Poetry Page III…



The chase certainly has inspired some great poetry…

Here is page III for poetry about the chase, Forrest or any other Thrill of the Chase related topic. I am hoping poets will create new poetry and place it on this page.

If you would like to peruse the  verse on the first page of poetry click HERE.

If you would like to peruse the verse on the second page of poetry click HERE



Thermopolis, WY…

SUBMITTED August 2015
BY Fenn Hunter


I have been doing some online research and have come up with a solve, which I know has about 0.01% chance of being correct, possibly less.  However as there is absolutely no way I can go and search them myself I thought I may as well send it to you. Please feel free to do with it what you will, ignore, follow up or share either partially or in its entirety with all – I was going to put it on your forum but didn’t want to waste peoples time if it’s totally wrong.

WWH – Hot Springs Park in Thermopolis WY. Hot Springs = Warm Waters.  Park = Stop = Halt.  Seems too obvious but we know the first tow clues can’t be too obscure they have been solved before.

Thermopolis is one of the towns marked on FF’s map, a major tourist stop on route to YNP.  Most importantly of all it’s a big fly fishing area and surely there is a chance FF fished here as a boy on his way to and from YNP?.

Although Thermopolis in under 5000ft.  That is not necessarily a problem: if the poem takes you up.

Canyon Down – We know that we need to travel up. Down on a map is South.  To the south of Thermopolis is Big Horn Canyon.

The Big Horn River is home to some notably big Brown Trout, often referred to as Big Horn Browns. This is a much lauded but relatively unknown fly fishing spot where fishermen will ‘float’ down the river.

If you travel South on Highway 20 for 4 or 5 miles (too far to walk and no obvious trail to walk on), you reach  ‘the wedding of the waters’. This is a spot where the river changes name,  Big Horn to the North, Wind River to the South.   Could Big Horn River be THOB?  It is home to Big Horn Brown Trout.  Big Horn Canyon is named after Big Horn Sheep which are Brown.  Just up river from here is also the Wind River Indian Reservation- which was home to ‘Camp/Fort Brown’. A military fort since renamed.   I think too that a Wedding of the Waters would appeal to the romantic in FF.

The Wedding of the Waters is a place where you can ‘put in’ to float down river – back towards Thermopolis.   In fact it’s the southerly most (furthest upstream) before reaching reservation land.   The putting in spot in within a couple hundred feet of the road – did FF mean that searchers (by being on that road) have been that close to the third, vital clue rather than the treasure its self?

Just downstream and across the river Is Memorial Cemetery, the final resting place to traverse the river you can’t be meek, and the cemetery is a scary place not for the meek either – it’s also a place where the end (death) is nigh.

From there Red Rock Canyon – a dry river bed (so no need for a paddle),  runs under the overhead train line (which carries heavy loads).

If you were to walk a few miles west into the canyon – in the direction of the Owl (owls are of course wise) Creek mountains, then the rocky outcrops on either side tower to just over 5000ft (could it be the altitude clue was a bigger clue than thought – that helps lead to a specific location, rather than a general area?)

The rock in this area is red and there appears to be a few cliffs in the area – could one look like a blaze? Or ese there are supposedly a number of petroglyphs in this area  does one mark the spot?  Whichever we know that me must climb to the top of the hills to get over 5000 feet. The area is not heavily wooded, but there are  some trees, is there a stand of them on top of one of the hills that appears as a wood from the bottom of the canyon?

When you reach the top of the hill it will no doubt be colder than in the canyon, and you will also be looking over the Wind River Indian Reservation (home of the Brave).  The hills have a number of drainage gullies running down them – a place  where a chest might easily be hidden without being fully buried and the chest will likely to be wet (especially in spring when the snow melts – what time of year was that interview held?)

How did an old man manage this journey? There are back roads just to the North that would take you very close without having to cross  the river and traverse up the canyon etc

Main problem, is this could be private land?  I think it might be but can’t really tell.. is it a problem, or the reason not to tarry?

I would be interested to know what you think of the above, is it with promise or complete trash?

Good luck and if it leads you, or someone, to the chest,  please do share some of the loot with me…


an addendum to this story from dal-
Please do not trespass. If this solution is on private property, please seek permission before accessing. We do not advocate trespassing.

Raider of the Lost Lair……


The Lorax



This little adventure in my vast  travels during this chase I have been lured into hook line and sinker started two trips prior when I was accompanied by my wife Luly to whom I wanted to show the beautiful country and extensive history of the area I had been searching for approximately a year now.

There was a blaze I had found up a canyon on the other side of the river that I wanted to search around and below but because of snow melt the usually calm and easily fordable river was a mocha colored raging torrent  of froth accompanied by a deafening roar that no one in their right mind would try to cross unless you were into body kayaking and being slammed into rocks. With the river being so high we decided to investigate some other areas I had wanted to search  while taking photos and sightseeing along the way.

After a couple of weeks had passed I was headed down the highway on my next trip and was excited because the river had subsided a considerable bit and I would more than likely be able to cross with my waders on.  Upon arriving at the river I gathered my gear threw on the waders, looped my shoes around my neck and made my way across. Once on the other side I stashed my waders and made my way up to the blaze, and I have to admit I was excited because I was confident that the chest was going to be resting there in all its beauty under my rock with my blaze on it or at least nearby. Well Ill tell ya I searched all around that blasted rock but didn’t find a thing except a little humility and some more courage to move on.

Me wearing waders for the first time.

I had told Luly on the previous trip that if the chest wasn’t found at my blaze on this trip I was going to hop over the ridge into the adjacent saddle to see what I could find. Once on the other side and in the saddle I started scanning around with my optics  and found another blaze and decided to go investigate it. It was located up near the top of the saddle nestled among some large rocks with a few pines nearby.

This is a blaze!

When I made it to this blaze I was standing there trying to figure out the meaning of what I was seeing when I looked quickly down and saw it, the rabbit hole. I thought to myself now way this cant be where it is hidden, while at the same time telling myself this is it, this is the spot, jackpot! ching! ching! ching! ching! I peered down into the hole with my flashlight and after some contemplation decided it would be best to return on another trip with some  rope and my wife or daughter for safety reasons.

Well the weekend finally arrived for my journey into the uncertain darkness and I could feel the adrenaline flowing because I just knew the chest had to be down there somewhere, and the thought of venturing down into that hole  was exciting in itself. I slapped on the waders again and started making my way across the river which luckily for me was still low when all of the sudden I slipped and myself and part of my pack went into the water but thankfully my camera, wallet , and cellphone did not get wet.

