking that reading them would assist me further in any way. No doubt they are probably good reads ,as everyone who’s read them says they are great. I will read them one day, but only after it’s been found. It’s just my way of approach to this. Evidently , the requirement is arbitrary. 🙂

    • Hello Alsetenash.

      “I will read them one day, but only after it’s been found.”

      Those are encouraging words. 🙂

    • I was discouraged when I first read TTOTC back when it came out. I felt the writing was hard to read and I was reading some things in circles, repetitive. Then I came back to it when I was in a different time in my life and sure as s#! I started thinking I was figuring things out and I am grateful to Fenn for being able to learn about things I didn’t know about before. I now believe I am in a place where the book took me but what I figured from the poem could be figured out without the book, just not as easily. <—- This surprised me. I actually think I figured out some things in the poem without the book BUT the book confirmed my focus. So if you don't want to read the book, then don't. Everyone has their way and someday one way will be right.

      • Jana,

        I’m glad you have found hints in TTOTC book, like myself. A couple of those hints didn’t come into focus until what I believe is the solve to most of the poem clues, after a botg trip. There is one hint that is in the very area of heavy loads & water high that I didn’t see it until I solved those two clues. There is another hint near hoB if you look around below this place. But the biggest to me relates to the most important clue and there is a second hint to help with that hint but not helping in the clue solve (if you can understand that). I have other ideas of things in the book and Forrest’s ATF comments but they are out there a little but fun learning about and relating them to the big picture.

        Good luck,

    • Thank you for the link, Dal. It’s a nice piece of art crafted by the gentleman. I’m happy for the future winning bidder.

    • That bronze jar is really cool.
      Think it’s a frog, maybe salamander.
      Current bid is $2650.00, WOW!
      I’d LOVE to bid on it but I’d have to find the treasure first before I can afford to bid on it.

        • SOLD! $5600.00!
          Congratulations to the winning bidder!

          Now……. are there any clues etched anywhere on it? Please tell us.

    • I’ll bet this item brings $5000 or more. I need to watch ebay more often!
      Thanks for the heads up Dal..

    • Can’t help but see forrest smiling and shaking his head, every time he checks ebay

    • Forrest, why are you selling your frog jar? What are you going to keep your toothbrushes in? 🙂

      • Actually, it looks like it is a different jar than the one pictured holding his toothbrushes! I am sure someone already noticed that…

    • Do u think it is F selling this? The description sounds like someone else has it……

    • Wagons like this were used on the Santa Fe Trail. FF’S grandma watched the Comanche Indians running around the barnyard – has anyone looked around the Comanche National Grassland area? The jar has frogs on it there are leopard frogs found in Comanche…and Colorado is the least talked about state. Sometimes it’s what isn’t said…

    • Bid is holding at 3300.00, but there will probably be an explosion of bids towards the end. Only a few hours left.

      Something just occurred to me, what if several years ago Forrest etched the location of the treasure on the inside of frog jar and forgot about it. And now, without realizing, because he forgot, he’s selling the jar and giving away the location to the highest bidder on eBay. Could this be possible?
      Forrest already admitted TFTW went to print with a clue somewhere inside the book without realizing it.

      This message is to the eBay winner: If there is a clue inside the frog jar can you please share it with all of us. Thank You.

  19. I’ve stepped back a couple of times and I can say it is very hard to come back to where I was. I had to re-acclimate myself and get my barrings back. So for those that step away, we may not see them again. Nice when a regular peeks in from time to time though… speaking of, anyone know if Stephanie is still around?

    • DAL

      It’s amazing how fast people are solving those things.
      I look at them and see Alien Writing with no chance of even knowing how to get started.
      I feel I have a better chance solving Forrest’s puzzle more easily than Jenny’s puzzles! LOL

      Although, that Explosion would be nice to see!

  20. Hello Blex, thanks. Ya, I had searched Canada same on Tarryscant prior. The “unintended clue” aspect has a shadow whisper to it that I am focusing on. A clue helps lead to the chest, a hint helps with the clues. The unintended clue said aspect of the map seems to be a clue about where it is not, rather than a clue about where it is . So being as it’s said- an unintended clue,does this actually make this mean it is not a clue ,by definition? Though it is said to be an unintended clue, being as it is more about where it is not rather than where it is; does thiis disqualify it as being a (unintended) clue? The mathematics of the words don’t add up. So, tight focus on them words might be key , thus this has my mind a churning .IMO . How is this being an unintended clue qualify as being called a clue?

    • Alsetenash, yes it’s a bit ambiguous about the “unintended clue” with respect to the discussions everyone’s had about clues vs. hints. By using the word “clue” at the Moby Dickens Bookstore event, one could think that the unintended clue could possibly be elevated to the same level of importance as the 9 clues in the poem. The other way to think about this is simply that Forrest really meant “hint” and just used the word “clue” in the excitement of a live interview event. This would put the “unintended clue” on the same level of importance as the “subtle hints” that Forrest said exist in the TOTC book. That second interpretation is what I have settled on myself.

  21. I think the elders in the Chase need to be a big influence on the future elders in order to keep the Chase going if it isn’t found in our lifetime. I feel as though the end is ever drawing nigh for Forrest and will not be willing and able to throw too many more carrots into the stew.

    He talks about finding edges and it’s probably not on a trail made by humans but maybe near or on a high ridge or edge where wise folks at one time looked down upon a valley and stream seeing everyone that comes in or out like an owl as JDA stated.

    A perfect vantage point for Indians before the whiteman took over with lots of history and artifacts. I would think Mother Nature would have control of this area now and wouldn’t be any modern roads, power lines, buildings or houses or cell phone towers etc…

    Just heavy loads and water high and a blaze if you’ve been wize.

    • My reply to you Jake Faulker got posted as a new main post rather than part of your thread. This post is doubling down on whether it was my mistake or a glitch in the software…

      • You’ve got a good Google eye but those wedges are not ridges.
        You know the real ridge where the elders stayed don’t you?
        I will share it with you in private if you don’t know.
        You have my permission to email me.
        Chief Joseph awaits us.
        Good night.

      • Appreciated Jake. I am interested in your stories but I’ll let you keep that secret until after I fail at the targets I already selected for this summer.

    • Jake

      You speak many wizen words.

      With regards to JDA I’d like to say this; I believe each one of us are mirrored by the image of an animal, in JDA’s case I think an Owl is an appropriate determination with respects to his wisdom, magic, mystery and ancient knowledge. The same can be said for many others as well.

      Men like Forrest, JDA, Dal, Yourself and others are rare and few these days. It’s been an honor to witness this extraordinary event and to be a part of it simply by reading everything that is involved. My mind has expanded astronomically, and for that I sincerely thank you all.

      Dal recently mentioned an explosion of something would be nice to see. I believe there is a countdown at this point. I keep reminding myself that Forrest said all you need is TTOTC, Poem and Map. Everything else is icing on the cake. But he intended for us to solve it with just the cake. I feel the treasure will be found by July, August the latest. (I wonder what the odds are in Vegas?)

      As for me, I’m just a Hound Dog who believes he sniffed out some spectacular Bones with some meaty marrow. I’d really love to bark about it but don’t wanna scare off the mailman.

  22. If you think that, then try and find the Chief Joseph monument somewhere up Cache Creek along the Wedge. Nobody today knows where that was located, IMO.

    • What does the monument look like and how big is it. Is it hidden like Fenn’s TC? Any other details?

      • I don’t know. It’s shown on an old not-to-scale map I found. I doubt the monument still exists because the nice people at the Gallatin Museum never heard of it.

        But I’m not really looking for the monument. I was just suggesting it for Jake in case it fits his general solve better than mine.

        I would share the map but I’m not finished checking all the highlighted points of interest myself. I should be done looking this summer, but that’s what I said last year..

        • Muset,

          The Chief Joseph Monument is at Laurel Montana, outside of the RM. Then there’s the he Chief Joseph Scenic Byway, Wyoming 296, links the town of Cody with the Beartooth Highway and the Northeast Gate of Yellowstone National Park.

          Hope that helps.

          • Yes, thanks, but only as a distraction for others. My map is not THAT inaccurate. Cheers.

  23. Don’t blame you Dal, hiding up in the Northwest and all. I once knew a guy who once owned a whole city block up in your neck of the woods, poor guy. He happened to be a real character and that’s for sure. Who would a thunk he would have named his gig after a missing section, or something better than that. I know this may sound a little spacy but it really isn’t, nor am I trying to needle you there. Its just that every enterprise needs a little logic and reasoning to round out the corners. Whoops! Wouldn’t you know it, as soon as I start to fire it up here on the ivories, the sound of chasing thunder shows up to show me who’s boss. Guess this is my cue to depart…catch ya on the rebound.

    • I would love to comment on the post but it just seems to tarry my imagination to confusion over threading a needle to whose boss. I thunk departures would be premature to any searcher until the fireball warms up a little.
      I wouldn’t put to much concern in chasing under until the ———lady sings.
      For know I’m very curious about what Slerb has to say. The Sound of Silence. One of my favorite tunes. There lurking.
      Go easy on the insect killer this spring. There not all bad.

      • Mr. Grasshopper…
        You might want to hide under a leaf somewhere…there’s lots of ravens out there, hungry after a long winter.


        • I do appreciate the advice there Mr. lawn man. I’ll make sure to keep cover and my antennas up. You never know when there’s a fox in sheep’s clothing.

          • Maybe grasshopper has climbed all the up a cell phone tower…or maybe some hooligan pulled one of grasshoppers antennae off so he’s disabled…He could be right…I think..


      • Grasshopper, I am not a lurker. I am well seasoned. I just comment from time to time to let others know that I’m not to be counted as being whipped by the chase. When the timing is right, I will get BOTG again. I look forward to seeing everyone at Fennboree this year. BTW, I’m going to take my vacation in two weeks so that when I go on my search in a few months it will not turn into a vacation.

        • Slurbs, I did not imply that you were in fact lurking, the opposite as to why I’m so inquisitive. No need to be defensive if that’s how I read. I Applaud Your confidence. We all are in this and a little fun and humor never hurt anyone.
          Good Luck.

  24. This silence is deafening. Even if you believe you have the poem solved, you will still figure more revealing hints elswhere. From calculating values of paintings to instruments of a different era you can glean some important clarity to the aberrations as long as you can maintain a hold of your sanity when the going gets sketchy. You can take that to the bank!

      • SLURBS,,,
        It’s Saturday morning, I think.
        Once the fire at the cave
        mouth is roaring, & I’ve had my first cup of
        steaming hot coffee royal., then can open both eyes . lol

    • The logic of “silence is deafening” won’t help solve the poem, in my opinion.

    • Too much of a stretch to be logical. But they may both refer to a common location. All IMO.

  25. Humor me a bit y’all, but I think I know why Forrest named his treasure box, Indulgence.
    And….it isn’t because it’s filled with fruits, nuts, and sweets cuz of course, they would spoil with time.

    • What’s humorous about someone saying they think they know something without disclosing what it is? This blog is filled with examples like this.

      In a word, emdash, or more specifically, pica.

    • All you seek can be found in a tin of Quality Street..

      There is the other interpretation where the Catholic Church forgave all of our sins for an earthly price. Martin Luther put a stop to that philosophy, but it remains a common concept.

      • Google The Reformation in Europe. We’re 500 years into it. But I don’t mean to bring religion into the conversation; only history.

        • Hi Muset.
          I understand its definition and it’s history with the Cathlic Church. I’m just curious to when and or FF used this word.

        • Thanks for the reference that was some time ago.
          I have been to indulged in this and need a break. Later.

        • Mr. America-

          IMO…The name “indulgence” is quite personal to Mr. F. I don’t think I would go there…out of respect for him.

          Somewhere in the past, I read he was going to name the box “Tarzan”, which is a hint IMO. Why not pursue that.

          Best regards;


          • No disrespect intended to Mr. Fenn.

            The word “Indulgence” has quite a lot of meanings – many of them do not impart negative connotations. Forrest himself said “No time spent in thought is wasted and nothing is too small to know”. He “indulged” the children at his gallery – allowing them to touch, think, and imagine.

            In The Thrill of the Chase, he has challenged us to use our imaginations and our brains – both of which are important in this search. And that is what I have attempted to do.

            IMO – the name “Indulgence” is very closely wrapped to where waters halt. I could be wrong tho – definitely won’t be the first time but oh how much I have learned.

          • Mr. Clint…

            On the stairway question…
            I have a couple of ideas, but nothing earth shattering, so I don’t think so…..
            I’ll admit that I am so biased to my current solve; it is difficult to consider any other path. I was there two weeks ago. I snowshoed in and the spot is under about 10 feet of snow! That is just too much snow to move at that elevation, and if I tried I’m afraid I’d be climbing that stairway to heaven.

            Best regards;

          • Hi Sherif Billy
            Yes I was checking my solve out, still over 4ft yet of the white stuff ,but is going

  26. Sherif Billy – yu mentioned “earth shattering” – kinda like an explosion?
    Well – let’s shake, rattle, and roll.

  27. I was thinking recently that if I do find Forrest’s hidden spot I’m going to immediately fill my pockets with all the loot,that way when I’m taking the chest back to my car and some stick figures jump out and chase me I’ll throw the bronze box at them and run down hill as fast as I can, just like Forrest was gonna do with the trout and Grizzly.

  28. Help Me Find An Old Thread
    I Want To Review The Comments About “Ducks In A Row” – This Goes Back A Year Or So – Thanks For Any Help

    • Chuck,
      There is a nice search feature on the pages on this blog.
      Can be found on the right side menu usually at the bottom of the menu close to Dal’s email for PC users. Not sure if it’s there for smartphones.

  29. Thanks T.Hunter, it pretty well summarizes my view of the the business side of the man…. I don’t know if it also is his character in what appears to be his more scholarly pursuits. I hope not.

  30. Can anyone recommend a good internet site that would give you a full list of geographic features & names from typing in a key word? I have not been successful in finding anything like this better than Google Earth, which is limited.

    It seems to be a major shortcoming of Google Earth when I try to search for a particular place name, especially if it is a commonly named feature that is repeated in many locations. For example, if I type in “Green Mountain” (which there are at least 4 mountains with this name just in Colorado that I know of) in GE, it will likely pick a single location based on whatever algorithm it’s using and possibly catch one more in whatever local search boundaries it decides to use, but that’s it. I could include a state name to help narrow it down (“green mountain colorado”), but still it seems like some features within the state get overlooked by GE.