After crossing and taking inventory of my gear I made my way to the blaze and started prepping for my descent, which reminds me, I don’t know if anyone has seen the movie the decent but I thought about it and was a little creeped out, plus the thought of rocks caving in on me crossed my mind as well and had me a little worried.

Snapshot from Go-Pro as I exit the Lair.

I fastened my rope around a large rock near the entrance unraveled  and threw it down the hole. I then prepped my Go-Pro,  threw on the gloves, turned on my flashlight and started my journey down into the emptiness. I also keyed my spot GPS one last time to mark my location in case I did not return and give searches coordinates of where to look.

Mr. Owl watching me. How many licks does it take to get to the center? For me usually five.

Making my way down the narrow crevice I had to straddle a rock and then kind of belly slide down the rock with barely enough room between my chest and back until I felt my feet touch as it was too tight to turn my head and look down to see where my feet were. I kind of felt like a sandwich.

Rock I had to shimmy around going down into the first room.

The first room was about eight x eight feet and approximately thirteen to fourteen feet high with enough light shining down through the hole so that you could see what you were doing. I lifted rocks sifted through the dirt  and found nothing, zilch zip, nada. I thought I might at least find some signs that someone had been down there before living or buried.

This is looking down into the first room.

After exploring the first chamber I had to kind of wiggle my way around some rocks into a smaller adjacent room that didn’t appear to hold much promise of hiding a chest in it but I still scanned around the room with my light hoping to catch a glimpse of the bronze beauty, but as fate or Fenn would have it, I found nothing. There was however another hole that went down into a lower chamber and it had a long cedar or pine pole that disappeared into the darkness below. Some one had to of put it there because there is no way it could have arrived at that location on its own. It appeared that whoever lived in the cave used it to get down into the room below, but as I discovered later a grown man could do it without using the pole, it just made it easier and probably assisted the women and children of the tribe. I didn’t think Forrest would go any deeper than the first room at 79 or 80 years of age but I was already there and adventure was calling so I proceeded on just to see what I might find.

Peering down in to lower room making sure there are no critters down there.

Me watching my rope as it disappears into the lower room.

Before I headed down into the bottom chamber I made sure my rope was taught and proceeded to make my way down into the unknown. The pole leading down to the room had nubs on it where branches had been which actually made for some good footholds as I made my descent. As I made my way down It was starting to get really dark as there was only a hint of light filtering through the opening above. Once I felt some firm ground below my feet I let go of the rope turned my flashlight on and started scanning the room.

Setting foot into lower room.

Lower room with wood pole on left side towards back.

Looking towards back end of lower room.

Looking in to back corner of lower room.

This lower room I would estimate was fifteen feet in length and about eight or nine feet wide at its widest point and varied between seven feet at its highest point down to about three feet at the back. When I turned on my light I was expecting to see bones and the chest or at least some old Indian artifacts or wall paintings but once again nothing, just dirt and rocks, not even any sign animals had been in there. I did lift some rocks again and move some dirt with no success. I came to the conclusion that this dwelling or burial site had been robbed a long time ago, or the Indians that had inhabited it did not leave a trace so that they could not be tracked by cowboys or cavalry. I do know the Indians used the spot because of some clues I found just outside the entrance, and those are for you to contemplate. I plan to go back in there again with a metal detector and my daughter  someday just to show her what I found I’m sure she will enjoy it as much as I did.

Eve though the rock cavern was empty and I did not find the chest the whole adventure was a thrill in the chase. I have to be honest I am not surprised that the chest was not there and Ill tell you why, unless Fenn hid the treasure on land that is not public or accessible by the public by permission there was no way I was going to find the chest on this day but none the less the whole experience was a blast, and I found a few other  caverns that I plan to explore on a later date.


This adventure was first published on The Lorax’s blog and is published here with permission. The Lorax’s blog can be found here.


Wildbirder in New Mexico……



Hi folks we are back from our search. Due to illness we could not finish our search. We had to drive grandson home and returned to quickly without enough rest.  Dr. at ER said this is very common problem for people and anyone would get very ill doing this.  We are trying to come up with a way back because we only searched about ¼ to 1/3 of our area.

Our thoughts were that our search would be a blast and was going to be so EASY!  HA! HA! HA! HA! We were to go into our narrow canyon and do our search going LEFT to RIGHT then moving forward. HA! HA! HA! HA! I real did think the bottom of our canyon would be FLAT! HA! HA! HA! HA! Of course it was ROCKY because we are in the ROCKY MOUNTAINS. HA! HA! HA! HA! And yes there were TREES going straight up to the sky, but there were trees across the trail or at least our path. To get an idea of what it was like hiking where we were hiking think of what a game of Pick Up the Stick would look like if God played using TREES instead of sticks. HA! HA! HA! HA!

We did find a large rock with three trees growing around it. On two of the trees was a clear blaze! Problem was you could not see the marks on the trees coming into canyon only leaving. We like idiots didn’t look very hard at the area at the time. NUTS!!!! We were tired and not thinking is all I can say. We didn’t realize this till later. We saw lots of animals in NM and had a very good time. We will post more later when we are more rested.




picture is of Hubby coming out of the search area.  it was a little dense! can you see him?

picture is of Hubby coming out of the search area. it was a little dense! can you see him?



A (partial) knowledge of geometry……




“Why do we need to hike all the way down there?” they asked. We were already tired from the several-mile hike the day before, and had already hiked a few miles that day to where we stood, just beneath 10,200 feet in elevation on the side of a mountain in New Mexico. We were standing beneath a rock formation that I thought looked like a campfire in Google Earth, what I was calling my blaze.

“We’re at 10,200 feet. Isn’t anywhere around here fair game?” they insisted.

“We need to get down to the trail,” I replied. More hiking. “You need a comprehensive knowledge of geometry.”

“I think you mean geography,” they looked at each other, and then back to me, skeptically. “He said geography.”

“Yes, but now that we’re here, this is a geometry problem,” I said.

Let me explain. Forrest Fenn has said that a comprehensive knowledge of geography might help searchers. It’s been a few months since I was out looking, but I thought I’d write this up because I had a day off from work, and I feel that this information could be useful to any searcher no matter where they are looking. It’s basic logic, and it may seem pretty straightforward, but I can imagine it’s easy to overlook when you have boots on the ground in the thrill of finally searching in your location.