    Summitpost.org seems to be the best website that I’ve found for searching the names of mountains, but the site doesn’t cover other geographic features like canyons, rivers, lakes, streams, etc.

    • Hey-O, Blex –


      This indexes named features from USGS topo maps.


      You can then set several useful narrowing variables, including state, county, an elevation range, a terrain feature type (creek, river, airport, eg.), etcetera.

      It’s not super-whiz-bang, but I’ve found it sturdy and reliable, and I use it both inside and outside of the Chase.

      Very useful, especially in conjunction with a good topo-map-viewer like Topozone.com.


      • I second this suggestion. You can download coord-referenced locations with names and incorporate into a clue-matched spatial modeling tool. It can help focus in on areas you want to manually explore prior to botg.

        And, if you like associating words with very specific points on a map, have a look at: https://www.ngs.noaa.gov/datasheets/

        These are two approaches I deeply researched in the past and have since abandoned. But I wish you good luck all the same!

    • Also, mapcarta.com has mapped these features as searchable, and has a useful proximity list.

    • J A Kraven & E.C. Waters – Many thanks for the website recommendations! I will start diving into these! 🙂

    • What’s up Blex? Usually about once a year I post this site for the noobs, so as to get a foot on possible names and stuff. Must of missed you, but check it out. The link is for Montana but you can fill in any state.

      I know it says “lat-long” but that’s not the gist of the site. You’ll see. Good luck…

  31. A clue to solving the coded words from forrest is being released soon. These words are in Jenny Kiles new book. If you are working on/planning on solving the last clue on site and retrieving the chest these words may be of importance. So we wait….

  32. It recently dawned on me that like ff, I have had a special place where I wanted to die if life got out of hand or if I were terminally ill. This place was one that I visited as a NM Tech student in the 1960’s (Magdalena area west of Socorro). I drove in there alone in my Buick Invicta and lay down under the shaded cool branches of fir trees in the midst of a traumatic summer with no other humans in site. I had personal issues at the time and this felt comforting and eerily prophetic. To me, this was an isolated and peaceful place visited by few people. However, it did not have any connection to fishing, hiking, rock hounding, or other interests I had at the time. It was just a hauntingly beautiful and isolated place that I stumbled on by driving out of Socorro on a whim. Could this be similar to what Forrest is describing? I had a previous memorable experience in the Jemez Wilderness before the Magdalena experience, involving a backpack treck and fishing with college friends. But this wasn’t my “special place” because there were other people involved. So what might this say about Fenn’s special place?
    Just wondering.

    • I too have such a special place. Mine also has nothing to do with any of my interests at the time I found it. It is just a place where I experienced a profound sense of peace and tranquility at a point in my life when pretty much everything in my life rather sucked.

      I have always imagined that Forrest’s special spot likely has similar properties for him.

    • Actually not bad to see like-minded folks talking about it. Dal, not sure we need an “explosion” of more people. The lull suits me just fine.

      • Dal – I hope you or Chris will allow this post and will consider my idea inspired by your “explosion” idea in Sean’s video broadcast.

        The Smithsonian Museum comprises several locations, including the fourth most visited museum in the world: the Museum of Natural History. (The Smithsonian Museum logo is an impressive Solar blaze, btw). One of the areas in that museum is Cultural Artifacts, which I think is the perfect area for your awesome blog and Forrest’s bronze chest. I have always believed its proper place would be the Smithsonian:

        “Cultural artifact is a more generic term and should be considered with two words of similar, but narrower, nuance: it can include objects recovered from archaeological sites, i.e. archaeological artifacts, but can also include objects of modern or early-modern society, or social artifacts. For example, in an anthropological context: a 17th-century lathe, a piece of faience, or a television each provides a wealth of information about the time in which they were manufactured and used.”

        Based on reading the site further, I think The Chase and Forrest’s bronze chest with it’s contents would be a perfect example of a modern day Social Artifact. Could we somehow involved the Smithsonian Museum in The Chase? Could they publicize that they would purchase Forrest’s bronze chest, when found, for an appraised dollar amount, by a certain date and time? Would that entice new searchers to join? Would the press be all over this???

        Just looking for an idea with Pow! factor….


        • The Smithsonian? No, not their bag at all.

          I can see a casino somewhere getting a charge out of displaying it. Or Ripley’s Believe It Or Not museum, if that’s still a thing.

          But enough said.

          There’s no bigger JINX than talking about what you’d do “after” finding the chest.

          Let it lie until then. And go in peace after.


        • You know Lisa. I thought the same thing. Maybe they would pay rent.
          And the poor finder could take a vacation. I would entertain this idea.
          I guess we all have to wait for that day. As crafty as Mr. Fenn is he probably has already thought of something. It will be what it be.

    • At 5 minutes 24 seconds into it Decall Thomas says, “We know someone solved it but don’t know who.”

      What’s that all about?

      • Decall makes another reference at 1:26:54 to a person who is close now.

        Where is this information coming from and where is it posted?

        • Dal
          Oh, I thought it was something more recent.

          The first 2 clues thing has been around for a really long time.

          Come to think of it, Forrest hasn’t said a word regarding anything pertaining to searchers solves in a very long time. Think it was well before the release of Once Upon a While.

          Even his last 6 questions with Jenny, he didn’t make a peep.

          That’s interesting isn’t it.

          And by the way, that was enjoyable last night, you 4 guys did a good job and should do that more often. Thank You.

  33. Here’s a question anyone can answer. How many clues (of 9) do you think you have solved?

    • Just two hints from the poem. I’m still working on the meaning of “nine clues”. I have a new faith the rest will come after I’m out there looking at rocks in May.

      I feel like just today I had a positive hit on connecting the log photo and the logger drawing with the word “hew”.

  34. For me , it’s a 5 step process approach:

    1-Identify what are the 9 clues in the poem.
    2-Figure out what each of the 9 clues mean and or represent.
    3-Unify the clues and story together as a poem.
    4-Figure out locations.

    I am at and have yet to do number 5 at the moment .

    So, I think I have a pretty good idea of the 9 clues. Hopefully , I have them in the right order lol. I am not overly confident. I am just giving this a true north strong and free try.

    This is just my opinion only.

    • I gota to say, that is one heck of an enigma breaker your trying to build there. I sorta remember watching the imitation game a while back but cant recall exactly how “Christopher” cracked the code.

  35. An Australian TV production company is visiting Colorado in June and they want to do a story on Forrest’s Treasure Hunt. If you are searching in Colorado in June and wouldn’t mind being on TV in Australia I will put you in contact with them…
    Just drop me a line at dalatlummifilmdotcom and let me know you want to be put in touch with the Aussie TV company and I will send them your email…

  36. Australia? Love those Aussies but after a few VB’s they can get a little heavy headed. I never could understand why they called them the same going down as coming out. Must have something to do with being Kimberly cool. Any who, its no secret that I have the only credible map to Lasseter’s reef, almost being the finder and all. So why is it that the best discoveries always seem to happen in the middle of nowhere somewhere?

    • Straw-
      You seem to be harboring deep ill-feelings against the Aussies…
      Did a kangaroo chase you down the street when you were a kid?

      • Dal.
        Straw did say Love those Aussies, so maybe it was just a few bad VBs and a lost race with a two legged squirrel.
        Maybe tarry Scant got the best and just ant up to the rest. Just something to dream about till morning. No harm intended.

  37. I do believe that the Australians may be important here – that is if we are ready for them.

  38. Perhaps we could use a little more aboriginal foresight. Even Olivia, with all her history, knows funny things happen down under.

    • LOL – remember tho that “the lion sleeps tonight.” Wait till she wakes up!

  39. I live in Australia and will go on a search on September Friday 13, it’s going to be a full moon too. I can’t wait! So, an Aussie will help find it but she will be with an American from the South. Oh and VB isn’t as popular anymore, XXXX Beer is the footy beer now, just as nasty though! Lol No thanks on the TV crew though, I’m not telling where his special spot is. Mr. Fenn will always be able to RIP there, if he wishes.
    As for the question, I think I’ve finally figured this thing out. The if you’ve been wise part was the hardest for me to figure out. But it all fit together nicely like a 7 layer burrito! Lol Sorry, been wanting Mexican food. I look at the poem differently than most I believe. I see the whole poem as a riddle first, the each sentence as a clue and that’s the path I took. Good luck all!

    • Birdie: “each sentence as a clue”
      I believe Fenn told us the 1st clue and it is a small part of this sentence in the second stanza.
      I think you are heading down the wrong path. Good luck!

  40. An Ausee with a shepard is a faithful mix. I know because my girl had a heart of gold, was a delight to share a t-bone with, and could tread water with or without an anchor. You didn’t need to dress her up cause she fit right in like a Queens land healer with a beautiful accent.

    • I’m not an Ausee but I do have a Belgian shepherd and I agree totally with you. Love that ole dog to the moon and back. Hates waer though. She’s my running buddy.

  41. The Enigma code was based on the name of that German leader, whatever his name was.

    Anyways, trying to solve the poem by a location first then the poem to fit, rather than first trying to solve the poem then find the location, will be a spring time production for a bunch of rabbits named Enigma. IMO . 🙂

    By whichever way works ,is yet unknown. Who knows anything for sure. I have tried both approaches. For me , understanding the poem first seems more logical and workable. IMO . I never was good a the dart game.

    • Funny and well played.

      But silly rabbit, remember, darts are for dart boards.

      Best of luck.

    • Was actually playing darts yesterday (slop version where you don’t have to finish on a double). Made me wonder a few things but all the comments on a bullseye were made by searchers and not Forrest, but an interesting train of thought nontheless.

      • I wondered what announcement aka explosion was.. Only for a Minute then went back to Bo. Maybe the weather will be perfect this season.
        Well back to my Gneiss creek trail thrill of the Google search.
        Even if its been searched by many. I think it is a possible place.
        Happy Hunting.

        • Bias and confirmation. WWWH Gneiss creek cemetery.
          TTOTC. Seating on head stone looking up at stars. The flowers
          on cover of TFTW. The cover of OUAW the stars.
          The Brown or grizzly comes down to the fields. The trail leads
          south/down to the Madison canyon. Probably within two miles
          of trail head. Bear tooth maps. Has swamp areas. ect.
          Probably near where the trail nears Campanula creek.
          Dangerous area. Wolves Bear. Prairie smoke flowers.
          Big area. TFTW righted a head stone. I think the area has
          some beauty to it. In the desert sand in the suns Blaze.
          My current Google search area. Why has nobody found
          it. Because there is to many possible solves. As I just
          wrote one. And my hint on the blaze.
          Happy hunting.

    • Idle Dreamer – Did you happen to pull up a map of Firehole Avenue in West Yellowstone and notice it ends at Iris Street? Iris is the Greek Goddess of the Rainbow. She makes it appear to ride on it to deliver the messages of the Gods. One end of Iris Street ends where a Jeep Trail begins. That leads to Baker’s Hole, the Madison River and the Madison Arm of Hebgen Lake.

      Thinking about the end of Forrest’s Rainbow and the treasure. And the Summers he spent riding his bike to go swimming or fly fishing.

      • I didn’t know that but I remember the conversation about Baker’s hole once being called Brown (hole or camp).

        Definitely would be cool to bike out there. Wonder what kind of bike he had (I assume he has mentioned it)

        • Which an eye also has. If you make a piece of cordage you will also encounter an eye.

  42. Joe,
    I’m sorry, my reply didn’t go on the correct spot.
    I was speaking to Rosdrunner when asked how many clues do you think you have solved.

  43. There is a radio tower in West Yellowstone. Hear me all and listen good? Of course there are radio towers all over the Rocky Mountains.

    • This is the only radio tower I know of in West Yellowstone.
      44.648893, -111.098355
      I went searching around that area for a fellow searcher a few years ago.
      We have both moved on since then. Too many shotgun shots for me to go back again and no heavy loads or water high but he bought me lunch and a few beers. 🙂

  44. Could the Grizzly and Wolfe Discovery Center in West Yellowstone be the home of Brown?

  45. Ads…ads…ads….. Is it just me, or what? Can these things be turned off? If so, can someone help me with my tech deficiencies? See ya

    • Maybe Chris can calc a subscription model. Pay $100/yr, or tolerate epilepsy episodes.

      • Lol… thanks E.C… seems like I remember someone saying you can turn them off, but I can’t find where it was talked about…
        $100 a year might be worth it…lol thanks for the smile….. have a great day… until next time.. see ya

    • Hello Focused! The ads keep popping up! It’s the way of the world now a days! I hope all is well in your world.

    • Hey what is up with all those ads? And…all the ads I get seem to be about E.D.. What’s up (or down) with that? I mean why do they think I need that stuff anyway?

      Then they go on to say that if I’m standing at attention for four hours, to call my Doctor…..Are you kidding me? Forget the Dr.,.. I’m calling the newspaper!


      That would make me famous I bet….

      • Billy…maybe the ads are geared towards what your browser is used to looking at? I’ve never seen any ads other than outdoor gear, boots and clothing, or insurance.

  46. Dal, you got me all wrong, the Ozzies are a real hoot on a Skimpy night to drop a piss with. And forget about the Bucks, Shielas and little Jonnies, its the big birds that can really send your quills into a tail spin. They can be as contankerous as the piss there named after, especially on a walk about way beyond Burke. Why I’ve heard they ain’t worth the tucker it takes to feed them but I wouldn’t know. What I do know is I’ve crammed alot into this 109 words and not a one single hint.

    • Your response maid me think of the Adventures of Ozzie and Harriet show – use to watch it alot when I was a kid. Those boys were real hunks – especially Ricky.

  47. Hay JDA
    How are you doing, just dropping you a line to see if everything is ok Clint

      • WOW JDA!
        You answered that in 2 minutes.
        You must be getting bored standing on the sidelines.

        • I’ll bet JDA was out there having a blast in 12 feet of ice and snow diggin around for the treasure. Did you find it near the Madisonn River?

          • JDA doesn’t search the Madison as he stated here. He does like Wyoming as the place but not the park or Montana. Dig deep into his rabbit holes.

      • Hey JDA

        Hope you are doing well and good.

        It’s been a while, I’ve been broadening my horizons in a hermit like capacity in the mountains somewhere north of Santa Fe with the likes of sherif billy. I try to keep to myself and walk the green mile with my head low and confirmation bias close to the vest. I feel my trail has become wary.

        May the sprouts of spring rain blossoms into your journeys of next.

        Safe passage.

  48. Jake –
    That’s crazy talk. What in the dad blame sense are you talking about?

  49. Fenn must have been clairvoyant.
    Filing Date August 3, 2017
    Duh, wasn’t the treasure hidden years before this date silly?
    Stick with bibles to find the treasure of God and not find Fenn’s treasure.
    His church is in the mountains.

    • Mr. Jake-
      A license for a copyright doesn’t last forever and you have to renew it. If you were a detective, you would have entered the owners name into the TESS system search and found that they had other copyrights with similar names long ago, which have lapsed and are now “dead”. IMO Without any imagination; you sir; have zero chance of finding “IT”.

      Best regards;

      • “other copyrights”
        “similar names”
        “long ago”
        So they didn’t have the exact name copyrighted before Fenn hid the treasure. Hmmm
        Your research is flawed at beast.

  50. Reminds me of all that cockiness Dal and the others were going on about the other night-

    • Hi Clint- that was on the Flip Side. Jake Faulkner provided a link to it on March 27 above. Closer to the end, I think which is also where they talk about Dal’s explosion-

  51. From somewhere up adove the blind man knows the ADvantages of touching Ones Kundalini.

    • Be carefull what you touch no matter blind or not. Sometimes you can not let it go and there is no way to go back where you once began.
      You are committed to the end and you are one with a new place. It is not for the meek but you will know if it is for you and you will chose to stay only if it was for you to be. If I go to my grave early I know that my quest was just. My only consolation is that acknowledgment and approval. We all seek that knowing or not. That’s life and so be it as long as the light in our eyes continues to glow. Denial is just a delay simply put a day off.
      There is no such thing as being a lone or as one.
      Just ask Wilson. You may laugh as Mr. Fenn. did , but rest assure he was not alone. I believe many are with him, mostly his family who undoubtedly proudly awaiting his soul. We all seek the same thing from life I hope. The chest of riches is just a symbol , as is a cross or any other symbolic item. These things we need as we seek safety within and we build our our walls and we struggle to justify.
      Just ask Wilson.
      I believe that this is going to be the best year ever.
      As I honor my recently deceased parents, fulfill my mission and start my new journey I will always see this chase as a Devine Intervention.
      No regrets.

      • Anyone with no regrets has a bad memory.
        I should say something about Fenn’s Treasure; that’s the title of this
        thread. I think that his biggest treasure he’s provided us with is the
        motivation to think . . . about many things. But still, I seek the bronze
        box and the gold, etc. inside. All part of my opinion.

      • A child is always told “don’t touch because it’s hot.” Often times a child has to EXPERIENCE the pain of getting burned before he can really understand what “hot” means. Altho a burn heals with time, the scar remains

  52. To anyone that has not been BOTG-it’s amazing. To walk to a spot that you have figured is the location is exhilarating. Two trips so far. Traveling couple thousand miles with no prize, disappointing. Went to walmart and bought a metal probe to grid search an area for hours with no luck. Getting angry at Fenn because he didn’t choose my spot was no help. Regrouped. Ready for round three.

    • It’s too bad that the nearest town to the TC doesn’t have a Walmart. Good luck
      to y’all (in general). All IMO.

    • Bezel,
      1582 miles, one way. 1 drive and 4 airline trips. Will be on trip 6 in about a month. Wouldn’t change a thing. The thrill is in the chase. Solving the poem is more important than the chest. With our BOTG and fine -tooth-combing the poem, we have refined our search to a narrow area . If the TC is found..great. If not, then the trip will still be worth it. The East is great but does not have the scenery of the West which makes any trip out West worth the time and effort.
      Good luck and stay safe.

  53. Bezel wrote: “Went to walmart and bought a metal probe to grid search an area for hours with no luck.”
    Grid search an area?

    Yes, this is one of many reasons why I don’t think that 8 clues (after WWWH) apply to BOTG. If an area can be searched by walking back and forth until the area is covered, searcher does not need ANY clues (aside from WWWH), much less 8.

    Despite the illogical assumption of reserving 8 or even 7 clues for BOTG (after having arrived at WWWH), the assumption has become standard operating procedure for conventional searchers. No wonder the treasure has not been found.

    Ken (in Texas)

    • This is one of the most logical and practical statements posted to the hoD in quite some time.
      This coming from a searcher that believes stanzas 2-4 happen within a painting gives it no validity right?

  54. wwwamerica,

    It’s only the person that makes fool for themselves. The reason is they don’t listen or can’t comprehend what they read with little logic.

  55. All clues were thought to be solved before my BOTG. As been discussed before, there still is an issue of precision with almost any point of reference that you go to. I don’t think the chest is going to be on a pedestal to just pick up. Some level of searching is going to be required. Since I turned over every log and stone and was so sure, I resorted to depth. I hated the thought of the thousand mile trip back, and the chest being 3 inches under. Try probing a 30 yard by 30 yard area every 10 inches. I then looked around at other features which would be good resting places. Contingent plans of searching the area allowed me to reassess my solve ,put the old idea to rest, and give confidence to my new solve.

    • Why not just look for a blaze and that may solve the problem in your search area.
      I wouldn’t probe a 30 x 30 yard area with no blaze.
      I think the blaze is the precision part of the last clue.

      • Had a blaze. Looked quickly down. No chest there; then what, leave after 20 hr drive? Nope. Just discussing what I did instead of ruining a trip and wondering for a year if I was “close”. I am now sure it is not close to my previous solve.

        • Don’t feel bad about no blaze being there. I and many others have been there too. I just tend to keep looking around the area where I thought it was to find a blaze but I also go back to the cabin and regroup to see where I went wrong and sometimes it means I was in the wrong area altogether after soaking in all the info of the area.
          I travel a few thousand miles every year myself and like to optimize my trips with other non search related activities.

          No blaze, no glory….

          • I think glory is over-rated, but it sure as heck seems quite
            important to some folks. As always, IMO.

      • Having found the blaze does imply or indicate some precision, but is not a complete solution to the poem (even though extremely important in relevance). IMO.

  56. I don’t think so Ken.
    This is my take on the situation:
    The trillions of cans of worms is created by searchers that think it’s not straightforward or face value so they tend to over complicate things especially when they try the face value method a few times and fail so human nature kicks in and most tend to think because they failed that the poem must not be taken at face value.

    Fenn didn’t spend every second, minute, hour and days in the 15 years on the poem. Sure all the words are deliberate just like all the words in your 15 minute comment and it may be risky to discount any of the words but he was a risk taker and if you didn’t take a risk playing the lottery you can’t win and you need to discount some of the words in the poem.

    If the poem was created in some type of cypher then you could have plugged it into some computer program to figure it out in hours with the computing power and speed we have today and that goes for all that think there are coordinates. POOF done in hours. Treasure found.

    You can look up all those obscure definitions and try them out with all the words in the poem but it seems like over complication of things seeing the dictionaries, online and book form will change through the years and ya he said he looked up definitions but he didn’t mention the word obscure or etymology or origin to my knowledge.

    The poem is written in a vague way where the clues are places, directions and things at places and you will have to find out where the 1st clue is to get to the next clue and so on. Imagination will always trump knowledge.

    As a reply to your last comment. Fenn said “the fact that nobody has found it I’m frankly surprised”

    • He mentions etymology indirectly. I’ll point it out if you wish. I suspect it won’t matter since this is just an approach on how to interpret.

      In my opinion, it is not a cypher. In my opinion and from what I’m gathering from said approach, it is a set of riddles whose answers index numbers, of which would then be used to create coordinates. Compare the word “thirl” with the word “riddle”. Compare the word “chase” with the word “geography”. You will see what I see.

      • He also said the chest originally held a bible, or a “book of names”. How to solve it seems pretty “frank” and straightforward to me. The “code” is cracked.

        • Sorry, a bible or a “book of days”, an allusion to recording names and dates.

        • “The code is cracked.” That is a bold statement with no “IMO” attached. I eagerly await your solve and BOTG search results….


          • The method is clear. I hope to solve the riddles and will be on location for 2 weeks in May. If not me, then someone else. But the probability of it being solved this year is now very high.

        • Well, EC I do certainly agree probability of a solve this year is high. I wish everyone luck…. but myself a little more maybe.

      • No thanks E.C.
        No need to point out etymology indirectly for me as I don’t think it will help find the treasure or help in a way on how he thinks.
        I also don’t think the coordinates you find after unraveling the riddles, answers and index numbers will help you with the finding of the bronze box.
        I don’t want to see what you see but thanks anyway.

    • I’ll give you another one just to get you started:


      … from the same spot he alludes just before to etymologies, but then mentions a look that reminded him of a can opener ad. Then again related to Andy Warhol’s art. Campbell also has a meaning in helping to solve the poem.

      • By the way, I tried to be clever with “can of worms”, but I’m nowhere near as clever as Forrest has been. The guy seriously is a genius with this.

      • Hello E.C. Waters. Sometimes I wonder if the mention of the can opener ad seen in a Good Housekeeping Magazine is to point out “circulation(s)” delivered to our homes/address. Mr. Fenn has said over at Jenny’s, “Ron, your question sounds like a travelogue, but I’ll answer it. No, I don’t want to be that bold. But I will say that I walked less than a few miles if that will help. I just looked “few” up and one definition is “scant.” Why do I sound like I’m talking in circles? f Yet, saying one has the face/profile of a can opener…oooh.

        • The can opener reference (“Campbell” —> “wry”/“rye”) is not related to “housekeeper”. But it is a good example of multiple references that are not intentionally (sequentially) placed to aid the searcher.

          • It could be Camp and Bell.
            Camp as in campground and Bell as in Ma Bell for us old timers. Remember the scrapbook with the bell on top of the post.
            He said imagination is important….just paraphrasing for all you literal people.

    • Jake, I’ll respond briefly to each of your 6 paragraphs …

      1. Once again, you are trying to justify, or rationalize, this “face value” approach, which hasn’t worked in 9 years. I don’t think you understand what I mean by “face value” or “straightforward”.

      2. This paragraph seems like a distraction. Don’t see the relevance. FF has made quite a point through the years of saying how long it took him to construct the poem, which was 15 years (don’t be so dismissive of that time span or the amount of work he put into it). The hunt has nothing to do with a lottery or winning by chance.

      3. You and I agree that the poem is not a cypher; college nerds have already tried using computing power, and it didn’t work. Not surprised, since the poem has no analogue.

      4. “Obscure” definitions are not relevant.

      5. You and I agree, but I’m baffled at why you included this paragraph; it’s so basic.

      6. FF has made a lot of statements that are contradictory; searcher needs to be discerning as to which statements of his to take seriously and which to discard.

      Jake, I certainly would not expect you to agree with me, or to understand where I’m coming from. It’s annoying for me to not be able to communicate specifics. If, and it’s a big if, I am correct, then the treasure chest will not be found in calendar year 2019. The vast majority of searchers seem to be looking at the poem and clues in the same “face value” way, more or less.

      Ken (in Texas)

      • Well Ken at least we agree on some things and thank you for an intelligent and relevant reply which seems to be a rarity.

        I have to ask you what you meant by not face value because we agree on a few things?

        Why won’t the treasure be found in 2019 if you are correct?
        Is it because you won’t be searching this year?

        • Jake wrote: “I have to ask you what you meant by not face value …”
          Words and phrases can have multiple meanings. I think this is how FF gets away with saying some things that supposedly are clues; he means those things in a way that is valid, but different from their usual meanings.

          As one example of commonly accepted “face value”, many searchers like yourself think of “warm” as being related to temperature. That’s a natural “face value” interpretation of WWWH. For that example, I’m saying that “warm” could have a different FF meaning which few searchers grasp.

          But beyond that, a broader interpretation of the poem as a whole leads me to think that the vast majority of searchers are looking at the poem itself in exactly the same way as everyone else >>> at this same, commonly accepted “face value” way. Regardless of different interpretations of clues and different ideas about location of the treasure, most searchers are still looking at the overall poem in exactly the same way as others (it’s called the “chase community” assumptions); just the incorrect details searchers come up with are different.

          I have not seen any comments or discussions, or read about any solutions that break through this commonly accepted “face value” approach to the poem as a whole.

          So “not face value” means that in my opinion the chest can be found only if searchers get away from the poem’s “face value” approach, which hasn’t worked in 9 years. You and I agree on certain ideas because they happen to be characteristic of both “face value” and non-face value approaches.

          You’ll notice that not many posters are taking my idea seriously. For some it’s because they’re really not serious about the treasure hunt, and the way this message board works is that their more recent gibberish supersedes previous comments which could actually be significant.

          For other posters, they’re so glued to their current “face value” solution, they’re not about to consider some alternative, which could potentially mean that they would have to start over, from scratch.

          These various reasons lead me to the opinion that the treasure chest will not be found in 2019 >>> by the chase community.

          To answer your other question, actually I do not now have any plans to search in 2019, though that could change. I don’t think there is any hurry.

          I appreciate that you read my comments even though I know you disagree with my theory.

          Ken (in Texas) 🙂

          • Hi Ken in Texas
            Like Forrest said there are a lot of WWH
            In the Rockey Mountains ,and to just use
            the poem at face value is expensive folly
            Forrest gives you the hints to figure his poem out, then the searcher must use
            the poem just the way it is written,once
            You get on the right Fenn WAVE .It vary
            hard to write anything here once everything is known and not give it away.
            Clint. Sorry

  57. I think you might need “tools” to find the treasure chest and these would most likely be the same “tools” that Mr. While eCoyote super genius used to hide it … IMHO. Beep beep!

  58. Just read this treasure quest.

    I need to know the day Forrest went to the lower falls in yellowstone and seen the blaze on the canyon walls as described/drawn by Grafton Tyler Brown.

    Assuming he took Uncle Tom’s trail.

    This is the riches of old declared by Pres. TR.

    The brink of the lower falls above 5000 but lower than 10000.

    At some point you see the blaze, look down, there is the treasure.