There is so much about Forrest Fenn’s treasure hunt that we don’t know. We don’t know which state. We don’t know what the clues mean in his poem. We don’t know a lot of things. However, if we take him at his word (and if we don’t, why bother searching?), there are a few things we do know. Some of the things that we know are actually very useful in weeding out bad search locations, or pinpointing high target areas in a location you feel strongly about. These hints that he’s dropped, unlike so many other clues, aren’t ambiguous, aren’t mysterious or shrouded in hidden meanings, and aren’t open to interpretation. They are, in fact, facts, assuming he’s being honest, and we all assume that he is. These facts don’t live in the realm of poetry. They live in the realm of math and geometry.

At a certain point, the search is no longer a question of geography. It’s a question of geometry.

He knows X, We know Y

Assumed Fact: Multiple searchers have been within 200 feet of the treasure.

Assumed Fact: Forrest Fenn knows this, because searchers have said where they’ve been.

Here we have two geometrical objects to work with. We have a treasure location, which we’ll call “X” (we totally have to call this X… X marks the spot). And we have a searcher location “Y”.

We don’t know X. Forrest Fenn doesn’t know Y. We don’t know each other’s Y. But after we tell him our collective Ys, we now know that X is within 200 ft. of some searchers’ Y.

We do know a few other things about X. Ignoring geographical information, such as it’s in the Rockies, north of Santa Fe, within four states, etc. we also know some geometrical z-axis information, namely that it is within 5,000 ft to 10,200 ft. This z-range is very useful.

X is a point, Y must be a point or line, Y is nameable

Whatever we do, we must remain geometrically consistent to have a good solve.

X is a geometric point. With just X, a point, there’s not a lot of geometry we can do. Thankfully, that’s not all we have. We also have a Y, and geometrically speaking, Y must be one of two things. Y must either be a single point, or a line, that is within 200 ft of X. Further, Y must be a nameable point, or line, for FF to know where the searcher is when he’s told. Let’s lay out another assumed fact.

Assumed Fact: Y is a nameable point, or a nameable line.

Consider these example (not real) emails:

“Hey Forrest, I was at Foo Bar waterfall. Sadly, I didn’t find the treasure, but I had a great time!”

“Hey Forrest, I was hiking along the Foo Bar trail. My wife tripped and fell into the river that runs along it. We’ll LOL forever off that one!”

Because the searcher identified Y (the waterfall, the trail, the point or line they were on), FF can then say that the searcher was within 200 ft. of X. Further, this is the only way that FF can know if we take him at his word.

I know, this isn’t rocket science. It’s pretty obvious. But you’d be surprised at how many potential solves don’t remain geometrically consistent with this, and how easy it is to forget when caught up in the thrill. Yet, if you keep it foremost in your thoughts, it has enormous benefits.

Case Example: We were standing at 10,200 ft., yet we were more than 200 ft below the blaze (a nameable point). We were partially geometrically consistent in being within 10,200 ft., but we were geometrically inconsistent because we were outside of 200 ft. of a nameable Y. We needed to get to the trail (a nameable line) that was much further below 10,200 ft.

What does nameable mean?

“Nameable” is a pretty loose term. One can name geometrical points and lines through GPS, after all. It’s conceivable that a searcher might email FF a list of GPS coordinates they were at as points, or even that they may have sent a list of all the GPS points they were at along a line. So far, the geometrical problem solving I’ve suggested is all math and geometrically fact based. However, I think we can go a little further by adopting a few likelihoods.

Assumed Likelihood: FF was not sent Y as a GPS point or a series of GPS points.

I mean, really? People don’t invoke GPS in email conversations. More to the point, “multiple searchers” are less likely to have sent FF a bunch of GPS coordinates that he had to then look up, measure from X, to conclude that Y is within 200 ft. of X. This, again, seems so simple, but it has very practical uses. A searcher should be ignoring areas that aren’t within 200 ft. of nameable locations, nameable in a common sense way that FF would recognize your Y. The nameable, perhaps, is where geography comes in. But after that, it’s mostly geometry.

Further, the nameable location has to be one that conceivably a number of searchers would have visited. One of the questions we have to ask ourselves when searching is, why hasn’t it been found there already? This is an important one. You have to reconcile two issues: 1) “Searchers” have been within 200 ft. of the treasure (not the general public, he said “searchers” wrote to him) and 2) They did not find the treasure. Your solve has to account for why they did not.

Case Example: Standing at 10,200 ft., we were further than 200 ft. from the blaze. Thus we had to get to the next nameable Y, a trail, a line, further down the mountain. To make this nameable location consistent with likelihoods, I had to assume that searchers would have taken that trail before. They had, it had been written on blogs. I also knew that the area within 200 ft. of the trail they had hiked on was not considered by them to be a high target area, but it looked good with my interpretation of the clues. Bringing it all together, within 200 ft. of the trail is my only geometrically consistent location, that is also consistent with likelihoods, and also matches my clue interpretation, and also accounts for why it hadn’t been found.

A geometrically consistent approach

See how it works? A knowledge of geometry (or keeping that as a focus) in your search not only reduces the search area, it makes searching more efficient. This applies wherever you are searching. We obviously didn’t find the treasure at this location in New Mexico because the location was wrong. The approach is sound.

I’ll wrap this already lengthy post up with an example of applying this approach to a target that we didn’t search. Turns out it was deeper on Taos Pueblo lands than we could get to. We tried, but the big Federal trespassing signs are quite convincing. Everything looks different on Google Earth, and all the routes I had to the location couldn’t get us there with boots on the ground. I don’t recommend you searching there either, but it’s a great case example for this approach (why I targeted it in the first place). I won’t bother push-pinning it. I’m sure you can find it. It’s up the mountain above the Veteran’s Memorial, to the north west. It’s called Apache Spring.

On Google Earth it kind of matched the clues. I could justify it through the poem, and it looked really good as a possible tie in to the Tea with Olga story. It was a beautiful, probably forgotten in time, natural spring in a clearing. It was a really unique spring as well. For some reason the ground was discolored at the mouth of the spring. I don’t know if this was rocks or vegetation. Bing maps highlight it better than Google, but it resembled the blaze on a horse’s face. These are the things that drive a searcher. It’s a real shame it’s inaccessible.

Let’s ignore all that. That’s geography, a bit of poetry, and just hunches. Now it’s a geometrical problem. Let’s apply the approach.

I have an unknown X. I now need to know what Y is, the nameable location that Forrest Fenn was sent. Looking at the clearing, I can see that the mouth of the natural spring that looks like a blaze is close to the tree line up top. The only nameable location here is the spring itself. “Hey Forrest, I was at Apache Spring up above the Veteran’s Memorial” is an email I could imagine multiple searchers sending (I didn’t know until I got there that it was inaccessible).