    80 yrs old how far did he walk down the trail? Definitely not for the meek or an 80 yr. Old

    • If I remember correctly, Fenn visited the lower falls in Yellowstone on Aug 22 2002. I think it was a tuesday from what I can remember and the sky was a beautiful lapis lazuli blue and he was with his wife Peggy. I think they were there to celebrate the hiding spot but then I realized it’s April 1st today and I just made this up and I never read or heard of Fenn being at the lower falls although it may be in his book. That was foolish of me.

  59. Two hairs in the chest – that’s an easy one. If that chest is not discovered for a thousand years, what do you think they might do with those hairs???? Hey Wyatt Earp – you need to watch more CSI.

      • They’ll clone Mr. Fenn. He’ll be immortal. And this time he will have to look for the chest that the finder hides … cause it will still be out there … IMHO.

        • Do you remember what happened to the “boys of Brazil” or in Jurassic Park?

        • I would hope that he included more than hair as even with the root you have a chance of not having a complete genetic DNA profile. With just the hair you definitely do not have enough.

        • Hello RoadRunner. No need for cloning Mr. Fenn. I believe he’s written in the pages for the ages. IF, he has been forgotten in a thousand years and the hairs are needed to compare DNA, wouldn’t there need to be family members to compare his DNA to? May the Fenn family tree continue to bloom.

      • You crack me up Sherif Bily Bob – Perhaps lack of imagination is your problem – let’s pretend you are a mummy…….

          • Not without a good bedtime story – I like nonfiction – especially biographical ones. But please make it short cuz I’m pretty tired.

          • OK Mr. America–
            That fella Mr. Fenn watched make a horseshoe, had a relative who was a mountain man. Read about him…
            Now that’s a story…

            Class dismissed

    • Mr. America..
      If you need an extension on the deadline you must include a short paragraph with answers to the following questions.

      1. What product did Simeon produce and what was it called?

      2. Why did f say Hamilton was on the $100 and how does it relate to the Mexican-American war of 1847.

      3. Who were the Bent Bros. of present day Colorado?

      4. Why did the Mexican govt. allow the establishment of the Santa Fe trail?

      5. What was the Lincoln county war?

      6. Was the trial of the leaders of the uprising fair and impartial?

      7. How has the Spanish land grant system affected ownership rights and title commitments in New Mexico today?

      8. Who had the largest land grant and was it legally obtained?

      9. In your opinion who was the most famous of the mountain men of that time?

      10. During the cold winters, the mountain men couldn’t trap beavers. What did they do during the winter and where did they live?

      Spelling and grammar is counted.


      • “Spelling and grammar is counted.” I love to hear this.

        So it means, No:
        – ‘where its at’ (there is not at at the end) it is just “where it is.”
        – ‘seen it’ (proper grammar is “saw it” unless one uses “have”
        – ‘he don’t’ (proper grammar is “he doesn’t”)

      • Answer to #1 is TAOS WHISKEY
        Prob learned how to make it when he was in Missouri.

  60. With regards to the key word or the code – has any of you considered the correlation between that concept of a key word and the words “coda” or “koda.” Just wondering…..

  61. I think if you expect to find the treasure chest, you will need to (important) learn how and know when to “shift gears” … and beware of While E Coyote, IMHO. Beep beep!

      • Is the Genius the Coyote or the Road Runner. I never could figure that out. I am pretty sure that word fits Mr. FF
        I am sticking with super heroes. Anyone no who the character that man made out of rocks was. One almost hit me on the head the other day at work. Got me thinking.

    • Now that is a load BS or HS or both and you better watch where you put that BOOT down it won’t be a clump you hear but a splat .There are hints if you’ve been wise.

      • Blex…Darn…I should have read upstream. That’s what happens when you are buried in an avalanche of work all day! So funny though…I just drove over Red Mtn 6 days ago and it was impressive. A guy on a motorcycle going the other way passed me at the snow shed. Spring in Colorado!

        • Yep Sandy, it seems like we have quite the late winter this season! Gotta share some humor to pass the time! 🙂

          The article gets pretty ridiculous towards the end, but there are quite a few items even early on in the article to not fool anyone who knows their Fennology 101! Although I will freely admit when I first saw the article headline… even though I well knew the date, my heart could not help but skip a beat or two in those first few seconds! lol! I guess you have to have a little gullibility to fully appreciate April Fool’s Day!

  62. Funny … I’m sitting here randomly reading Hemingway’s short stories in The Fincia Vigia Edition, … In THE NIGHT BEFORE BATTLE … [Madrid, Spanish Civil War],… dialog between Al. commander of tank unit, believes he is going to die in tomorrow’s battle & Hank, friend & war correspondent:.

    “They aren’t going to counter-attack tonight.” Al said. “When they’ve got those positions, and we are up that creek, they aren’t going to leave their positions to try and kick us out of that creek.”
    “What creek?”
    “You know the name of that creek.”
    “Oh, that creek.”
    “Yeah, Up that creek without a paddle.”

    • OS2 – Why does that remind me of Osborne Russell’s description of his party of trappers vs. the Blackfeet Indians above where Hebgen Dam is today? I like Aubrey Haines’s version with his maps and footnotes to identify exact places and distances. Forrest mentioned that battle in his story, “Looking for Lewis and Clark”.

      Oh, and Beaver Creek has a paddle. Up a creek without a paddle might be a reference to take the trail along Cabin Creek next door. Which is probably where Osborne Russell and his trapper party camped, up the creek drainage from the Madison River. The night before their battle with the Blackfeet.

    • OS2 – Sounds a lot like the scenario of the battle with the Blackfeet that Forrest mentions in this story:


      I like Aubrey Haines’s version with his maps and footnotes to try to determine exact locations.

      And your quote made me wonder if “your creek” in the Poem separates the route from nearby Beaver Creek in my solution. That creek has a paddle: the Beaver’s tail. My creek does not. Thanks!

          • Hi Lisa, Hope I’ve embellished your spring search a tad.

            I wonder if the ‘paddle’ phrase was common when Hemingway incorporated it, or did he originate it in the story & it became popular? Another slang word he uses is ‘wet”… I think its kinda like FF’s “primeval thoughts”, a reference to emotions & thoughts too complicated to explain. In the poem, “Your effort will be worth the cold” could even be a double entendre, a salute to Papa’s famous style. Slang & jargon are shorthand … the visible part of the Iceberg. Ta.

        • OS2 – OK. According to Ben Goldfarb at the library, back in 1500, before the Beaver Top Hat craze in the 1800s, there were about 300 million Beavers here on Planet Earth. Now there are only about 100 thousand.

          Ben’s book, “Eager Beavers Matter”, got great reviews. And here is a great pic of a presentation slide he talked about:


          Clark was up one of the tributaries of the Missouri River. Before trappers like Osborne Russell, Jim Bridger and Joe Meek got to it. Creeks that have Beaver dams and lodges on them spread out into a meandering flood plains to create excellent riparian areas, supporting so many species. Without Beaver, creek water rushes downward, unimpeded, and erodes the stream banks. That forms deep canyons with steep walls. Like the one that leads to my hidey spot out Cabin Creek. I hope there are Beaver out in that meadow, but probably not. They don’t like to eat and build with Conifers, apparently. Looks like Spruce and Lodgepole Pine on Google Earth.

  63. I don’t like rules any better than you do. But here’s the thing, if you don’t know the rules, you’re not gonna find nothin … IMHO. It’s been a busy day, huh?

  64. And POOF things disappear! Guess we got in trouble last night Sherif Billy.

    Hope we have a good night tonight and make peace with the moderators.

    I think we should talk about things more related to the chase – such as Texas tea, warm jackets, and volcanoes – so people will quit blowing their tops.
    I’m getting tired of all the “noise” and am in dire need of some repairs.
    Where do we go from here?

  65. O ya I’ve been fooled all day long so many times. I don’t know who to listen to.
    April fools. You nuty crazy searchers.
    I’m going to the Mama Mia play with my Wife and Daughter and that’s that.

  66. I’m Sorry. I don’t know all the rules and I forget to say in my opinion so this goes for all of them. Please understand I’m in a lot of pressure these days.

    • No need to apolgize – you can’t be expected to know everything.
      Surely someone will get some action going soon and hopefully I won’t be missing out on the fun. I’m still in the middle of the road as to where to go seaching this year – perhaps a nice mountain valley on the edge of the Western slopes. Then gonna just head out and hit the trails. I may not find the gold but I definitely will see some mighty fine slivers of God’s green earth.

  67. IMO, The searcher that’s the closest is “a man eater, watch out boys, she’ll chew you up.”

  68. That maybe a long time since the winter was strong this year.
    We all may have to nap a little longer.
    Don’t over sleep IMO

    • Grasshopper, I told Dal I’d be nice and follow his rules. I’m already bright eye’d and bushy tailed, and you might be a tasty treat. As above @7:17pm

      • Hey Dal, I’m just having fun with Grasshopper. Btw hopper, thanks for your welcome aboard earlier.

        • Refreshing to see someone with a sense of humor by the way I taste terrible. Going to work so I can’t chat.
          Until later.

        • I don’t have a lot of time to T Hunt as my girls say. At dinner I’ve been accused of having some disorder or something and that I may need help. As such some therapy may work.
          They said I couldn’t close my electronics down until tomorrow morning. I said I could I just don’t know which one. So there shopping and I have free time.
          I just can’t think of anything

          • So so it sounds like you have head issues. Tap in to a good therapist and maybe they can reconnect you to reality. I’m sure your wife and daughters will come home with sacks of goodies – maybe if you are lucky you’ll find something in there for you.

            Sirisously tho – Get your head together cuz we all appreciate your wisdom. Let us know where you think we should be hopping off to this spring.

  69. If I do find the Fenn treasure, I WILL accept an invitation to host “Saturday Night Live”! You know … in case anybody is wondering.

    “Live from Sante Fe … it’s the Thrill of the Chase!”

    How did I do? Good? “Our music entertainment tonight will be non other than the greatest rock’n roll band of all time … Please welcome … VANHALEN!

  70. So many discussions, so many interpretations, so many ideas, so many thoughts, so many solves.

    But there is one thing We ALL have in common and that is the FACT that we must drive a vehicle to a certain place and get out and walk.

    Does, Not far, but too far to walk suggest that we must still be in our vehicle and when do we stop our vehicle?

    If you’ve been wise and found the blaze suggest we should stop our vehicle and get out to look at the blaze and continue with the rest of the clues?
    If so, we just traveled from the beginning, where warm waters halt, to the blaze in our vehicle.

    There has to be a point where we stop our vehicle and get out.

    Where is THAT point?

    I’m trying to simplify like a wise man said.

    I believe we must travel in a vehicle through most of the clues.

    Outside Magazine Interview with Forrest Fenn
    August 10 2015
    Minute mark 1:06
    Forrest says: I mean these people DRIVING down the street looking for a BLAZE, because that’s one of the clues, but you can’t start in the middle of the poem and find the treasure, I DONT THINK, I mean it would be a MIRACLE if someone did.

    This suggests, to me, In My Opinion, that we are to be in our vehicle up to the point of the blaze. Forrest says it would be a miracle IF someone was just driving around looking for the blaze and found it. So it is possible to find it, not impossible. But if someone is following the clues to the blaze and found it, they would have done so in their vehicle.

    So, where do we stop our vehicles?
    Where warm waters halt?
    Canyon down?
    Not far?
    Home of Brown?
    Place of meek?
    The end?
    Up a creek?
    Heavy loads?
    Water high?
    The look down?
    The cease of Quest?
    Marvel gaze?
    The chest?
    In peace?
    The cold?
    The brave?
    The wood?

    Where do we stop our vehicle? That is the question.

    • If someone saw the blaze from their vehicle, that would be virtually a miracle,

        • That’s a lot of driving in the Rocky’s
          Why would you want to do that.
          If I was retired I sure would.

          • Imagine thousands of visitors to the Rocky Mountains looking out their vehicles looking for the blaze. Someone’s bound to get lucky. Don’t you think?

    • Pauley T – Great question! I believe you stop your vehicle at this line in the Poem:

      Put in below the home of Brown

      Forrest could easily have parked out of site from the cars on the highway at the Day Use Area on the Madison River, where it meets Cabin Creek. I saw my Owl blaze rock across the river from there on my first walk from my camp. I believe it can be seen from the highway a little further up (@5:49 in the upper right corner of the still shot):


      That is a pretty big Brown trout! That spot is also where a huge Brown bear, aka My Grizz, has followed hikers down to while I was there one Summer. He lives somewhere up the Cabin Creek drainage. That Day Use Area is below that drainage.

      But my REAL blaze I look quickly down from to see my hidey spot is on a hillside ridge shown in the background of a picture shown at the top of Forrest’s “Looking for Lewis and Clark” story. I think the Poem is referring to finding this blaze prior to making a BOTG search. By using a comprehensive knowledge of geography, a good topo map and TTOTC book. To go with confidence.

      All IMO. Hi DeCall!

      • Lisa

        Isn’t it amazing how many variations there could be, almost infinite, like the stars in the sky!

        Put in below the home of Brown is a great spot to get out of your car. It has Panache! How often do we hear that word, Panache, it’s cool huh? LOL

        Interesting search area you’re covering, many possibilities. Just make sure you have a trout tucked nicely in your pocket in case your grizz gives you a charge so you can throw it at it and RUN!

        My solve has a great distance from Grizzly country, I can’t imagine what it would be like trying to out run a Bear carrying an extra 42 pounds! Hopefully, it would be a reasonable Bear, a Bear that I could bargain with, the type of Bear that would consider my feelings.

    • Miracle Definition:
      A surprising and welcome event that is not explicable by nature or scientific laws and is therefore considered to be the work of a divine agency.

      Divine Definition:
      Divine basically means relating to, coming from, or like God or a god.

      Divine also has an old-fashioned and informal meaning of being very good or pleasing.

      More Miracle Definitions:
      A highly improbable or extraordinary event, development, or accomplishment that brings very welcome consequences.

      An amazing product or achievement, or an outstanding example of something.

      With that said, I think if a searcher did find the blaze by driving around they would have to be incredibly lucky OR had a pretty good HUNCH about something.

      Hunch Definition:
      A feeling or guess based on intuition rather than known facts.

      Could a DEEP THINKING person have mettle enough?

      A synonym of miracle is Marvel.

  71. Kpro Cow 2019 FF coin hunt! The finder of the proxy item will get 2 coins. 2019 FF coin #045 and 2018 FF coin #272. Thanks to Jeff M. for donating coin #272.

    Clues will be released every Monday and Thursday until the proxy item is found. You will know for certain you have it when you find it. It it somewhere within the continental United States.

    I am compiling a email list to send out the clues before we go live on YouTube each week. Email me to get on this list ~ Cowlazars2@gmail.com Please put “treasure hunt clues” in the subject line. You will receive clues for all future hunts.

    ~ Cowlazars

      • How outre, yet apropos! An avalanche reveals my location as well, although not originating anywhere nearby. How far does an avalanche travel? Musta been shipped in.

        • LOL i was loosing my mind when i found the article i was laughing so hard. Must travel really far. That place has 80+ feet of snow.

  72. Couple days ago the subject of two hairs came up. Just musing here, but how old was he when began sprouting CHEST hairs? Does his treasured place date to that time? The hairs may not be as silly as it might seem.

    • Forrest must’ve heard the treasure value finally hit 10 million, he’s wasting no time!

      Thanks Lisa!

      • Tall. That almost sounds like an acquisition of sort. There are many false blazes out there.
        Why do you mention vandalism.
        Vandalism is an intentional act of meaning to cause harm. Sometimes some harm may come from an act without the intent for any harm. Indiana Jones could testify to that.
        After all we all know that when we drive our car down the road we harm the environment but we do it anyhow. So we are all vandals in our own way.

        • The definition of “harm” is subjective. I guess that you would not approve of someone spray-painting graffiti on property you own.

          What I saw is akin to that. I don’t approve of that act, and
          would not encourage my grandson to do it.

          I don’t sweat “the environment” too much. And I never feel
          guilty about exhaling carbon monoxide into it. As always, IMO.

  73. RoadRunner
    Someone’s definitely bound to get a little lucky.
    It’s funny I go to google earth and look at my search area. They must have updated it because I see my car in this dumpy area right of town. I think it’s the same color

    • I was hoping to find the treasure myself, but I had a dream that a blond haired girl named Grace delivered the bracelet to Forrest. Said she got it as a wedding present. I need to stop snacking before bedtime.

  74. MM- Maybe it’s a red herr. I’m a little slow picking up on these things sometimes-

  75. I’m gonna go out on a ledge here y’all and ask a question. Do you think Forrest ever intended for any of us to ever find “his” treasure – or was it his ultimate goal that we find our own. When we begin our search do we start at the head or the tail – all trails will lead us back to where we started. If we flip a coin, we win depending on how we called it. Could we be on board a train going nowhere or is nowhere a destination in itself? Oh well – I hear the conductor calling and I guess I gotta go, this train is leaving.

    • Mr. America…

      Yes; I am convinced he provided a solution to the quest. Therefore it has a beginning and end. Temporally, I think a few are close to the finish, while the masses are exhibiting Brownian movement near the start.

      Best regards;

      1F Billy

        • Finder – Forrest is 88 years old. I have always seen the Infinity symbol as an 8 rotated 90° and stretched.

          There is a Trail #88 high up in the Cabin Creek drainage, which is also the Big Sky Snowmobile Traiil in Winter. It leads to the parking spot 1/2 mile from the Forest Service cabin up there, built by the CCC in the 1930s. There is a Big Brown bear that frequents that area.

          88>Double Infinity>Double Omega?

          Looks like it would be Heaven up there to me!

        • Finder – And as to related private Brownian movements…

          I shared this cabin location with Forrest, suggesting that he buried the bronze chest under the outdoor privy He announced a clue on TV not long after about not digging under any outhouses; that the treasure was not associated with any structure.

          • I have been in chase since July. I sent Forrest two emails about my solves. The first time he replied thanks. After I sent my revised solve late last fall, he announced he would no longer review or respond to emails. Hoping to get back there this summer. Must arrange with Sheriff.

      • Wow – I’m impressed!
        Haven’t heard that term since my college days. Being a microbiologist by trade, I’ve seen quite a bit of Brownian movement.

        And on what scale would define “a few” ?

        • wwwamericana – And I am looking forward to meeting Grant McClintock this Summer, here in Sun Valley, to get the library’s copy of “Flywater” signed, and to have him identify the locations of every color plate in the book! Because my WWWH is at Madison Junction, where the Firehole and Madison and Gibbon Rivers meet. And there is lots of Browian movement all around; in the form of fly fishermen trying to land a trophy Brown trout:


          • Lisa,

            Madison junction is inside of Yellowstone National park. It’s very unlikely that Forrest hide the chest there (legal problems for finder and search problems).
            One recent featured question to Forrest was about drones:
            “Dear Forrest,
            When you hide the chest you most like was not aware about how fast modern technologies will be developed and become available to many searchers. For example, they have now remotely controllable drones with high-resolution cameras. In nearest future treasure searchers will have possibility to use drones with distant metal detector radars that can fly over big areas and detect all metal objects on the surface.
            My question is: will these modern devices (drones with cameras and metal detectors) provide more advantages to high-tech searchers in comparison with the traditional searchers (simple hikers that just visit each place personally)?”

            Forrest answer was very short and direct:
            “I have no doubt that they will Natalia.f”
            But everybody knows that what FF said about drones several years ago (SB 62):
            APRIL 2014
            “Some searchers overrate the complexity of the search. Knowing about head pressures, foot pounds, acre feet, bible verses, Latin, cubic inches, icons, fonts, charts, graphs, formulas, curved lines, magnetic variation, codes, depth meters, riddles, DRONES or ciphers, will not assist anyone to the treasure location, although those things have been offered as positive solutions. Excellent research materials are TTOTC, Google Earth, and/or a good map.f”
            All searchers know that:
            “Policy Memorandum 14-05, released by the National Park Service (NPS) director in June 2014, directed each superintendent to use the authority under 36 CFR 1.5 to prohibit the launching, landing, or operation of unmanned aircraft, subject to the certain conditions and exceptions set forth in the memo. This is still in force with a very few exceptions. This action applies to the launching, landing, and operation of unmanned aircraft on lands and waters administered by the NPS. Jurisdiction by the NPS ends at the park boundary.”
            Violation of the ban is a misdemeanor with the maximum penalty of six months in jail and a $5,000 fine.
            Simple conclusion is: you can’t use drones in Yellowstone National park because it will be too expensive for you.
            And we know that the Bureau of Land Management allows recreational drone use on most of the lands it manages. Maybe when Forrest said that drones will help to find the chest he wanted to say us that it is hidden not in NPs?
            BTW thanks for the link. I will think about “places where I fished in Montana as a kid under the tutelage of my father”. Montana was my primary BOTG state and I will continue there.

          • Andy S. – My WWWH location is inside YNP. My treasure location is canyon down from there, and a least 20 miles from the crowds in the park.

    • I think that Forrest intended for someone to eventually find the treasure. I do not think that he wanted to make it easy to avoid someone finding the Chest the week after he announced the Chase and shared the poem. I think that would’ve been kind of lame too. At this point, I think that the Chase has had a chance to ferment in popular culture & media and gain a nice legendary status. If anyone found it this year, that would seem like a good amount of time between hiding and finding. On the other hand, if the chest was hidden too well it may never be found, which I think would be disappointing for Forrest as well as all of us who want to know the true solution to the poem (Forrest has said in interviews that he understands that this is a possibility and is ok with that, but I still think deep down he’d like to see it found). All just my opinion, but I think that there are plenty of “treasures” to be had exploring the Rocky Mountains in addition to the treasure inside the bronze chest that’s also out there somewhere for one lucky Chaser!

  76. This is odd…

    I’ve spent the last couple of months refining my search area, working mostly on Stanza 4, the Blaze and beyond.

    I’ve recently discovered (based on my interpretation of the previous clues and the Blaze), is that I’m now able to get to the same end location (where I think the chest might be) by using both a shortened or condensed version of what the 9 clues might be and also by using a more expanded version of what I really think the 9 clues might be. Either way, both interpretations take me to the same place…the same ending spot. I find this pretty interesting.

    Could f have designed the poem this way? A coincidence? Beats me!

    Anyways, is it possible that there might be more than one way to correctly solve this poem? Could it depend on which way each individual searcher interprets the poem? Either way works? One way being a more shortened version and the other being a longer, more expanded version? Both end up in the same place?

    Curious to learn if anyone else’s solve has panned out this way or if I just need to get a little more sun than this year’s late Spring has allowed.

    All IMO

      • Hi RoadRunner,

        No, not a shortcut, but more of an actual solving of the 9 clues. Of being able to solve them two different ways, both correct solves, depending on how each individual searcher decides to parse the clues. A searcher doesn’t have to solve them both ways, but either way a searcher does decide to decipher the poem, either way could work. Might be possible. IMO.

        • RoadRunner,

          I completely understand what you are saying and mine solve is the same way and i was very surprise it almost feel like I have confirmed my solution in so many levels. Can wait to go this summer once my kids are out of school. My search area is very small and i know my kid will have fun.

        • SRW, is it that your solve can actually solve for all clues 2 entirely different ways, or, is it that you have solved the poem, and with that can see how to shorten that solve to arrive at the same place?

          There is only one correct way to solve the poem. If f was to explain the solve, he would use one way, but for us, as searchers, we need to follow as many different paths in order to solve. We don’t have the luxury of knowing, so know “one” way is correct until it is found.

          I would say there are thousands of ways to solve the poem. Everyone has a solve. so yes, there are different ways to solve. Can a searcher with a solve, let’s say it is correct, condense the solve, probably. If you mean it by, the poem gave you a solve, and other information brought you to the same place, sure, I would bet on it. There are reasons he chose the stories he chose. Same thing with all the ATF’s. It wouldn’t be hard to find that the poem gave you an “X” on a map, and in also solving some of his stories and comments, you were to also come to the same place. I really don’t think that every comment he has used pertains just to the 9 clues. In that case, other things would reference the same place.

          So, it’s not far fetched to find that your solve may have a “cousin” if you will. All IMO, but IMO, I would say that if you didn’t have your solve doing this, then you haven’t solved this whole thing. There are so many little puzzles to solve, that just solving the 9 clues I’m sure, has a few certain ways to solve. But, in the end, there is only one sure fire solve, and only one way.

          • Hi Poisonivey,

            You said: SRW, is it that your solve can actually solve for all clues 2 entirely different ways, or, is it that you have solved the poem, and with that can see how to shorten that solve to arrive at the same place?

            You stated it perfectly. The answer, strangely enough, is both. My answers for what I believe to be the 9 clues are the same for the condensed version, as they are for the expanded version. And by condensed, I’m not referring to a shorter hike or a shortcut along my journey of any kind. Rather, i’m referring to interpreting the poem itself.

            Both ways expose the same 9 clues, I find the same 9 answers, I check off the same way points along the way and I end up at the same ending spot.

            Honestly, I was really just curious to see if anyone else has ended up with a similar outcome. It doesn’t appear that anybody has.

            Anyways, I’m sure there’s nothing to see here but I did find it interesting just the same.

            All IMO

  77. The most logical, in my opinion, is that Forrest Fenn hid his treasure in a beautiful place, and I believe that he never mentioned this word, it is not in books, not in interviews or anywhere else.

    • It is beautiful and is place were that rainbow is located 🙂 can wait to find the pot.

      • IMO, that would not be the most logical. If it is such a beautiful place, it would be well known. A lot of traffic to see. Case in point, is Niagara falls beautiful? Is Ol’ Faithful?

        The most logical, IMO, would be a place that is not frequented. Is common in the Rockies, and is set as to not invite much traffic. I think the finder will find that the place is just as ordinary as anywhere in the mountains.

  78. Searchers 2019, IMO, if you can take 95% of Mr. Fenn’s quoted comments and answers to questions since the beginning of this chase, and they correlate to your solve/theory, and they fit easily without force fitting. Then you can go straight to the TC. If not, best to stay home and play canasta.

    • To coin a phrase, my pie chart is nearing 85 and that’s a Smith number. But there’s definitely enough content to turn a lot of pages, fill a few chapters and livres for quite a while.

    • The 95 percenters are wrong IMO.
      In fact the 100 percenters have been wrong in 9+ years.

      • Jake,

        I think I have 8 poem clues narrowed down. Does that make me a 80%er. Lol

        You know I believe I’ve searchered 8 different areas in the past and I will say I did force fit clues, comments, and out of the box ideas for most of them to come up with a solve. Now I jumped back in the box and stuck with the poem clues and hopefully that will pay off.

        I will comment to Afana here too if that’ ok Jake. As far as all of Forrest comments and ATF remarks, I believe there are a few (not 95%) that may help with the big picture, but I never heard any that leads to the exact spot he hid the chest.

        Ok, good luck guys,

      • I don’t think so, Jake. I believe there are some people ahead of me that just need to finish their work, but have not. Maybe they ran out of money, or maybe they just need a while longer to think about it. Good for the rest of us. I can definitely see how the poem works now, and it is difficult to make the transition if you only think one way. The blaze readily and abundantly confirms biases. Forrest clearly wants someone to find it or he wouldn’t have released SO MUCH atf content. When it clicks for you, everything becomes obvious. If you have learned a language in the past, there is a tipping point where one day you just wake up and understand and speak it regularly (although still in basic terms until you become more proficient). Consider this analogy and please try to transition. Conversations will either become more exciting, or you will choose to go dark and we won’t hear from you until you find it.

    • I think whether one can get as close as 95% or any other percentage, being out in the mountains whether alone or with family and/or friends would be worth spending time together.

    • If the poem can be solved then it seems to me the smartest thing a person could do is to ignore everything that Mr. Fenn has ever said about the chase, lest you unnecessarily misinterpret even one utterance and find yourself led astray. However, if the poem cannot be truly solved on its own, then we have no choice but to be unparsimonious in our approach to the problem. But which is it?

      In either case, I have been reading the blogs lately and it seems like for some reason the ATF has got involved and is responsible for creating all this confusion. I urge you to call them right away and tell them to leave us kids alone.

  79. The monkey king himself, Forrest, told us why he did this. The importance of family and friends is all through his books as well.

      • Hey Lisa. May not be directly related to finding Indulgence, but an apt comparison to Mr. Fenn. Preston’s book more than hints (yes, good read). The lore of the monkey King, his ability to deceive enemies (you are what they think you are), his hairs, it’s all there and worth a quick review. Did I mention China and southeast asia? Here’s to hoping I get a banana.