Standing at Apache Spring, virtually, I see that the path of the water flows into the treeline goes, “looking quickly down”, you guessed it, a little less than 200 ft. away. Geometrically, I now can guess that Y is the mouth of the spring and that X is just inside the treeline. The story I form for my solve is that searchers, on a hunch, went to Apache Spring, looked at the spring and didn’t see the treasure, gave up and left, and told Forrest about their adventure. Maybe they even glanced in the tree line but, because it wasn’t their target, they didn’t look closely. If they had just checked more closely in the tree line!

And that’s how it goes. This approach identified an area that, maybe, other searches had missed because it wasn’t their high target area. Since it wasn’t, maybe they half-assed the search, so now we can account for both searchers being there, and why it wasn’t found. We remain geometrically consistent throughout.

If this all seemed obvious to you, sorry for the long read. If not, hopefully you can get some use out of it. Best of luck out there, and if it does help remember: “It’s fortune and glory, kid.” You keep the fortune, let me share the glory. Give me a heads up if you find it using this approach.

Please feel free to contact me: jeremysdropbox@gmail.com


Jeremy Parnell


Connecting the Dots…




Disclaimer: This is my hypothesis. It is “tl;dr”, but worth the invested time if you’re a serious seeker. There may or may not be a treasure chest after following and attempting to prove this hypothesis.


So, yeah… There’s a news story out at the moment regarding a persistent seeker. The story focuses on everything he’s given up to be in the chase, and it basically impales him (and by inference all of us) in the public eye. It suggests we are all addicted to lunacy. While I too had come to the conclusion that I had solved the puzzle, I have concurrently come to the conclusion that I don’t want to continue with how the media and Yellowstone National Park officials depict us… as lunatics. I don’t believe I’m a lunatic, although this is likely to be what a lunatic thinks. For this purpose, I’m tapping out, but also publishing my lunatic solution with my recent experiences, which of course resulted in my returning empty-handed. For those who use Twitter, follow my random thoughts on @mikebibler. For those who like dalneitzel.com, I am organizing my thoughts in a way that is hopefully meaningful for this community. It is important to also know that I work in IT and have interests and experiences in the field of text mining. I use computer programs to quickly sift through information (structured and unstructured) and attempt to derive meaning and/or correlations. This is how I started my chase.

Like everyone, but computer software, I used readily available geo-referenced feature names above 5,000 feet and below 10,200 feet, and searched for synonym cluster hits within a reasonable proximity tolerance. I followed this path for about 8 months with no solid findings and only one trip out in April 2014. I stopped in Colorado, Montana, Yellowstone, and Cokeville, WY to look at the areas of my most favorable results. Next, I focused on specific angles of F’s interests: archaeology (“aguas tibia”), then art (“Thomas Moran”) for about 6 months and 2 more trips, and then finally literature. It wasn’t until I started focusing on story-telling (inclusive of movies) that everything snapped into place for me.

By my amateur and incomplete analysis, I speculate F conceived of his plan with a specific adult audience in mind, wrote a few things in the beginning, like My War For Me, and then began to augment as he found more correlations of his own life to that of “the hypothesis”. I speculate the idea of getting kids out into the woods and off their devices came just before writing or finalizing his poem. He said the book quickly wrote itself. As such, I speculate parallel paths to the chest developed: one for adults as in the original plan, and an augmented plan for children that also seems to fit. I’ll attempt to describe my translation of these paths, right or wrong. You can think about them now because I’m not going to think about them any longer. I believe the chest is out there. I now also believe F to be a genius, far smarter than I am, and far smarter than he lets on. There are some who would say I give him too much credit. To you I say “then go get the chest where you think it is, smarty”. There are a few who challenge my premise and say one could derive meaning from any literary source, such as Robin Hood. Ok, fine. I could not derive a motivating fraction of the volume of content from Robin Hood

that I can derive from “the hypothesis”. For those who insist the poem is all one needs to find the chest, I have this to say: yes technically yes I agree Yes. If that response seems silly to you, please download the free or paid version of James Joyce’s Ulysses somewhere on the Internet, get into the wood (paper) and read it. Lege totum si vis scire totum. Having this book may not be necessary, but it sure as blue hell makes everything F is saying so much easier to relate to and understand, even if (with irony) what he’s saying relates to content that is very difficult to understand. And for the kids, please find Disney’s digital movie Tinker Bell and the Lost Treasure.

Path #1: For the Kids

“Ask a child where warm waters halt.” says F. I think this may have three meanings.

Meaning 1, kids love Disney everything. The movie Tinker Bell and the Lost Treasure has some very interesting coincidences that, if recognized, will actually lead the seeker to the solution I hypothesize is the winning solution. In this movie is a lyric sung by Lyria, a story-telling fairy. Other coincidental names of characters correlating with words in TTOTC include Fawn, Blaze, Clank, Rosetta, and Tinker Bell (bronze bells, For Whom the Bell Tolls). F also mentions a painting about fairies dancing around a rock in the chapter Blue Jeans and Hushpuppies Again. And F uses the words “sprinkled” for describing what he has done with clues in his chapters. “Sprinkled” is a very specific word in the context of Tinker Bell, and has sent many seekers to Fairy Falls in Yellowstone. In this movie, Tinker Bell is seeking the fabled Mirror of Incanta (F’s chest is said to contain mirrors) for a rumored single remaining wish to correct something that went wrong. Here is the lyric:

The Ancient Chant

Journey due north, past Never Land
‘Til a faraway island is close at hand
When you’re alone, but not alone
You will find help and an arch of stone There’s one way across the isle’s north ridge,
But a price must be paid at the old troll bridge
At journey’s end, you shall walk the plank
Of the ship that sunk but never sank
And in the hold, amidst gems and gold,
A wish come true awaits, we’re told
But beware and be warned; there’s a trick to this clue: Wish only good will, or no good will come you

For the treasure you seek you may yet come to rue!

Journey due north, like somewhere north of Santa Fe? A faraway island, as in there are islands somewhere in the Rockies? Alone, like alone in there? An arch of stone, maybe like Natural Bridge at Yellowstone? What’s at the north ridge? A troll bridge, like maybe the (non)Fishing Bridge? A ship that sunk but never sank, in the Rockies, like maybe the E.C. Waters? Past Never Land? Here’s a screen cap of Tink’s homemade treasure map:

Screen Shot 2015-08-17 at 7.42.59 PM

So, if the E.C. Waters is the ship that sunk but never sank and it’s on Stevenson Island, canyon down or south of there is Dot Island. But wait, Dot Island LOOKS LIKE AN ARROWHEAD! F has been alluding to finding an arrowhead when he was nine that started him on his adventures. I had to have a closer look at Neverland. I found this in reference to J.M Barrie’s Peter Pan:

“Of all the delectable islands the Neverland is the snuggest and most compact, not large and sprawl, you know, with tedious distances between one adventure and another, but nicely crammed.”

Ok, Dot Island, check. But I’m a bit of a scientist and this path seems crazy (journalism worthy). How can I actually validate that Tinker Bell has ANYTHING to do with any of this before I invest money I don’t have into a search? I sat through the other Tinker Bell movies looking for and noting any similarities I could find. There are a few, but enough to indicate significance? There’s one in the first Tinker Bell that is a bit more than coincidental to the Buffalo Cowboys chapter in TTOTC where Cody is replaced by thistles that seem to rampage the area, needing to be corralled, with Tinker Bell in tow. There’s a few more here and there that would seem to allude to similar stories or words F chose. But in Tinker Bell and the Great Fairy Rescue, released after the book but before the range clue on NBC, this popped up unexpectedly:

Screen Shot 2015-08-17 at 7.43.07 PM

So, above 5,000 feet and below the tallest peak in Yellowstone, 10,200. Ok, check. Tinker Bell is now strangely and somehow involved. E.C. Waters to Dot Island (Neverland).

“Ask a child where warm waters halt.” says F. I think this may have three meanings. (It’s worth repeating like F did.)

Meaning 2, in the Preface of TTOTC, F gives us this poem to ponder:

“Life is a game of poker, Happiness is the pot.
Fate deals you four cards and a joker, And you play whether you like it or not.”

These (roughly) are also song lyrics from a song remade by Ernest Tubb, the Texas Troubadour. Ask a child where warm waters halt and they might reasonably tell you “a sink” or “a tub”. That would be useful to derive because this particular song from Ernest

Tubb is titled I’m Waiting On Ships That Never Come In. Now why in the world would F use that in his preface if not to signal where warm waters halt, back at the beginning of his book after reading his treasure poem? If he’s waiting on ships, that would indicate a lake higher than 5000 ft that can support a ship. At least one that would match this criteria in the search zone, as well as match the criteria of synonym allusion, is indeed the E.C. Waters, a steamship remnant on Stevenson Island.

“Ask a child where warm waters halt.” says F. I think this may have three meanings. (It’s worth repeating like F did.)

Meaning 3, E.C. Waters, the person, was replaced by Harry Child after the government became impatient with Waters’ obnoxious behavior, helped introduce competition and drove him out of business. Clever. This Child would definitely know where warm waters halt.

So yeah, there are several thoughts where a kid could assist (as it pertains to my hypothesis). I felt I was on the right track, but that my hypothetical solution was still incomplete.

Path #2: For the Adults

I speculate F wanted each of us to experience our own Odyssey. I speculate that F recognized the intriguing amount of correlations of his own life and experiences from Ulysses and to Odysseus. Perhaps he embellished enough to make the correlations fit, and perhaps that would be the reason he also released Too Far To Walk, to release his real story. James Joyce himself said the following which also seems to apply to F:

“If I gave it all up immediately, I’d lose my immortality. I’ve put in so many enigmas and puzzles that it will keep the professors busy for centuries arguing over what I meant, and that’s the only way of insuring one’s immortality.” – Joyce’s reply for a request for a plan of Ulysses, as quoted in James Joyce (1959) by Richard Ellmann

With that said, I’m not capable of explicating all of what F meant or alluded. I can find a reasonably convincing enough amount of content in TTOTC, Scrapbook posts on dalneitzel.com, and in F’s public appearances with James Joyce’s Ulysses or other The Odyssey allusion material. This is super clever because Ulysses is one of the most difficult books to process as well as being the most important Modernist literature of F’s time. Why didn’t he mention it in his chapter Important Literature? Well, that should now become obvious. For purposes of organizing this material just to point to the sheer volume of it, I will do so in these three categories: 1) Ulysses references about the chest and its contents, 2) Ulysses references from TTOTC and Scrapbook posts, and 3) references related to the actual hunt locations.

1) Ulysses (and The Odyssey) references about the chest and its contents
– F named the chest “Indulgence”. This word is also used prominently in the Ulysses colophon by Sylvia Beach, publisher at Shakespeare and Company, apologizing for the

misspellings in this most exceptional of cases.
– The chest depicts ladders. In Ulysses, I wonder if this alludes to Stephen and Buck leaving the tower via a ladder.
– 265 gold coins = 265,000 words in Ulysses
– 2 Ceylon sapphires = Ceylon tea distributor located at 2 Mincing Lane, London, E.C. (there’s E.C. again… so strange)
– 6 emeralds = I believe this relates to the emerald 4-leaf shamrock ring (2 extra as stem)
– 42 lbs = #42 is Ulysses in the Companion to Modernist Literature
– 20.5 Troy lbs of gold = Troy was defeated in The Odyssey, the book which Ulysses is said to allude. Twenty may allude to the number of people at Dignam’s funeral. Death’s number.
– F’s autobiography in an olive jar = Odysseus built his unmovable bed around an olive tree, proof to Penelope that he was Odysseus. In Ulysses, “Olives are packed in jars, eh? I have a few left from Andrews.”
– Gold dust and rubies = I speculate it relates to this line in Ulysses … “Dust slept on dull coils of bronze and silver, lozenges of cinnabar, on rubies, leprous and winedark stones.”
– My hypothesis suggests there is likely to be more, I’m just not ambitious enough to find and list them.

Not convinced yet? Let’s continue.

2) Ulysses (and The Odyssey) references from TTOTC and Scrapbook posts
– Ulysses uses the word “Fenian” for an Irish movement of the time (that’s kind of funny).
– Important Literature – F references the book Kismet, kismet is mentioned 4 times in Ulysses.
– Important Literature – Ulysses is missing while being the most important Modernist literature of F’s time.
– First Grade – F says John Charles would bring a jar of olives to school. In Ulysses, “Olives are packed in jars, eh? I have a few left from Andrews.”
– My Spanish Toy Factory – Ulysses references a squatted child at marbles.
– Me In The Middle – references chickens being chased, same is in opening scene of O Brother Where Art Thou (another set of allusions to The Odyssey)
– Gypsy Magic – Ulysses uses the words red Egyptians as Gypsies were was once thought to have Egyptian origins.
– My War For Me – F references Shakespeare throughout, Ulysses references Shakespeare and Hamlet throughout, and the book was published by Shakespeare and Company. There are several more, but this is getting too long.
– Teachers With Ropes – this concept is the final scene in O Brother Where Art Thou (another set of allusions to The Odyssey), the Penelope character is dragging her children holding onto twine, the last one is lassoed with the twine.
– Teachers With Ropes – Gilbert Stuart is the artist of the George Washington paintings F allows the children to touch. Stuart Gilbert was the French translator for Ulysses.
– A scrapbook about forgetting his keys – In Ulysses, Bloom has to break into his own house through the basement for the same reason.