  80. In the game of the Chase, there seems to be a few clever players tempting you to show your cards. Let “them” talk. Keep your cards to yourself. Someone is bluffing, and I could just about guess who is probably behind the shenanigans. IMHO naturally.

    • Thanks for showing me your cards RoadRunner although I already knew what you have. I would fold. Beep Beep! 🙂

      • OMG. If the chest is where I think it is, the “precise” location will “never ever ever” be published. Ever!

      • Hey Jake Faulker and others
        How about a 99.9%er
        Forrests says kept quite until the snow goes,then go get it.I don’t say much out here just a few wispers now
        and then.Imagination will help 50%the 49.9% of_ _
        will I figure it out , ya all can do it ,mho

  81. Y’all, In my prior post , I’m not talking about our own biased solve’s and %wise. I’m talking about marrying the clues/hints not only to the poem, but also with 95% of everything Mr. Fenn has said basically. When and if you come to see it, you’ll know your ah-ha moment. Jake, I thought you’d get it. And EC Waters, I’m obviously below average, because I don’t know what you where saying above thread.

    • I think your numbers are a little overrated and inflated. Somebody ask Mr. FF
      The only good number is the right one and that’s 100%. I must be tired. And lost

      • I obviously can’t seem to get across my point. I guess you have to get THERE, to see what I’m referring to. I’m over and out. Goodnight all.

        • Hi Afana
          I do know what you are talking about,every thing Forest talks about is a hint if you know
          how to listen. Clint

          • Oh Contrare there Clint, I believe that everything that FF talks about could be a hint, but not necessarily is. Here in lies the beauty of what he created….direction vs mis-direction. The trouble is coming to the conclusion as to what could be, what should be, and what is. The hints have been there and I feel there have been many. I keep trying to gleen something from the blogs, the interviews, the SB’s, and everything that I can find, to disprove my theory. So far I haven’t found anything, but I too keep listening.
            Best of luck to all…..Spring is around the corner!

        • Afana. My apologies. I was not trying to be derogatory JMO. No disrespect.
          I’ll just save my opinions for another time since I clearly don’t fit the mold here.

  82. I’m not sure if this is the right place to post this, because it seems it could fall into different categories. I hope you’ll understand.

    In TTOTC I’ve found different things that appear to repeat itself and have mentioned this to others at the Denver Meet-up, and I believe I may have mentioned it here on the blog somewhere, although my memory fails me. One thing I’ve noticed is the word “cross” and it comes in different forms in the stories. The passing of his friend Eric Sloane at the “corner” waiting for the light to change. The two older women (biddies) who claimed he couldn’t “cross” the street by himself. Miss Ford (ford means to “cross”). When Miss Ford walked by him while he made marbles, he “crossed” his legs. And there is more which can be found in the book. Along these lines, there’s Skippy going “Alpha” and the “Alpha” teacher. The story of Skippy’s passing and how he should have been “buried standing up”. The story of Bessie and the “unconditional love” he had for her and how the kittens were “blessed”. Blessed has been mentioned other times in the book. There are other stories about love, too. “In Love With Yellowstone,” we have the saying on the one-room schoolhouse, “He Who Teaches a Child Labors with God in His Workshop.” Frosty given an inch and becoming a “ruler”. The story with the mention of the banquet table. “My War For Me” and the story of the waterfall and a “promise to return.” The “three teas” with Olga. “Flywater,” and “God subtracts from the allotted time of man, those hours spent fishing.” In “Gold And More,” in part, “…I dreamed the other night that I had been ‘reincarnated’ as Captain Kidd…”. There are more along these lines that seem to continue to suggest the same things. Studying different things and trying to apply the meanings of the nine clues of the poem to the stories is difficult. I shared to some that I thought “Where warm waters halt” was Los Alamos, New Mexico. The bombs of wars where and when we can’t leave each other alone. Then I tried to consider the other lines of the poem, in particular “Look quickly down, your quest to cease, But tarry scant with marvel gaze, Just take the chest and go in peace.” I would like to share the following:

    35 degrees 49′ 35.16″ N
    106 degrees 10′ 40.96″ W

    The Chase has brought me to beautiful spots and will continue to use my imagination. Is Mr. Fenn’s parachute still hanging in the tree? I believe it was a “hanging savior” for him. Again, my imagination.

    This is an opinion, offered as a thought.

    • Thanks for sharing, Pdenver. An interesting location for sure. Have you tried to visit it yet? It looks like it could be hiked to in a roundabout route from the overlook by veering north and bypassing the cliffs. I’d be interested in seeing photos of the location up close. If Los Alamos is your WWWH, then I am assuming either Cedro or Pueblo is your canyon down. What would be the home of Brown for this area?

      I do very much like your finding of common themes as the hints in TTOTC. I’ve skirted some ideas along these lines too, but am never sure if I just drawing connections that were intentionally or coincidentally placed.

      • Hello Blex. I have been to this area a few years ago and saw the cross, but didn’t think twice about it. I just thought of it as being beautiful and unusual, and it was during a time when my family and I were mainly interested in wanting to visit Santa Fe and other areas of New Mexico. It was of recent that I had noticed different forms of “cross” being mentioned in the stories. As for the canyon down, there is also Pajarito Canyon (Pajarito means “Birdie” in Spanish). I believe there is also Pajarito Falls. One of the trails, I am reminded of the little girl from India in a roundabout way:


        • Pdenver – I see what you mean! From blue to silver to red with plenty of springs along the way! 🙂

          • Yes. Remember the name of the pony the Fenn family had, as well as, the stories about tears, or lack of them?

    • Hey PDenver. I am definitely in agreement with your “cross” observations, and I could add a few more but we all have the books memorized, right? My only caution re: your location of interest is that it falls south of Cuyamungue. A long time ago, I took a black sharpie and drew a line across my NM Gazetteer at the point that I calculated was 8.25 miles north of the northern most city limits of Santa Fe (which is very near the opera house). That point was Cuyamungue. Take it or leave it…just my own personal benchmark. Gotta draw a line somewhere.

      • Hello Sandy. Thank you for your thoughts. Has it been determined the 8.25 miles north of Santa Fe as being the most northern limits or from the Capital building of Santa Fe per say? I know it was a big discussion when the comment was made, and I don’t recall if Mr. Fenn had stated the northern limits or not. Do you have a link you could provide where he clarifies this, please?

        • Hi pdenver…sorry I didn’t see this earlier. Forrest himself said that the treasure is located 8.25 miles north of the northern most city limits of Santa Fe in “Fundamental Guidelines Updated by Forrest June 26, 2017” here on Dal’s blog. Sorry I am a horrible cut and paster but it’s fairly easy to look up. My “line” on the map discussed in my comment above could very well be argued using the compass rose theory regarding north etc. I only wanted to share the criteria I use, in the off chance it is helpful to you and others.

          As a peace offering, I will add to your list of crosses the King’s X phrase he uses in TFTW. Crossing your fingers. That is an archaic phrase that I wasn’t familiar with. Also interesting are all the crosses depicted in the illustrations that accompany that story. Hope this helps you in some way.

  83. Here is some general guidance for all s riots treasure hunters …
    “Investigate abberatiions”, IMHO.

  84. Don’t ever think a good browbeating won’t set you in the right direction. Or perched like a DoDo keyed into a corner dreaming of a Tiger Lily. Though each there own, as we all know, in Alice’s house of reflection. If I had my way to spend today it would be playing with, a mans best friend, little Willie.

  85. How many here have a gut feeling there’s going to be a close foot race to the TC this year? I do.

    • Afana,

      That has been the occasion every spring. Folks have had more time to go through things that is before them. I call it the biggest chase during the spring and mellows out in the fall.

      As for the gut feeling, drink tea, take plenty of anti-acids, some peppermint oil and sip ginger ale every day until all settles down. Believe all is going to need it.

      If your wise and found the treasure drink plenty of Dr Pepper.

      Just Say’n

      • CharlieM, I just knew someone, not surprisingly you, would have a comeback like that. If I drank a Dr. Pepper, I’d be running back to my car with the TC and a grin on my face. Good luck this season.

    • I look forward to it being over soon. Thinking like this for years is maddening.

      And it wouldn’t be fun and motivating if there wasn’t conpetition. No one’s conning me out of my confidence nor the pros and cons of my constant and contiguous attempts to conplete. Like I once learned from an old man who indulged me with his wisdom, it’s better to pay a toll and climb a ladder than to dig a tunnel if you want to ring a bell and it be heard. Or something like that. Maybe I mixed that up somehow. My mind is besieged with useless things now.

      • E.C Waters, I know this chase brings out a lot of emotions. I find my biggest competition is my own mind throwing self doubt in the mix when I least need it. Yes it is maddening at times and I to hope it’s over soon, because it’s hard for me to kick this addiction. I know it’s said every year, but I do think it will be over this season IMO.

        • This year is different. The code is cracked, I’ve been publicizing this with some who are avoiding the baloney pie, and it’s up to us to finish, soda speak.

          Thirty cows, twenty-eight chickens. How many didn’t? Tin.

          Siege of Constantinople is Indulgence, For Whom the Bells Toll, his old friend Conny, confidence, contiguous, Con Young… although he also used those words correctly. He just cleverly and wisely chose them so that they would also be meaningful.

        • Hi Afana
          I am on that Train and grabbing all the bananas
          I can, like Forrest said the Train only goes by
          the banana once.Clint

          • A close race to the chest, no. There’ll be nothing close about it. E. C. Waters code? What code? f didn’t code the poem (imo). Some have felt the chase would be over in any one of the recent treasure hunting seasons. I, personally felt that I would find the chest every year that I’ve been involved in the chase. So, of course, the chest is expected to be found this season. It isn’t a race because no one will be close to finding Indulgence as the one who has the clues and hints interpreted. He /she will take the take and walk the walk. The time is near to begin it where the eggs halt their roll. Disclaimer, all of this is said IMO.

          • I know it sounds bold and arrogant. And I apologize. I also get bored of people claiming they know. Would it be better that I say nothing and turn up with it, or better that I share as I go? I believe there are others ahead of me. I have finished only 1 omega and am attempting to finish the 2nd. I understand the themes for both. There is a lot of work involved. But I also recall he said it gets easier as you go. This is also my experience. It is too bad Forrest won’t confirm or deny.

          • Keep sharing E.C.

            It’s all supposed to be fun. Nobody will head out for somebody else’s general solve. When I find the chest, it must be my own solution or I don’t want it.

  86. You know, who ever finds the treasure I hope people will respect that person and hope no crazy people try to sue them. Every one has an equal chance on finding the treasure and if that person is me then, the best thing i will do is keep it a secret and only tell Forrest Fenn. So he can visit his place of solitude as many times he wants.

      • Clint,

        When did FF say this. Was it because of his age or did the land or access to the land change. I have not read that he could not go back to the spot. Just trying to see if what he said has any connection to the solve.

    • I agree Luis. I have said that before also. I hope there is no ill-will once it is found. The finder will have done work to figure it out. I also hope the finder is a humble and gracious person. Perhaps he will help cook pancakes at Fennboree 🙂

  87. So we aren’t just looking for a treasure chest? We are also looking for a six pack of either Dr. Pepper or Jax Beer or both? Wow! That’s even better. The perks in the Chase are awesome.

    • Awesome, thanks Cythnia I enjoyed reading it and always great to see Forrest doing well. Definitely wish I could make it out that way and really didn’t know I could request a doodle. I wouldn’t sell it of course.

    • Thanks for sharing, Dal & Cynthia. Glad to see that Forrest is still doing well.
      And I should HOPE that everyone is already at the very least taking a map with them when they go searching!

        • Lisa – That’s some good sleuthing! If the library allows you to take pictures or scans of it whenever you make the visit, I’d be interested in looking at it too!

          • Blex – Thank you! Maybe some kind searcher in Bozeman will go take pics for us, while we wait for the snow to melt. I need all that terrain in the Red Creek, Cabin Creek and Beaver Creek drainages, where Forrest and Donnie Joe got lost. They burned their map for fuel, unfortunately.

          • I know you’re resourceful, Lisa, so these may be redundant to you. Others, though, might find it useful to see samples.

            This one’s from the Forest Service, though 1964. This particular sheet covers the district of Gallatin NF that contains Beaver Creek and Porcupine Creek.


            The U of Wyo historical collection also includes old USGS topo maps (1928, for example). The whole collection can be accessed through the link above.

            Forest Service maps typically show water (streams, rivers, lakes, ponds), roads of all kinds, and peaks, but not much else in terms of terrain detail.

            USGS topo maps show the full range of terrain features and elevation contours.


          • JA Kraven – What a great online map resource! Thank you, Jake! I will check it out from a computer. Too small too see detail on my phone, and you can’t move the map around when you expand it.

    • Thank you for the link, Dal.

      Great write-up, Cynthia. You made me giggle about your photo adjustments with all the good looking men. Seems the Chase continues to grow with all of those signed books. Glad to see Mr. Fenn looking healthy and keeping busy. I certainly agree he’s doing something right to look so young and we could be so fortunate to do the same. The book you purchased looks interesting. I’m sure you’re going to have a good read.

    • That was a tremendous write up Cynthia. What a fun day, running into the man himself! I would have just stood there mumbling and tripping over my own two feet.

    • Thanks for sharing Cynthia…it is always good to hear that F Fenn is on the move and keeping the ball rolling. Thanks Dal for making it available.

  88. Brian Mockenhaupt is a freelance writer who drives an old Corolla and travels around North America looking for great stories to share. In 2014 he discovered Forrest’s poem and came up with a solution…possibly THE solution… and headed out to recover the chest and improve his savings account. It’s a good story and possibly one you may not have read if you don’t read Backpacker magazine. You can read it at the link below. It’s 17mb so give it time to load up…

  89. Hi everyone. Hope you are ready for a nice, relaxing weekend as much as I am!

    I just wanted to mention that this morning I realized that my scrapbook index was about 15 entries behind, so I updated it this morning and Dal posted the updated version at the top of the scrapbook page today.

    Sifting through some of those old scrapbooks is another nice way to pass the time while we wait for the snows to melt!

    • Thanks Blex and dal, I will download it and get rid of the old one from early 2017.