– A scrapbook about house slippers with a hole in his sock – In Ulysses, “Stephanos, my crown. My sword. His boots are spoiling the shape of my feet. Buy a pair. Holes in my socks. Handkerchief too.”
– A scrapbook on Glenna Goodcare (of her works, he chose these) – In Ulysses, “… the tea merchant, drove past us in a gig with his daughter, Dancer Moses was her name…” This scrapbook instead could be pointing to the importance of the maternal relationship alluded to in Ulysses, and between Molly and Milly. There are very small Molly Islands in Yellowstone Lake. I suppose it’s also possible that the chest could be here, but everything else in my hypothesis points to Dot Island. And perhaps I’m anchored.

– My hypothesis suggests there is many many more, I’m just not ambitious enough to find and list them.

Still not convinced TTOTC is entangled with Ulysses? One more.

3) references related to the actual hunt locations (in my interpretation)
– wwwh: E.C. Waters – there’s a German passage in Ulysses, “Und alle Shiffe brücken.” – canyon down, tftw: boat to Dot Island – Ulysses refers to Dottyville, a colloquialism to a lunatic asylum, and according to journalists, where all of us belong.
– home of Brown – A Phil May cartoon referencing Dottyville seems appropriate to F. Definitely google it.
– no place for the meek: Dottyville (Dot Island) was E.C. Waters’ zoo. The park officials shut it down after seeing what an idiot Waters was and how the animals were being treated.
– end drawing nigh: Dottyville (Dot Island) is in the shape of an arrowhead, pointing NW.
– no paddle: Dottyville (Dot Island)… seriously, have a big motorized boat take you, or if you’ve dragged your own there, use it. Paddling here could endanger your life.
– water high: elevation of Yellowstone Lake
– blaze: Dottyville (Dot Island) pointing at the location. Ithaca, Episode 17 in Ulysses, ends with a giant dot, an oversized period which at the time alluded to a Latin mathematical suggestion of QED, or problem solved.
– hear me now and listen good: a sound (water measurement) synonym is “fathom”… he says this twice —> 2 fathoms – he also alludes to this somewhere when describing measurement systems of links, chains, fence poles, telephone poles, and fathoms.
– efforts worth the cold: this is where I completely missed it… I think you have to wade into cold water and look under a rock off the point of Dot Island (there are 2 visible during windy waves, it’s probably the one 2 fathoms or 12 feet away from the NW point shore so that Dot Island is pointing at it). I started to wade in barefooted, without waders. My feet were in pain immediately and began to numb. I had to turn around. A fathom used be about an arm’s length. Maybe he’s suggesting to stick your arms in the ice cold water and feel around. That seems weird. Maybe use a flashlight first.
– brave and in the wood: paper is made of wood. F alludes to this as being a bit of a conservationist. So, get in the wood and read Ulysses. “in the wood” may allude to “read the story about the wooden horse at Troy.”
– give you title: an allusion to Ulysses S. Grant, the President who signed Yellowstone into a preservation… “grant U president”. See how he nicely tied that all together?
– the nine clues are the nine sentence-ending punctuation dots, alluding to the nine muses throughout his book and throughout Ulysses, plus Ulysses has nines all over the place.

Motivation into Action

Now you know the premise to my hypothesis. More random coincidences than Robin Hood? I’d say yes absolutely yes undoubtedly yes. So I went there just last week, boots on the ground. Here’s a few findings as I traipsed around, roaming with purpose but without the confidence in the “get into the lake” solution.

If Dot Island also interests you, and you don’t have your own motorized boat, Cap’n John Blair of the Otter will shuttle you from and to Bridge Bay Marina (launch at the gas station next to the docks where Virginia has manned the desk for years). They are open for shuttle service between season-open and season-end (about June 15 to Sept 15 depending on various things). Make a reservation. Cap’n John and Virginia need permission from NPS to drop-off and pick-up at Dot Island for day hikes because it’s not one of the pre-approved drop-off points. A NPS day-use hiking permit is not required according to the ranger we checked, but you’re not allowed to camp overnight. Earliest drop-off is at 8am. Latest pick-up is at 5pm. The shuttle costs a little more than $300 as an excursion special for up to 6 passengers in total, so make sure you believe it’s worth it. It comes with a canoe, which we opted out of because we weren’t yet convinced the water was related. Doing this with park permission removes all the worry, and there’s enough worry just being on the island than to also have to worry whether or not you’re legal. Once approved, you’re good to go. If you mention you are seeking Fenn’s treasure, you will undoubtedly be denied. It makes people there nervous because they don’t want to break the rules, and they all believe we’re dotty as it is. A letter (although a bit dated but still applicable) is always at the ready to be shown to the “tourons”, a colloquialism of what the park concessionaires and rangers call us, moron tourists, because we must stop traffic for 20 minutes to get pictures of a lumbering bison, or feel confident enough to try to pet one before getting gored. But this letter also expresses the seriousness and the consequences:


click on image to see it larger

Just follow the rules. Don’t destroy our park. Dot Island has a beautiful open grassy vale behind some trees on the NE side of the island, or up and over the peak dune on the west side near the northern tip. There are a couple of things that appear to be old rusty fire pits about 30 yards apart along the north tree line. Do not start fires. Just take pics. We had a picnic, took a sandwich. We packed out everything we packed in, although we did find a few old rusty cans, bottles, jars, and a broken plate fragment in a large hole area with a fallen tree on the SE side of the vale. Uncaring and littering people have been there before us. Just use common sense and you won’t ruin it for everyone else. Also, watch for a nesting duck near the NE edge of the grassy vale. It scared the wits out of me as it flew up vertically into my face when I approached. Good for a laugh and a story after when I could see the duck returned. But that’s the beauty of Dot Island. It’s secluded and difficult, but not impossible. There’s an extremely low probability of seeing bears, bison, elk, moose, no worries of attacks, although there have been sightings in the past of stranded wildlife early in the season perhaps after crossing on the ice. Rangers will attempt to relocate stranded wildlife. One other caution about Dot Island… It’s packed with stinging nettle, thistle, and lots of other thorny messiness. Hikers beware. The nettle is quite ugly and helps to discourage passage into a lot of areas.

Looking east into the vale.

Screen Shot 2015-08-17 at 7.49.48 PM

A fire pit on the NE tree line of the vale, pointing north into the tree line.

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A fire pit on the NW tree line of the vale, pointing east toward the other fire pit about 30 yards away.

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We also located a heavy wooden plank in some woods near the SE corner of the island.

It’s about 200 to 300 lbs. Upon hearing of it, Cap’n John speculated it might have floated there or was abandoned there from a former dock. It was old, very solid, and very heavy. We found a similar sturdy plank at Spruce Point the next day, wondering if “in the wood” could be Spruce Point after failing at Dot Island.

Screen Shot 2015-08-17 at 7.50.21 PM

This plank at Spruce Point had a marking scratched into it. It looked recent-ish.

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An old picnic table at Spruce Point… We checked all around the rocks at Spruce Point, but may have missed it if it’s there.

Screen Shot 2015-08-17 at 7.50.44 PM

We also hiked Sand Point to Rock Point (aka Suicide Point although I don’t know why) to a location we believed was the position on the western lake shore where Dot Island is pointing. The boating staff call it “The Great Wall” area because of the cliff erosion formations. The hike in the sand was a foot muscle killer (FitBit should have given me at least 3x steps), and fallen trees were a real impediment in several locations. But we did find this interesting human formation at Rock Point…

Screen Shot 2015-08-17 at 7.50.51 PM

Anyway, thanks to Dal and Goofy for running a great site. I said I would give up after this. And so I am… yes I said yes I will Yes.

Cheers all and good luck, E.C. Waters (aka Mike Bibler)



Forrest Gets Mail – 8


In this email from Forrest to a fact-checker for a Outside Magazine, Forrest answers some questions you may have been wondering about yourself. The story is in the September 2015 issue and not all these “facts” made it into the final story. You can find the finished story by Peter Frick-Wright on the Media Coverage Page of this blog.


How old were you when you were a fly-fishing guide? Where was that?
I was about 13 and it was in and around Yellowstone Park.

How old will you be on August 15? What year were you born?
I will be 85 on August 22, 2015. I was born in 1930.

How old were you and what year did you join the Air Force?
I was 20 and I joined the AF on 6 Sept. 1950.

What happened the second time you were shot down in Vietnam? How were you rescued?
I ejected from my burning F-100 near the DMZ in Laos. I was rescued by a helicopter the next day, which was 21 Dec. 1968.

When were you discharged from the Air Force, and when did you move to Santa Fe?
I retired from the AF at the end of September 1970 and moved to Santa Fe in the summer of 1972.

When and how did your father pass away?
My father had terminal pancreas cancer and was given 6 months to live. He refused to take any pills for pain, and eighteen months later he took 50 sleeping pills. He died on 8 Feb, 1987.

Can you explain your first plan for the treasure, before your cancer went into remission? How did your disease impact the plan for the treasure? And why and when did you start it up again?
I don’t know what you mean by “first plan.” When I was told that I had a 20% chance of living 3 years I decided to take some of my things with me. My plan was to let my body go back to the earth at the place where I hid the treasure. When my cancer went into remission I decided to hide the treasure anyway.

How many people would you estimate have gone out looking for the treasure?
Based on the number of emails I have received I estimate that by the end of this summer (summer of 2015) 100,000 people will have been out searching.

Have you narrowed the search area for the treasure?
Yes, I said the treasure is hidden in the Rocky Mountains at least 8 miles north of Santa Fe, excluding Utah, Idaho, and Canada. I have said it is above 5000’ and below 10,200.

You told P* that, considering some of the lengths people have gone searching for the treasure, your story has turned into a monster.
I did not expect the story to get as big as it has, nor did I expect a few searchers to go to such great lengths in the hunt.

You’ve said repeatedly that the treasure isn’t in a dangerous place, and searchers shouldn’t look anywhere you couldn’t have gone.
That is true. There is no percentage in searching where a 79, or 80 year old man could not carry the treasure.

Tales of the Rainbow…




The day began rather early, or late depending on your perception.  We headed
out at 1:00 am to ensure we could hike to the destination for
sunrise.   Over the Beartooth and into Wyoming.  Shooting stars and planets
abounded in the pitch night sky.  There wasnt anyone at the Yellowstone gate
at 3am and the roads were empty.  Such a rare sight for Yellowstone in
August.  We wound along the mountain roads, wary of wildlife as we peered
down the misty pavement.  It had rained profusely in the days prior, giving
the pines a fresh clean smell and filling the valleys with a rich thick
fog.  We weaved in and out of the desolate canyons, up and down the passes,
past countless unseen wildlife until finally we neared our destination. Past
where the warm waters had blocked the Brown trout’s proliferation….past
the canyon….pulling into the picnic area marking the creek where the
Browns were introduced to the upper reaches of the river nearly 100 years
ago.  (Ive  learned so much through my exploration!).  Dawn was still some
time away.


Aspen and Mark

My husband Mark, 13 year old daughter Aspen and I grabbed our
flashlights and headed out alone onto the dark trail.  The stillness and
quiet was astounding.  Wolves howled at our backs and a combonation of steam
and fog swirled around us, so thick even the flashlights wouldnt pierce it.

The air was a chilly 39 degrees, but thankfully no wind.    At our feet,
some 50 yards in, a pile of very fresh bear scat in the center of the
trail.  This was certainly no place for the meek. We pushed onward, swinging
our lights around, happy to not see any pairs of glowing eyes staring back
at us.


Over the bridge we walked, attemping a view at ojo, although the
dense cloud of steam and fog wouldnt allow it.  We pointed our lights below
the bridge, peering into the dark water.  The long grasses swayed gracefully
in the clear clean waters.  I imagined the gigantic fish hiding amidst  the

We continued onward.  The sky had begun to lighten a bit, more and more so
as we continued on.  We quickened our pace so as to not miss our appointment
with dawn’s light.  We drank from the droplets of dew on the pine needles
and sucked in the sweet air…..so clean it felt as though it burned your
lungs.  We would stop periodically and just listen.  The wolves had ceased
their song and even the birds were still and silent (with the exception of
the quiet little log hoppers that bounced around in the deadfall amongst the
long grasses).  Our ears rang with the epic silence that surrounded us…no
hum of technology, no cars in the distance, no planes overhead…..just
utter silence.