    • Thanks Blex….the Index is a great resource; you have done a great job summarizing the SBs. Thank you to Dal as well.

    • Thanks Blex, I appreciate your work and the sharing of it.

      As for the weekend, first real spring attack on the palace grounds.

      It’s work, but at least it’s outdoor work.

  90. Does anyone out there really know how much this treasure is really worth? I have been reading numbers from $1M all the way up to $10M.

    • No. With pop culture and artifact inclusions, it is impossible to know until it is auctioned. Intrinsic value is probably close to $650K to $750K (20.2 Troy pounds of gold w random gemstones and metal, and the haha addition of the Nickelback CD with Photograph) if secretly selling off piece by piece.

        • Olga’s bathtub, combined with the washing machine story of Skippy, is where warm waters halt.

          • Hey Kate. Where are you located suggesting you know how the roads are in Moneta? That would put you in the middle, right smack between the end and the other end, like burning a candle on both ends.

          • I don’t know what fine by nine means, but I had some business around Moneta the other day and the snow is gone and roads are good.

          • Oh chute. That’s too bad. In my silly mind you have just been demoted from Kate to kate. Oh well. Good luck anyway.

        • Anyone besides me notice his chosen epitaph is an epithet? In that case, wouldn’t his epigraph would be quite telling? Or am I just the crazy one here?

          That was an example of a rhetorical question. The anser is “Yes”. You decide which question.

          • You are replying to your own ambiguous posts.

            The condition is similar to Cleuseau’s boss with the tick– Charles LaRousse Dreyfus

          • No worries, Muset. We’re not on the same trail. Good for me.

            I was just having a public epiphany as a lowly epigone that Forrest’s epitaph in his epilogue is the epitome of an epithet, and that both his epigraph and epilogue are exceptional at summarizing what an epic job he did on all of this.

            But that’s just me.

          • E.C. Waters – I agree. Epic. Just “So.”


            Click on the “View excerpt” link and scroll down to the epilogue page. My hypothesis is that Forrest originally inscribed that epitaph with that shape on one of the San Lazaro Pueblo rocks to cover the hidey spot. But then he changed it to maybe a Sun or Rainbow blaze.

        • William..some folks that have a narrow gauge train solution think that the length of Olga’s bathtub and the width of a narrow gauge train track are more than coincidental.

    • Sounds like you have given up on the search for FF’s treasure chest.

      Ken (in Texas) 🙂

    • It’s just now kicking in! The collective is just starting to wake up! Don’t quit! This is the year it gets really really good!

      • Quit? I’m just warming up. One of my friends thinks there are as many as 8 possible right answers to WWWH. With odds like that I like my chances. But To ensure that my effort isn’t a total bust, I’m toting a fly fishing rod. You should too.

  91. I wonder how many people would buy a book or go to the movie that reveals the solution? Would that be more valuable than the contents of the treasure chest? Or is it possible that the unknown contents in the chest are more valuable than the known content? What if there’s a surprise in the chest? Just thinking out loud. I guess that’s part of the thrill. Nobody knows. Well, almost nobody.

  92. Spring has sprung in Texas. Flowers are blooming, birds are doing their thing. I’m in the mood for a big bowl of etymon soup, served chilled. Yum.

    In a month I’ll be out on the links near home base, practicing my putting, working on my redneck tan, and definitely working my way out of the heather. This year is different.

    • E.C. Waters – “I’m All Right”. How are you??? I am looking for a former gopher hole, or one from a den of a small Burrowing owl, to be covered.with that Stone from San Lazaro Pueblo. Let the engineers of Nature do the work, right, Forrest?

      Go-Fer It, E.C. Waters! Get out there and excellently elucidate those Nine Holes! Forrest loves golf. Didn’t he used to play a lot, when he was Aide de Camp for the General in the Airforce? And Forrest worked right here on the Sun Valley Golf Course with Donnie Joe at age 19-20, before he joined the Airforce.

      • Shine on, E.C. Waters? Maybe YOU are the blaze?!:

        To “elucidate” is to make something clear that was formerly murky or confusing – and it is perfectly clear how the modern term got that meaning. “Elucidate” traces to the Latin term lucidus, which means “lucid.” “Lucidus” in turn descends from the verb lucēre, meaning “to shine.”

        I need a bier. Where is my Seamus Heaney translation of “Beowulf”? And I wonder how Forrest’s alligator by that name is doing, back in the swamp?

        • I don’t want to seem any part of flannelmouthed to anyone. But I will say welcome aboard the crazy train. I can attest it is a very lonely ride in this game, even after the 9 holes are finished. Soda speak.

          • I hope you enjoyed the ride. True story. When I was worked my way through college I worked for an architect that had his own Twitter n engine plane. He was bit of a prankster. He handed me a construction helmet in case I got sick. Then he performed every acrobatic move possible in that plane. I didn’t lose my cookies soda speak. But he had a big smirk on his face for the remainder of the flight. Today it was my turn to fly. 😉

        • Maybe ol’ Beowulf has been guarding the treasure, at the river.
          He probably likes that job, I’m sure he’s grinning.
          Either that or he’s boots.

          • Renard Miroir – What was that Croc’s name in Peter Pan again? Tick-Tock??

            Forrest used this poem:

            The Crocodile
            Lewis Carroll, 1832 – 1898

            How doth the little crocodile
            Improve his shining tail,
            And pour the waters of the Nile
            On every golden scale!

            How cheerfully he seems to grin,
            How neatly spreads his claws,
            And welcomes little fishes in,
            With gently smiling jaws!

  93. Just read some articles from the past with FF’s comments. Not confirming with certainty the author/blog….just discussing some peculiarities.
    FF said referring to the year 1620 “As you rode your horse into town you had to pass 80 telephone poles…
    FF is a man concerned with being correct with words. There were no “telephone poles” in 1620. I think this was a clue/hint to solving the poem.
    Also one article states that FF said “It’s between 5,000 feet above sea level and 10,200 feet above sea level….” My take is is the TC is at 7,600 feet as this is between the two altitudes.
    I think the TC is at 7,600 feet and along a telephone route line. Our solve has Warm Waters, a canyon, going down via a road (no walking), home of Brown, and a place for families and it is at 7, 600 feet. The Blaze is a family solve/secret and matches where all the lines cross.
    Will soon have the chance to test out theory.
    Hope this helps. Good luck and stay safe.

  94. I’m actually referring to the square object below in the front and center of the picture, certainly not a shadow. ..

    • Either it’s cut off in the photo, or you’re talking about the rock in the damp sand at the bottom of the foreground pourover.

      If the latter, it’s a rock that’s spalled off the pourover walls.

      All the rounded surfaces are due to long exposure, slow shaping by wind and water. The sharp edges on the rock down there are what you get from a sudden break.

      If in doubt, throw another rock at it, and listen.

      • That’s what I thought too, but the edges are pretty squared. It’s hard to see where it came from since the walls are very smooth.

        • In the upper left (across the way), you can see edged rocks lying on the thin turf layer that have come down from above. They’re very weathered, but not rounded.

          What’s behind and above the camera? It’s a decent-sized small spout in the photo.

          Since there’s clearly no perennial flow, that means that when it rains, the spout pours.

          Depending on how much drainage there is above and behind the photographer, that spout could *really* pour under the right conditions.

          Or if it’s very steep above and behind the camera, gravity could have dropped the rock from on high.

          Or a couple hoo-haw hikers could have rolled it out of the turf layer (where the scrub brush grows) and down into this part of the spout.

          One way or the other, it’s a rock.

          Not weathered, not lichened, so from a relatively recent break.


          • That’s a reasonable explanation. Behind the camera it’s like a short staircase with large landings, very wide up to the spout. The walls on either side do have the more squared rocks so I guess is possible a piece found its way down that far. Thanks Jake

  95. Kinda looks like the bedrock quarry but with to much vegetation.
    Maybe a rock fell from the conveyor belt. Imagination at work.
    Who knows.

  96. Morning all,

    I’m hoping that somebody can point me in the right direction.

    I’ve been looking for Forrest’s quote about how when he looks quickly down, what he see’s is his own two feet, or something to that effect. There was also a photo of his feet included in the story. I also can’t remember if it was a Scrapbook, Forrest gets mail or a Q&A over at Jenny’s site, etc. I’ve been looking/searching everywhere to no avail. Biggest problem I’m having is when I do a search that includes “feet” or “foot”, I get a gazillion results about the 200 ft or 500 ft discussions. But that’s not exactly what I’m looking for.

    Thanks in advance for any pointers.


      • Thanks morecowbell,

        I kinda thought it was a scrapbook too. I did read through the handy index for the Scrapbooks but still couldn’t find it. I also searched for it but like I said, the results were numerous. Hopefully someone else will chime in.

        Thanks again,

          • Thanks morecowbell,

            I did find and re-read that one yesterday but for some reason, that’s not exactly the one that I was thinking about. As I recall, I thought it was more along the lines of Forrest saying something like:

            when I look quickly down, all I see is my own two feet.

            Or something similar to that. Plus the photo.

            Maybe it wasn’t a Scrapbook posting?

            Thanks again for finding the “cuddles” story. It does seem like he likes to mention his feet a lot. That’s why I was wanting to review that other story. I was thinking that there might be something there worth reviewing, in regards to looking down.

            Thank you again and please pop back in if you happen to stumble across that particular foot story. I’ll do the same.

            I wonder why it’s so hard to find?

            Does anybody else recall the story that we’re talking about?

            Thanks again,

          • *** *** *** ***
            ” . . . anybody else recall the story that we’re talking about?” (that ff said “when I look quickly down, all I see is my own two feet.”)
            *** *** *** ***

            Nope, not me. I’ve definitely seen/heard any number of searchers saying it online, but I don’t remember it being a bona fide ff item (or even a hearsay “attributed to”).

            On the other hand, if I *had* ever run across it straight from the horse’s mouth, it’s not the kind of item that would have struck me as significant. I doubt I’d have retained it, so I’m not really a very useful yes/no.


          • Thank you J A Kraven,

            It could be nothing, but for whatever reason, something about it did seem to stick in my mind.

            If I happen to find what I’m looking for, I’ll post it here. In the mean time, I’ll keep looking.


          • Welcome SRW! I think you prob should reread that SB again. His dog, Tes, seems to be very important in alot of his communications. It may be nothing tho. I do know that dogs are always great companions and can really cheer you up when you are feeling blue or in a bad mood.

  97. (I’m posting this in the “Leave a Reply” box, the only entry method I see here. If it ends up being a reply to someone else’s post, sorry for any confusion–it’s meant to be a stand-alone post.)

    The third stanza has always seemed jarring to me because it’s composed almost entirely of what I guess could be called cliches, or anyway some type of overused idiom, among 5 other stanzas that are uniquely phrased.

    I’m wondering if anyone here has been struck by the same thing, and has any insights to share. I haven’t even figured out WWWH yet, but every time I read the poem I get distracted at this point. Maybe I could make some progress by eliminating this hump.

      • Kate – Thank you for that info! Another searcher was examining how the third line of the third stanza of the Poem might relate to one of Hemingway’s stories about a night before a battle during the Spanish Civil War. Your posts made me see this pic in my head of ‘Hem’ witing “For Whom the Bell Tolls” at the Sun Valley Lodge in December of 1939:


        I am having coffee less than a mile from there now. His last meal was at Michel’s Christiania Restaurant, less than 100ft from where I am sitting.

        • Thank you, Lisa. It must be exciting to be in the midst of so much literary history.
          I did see the discussion about that story. But I’m having no luck making a connection that would explain three such expressions, all grouped together, in a poem that is otherwise notable for its originality. It seems off somehow, and that’s why it holds my attention (when it would probably be better off on warm waters!)

          • Consider the possibility that the blaze is so emblazoned, one must step into the shade to connect with its knowledge, hence the soda-speak of why the shadow knows.

          • But all of this is premature. Start with where warm waters halt and follow the words from there. It gets easier.

          • E.C. Waters – Yes. Read about the Cuddles twins in Forrest’s Scrapbook 130 again. A famous shadow quote is mentioned. A famous literary work has a shadow on the cover and that same quote inside. Hmmmm…

          • And when you understand the blaze, you will understand the meaning of “Once Upon a While”.

          • E.C. Waters – First guess: You are referring to Wile Ethelburt Coyote and the Dogstar.

            Second guess: You are referring to the ever constant Julius Caesar, my ancestor, and Polaris.

          • No. When you get to the blaze, all will be illuminated. Even more at the first omega. Get the book and start with wwwh.
            There’s a lot of work to do.

            If you can’t find a reference to what you are seeking in the book, usually several references, then put it aside or research atf communications until you can reconnect it into the book. Wile E Coyote and Dogstar are not in the book, but Wimpy is. So is a homely girl. As for atf content, a redneck with a pickup and a bedroll will also become “obvious” to you. As will Kacir, Dr. Pepper, and the meaning of Catcher in the Rye. It all becomes clear when you are finally looking through the right lens. Soda speak.

          • No. Brown is Bessie (Guernsey), because she is tawny, a synonym of brown. This is mentioned in the book. You need the book. Below her is a basement (that which is below a home) with a golf course. This is where one “puts in” (mentioned as “putt-putt” in The Long Ride Home) onto the Oregon Trail. Too far to walk is Nine Mile Station at Register Cliff, confirmed by a photo of Nine Mile Hole in the book. You need the book. Where waters halt is Warm Springs Station, a place where emigrants stopped to wash their clothes and bathe. I just did these in “reverse” order for you. Reverse is also a hint. Get the book. Do the work. You will find it.

            The lens I am looking through to answer the riddles is the lens of figures of speech. Soda speak.

          • E.C. Waters – How Now Brown Cow? Wow! Thank you for sharing!!! What fun interpretations of possible clues you found in the book to match the Nine Clues Forrest said were in the Poem.

            That all reminded me of the veiled references that were made by playwrites during Elizabethan times, so they didn’t lose their heads. Like William Shakespeare. QE1 went by the nickname Bess. Hmmmm…

          • E.C. Waters – I can hear you replying, “Surely you just.’ But I assure you, I do not.

            “The use of the phrase ‘how now brown cow’ in teaching elocution can be dated back to at least 1926. Although not in use today, the phrase ‘how now’ is a greeting, short for ‘how say you now’, and can be found in archaic literature, such as the plays of William Shakespeare.”

          • The reference to William Shakespeare was regarding all the world is a stage. This alludes to stage coaches having used the same emigrant trails. The older places of the emigrants trails were, on average, about 15 miles apart as this is what a day of rolling thru this terrain required. The maps of these places had names of these stops, or halts. After the emigrants and gold miners, the Pony Express also used these places, along with the stage coach companies like Wells Fargo. Then Union Pacific. Some of these places still exist as towns, cities, or remnants. Others have disappeared completely.

  98. hi all, I think i have a search area in west yellowstone, does anyone know when the snow is usually gone there? thanks

  99. Morecowbell –
    This is for you. I couldn’t for the life of me figure out how the horses in the books were tied to the Chase. I finally got it. Just FYI. On another note, I found an article on a race horse named “Shining Bright”. Yea it has a white mark, a blaze, coincidentally. There was a great story behind that horse. It’s worth reading, IMO.

    • Related to book horses, Lightning and its blaze alludes to solving the poem’s blaze. Silver, in good soda-speak, alludes to several things including “Sylph” the name of a horse attributed as one of the first on the Pony Express.

      • E.C. Waters – Forgot that Lightning horse blaze from that pic in Forrest’s L&C story. And the Lightning Creek ridge formation that points quickly down to my hidey spot from the vantage point of a plane or on Google Earth. Thanks!

        And isn’t there a pic of Silver the horse with Forrest or one of his family members on it in one of the treasure related books?

        • Kind words morecowbell. Thanks. BTW, I discovered an interesting artifact while searching for Arrowhead today. It was most unexpected. It’s good to stay alert and keep your eyes open. It must be my connection with f and the Chase that brought this on, IMO.

          • What was it you found RockItMan if you don’t mind my asking and what part of the country are you from?

          • Well I’m not sure what it is just yet, but I’m a Hoosier soda speak. Cornfields ‘r us. 🙂

          • I’m in Idaho near JDA still waiting for Spring to kick in. Still have about 6 weeks until we get there in my estimation.

  100. Sandy-dude? I almost fell flat on my face. So the DoDo should have been a Dodo. One simple mistake and you got me tucked in tight like a frog up to his eyeballs in sand. Don’t know what you were thinking but that read like a children’s book to me. Sorry I had to get right down to the fling of it but you should know the difference between that and a spell of indulgence on an eve of responsibilities. Perhaps I should have just smiled, next time I’ll tern my head.

    • Straw. .you have a great smile ..I prefer you leave it at that! But a grin would have also been nice.

    • Straw, IMO Alice isn’t a children’s book. Have you read the annotated version by M. Gardner? Swing by, I’ll lend it to you. Along with a copy of the urban dictionary. Ok, it’s a school night better get my teeth brushed and tuck in. Good chatting – I’ve missed our talks.

  101. Good to see everyone are still having fun. Like Forrest said, “It is still out there”. I hope you all find what you are looking for.

    An Indian Scout and A Saint

      • Good for you Lisa. I am slowly stepping away from the chase. But for some reason it keeps following me in single unfamiliar order. It is all good though. Hopefully, I can make it to Fennborre this year and sell everyone my fresh fried Pineapple pies. 2 pies for a dollar or 3 pies for a nickle.

        An Indian Scout and A Saint

        • Geydelkon – Don’t take any In-the-Wood nickels! Especially those with the Buffalo’s on them.

          Still haven’t tried to get into the library below the Draper Museum in Cody to listen to that Oral History Forrest did…

  102. Hi everyone – I’m making my undergrad final film (film nerd here) about New Mexico and the treasure hunt. I had the absolute privilege to travel to NM for the first time in December to film for this project. I also had the CRAZY experience of accidentally meeting Forrest! It was amazing, he signed my book and I told him about my film. His reaction was essentially this face: :O . It was awesome.

    I’m posting bc I’m writing a narration/poem for my film (its a super 8 experimental documentary) that includes writings from Forrest combined with my own poetry. I was wondering if any searchers out there would be interested in recording some audio for me (the narration) and be included in my film! It would just involve me sending you a short bit of a poem, you recording it on a phone or something low tech, sending it back and of course getting credited.

    I’ll post some follow up screen shots of the awesome footage I’ve gotten. Let me know if you’re interested, you can email me with questions or anything. This project is combining a lot of my passions and it would be so much more awesome if I had some searchers involved.

    • Lily

      I think it’s very interesting what you’re doing.

      I may be interested in reading lines from the poem if I’m able to do it with a little twist.

      I was thinking of doing it in the billy bob character voice from the movie sling blade, it would go like this:

      As I have gone mmmmm hhhmmm alone in there
      And with my treasures mmmmm hhhmmm bold
      I can keep mmmmm hhhmmm my secret where
      And hint of riches mmmmm hhhmmm new and old.

      What ya think?

  103. Will someone PLEASE find that treasure already!
    I’m losing my marbles!
    I said my peace.
    Thank you.

  104. E.C.Waters…sorry cant reply above. But – is your solve going to take you on the Lander Cut-Off and drop you into The Salt River Valley (pretty good Saline Door if I may say so)? From there it is Afton (Not fa) get it? Afton reversed is Notfa…but too fa to walk. And Freedom. From there you are quite close to an important border and Soda Springs ID. Soda speak. Almost a full circle but in a straight line if you get my drift. Or are you perhaps headed north to the Snake?

    • No. I don’t go that far. I do cross Natrona (“soda”) County, but I leave the borders nigh and I hang a right at the thirl (“there’ll”), which is also the place where Forrest’s dog derives his name. And since there are no spades where I’m headed even though it’s named like there should be, I’ll still find the endurance to ask for a good map. While I’m there, I will meet a woman who is plain and homely, driving a bright-yellow Cadillac, and is known around town as Dame Fortune (“misfortune”). She’s not for me, though, not with that giant diamond on her hand. This is a great place to look around for Canasta buddies. Soda speak.

      The rest I leave to you to Gucci out because then comes the really good stuff that you will only enjoy if you do it yourself.

      • E.C. I will do my best to follow your “trail” of thought. Always enjoy your posts and thank you for sharing. Good luck to you. I would love it if you were the finder.

        • lol

          “end is ever drawing nigh” are Wyoming’s borders while on the emigrant trail.
          “There’ll” = “thirl” = Rock Creek “Hollow”, where the Willie Handcart party lost 13 souls.
          “spades” = “paddle”
          “heavy loads and water high” = “Atlantic City”, where Calamity Jane was reportedly a dancer. Nearby is Basket (“Canasta”) Gulch.

          One is able to see all kinds of more links at these places.

  105. Not sure why he wouldn’t have connected a fricative V with grinding marbles, turning “marvel gaze” into “marble observance”. Nor why he didn’t choose “slab” for “scant” instead of “scam”.

    Maybe his own name implies he’s a whinging “cin-cin”.

  106. Forrest has mentioned four key qualities that he attributes to the success he has had in life. I consider these to be the “Fennian Virtues”. In no particular order, they are:

    1. A wild imagination
    2. A logical mind
    3. Guts
    4. A willingness to work

    He has only spelled these out when talking about his own life, but I cannot help but think that these 4 virtues are baked into the Chase as well. The finder is going to need to rely on all 4 of these qualities, IMO.

    I would also like to mention that these 4 qualities balance each other out somewhat. If you keep all 4 in mind, it should prevent you from slipping too far in one direction or another. For example, a wild imagination is important, but if it is not being held in check by a logical mind, you will be forever seeing images in clouds and not getting anywhere. A logical mind helps think things through rationally, but if you lack imagination, you will be hemmed in by stark facts and literal interpretations. You can have guts, but listen to your logical mind at the same time to keep yourself out of unsafe conditions. You can work all day constantly on trying to solve the poem, but without an imagination, your time may be going to waste. Etc., Etc.

    To me, these seems like a good virtues to have in life in general, on top of using them to figure out the Chase.

    • Blex,

      I would have to disagree with your wording of your item 1. I would take out *wild*, yes F has good imagination, but I wouldn’t call it wild. I also wouldn’t use guts, I would use bravery instead. I would also insert # 5. Tenacity.

      Good thoughts never the less.

        • E.C. Waters,

          Why is brave rude? Saying brave is rude, is like saying the bronze, silver or valor metals are rude. Also you are saying as well, Forrest is rude or anyone in the military is rude.

          Jumping out of a plane, hang gliding, rock climbing, sailing around the world, combat etc, takes bravery.

          I’d hope you have a good explanation.

          • No idea why. It’s just how the word evolved. Rather barbarous I suppose.

          • CharlieM, I was questioning the same thing. I have to be nice so Dal won’t lock me up again. So I won’t repeat what Jake F. said about pretzels.

          • Folks, use the book. The book is your friend. Search on the word “brave”. If there is any reference to rude or barbarous behavior nearby, your answer is clear. Don’t blame the messenger. It’s just a linguistic riddle that Forrest used.

          • E.C. Waters, I hope you’re not using that choice out of various definitions in your solve. I’d like to see this “linguistic riddle” reference Forrest used.

          • Afana, see prior post on how to resolve brave to rude. The linguistic riddle is “if you are brave and in the wood”.

            On another note, it’s fine that I am here alone. It is how I will have gone in there.

          • E.C. Waters, I know the line’s in the poem, but I’m almost sure there’s no barbarous insinuation with Fenns choice and use of the word brave. IMO, I sense you interpret the poem literally, and you tend to express your interpretations in obscure ways oft times.

          • No worries, Afana. We each see what we see. Good luck!

            But on your way, the German word “Stachel” may help you group “barb” terms and other soda-speak Forrest has used in his book and atf communications (including Satchel Paige) to draw attention to the word “barbarous”, which happens to be the etymon for “brave”.


        • I like ‘grit’….’brave’ is ok if you are speaking of another, but seems arrogant to say about yourself. ‘Guts’ seem to imply a bit rash, not thoughtout. Grit seems ok to me. I have no idea why I am even posting this nonsense.

          • Guts is a hint to the blaze. Rude is the answer for brave. It goes on to mean something else. Again, Forrest is extremely clever to have put this together like this.

          • Hi E.C. … I can only guess you mean ‘rude’ as in ‘rudimentary’… as maintaining an uncultivated eye, or, without artifice. ‘Guts’ I don’t get, unless your at a fish-cleaning place & chumming the waters.

          • No you/ma’am/sir (trying to be politically polite).

            Guts is connected to finding the blaze. When you solve it, you will understand it. I don’t want to ruin it for others because it is a pivotal moment of illumination. Once you get it, you get it all the way to the finish. The blaze was my first and favorite eureka moment, when a whole bunch of stuff started to click and make sense. My 2nd favorite moment was a while after when I started to realize you can’t half-ass the work that’s involved. One must invest the effort, and it is difficult.

            I wish there were others who have made it this far and were willing to talk to me about this. It is very lonely here, especially when everyone else is understandably anchored in their work My sense is that Zap got to a point where I’m just finding, and … well … did not finish. But that’s just a sense. I don’t see Zap anywhere now. Maybe he’s busy with his satellites.

      • CharlieM – Those were Forrest’s choice of words; not mine.

        He has mentioned imagination with and without the qualifying adjective “wild”, so take it or leave it as you choose.

        I tend to put tenacity into the same category as “a willingness to work”, and the only reason I would exclude it is because Forrest has mentioned the four virtues I list above together multiple times in the same sentence. Tenacity could just as easily lean towards the idea of stubbornness, which would be a bad thing for a Chaser who is on the wrong track (i.e.: most of us!) and unwilling to change direction.

    • In TTOTC – “Teachers With Ropes,” Forrest says about himself, “All I had going for me was some imagination, hard work and a logical mind.” f

      • JDA – He has also referred to imagination & guts as “an awesome twosome” on Mysterious Writings.

        I like the list of four virtues myself best, but that’s only a matter of personal preference.

  107. If you invested 50 cents in a “blaze” you could find the treasure, IMHO.

  108. FYI… Current issue of The New Yorker has a long article by Doug Preston on new dinosaur stuff. Touches some issues, places, & people that searchers have spoken of.

    • The old dinosaur stuff was starting to smell a tad rancid.

      But most everything in the New Yorker smells a tad rancid, so I have a hard time appreciating any ‘new’ dinosaur stuff there…

    • I like the New Yorker. I also like to read Preston’s stuff… thanks for sharing that OS2.

      • Yes, great droll cartoons.
        I wonder if FF will comment on his friends article. I was gonna print it out from an on-line source, but my printer said it was 31 pages! B&N says it should be on their stands today.

        I miss the old drug stores with long magazine stands & marble lunch counters for a milkshake & a read on a vacant hour.

  109. what catches me every time is its, in the poem for all to see. up down in out here there; key no mess with the poem how can that work looking back it looks like tumblers with the right combo your there good luck have fun be safe. im gearing up for boots on the ground like boots on the moon 2024 ty mr Fenn to much entertainment is good for the soul. i hope your getting yours and you and yours ar doing well i often think of yous. jeff burch titan mom and ranee all sending a hug your ways.

  110. Another ‘Bombsicle’ weather front forecast to pass over the Colorado front range the next few days.

    It’ll certainly blast the plains east of here. Not sure how much it will wet the Rockies before blasting the midwest.

    • J A Kraven,

      I’m always watching the weather out west, especially the Rockies in all states. Mother Nature has a month to get the “snow part” out of her system. At least I’m hoping she will.

      Good luck,

  111. I have a couple question’s. 1st – Did any of you have difficulty getting on Dal’s site today? 2nd – Has anyone heard from pdenver? I hope all is well.

    • Adana,

      Yep there is a problem, I get pop up window asking to save or pick a application to run the file. Very odd file, without a program to run it. This only happens using desktop computer browsers. No problem on iPad here.

    • No problem on the mac. But got here from web search and coming in on the ‘meetups’ page from the kindle. Home page not working. Macs rule!

    • My desktop works every time I come to this site. It never fails for me. Beware some of the other sites…

      • Ken,

        What operating system Mac or Win? mine is Win, and none of the popular browsers work. I still can’t get in as of 6:16 pm Pacific, 7:16 Mtn.

        Dal, Chris help

  112. Hi Afana,

    I’ve not had any problems with the site today and pdenver has not posted today, at least not that I’ve seen.


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