To our left we sensed the lake, shrouded entirely in fog.
Geese trumpeted in the distance floating discreetly on their namesake.
Further down the trail the terrain dropped away from us to the left and the
river came into view again, draped in a warm haze.  A  herd of elk  stared
back at us before turning and splashing through the currents back into the
safety of the mist.


We trudged on, quicken our pace even further as the
sky continued to glow with the emminent arrival of the sun.  We turned down
the path into the pines,  flanking the steep mountain ridges and continued
along the tree lined path, tripping over the huge obsidian chunks protruding
from the trail.  We wound through the trees until finally we steadily
climbed to a small rise and a clearing that allowed us to see the immense
stone wall ahead of us, still cloaked in darkness in its recess.


The sound of falling water now permeated the silence.  We pushed forward, loping up
the trail with the promise of the sun looming behind us.  Finally we came
upon the majestic falls.  Beautiful.  The small wooden bridge has washed
away sometime in the past years but ample deadfall bridged the creek in
numerous places.


We filled ourselves with wild  raspberries as we  waited
anxiously in the wood for the eastern sky to break loose and cast its light
on the spectacular spray of the falls.  Forrest Fenns rainbow and our pot of
gold at the end.  Our effort was indeed worth the cold.






Lea and Mark – Ahh the joys of always being the one behind the camera. Always the artist, never the muse.








Leza Vargas

Thomas…a Follow-up



This is a follow-up to Cynthia’s original story about searching with Thomas that can be found HERE.

The Hunt…Searching for Fenn’s Treasure*

Last month, Dal posted my story about Thomas, a 10-yr old boy and his family from Arizona who allowed me to film a couple of their searches  for a documentary I was making about Forrest and the massive appeal of his treasure hunt to those of all ages.  I just finished adding the final touches, and uploaded it to Vimeo for anyone who is interested in watching three separate search parties in the remote (and not so remote) wilderness of northern New Mexico, as well as an interview with Forrest.

I got the idea for making my own documentary after being interviewed by two professional companies also making documentaries about Fenn and the searchers. I felt like my contribution was boring…all talk, not even about my particular solutions to the poem, and not on-location actually searching. I felt I could do better…and that I could add some pizzazz…a wow factor. I came up with a preliminary story and sent it to Forrest for his approval, and asked him if he’d allow me to interview him in his home like the pros, to give it some legitimacy. He said yes…

I had never shot a video before but had taken thousands of photos…I thought “how hard can this be?” (As Dal is reading this, I bet he is rolling on the floor laughing his butt off since he is a professional videographer, I think.) After ff approved the “script” and agreed to the interview, my arrogance surpassed my confidence, and off to the store I went to buy a GoPro camera (the palm-sized ones that athletes attach to their bikes, surf boards, etc.) and all the accessories. My budget was zero when it came to paying anyone to help, but I was lucky to have a few people  agree to let me film their searches for the documentary.

My partner agreed to help as the cinematographer (cameraperson) which was a tremendous help since I only had one camera (the GoPro) and didn’t want to film every scene Les Stroud-like (Survivorman). By the middle of June we had all the gear we thought we needed and started practicing at home, not to mention spending oodles of hours watching YouTube videos on how to make a movie, top ten mistakes of new film makers, etc. (I don’t know why anyone goes to college anymore because you can learn everything on YouTube… Or so we thought.)

We got up at 4:00 am some days just to drive to the areas in Taos Canyon to shoot my search scenes..I wanted to be there and hike up the canyons before any clouds moved in…even though I was a first time movie-maker, I was aware of continuity between scenes and wanted to get everything right. (By the way, Dal, what is the difference between a “movie” and a “video”? When strangers would happen upon us while we were “filming” which I know is an incorrect term since we were shooting a digital movie/video, I always preferred telling them we were shooting a movie, not a video. When I hear the word “video”, I think MTV…when I hear the word “movie”, I think Hollywood or Sundance.)

We even practiced “interviewing Forrest”… a lot. This was in the midst of the real media madness at his home, and I knew it would be tough to get an “appointment”. I knew there would be no “do-overs”…if we made a mistake, we’d have to live with the footage and audio we got. The night before the interview, I didn’t sleep a wink…I was so nervous…I couldn’t pronounce any words more than a syllable

without stammering. I couldn’t even remember the questions I had decided upon to ask him, so I wrote them all down.

The 50-min drive to his home was spent in silence…I kept going over the questions in my head…practicing “quietly” not to stumble over the words. I wondered to myself if I should have had a drink (alcohol!) before leaving my house…I wondered which would sound worse…me stammering  from the jitters or me slurring my words from too much booze. Too late…we were at his front door. As always, Forrest greeted us with a smile and graciously escorted us into his office. He worked on some emails as we “set up”. Then we chatted…by the time the camera was ready to roll, I was okay, mostly. Forrest was, and is, such a pro when it comes to being interviewed. He knew where to sit for the best lighting, and how to turn the statue on the stand beside his chair just right for the best composition. Within an hour, we were done, and heading home. As much as I always enjoy seeing Forrest and chatting, this time I felt such a sense of relief to be leaving…I couldn’t wait to get home, and watch the interview…

Weeks seemed to pass rapidly…we spent most of July following Thomas and his family, following Frank, and re-shooting a lot of my scenes in Taos Canyon. Then it came time to “make the movie”…holy cow, if you’ve never edited a movie, video, whatever, you can’t imagine how tedious it is to look at 500 video clips worth hours of footage and try to edit segments to make a “movie” less than 50 mins long. All along, my idea was to make a documentary/docu-drama “short” to submit to the Sundance Film Festival, and their rule for a short is less than 50 mins.  Everybody’s footage got cut drastically, including Forrest.

The final version of this movie/documentary/video is about 44 mins long. We learned a lot, we made some major mistakes which had to be fixed, our shotgun mic went bad part way through Thomas’ search so we had to improvise and record the sound on my cell phone (which is quite obvious when you watch this)…but mostly we had FUN. If watching this makes any of you smile, then I accomplished what I set out to do…to entertain as well as to inform.

I hope you enjoy my MOVIE (don’t like the word video)…here is the link.



PS: Several days ago, I uploaded a preliminary rough copy to Vimeo so Forrest and the people in it could view it and approve it before I put the link out there to the people on this blog. If you are one of the 50 people who have watched this in the past few days, this link will take you to the new and improved version which includes a few new short clips.


X Marks the Spot Photos…



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